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Samsung Galaxy tab 10.1 with 4g up for preorder at $550. Motorola let us down big...

Title says it all. Motorola went the way of exploitation and took the cheap route of superficial marketing to rush a half baked device to market at the expense of it's customers. Trying to put the final touchs on their Frankenstein creation people received their xooms unsealed and in essence unguarded. People have reported sending in their malfunctioning devices only to met with refusal because of "water damage" even though the seal on the purchase was already removed when they received it. Motorola reps at CES repeatedly said that the xoom would be upgradable to 4g soon after release, some saying 40 days, some saying 2 months, some saying whatever - all being false. SD card support has never been honored even though other tablets like the transformer with fundamentally identical specs have delivered since day one. Now Samsung is offering the same thing in thinner form factor for almost 300 dollars less - and we can only assume it will actually be WORKING also.
And if all this isn't bad enough we see that while Motorola had no problem taking large sums of money on false pretenses they simultaneously had no shame about neglecting original xoom owners and developing a second xoom in the meantime that is nothing more than a working version of what they promised the first would be. Pathetic.
They are striving hard for recognition as the biggest piece of **** company in the android game and judging by the recent reports of their stock value, it seems they are successful at something. Seriously it is not rocket science. False advertising, ****ty support (or none at all), zero accountability, no remorse or attempt for compensation or consumer confidence, equals a ****ty company that loses value in a competative market. Someone over there needs to take their heads out of their ass. A child can understand this.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA Premium App

Oh my god just $550 and no contract? I wouldn't mind prepaid 4g data from verzion....

Europe has SD card support, and since it's not a GED that makes me suspect that the problem with SD card support is more of a Google issue than a Moto issue.

VaKo said:
Europe has SD card support
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Not yet, Motorola posted at Facebook that they will roll out the 3.1 Update with SD soon for EU... But what is soon? 2 weeks? 2 months?
Nobody received a update yet...

They shafted a lot of people. I have the WiFi only model so I don't apply. That sucks for everyone else though.

Does it suck? Yes. Motorola sold the Xoom on promises. But nowhere on the Box or on any advertisements did they say when LTE would be given out and nowhere in the advertisements was the SD card slot mentioned. So although you feel like you have been taken advantage of, you need to take some personal responsibility. You purchased an unfinished product willingly.
My response is that I will no longer buy Motorola products.

First this is not a personal attack on anyone, but I have to say that ALL of us bought this device well knowing that some of the features were still in developement. I have not seen anyone present actual evidence of Motorola committing to any specific dates as to when these features would be added. If you have evidence please share as I am sure there are many people who would like to see it.
Moto was first out of the gate with a HC tablet, if they had waited until everything was done it still would not have shipped and the same people who are blasting Motorola now for unsupported features would be the same people screaming that they were late to market. The US Xoom is a GED device, so the SD support is fully in Google's hands. As for the LTE upgrade, I have a WiFi Xoom so I really can not comment any more than what I have already said. In this type of market there really are not too many options.
1) Ship something with less features to be first or earlier to the market
2) Wait for the features to be fully supported and be late to the market
3) Ship the unit with full hardware support but lacking full software support so that features can be enabled in future SW updates.
It comes down to which one of these options satisfies the most people. I personally think they made the right choice, but everyone is entitled to thier own opinion. Now do I believe Moto needs to reduce the pricing to compete, of course. But I am sure that as soon as they reduce prices, people will be *****ing about that too. There is ALWAYS a premium for buying the first of anything, especially in the technology market.
Me personally, I like my Xoom and after reading reviews of the Samsung given the option to choose I would stick with the Xoom. Is it heavier - absolutely, is it more robust/durable - absolutely, is it going to get Adroid updates faster and for a longer period of time - most likely.
Regarding the point of them already designing a next generation Xoom, that is what companies have to do to stay competitive. There will ALWAYS be something newer/better/cheaper on the horizon and I would be more pissed off if they were not working on the next best thing.
Does it suck that something we all just spent good $$$ on a few months ago is not the "best" thing anymore, sure but that is how it goes.

I dont feel bad about my purchase...the cost of being an early adopter...also i dont care what anyone says...that Tab feels cheap as hell. My xoom feels bullet proof. Apple was able to make a thin device feel solid but like their phones, cameras, and big screen TV...the tab feels very plasticy and cheap. Just my opinion. I still love my xoom despite all this other stuff that comes out.

