Database Users

[Q] Can Google tell if device rooted remotely?

Hi all,
I just got off the phone with Google support... I phoned them because my nexus definitely has heat issues when I fire up need for speed it gets like a furnace...
When I was on the phone though they told me the warranty was void as it had been rooted (<3 TB)... how can they tell?
Does this mean my nexus is permanently ear marked?
Thanks.

Did they ask you to read out any info from the about screen?

juDGEY2k10 said:
Did they ask you to read out any info from the about screen?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Serial number...
But surely they can't just remote onto device like that. probably in the T&C. FML.

dont know mate was it new when u got it?
If not just tell them nope i dont know what your talking about, root wtf is root???

juDGEY2k10 said:
dont know mate was it new when u got it?
If not just tell them nope i dont know what your talking about, root wtf is root???
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah brand new. Straight from Gplay.
That's exactly what I did... still wouldn't process repair or anything sent me Samsung contact details for out of warranty repair. :S

Keep calling mate say they are wrong, keep at it mate just say i want to talk to a manager bla bla, keep pushing them

That's really strange. If they don't budge then contact Samsung directly using the contact info in the warranty that shipped with the phone for a warranty repair or replacement.

problaze said:
Yeah brand new. Straight from Gplay.
That's exactly what I did... still wouldn't process repair or anything sent me Samsung contact details for out of warranty repair. :S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm new to all this stuff so PLEASE do not do anything based on my flimsy idea, ... just thought it might help send you down a different thought/investigative path.
I installed a toolkit that had a re-lock and un-root option thinking that if I ever got into a similar warranty situation, I would just kinda go "backwards in time" and after using TWRP to backup my tablet, do a full factory wipe, and re-lock then un-root (or whichever comes first) THEN report the problem.:fingers-crossed:
You may have let the cat out of the bag by calling first though
It seems you need to find out how they know,erase the evidence,re-lock un-root and then as juDGEY2k10 says- DENY DENY DENY- you know, like "Dexter" does:laugh: .
But wada I know. Keep us posted on your progress.

Im no expert but I don't see how they can tell unless when you get new apps or update apps from the play store they pulling information from the units. Hopefully they arent doing that.
G●Note~2 {Jedi X5}

I have never seen root voiding warranty of a nexus device before, even though it says so.
I've noticed their bug report tool, built in, attempts to call su, so perhaps they do check now.
I'd prefer to see a root method where the app hides the binary under a unique name so they can't call it to find out.
Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

If Google is doing that, hopefully they won't share that info with manufacturers.
G●Note~2 {Jedi X5}

problaze said:
Hi all,
I just got off the phone with Google support... I phoned them because my nexus definitely has heat issues when I fire up need for speed it gets like a furnace...
When I was on the phone though they told me the warranty was void as it had been rooted (<3 TB)... how can they tell?
Does this mean my nexus is permanently ear marked?
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Let's assume what the OP is saying is true, which it probably isn't. Many states provide additional consumer protection, even if there was a clause in the warranty which reduces your rights. (There is no clause which explicitly removes your right to root in the Nexus 10 warranty, but IANAL.)
The manufacturer is still responsible for physical defects.
However, I cannot imagine that someone would call Google and receive that answer and not be angry, mentioning the rep by name he talked to, and asking to make sure that the rep's claim was accurate.
Perhaps the OP is not telling the whole story, (e.g. he called and proclaimed that he was an advanced user, gave the rep attitude, rep came back with "oh yeah well you're rooted, we don't have to support you". Anyone who has done customer service or help desk knows what I'm talking about.) or just plain making the whole thing up, since I have never heard of any company refusing to service a rooted device unless there was a problem user with multiple returns.
I do acknowledge that the OP may not be full of crap, but if that is the case, I strongly advise OP not to take what a single rep said as gospel and keep calling back and asking for a supervisor until it's resolved.
However, there's another issue:
If the OP rooted, installed a custom kernel, found his device ran too hot, then called Google complaining without first reverting to stock and testing to make sure it wasn't the custom kernel causing the overheating, the OP's brain is the thing needing a warranty exchange.

I contacted Google about my nexus 10 dropping wifi randomly a few days ago.
The guy who I spoke to was quite nice and told me to do a factory reset. I told him I had already done that and I had also tried CM10, AOKP as some people have said that fixes any kernel/rom issues and I said the problem remains on everything I do so it had to be the device.
I was offered a refund outside the 15 day period and I chose a replacement which was shipped today.
If I spoke to someone who said that they couldn't help me because I'm rooted, I'd hang up and try again. Although if you are having problems a full restore to stock will be helpful if you ring up and speak to them.

