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If you haven't heard all ready Verizon is tracking down root users and limiting there data or fully suspending it so watch out. But we have to fight back against them by hiding Verizon from seeing that we are proudly rooted and some people have said the would sue Verizon. Please do whatever you can to fight against this.
Also motorola and htc are going to start doing the same.
Source? Where was this announced?
PixoNova said:
Source? Where was this announced?
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http://www.mydroidworld.com/forums/...rooting-manufacturers-carriers.html#post65013
I would like to know how it is even possible for them to detect root. Seems android becoming more closed to me
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App
Ya, the android world ain't looking too bright.
No sideloading
No tethering (for free)
No emulating
No rooting
No updating
So far the Atrix is GSM only so I'm not sure how much fervor there's going to be against VZW in this particular forum.
I'm more concerned about the messages ATT has been sending out to iphone users telling them to cease tethering or be automatically switched to a tethering plan.
Wow that's some crazy ****. Someone made a good point after the article, apple tried to fight jail breaking and lost. So why can't we fight.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App
sagerox said:
Wow that's some crazy ****. Someone made a good point after the article, apple tried to fight jail breaking and lost. So why can't we fight.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App
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no apple did't tried to fight the jailbreak community they realized that is in their best interest if they just pretend that jailbreaking doesn't exists, like this they can keep everybody happy, regular users and jailbreakers
How the hell am I post to install my antivirus that isnt on market place if I cant side load either or even use amazon app store.
-illusion
sagerox said:
Wow that's some crazy ****. Someone made a good point after the article, apple tried to fight jail breaking and lost. So why can't we fight.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App
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This is actually a rather interesting situation. The DMCA and subsequent Apple lawsuit has established both the legislation and court precedent that you can unlock and jailbreak/root your mobile phone if you so wish (mobile phones only so far, tablets do not qualify under the DMCA exemption).
I believe any language in a VZW contract contradicting these consumer rights you're afforded under the law would be considered null and void. VZW limiting or terminating the data service you've paid for and signed a contract to receive just because you've rooted your phone should be considered a breach of contract by VZW and allow you to leave without ETF...
Maybe VZW's on to something! Buy phone, sign contract, root phone, get data suspended, terminate contract for breach of terms...Profit?
rboone18 said:
I would like to know how it is even possible for them to detect root. Seems android becoming more closed to me
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App
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Motorola, HTC, and Verizon are developing a software to track us.
Kueller said:
So far the Atrix is GSM only so I'm not sure how much fervor there's going to be against VZW in this particular forum.
I'm more concerned about the messages ATT has been sending out to iphone users telling them to cease tethering or be automatically switched to a tethering plan.
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Click to collapse
But motorola could release this in an update
Kueller said:
This is actually a rather interesting situation. The DMCA and subsequent Apple lawsuit has established both the legislation and court precedent that you can unlock and jailbreak/root your mobile phone if you so wish (mobile phones only so far, tablets do not qualify under the DMCA exemption).
I believe any language in a VZW contract contradicting these consumer rights you're afforded under the law would be considered null and void. VZW limiting or terminating the data service you've paid for and signed a contract to receive just because you've rooted your phone should be considered a breach of contract by VZW and allow you to leave without ETF...
Maybe VZW's on to something! Buy phone, sign contract, root phone, get data suspended, terminate contract for breach of terms...Profit?
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The profit part makes perfect sense.
tyvallely said:
But motorola could release this in an update
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Release an update that does what? Limit or suspend your data services? Why and How would Moto go about doing that?
If you haven't heard all ready Verizon is tracking down root users and limiting there data or fully suspending it so watch out. But we have to fight back against them by hiding Verizon from seeing that we are proudly rooted and some people have said the would sue Verizon.
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There's the Why (VZW), and also the How (also VZW). And neither the Why nor the How have anything to do with the Atrix.
Wrong forum.
Kueller said:
Release an update that does what? Limit or suspend your data services? Why and How would Moto go about doing that?
