So..... - Droid X General

So..... - Droid X General

I hardly post here, this is known.
Even still....The end of the month is coming up for early adopters. Still no custom roms. This is not good news.
I pondered a resolution...and other than returning for a refund and waiting for the fascinate, I couldn't really come up with anything.
About a month ago, I was fortunate enough to read a donation thread in this section of the boards that was titled: "help buy a droid x, for developer" .
Obviously that idea has been done. So i thought what can be better?
im going to cut to the chase. most of you HAVE to know the deal and have some idea of what we need. Hopefully some of you know exactly what we need and work with it daily Perhaps somebody here has a friend that has a connection. Instead of fearing the efuse, we can start a fund for the individual(who will remain anonymous) who can upload the engineering ROM, encryption keys AND the bootloader. Once the files are verified as authentic by the talented members of xda, then the raised funds will be transferred over to the anonymous uploader of said data.
Discuss.

Uh...
No, thanks

OMNIPOTENT1 said:
im going to cut to the chase. most of you HAVE to know the deal and have some idea of what we need. Hopefully some of you know exactly what we need and work with it daily Perhaps somebody here has a friend that has a connection. Instead of fearing the efuse, we can start a fund for the individual(who will remain anonymous) who can upload the engineering ROM, encryption keys AND the bootloader. Once the files are verified as authentic by the talented members of xda, then the raised funds will be transferred over to the anonymous uploader of said data.
Discuss.
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sure, thats a bad idea for a couple of reasons, legal issues come to mind
we have root with froyo coming soon and the sbf just came out. id say were doing pretty good for being three weeks from launch. enjoy it for what it is and enjoy the goodies as they come. There arent many we dont already have.

custom roms dont entice people? LOL. wow.
That is all that the X needs, as it will add longevity to the device. Being binded to motorolas software release schedule, really blows. This is a great unit, it just needs some work on the software. Said fixes that most likely will only be done by devs on these forums.
Thanks LegionTHEFecalExcretion, i knew about the security breach and the sbf. Hey, at least you offered somewhat of an answer and not some peabrain bot rebuttal.

The encryption keys are, I'm very sure, tightly controlled at Motorola. Most companies have software design/build control where software ready for compiling gets checked in and typically encryption keys are locked away within these build control systems.
This means that, not only do you have to raise enough money to make it worthwhile for the person to potentially lose their job and get sued, but it's not usually all the average-Joe programmers who have access. It's probably the higher-up project managers or coding leads.
I just don't see the donation pile getting big enough to entice someone already making a very good living to take a change on losing their livelihood and getting sued over it.

Why not just enjoy the phone, be happy with the current root abilities, and know that at some point we will be able to load custom roms. Yes I want to load a vanilla rom just as bad as the next guy, however I am tired of seeing people ask "are you done, are you done, are you done yet?, how about now, now? maybe now"?
Give some breathing room to these guys, maybe they have kids, jobs, wifes, a life.

I don't understand why you guys have to be mean to the guy. He is new to the forum and probably new to smart phones. He may even have very little knowledge of what a programming environment would be like and how great the downside could be for someone to leak said information. He had what he thought was a good idea and was a b it ignorant. That does not mean he should be treated like crap.

I have some advice for you omni, go get yourself an iphone and leave this forum... i can't believe that you would have the mentality to whine about some of the brightest minds that we have come to respect in this forum, complaning that they don't work fast enough for you... your a very selfish person who has no right to treat the respected members of this forum in such a way.
I for one love this phone and will continue to use it with or without custom roms...
And a special thanks to those working on the bootloader/ custom rom programming... we will wait for your perfection.
Sent from my DROIDX using XDA App

Some phones are easier to work with then others. The DX has not been out that long, have patience.
As an example the Droid Incredible was rooted and a custom recovery added pretty dang quick. On the other hand the Droid Eris took awhile to root and even then, some Eris users had "upgraded" to one of several "leaked" roms and could not root while others that did not leak could. I was a "leak" adopter and it took them several more months to finally get root for the "leaked" Eris owners.
Give it time. They will figure it out eventually.
Or go get something that is more customizable, like the DInc.

Related

THIS PLACE (ROMS) needs to grow up... HOW ABOUT...