ZanshinG1 said:
Let's assume what the OP is saying is true, which it probably isn't. Many states provide additional consumer protection, even if there was a clause in the warranty which reduces your rights. (There is no clause which explicitly removes your right to root in the Nexus 10 warranty, but IANAL.)
The manufacturer is still responsible for physical defects.
However, I cannot imagine that someone would call Google and receive that answer and not be angry, mentioning the rep by name he talked to, and asking to make sure that the rep's claim was accurate.
Perhaps the OP is not telling the whole story, (e.g. he called and proclaimed that he was an advanced user, gave the rep attitude, rep came back with "oh yeah well you're rooted, we don't have to support you". Anyone who has done customer service or help desk knows what I'm talking about.) or just plain making the whole thing up, since I have never heard of any company refusing to service a rooted device unless there was a problem user with multiple returns.
I do acknowledge that the OP may not be full of crap, but if that is the case, I strongly advise OP not to take what a single rep said as gospel and keep calling back and asking for a supervisor until it's resolved.
However, there's another issue:
If the OP rooted, installed a custom kernel, found his device ran too hot, then called Google complaining without first reverting to stock and testing to make sure it wasn't the custom kernel causing the overheating, the OP's brain is the thing needing a warranty exchange.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I totally understand where you're coming from.
I used to work behind the genius bar so I know what you're getting at.
The full story is that I phoned up first and arranged a swap but realised that they would send to university address and not home phoned back again to change address and that's when the guy tried some extra steps with me and then asked for serial etc, you know the rest.
I get his word isn't stone but was shocked that they could definitely tell, wanted to share exp.
In all honesty the reason I didn't act rationally was that he ultimately called me out and I was major surprised since I'd never heard of anything similar before aka remote sense of root.
This is literally the third android device I've had and I'm only getting into the scene now, there's no custom kernel on my nexus. I run it stock.
FYI this was UK. Oh and CS didn't deny service they just referred me to someone else. Will try again post hols.
Hope explains!
?? Has anyone else experienced major heat on NFS:MW ??

alias_neo said:
I'd prefer to see a root method where the app hides the binary under a unique name so they can't call it to find out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you mean like the way a rootkit does it

?? Has anyone else experienced major heat on NFS:MW ??
Mine do to and lag in a lot of games because of throttling

[Q] - KNOX - We buy a phone but we dont own it (almost).

What is the KNOX?
To understand we must read this:
http://www.samsung.com/global/business/mobile/solution/security/samsung-knox
And this:
https://www.samsungknox.com/overview/technical-details
"The Galaxy Note 3 already supports KNOX by default"
I really dont get it...you buy a phone but you dont own it (almost)? See HERE a opinion by a member.
This Thread also is important: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2447832
And You, will buy a Galaxy Note 3?

ValenteL said:
What is the KNOX?
To understand we must read this:
http://www.samsung.com/global/business/mobile/solution/security/samsung-knox
And this:
https://www.samsungknox.com/overview/technical-details
"The Galaxy Note 3 already supports KNOX by default"
I really dont get it...you buy a phone but you d'ont own it (almost)? See HERE a opinion by a member.
This Thread also is important: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2447832
And You, will buy a Galaxy Note 3?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Probably the main reason behind not to decide yet to buy it. For me is a BIG ISSUE. I have always rooted my phone, and have installed many ROMS, for me, is a MUST. I am buying a hardware not a software.

95% of mobile device owners don't even know what a bootloader is and could care less. Almost 100% of companies with BYOD policies don't let rooted and unlocked phones on their networks whether or not they have Knox.
You're also confusing Knox for consumers and Knox for business. On the consumer side activating Knox is totally optional and when left unactivated makes the N3 just like all Samsung's previous devices. There are real benefits of Knox to people that don't care about bootloaders being locked. You can prevent the phone from being wiped if it's lost and stolen and can hide sensitive files you don't want people to see in a seperate container on your phone.
Here's the overview of how Knox works for consumers...
https://www.samsungknox.com/knox-consumer
For XDA Knox stands to bring with it some real negatives. Including a new warranty status method that can't be reset. So the 5% of people that want to unlock their bootloader and flash non-stock s/w without affecting their warranty have a right to be pissed about Knox. But the 95% that don't care and corporate IT departments with BYOD will be thrilled with it.

BarryH_GEG said:
95% of mobile device owners don't even know what a bootloader is and could care less. Almost 100% of companies with BYOD policies don't let rooted and unlocked phones on their networks whether or not they have Knox.
You're also confusing Knox for consumers and Knox for business. On the consumer side activating Knox is totally optional and when left unactivated makes the N3 just like all Samsung's previous devices. There are real benefits of Knox to people that don't care about bootloaders being locked. You can prevent the phone from being wiped if it's lost and stolen and can hide sensitive files you don't want people to see in a seperate container on your phone.
Here's the overview of how Knox works for consumers...
https://www.samsungknox.com/knox-consumer
For XDA Knox stands to bring with it some real negatives. Including a new warranty status method that can't be reset. So the 5% of people that want to unlock their bootloader and flash non-stock s/w without affecting their warranty have a right to be pissed about Knox. But the 95% that don't care and corporate IT departments with BYOD will be thrilled with it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In the end, if we are talking only about the loss of the guarantee, it is a fair fee for changing the characteristics of the instrument. After all, no one is saying that the manufacturer refuses to fully service the smartphone - for your money every whim. It's time to learn how to make decisions and to take responsibility ...

Finding about this issue has just knocked the N3 from the top of my upgrade choices. Not happy at all.

Looks almost like a kicked up refreshed version of hboot on HTC devices. Anybody else get that feel?
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

Was unaware of this.... Wow... idk... I pre-ordered and have been stoked for months... I'm hurting inside.

You guys are mis-understanding what Samsung Knox is.
I'll let Apple explain it
http://www.apple.com/iphone/business/it-center/deployment-mdm.html

We'll see about that. Judging from what I've read on the S4 forum, it looks like you're buying a device without a warranty.
(If you have no intention to root or mod your Note 3, what are you doing reading on this forum?)
Or to paraphrase the Google search page, are you feeling lucky?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using xda app-developers app

designgears said:
You guys are mis-understanding what Samsung Knox is.
I'll let Apple explain it
http://www.apple.com/iphone/business/it-center/deployment-mdm.html
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, why not? I see. This is what will make the device according to the personal. At once and for all ...