Kippui said:
Oh my god just $550 and no contract? I wouldn't mind prepaid 4g data from verzion....
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Where are you seeing that. I see $529 with a contract.

nubsors said:
Does it suck? Yes. Motorola sold the Xoom on promises. But nowhere on the Box or on any advertisements did they say when LTE would be given out and nowhere in the advertisements was the SD card slot mentioned. So although you feel like you have been taken advantage of, you need to take some personal responsibility. You purchased an unfinished product willingly.
My response is that I will no longer buy Motorola products.
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I am aware that they didn't commit to a "specific" date. Although if you followed CES where the xoom was debuted you will have heard Motorola reps offering all sorts of unofficial etas (all of which have come and gone). Regardless, misleading and dishonest advertising doesn't depend on them specifying a date. While they have said things like "by the end of Q2" (which was yesterday for anyone following) the practical truth is that when you offer a service in a fast moving market where a devices life cycle of relevance can be as little as 6 to 8 months (hence the new xoom 4g already on the horizon and quadcore chips becoming standard before the end of the year) you only have a certain window of oppertunity to deliver in a manner that represents the market you are trying to succeed in. To turn around and crawl under technicalities like, "we never promised you a certain date" becomes just a bold affirmation of ones own incompetence and utter lack of comprehension of the role that consumer trust plays in the role of your business. Look at apple. They have the most loyal fanbase, so much so that people buy their **** on principle without thinking, and while they shaft them on price, specs, and basic functionalities - they don't leave them out to dry when it comes to support.
As far as the SD card goes, go to Motorola's site. It is one of the specs advertised.
Someone can try to portray this as my own personal unjustified gripe but objectivity speaking these are business practices that will tarnish anyone's reputation and make people hesitant to buy their ****. I don't control that, it stems from common sense.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA Premium App

The SD card issue on the US GED is a Google issue, everyone else is adding it aside from Google, so they need to answer this question. I don't think it's a huge issue though, it has 32GB of storage and I'm happy with that.
As for all the other complaints, yes, Moto are lying ****s, this isn't even a matter of debate anymore. But I still like my Xoom and I'm glad I bought it.

bmhanson said:
Where are you seeing that. I see $529 with a contract.
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Oh....
Sorry lol

Is America Screwed when it comes to Samsung?

First of all I am not what I would call a fan boy even though every major appliance in my house is a Samsung, even the dishwasher. I have an S3 phone and the Note 10.1 is my constant companion. Lately I have been wondering as we wait for JB update (both phone and tablet) if the Apple ruling in the USA is hampering the speed that we are getting Samsung updates or software. Hell, you can barely get any accessories for the Note 10.1 in the US much less an update. There are even issues with some software available on the the Samsung app store that due to licensing issues Samsung can't sell in the US but the rest of the world has full access.
I love my tablet and would not trade it for any other. Works great as it is and if JB never came I would be fine. However, I think that it is possible we will see a much different user experience here in the states over the next few years when it comes to Samsung Tablets and Phones than the rest of the world. Until Apple gets off the crack pipe and stops litigating every electronic item that comes out we may have an issue.
Thoughts?

rap6388 said:
...if the Apple ruling in the USA is hampering the speed that we are getting Samsung updates or software.
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It's just Samsung's priorities or lack thereof. HTC's just as bad. And both typically launch updates internationally first so our friends overseas aren't getting something we're not since other than the one German carrier ROM no Note has JB. The JB roll-out on the SGS3's not going particularly well and the One X JB update went back to the drawing board after problems were encountered when it was rolled out to the first region to receive it (Taiwan). So it’s the update process that sucks and the U.S. is just along for the ride.
Hell, you can barely get any accessories for the Note 10.1 in the US
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Or Europe. The car dock for the GN was released nine months after it was shown. Same thing for the wireless charging station for the SGS3. The U.S. actually got the book cover for the Note before Europe. The accessory line is just mismanaged; I don't think the U.S. fares better or worse than the rest of the world. And again, HTC's the same. Kind of makes you wonder why they offer accessories at all if they don't want to sell them.
I think that it is possible we will see a much different user experience here in the states over the next few years when it comes to Samsung Tablets and Phones than the rest of the world.
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You need to separate tablets and phones. Phones are always going to be a cluster here in the U.S because Samsung doesn't sell unlocked phones directly and the carriers here are notorious for their lack of urgency for getting updates out. The U.S. Wi-Fi Note is a Samsung direct device and so far hasn't been treated better or worse than its international relatives when it comes to updates. Samsung customizes the s/w by region for each device they sell. The U.S. is just another region and a big one at that. Certain Android features are blocked in the U.S. by both Samsung and HTC but so far that hasn’t appeared to affect the update schedule one way or the other.

Don't you guys never heard abaut ebay (de or gb). And considering on updates, sammobile page is available on whole earth.

No, its the same everywhere else. I'm in the uk and have received 0 updates.

im in egypt and no update
i wish the give the update to world wide very soon

I don't think I was clear. This is not about the JB update but just Samungs' position in the market right now with Apple hanging over their head based on the over the top billion dollar ruling.
For example, there is an app in Samsung market called DirectOffice Print. It is a great print app but the US owner can't buy the app on the app store because of contract issues Samsung has in the US. It is items like this and features that the US seem to miss that I am speaking of.

rap6388 said:
I don't think I was clear. This is not about the JB update but just Samungs' position in the market right now with Apple hanging over their head based on the over the top billion dollar ruling.
For example, there is an app in Samsung market called DirectOffice Print. It is a great print app but the US owner can't buy the app on the app store because of contract issues Samsung has in the US. It is items like this and features that the US seem to miss that I am speaking of.
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The Samsung App store not being able to manage payments in the U.S. is an infrastructure issue that has nothing to do with Apple. They've said U.S. payments will be in enable in Q1 2013. And the "billion dollar ruling" is a drop in the bucket; they made $7.4B in profit in Q3 of this year alone. By raising Apple's chip prices 20% they probably covered it if they indeed ever have to pay it. The Note V will be out by the time appeals are exhausted. If Samsung's not doing something or not doing it right it's because their Samsung. They get a lot right but they get a lot wrong too.