OK guys... I think it's time to have a coming-to-Jesus (or buddha, or Mohamed, or Spaghettimonster) moment. Over many months I have downloaded lots of Roms, followed progress here and there... and quite frankly my opinion is THIS PLACE HERE NEEDS TO GROW UP.
THE PROBLEM
----------------
I mean it's great that everyone and their grandmother can express their creativity by bringing out Roms, by using test releases, adding a few themes and call them stable, by taking dogs and call them fast.
FACT is, most ROMs SUCK, most are unstable don't make it past a few weeks, they start out fast but come to a screeching halt. Or a week in you notice that wifi doenst work, or alarm, or gmail or voice... or gmail works, but you can't send emails... and you'd don't find out until one week later when you really need that feature (at least those of us here who work)
At the end of the day the Roms here are for the most part BS... mine is longer than yours, I am faster then you, I am a pony or not, or stupidfast or or just superfast or superD or fastest or fasttest ...WHATEEVER.. I'd bet that 90% of regular users stop by once, flash a few roms then just get ultimately annoyed by the prepubescent J.O. session.....without any goal or direction or common goal...
THE SOLUTION
----------------
So this place needs to grow up. HOW, well for a start adopt open source dev. principles. Instead of every 12 year old kid with a keyboard releasing their own orgasmicallyfast and ultimaterock stable rom, how about having a few development TREES.
Have different trees, that focus on FAST, STABLE, FUNCTIONAL. Or some mix that is clearly defined in a mission statement. Then have people commit improvements, changes to those trees and have official releases that would actually bring each tree further and add improvements. Have the most respected devs. manage those trees while all the newby devs contribute. Make contributions, being the creator of X or Y be the thing to be known for, not the "being creative in coming up with some dumb rom name".
Why, well it works in the opensource community, and if you look at that model, you'd actually see commercial companies entering the picture, sponsoring developments, donating code, paying salaries of developers, and with the option that some of the best devs. here actually can make a living of the work that is done here. Right now there's so much bs going on, a few minor things are real improvements, a lot is just cosmetic, same thing over with a new label or new mix
With the current situation devs spend hours and hours without the remotest chance that this work is taken seriously by the industry. Do you think they go and flash 100 rom's and test'em all to figure out what works.
Also what is better, to have 1000 Roms out there each used by 1000 people, or 10 used by millions.. in fact it would be a lot more. You'd find more mainstream users using the Rom's and you'd find the industry taking a look and things would move forward, there's evolution.
FINAL WORDS
Sorry to interrupt that happy kumbaya session here, and I am sure I'll get lots of hate/fu comments.. which quite frankly I don't care about - I'll just ignore you.
This is an idea, I want some of the leaders here to think about. Taking this mess and unite devs to actually contribute to some meaningful path forward, that is documented, has a standard, and people and eventually the hardware industry or telecoms or 2nd users (often in developing countries) can rely on, rather than being the side-freak show it is now, mostly created by all the 3rd rate devs that just remix while the people that really make progress are being flooded by the all the garbage out there...
Do whatever you wanna do with this comment... if this ends up being some angry comments flame war thread.. I'll just not gonna come back to it...and if no one sees my point.. then well, feel free to keep dwelling your nice little ecosystem here... and just dream about what this could be... for now I'll move on to my faster android device.. so long everyone.. and would be great if at least a fraction here would agree...
UPDATE:
How about having 2 sections. One for official ROMS - Have the community pick a handfull of ROMs. Each one needs to fulfill a basic set of requirements in regards to bug management/reporting, documentation (including credits), supervision (someone in charge approving code/additions). Also each ROM should have a mission statement as what the goal is of the ROM: f.e. stable and fast, or HERO, or Eclair, or max features, or keeping up with latest Android, etc. The goal is people can read the purpose/strategy/mission of each rom and decide which ROM they want to use and support (also financially) and keep track off. Each ROM needs to have 2 or 3 lead devs in charge.. so if one leaves that continuation is not an issue. If I can follow one Rom and use it for months.. I am much more willing to contribute $ then continually having to jump ship because of abandoned Roms...
If we would structure things this way, the leads for each of those main Roms, likely can live on this part time, we'd get dedicated people, and continuous progress, and results people can use... and it would open the development work to a more mainstream audience...