Rooting voids the warranty. Anyone in there position wouldn't care about the 5% who void their warranty then try to get around it and still have it covered.
So it's harder to scam a company into covering it under warranty? Oh well... we all full well now we are voiding our warranty every time we root.

Dumbo53 said:
We'll see about that. Judging from what I've read on the S4 forum, it looks like you're buying a device without a warranty.
(If you have no intention to root or mod your Note 3, what are you doing reading on this forum?)
Or to paraphrase the Google search page, are you feeling lucky?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Samsung has no obligation to xda. And we have a choice - to lose warranty or shake for it. The validity of that to pay for everything. And the phrase "I do buy the hardware and not a soft" - fundamental error ..

clninja said:
Rooting voids the warranty. Anyone in there position wouldn't care about the 5% who void their warranty then try to get around it and still have it covered.
So it's harder to scam a company into covering it under warranty? Oh well... we all full well now we are voiding our warranty every time we root.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes and no. Pretty much all of Samsung's devices have had some form of flash counter in them. Plenty of people who root their devices and don't use Triangle Away have returned the phone for service, and Samsung fixed it anyway. I recall one guy saying has flash counter on his Note 2 was over 100 and they still fixed it without blinking an eye.
The legal side is questionable too - Samsung can put any clauses they want in their warranty agreement, but even if you were to agree to them in writing they wouldn't necessarily be enforceable. I don't know if anyone has ever had reason to test it, but if they refused service on my device I'd be expecting them to be able to justify with reasonable certainty that the fault was caused (at least indirectly) by running non-standard software on the device. I suspect if this were tested in court they would have a hard time enforcing it. In reality the non-rooting clause cannot render the device void of all warranty, but if the software needs to be reinstalled by them because of a faulty flash or to rectify a problem caused by rooting, they can still charge you for that.
Same way Dell can't void the warranty on my laptop if I load Linux on it........
* This is based on the terms of statutory warranty in the country of purchase. So in some jurisdictions the vendor has more freedom to add limitations.

So it's going to be impossible/hard to root this phone with the KNOX security? Is it going to be totally impossible to do it?
I am totally addicted to ROOTING my phone and installing Custom ROMs s this is going to be a deal breaker for me if it's not possible.

Quasar83 said:
So it's going to be impossible/hard to root this phone with the KNOX security? Is it going to be totally impossible to do it?
I am totally addicted to ROOTING my phone and installing Custom ROMs s this is going to be a deal breaker for me if it's not possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can still do it nothing is stopping you, you just void warranty
A.S._id said:
In the end, if we are talking only about the loss of the guarantee, it is a fair fee for changing the characteristics of the instrument. After all, no one is saying that the manufacturer refuses to fully service the smartphone - for your money every whim. It's time to learn how to make decisions and to take responsibility ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well said Sir :good:
Rocheau said:
I am buying a hardware not a software.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well if you want to buy a phone without software I wish you luck

Xalies said:
You can still do it nothing is stopping you, you just void warranty
Well said Sir :good:
well if you want to buy a phone without software I wish you luck
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do not need the bloatware offered by Samsung. Cynogenmod 10.2 is just fine for me.

Xalies said:
You can still do it nothing is stopping you, you just void warranty
Well said Sir :good:
well if you want to buy a phone without software I wish you luck
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank God! I don't care if I void my warranty add long as I can install custom ROMs
Sent from my GT-N7100 using xda app-developers app

Does anyone else sense de ja vu here when the note 1/2 first came out....we had no way at first to reset the flash counter
Regardless if KNOX is "different", i blindly have much faith in our awesome developers to eventually be able to do something about it by the time i would need warranty

lmike6453 said:
Does anyone else sense de ja vu here when the note 1/2 first came out....we had no way at first to reset the flash counter
Regardless if KNOX is "different", i blindly have much faith in our awesome developers to eventually be able to do something about it by the time i would need warranty
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You do not understand the basic. This technology Samsung KNOX ® has one goal - to tie the device to one particular user. That is, the device will not be a secondary market, as the user can not be removed. This means that the whole story is not vulnerable device, basically ...
p.s. I think that's why this technology has been approved by the Ministry of Defense USA. Or maybe I just being paranoid ...

In the EU rooting does not void warranty. I work at an official samsung cervice centre and we must fix softbricked phones at no cost since the updated licence.
link: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1998801

[Discussion]Knox will void your warranty (Chainfire news)

Hi people,
today i found this post on the internet, and this is so bad.
If you will root a tablet/phone by samsung with knox, you will lost the warranty.
But why?
Personally samsung are doing a bad service if this will be true.
What do you think about this?
p.s. This is like region lock for Note 3 and other devices.

Imagine troubleshooting an issue on 1000s of devices with different configurations and hacks. The carriers want their own specifications forced to reduce troubleshooting issues as well as those that flash, brick their phones, and then trade them in under warranty. I think if you brick your phone you should be responsible. This is why they block rooting. People abuse the system.

spinkick said:
Imagine troubleshooting an issue on 1000s of devices with different configurations and hacks. The carriers want their own specifications forced to reduce troubleshooting issues as well as those that flash, brick their phones, and then trade them in under warranty. I think if you brick your phone you should be responsible. This is why they block rooting. People abuse the system.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Root and brick are different as you know...
One things is bricked, another is rooted.
If i will root my phon/tablet, is because i want customize it, i want to do perfect the device i bought.
The brick is different.
I never bricked a phone, and it's really hard do this.
If you have the knowledge, you will never brick a phone/tablet.
Personally i don't like the behavior of samsung, the same for htc with the s-on/s-off system...

this would suck, how could they not cover hardware problems that have nothing to do with root. This worries me cause i've never once owned an android that i didn't root. I usually am tempted to as soon as i open the box.