rap6388 said:
I don't think I was clear. This is not about the JB update but just Samungs' position in the market right now with Apple hanging over their head based on the over the top billion dollar ruling.
For example, there is an app in Samsung market called DirectOffice Print. It is a great print app but the US owner can't buy the app on the app store because of contract issues Samsung has in the US. It is items like this and features that the US seem to miss that I am speaking of.
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Well, as much as I hate to say it, this is how Sammy does business.
It's worse if you're in Canada.
Samsung Canada has a reciprocal agreement with Samsung USA not to sell to each other's market. But Samsung Canada doesn't feel there's much demand in Canada for computer products - just phones... (although it is getting better - we now have netbooks... Yes, that was sarcasm...) so we either get Samsung products late or not at all. And even though we're right on the border - we can cross border shop - we can't buy the products in the US online and have it shipped.
Ironically, Samsung opened their first North American full time store in Metrotown Mall in Burnaby British Columbia Canada (a suburb of Vancouver).but they can't show most of their products because they're not available in Canada and you can't buy them from the US.
And even though Canada uses the same cell and WiFi frequencies as the US, we get 'special' verisons of their products that block us from getting updates at the same time as the US. (That's why there's a GN 8010 AND a GN 8013 that are essentially identical). I had the same problem with my Galaxy Nexus phone - the Canadian version is a yakjuux which is supported (barely) by Samsung rather than the yakju version that's supported by Google directly,.
Like you - most of my hardware is Samsung - simply because they build exactly what I want. No one else does. But it means I have to drive to the US and buy these over the counter and drive them back, or have a friend in the US ship it to me.
I may like Samsung's products - but the company sucks...
Side note: Also, they're lousy at getting accessories in big box stores like Best Buy and Future Shop up here... I was trying to get a Note 10.1 Book case and the Samsung Store was out. They recommended going to BB or FS and I had to point out that neither of them actually carry any Samsung accessories - hell, it's hard enough finding the Note 10.1 in some of them...

I should have learned my lesson when I had my Tab 10.1, took them a year to update it to ICS. By the time they did that, I had been using unofficial ROM for about 4 months (give or take). Not acceptable. This is definitely my last Samsung tablet, even though I love it dearly. Samsung don't deserve one single dime for their awful commitment to customer's satisfaction.

Gotta get Nexus
if you want the latest ROMS

mrdaco said:
Don't you guys never heard abaut ebay (de or gb). And considering on updates, sammobile page is available on whole earth.
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That's not a solution. If I wanted to buy from unreliable and potentially shady resellers - I'd buy at Best Buy.
At least they have a return policy...
The point is that if you're going to make products, you should support them well. Or at all. Samsung is the leader in sales for smartphones and are rapidly growing in market share for tablets... yet they still can't get Best Buy to carry cases for their phones or tablets. All you get is the usual wall after wall of iDevice crap.
Best Buy isn't a charity - they carry what they think will sell - or what the manufacturer will pay them to carry (yes, surprise - manufacturers pay for special displays and 'endcaps' as well as for preferred positioning - higher on a shelf for example). Samsung has to spend a bit more to get the visibility Apple gets. They have to realise that customer support is more than just having a lousy website that's more about selling more product than about supporting the customers they already have...
But 'return customer' and 'customer loyalty' seems very low on Asian hardware maker's minds, it would seem.

