Database Users

The state of Android homebrew.

When the G1 came out it was the only Android powered device so modding it worked for everybody. And it was just one brand, HTC, so this forum was a one stop destination for modding our phone.
However, things have changed, now there are multiple phone with incompatible hardware from different manufacturers. Now a custom rom made for the G1, won't work on a DROID for example and vise versa. This complicates things quite a bit.
Right now Cyanogen mods are the best thing for our G1 and maybe the best thing for Android as a whole. I'm used to the build in tether capability and apps to SD and compcace and the other perks of a modded rom. But if I wanted to upgrade my phone, I would lose it all.
There are no Cyanogen mod for anything other than G1 and myTouch phones as far as I know and if I were to upgrade to DROID, I would lose root, lose tether, lose apps to SD, lose everything about my phone that makes it my phone.
Everything I wrote may not be facts, I don't really know what goes on at other forums, but I know that we don't have roms build to run on the DROID and we don't have them built to run on the HERO hardware, it's all for G1 and myTouch, and it seems to me that if I don't ha.ve on of those phones, I lose everything.
I do understand that this forum is for HTC devices which DROID and a few other's are not which is why I don't see homebrew for them. Is there a another website similar to this that supports all Android hardware?
These are thoughts that have been running through my head lately. If I am totally wrong here, please let me know.

I would say check out websites such as androidcommunity.com, androidandme.com, phandroid.com. The developers might not be on there but you can probably find links to where there are custom roms for the phones.
And you are right about different phones having different development oppurtunities. I thought about this today and realized that the next android phone I get not only has to be what I want but also be a popular phone that will attract developers such as cyan, maxisma, jac, manup and everyone else. My best guess and hope is that it will be a snapdragon android handset, hopefully for T-Mobile USA.

What we'll end up having to do is pick our phones based on it's community support and what kind of home brew is available for it.

The reason I love the G1 is the fact that it's rooted and has a large community. This phone is the best on the market, all things considered, because the rooted OS allows so much.
If and when the Droid is rooted, when a GSM version is released, and when it has T-Mo's 3G bands, I will move to it. But all those may not happen for another year or more. If you haven't played with a Droid yet, do so. Incredible speed and the best screen I have ever seen on a phone. Till then, G1 all the way.

The man is right, we have a problem on the dev side.
I think though, once 2.0 gets standard, we'll only need root for a few things like tethering and setting the CPU clock. Really cyanogen's only advantage is optimization, but once 2.0 and snapdragon rolls around, who cares? We'll always want to tinker, but it won't eclipse getting the phone you want.
The big problems right now are that the market isn't getting what it needs. Nothing compares to the HTC widgets, yet instead of cloning them on the market, we try and run a ROM that doesn't even work on our phones! We still don't have BT in Hero and it may just never happen.
2.0 will be what we need as a base, but the market needs our help now.

I'd contest the cyanogen are the best rom's.. maybe for someoen who wants to flash an upgrade every 3 days.. but for the majority of users.. Dwang is the way to go. Lengthy discussion about this, is over here..

alec.baldwin said:
I'd contest the cyanogen are the best rom's.. maybe for someoen who wants to flash an upgrade every 3 days.. but for the majority of users.. Dwang is the way to go. Lengthy discussion about this, is over here..
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Click to collapse
Thanks but this thread is not about who has the best rom.
The point is, when you get a new Android phone, your rom of choice won't be available for it. So what do you do?

alec.baldwin said:
I'd contest the cyanogen are the best rom's.. maybe for someoen who wants to flash an upgrade every 3 days.. but for the majority of users.. Dwang is the way to go. Lengthy discussion about this, is over here..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think we all get it already, YOU are dwang's biggest fan
But, to stay on topic. My G1 is the first HTC device I've ever owned and I've only discovered XDA since I've had it, and I think that because of the community involvement here and the custom roms that have come out, I will definitely lean towards another HTC phone when I look for my next upgrade, and it will definately be an android phone.
Also another thing to look at is the availability of the phones that are out to actual dev's. Unless people are donating phones, I doubt everyone can just run out and pick up all the latest devices, and network restrictions/preferences that come along with them.

I think the easiest solution is as follows:
1. Find the dev you like best.
2. Find the phone you like best.
3. Buy phone you like best.
4. Buy/Create a donate link to get said dev the same phone.
Assuming said dev doesnt turn around and craigslist the phone you bought him/her, you have (hopefully) ensured said dev will migrate and develop on your favorite hardware.
Not the best solution but probably the most reliable.

alec.baldwin said:
I'd contest the cyanogen are the best rom's.. maybe for someoen who wants to flash an upgrade every 3 days.. but for the majority of users.. Dwang is the way to go. Lengthy discussion about this, is over here..
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Click to collapse
Seriously dude, are you going to diss me in every thread? What do you even contribute to this community? I've not received any patches or even logs of the "problems" you claim.

cyanogen said:
Seriously dude, are you going to diss me in every thread? What do you even contribute to this community? I've not received any patches or even logs of the "problems" you claim.
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Click to collapse
For real.
Alec, you're like the little annoying brother that no one wants to be around.
Grow up, let your balls drop, and enjoy your phone, your life, and whatever rom you want.
But, you don't have to go around dissing well-respected devs.

The Droid hasn't been out long enough for a community to gather around it. Many of the Android big names are waiting to get GSM versions before tinkering.
Also, remember that the HTC Dream was in circulation well before it launched last year. The Android development phone is identical to the Dream, with the only difference being some swish art on the back cover. The hardware and software were free-flowing long before it landed in our hands. In contrast, the Droid was a much more secretive launch; we've only just got Eclair source code, and the SDK was kept under wraps by a non-disclosure agreement (probably to conceal the nuclear bomb that is Google Maps Navigation).
I find the cracking of the Droid to be inevitable. The poor thing is going to be broken just as much as our Dreams were. Just give it time.
As for ROMs being available over a span of phones, I'm not sure that's even a good idea. Android variants like XROM, cyanogenmod, The Dude's ROM, yadda yadda... they're all about maximising the capabilities of the Dream. Not the Droid, the Dream. Adding in features that the hardware can support, changing CPU frequencies, Apps2SD, all that jazz. Droid ROMs will be built around adding in core features, like Apps2SD, and whatever else the Droid has tucked away. Likewise, speed optimisations may not be portable between phones, as what gives the Dream a boost may hinder the Droid.
For me, features of a ROM are not the best part of homebrew Android builds. The best part is being able to upgrade your phone outside of the carrier's say-so. If T-mobile have no plans to push Eclair to Dreams, I will install it myself. I am not tied down by the say-so of a room full of suits three thousand miles away. If T-mobile don't include an app that I like, such as the IM app or the Amazon MP3 store (which T-mobile UK don't), I can get ROMs with them myself. If a carrier would rather I didn't tether without paying for my bandwidth twice, I can do it anyway, so long as I'm not an idiot.
You may have guessed that I have a very dim view of cell carriers.
With root, we are free to do as we like. This is the real killer feature of homebrew, and the Droid will benefit from it too.
Anyway...
dwang said:
I want to acknowledge cyanogen, daproy, cyrowski, loccy, and alla for their contributions to the android community.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It seems dwang himself has a much higher opinion of the man than a certain other someone.