It's in the contract to not tamper with the phone. This includes root. They are doing it to protect the bottom line like it or not. Just playing Devils advocate. This forum is FULL of folks who mess up the configuration of the phone and return it under warranty. Also, when tethering isn't allowed root allows you to break your contract and share data from your phone. All things they don't want..
Of course we all want more control. But I understand why they protect themselves. The only way to change this is to ask for it. Developer edition phones etc are a great step.

smac7 said:
this would suck, how could they not cover hardware problems that have nothing to do with root. This worries me cause i've never once owned an android that i didn't root. I usually am tempted to as soon as i open the box.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm hoping Chainfire will release a tool for disabling this.
However i will root my tablet in the same case.
Because, in Italy, the warranty of samsung is so slow...

The knowledge to brick or not makes no difference. No root no noob bricking the phone. How are they supposed to know if you know what you are doing or not.

spinkick said:
It's in the contract to not tamper with the phone. This includes root. They are doing it to protect the bottom line like it or not. Just playing Devils advocate.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In which contract?
spinkick said:
The knowledge to brick or not makes no difference. No root no noob bricking the phone. How are they supposed to know if you know what you are doing or not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're wrong.
If you have the knowledge you're knowing what you're doing.
So, you won't brick any device.
If i will do a specific thing, i will study how to do it and after do it

The contract with your provider and the warranty with the manufacturer.
I'm not wrong. If im the carrier and manufacturer I will do whatever I can to not pay for your mistakes.
Congratulations to you for knowing how to not brick your phone. You are still tampering and therefore they want to void your warranty because your warranty is void when you root.

spinkick said:
The contract with your provider and the warranty with the manufacturer.
I'm not wrong. If im the carrier and manufacturer I will do whatever I can to not pay for your mistakes.
Congratulations to you for knowing how to not brick your phone. You are still tampering and therefore they want to void your warranty because your warranty is void when you root.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm okay with partial voiding of warranty, but if my power button gets stuck or a row of pixels get killed, why would the fact i rooted my phone matter?

spinkick said:
The contract with your provider and the warranty with the manufacturer.
I'm not wrong. If im the carrier and manufacturer I will do whatever I can to not pay for your mistakes.
Congratulations to you for knowing how to not brick your phone. You are still tampering and therefore they want to void your warranty because your warranty is void when you root.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only samsung have this
Because lg, google, and htc give the possibility to root and don't lose the warranty.
Ops, i'm not wrong too
If i will brick a phone, i have to pay a new one, but if my phone died for another cause and it was rooted, the carrier have to show me that the cause of the die is of root/unlocking.
And yes, i will tamper my tablet.
I don't see any problem on this, i can revert to stock for the warranty.
And if samsung and other carrier will block this, they will have negative feedback.
Android is open source, carriers edit the code and they release the code for the kernel and other things.
Why i can't root/tamper my phone/tablet?
This don't have sense.
In fact, other carrier, give the possibility to unlock/root with the warranty, as i wrote before.
Sent from One with Tapa4

smac7 said:
I'm okay with partial voiding of warranty, but if my power button gets stuck or a row of pixels get killed, why would the fact i rooted my phone matter?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In fact, this don't have sense.
How a firmware edit will broke the hardware like the power button?
And if a custom kernel will broke some componets of the cpu or other thing, samsung have to show that the tablet is rooted and it have a custom firmware.
Sent from One with Tapa4

smac7 said:
I'm okay with partial voiding of warranty, but if my power button gets stuck or a row of pixels get killed, why would the fact i rooted my phone matter?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree. I bet they would not even check the knox eFuse if you brought it into a store and showed them. I think it's more for software issues that can break a phone more than anything else.
---------- Post added at 06:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:29 PM ----------
Guich said:
In fact, this don't have sense.
How a firmware edit will broke the hardware like the power button?
And if a custom kernel will broke some componets of the cpu or other thing, samsung have to show that the tablet is rooted and it have a custom firmware.
Sent from One with Tapa4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You think they will check knox when you shown them a phone with a bad power button?
---------- Post added at 06:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:30 PM ----------
Guich said:
Only samsung have this
Because lg, google, and htc give the possibility to root and don't lose the warranty.
Ops, i'm not wrong too
If i will brick a phone, i have to pay a new one, but if my phone died for another cause and it was rooted, the carrier have to show me that the cause of the die is of root/unlocking.
And yes, i will tamper my tablet.
I don't see any problem on this, i can revert to stock for the warranty.
And if samsung and other carrier will block this, they will have negative feedback.
Android is open source, carriers edit the code and they release the code for the kernel and other things.
Why i can't root/tamper my phone/tablet?
This don't have sense.
In fact, other carrier, give the possibility to unlock/root with the warranty, as i wrote before.
Sent from One with Tapa4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can bet other manufacturers will be looking for ways to block things if the carriers demand it.
Android is open but the phones are not. Buy a developer edition where rooting is allowed, or make your own phone and wireless service.
In the end, they are doing it because the carrier demands it. Business also demands it, lots of corporations and hospitals need to guarantee that their employees aren't Walking around with rooted phones which allow all kinds of nasty ways to steel data, allow unauthorized apps, etc. Knox is a tool for it departments to lock things down.