There's the Why (VZW), and also the How (also VZW). And neither the Why nor the How have anything to do with the Atrix.
Wrong forum.
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No no no no like enable the tracking feature. And no its the right forum because motorola or verizon could do it. ATT is next to do so.
what does this have to do with the Atrix?
Well if motorola releases the tracking update then its a problem for motorola devices. The last time I checked it was made by motorola. Sorry for the misunderstanding.
ChumleyEX said:
what does this have to do with the Atrix?
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Because other carriers will start doing the same thing. Classic case of monkey see, monkey do.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App
At&T will just have a superuser fee, no worries, ill pay it
Why would they have to release any form of tracking software or update, they can already see what software you have loaded on your device. Any device running a program requiring root, automatically defines you as having rooted your device
Running liberty v.4 gingerbread on my dx. Yesterday I went to try and use my theathering application, and it directed me to the verizon page for 3g mobil hotspot and usb thethering. Is this a problem faced by all who use gingerbread? and if so has there been a solution posted anywhere to allow me to still be able to tether on gingerbread? I never had this issue until I went to gingerbread, and will flash back to 2.2 if I need to in order to be able to tether. Any input is always apprecitaed! thanks
Try using wireless tether from the market instead
Ive been using pdanet ever since the p3droid warning... Ive heard that people are still using the wifi tether app
Sent from my DROIDX using XDA App
I am using wifi tether, and it works, but when I want to get back online from my phone, it kicks me over to the verizon page telling me that I have to pay to tether, and I have to restart my phone to be able to search the internet.
I'm using the market wifi tether with the tbh patcher applied. Its tricky to get started, but once I do, it stays connected.
Sent from my Xoom the way it should be, rooted and with SD card.
I've actually just been bluetooth tethering to my transformer
Sent from my DROIDX using XDA App
i flat stayed on froyo fission 261 cause it runs fine and i dont like being screwed with by processes i cant find or not being able to delete things i want to delete from the system....
Tethering is the reason the heat is coming down on us rooters. Don't do it.
rocko73 said:
Tethering is the reason the heat is coming down on us rooters. Don't do it.
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It is ok to do it, just don't be one of those jerks who uses 200+gb a month
Jmoney47 said:
It is ok to do it, just don't be one of those jerks who uses 200+gb a month
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If you are under contract with verizon (I.E. the one or two year contract offered in order to obtain a discount on your mobile device) then rooting your phone is illegal as well as teathering with out paying the service fee! If you are not under a contract then it is leagal to do as you wish to or with your own phone, including but not limited to rooting, teathering, and cloning another device owned by you (also not under contract) for your own use and purpose!!!
First off, this thread was not started to create an argument or debate on the legalities of tethering or rooting. Now that being said, how is tethering illegal? We should be able to use our "unlimited" data package however we wish. From my understanding, there is a difference between tethering and the mobile 3g hotspot which makes the way they both go about producing the wireless internet different. Again though, this is not the point, I was simply hoping someone could help me, if i wanted to be lectured on what I was doing wrong, I would have asked "hey, is this something that is wrong or not" can we please stay on topic?
here we go....
faber78 said:
here we go....
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lol i know right... -_-
anyway...I am hoping myself to find out how I can get some tether going on my droid x with GB..Don't wanna have to SBF back 2 froyo..
smiteme said:
First off, this thread was not started to create an argument or debate on the legalities of tethering or rooting. Now that being said, how is tethering illegal? We should be able to use our "unlimited" data package however we wish. From my understanding, there is a difference between tethering and the mobile 3g hotspot which makes the way they both go about producing the wireless internet different. Again though, this is not the point, I was simply hoping someone could help me, if i wanted to be lectured on what I was doing wrong, I would have asked "hey, is this something that is wrong or not" can we please stay on topic?