TheWerewolf said:
But 'return customer' and 'customer loyalty' seems very low on Asian hardware maker's minds, it would seem.
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The h/w business is almost entirely Asian with the exception of Apple, Nokia, and Motorola. We've discussed update priorities, accessory availability, and general attention to existing customer's needs. Only Motorola sells Android devices so it's them vs. the Asians if you want to draw a comparison. I've owned devices from Motorola and most of the Asian manufacturers. Here's my conclusion: they all suck in the three categories we're discussing. Let's add a fourth category; product quality. Here's my quick assessment:
Samsung - Means well but gets caught up in their enormity. Their priority is clearly future sales but they generally tend to treat the existing customer base well. There are exceptions and the OG G-Tab update to ICS is a good one. By offering dozens of different s/w types on a single device they make their own life more difficult. Rolling out updates across regions is a cluster because of it. They have terrific warranty service and will pay roundtrip shipping for repairs and replace a device with a new one if parts aren't available. They suck at the number of accessories offered and making them available in a timely manner. Their products are generally well put together using premium components.
HTC - Has really been trying to get updates out more quickly and with better quality. The One X has been updated to three new Android versions and has gotten three new versions of Sense since March. In spite of that it still takes too long to get updates out and they've had some pretty bad s/w that's been deployed without being thoroughly tested. Their warranty service is hit or miss depending on region. The U.S. isn't too bad and they do seem to try to get things right. They have a really nice variety of accessories; good luck trying to find them in stock anywhere. Their products are made from premium components but they've had a lot of QC issues with their latest devices. Good examples are extremely well made. They don't provide warranty support for devices that have had their bootloaders unlocked.
LG - Their support in the U.S. is atrocious and the rest of the world is a mixed bag. An alarming number of their products over the past two years have had design and h/w issues. Examples are overheating, spontaneous rebooting, boot loops, and sporadic wireless performance. Both the new Optimus G and N4 have thermal throttling issues so it doesn't seem like much has changed. The HTC Droid DNA has the same chip set and isn't experiencing similar issues. They are absolutely atrocious at updates. They offer few accessories and what's offered is impossible to find. Their devices are built well but it doesn't matter if they have fatal design flaws. The customer has to pay to ship a device to LG for repair.
Asus - They put more effort in to serving their existing customers than any other Android manufacturer. They are quick to update their devices, have representatives commenting on XDA, and try to address issues they're made aware of. Their warranty service is atrocious with frequent claims of "customer induced damage" for known issues. It can take weeks to get a device repaired and it's difficult to get an accurate status. Customers pay shipping to get the device to Asus. Their products are made from inferior and in some cases outdated components. They also have an abnormally high number of QC issues. The latter two elements along with crappy repair service sort of negate their customer service efforts. They offer a few basic accessories that seem to be generally more available compared to other manufacturers. When they introduce a new device its a cluster trying to find it and, because they're offered in multiple colors, finding the matching keyboard. They don't provide warranty support for devices that have had their bootloaders unlocked.
Sony - There are tied with LG for being worst at keeping their devices updated. I'm not familiar with their mobile device service but I've used them for PC service and they've been very responsive. Their products are generally well made but always seem to be a cycle behind everyone else design, feature and s/w wise. They tend to do well with offering accessories and making them readily available but they are very expensive.
Motorola - Their support of existing customers is tragic compared to the Asians. Even after Google acquired them they announced that late-2011 high-end devices that they promised upgrades to ICS for wouldn't be receiving them. They offered affected customers $100 off a future Motorola phone instead. They are also worse than the Asians at updates they do roll out. Their warranty and repair service is generally good. Their products are well made but MotoBlur is considered the worst of the overlays. It has been toned down on newer phones but is still far less complete than Sense or TW. They offer quite a few accessories but they are quite expensive. They are fairly easy to find. But in comparing Motorola to the Asians their complete lack of regard for existing customers makes them the worst of a bad lot. They don't provide warranty support for devices that have had their bootloaders unlocked.​
So, at the end of the day, there aren't really any stand-out winners. Toshiba, Acer, and Lenovo are bit players based on the low volume of devices they sell so I haven't included them. From general observation they aren't typically known to be any better or worse than the companies I've described. So balancing all four criteria Samsung and HTC, IMHO, are the best of a bad lot (at least in the Android world). Since Samsung seems to be taking over the Android world any way we might not have to worry about comparisons for very much longer.
Thoughts? Personal experiences?

BarryH_GEG said:
The h/w business is almost entirely Asian with the exception of Apple, Nokia, and Motorola. We've discussed update priorities, accessory availability, and general attention to existing customer's needs. Only Motorola sells Android devices so it's them vs. the Asians if you want to draw a comparison. I've owned devices from Motorola and most of the Asian manufacturers. Here's my conclusion: they all suck in the three categories we're discussing. Let's add a fourth category; product quality. Here's my quick assessment:
...
So, at the end of the day, there aren't really any stand-out winners. Toshiba, Acer, and Lenovo are bit players based on the low volume of devices they sell so I haven't included them. From general observation they aren't typically known to be any better or worse than the companies I've described. So balancing all four criteria Samsung and HTC, IMHO, are the best of a bad lot (at least in the Android world). Since Samsung seems to be taking over the Android world any way we might not have to worry about comparisons for very much longer.
Thoughts? Personal experiences?
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Sounds like Samsung should hire Asus to support their products and Asus should get Samsung build their products.

Vincent9756 said:
Sounds like Samsung should hire Asus to support their products and Asus should get Samsung build their products.
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Here's the difference between Asus and Samsung/HTC when it comes to updates. Asus is the hands-down winner for getting updates out the door the fastest. But in doing so, it takes at least three subsequent updates to make the initial update complete. Samsung and HTC are painfully slow but (usually) the updates they get out are pretty solid. By that time, because Asus had to update the update multiple times, they arrive at the same place at the same time. Kind of a "tortoise vs. the hare" thing.