AthlonBoy said:
The Droid hasn't been out long enough for a community to gather around it. Many of the Android big names are waiting to get GSM versions before tinkering.
Also, remember that the HTC Dream was in circulation well before it launched last year. The Android development phone is identical to the Dream, with the only difference being some swish art on the back cover. The hardware and software were free-flowing long before it landed in our hands. In contrast, the Droid was a much more secretive launch; we've only just got Eclair source code, and the SDK was kept under wraps by a non-disclosure agreement (probably to conceal the nuclear bomb that is Google Maps Navigation).
I find the cracking of the Droid to be inevitable. The poor thing is going to be broken just as much as our Dreams were. Just give it time.
As for ROMs being available over a span of phones, I'm not sure that's even a good idea. Android variants like XROM, cyanogenmod, The Dude's ROM, yadda yadda... they're all about maximising the capabilities of the Dream. Not the Droid, the Dream. Adding in features that the hardware can support, changing CPU frequencies, Apps2SD, all that jazz. Droid ROMs will be built around adding in core features, like Apps2SD, and whatever else the Droid has tucked away. Likewise, speed optimisations may not be portable between phones, as what gives the Dream a boost may hinder the Droid.
For me, features of a ROM are not the best part of homebrew Android builds. The best part is being able to upgrade your phone outside of the carrier's say-so. If T-mobile have no plans to push Eclair to Dreams, I will install it myself. I am not tied down by the say-so of a room full of suits three thousand miles away. If T-mobile don't include an app that I like, such as the IM app or the Amazon MP3 store (which T-mobile UK don't), I can get ROMs with them myself. If a carrier would rather I didn't tether without paying for my bandwidth twice, I can do it anyway, so long as I'm not an idiot.
You may have guessed that I have a very dim view of cell carriers.
With root, we are free to do as we like. This is the real killer feature of homebrew, and the Droid will benefit from it too.
Anyway...
It seems dwang himself has a much higher opinion of the man than a certain other someone.
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Click to collapse
You seem to have almost got my point but not quite. Of coarse DOID doesn't need Cyanogen MOD specifically. But would you buy an Android phone if there weren't a mod that lets it do the things that we are used to and have only become available by modding? Apps to SD, tethering, themeing?
Sure DROID might get all these things though a custom rom but we won't see it on this website. The problem is that things will get too spread out and hard to find with all these new hardware options.
What would be nice is a rom that works on nearly every Android device that just adds root access to the phone and some basic universal packages like A2SD and tethering etc. That way you can buy any Android device you want and still have these basic privileges.
Do you think something like that would be possible?

Pinesal said:
You seem to have almost got my point but not quite. Of coarse DOID doesn't need Cyanogen MOD specifically. But would you buy an Android phone if there weren't a mod that lets it do the things that we are used to and have only become available by modding? Apps to SD, tethering, themeing?
Sure DROID might get all these things though a custom rom but we won't see it on this website. The problem is that things will get too spread out and hard to find with all these new hardware options.
What would be nice is a rom that works on nearly every Android device that just adds root access to the phone and some basic universal packages like A2SD and tethering etc. That way you can buy any Android device you want and still have these basic privileges.
Do you think something like that would be possible?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Beats me, man. I'm not a developer. But I think it's unlikely.

For the DROID (and other/future android phones) is Apps2SD really necessary? The only reason why we need it on our phones is because of the pathetic amount of internal space the G1 has, the same goes for Swap Partitions etc.
As long as people buy the phone there is always going to be someone who is smart enough to work on rooting it IMO. And even without root what do you really lose? The only things I think I would really miss are Wireless Tether and Bluetooth File Transfer (Which I THINK is in 2.0 anyway).

I'm not buying a new phone until it's rooted and Cyanogen has it too.

My biggest requirement for any android phone..and any cell phone in general is the keyboard. I bought the G1 because of the keyboard and lucked out with the high number of developers available for it. I didn't find this place for several months during the time when the grandfather of the G1 mod program was still active =) JF!. I enjoyed all the modding and updating because I personally feel that the phone is, well mine. And I should be able to do what ever I want with it. I had picked up the V3C Razer because it could play MP3's. I get it home and then discover that the Verizon Nazi's completely locked down that feature so you where forced to use their service at an additional cost. Of course the motorola dev/repair/store software allowed us to get in a enable the various features that Verizon required to be locked. I also love the Aps2sd. No matter what phone you have, the internal memory will never be enough. And with the Cliq supporting 32gig sd cards, a full keyboard, and NOT verizon was enough for me. I'm patient and confident it will be rooted eventually. If not, I still have my G1 and I still do Cyanogen updates and play around with it. And when my contract is up with Tmob(renewed for the Cliq), I'll see who has the next most popular rooted phone with a keyboard and switch over. I just really hate people telling me how to use a device I own. Its like going to McDonalds and having them dictate what condiments to put on my BigMac and Fries, and then telling me I can only eat it a certain way and which hand to use. If Cyanogen was down with the Cliq, or interested in it. I may be willing to ship him my phone to see what he can come up with.
As far as a universal O/S for all phones, isn't that just the core Android software with specific drivers provided by each manufacturer and custom UI? There should be a way to make 1 O/S for all android phones, then have update packs with the drivers and UI enhancements and add-ons for each android phone released? Not sure of the SPL locks though. Thats a bit beyond me. But i wouldn't think it would be to hard to run Cyanogen on the Cliq or droid provided the correct drivers and such where bundled with it. Kind of like slipstreaming a service pack into a bootleg Windows OS . Each phone eventually has to release the source code which contains the drivers for that phone. Thats how we get the Cliq's OS onto the G1, should work the other way around too. Sounds easy, but Cyanogen's Rom should run on my Cliq, provided the drivers are slipstreamed into it for the Cliq...right? Only problem is root.. :/ hehehe

and there he flames again...alec.baldwin, no one has the problems you have with cyanogen's latest. actually, lets delve into this...what exactly are your "problems" with 4.2.5? PLEASE, answer this question so cyanogen can dutifully fix the "problems" you are having.
You might check out some of the Q/A threads to first learn how to properly flash cyanogen's ROM. It is slightly different than Dwang's because Cyanogen uses the legal method. In fact, check out www.cyanogenmod.com and you might find a ton of useful info on getting cm to work on your phone.
Best of Luck,
njuncos
P.S. Cyanogen, mad props on once again reaching over a million thread views on your latest. Now you own 3 of the top 4 most viewed threads of all time in Dream Android Development!