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seriously I agree stop lecturing on tethering, people are going to do it regardless... go onto a different forum for its illegal and what not geez
Sent from my DROIDX using XDA App
jalupinja said:
If you are under contract with verizon (I.E. the one or two year contract offered in order to obtain a discount on your mobile device) then rooting your phone is illegal as well as teathering with out paying the service fee! If you are not under a contract then it is leagal to do as you wish to or with your own phone, including but not limited to rooting, teathering, and cloning another device owned by you (also not under contract) for your own use and purpose!!!
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Tethering and rooting is in absolutely no way illegal and does not even go against the terms of service. If you are against rooting then you truly don't belong on a DEVELOPERS forum.
Anyway, what I would recommend is trying wireless tether, if that doesn't work, you could try a wired tethering service such as PDAnet or easytether which is what I use
yikes
Tethering doesn't work in GB? F that, I'll stay on .340.
What a bunch of big red hookers...try'n to snarf up the wifi tethers.
Jmoney47 said:
Tethering and rooting is in absolutely no way illegal and does not even go against the terms of service.
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http://tinyurl.com/vzwtos1
Sent from my unrooted DroidX using XDA App
jalupinja said:
If you are under contract with verizon (I.E. the one or two year contract offered in order to obtain a discount on your mobile device) then rooting your phone is illegal as well as teathering with out paying the service fee! If you are not under a contract then it is leagal to do as you wish to or with your own phone, including but not limited to rooting, teathering, and cloning another device owned by you (also not under contract) for your own use and purpose!!!
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Click to collapse
Rooting is not illegal. What penal code refers to this? It simply voids your warranty.
jalupinja said:
If you are under contract with verizon (I.E. the one or two year contract offered in order to obtain a discount on your mobile device) then rooting your phone is illegal as well as teathering with out paying the service fee! If you are not under a contract then it is leagal to do as you wish to or with your own phone, including but not limited to rooting, teathering, and cloning another device owned by you (also not under contract) for your own use and purpose!!!
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Click to collapse
The fifth us circuit court has deemed there is no legal basis to prevent users from gaining higher level access to their devices. As for contract obligations, there are no stipulations against rooting, rather it voids the warranty, which is acceptable. Teathering is a bit of a gray area. There are two schools of thought. You obviously highlight one, but I believe in the other. That being that I signed up for a data plan at $29.99 a month that allows for my usage of as much data as I desire. (Unlimited, as in not restricted) As teathering is a feature of the android device I purchased, I am using my unlimited data plan in a manner I see fit. And lastly, I would love a direct quote of the verizon service agreement you draw this conclusion from.
Back onto topic, the TBH patcher works with wireless teather. The trick with the patcher is to flash it in CWM a few times, reboot, start teather, then flash it a few more times. Whatever the difference was, it works well for me.
Sent from my Xoom the way it should be, rooted and with SD card.
This was enough to stop me right in my tracks:
rocko73 said:
Tethering is the reason the heat is coming down on us rooters. Don't do it.
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I thought to myself; "self....rocko73 just gave you a direct order. you better listen up and straighten out...."
lulz....
Received this text message today, promptly called and complained and had it switched back. Thought you guys would enjoy this.
I like the flex of muscle by att, can't wait for sprint to have service in my area.
Couldn't you just cancel your contract since they changed it without your permission?
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Tapatalk
Yes. There is nothing about tethering in the 2 year agreement. I work in a cell phone store and ive read the agreement with no tethering rules
Sent from my MB855 using xda premium
They claim that they sent me a message back in September but i don't ever recall getting it. And what do you mean cancel my contract, why would I do that, to get a cheaper phone? Haha
Sent from my Inspire 4G using xda premium
.
Thread moved. Would advise you to read forum rules and post in correct section.
Failure to comply with forum rules will result in an infraction and/or ban depending on severity of rule break.
how do they detect this?
exileinoblivion7 said:
Received this text message today, promptly called and complained and had it switched back. Thought you guys would enjoy this.
I like the flex of muscle by att, can't wait for sprint to have service in my area.
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Firstly.
They are violating your privacy as a user.
Secondly.