Cool story, bro.

lol.. your probably gonna get flamed....
but, the thing is they are "PORTING" roms that are not made for the G1/MT3G, most dev's are posting them as "unstable" or "experimental". The problem is that the users are expecting too much. The time it took you to write up all that could have been used to post bug reports.
I agree tho, that there needs to be more centralization with bug reports, more team work involved. Cyanogen and his buddies are doing a great job, I hope the other dev's can learn to work with him, contribute to his builds etc...
Also if your flashing rom's like crazy, its probably a hobby, if you want stable go back to stock and unroot your device

CaptainShanks said:
Cool story, bro.
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quoted for lulz

Bravo! Something that needed to be said since I stopped coming here 5 months ago because of all the bs. Facts are as simple as 4.0.4 was the best g1 roms and most stable since.. well ever. Every rom released since has in my opinion sucked HARD. I've flashed every single freaking one released and I've been visually impressed.. cause the themes are cool.. but i've been slow, and crashing apk's constantly. I don't like where the rom community is going. I believe all themed roms should be put into the Theme section and all of them marked unstable. and all the offical roms posted here. I'd even stretch and say this is one of the reasons Cyanogen removed his threads here. He knows his stuff needs more work and didn't want it here until it was ready. But kids and linking his work and messing around cause they're wannabe programmers and really ruining this site... I'm done ranting but kudo's Alec well said.

I'm hoping Froyo w/JIT comes to the G1/MT3G, Cyanogen will probably be the first with a froyo build, it seems the android dev's are pushing out froyo already Let's wait, be patient, submit bug reports, support the dev's that are spending hours a day porting this **** over..

preach on brother man. but yeah, i mean, the community has always had its drama which whatever..... but really, firerat has been the only one doing what this community used to be about which is helping lend support to other devs roms.
i mean even if you look a couple months back, yeah sure you had about 3 maybe 4 diferent hero roms out there and maybe 3 other 1.6 roms plus Cyanogen's stuff..... but then again the community was alot larger (obviously before 2.1 and before the N1). now we have far less devs, but the same amount of roms. i mean, slide port alone has about 5-6 different ports and it just came out. same with legend and everything else. back then it wouldnt be strange to have several devs on one rom. now its one maybe 2 doing stuff on here (besides CM and teamdouche). they embody what the community used to be about, and the turn is really what has pushed some other mods away.
ive had a cliq and i have talked to eugene and barak about it. the mentality of everyone here basically pushed them away. thats why they dev on the cliq/behold. heck. the cliq community pitched in to get one dev a replacement phone after he bricked and its been sent around to several devs for them to pitch in on the phone since it has different bootloader images etc and its not worth going into bc its a crazy rediculous device. the "community cliq" is basically the phone that gets sent around to make sure development keeps going.
not that im saying we should do that but it just shows that other android devices have much tighter knit communities and dont have anywhere near the bs that we do. for example last night, some guy put out a thread SAYING he took a rom put out by other devs that dropped it, and did some work, then resigned and released. no one said he claimed full ownership of it. then someone has to come into his thread and start uselessly contributing. at that time he replied how he felt which is completely understandable, and he was right in ending the post by saying to continue it on twitter if he wanted to continue the conversation to get on twitter or start something in gen discussion (which where this should prob be btw but i understand the reason for putting it here so more would see). these threads should be for releases and bug repports and ideas for development. not saying awesome! or i cant wait to flash this! or most definatly hey everyone i wouldnt bother flashing this bc someone else is releasing this tomorrow and it will waste your time. that pushed another possible dev away. sure he might not have been super dev who would create his own rom from source, but he might have had a different look at something that might have helped speed up a rom or stop an issue.
moral to the story- were all on the same team, we dont need to shoot ourselves in the foot.
*yes i know this post has grammar and spelling errors. this isnt english class. thats my .02 cents

Who said you needed to flash them... For a person with the audacity to tell people that there rom sucks or anything of that matter and you haven't even touched a rom except to download, drag, drop, flash, and flame. People start somewhere not knowing what the hell they are doing to great developers like Cyanogen (and team) Firerat, pershoot, dumfuq, etc. I am dumfounded someone with 82 posts could be so belligerent when they have absolutely no idea how long it takes to theme or make a rom. Before you tell people to grow, I suggest you take your own advice and shove it where the sun don't shine.
If you want stable, unroot and get your *** back to stock...
All I am going to say on this topic.