BarryH_GEG said:
The h/w business is almost entirely Asian with the exception of Apple, Nokia, and Motorola. We've discussed update priorities, accessory availability, and general attention to existing customer's needs. Only Motorola sells Android devices so it's them vs. the Asians if you want to draw a comparison. I've owned devices from Motorola and most of the Asian manufacturers. Here's my conclusion: they all suck in the three categories we're discussing. Let's add a fourth category; product quality. Here's my quick assessment:
...
So, at the end of the day, there aren't really any stand-out winners. Toshiba, Acer, and Lenovo are bit players based on the low volume of devices they sell so I haven't included them. From general observation they aren't typically known to be any better or worse than the companies I've described. So balancing all four criteria Samsung and HTC, IMHO, are the best of a bad lot (at least in the Android world). Since Samsung seems to be taking over the Android world any way we might not have to worry about comparisons for very much longer.
Thoughts? Personal experiences?
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I agree. I wasn't actually making a 'Western vs Asian' comparison - although rereading what I wrote, it does come across that way. Unfortunately, Apple is kind of the bar for support, quality and attention to detail, even with their recent decline in all three areas.
But my experiences with HP, for example - with their Slate 500 was odd - they had delivery problems, but they really went the extra mile to make up for it. In fact, in my own case, they ended up giving me almost a 30% discount for being late. I didn't even ask for it. They did screw up by choosing n-Trig for the digitiser - but at the time, it seemed a logical choice.
I only have one major experience with Dell - I bought an Axion Windows Mobile PDA that failed. They sent me a box in which to return it at no cost... and a new unit along with the box - also at no cost.
Of course, I have a Transformer Prime - and it's such a mixed bag of hurt and happy. As you note - the device feels right - and they got a lot right about it. It has the best USB driver support of any tablet out there. It provides enough USB power to run a hard drive. The dock is brilliant. And then they mess up something as basic as the GPS, WiFi and Bluetooth. And I think most of us could have dealt with that - if Asus hadn't utterly botched their response to the problem by essentially admitting the problem, then failing to fix it, then claiming the GPS wasn't meant for serious use (commerical GPS? What?) then trying to erase history by removing the feature from the box, then sending everyone a free GPS dongle that was just horribly thought out... and didn't fix the WiFi or BT issues. To add insult to injury - they announce a replacement pair of Transformers with the problem fixed... just two weeks after finally shipping the Prime - which was late. But the Infinity was supposed to be $100 more (which kind of took some of the pain away) - only to finally ship at the exact same price as the Prime.
Oh.. and then just after getting the dongle, the Prime's back camera died and that took a month to get repaired...
That's a lot of bad PR and bad customer support in one ball of hurt.
I bought an HTC Surround - the design made it impossible to remove the back without holding the screen which is on a slider. I sent it back after just two months of ownership because after upgrading to WP7.5 the screen started to act oddly.They claimed that the strain on the screen damaged it and refused to repair or replace it under warranty - demanding $250.
Which brings us back to Apple for a moment - I bought an iPhone 3G and two weeks afters the warranty expired, the 3G radio fried. When I took it back, they refused service - but offered refurb replacement.. also for $250. I asked if I could pay extra and upgrade to the 3Gs, but they refused claiming that their agreement with the cellco prohibited that. You'll pardon me when I get annoyed at people who go on about how great Apple's customer support is and how 'they'll replace or repair broken devices, even if they're a little over warranty...' Riiiight.
So, yes, as much as I hate to say it - at the moment, Samsung is the least evil current choice....
But it's definitely not what I would call a great choice...

TheWerewolf said:
Apple is kind of the bar for support, quality and attention to detail, even with their recent decline in all three areas.
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I totally agree. Part of it is because Apple's a marketing culture. They have always believed that pulling customers in with an excellent experience (h/w, s/w, content, support) and not relegating the control of the experience to others would lead them to loyalty, advocacy, scale, and profit. Looking at their market cap you can't argue with their approach. But their stock's dropped 20% since September while Samsung's been selling record numbers of devices and reeling in record profits. Samsung is no Apple and I don't think they'd ever be able to adapt that culture. But Apple's begun to bore people by sticking to their formula while everyone else is offering bolder more individualized experiences. The aging of Apple's demographic and adoption of Android by younger market segments doesn't bode well for Apple's future. At some point they are going to have to do something interesting and it isn't making the iPhone's display taller. Remember their famous "1984" commercial and the "think different" campaign? They've become what they used to parody.

I'm from Australia and thought much the same particularly with accessory availability. Then I moved to kenya of all places. Here Samsung is the undisputed champion. Nobody has an Iphone. Everyone has Samsung. Accessories are everywhere. All the major Supermarkets have a phone shop inside them and nearly all carry accessories en masse.
It makes an enormous difference to the functionality and usefulness of the product when you can do things like plug a flash drive into it or plug it into your TV. There are also many dedicated Samsung shops around the place. Although for some reason they seem to get the products later than the other retailers.
Samsung can definitely get it right in certain regions. I'm not sure why it struggles in others
Sent from my GT-N8000 using xda app-developers app

Simple, its what the public wants... Or thinks it wants...
Samsung have started to push out adverts here in Oz, especially S3 and SGNote 10.1, now when you rarely ever used to see their phones advertised. Apple was everywhere...
The shops are simply responding to what the customers want... Everyone was buying apple products, so naturally you stock Apple accessories with a few other brand accessories too. But if the lions share of customers want Apple products, why would you stock with only a few Apple accessories and have a whole heap of stuff you can't sell because the perceived market isn't there? That would be, from a sellers point of view, madness...
Until public opinion and buying habits shift noticeably then we are stuck with shops full of Crapple merchandise. When Android becomes a major seller, this is where standardisation is good, then we'll see the stock move to that area instead as profit drops for Apple stock... Unfortunately there's still a perception among retailers that Apple is an easy sell... That and the fact that there are a million different types of android tablet and phones out in the world, and there's only so many things they are prepared to stock while generally all Apple stuff fit or was useable by all apple customers... Until Iphone 5 that is...