HTC threatens handset hackers with legal action for distributing ROMs

READ YOUR HOMEWORK PEOPLE http://www.mobilecrunch.com/2010/06...kers-with-legal-action-for-distributing-roms/

I guess I know what i'll be downloading all day till I got work

That's for Windows Mobile.
hTC can't stop anyone distributing AOSP ROMs, but they could throw the hammer down on distributing their Sense ROMS.

Because of all that nonsense (no pun intended ), I've commited myself to getting this. I'll be more than satisfied.

wcdisciple said:
Because of all that nonsense (no pun intended ), I've commited myself to getting this. I'll be more than satisfied.
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Man, i think you're not getting tired of emphasise how good apple is. Please don't take it offensive, but why are you in this forum if you will buy / have bought an iPhone?
HTC is only one company of many building phones with Android. Whether you like Sense or not is your decision. G1 and MT3G (with google) were never intended to run with Sense. And no one can sue us for using AOSP ROM's. So i have no problem with it compared to apple, who will preselect the software for you...
Jailbreaking the iPhone isn't legal by the way...
PS: don't want to start an Apple/Android war, but leaving one company suing others for another company suing people since years and taking it for the reason why, seems a bit curious to me...

hudl said:
Man, i think you're not getting tired of emphasise how good apple is. Please don't take it offensive, but why are you in this forum if you will buy / have bought an iPhone?
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He's been on a rampage with it.
On a better note: I don't think this will stop ROM development. Didn't xda go through the same thing, but HTC didn't care about the actual developed ROMs?
Edit: Can't find anything to support that. :/ Remember reading it somewhere - might have been bs, but I swear it was on xda news.

HTC threatens handset hackers with legal action - WORST MISTAKE EVER
HTC is seriously making a mistake with that one.
Ive only been satisfied with my purchase of anything they have come with AFTER flashing a Rom into it.
If this continues I promise you they will regret it.
They will lose customers that WILL choose to go to other manufacturers.
The Devs and all who create on a constant basis are not hackers.
They innovate to make HTC a better phone than the competitors because of the work that are done by these fine people.

legend221 said:
HTC is seriously making a mistake with that one.
Ive only been satisfied with my purchase of anything they have come with AFTER flashing a Rom into it.
If this continues I promise you they will regret it.
They will lose customers that WILL choose to go to other manufacturers.
The Devs and all who create on a constant basis are not hackers.
They innovate to make HTC a better phone than the competitors because of the work that are done by these fine people.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But they didn't take it down because of them being custom ROMs. They were all just the basic stock ROMs that came with the phone. Honestly, there's not much of a difference as both custom and stock contain IP. However, I think they would've taken down xda a long time ago if they were worried about custom ROMs.

r3s-rt said:
Honestly, there's not much of a difference as both custom and stock contain IP.
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Click to collapse
There is a HUGE difference between stock and Custom Rom, anyone that has ever flashed a Rom will tell you this.
r3s-rt said:
However, I think they would've taken down xda a long time ago if they were worried about custom ROMs
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Click to collapse
A similar C&D almost stopped the progression of a certain legendary Dev on the android scene.
Luckily, there was a workaround and everyone was happy flashing and seeing for themselves how much better our phones have been on a customized, fast and stable Rom.

legend221 said:
There is a HUGE difference between stock and Custom Rom, anyone that has ever flashed a Rom will tell you this.
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Click to collapse
Are you serious? So you're telling me all HTC widgets involved in a sense ROM aren't IP? Or Google Apps included in most ROMs aren't IP? Google Maps? Market? Anything? That's actually pretty funny. No THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE between a stock ROM and a custom ROM on the IP subject with the exception of JUST a few. Like.... 2 or 3? Do you even know what intellectual property is?
A similar C&D almost stopped the progression of a certain legendary Dev on the android scene.
Luckily, there was a workaround and everyone was happy flashing and seeing for themselves how much better our phones have been on a customized, fast and stable Rom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And no, the similar C&D did NOT almost stop ROM development. If that was the case, NO ROM would come with Google Apps included. However, they DO, and are they are NOT getting C&Ds. If you think Google isn't looking at XDA to see what's happening, you need to start thinking a bit more.
Edit: Also, not every ROM is based off of cyanogen. While there are A LOT that are, not ALL are.

r3s-rt said:
Are you serious? So you're telling me all HTC widgets involved in a sense ROM aren't IP? Or Google Apps included in most ROMs aren't IP? Google Maps? Market? Anything? That's actually pretty funny. No THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE between a stock ROM and a custom ROM on the IP subject with the exception of JUST a few. Like.... 2 or 3? Do you even know what intellectual property is?
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Click to collapse
Not everyone even cares about widgets. I only use the calendar one for example. Widgets are not the issue, we are talking about Roms overall because if HTC starts implementing a stricter enforcement of people not having the ability to use or host the Rom of their choice and preventing Devs to freely distribute their work then we are all held mercy to whatever HTC has pre-installed from the factory. A major FAIL for them.
r3s-rt said:
And no, the similar C&D did NOT almost stop ROM development. If that was the case, NO ROM would come with Google Apps included. However, they DO, and are they are NOT getting C&Ds. If you think Google isn't looking at XDA to see what's happening, you need to start thinking a bit more.
Edit: Also, not every ROM is based off of cyanogen. While there are A LOT that are, not ALL are.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Google knows its in their best interest to keep letting everyone that wants to flash a custom Rom. Some people buy specific phones (the past phones of mine as well) only if they are rooted or can install a custom SPL and flash their flavor of a Rom. The Cyanogen reference was an example not for every case, we are aware of the Windows Mobile, etc sections of xda.