Not much to say on this since I run cdma hero but I do come over here alot to check up to see if anything new thats good has popped for my girls phone up and although I agree partially with what your saying but your approach is wrong. And if you want a good rom two things you can do is make it your self or buy a sprint hero and come on over to our neck of the woods

Looks like someone forgot to take their 'Happy Pills'.

not sure on this guy himself but ive been looking into it for awhile, have the stock system dumps of a couple of dif sense roms and once i feel as though i have a good understanding of the java aspect/coding of it i fully plan on starting. right now im just messing around with apps. basic stuff. but i would be more than happy if anyone did wanna lend a hand at any time.
i wish that if you wanted to submit a rom, you would do it to a site, that would then take and post the rom with no name on it. users could submit bugs anonymously and the dev can then fix the problems. the users would submit a form having required fields like what type of device, sd card information, any apps added/removed and comments sections as well. this would then make it so it was all annonoymous. it wouldnt be hey have you flashed that new hero 5 v6 rom? or that eclair 3 v2 has a problem with wifi, i reported it and it should be fixed in v3. the only people who would have problems with it are people wanting credit. if no one takes credit and no one gives credit...... then where is the issue. people have problems with person b using person a stuff and getting credit for it. well if theres no way to tell who took what from where then what does it matter? unless your a credit whore it doesnt.
the dev i respect more than anyone out there is Barakinflorida.... guy never asked for a donation from anyone, guy is willing to lend a hand and talk to you about whatever it is you have to ask. by far the nicest guy in the android community. and he did it the right way. untill drizzy put him on blast at the end of his thing outing him as the one who basically helped him when he needed it, he was an unknown besides to the main devs and a small group of others.
and its not like the basic ideal of the OP couldnt be achieved. theres all kinds of sites that you can go to to host where people can go and update with their own edits. and if people want credit who cares. take and have them sign the mods they make or things they add/remove and then throw their name on the big board.
whoever has anything to say about credit, i say this.... take the free apps you use, we wont even use the stock OS' since they get paid by big companies (and i know no one will be able to list a developer who deved on one of the stock os' ne ways), and tell me each person who was on that dev team. sure one or two you might be able to. but on most of them..... you prob wont. ie- level up studios, seesmic. its free. how many people use it? and who created it???
exactly.

XxKOLOHExX said:
Who said you needed to flash them... For a person with the audacity to tell people that there rom sucks or anything of that matter and you haven't even touched a rom except to download, drag, drop, flash, and flame. People start somewhere not knowing what the hell they are doing to great developers like Cyanogen (and team) Firerat, pershoot, dumfuq, etc. I am dumfounded someone with 82 posts could be so belligerent when they have absolutely no idea how long it takes to theme or make a rom. Before you tell people to grow, I suggest you take your own advice and shove it where the sun don't shine.
If you want stable, unroot and get your *** back to stock...
All I am going to say on this topic.
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+1000000000000
The only point the OP got right is that devs will call almost anything ported to Dream/Magic as stable and fast (the worst offenders: zach, king, king, king, and king) but I never really expected that a Sense ROM would go super fast on our first gen devices.

Dude, you guys still don't get it... long as you got those big ass "Donate" buttons, and you idiots keep giving them money, and thus, incentive, it's not gonna stop...
I've said it before and I'll say it again (I myself pulled about 500 bucks from two rom series I made):
Contribute code/knowledge, not money. Learn how to do things yourself.
As long as people can make a buck off of simple stuff like porting, they'll continue doing it, subpar as it's always been.
That'll weed out the file-pushers, something every idiot who can use a browser can do, and leave those who actually have something to contribute doing so.

r0man said:
+1000000000000
the only point the op got right is that devs will call almost anything ported to dream/magic as stable and fast (the worst offenders: Zach, king, king, king, and king) but i never really expected that a sense rom would go super fast on our first gen devices.
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hahahahaha

rom
this rom sucks. I tried to flash it and it just hangs. This dev sucks. I thought my g1 was gonna grow up into a nexus one. This **** ain't stable at all. To the op "FIX THE DAMN SMS"

would be neat to see a tree with branches for Ramhack, crazy O.C kernels, stable non-crazy kernels, etc... so that we can actually compare apples with apples when it comes to speed from all these weird and wonderful hacks. but thats about it...