The issue as I have always understood it has many sides. First Apple builds their OS for their devices, no one else gets it no other hardware can run it so they only have to optimize and remove features based on the generation of the device (3GS, 4, 4S, etc) and what will and won't work.
Now for Android OEM's they have a couple of challenges. First Google makes the OS and unless you are chosen for a Nexus launch you won't get the new OS in its finished state until after that (don't recall when JB 4.1.1 came out) so they have to wait.
Then the OEM's have to decide which devices can and cannot run the software based on the crippled (carrier specified hardware in the USA) so devices that are less than a year old get screwed over (HTC 2012 and 2011). Then they have to make sure their drivers work since not ever one of their phones (and tablets) uses the same processor or family of processors so we have Texas Instruments, Qualcomm, Samsung, Intel, etc. Then the priority is always given to the latest hardware going out the door since you want your newest hardware to (hopefully) be running the most current OS you had in the pipeline, or in our case JB 4.1.1. Then they start to update for devices they can support.
Now what I see as a huge issue and is the heart of fragmentation is Google's failure to set standards and timelines from both the OEM's and Carriers (USA are the offenders here) to deliver the OS updates. Google should be collaborating with the OEM's to enforce software rollouts. They could also put forth some type of awareness campaign to insure users are in the know and can have an expectation from their carrier and OEM that they will get that update. Oh wait that was the Android Alliance crap announced last year that did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
For me I would be fine with my GN 10.1 and soon GN 2 running some iteration of JellyBean hopefully 4.2 so it has the enhanced security features etc.

BarryH_GEG said:
I totally agree. Part of it is because Apple's a marketing culture. They have always believed that pulling customers in with an excellent experience (h/w, s/w, content, support) and not relegating the control of the experience to others would lead them to loyalty, advocacy, scale, and profit. Looking at their market cap you can't argue with their approach. But their stock's dropped 20% since September while Samsung's been selling record numbers of devices and reeling in record profits. Samsung is no Apple and I don't think they'd ever be able to adapt that culture. But Apple's begun to bore people by sticking to their formula while everyone else is offering bolder more individualized experiences. The aging of Apple's demographic and adoption of Android by younger market segments doesn't bode well for Apple's future. At some point they are going to have to do something interesting and it isn't making the iPhone's display taller. Remember their famous "1984" commercial and the "think different" campaign? They've become what they used to parody.
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Just gotta say: iCustomers are snobby, horribly wretched, self-absorbed "high designer" wanna-be's. Apple's hw is far from impeccable, the sw is strangling. They're good at glamour (making something appear far better than it actually is). Samsung is unfortunately trying to cut into that crowd, and I think they'd do better to provide a strong counter position: a tablet that lasts for years instead of 6 months. A phone that makes it to the next upgrade cycle (like the gNex).
Early 20th century design principles (built to last decades-- ie heirloom quality) should be a global standard....yes I know I'm pipe dreaming here....
Apple IMO has made it difficult for Samsung to really get behind its own products in the US, but it's jot just apple, mobile device carriers have lobbied our government, fcc, and individual manufacturers to NOT release things like the p6800 or the n8000 because carriers want you to buy a phone AND a tablet with a data plan, not just a tabletnwith telephony hardware... so f***ing sick of our markets being manipulated by the big players, people don't even know that there ARE tablets available with telephony hw... blah...
Sent from my GT-N8013 using XDA Premium HD app

Lenovo is buying Motorola Mobility from Google

TechCrunch has confirmed reports that Lenovo is buying Motorola Mobility from Google. This is the division within Google that the company purchased in 2011 for $12.5 billion. Motorola Mobility will go to Lenovo for $2.91 billion.
http://techcrunch.com/2014/01/29/lenovo-to-buy-motorola-mobility-from-google/
I don't know this is good or bad?
May be lenovo can open atrix source

I dont know good or bad... What I know is... Google came... screwed Atrix community... and then went away.

Google will maintain ownership of the vast majority of the Motorola Mobility patent portfolio.
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Pretty sure at least some if not all of the patents included in the Atrix are a part of this.

Google brought Moto just want its patents in case others contestant own them, now sold some of patents, and using Lenovo to against Samsung.

I think it's good, Google needs partners and vendors needs android. So, Motorola was a problem. This answers also limited availability of Moto X and Moto G. Motorola under Google was "undervolted" because vendors
Sent from my Nexus 5 using xda app-developers app

I guess Motorola is now considered a "low end" cell phone company. That's all Lenovo does is low end business. They just bought IBM's low end server business last week. Our company supplies us with Lenovo laptops, they suck.

It's amazing how experiences can differ so greatly. My last four business laptops (including the one I'm using right now) were Lenovo ThinkPads. They were the best laptops I've ever had (and I had many). I even kept one as my private laptop. If for some reason I had to buy a new laptop right now, it would be a ThinkPad. A lot of my peers here share this opinion. I've never heard anybody complain about a ThinkPad, ever (well, except maybe girls, because they're "too black and ugly", lol).
I know next to nothing about IBM's server line so I can't comment on that.
Back on topic. I don't really know what to make of this deal. So far Lenovo has been making reasonably decent smartphones but there weren't many and they weren't really marketed too much. Maybe they're looking into changing that, just like buying the ThinkPad line from IBM was in fact their way to a more global market? Not quite sure what Google is getting out of this.