legend221 said:
Not everyone even cares about widgets. I only use the calendar one for example. Widgets are not the issue, we are talking about Roms overall because if HTC starts implementing a stricter enforcement of people not having the ability to use or host the Rom of their choice and preventing Devs to freely distribute their work then we are all held mercy to whatever HTC has pre-installed from the factory. A major FAIL for them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're not continuing what you originally said. You said there's a huge difference between a custom ROM and a stock ROM. Now, this statement should have been based on IP terms, as this is clearly what the topic is supposed to be about. My point is that IP is still included in any ROM. It doesn't matter what you use - that is completely irrelevant to the subject matter. They clearly are not enforcing all little bits of IP. If that was the case, as I've said multiple times, xda wouldn't be here right now. HTC is WELL AWARE along with Microsoft and Google of what goes on here. I promise you they pay once lucky bastard to sit here and probe this site, along with others, all day everyday and flag anything they see unfit. The main thing they seem to not like is ROM libraries. That's just from my experience.
To sum this up" We are NOT at mercy of what is pre-installed from factory or they would have sent out much more C&D letters much sooner than this. XDA has over 2 MILLION users. That's all I'm saying.
Google knows its in their best interest to keep letting everyone that wants to flash a custom Rom. Some people buy specific phones (the past phones of mine as well) only if they are rooted or can install a custom SPL and flash their flavor of a Rom. The Cyanogen reference was an example not for every case, we are aware of the Windows Mobile, etc sections of xda.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Best interest? Are you serious, bro? Android is marketed as an open-source platform. That's not in their "best interest." It's in their intents! The unrootable is because of cell phone carriers! Guess what?! The Dream came out as a Development phone! The Google ION (more commonly the myTouch 3g)? Development phone! The cyanogenmod reference was taken for what it was - an C&D from GOOGLE! NOT HTC!

r3s-rt said:
You're not continuing what you originally said. You said there's a huge difference between a custom ROM and a stock ROM. Now, this statement should have been based on IP terms, as this is clearly what the topic is supposed to be about. My point is that IP is still included in any ROM. It doesn't matter what you use - that is completely irrelevant to the subject matter. They clearly are not enforcing all little bits of IP. If that was the case, as I've said multiple times, xda wouldn't be here right now. HTC is WELL AWARE along with Microsoft and Google of what goes on here. I promise you they pay once lucky bastard to sit here and probe this site, along with others, all day everyday and flag anything they see unfit. The main thing they seem to not like is ROM libraries. That's just from my experience.
To sum this up" We are NOT at mercy of what is pre-installed from factory or they would have sent out much more C&D letters much sooner than this. XDA has over 2 MILLION users. That's all I'm saying.
Best interest? Are you serious, bro? Android is marketed as an open-source platform. That's not in their "best interest." It's in their intents! The unrootable is because of cell phone carriers! Guess what?! The Dream came out as a Development phone! The Google ION (more commonly the myTouch 3g)? Development phone! The cyanogenmod reference was taken for what it was - an C&D from GOOGLE! NOT HTC!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for giving that one guy the heads up on what goes on and what doesnt go on around here if he indeed does exist. If theres anything we dont need is anyone giving them more fuel to thier fire.
No one said the C&D came from HTC, seeing as you are a reader on xda I knew I didnt have to explain this to you. hahaha. It is in Google's best interest to let the Devs continue thier greatness because guess what many would jump ship to Windows Mobile devices or other OS including the iPhone even though there are not Roms for it I believe. If Android Development was not allowed to continue, at least most people would stop buying Android powered phones I believe.
Yawn........ time for bed now.

Why are you all under the assumption that the majority of HTC sales all run off of custom firmware? Do you really believe that sales are going to be effected that much because of HTC's decision?

legend221 said:
No one said the C&D came from HTC
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Did you even read the article? If you are referring to the one cyanogen got, I never said it did. Seeing as you are just a reader (not) I didn't have to explain this to you. But I did. Please, if you're going to try and get a point across, respect me enough to actually read what I said.
legend221 said:
Thanks for giving that one guy the heads up on what goes on and what doesnt go on around here if he indeed does exist. If theres anything we dont need is anyone giving them more fuel to thier fire.
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I had to edit this is. Really? Have you been snorting cocaine or something? That's pretty damn paranoid. If you don't think that happens, you just need to get off the internet as that's just basic knowledge. If you were HTC, would you not watch us? If you wouldn't - stay out of sales forever.
Binary100100 said:
Why are you all under the assumption that the majority of HTC sales all run off of custom firmware? Do you really believe that sales are going to be effected that much because of HTC's decision?
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Click to collapse
I'm not under that assumption; I take you include me in the all. I just stated that at least this won't affect custom ROMs and he went on about how custom ROMs are so different and don't contain IP. That's what I've been trying to get across in all my posts. And no, I don't think their sales will be affected .

r3s-rt said:
Did you even read the article? If you are referring to the one cyanogen got, I never said it did. Seeing as you are just a reader (not) I didn't have to explain this to you. But I did. Please, if you're going to try and get a point across, respect me enough to actually read what I said.
I had to edit this is. Really? Have you been snorting cocaine or something? That's pretty damn paranoid. If you don't think that happens, you just need to get off the internet as that's just basic knowledge. If you were HTC, would you not watch us? If you wouldn't - stay out of sales forever.
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Click to collapse
You're still on what I said?
Get over it and realize not everyone is going to agree with you or your thoughts.
The one on drugs is YOU, damn get out of the forums and do something else with your time man. hahaha
That's why its a forum and NOT your personal website.

legend221 said:
You're still on what I said?
Get over it and realize not everyone is going to agree with you or your thoughts.
The one on drugs is YOU, damn get out of the forums and do something else with your time man. hahaha
That's why its a forum and NOT your personal website.
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Click to collapse
Any one with intelligence will tell you that 90% of custom ROMs contain IP. The fact that you are swearing up and down that they don't is just.... stupid.

r3s-rt said:
Any one with intelligence will tell you that 90% of custom ROMs contain IP. The fact that you are swearing up and down that they don't is just.... stupid.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The fact of the matter is that without proprietary IP, you can't even start the thing up. There is more IP than just widgets, launchers, and apps... there are DRIVERS and other such buried nonsense.
SOME of this IP *IS* distributed, have a look at developer.htc.com -- HTC eventually relented and opened their kernel modifications since they were committing a GPL violation, but there is other stuff on that page that is being distributed that IS proprietary IP, specifically, the "HTC Proprietary Binaries for ADP1". And those binaries don't even include all the proprietary binaries needed to make full use of the phone, such as the GPU drivers and the video decoder drivers.
THANKFULLY, the phone's owner IS licensed to use all of those binaries, so they can just keep them. Note that they're also included in the FULL SYSTEM IMAGES that HTC ITSELF distributed from developer.htc.com.
*** and that is a HUGE DIFFERENCE between the android platform and wimo.... the fact that HTC distributes ***all*** of the proprietary binaries straight from their website. It means that it ***IS*** possible to generate fully AOSP (but non-functional) system images, and the USER can combine them with the binaries provided by HTC to make a working system.
From what I've seen, HTC REALLY DOESN'T CARE and/or actually WANTS users to build custom roms for their phones. They send out the cease and desist order for distribution of wimo roms, PROBABLY in accordance with MS's demands. MS probably said to them -- "listen, you either try to put a lid on piracy or we're going to stop sending you MSTRASH." HTC distributes GOOGLE apps in the roms on their website because THAT'S WHAT GOOGLE WANTS.

