Related
I mean the description "For all your questions" pretty much covers anything that would be asked anywhere else? Just sayin.
For instance. "What screen do I have, Epson or Novatek?". It is a question but some one would give me a tip on how to figure it out.
Yea they're pretty sub-forum happy here.
i like the way it is...
i like it i would rather go to q & a for my questions than weed through answers to questions that are buried beneath topics like 'cool tricks' or 'would you rather the droid x' ...i like it for those reasons.
I think of it this way, Q&A is just that, general is more like an off topic forum just for us
PAPutzback said:
I mean the description "For all your questions" pretty much covers anything that would be asked anywhere else? Just sayin.
For instance. "What screen do I have, Epson or Novatek?". It is a question but some one would give me a tip on how to figure it out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Shouldn't this post go in the Q&A forum??? It IS a quesiton!
If everyone used it properly and only asked questions in the Q&A section then it would be fine.
But since the reality is different it just makes it more work for everyone to check both sub forums.
-------------------------------------
Sent via the XDA Tapatalk App
ramiss said:
If everyone used it properly and only asked questions in the Q&A section then it would be fine.
But since the reality is different it just makes it more work for everyone to check both sub forums.
-------------------------------------
Sent via the XDA Tapatalk App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True, I'm amazed so many people are allergic to logic.
I am a programmer and for the masses I live by the KISS rule. Not the disco rock band, the Keep It Simple Stupid rule. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KISS_principle
No, what is odd to me is that you knew there was a General and a Question forum, so ignorance can't be the excuse, and you STILL posted a question in the General forum.
Minjin said:
No, what is odd to me is that you knew there was a General and a Question forum, so ignorance can't be the excuse, and you STILL posted a question in the General forum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Except that I think the OP was more of a Statement formed as an ironic question.
Well the general forum has pretty much turned into crap. So the q/a forum is a place to go to actually help people without the general forum's level of retardation.
nebenezer said:
True, I'm amazed so many people are allergic to logic.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
After working retail so long, my amazement at that has long died XD
If I'm supposed to put my questions in the Q&A section, why is it not available on the mobile app? Our am I missing something? Lol
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA Premium App
WRONG SECTION!!!!!! jk
I had the same issue and just un installed and reinstalled the app and it came up.
*edit* Previous thread.
good day.
ragarm said:
If I'm supposed to put my questions in the Q&A section, why is it not available on the mobile app? Our am I missing something? Lol
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The q&a section is a joke, now all you hear is wrong section!, wrong section!... what is the point exactly? I just was reading a post where a guy was getting yelled at for posting a question in the question forum...
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
ziggy484 said:
The q&a section is a joke, now all you hear is wrong section!, wrong section!... what is the point exactly? I just was reading a post where a guy was getting yelled at for posting a question in the question forum...
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which thread was that you were reading?
Yeah, can you link me? More than likely it was a thread that was moved after the question was asked an the yelling happened.
Moderated from my HTC HD2 using XDA Premium.
That's exactly what I was thinking. Probably the ROM/Kernel combo for battery life thread.
ashasaur said:
Yeah, can you link me? More than likely it was a thread that was moved after the question was asked an the yelling happened.
Moderated from my HTC HD2 using XDA Premium.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well im sure not going to waste time looking for it again... but lets say your right and it was moved after the yelling, how about why all the yelling anyway? Only at xda are the majority of conversations polluted with arguing over where to properly post. Ok fine, dont post general stuff in the dev section, thats a no brainer... but q&a, and general are the same thing.
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
ziggy484 said:
Well im sure not going to waste time looking for it again... but lets say your right and it was moved after the yelling, how
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Moved by the moderator. OP thought he was posting his thread in the General section when he was actually posting in the developer section. Not hard to find. Is this the thread to which you were referring?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1028286
landshark68 said:
Moved by the moderator. OP thought he was posting his thread in the General section when he was actually posting in the developer section. Not hard to find. Is this the thread to which you were referring?