spinkick said:
You think they will check knox when you shown them a phone with a bad power button?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes.
Because, when you will send a phone to warranty, they will check firmware and hardware.
Do you know that when a phone returt to you from warranty, this have the latest version of firmware for the phone/tablet?
All carriers check hardware and software when you will give to the watranty a phone

Welp, I guess you'd better not root.
Personally I've had to replace two phones that were rooted that had hardware issues with no problem.

spinkick said:
I agree. I bet they would not even check the knox eFuse if you brought it into a store and showed them. I think it's more for software issues that can break a phone more than anything else.
---------- Post added at 06:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:29 PM ----------
You think they will check knox when you shown them a phone with a bad power button?
---------- Post added at 06:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:30 PM ----------
You can bet other manufacturers will be looking for ways to block things if the carriers demand it.
Android is open but the phones are not. Buy a developer edition where rooting is allowed, or make your own phone and wireless service.
In the end, they are doing it because the carrier demands it. Business also demands it, lots of corporations and hospitals need to guarantee that their employees aren't Walking around with rooted phones which allow all kinds of nasty ways to steel data, allow unauthorized apps, etc. Knox is a tool for it departments to lock things down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
does samsung have places i can just walk into? i always assumed shipping was the only way. I purchased mine on Amazon.

spinkick said:
You can bet other manufacturers will be looking for ways to block things if the carriers demand it.
Android is open but the phones are not. Buy a developer edition where rooting is allowed, or make your own phone and wireless service.
In the end, they are doing it because the carrier demands it. Business also demands it, lots of corporations and hospitals need to guarantee that their employees aren't Walking around with rooted phones which allow all kinds of nasty ways to steel data, allow unauthorized apps, etc. Knox is a tool for it departments to lock things down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All phone are, you can unlock all phone with some fastboot command or tool
Yeah, business demands it, but why i can't so a thing because hospital need this?
If i will buy a product i can do all i want with this.
Samsung will be like Apple.
You've the phone, but your carrier decides how it will be.
Why all iphones are the same?
And i'm not talking about hardware, but software.
If i will buy a phone, I should have the possibilty to customize it as i like, but iphone can't, amd samsung are doing the same.
Sent from One with Tapa4

smac7 said:
does samsung have places i can just walk into? i always assumed shipping was the only way. I purchased mine on Amazon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In the states we buy them from a store like Verizon or sprint, and they handle the warranty stuff. Not sure what you do with Samsung direct.
---------- Post added at 06:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:41 PM ----------
Guich said:
All phone are, you can unlock all phone with some fastboot command or tool
Yeah, business demands it, but why i can't so a thing because hospital need this?
If i will buy a product i can do all i want with this.
Samsung will be like Apple.
You've the phone, but your carrier decides how it will be.
Why all iphones are the same?
And i'm not talking about hardware, but software.
If i will buy a phone, I should have the possibilty to customize it as i like, but iphone can't, amd samsung are doing the same.
Sent from One with Tapa4
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As far as a provider is concerned they would love to be like the iPhone. Which is wildly profitable and easier to support because it's so locked down. They made dev edition phones for guys like is. Maybe if we demand a note dev edition we can be happy.

smac7 said:
I'm okay with partial voiding of warranty, but if my power button gets stuck or a row of pixels get killed, why would the fact i rooted my phone matter?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's just how Samsung's policy is. Rooting is risky by itself anyway; the fact it now voids your warranty is something people can consider and choose whether or not to root and risk suffering a hardware issue.

archos did something like this with the gen 8's. you had to install a custom boot to be able to install custom roms. they did still cover hardware defects in a few cases i saw. hopefully samsung does the same. if not, then i'll just go back to win tablets - sadly i think samsung makes the best of those so far too.
on another note, between me and my cousin we've had 4 droid charges replaced under warranty with the flash counter not reset without any problems. so hopefully they'll only use the knox efuse only in extreme cases like burnt processors from overclocking.

3rd Party Trojan horse on my S5

DISCLAIMER: This isn't about resetting a stolen device, since this discussion doesn't apply to what to do AFTER it was blocked
I'm very happy with the combination find my mobile + reactivation lock. I've noticed that all our s5 are running a c&c client named Compuserve Agent (com.absolute.android.agent).
Now comes the disturbing part: I can't remove it. If I delete it it just pops out again.
I don't want a third party trojan horse, anyone who as access to my EMEI can in theory control my device, the traffic to the C&C can be seen and possibly it is not that secure.
Did anybody attempt to remove this?

venereo said:
DISCLAIMER: This isn't about resetting a stolen device, since this discussion doesn't apply to what to do AFTER it was blocked
I'm very happy with the combination find my mobile + reactivation lock. I've noticed that all our s5 are running a c&c client named Compuserve Agent (com.absolute.android.agent).
Now comes the disturbing part: I can't remove it. If I delete it it just pops out again.
I don't want a third party trojan horse, anyone who as access to my EMEI can in theory control my device, the traffic to the C&C can be seen and possibly it is not that secure.
Did anybody attempt to remove this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That doesn't sound particularly disturbing. If you want to take the red pill I'll give it to you.
Samsung, like all major developers/OEMs, is known for including backdoors in their software. Not 3rd party trojans but actual backdoors in apps such as Task Manager, Camera etc. The usual excuse they give is that they've included those backdoors for law enforcement to be able to protect us easier. And now we aren't even talking about low level backdoors and trojans that are hardcoded in to the chips..

lingowistico said:
That doesn't sound particularly disturbing. If you want to take the red pill I'll give it to you.
Samsung, like all major developers/OEMs, is known for including backdoors in their software. Not 3rd party trojans but actual backdoors in apps such as Task Manager, Camera etc. The usual excuse they give is that they've included those backdoors for law enforcement to be able to protect us easier. And now we aren't even talking about low level backdoors and trojans that are hardcoded in to the chips..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://lojack.absolute.com/en/products/absolute-lojack
It's a partner's application, for me it's still 3rd party PAID service, remote controls from sammy and absolut C&C client are 2 different applications in the mobile.
Do we really need both? Disturbing in terms that somebody can abuse from it.