lbcoder said:
The fact of the matter is that without proprietary IP, you can't even start the thing up. There is more IP than just widgets, launchers, and apps... there are DRIVERS and other such buried nonsense.
SOME of this IP *IS* distributed, have a look at developer.htc.com -- HTC eventually relented and opened their kernel modifications since they were committing a GPL violation, but there is other stuff on that page that is being distributed that IS proprietary IP, specifically, the "HTC Proprietary Binaries for ADP1". And those binaries don't even include all the proprietary binaries needed to make full use of the phone, such as the GPU drivers and the video decoder drivers.
THANKFULLY, the phone's owner IS licensed to use all of those binaries, so they can just keep them. Note that they're also included in the FULL SYSTEM IMAGES that HTC ITSELF distributed from developer.htc.com.
*** and that is a HUGE DIFFERENCE between the android platform and wimo.... the fact that HTC distributes ***all*** of the proprietary binaries straight from their website. It means that it ***IS*** possible to generate fully AOSP (but non-functional) system images, and the USER can combine them with the binaries provided by HTC to make a working system.
From what I've seen, HTC REALLY DOESN'T CARE and/or actually WANTS users to build custom roms for their phones. They send out the cease and desist order for distribution of wimo roms, PROBABLY in accordance with MS's demands. MS probably said to them -- "listen, you either try to put a lid on piracy or we're going to stop sending you MSTRASH." HTC distributes GOOGLE apps in the roms on their website because THAT'S WHAT GOOGLE WANTS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. Didn't even think about all that.
2. That's exactly what I thought. Microsoft is so scared of a lonely developer doing better than what their out-the-ass payed developers do. Honestly, why would the manufacturer of the phone give a damn what you do with it when you buy it? No matter what way you look at it: their task is to sell the phones they manufacture.

Honeycomb-only for tablets not mobile!!!

http://mobile.computerworld.com/dev...erworld.com/17612/google_android_30_honeycomb
Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk

I will buy it
Sent from my Nero powered Vibrant

heres a link to the video from engadet, because that website doesn't have it.
http://www.engadget.com/2011/01/05/google-shows-off-android-3-0-the-entirely-for-tablet-honeycom/

This news has been around for awhile. The 3.0 is basically 2.3 with a bit more and will allow android to run on a screen bigger than 7". This is not a exclusion of 3.0 but, rather just a modding of 2.3

As long as it retains the Android functionality, adds google docs integration and Netflix app I know what I will be getting for Christmas next year unless it is released earlier

oka1 said:
This news has been around for awhile. The 3.0 is basically 2.3 with a bit more and will allow android to run on a screen bigger than 7". This is not a exclusion of 3.0 but, rather just a modding of 2.3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's just another version of Android, so that's obvious.
The bigger issue here is how much of the functionality will be backported to existing Android handsets.
For example, the Google Talk Client in that video supports Native Video chat. Will Existing phones with FFC get a backported GTalk client, or will it require a firmware upgrade (which will probably never come to the likes of an Evo, MT4G, and Epic4G)?
It's extremely frustrating to use a platform with so many functionality gaps that requires you to upgrade you phone virtually every 6 months just to get trivial Quality of Life updates, or do the Custom ROM upgrade treadmill thing...

oka1 said:
This news has been around for awhile. The 3.0 is basically 2.3 with a bit more and will allow android to run on a screen bigger than 7". This is not a exclusion of 3.0 but, rather just a modding of 2.3
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Google hasn't announce the Honeycomb for mobile phones yet, the current handsets on the market if they will get the upgrade might already be obsolete, the upcoming dual processor powered handsets will be more suitable for the new OS release, and I am pretty sure the time the news will trickle down we might as well just be on the market for the new handsets. I understand not everyone shares the same view but I know for myself I would not be holding onto my Vibrant till it evaporates into dust

N8ter said:
It's just another version of Android, so that's obvious.
The bigger issue here is how much of the functionality will be backported to existing Android handsets.
For example, the Google Talk Client in that video supports Native Video chat. Will Existing phones with FFC get a backported GTalk client, or will it require a firmware upgrade (which will probably never come to the likes of an Evo, MT4G, and Epic4G)?
It's extremely frustrating to use a platform with so many functionality gaps that requires you to upgrade you phone virtually every 6 months just to get trivial Quality of Life updates, or do the Custom ROM upgrade treadmill thing...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What functionality gaps? There are phones out right now with video calling, why does it matter if its native? if the upgrades are trivial, why are you worrying about them?
You do realize you don't have to upgrade from custom roms, you can stick to using an older one. I already know the answer to that, I find your sig hilarious because its your sig.

j0hnZ said:
What functionality gaps? There are phones out right now with video calling, why does it matter if its native? if the upgrades are trivial, why are you worrying about them?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. Because video calling on Android is fragmented to hell right now. Some people use QIK. Some people use Tango. Some people use Yahoo, Fring, etc. I'm not installing 3-5 applications on my phone (2-3 of which runs battery whoring services in the background) just to video call. A native solution is necessary, unless a more umbiquitous 3rd party like Skype brings Video Calling to Android.
That's why a Native Solution is needed. So that you can just look in Google Talk and video call with anyone you know who has it installed on their Android phone OR Computer/Notebook/Netbook.
2. It's trivial in a way that it should be easy to backport them to lower Android versions. That's why I worry about them. Phones aren't cheap - contract or not. This was particularly an issue going from Android 1.5 to 1.6,a nd FroYo to Gingerbread is looking somewhat similar, IMO. Again, fairly obvious...
You do realize you don't have to upgrade from custom roms, you can stick to using an older one. I already know the answer to that, I find your sig hilarious because its your sig.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you're missing the point. You don't have to use anything. You can be totally stock forever. So what...
Custom ROMs have issues and the release cycle of them is too fast, yet they're endorsed here as if they're official ROM builds. When one build fixes an issue, it often introduces another issue (I read change logs, and I do keep up with them somewhat, even though I don't use them). It puts you into an upgrade treadmill that I simply can't (and won't) deal with. I don't have time to constantly reflash my phone - like most of the flashers here do.
The fact that you don't have to upgrade you ROM doesn't mean you won't have to upgrade your ROM.
Official ROMs and devices will get thoroughly reviewed by me in the future, especially since I plan to move off of T-Mobile and only stick with carriers that give 30 day return policies.
Glad you like the sig /rolleyes

Morrill: No minimum processor requirements for Honeycomb http://bit.ly/eK9qrG
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

alvintimothyjr said:
Morrill: No minimum processor requirements for Honeycomb http://bit.ly/eK9qrG
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What about RAM?
Well, probably won't be an issue for Galaxy S phones since the Nexus S probably has the same RAM configuration as ours...