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1028286
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its development section, not developer... are you suggesting that only the devs are allowed to post anything there?
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
ziggy484 said:
Its development section, not developer... are you suggesting that only the devs are allowed to post anything there?
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, sorry. Development section. I'm not suggesting anything. I was just trying to answer your question as to how it got moved.
landshark68 said:
No, sorry. Development section. I'm not suggesting anything. I was just trying to answer your question as to how it got moved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok... but tell me the truth, does there really need to be q&a and general? Isnt the whole nature of android forums, people asking, others answering?
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
ziggy484 said:
Ok... but tell me the truth, does there really need to be q&a and general? Isnt the whole nature of android forums, people asking, others answering?
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see the confusion generated by the q&a and general sections. What kind of questions belong in which? I just started posting here with some frequency like 3 weeks ago. I agree the whole nature of forums is asking and answering questions, sharing information, and helping each other out. I think how each forum handles that and how they are formatted are going to be different. I'm not a moderator or anything like that. I'm just someone who is wanting to share information and give and get answers and I'm still trying to figure out exactly how this forum is structured. Still haven't nailed down all the rules and particulars, but I keep searching. I know pretty much all the devs hang out here, so I figure it must be a good place to get some good info.
ziggy484 said:
Ok... but tell me the truth, does there really need to be q&a and general? Isnt the whole nature of android forums, people asking, others answering?
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How about we take a step back and think about this.
You're asking why is there even a Q and A & General Forum. Well think about if there was just a Samsung Fascinate forum, and nothing more. Everything lumped together. Better yet how about we just make a Samsung forum, people can ask what they want about any Samsung android device. Sounds great right, everyone has a voice and there is no way it would be complicated to use!
The reason they are here is to help you, to help me, to help the devs, to help everyone. Order and organization is the name of the game.
There has to be structure, that is why if you have a question about the Samsung Fascinate and/or its development you place it in the Q and A forum. If you have something you would like to bring up in "general" then..... you see where this is going.
We can either have one large room with everyone yelling at different people, or smaller rooms where there is no need to raise your voice!
But there is no real yelling on a forum, its online. The tense of any one sentence is how you make it.
gkirby11 said:
How about we take a step back and think about this.
You're asking why is there even a Q and A & General Forum. Well think about if there was just a Samsung Fascinate forum, and nothing more. Everything lumped together. Better yet how about we just make a Samsung forum, people can ask what they want about any Samsung android device. Sounds great right, everyone has a voice and there is no way it would be complicated to use!
The reason they are here is to help you, to help me, to help the devs, to help everyone. Order and organization is the name of the game.
There has to be structure, that is why if you have a question about the Samsung Fascinate and/or its development you place it in the Q and A forum. If you have something you would like to bring up in "general" then..... you see where this is going.
We can either have one large room with everyone yelling at different people, or smaller rooms where there is no need to raise your voice!
But there is no real yelling on a forum, its online. The tense of any one sentence is how you make it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry, but that makes no sense... all you need is general and development for each device
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
ziggy484 said:
Sorry, but that makes no sense... all you need is general and development for each device
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I guess the themes and apps section and the accessories section should be put in general? That would make the general section completely unusable.
To the OP, all you need to do is remove the fascinate forum from your favorites. when you add it back to favorites, q&a should be there.
As far as what should go where:
General should be for general discussions like "what rom and why?"
Q&a should be for questions like, "how do I fix xyz?"
If anything should be changed, maybe q&a needs to be renamed "help"
ziggy484 said:
Its development section, not developer... are you suggesting that only the devs are allowed to post anything there?
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sounds like a good suggestion to me. I think only devs should be thread starters in the dev section.
Lemme break it down for you all:
General is for everything that is a general discussion, not a specific question. Is it confusing, yes. Does it mean that people will still post questions without searching? Yes. But that's why you all have me, I can sort it all out.
Q&A is self described. All questions, whether they are specific device questions or development questions are to be posted within the Q&A section.