Google is washing their hands of a money-losing business whilst keeping control of the patents (which is what they really bought Motorola Mobility for in the first place). Lenovo gets the Motorola brand name and marketing contacts in North America. Probably a pretty decent deal for both.
I've got an interest in the china phones available and the Lenovo smartphones, whilst not groundbreaking in any particular way, are very well thought of.
I don't think anyone can claim that they produce nothing but low end phones, either:
http://shop.lenovo.com/us/en/smartphones/vibe/vibe-z/#features
Snapdragon 800 chipset, 2GB memory, 5.5 inch fullHD screen, LTE support, Gorilla Glass 3, 13MP BSI camera and large battery. Hardly a low end device! Certainly much more powerful and highly-specced than any phone ever released by Motorola, in fact!
Similarly, I've never heard anybody complain about ThinkPads in the past as I've always thought that these are considered a cut about laptops from Acer, Asus, Toshiba and the like!

Exactly! Big G got it's share. The ThinkPad line was well translated from IBM. If they do the same with Motorola, it will do -at the very least- just fine with Lenovo.

Moto G: The last powerful well-made budget phone

The reason why Google bought Motorola Mobility for 12 billion dollars and sold it for three is that it stripped the company of most of its patents before selling it. Patents are what enable companies to use technologies without having to pay expensive licensing agreements with patent owners. And failing to do so can result in extremely costly legal battles.
Lenovo has its own share of patents, and there are a few little stringy bits of IP flesh left on Motorola’s bones. But without the old library of Motorola patents to hand, making a new phone as cheap and good as the Moto G may simply not be possible.
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http://www.trustedreviews.com/opinions/will-the-moto-g-be-the-last-great-motorola-phone​

Although I have a Nexus 5, this makes me feellike I should maybe get the Moto G GPE just as a backup

Talk about oxymoron for a website name.
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Google got 17000 patents when they bought moto and now while selling moto to lenovo, they gave only 2000 patents. But lenovo got the license for the remaining patents as part of the sale. So they have all the technology to develop great quality phones like moto g.
But moto g is now sold at very low margin because mighty google can afford it(It'll make it up in software). But lenovo is no google. so they have to sell at higher margin to bring profit. So even if they make phones like moto g, the price will be higher...

satheesh.a said:
But moto g is now sold at very low margin because mighty google can afford it(It'll make it up in software). But lenovo is no google. so they have to sell at higher margin to bring profit. So even if they make phones like moto g, the price will be higher...
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Motorola already stated they were making a decent profit margin on the Moto G. I don't think Lenovo would have a problem making a small profit on a low end phone. All low end phones have small margins. Lenovo is in a lot of countries that require low-end phones. It seems like a perfect match to me.

bozzykid said:
Motorola already stated they were making a decent profit margin on the Moto G. I don't think Lenovo would have a problem making a small profit on a low end phone. All low end phones have small margins. Lenovo is in a lot of countries that require low-end phones. It seems like a perfect match to me.
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Plus they are used to razor thin margins from their PC business.
I just hope they won't screw everyone by using exclusively MTK crap (like in most of their current phones). Or if they do, at least they should twist MTK's arm (see what I did there?) to release sources...

bozzykid said:
Motorola already stated they were making a decent profit margin on the Moto G. I don't think Lenovo would have a problem making a small profit on a low end phone. All low end phones have small margins. Lenovo is in a lot of countries that require low-end phones. It seems like a perfect match to me.
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I agree with you that lenovo being ok with low margin. But they'll be ok until getting enough market share. after that they'll increase margins to bring in money... If you think moto g's margin is "decent", then check out profit margin of samsung and apple
I believe lenovo bought moto mainly to gain market share in US and latin america. In asian market[low-end phone market], they are already stronger than motorola.But they'll try to push motorola in asian market because of it's well established brand name in mobile industry..
try reading this one http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702303497804579242511374858016

satheesh.a said:
I agree with you that lenovo being ok with low margin. But they'll be ok until getting enough market share. after that they'll increase margins to bring in money... If you think moto g's margin is "decent", then check out profit margin of samsung and apple
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Samsung has terrible margins on most of their phones they sell that aren't part of their flagship family. Samsung's last few quarters has shown their profit margins going down even more. No one has found a way to make high profit margins on low end phones. The only way to win that war is with volume. I don't see Lenovo changing much with the Moto G looking forward. When they take control of Motorola it will be at least a year or two before they can really make an sweeping changes.

mazinya said:
Although I have a Nexus 5, this makes me feellike I should maybe get the Moto G GPE just as a backup
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Why? So you can have a smartphone just to have it collecting dust, losing value, and becoming obsolete instead of using it?