I didnt know 12 year olds were making roms, maybe we need to call authorities since I sense a sweat shop! Also, I dont see you creating any roms. You and many other *****ing bastards are the main reason why we cant have nice things in life.

you know he is true.
When I had my windows phone its was a lot of good **** going on hear (and the mods were more understanding)
I never post anything here anymore cause it will get deleted by a mod/admin you cant even ask a question without a million people saying why don't you use search.
Anyways thinks for The roms CyanogenMod or Steve cause in IMO he is the only one that deserves it. Every one just trys to make his **** better and by the time they do get it stable he has already released a stable version

RaffieKol said:
you know he is true.
When I had my windows phone its was a lot of good **** going on hear (and the mods were more understanding)
I never post anything here anymore cause it will get deleted by a mod/admin you cant even ask a question without a million people saying why don't you use search.
Anyways thinks for The roms CyanogenMod or Steve cause in IMO he is the only one that deserves it. Every one just trys to make his **** better and by the time they do get it stable he has already released a stable version
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A very sad but true statement indeed. I have seen many people on here asking a question only to be told: wrong thread, use search, MOD close this thread! All of that is just ridiculous.. oh yeah.. goodbye in case I get BANNED!

Well i do agree there is a bunch of unnecessary roms out there. I think it would be more beneficial to give support to the main roms like Cyan, instead of making a new rom out of each release.

Mandatory "donations" for ROM access?

This is becoming more and more common. Does it bother anybody else? I mean i dont lose sleep over it, but it kind of ruins the "community" feel and turns things into more of a business.
Donations are slowly turning into payments. This is precisely why i PERSONALLY never believed in the word donation in the development world, but lets not get into that debate.
I mean, if a dev/dev team is really good, im sure they get more than enough donations to fund their work, seeing as though im always seeing people on the forums talk about how theyll donate or how much they donated. I feel like whats happening is a dev/dev team starts out strong, and at first is just soaking up the notoriety amongst users, and understandably so. But as time goes, and their knowledge and popularity grows, they realize "hey, we could probably make some serious money off this" but then they realize that that just goes against the whole "doing it in your free time" or "doing what we love doing" concepts, so they insist on continuing to label it a "donation".
Let me be clear, I have absolutely no problem with a dev/dev team expecting money in order to grant access to something that is popular. Thats what a lot of governments are founded on, and these guys definitely deserve a little spending money for all of the smiles they put on peoples faces. I just dont like the abuse of the word "donation" that takes place. Why dont you just say "you have to pay for it"? Cause thats pretty much what is going down......
This isnt directed at anyone in particular, im simply curious to see how other people feel about it.

I feel the same way. Label it as payment/charge/etc and it will be good. Just dont use the word donation when only a donation gets the user access to an area of forums, kernels, roms, other, software. Its just not correct to do
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

It's incredibly silly. In many cases these people are charging for tweaking something that they didn't create and don't even have the rights to redistribute.
When you get right down to it, every ROM here that's built off of one of the leaked Froyo builds is in murky territory. Although parts of those leaks are GPL'd, there are tons of proprietary Samsung bits in there, and if Samsung felt like it they could slap everybody with a C&D on redistributing that stuff.
On the one hand, the people who distribute leaks (and tweaked ROMs based off of those leaks) for free are taking risks by doing so, and they're doing it to help the community. But on the other, you have people who take those leaks, apply their own tweaks to them, and then charge for the completed product. Those guys are basically profiting from the work that others took a risk in releasing to the public, which is ridiculous.
The best way to deal with it is to not simply not "donate" to people who pull such shenanigans.

JeremyNT said:
It's incredibly silly. In many cases these people are charging for tweaking something that they didn't create and don't even have the rights to redistribute.
When you get right down to it, every ROM here that's built off of one of the leaked Froyo builds is in murky territory. Although parts of those leaks are GPL'd, there are tons of proprietary Samsung bits in there, and if Samsung felt like it they could slap everybody with a C&D on redistributing that stuff.
On the one hand, the people who distribute leaks (and tweaked ROMs based off of those leaks) for free are taking risks by doing so, and they're doing it to help the community. But on the other, you have people who take those leaks, apply their own tweaks to them, and then charge for the completed product. Those guys are basically profiting from the work that others took a risk in releasing to the public, which is ridiculous.
The best way to deal with it is to not simply not "donate" to people who pull such shenanigans.
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Its very important that we dont mention names, to avoid flaming.....but i know exactly who you are talking about in particular....