N8ter said:
1. Because video calling on Android is fragmented to hell right now. Some people use QIK. Some people use Tango. Some people use Yahoo, Fring, etc. I'm not installing 3-5 applications on my phone (2-3 of which runs battery whoring services in the background) just to video call. A native solution is necessary, unless a more umbiquitous 3rd party like Skype brings Video Calling to Android.
That's why a Native Solution is needed. So that you can just look in Google Talk and video call with anyone you know who has it installed on their Android phone OR Computer/Notebook/Netbook.
2. It's trivial in a way that it should be easy to backport them to lower Android versions. That's why I worry about them. Phones aren't cheap - contract or not. This was particularly an issue going from Android 1.5 to 1.6,a nd FroYo to Gingerbread is looking somewhat similar, IMO. Again, fairly obvious...
I think you're missing the point. You don't have to use anything. You can be totally stock forever. So what...
Custom ROMs have issues and the release cycle of them is too fast, yet they're endorsed here as if they're official ROM builds. When one build fixes an issue, it often introduces another issue (I read change logs, and I do keep up with them somewhat, even though I don't use them). It puts you into an upgrade treadmill that I simply can't (and won't) deal with. I don't have time to constantly reflash my phone - like most of the flashers here do.
The fact that you don't have to upgrade you ROM doesn't mean you won't have to upgrade your ROM.
Official ROMs and devices will get thoroughly reviewed by me in the future, especially since I plan to move off of T-Mobile and only stick with carriers that give 30 day return policies.
Glad you like the sig /rolleyes
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I get that they have all the different video calling options will make it difficult how about one that integrates all of them into one app ala trillian? Then if your someone who likes to talk to people on different messengers you can have an all in one variety without limiting others to your specifications.
I know TW has a few final builds that you can use until you get a new phone. As far as the manufacturers its all about making money. Android provides a base for these manufacturers to add components the market might want and that is what makes them money. They can offer high and low end devices and still say hey you can have apps. I don't really care for this, and it is one of the things I like about the iphone and WP7. It still comes down to asthetics, I can do what I want on my android phone and make it look however I want and for the most part without voiding my warranty.

If you're *****ing about Android, STFU, QQ, and move to your beloved iPhone.
If it seriously bothers you THAT much, just sell your phone and purchase a non-android solution.
thanks.

scrizz said:
If you're *****ing about Android, STFU, QQ, and move to your beloved iPhone.
If it seriously bothers you THAT much, just sell your phone and purchase a non-android solution.
thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Finally someone who gets that all he is is an Android hating troll

N8ter said:
It puts you into an upgrade treadmill that I simply can't (and won't) deal with. I don't have time to constantly reflash my phone - like most of the flashers here do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm wondering why exactly you feel your opinion is of any relevance to anyone but yourself on the xda DEVELOPERS forum. This is a development community, not a social comments board. The people who are here are (mostly) here because they are interested in developing and tweaking their phones. Why do we want to hear your biased opinion about Android if you aren't even willing to participate in the primary activity shared by members of this site?
Furthermore, you complain about the primary activity linking everyone here. You call it a "treadmill", implying that the activity invested into it leads nowhere, and insult the hard working devs who invest their PERSONAL time for nothing but thanks. Why don't you go complain to another community you aren't insulting, implied or otherwise?

Thegreatheed said:
I'm wondering why exactly you feel your opinion is of any relevance to anyone but yourself on the xda DEVELOPERS forum. This is a development community, not a social comments board. The people who are here are (mostly) here because they are interested in developing and tweaking their phones. Why do we want to hear your biased opinion about Android if you aren't even willing to participate in the primary activity shared by members of this site?
Furthermore, you complain about the primary activity linking everyone here. You call it a "treadmill", implying that the activity invested into it leads nowhere, and insult the hard working devs who invest their PERSONAL time for nothing but thanks. Why don't you go complain to another community you aren't insulting, implied or otherwise?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is the general forum.
Didn't read the rest.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

Thegreatheed said:
I'm wondering why exactly you feel your opinion is of any relevance to anyone but yourself on the xda DEVELOPERS forum. This is a development community, not a social comments board. The people who are here are (mostly) here because they are interested in developing and tweaking their phones. Why do we want to hear your biased opinion about Android if you aren't even willing to participate in the primary activity shared by members of this site?
Furthermore, you complain about the primary activity linking everyone here. You call it a "treadmill", implying that the activity invested into it leads nowhere, and insult the hard working devs who invest their PERSONAL time for nothing but thanks. Why don't you go complain to another community you aren't insulting, implied or otherwise?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If this were true their wouldn't be a WP7 forum lawl...

Thegreatheed said:
I'm wondering why exactly you feel your opinion is of any relevance to anyone but yourself on the xda DEVELOPERS forum. This is a development community, not a social comments board. The people who are here are (mostly) here because they are interested in developing and tweaking their phones. Why do we want to hear your biased opinion about Android if you aren't even willing to participate in the primary activity shared by members of this site?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
You've shown disdain towards Android, the Vibrant, and the developer community here in general. Why keep coming back? If you dont agree with the entire reason this forum exists (modding, tweaking and developing) then why not move to a forum with less of that going on? The general forums are filled with enough trash to turn anyone into a cynic, so if I wasnt here for the dev community, I would have been gone a long time ago.

scrizz said:
If you're *****ing about Android, STFU, QQ, and move to your beloved iPhone.
If it seriously bothers you THAT much, just sell your phone and purchase a non-android solution.
thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1......................

S-off and rooting software, can it be trusted

Hi, I just wondered if all the people who use the software made by complete strangers to root there phones are concerned about the safety of the programs they use.
As most phones being rooted are Android, which I think is based on linux, can it not also install some kind of unwanted code to infect you phones software. I read somewhere that some custom roms contained viruses etc.
I would like to know what you think and learn more about how the software works and if this is actually true, thanks.