Nexus 6 - Trash Or Treasure

The end of Motorola has been announced.
Will the Nexus 6 become a prized possession, reminiscent of Motorola's accomplishments? Or maybe it will be forgotten, collecting dust alongside other phones that fell victim to the expansive mobile industry.
For me personally, the Nexus 6 is perhaps the best Motorola phone made. Call it nostalgia, but I will always love my n6. Goodbye Motorola, and thanks for the memories.
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

Didnt know about the announcement but me an motorola go way back. People didn't even know what smartphone was back in the day (aside from tech people of course) and i was rocking Motorola mp200 windows smartphone edition, one of the best phones made. This is a sad day.
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

So all products of Motorola are going away? It says they are still keeping the branding which makes it sound like they are removing the official name but still making the products under Levano

Lenovo isn't really ending Motorola Mobility. They are rebranding some phones like the Moto X and the budget devices will become Lenovo vibe phones.
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

Treasure.

I bought this stuff recently.
And I'm sure it's worth for 200$ disregarding its low quality.

Not worried about it. They are still keeping the Moto name though.

What`s in a name?

I don't see anything special with Nexus 6 except motorola's collabration with Google. Otherwise It is just a beefed up moto x. There were devices made and engineered by motorola once in a time and that era ended with the Droid Razr.

dryfy said:
The end of Motorola has been announced.
Will the Nexus 6 become a prized possession, reminiscent of Motorola's accomplishments? Or maybe it will be forgotten, collecting dust alongside other phones that fell victim to the expansive mobile industry.
For me personally, the Nexus 6 is perhaps the best Motorola phone made. Call it nostalgia, but I will always love my n6. Goodbye Motorola, and thanks for the memories.
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Either you misread the article you read on it, or the author of that article misread the press release from Lenovo.
What is happening, is they are redefining the Motorola BRAND as exclusively premium, and merging all of the non-premium offerings in with Lenovo.
In other words, Lenovo = low/mid tier products, Motorola = high.
This move is to prevent product duplication. There is no point in having a high-end motorola competing with a high-end lenovo and a low end motorola competing with a low end lenovo.
Nexus 6 is a premium device, and a similar product would still carry the Motorola branding. So for us, nothing to see here.

TREASURE
Nexus 6 on sale for $249-$299
AMAZON.com running brand new 32G and 64G Nexus 6 sale again, until February 1st.

doitright said:
Either you misread the article you read on it, or the author of that article misread the press release from Lenovo.
What is happening, is they are redefining the Motorola BRAND as exclusively premium, and merging all of the non-premium offerings in with Lenovo.
In other words, Lenovo = low/mid tier products, Motorola = high.
This move is to prevent product duplication. There is no point in having a high-end motorola competing with a high-end lenovo and a low end motorola competing with a low end lenovo.
Nexus 6 is a premium device, and a similar product would still carry the Motorola branding. So for us, nothing to see here.
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The thing that sucks is that they actually aren't using the full name "Motorola". The products will be just "MOTO" and they're keeping the "M" logo. You're right about the plan though:
Lenovo, which bought Motorola Mobility from Google in 2014, is unifying its two phone businesses under the Lenovo name. It's going to use Motorola's Moto brand for high-end products and its homegrown Vibe brand for budget devices. The Motorola name isn't completely gone. It will live on from a corporate perspective as a division of the Chinese consumer-electronics giant, said Motorola Chief Operating Officer Rick Osterloh... his business group will soon take over all mobile operations at Lenovo. This means bringing Vibe phones into markets where Moto exists, and vice versa.
In markets where the Lenovo name is strong, the company intends to introduce the Moto line as an upscale product.
- CNet
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Dusty Rhodes said:
The thing that sucks is that they actually aren't using the full name "Motorola". The products will be just "MOTO" and they're keeping the "M" logo. You're right about the plan though:
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I wasn't aware of that aspect of it.
Well, what else could you expect from China?

Treasure

Trash for sure. The Motorola Nexus 6 is the biggest piece of junk garbage phone I've ever owned. I take my phone out to take a photo of something and I'm waiting for the camera app to open so I can take the photo, my wife takes her iPhone out and takes the photo before my Nexus 6 will respond. I'm on my 2nd Nexus 6 and about to ask for another RMA because of the garbled/distorted notification sounds issue that so many others have. What really pisses me off is that I used to enjoy flashing custom ROMs and all that fun stuff - now I stick to only the Google images or Android N previews and I'm afraid to root the phone because it's so damned buggy. This phone undoubtedly has been the worst android phone experience I've had. I used to love flashing the custom ROMs and having all the new features - now I just want a phone that I can reliably use. I can't wait for my 2 year contract with Project Fi to end so I can get a different phone.

Treasure...love my N6.

Treasure. Though it was a toss-up between the Nexus 6 and the Moto X Pure 2015, the Nexus won out. My roommate got the Pure.

Treasure of course .

Definitely treasure. I've had my N6 since December and couldn't be happier. Huge screen, good build quality, wireless and turbo charging, excellent front speakers, great battery life (6+ hrs SOT) good enough camera and lots of custom ROMs.

Treasure of course. I have been using it for 3 months and it's the best Android I have ever owned. And i have not experienced any lags or hiccups whatsoever. Everything is smooth, battery timing is great. Couldn't be happier.