If the said terms have been put into place after you have bought and signed for the device 'without you agreeing to it initially', then legally you have the right to sue them.
You can easily argue that AT&T is taking advantage of the idea.
OmegaRED^ said:
Firstly.
They are violating your privacy as a user.
Secondly.
If the said terms have been put into place after you have bought and signed for the device 'without you agreeing to it initially', then legally you have the right to sue them.
You can easily argue that AT&T is taking advantage of the idea.
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The woman I spoke with on the phone said that back in September they sent me a similar text saying that if I continue to tether then I agree to it. I don't think I ever got that message but i flash roms so much that I could've missed it
This really brings to light just what a scummy company att really is. If there is anything I can do to retaliate it would be awesome if someone could send me a PM with some details as what i can do.
Sent from my Inspire 4G using xda premium
donsh00tmesanta said:
how do they detect this?
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I think they detect it because tethering uses a special APN which is detectable by att.
I've also read(and immot sure how this works so dontquote me onit) but when att sends a signal out it has what's called a TTL number. This increases by a value of 1 everytime its passed down so the return number they get is higher than it should be.
Don't really know how it works but isaw those methods somewhere so thought I'd let you know
Sent from my Inspire 4G using xda premium
Thing is, if your on unlimited, there's NOTHING in your contract that says your allowed to tether on unlimited, and that's how they get you.
No way to sue, they state that your not allowed to tether, and will change your plan if you do, so they're completely in the right.
Remember this... we only get as much rights as the carriers allow us to have.
and the other side of the coin is......is there anything in there to not allow tethering?
I got the message. A 12 year veteran of AT&T. Broke my contract for free and switched to Verizon.
Done like a boss.
Sent from my DROID BIONIC
Can't the method AT&T uses to detect tethering be bi-passed by rooting and removing their tethering app...?
Another way the know your tethering is when you use several IPs at the same time, like you tether, connections include game servers, youtube, etc. And it's kinof hard to explain how you were able to watch netflix movies, youtube videos, play games at the same time.
https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=...inspection.federalregister.gov/2012-26308.pdf
all it says is that in 2013 its legal to root any phone bought b4 that date without carier permission for any reason, after that date you have to ask your carrier, and b4 this law you could only root to change carriers. No one is going to care. If you want to root, your going to root, no one will stop you. Its the same with dvds, no one cares its illegal to rip em. or torrents, no one cares thats its illegal to torrent music. So in the end this doesn't matter.
oh and btw tablets are illegal to root because there is no set definition and they don't want laptops or ereaders using a loophole
When it is legal, no one cares... when it becomes illegal, no one cares until they actually get in trouble for it
Even if it only happens 1% of the time, there will be a carrier that uses the law to the fullest extent possible somewhere, sometime - and the customer(s) at the receiving end will definitely care
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda app-developers app
Actually, it has nothing to do with rooting. It has to do with unlocking your device to take it to an alternate carrier without both carrier's approval.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
Zeinzu said:
Actually, it has nothing to do with rooting. It has to do with unlocking your device to take it to an alternate carrier without both carrier's approval.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
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Thank you! Finally someone who can read and understand it. Some lower level phone stores were unlocking phones without carrier permission and this is what this is about. Unlocking means free to use phone on any other carrier and rooting means access to system files and processes...2 different things.
I'm not sure if anyone has seen this but I found it pretty cool that they used a picture of our trusty OG incredible...
http://www.longisland.com/news/01-27-13/unlocking-smarthphones-now-illegal.html
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
RepeatUntilTheEnd said:
I'm not sure if anyone has seen this but I found it pretty cool that they used a picture of our trusty OG incredible...
http://www.longisland.com/news/01-27-13/unlocking-smarthphones-now-illegal.html
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
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Damn government, always screwing the little guy. Oh well its not like its going to stop people from doing it anyways. I have been seriously thinking of switching my service to straight talk, and this news changes nothing. Tell them to come get me.