Don't think the OP knows what a trojan is.

Thanks but I've reversed many c&c clients/servers much more elaborated and first thing is to try to hide client code. I'm concerned that anybody can see how it works. I don't need it and I want it removed, that's all.

.
.

fffft said:
As any half reasonable search would have revealed, the cited process is a legitimate stock app. Computrace authored by Absolute Software. It's an anti-theft measure that is embedded in the firmware and NV memory.
You may not like it, but it is in no way a rogue app or trojan horse as you claim. Do a search and you will find a number of existing threads on the subject as well as press releases from both companies about the theft-recovery rationale for Samsung including it on your phone.
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
His behavior is no different than other malware in the market, it's just sitting there waiting for me to pay for a service that I'm not going to pay, Samsung still have their own "backdoor" maybe you have a good excuse for then to make them separate services. Like I told anybody that can see your emei in the path that the device takes to reach your hands can activate it, operators are doing soo. Not everybody lives in a free country, and from my perspective I've the right to disable it

..

Of course the only way to push this kind of sw it's by finding legitimate excuses. The same persistence technics applied to this are for sure applied to Samsung software, I still find that weird. Security through obscurity has never been a solution. Knocking Knox is as ilegal as knocking this. And if it has flaws then they should be public in order to get a better one on next update. Samsung have their own anti-thief measures in a separate service

if ur so worried about the dystopian nature of samsung, root and flash cyanogen. sure ull invalidate warranty but who wan'ts any favors from those NSA-like evil overlords

-PiLoT- said:
if ur so worried about the dystopian nature of samsung, root and flash cyanogen. sure ull invalidate warranty but who wan'ts any favors from those NSA-like evil overlords
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm sure you missed the point I made above about the fact that simply flashing another rom is not enough if you're looking for real security. AFAIK it is completely possible to hardcode a backdoor into the device's chips or have a dedicated chip just for this purpose. If you are really concerned about your safety you should either get it done yourself (build a device from scratch) or you should hire someone to do it for you. Buying a device from the public market and talking about real security is ridiculous imo. :good:

lingowistico said:
I'm sure you missed the point I made above about the fact that simply flashing another rom is not enough if you're looking for real security. AFAIK it is completely possible to hardcode a backdoor into the device's chips or have a dedicated chip just for this purpose. If you are really concerned about your safety you should either get it done yourself (build a device from scratch) or you should hire someone to do it for you. Buying a device from the public market and talking about real security is ridiculous imo. :good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
actually it was more an agreement with the idea that people would buy a phone made by a large company by using a service from another large company and expecting neither company to do something to protect their investment is silly. also theyd do anything to strip out this "spyware" then complain if samsung refuted a warranty claim cause it was mucked with

-PiLoT- said:
if ur so worried about the dystopian nature of samsung, root and flash cyanogen. sure ull invalidate warranty but who wan'ts any favors from those NSA-like evil overlords
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
after all said you still think is that easy? this is persistence trough firmware, not kernel/OS related. same as having something writen on your disk when bios loads

..

lingowistico said:
I'm sure you missed the point I made above about the fact that simply flashing another rom is not enough if you're looking for real security. AFAIK it is completely possible to hardcode a backdoor into the device's chips or have a dedicated chip just for this purpose. If you are really concerned about your safety you should either get it done yourself (build a device from scratch) or you should hire someone to do it for you. Buying a device from the public market and talking about real security is ridiculous imo. :good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
guess so, but since somebody GOT us root.....
without root yes, but with root.............
real security does not exist. but it's much more difficult to enforce real-security when the user have root privileges
before that point they still have to make it work with the phone powered down, after that we can talk about chips
lazyness works like this

If you are so concerned, install a firewall app - droidwall and restrict network connection. Also there is an app to revoke certain permission of your installed apps.
these 2 should increase your security somehow

venereo said:
guess so, but since somebody GOT us root.....
without root yes, but with root.............
real security does not exist. but it's much more difficult to enforce real-security when the user have root privileges
before that point they still have to make it work with the phone powered down, after that we can talk about chips
lazyness works like this
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Buy a Blackphone.

sam20e said:
If you are so concerned, install a firewall app - droidwall and restrict network connection. Also there is an app to revoke certain permission of your installed apps.
these 2 should increase your security somehow
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agent sends your number as soon as it calls home and it can send you SmS with the commands.
I can stop it, I just wanted to know if somebody actually managed to remove it

FYI:
Devs angrily dismiss Absolute Computrace rootkit accusation
Absolute Computrace Revisited
And believe me, Computrace just started now on android, AFIK they have absolute no experience in android. They don't even can afford a dexguard license! out-of-the-box proguard? DISTURBING

..