Accessories is of course for accessories. Not much to say.
Development is ONLY meant for the releasing of new ROMs and such. General discussion or questions are not permitted within the development section. With the exception of kernel or source discussions, all general development discussion should be posted within the general section.
And themes and apps is self explanatory.
Now, not to be a douche, but if you don't like my rules...don't post! I for one am getting tired of having to stop these arguments when all I am asking is that people read the XDA rules, post in the correct section and use the search button before posting.
Any beef should be brought to me via PM.
Word.-saur
ashasaur said:
Lemme break it down for you all:
General is for everything that is a general discussion, not a specific question. Is it confusing, yes. Does it mean that people will still post questions without searching? Yes. But that's why you all have me, I can sort it all out.
Q&A is self described. All questions, whether they are specific device questions or development questions are to be posted within the Q&A section.
Accessories is of course for accessories. Not much to say.
Development is ONLY meant for the releasing of new ROMs and such. General discussion or questions are not permitted within the development section. With the exception of kernel or source discussions, all general development discussion should be posted within the general section.
And themes and apps is self explanatory.
Now, not to be a douche, but if you don't like my rules...don't post! I for one am getting tired of having to stop these arguments when all I am asking is that people read the XDA rules, post in the correct section and use the search button before posting.
Any beef should be brought to me via PM.
Word.-saur
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I for one am tired of you acting like such a big shot... and rambling on about YOUR rules and where to post this and that, blah blah blah. but thats why i dont come here much anymore. You and chopperdog, and landshark all think your so much better than everyone else
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
ziggy484 said:
I for one am tired of you acting like such a big shot... and rambling on about YOUR rules and where to post this and that, blah blah blah. but thats why i dont come here much anymore. You and chopperdog, and landshark all think your so much better than everyone else
Sent from a Superclean Fascinate
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He is laying out the rules, how is that acting like a big shot? Would you rather have an unmoderated, disorganized, cumpled together forum? If that is the case then you are in a very small group of people with that type of preference. You dont have to be here if you dont want to, so why punish yourself if you clearly dont like being here?
The Q&A forum makes perfect sense, as does breaking the forum up based on specific interests. It makes people with certain interests able to more easily find the information they seek as well as get answers to the specific answers they have. It also cuts down on the clutter than can liter a forum because it clumps all information together.
The ONLY reason I made ANY rules is because YOU, as the collective users of the Fascinate section wanted them, you wanted order, and I gave it to you. If you don't feel that my simple rules are worth your time to follow, then do us all a favor and don't post. There are plenty of more open minded users who are happy with the way things are going, and appreciate a little order and structure over the chaos that once was.
Moderated from my HTC HD2 using XDA Premium.
I don't mean to complain, but rather voice my opinion on the fact that these forums for the gs3 are just too messy. I don't think it's efficient to have one forum for gs3 themes when they're not compatible across different carriers.
I'm just saying that we're all modding our phones here, which we all know can end disastrously if something is flashed that shouldn't be. And it seems like every other post in the T-mobile development forums are people with Sprint variants asking questions about compatibility etc etc. I'm here to read about my phone, and mods that are applicable to my device, not people having problems or questions about a phone variant I don't even own. Not to mention it's annoying to see a theme I like, only to find out there's no version for my T-mobile variant.
I can understand the General/Q&A/Accessories forums being unified, but themes? It's already been clearly stated that they don't work across each carrier so why are they all mushed together in one forum? I liked the layout before; 5 subsections for each carriers device, and I don't think this new breakdown is as efficient as it could be.
Well there's different forums for each carriers Android development at least. But I agree I don't like combining all carriers into one general forum
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using xda app-developers app
Agreed, this place is a mess. I can understand having all the US variants under one "main" section of the forums, but I would then have 4 subforums: AT&T, T-Mo, Sprint, & Verizon, and then each of those subforums have a General, Q&A, Development, & theme section. Leave the accessories subsection under the "main" US GS3 section.