RepeatUntilTheEnd said:
I'm not sure if anyone has seen this but I found it pretty cool that they used a picture of our trusty OG incredible...
http://www.longisland.com/news/01-27-13/unlocking-smarthphones-now-illegal.html
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
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I don't know why they picked a CDMA phone for the picture when usually only GSM phones are even unlockable for carriers. Technically flashing an inc on straight talk is not unlocking it.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
tiny4579 said:
I don't know why they picked a CDMA phone for the picture when usually only GSM phones are even unlockable for carriers. Technically flashing an inc on straight talk is not unlocking it.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
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Click to collapse
None of the articles I've read mention the N4, or how comparable the price is to phones on contract. I guess I can't really talk, since I'm still with big red.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
The Nexus 4 comes unlocked. I guess it's above the law then.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using xda app-developers app
Ah yes, leave it to the government to try to forbid people from messing with the device that they paid for. Well, it's not as if it'll stop anything whatsoever.
This is kind of disturbing if you ask me...
Sent from my ADR6300 using xda app-developers app
One good thing is that the law only applies to phones purchased after the law goes into affect - so anything before that is fine to unlock.
Sent from my ADR6300 using xda app-developers app
scals37 said:
This is kind of disturbing if you ask me...
Sent from my ADR6300 using xda app-developers app
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Click to collapse
Digital Millennium Copyright Act, the gift that keeps on giving to lawyers and corporati.
Incidentally, a few clarifications. I see people making the same wrong assumptions about this ruling again and again.
1.) Unlocking your phone is not illegal. What IS illegal is for you, the end-consumer, to unlock or otherwise edit the firmware/OS installed on the phone from the factory. This means that we, the citizenry of XDA and similar forums, are guilty of violations of the DMCA, because the carriers (Sprint, ATT, VZW, etc) actually hold the copyrights to the firmware's installed on the phone.
1a.) The carriers, however, CAN unlock the phone for you, legally. Most of the carriers have come forward and said that they will still unlock devices so long as you have met your original contract obligations. Now, this is great if you've bought a new device. Unfortunately, it means any Non-pay or otherwise blacklisted phone on Craigslist or ebay is still screwed.
1b.) New, Unlocked devices such as Nexus, Galaxy, and Incredible International are still, and will always remain, legally unlocked. The firmware found on these devices is owned by Google or by the device's original manufacture, and they are unlikely to proactively start locking such devices just to lock out the reseller community.
2.) Any device purchased or unlocked prior to January 26, 2013 can still be legally unlocked and used on any compatible network.
2a.) Carriers won't retroactively kick your device off of their network if it is illegally unlocked. Nor can they impose any special usage fines or taxes of utilizing an unlocked device. A "locked" cellphone is one which has been firmware coded to its own carrier's network.
2b.) The only person or group who can take action against you for illegally unlocking your phone is the Librarian of Congress (who made this ruling and is the conservator of DMCA exception law) or the carrier who originally sold the device to you, as they are the ones holding the copyrights to the firmware. They cannot, generally, tell some other network to not host your device. Obviously they can ASK a competitor not to host your unlocked device, but they can't actually stop them doing so.
2c.) The original vendor of the phone (Sprint, ATT, VZW, etc) can, however, sue you under the DMCA for violating their copyrights. This is identical to lawsuits used to penalize movie and music downloaders. However, since phone unlocks are generally not "shared" in the same way that music, movie, and game downloads are, an aggressive lawsuit by a patent troll or copyright bully holds little potential profit because they'd only be able to claim a single violation, not the sort of perpetual resharing that goes on with torrent users.
3.) While jailbreaking/unlocking/rooting a phone is illegal now, re-romming a phone is still a grey area. IE, completely replacing the firmware on your phone with a homebrew is not illegal in the same way that a simple unlock or jailbreak code is. Since you're not technically changing someone else's copyright protected software so much as simply deleting and replacing it.