Ive flashed every rom here in the last few weeks
Still have my google account and My phone
Also nothing important on my phone - if you run a multinational company? maybe think twice
If someone has hacked me ,i make sure they have hacked the most boring person on the planet.
So i feel completely safe flashing
I cant control or guess at your level of paranoia though - so you will or you wont flash random roms to your phone

Not my paranioa, just read some things about phones that run android and that some custom roms can contain viruses, it was more like they were blaming these roms for all the viruses that infect android phones.
Thanks for your reply.

ricky20 said:
Hi, I just wondered if all the people who use the software made by complete strangers to root there phones are concerned about the safety of the programs they use.
As most phones being rooted are Android, which I think is based on linux, can it not also install some kind of unwanted code to infect you phones software. I read somewhere that some custom roms contained viruses etc.
I would like to know what you think and learn more about how the software works and if this is actually true, thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What do u mean by that. This kind of thread is already created. This is not a debatable thing.
There are great developers here who sacrifice their free time and work to bring awesome things to us. And it is up to u whether to trust them or not. I completely trust them. The ones u adressed complete strangers are really great great people here.
And i believe xda and market are completely genuine things. I never worry about that. Even if some non-functional thing is introduced here, it will be removed immediately ASAP. And lastly, it is up to u.
[IMO, android phone without xda and market = nothing]
morbosity said:
If someone has hacked me ,i make sure they have hacked the most boring person on the planet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOL....

Answering to the OP: you should be much more worried about what manufacturer did to your phone and its software. Manufacturer knows both of these very well and would probably plant something hard to detect, if it were to happen. Of course, the software would have much more power over the device than any virus produced by third party, like being able to brick the device.
As for your concern of lack of trustworthiness - these people are doing the hacks for long time. They are hackers, not crackers. Hackers create and mod, crackers destroy and vandalize. Do not confuse the terms, they mean opposite things. Hackers are the people who power this forum, crackers would get kicked out as soon as detected. No reason for concern. Just stick to open source ROMs and you will be safe.

One more thing if u cant believe developers then i think u must not use any cellphones as blaming developers or hackers here is equal to blaming a manufacturer who have complete control over their device. They can steal your information without informing you and send it to server of their own.
I too 100% trust developers here. It depends on u to trust or not. Android is an open source software or OS. So, u can too build your own ROM and try it. Make sure u've knowledge on this else u'll surely brick ur phone forever. So, the last option is to trust developers here!

I am not referring to any developers on this site and apologize for any offence caused, I am new to this and have just bought my first smart phone. I read an article about viruses being spread on the android market and it continued to explain how this happens but also mentioned that people using custom roms were also at risk.
I feel you've answered my question from your replies, I was always going to try custom roms but HTC's update installed a new locked boot loader. I was just curious what people thought about the methods used to gain root control, I was just trying to learn more about the whole issue. I think the people who do this sort of thing are very clever and intelligent people and admire there dedication and hard work.
Obviously you very passionate about this kind of thing and I agree entirely that manufacturers and carriers can put far worse things on my phone, thanks for your replies.

No one can say what happens when u download something from unknown xyzxyzxyzxyz.com
Only thing I can say is go with the trusted sites, where even if the so called viruses are introduced, they will be removed ASAP. That's all from my side.

Custom ROM viruses are only potentially possible and as far as I know, Cyanogenmod already fixed this. It had something to do with the encryption keys used incorrectly if I remember right.

[Q] Why do we need devs? [Discussion]

Hi, don't know if this should be here or in a development thread.
My question is, and I know they are very important to this community etc
Why do we need devs?
What I mean is why do the original developers of the software, such as Google, leave it at such a bad state.
When XDA dev's get hold of it, their's no limit to what it can do.
E.g. Network mods, speaker mods, speed mods, theme's, custom drivers battery mods, heat mods, the list could go on.
Why don't the develops make it as good as it could be before they release it to us?
Some simple tweaks such as the networking ones to improve browsing/download speeds, why don't they just do it in the first place? Rather than limiting their users and therefor creating the need for so many underground developers.
Don't take this in the wrong way devs, I appreciate your work, just want to hear your opinions on why you think original devs leave it at such a state, where it could be deemed unfinished or totally lacking.

The oem thinks what is best for the device while other developer may have other opinions.
Eg, Google may think a kernel running at 1.3ghz is better than 1.6 ghz which Dev may think like wise. Also, the Google wanted promote cloud tech, and hence does not allow otg but Dev can unlock this feature.
Dev are there to do things not permit by company
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

sinple said:
The oem thinks what is best for the device while other developer may have other opinions.
Eg, Google may think a kernel running at 1.3ghz is better than 1.6 ghz which Dev may think like wise. Also, the Google wanted promote cloud tech, and hence does not allow otg but Dev can unlock this feature.
Dev are there to do things not permit by company
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey
Thanks for the reply, and I want this to be more of a discussion than answers
I don't understand why companies do it though.
And OTG is allowed for non-rooted devices. Just some of its features arent, if you get that. Like a mouse and keyboard works un-rooted, by a HDD doesnt.
I'm just curious as to why some of the devs here, such as Faux and Xmoo, havent got jobs at Google so they can teach them a thing or to. They know what the consumer actually wants, and pay attention to the needs of the tech enthusiast.

There is an diference between normal state and improved state. Its better. 1.3ghz processor runing normal and cooler than a 1.6ghz that could get warm and gives some trouble.
Im just glad that its not a locked device giving ours beloved devs the chance to improve it.
Sent from my LG-P500 using xda premium

maztahbr said:
There is an diference between normal state and improved state. Its better. 1.3ghz processor runing normal and cooler than a 1.6ghz that could get warm and gives some trouble.
Im just glad that its not a locked device giving ours beloved devs the chance to improve it.
Sent from my LG-P500 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see your point
Basically "Better Safe than Sorry" right?

Exactly!
Sent from my LG-P500 using xda premium

How do you not see a need for developers?
Sent From My Toro+ via White Tapatalk

It's because people have preferences. And some people just like to tinker with their stuff.