Thank you for using this thread as a solution instead of adding much more "mess" to our section. Please take the time to enjoy our many other "mess" threads regarding your "opinion"
Here is an ideal one. :good:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1734159
Mods should delete crap threads immediately
Sent from my MB855 using xda premium
1SiK1500 said:
Thank you for using this thread as a solution instead of adding much more "mess" to our section. Please take the time to enjoy our many other "mess" threads regarding your "opinion"
Here is an ideal one. :good:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1734159
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think that's kind of what OP is talking about. I saw that thread a while ago but haven't been able to find anything without spending 20 minutes scrolling. Or subscribing to every thread I read and wanted to get back to. Search has proven useless from the phone.
Sent from my DROIDX
Now we have multiple development forums for each carrier but for some reason we cannot manage to have discussion forums based on the carrier? Why not? This does not make any sense at all.
Trying to sort through all the info is a real pain in the neck. I am the type that tries to read everything I can to avoid stupid questions that can be easily researched, but the current format seems dysfunctional to me.
Most posters do not tell us what carrier they are on when asking questions or providing information, so much of the info is a waste.
No offense intended toward the mods, but I believe there is a better way to handle this phone.
I have had multiple phones and have never seen so many issues on an XDA forum before.
PS. can we unsticky the pre-order discussions yet? I find it annoying when viewing the forums on my phone to have to scroll past useless threads.
Sorry for the mini rant...
Hope everyone has a great day!
What's your suggestion?
Agree, there needs to be an entire section for each carrier. General, development , QnA, and themes.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
I agree that things could be cleaned up a bit. I think it would be better if the "Original Development" forums were subforums of each of the Development forums. I like that the development forums are separated by carrier and that all the other forums are not, but there's no reason to have two completely separate development boards for each carrier. I also think some of the stickies in general discussion could be taken down.
jcbofkc said:
Now we have multiple development forums for each carrier but for some reason we cannot manage to have discussion forums based on the carrier? Why not? This does not make any sense at all.
Trying to sort through all the info is a real pain in the neck. I am the type that tries to read everything I can to avoid stupid questions that can be easily researched, but the current format seems dysfunctional to me.
Most posters do not tell us what carrier they are on when asking questions or providing information, so much of the info is a waste.
No offense intended toward the mods, but I believe there is a better way to handle this phone.
I have had multiple phones and have never seen so many issues on an XDA forum before.
PS. can we unsticky the pre-order discussions yet? I find it annoying when viewing the forums on my phone to have to scroll past useless threads.
Sorry for the mini rant...
Hope everyone has a great day!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Comment removed.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using xda premium
I agree that it is a mess. The new "Original" development section does not make sense. We do not need it and we did fine without having it in the Nexus One forums.
Can we make a development forum that pertains to all devices and then have a separate one that only works for the individual devices. E.g.: Kernels would go in device specific development, and then ROMs/scripts that work for all devices would go in the general development forum.
The last thing I need to do is scour the ATT, Verizon, and Sprint development + their Original Development Forums to see if I can use any of their ROMs/Scripts, etc... 9 different development forums are too many!!
Why does each carrier have two separate development forums anyway? The ones on the bottom don't even have anything in them really? I thought this was some type of error.
jsmcmahon89 said:
Comment removed.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry. I should have provided the solution.
Go back to the original format when the forums were based by carrier. I know it would help new folks. As the popularity of this phone increases the problems will also multiply. I would hate for someone to mess up their phone by taking advice from a person on a different system.
Anyway that is my 2cents on the topic.
Markdental said:
I agree that it is a mess. The new "Original" development section does not make sense. We do not need it and we did fine without having it in the Nexus One forums.
Can we make a development forum that pertains to all devices and then have a separate one that only works for the individual devices. E.g.: Kernels would go in device specific development, and then ROMs/scripts that work for all devices would go in the general development forum.