3a.) Unfortunately, because most custom roms are still based in one form or another on the factory rom, you MIGHT still be sued unless, as in the case of older devices like the DINC, all original drivers and firmware's have been open-sourced to the community. It's unlikely that HTC would go after someone unlocking an Incredible series phone since you can legally root most HTC devices from their website; but other carriers and manufacturer's may not take the same view in the future.
There is also a division between hardware manufacturer's and carriers. Carriers lobbied long and hard FOR this ruling, because it is in their best interest to keep you chained to them for as long as possible, and a person who just spent several hundred dollars on a device is unlikely to be willing to simply ****can that device at the end of two years in order to move to another carrier and repeat the expensive process with a new device (unless you own an apple product, in which you're already indoctrinated to all of this ). Sell such a device, yes; dispose of it, no. So having a locked device makes you stickier since you'll use it for longer before parting with it, and if you can only use it legally on their network, then you are stuck with them since you can't resell/unlock it to recoup even part of your investment as you can currently by simply unlocking it or having a reseller do it for you.
Device manufacturers, on the other hand, have a vested interest in keeping their units in use as long as possible, regardless of what carrier it is operating on. Having a unit of hardware able to be reused on multiple carriers breeds customer loyalty to the hardware manufacturer in the same way a reliable car or home appliance does, and increasingly people are seeking out devices based not on the name of the carrier but the name of the phone. Already it's a lot less common to ask who a carrier is than what a phone is; particularly when the same device is available on multiple competing networks.
The best we can hope for is that this will all come to a head in 2 years as the first generation of legally locked phones start coming up for resale and people find themselves face with either throwing them away, sticking with their current carrier, or breaking the law.
What I find curious...
In every article and argument I have read; the carriers framed the argument around "Unlocking / Rooting so we can change service providers." If I were a phone carrier, I wouldn't want my customers to be able to leave either. Sounds reasonable on the surface.
However....I think most of us would agree, that the vast majority do NOT unlock and root for the sake of changing carriers. In fact that argument is already very weak and flawed,
With two standards (GSM vs CDMA), some technical differences in phone models that prevent differing networks from connecting with the devices, and only a handful of carriers....you don't have a lot of options...so not much point.
The phone carriers can refuse service to devices they didn't sell and were in no way required to do so, however it would be in their long-term interest.
The steep financial penalty for leaving a carrier before the contract expires easily covers the "subsidy" at the time of purchase.
Basically....rooting just to switch carriers doesn't make sense
What do we unlock/root for?
Control of our devices.
Control of our privacy and data.
"Fixing" the bugs ( ask me about the ASUS Transformer ICS updates...HA!!!)
Excessive bloatware, like three book reading apps on my tablet...(seriously)
Customizing the device to our needs
...the list is long and the consumers don't have a voice in these issues.. Worse yet to my opinion, this legal ruling actually cripples the end user. Without root access the task of managing and monitor apps, permissions, data, etc has more challenges and limitations , especially without any Android "stock" apps for the purpose. I mean, they didn't even make a file manager. I'll spare you all my usual Google rant. Just imagine what the teaming millions of non-tech, non-xda have to live with....when was the last time you had to work with a device without Titanium Backup, Root Explorer and such? (scares me)
Sorry, my point is...they used a bogus argument to get what they wanted, with them in control of our property and data.
Final thought..how long do you think it will take before we see the first "Price gouging/manipulation" lawsuits against the carriers? They price an unlocked phone so high that no one purchases them. I get it, why pay $650 for a phone with no contract, but you pay the same monthly charges.....when you can get one for $50 and two years of contract? Also, for the record, I do believe that the legality of unlocking/rooting only applies to carrier subsidized devices made and purchased after the above date, and not ones sold at full retail, purposefully unlocked. I'm no expert, but just based on the price differences between 3g/4g and WiFi only tablets, you frakkin know the carriers are messing around with pricing.
WOW...sorry for being long-winded and thanks!
Seems the White House agrees that we should be able to unlock our phones.
http://gizmodo.com/5988388/white-house-you-should-be-able-to-unlock-your-phone-if-you-own-it