Stock firmware with root access - Warranty Claim being denied... :(

Hey guys.
So, the worst case scenario seems to be playing out with my phone, and Samsung & the retailer are turning into villains. I've had my phone maybe 8 months, I flashed root to it in the first week. This is the stock firmware, just with root access so I could run Titanium Backup. The phone was working fine, had recently started to become a little bit chuggy due to lots of apps & data, though yesterday I opened a link from a friend which looks like it's killed my phone. I was in the middle of doing my Japanese lessons with Duolingo... received a Whatsapp message from a friend with a link to a sale ( I could post the link, but spam filters might block it)- the moment I opened the link in Chrome my phone had a heart attack. Froze, rebooted... but worse, the boot animation also froze. I tried the power reset (volume down + power button), and managed to get as far as the lock screen. Upon entering my PIN, the phone went black and it has been a brick ever since. I took my phone to the shop I bought it from this morning and regret being honest about having root access. I cannot possibly fathom how having full access to MY DEVICE could possibly kill any hardware or disable the device to this degree, and as such think this warranty voiding angle is a giant scam.
This post is seeking a few things... 1) sympathy (lots please).... 2) advice about warranty (are they within their rights to deny my warranty? I'm in Australia, imported phone) ... 3) How could this happen?!?!?!
Please, thanks, and woe is me....
:-/

loudboy77 said:
Hey guys.
So, the worst case scenario seems to be playing out with my phone, and Samsung & the retailer are turning into villains. I've had my phone maybe 8 months, I flashed root to it in the first week. This is the stock firmware, just with root access so I could run Titanium Backup. The phone was working fine, had recently started to become a little bit chuggy due to lots of apps & data, though yesterday I opened a link from a friend which looks like it's killed my phone. I was in the middle of doing my Japanese lessons with Duolingo... received a Whatsapp message from a friend with a link to a sale ( I could post the link, but spam filters might block it)- the moment I opened the link in Chrome my phone had a heart attack. Froze, rebooted... but worse, the boot animation also froze. I tried the power reset (volume down + power button), and managed to get as far as the lock screen. Upon entering my PIN, the phone went black and it has been a brick ever since. I took my phone to the shop I bought it from this morning and regret being honest about having root access. I cannot possibly fathom how having full access to MY DEVICE could possibly kill any hardware or disable the device to this degree, and as such think this warranty voiding angle is a giant scam.
This post is seeking a few things... 1) sympathy (lots please).... 2) advice about warranty (are they within their rights to deny my warranty? I'm in Australia, imported phone) ... 3) How could this happen?!?!?!
Please, thanks, and woe is me....
:-/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It depends on how you rooted but guessing as you rooted when you first got the device it probably tripped knox and voided your warranty... either way by the sounds of things you can fix this yourself by flashing official firmware with odin do you know how to do this?
In fact can you get into recovery mode?
while the phone is off try holding power button + home button + volume upfor around 10 seconds (this does not require the boot animation to load)
If you can do that use the volume keys to navigate down to "wipe data and factory rest" then navigate to yes and after that reboot your phone (might take 10 mins to boot) but should fix your problem

EasyAndroidPro said:
It depends on how you rooted but guessing as you rooted when you first got the device it probably tripped knox and voided your warranty... either way by the sounds of things you can fix this yourself by flashing official firmware with odin do you know how to do this?
In fact can you get into recovery mode?
while the phone is off try holding power button + home button + volume upfor around 10 seconds (this does not require the boot animation to load)
If you can do that use the volume keys to navigate down to "wipe data and factory rest" then navigate to yes and after that reboot your phone (might take 10 mins to boot) but should fix your problem
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For a moment I was excited to get a reply, and then I read yours. Please read my post before replying. If I could flash anything or get any kind of response do you think I would have taken my phone in for repairs??! It's DEAD. They changed the battery, the display (so they tell me) and they like to refer to the remainder as "the motherboard" but they mean the whole damn phone... Can anyone report if this has happened to them? Seems so thoroughly weird.... and to blame it on the fact I have root access.... the same as thousands of others.... it's really dodgy.

loudboy77 said:
For a moment I was excited to get a reply, and then I read yours. Please read my post before replying. If I could flash anything or get any kind of response do you think I would have taken my phone in for repairs??! It's DEAD. They changed the battery, the display (so they tell me) and they like to refer to the remainder as "the motherboard" but they mean the whole damn phone... Can anyone report if this has happened to them? Seems so thoroughly weird.... and to blame it on the fact I have root access.... the same as thousands of others.... it's really dodgy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow good look getting help with an attitude like that :good: i was offering beginner advice because from your post you sounded like an newbie. Good luck i won't be helping further.

EasyAndroidPro said:
Wow good look getting help with an attitude like that :good: i was offering beginner advice because from your post you sounded like an newbie. Good luck i won't be helping further.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh no... you're going to keep that awesome advice to yourself? Maybe someone else can suggest I try turning it off and on again?
Seriously- it's frustrating enough being put through the wringer of losing a device like this, and even moreso being held over a barrel by Samsung & the retailer. I'm doing my best to be clear and spell out my situation, in the interests of not only myself, but the whole Samsung community. When you're locked out of a device by design, and all you can do is press buttons in certain combinations, please assume that I meant it when I said I already tried pressing the buttons.
More frustrated. Thanks. =)

loudboy77 said:
Oh no... you're going to keep that awesome advice to yourself? Maybe someone else can suggest I try turning it off and on again?
Seriously- it's frustrating enough being put through the wringer of losing a device like this, and even moreso being held over a barrel by Samsung & the retailer. I'm doing my best to be clear and spell out my situation, in the interests of not only myself, but the whole Samsung community. When you're locked out of a device by design, and all you can do is press buttons in certain combinations, please assume that I meant it when I said I already tried pressing the buttons.
More frustrated. Thanks. =)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Come on, dude. I/we know the frustration of things like this but that's completely uncalled for. He offered genuine advice from the information given in your post.
I hope you get it sorted but I doubt you'll get much in the way of helpful responses if you are this rude.