The last thing I need to do is scour the ATT, Verizon, and Sprint development + their Original Development Forums to see if I can use any of their ROMs/Scripts, etc... 9 different development forums are too many!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree, I have no f-ing idea what the "Original Development" forums are even supposed to be... the description confused the hell out of me. As far as I'm concerned. A ROM is a ROM. Why do we need 2 threads for vaguely different types of ROM. Who the F cares? This is the first forum I've seen that makes this stupid distinction.
I agree with the other guy that this unnecessary forum should at least be made a subforum of the development forum... or at best deleted entirely.
I don't mind the combined discussion threads, though.
I agree with separating the carriers, but the two separate development sections for each carrier has been around for months. It was that way with the SGS2 and works fine. So, yeah, the only change i would like to see is to separate carriers.
i agree, we need a cleanup on aisle S3
If enough people post in this thread, maybe the mods will reconsider the overall setup of the forums for the GS3.
x_SCOS_x_ELITE said:
i agree, we need a cleanup on aisle S3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude, that signature is bananas... it's taking up half the screen (which looks even crazier compared to your 1-line comment). Just sayin' :silly:
My suggestion that I brought up before to a mod.
"I have an idea that would help both mods and us xda user when it come to SGs3 forum. General and accesories can be left without carrier specific names. Then sprint, verizon, att&t, and t-mobile can have their own sub-forums with development, Q&A, and themes & apps.
Ex.
[Sprint]Gs3
- Dev
-Q&A
-Themes & Apps
And last the title of the Gs3 forum title should be changed to
"U.S Samsung Galaxy S3 variants ( Sprint, T-mobile, Verizon, & ATT&T)
With this two sub forums can be deleted that are present now since they'll be apart of the carrier variant sub forum."
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
masaidjet said:
My suggestion that I brought up before to a mod.
"I have an idea that would help both mods and us xda user when it come to SGs3 forum. General and accesories can be left without carrier specific names. Then sprint, verizon, att&t, and t-mobile can have their own sub-forums with development, Q&A, and themes & apps.
Ex.
[Sprint]Gs3
- Dev
-Q&A
-Themes & Apps
And last the title of the Gs3 forum title should be changed to
"U.S Samsung Galaxy S3 variants ( Sprint, T-mobile, Verizon, & ATT&T)
With this two sub forums can be deleted that are present now since they'll be apart of the carrier variant sub forum."
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seems like a reasonable plan. I hope the mods consider it.
Sooo...
General Discussion
General Q&A
AT&T
Q&A
Development
Themes
Sprint
Q&A
Development
Themes
T-Mobile
Q&A
Development
Themes
Verizon
Q&A
Development
Themes
deserted1 said:
Sooo...
General Discussion
General Q&A
AT&T
Q&A
Development
Themes
Sprint
Q&A
Development
Themes
T-Mobile
Q&A
Development
Themes
Verizon
Q&A
Development
Themes
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Might as well just make entire different sections like they used to. Including their respective general sections.
I agree with the idea what the original dev forums should be subforums on the dev forums, but I totally understand what the mod's were going for in regards to having a general section for all carriers. I'm assuming the idea was that it would create more of a community if we were lumped into one general forum, versus all being isolated by carrier. I wonder, if it was split up by carrier, if we would have gotten as much help from non VZW dev's who have come over to show us support. There might be a better way to organize things, but I also like the idea of a more connected community of SGS3 users across carriers
The other solution is to keep the QA, Dev, etc forums, but instead have subforums for each carrier. This way solutions that worked for all carriers could be posted in the main forum for each section, with carrier specific solutions in the subforums.
Galaxy S III Development
T-Mobile Development
AT&T Development
Sprint Development
Verizon Development
[Below all these would be a forum for development that crossed over between carriers, not necessarily for ALL carriers, but if there's any crossover]
deserted1 said:
Sooo...