The basic argumentative of yours seemed to be "if it's good enough, then we only need one". But, see , there is nothing in the world that's "best" enough to outsweep everything else. It's always nice to have options
I wouldn't say the stock rom and kernel is bad or "not enough" so the devs have to step out. I think google guys do a great job on stock rom. It's just nice for us users to have some other choices to play with.
In some sense it's kind of like buying flours. We wouldn't say,"well, if this brand of flours is good enough, we only need one brand in the world. Why so many brands out there?" Because different brands might grow in different places, use different breeds of wheats, have different moistures, use different ways to grind them, therefore different flavors. You simpy can't say anything would be that good that one is enough.
There is no limitation in improvement and imagination, and I think that's what devs here are doing.

The devs do amazing work, if only XDA was a tech company.

I know I won't be popular for saying this but I have tried a lot of different roms on a lot of different devices and in my experience it is best to stick with the stock rom, since custom roms inevitably have flaws which only present themselves at the most inopportune moments.
There's a reason why stock roms ship in the condition they're in; it's because all the variables are tried and tested and because a shed load of time has gone in to developing the software to work perfectly with the hardware. Dev's seem to have a knack of improving the software in some conditions at the expense of breaking it in others.
As an example, I once loaded a very popular custom rom onto a handset because everyone was raving about how good it was. Several days later I was at a wedding and took my handset out to snap some photos, only to realise that the camera didn't work in a certain configuration with this rom. The bug wasn't documented and the result was that I couldn't take any photos.
All too often this sort of thing happens; you'll read threads about the latest and greatest rom and how fast it is etc etc, only to then come across a comment about someone whose wifi keeps disconnecting, or someone whose battery life has halved and so on.
It's a bit like switching to Ubuntu from Windows, Ubuntu is fine if you like tinkering but if you want to get **** done, stick with Windows.
Happy to eat my words if someone recommends a fully working rom which is a genuine improvement over the stock rom.

Development can go on forever. My HTC inspire is two years old, and development is still going forward thanks to great devs (randomblame). Big companies just build for the masses. Devs tweak for us geeks that are always looking for more.
Sent from my Inspire 4G using xda app-developers app

Switchbitch said:
I know I won't be popular for saying this but I have tried a lot of different roms on a lot of different devices and in my experience it is best to stick with the stock rom, since custom roms inevitably have flaws which only present themselves at the most inopportune moments.
There's a reason why stock roms ship in the condition they're in; it's because all the variables are tried and tested and because a shed load of time has gone in to developing the software to work perfectly with the hardware. Dev's seem to have a knack of improving the software in some conditions at the expense of breaking it in others.
As an example, I once loaded a very popular custom rom onto a handset because everyone was raving about how good it was. Several days later I was at a wedding and took my handset out to snap some photos, only to realise that the camera didn't work in a certain configuration with this rom. The bug wasn't documented and the result was that I couldn't take any photos.
All too often this sort of thing happens; you'll read threads about the latest and greatest rom and how fast it is etc etc, only to then come across a comment about someone whose wifi keeps disconnecting, or someone whose battery life has halved and so on.
It's a bit like switching to Ubuntu from Windows, Ubuntu is fine if you like tinkering but if you want to get **** done, stick with Windows.
Happy to eat my words if someone recommends a fully working rom which is a genuine improvement over the stock rom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
CM7 for the G2 is LOADS better than the stock HTC rom.
Android is a platform of options, our developers help give you more options. They allow you complete control over the hardware YOU purchased, keep you updated on the most recent version of Android, and let you tweak to your heart's desire. Microsoft and Apple lock you in, it's their way or the highway. But Android and it's developers give you the ability to say "I don't like this, and I'm going to change it".

Switchbitch said:
I know I won't be popular for saying this but I have tried a lot of different roms on a lot of different devices and in my experience it is best to stick with the stock rom, since custom roms inevitably have flaws which only present themselves at the most inopportune moments.
There's a reason why stock roms ship in the condition they're in; it's because all the variables are tried and tested and because a shed load of time has gone in to developing the software to work perfectly with the hardware. Dev's seem to have a knack of improving the software in some conditions at the expense of breaking it in others.
As an example, I once loaded a very popular custom rom onto a handset because everyone was raving about how good it was. Several days later I was at a wedding and took my handset out to snap some photos, only to realise that the camera didn't work in a certain configuration with this rom. The bug wasn't documented and the result was that I couldn't take any photos.
All too often this sort of thing happens; you'll read threads about the latest and greatest rom and how fast it is etc etc, only to then come across a comment about someone whose wifi keeps disconnecting, or someone whose battery life has halved and so on.
It's a bit like switching to Ubuntu from Windows, Ubuntu is fine if you like tinkering but if you want to get **** done, stick with Windows.
Happy to eat my words if someone recommends a fully working rom which is a genuine improvement over the stock rom.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On non nexus devices I would agree. All of the aosp ROMs on my fascinate and d2g had serious issues that really couldn't be overlooked and made the phone unusable on a daily basis.
On the other hand, ROMs on my Galaxy Nexus and Nexus 7 are a huge improvement over stock. CM is always a solid choice.
I haz no sig

I can't believe no one has explicitly mentioned this...Google and other OEMs have a responsibility towards their shareholders and the market, whereas "devs" (like on xda) have no such responsibility; this makes a huge difference in process and result. As an example, theres a hack for the n7 to get the sony bravia engine, which is kinda nice, but there is no way that sony is going to let google do that legally is there? OEMs have to do things proper and legal.
The biggest difference though, is one already alluded to in this thread previous (imo), testing. Now CM actually does go through a LOT of testing and so on, but there is a sense in which Google's (or other OEMs) hands are tied due to deadlines, whilst CM has no such thing. While it is perfectly understandable for CM to go "here is CM10, btw its beta, but have at it" to the whole world after months of testing, I'm sure if Google did that people would be pissed, because Google releases to general market, they have strict deadlines based on internal product cycles and market variables and shareholder crap , but most of all people EXPECT market products to be rock solid, whereas its okay for something like CM to be broken sometimes. The reason n7 runs at 1.3 in stock and not 1.6 like some other ROM is likely because the company that made the processor probably told google something like "based on our testing 1.3 is the safest speed", people OC all the time, even desktops etc, but there is a "this is what it was MEANT to do according to the dudes who made it" thing.
But, at the end of the day there is no such thing as 'best' which is likely the reason we have SO MANY ROMs and not just the one, doing different things.

The devs are here because people like their devices to do different things and think they can make them better, myself I love to tweak things and so do the devs. Myself I just like to run CM10 on my N7, at least until its stable then I may try out the other ROMs. Also without the devs I wouldn't be able to run my CPU at 500 MHz over what its sold at and same thing with the GPU.

Determining when the development is "done" is subjective. And companies can only support their product in a limited time. Therefore, we need developers to continue where they left.
Sent from my Nexus 7 using xda premium