It is completely within their rights to deny you warranty. You rooted the thing. The very act of rooting voids warranty. And yes, complete access to the device can do that to your phone because any rogue app can delete system files/programs that are essential to running the phone, or even turning it on. As it is, suck it up and accept you lost warranty and pay for the repair or get a new phone.
Sent from my SM-T231 using Tapatalk

what whatsapp message could do that much harm and has that done any harm to your friends (rooted) phone?
I think that after the freeze the phone has become damaged in software
Could be that it happens with any application that filled the memory.
If nothing can be saved with any trick and you have done everything I'm afraid there is nothing more possible than all the "tricks" here on XDA that are available after a good search.
Succes

loudboy77 said:
Hey guys.
So, the worst case scenario seems to be playing out with my phone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If u cant get into Download mode, then the people at service centre also cant
Go to a different service centre and play dumb. Just say that 'The phone stopped working when I was travelling. I dont know what happened. The phone just died'
Dont give anymore info than this. If u do then they might pin it on you
Just play dumb and deny everything lol
They cannot prove that the phone is rooted just by looking.
In your case the motherboard might be fried (IDK maybe) and if they replace motherboard then ur knox flag will be reset.
Visit another Service centre. Dont go to the same place again.

chanchan05 said:
It is completely within their rights to deny you warranty. You rooted the thing. The very act of rooting voids warranty. And yes, complete access to the device can do that to your phone because any rogue app can delete system files/programs that are essential to running the phone, or even turning it on. As it is, suck it up and accept you lost warranty and pay for the repair or get a new phone.
Sent from my SM-T231 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There was recently a ruling in the States that returned some rights to consumers to unlock their devices while keeping warranty. In Australia we have some pretty decent consumer protection laws. http://ausdroid.net/2012/10/22/warranties-and-bootloaders-what-you-should-know/
You're not showing an awful lot of compassion to the community of developers who spend their time trying to root phones... too bad if your phone dies? nice.

I suggest you read this.
http://www.samsung.com/au/support/warranty/
From the read of it. You have already violated 2 things.
1.Your phone was imported.
2.Modification(in this case root)
Also, if you think software can not kill hardware then you are wrong. Some hardware are also being controled by software. Of course something like the glue holding the display together come off is definite not caused by software but something like fried mainboard/electronic is possible.
Of course, this seem very unlikely in this case but still not impossible. If you still want warranty, you must prove yourself innocent enough for them to accept your claim which seem nearly impossible.
Also being honest about rooting when claiming your warranty will instantly have your warranty rejected, no question asked.
Well, you can still try using the customer right law or something like that to help you, if you don't mind wasting time.
Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

loudboy77 said:
There was recently a ruling in the States that returned some rights to consumers to unlock their devices while keeping warranty. In Australia we have some pretty decent consumer protection laws. http://ausdroid.net/2012/10/22/warranties-and-bootloaders-what-you-should-know/
You're not showing an awful lot of compassion to the community of developers who spend their time trying to root phones... too bad if your phone dies? nice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unlocking and rooting are two different things. Compassion? What are you talking about? Just accept that rooting voids warranty. Rooting opens the phone to exploits which may or may not cause problems. The manufacturer has every right to deny you service because they cannot prove if it is a fault on their part or yours. If you a friend bought an unrooted phone from you and roots it and bricks it, would you take back the phone and give him a new one free of charge? Or would you shoulder repair fees for your friend? No. Same thing. If you accidentally drop your chicken on the floor, KFC won't take it back.
There is consumer protection, and there is abuse.
And I appreciate the rooting community, but understand and accept the fact that doing so voids my warranty.
If my phones dies? I pay for the repairs. Simple.
Sent from my SM-T231 using Tapatalk

EasyAndroidPro said:
It depends on how you rooted but guessing as you rooted when you first got the device it probably tripped knox and voided your warranty... either way by the sounds of things you can fix this yourself by flashing official firmware with odin do you know how to do this?
In fact can you get into recovery mode?
while the phone is off try holding power button + home button + volume upfor around 10 seconds (this does not require the boot animation to load)
If you can do that use the volume keys to navigate down to "wipe data and factory rest" then navigate to yes and after that reboot your phone (might take 10 mins to boot) but should fix your problem
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I take it that there's a way around knox to root the phone without tripping it? I've got the Exynos variant of this phone, would you mind putting me in the right direction on rooting it? I've looked everywhere but never found a way that does not trip knox.

Alaa Joseph said:
So I take it that there's a way around knox to root the phone without tripping it? I've got the Exynos variant of this phone, would you mind putting me in the right direction on rooting it? I've looked everywhere but never found a way that does not trip knox.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've not tried it myself nor have I looked into it myself I rooted the normal way as I don't care about Knox related apps I just remember seeing the reports around.
Here is a related thread https://forum.xda-developers.com/ga...ot-method-via-engkernel-t3423438/post68204186