General Discussion
General Q&A
AT&T
Q&A
Development
Themes
Sprint
Q&A
Development
Themes
T-Mobile
Q&A
Development
Themes
Verizon
Q&A
Development
Themes
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea basically that's what I meant
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
Just an innocent question.
The three threads already here should be in the "Android Development" forum as they are about Android kernels.
This Forum seems redundant, or at very least lacking unique purpose.
I suggest that what's here be rolled into N7 Android Development, so that both readers and posters aren't confused about what belongs where. If not, the mods who created this forum ought to make clear -- in a sticky post -- the differentiation between what belongs in "Original Development" as opposed to "Android Development"
(.... unless someone knows something I don't, and there's a plan to port WebOS or Symbian to the N7 )
http://www.xda-developers.com/android/introducing-original-development-forums-for-more-devices/ - here is the announcement on the portal!!
The dev section will be full up with rom after rom after rom... Most roms will only have small differences between them... I think this is a good move from the mods... Although, it can get a bit confusing, and we now have to check another place...
Anyway, I suggest you try to get this moved to q+a, as it isn't "original development"...
Sent from my HTC One X using xda premium
el56 said:
@Mods: Is this forum needed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@OP: Is this thread needed?
I some what agree with the OP. Only because this is a nexus device. So wouldn't almost 95% of all development for a nexus device "original development"? I could see this for the Samsung Touchwiz or HTC Sense device threads, because alot of those roms are just .zip hack jobs.
I concur with OP on this forum... It is basically just another dev forum, except now instead of 1, I need to watch 2 forums. Not really a big deal, just more of an irritance. Seems like the same thing could be accomplished by a regularly updated Sticky topic in regular Development that tracked all notable software for the Nexus 7 without needing a superfluous forum.
Maybe the android dev thread could be in the Original android dev thread? Like on android central.
I kinda like how you can sorta find what your looking for... but it seems quite confusing also at least for a while .. watching two forums now .. ugh
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
mattmanwrx said:
http://www.xda-developers.com/android/introducing-original-development-forums-for-more-devices/ - here is the announcement on the portal!!
The dev section will be full up with rom after rom after rom... Most roms will only have small differences between them...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, that defines the first three threads in this forum, all about slightly-derivative kernels, yet are here because the devs think they're original. So I'm not the only one who hasn't read the split rationale.
What this particular split represents is a choice of two forums based on a totally subjective criteria -- whether it's "original enough". Will there be a litmus test -- like what percent of AOSP has to be replaced -- before something is considered "original"? And how does that split really help people find what they want in terms of features, maturity, etc.
I agree that splitting up a crowded dev forum is a good thing to do, but believe that doing it based on "level of originality" is a recipe for confusion and needless police-work for mods. Why not consider something more straightforward and easier to categorize? One possible alternative could be
ROMs
Kernels (and basebands where appropriate)
Root/booting
HOWTOS and requests for help (both from devs and users)
That would make it easier for devs, mods and users.
Yeah, I find this setup a bit confusing too, honestly.
el56 said:
*snip*
ROMs
Kernels (and basebands where appropriate)
Root/booting
HOWTOS and requests for help (both from devs and users)
That would make it easier for devs, mods and users.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm lovin that idea. If were gonna have mountains of dev stuff, the more organized, the better.
Firstly, you don't start a thread in a Dev section to ask a question, ever.
Secondly, the decision to add 'Original Development' sections to devices that have or are expected to have very active development was taken by the forum Admins, not the Forum-Specific Moderators.
So you would be far better off posing the question to them, either in this section or even in this thread.
Beyond that, given how new the Nexus 7 is, it's extremely premature to conclude that the Original Development section will be a waste of space.
Step666 said:
Firstly, you don't start a thread in a Dev section to ask a question, ever.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry. No offense intended.
Step666 said:
Secondly, the decision to add 'Original Development' sections to devices that have or are expected to have very active development was taken by the forum Admins, not the Forum-Specific Moderators. So you would be far better off posing the question to them, either in this section or even in this thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Done.