The trend started with kingklick and everyone was all up in arms about it
But eventually the rest of the developers followed and now its OK for them and they accept it LOL hypocrites
This is another reason making my decision on NS much easier
Some real development will be underway i miss my N1 XDA support back in the day
Not that i dont appreciate what others have done here just most of it wasn't my cup of tea with exception of Eugene's work
But he left for a reasonable reason too much BS but his work is still freely available

It would be nice to hear a devs take on this but on the other hand this could just start a huge ordeal I understand what you guys are saying but I don't think this thread is going to help any development at all in fact it may even be counter productive the dev group is growing for the vibrant but I wouldn't say there are enough devs to start pissing people off and making them lose interest in xda all together if its not one thing its another nothing is free in this world eventually if you want something ahead of everyone else you gotta pony up the cash I went to a street fair once at the gate was a booth labeled donations they didn't deny me access when I refused to pay but I didn't enjoy the full access everyone else did when they received theyre wrist bands that got them free drinks your not paying to get in your paying for the cause and the work and the time it takes to create something that millions can enjoy ......i wouldn't get to butt hurt about it its the way of the world be it in day to day life forums or whatever else you think it applies to just my opinion we're all entitled to them I suppose
V5 custom vibrant

I take back allot of what i said apparently some are still releasing roms here

willsnews said:
It would be nice to hear a devs take on this but on the other hand this could just start a huge ordeal I understand what you guys are saying but I don't think this thread is going to help any development at all in fact it may even be counter productive the dev group is growing for the vibrant but I wouldn't say there are enough devs to start pissing people off and making them lose interest in xda all together if its not one thing its another nothing is free in this world
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In terms of my opinion, and what im trying to say, the paragraph in bold in the OP highlights my exact problem. I understand the concept and the need for devs to ask for money in whatever form, and i have absolutely no issue with that. But thats what they are, PAYMENTS. The only thing im questioning is why they insist on calling them donations. They are not donations when they are in the format of a transaction.
do·na·tion noun \dō-ˈnā-shən\
Definition of DONATION
: the act or an instance of donating: as a : the making of a gift especially to a charity or public institution b : a free contribution : gift
trans·ac·tion noun \tran-ˈzak-shən, tran(t)-ˈsak-\
Definition of TRANSACTION
1a : something transacted; especially : an exchange or transfer of goods, services, or funds <electronic transactions>
Theres just something about it that seems a bit unethical to me, almost like a bit of a marketing scam. "Donate" has a much friendlier, less threatening tone to it than "payment". Maybe theres a mindset in place that people will be more inclined to "donate" rather than "pay". Im just trying to figure out why they cant just call it like it is.
Regardless of how you may feel about it, theres no question that sometimes it feels like our "community" is faltering in favor of making money.
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In terms of the devs leaving XDA because of threads like this? i mean come on, we are talking about word definitions here...not insulting peoples families.....

Donation: ASK for CONTRIBUTIONS DURING development
Payment: REQUIRE COMPENSATION for COMPLETED product

I haven't ever seen a developer require payment for a complete product here on XDA. Some give early access to buggy ROMs and kernels, but that's it.

I don't. see anyone asking for a payment to get a full version of a rom. some gets it early when you donated but still the ones who didn't still gets the rom later. If that's how they want it to be then let it be.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

Used to have "buy me a beer" links up at the most a couple of years ago. Seems there was more collaboration among devs like LucidRem who was super nice on G1 apps to SD. Was constantly being tweaked by seperate devs to get a better partition solution for example.
Don't blame me, blame my keyboard's autocorrection algorithm.

Any developer that does that is very clearly breaking the law. They could be very easily sued by anyone that cared.

Haha, even if that's true, which I don't think it is.....i think that would be taking things just a tad too far
Sent from my pocket rocket!

I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM WITH IT!!
I have been on with Android since Day 1. XDA and the developers who come here are the only reason I am so passionate about my phone and android. Without these 2 things a large part of my "hobby" would be severely hampered.
Developers do a tremendous amount for us. Can you imagine being on JI6 right now? I feel that they get barely anything in donations.... if this is a method for them to beta with a small group and reward those who support them/him, than I think they should take advanatage of that... and if it leads to developers earning a bit more than they would normally, awesome for them.
Cause you know what....
When developers are happy.... WE are all happy!!!
I mean come on, they release them to the public anyway.... is it okay for you to whine about not getting something sooner, that you had no part in creating/making.... what gives YOU the right???
PS, both R14 and Nero_Beta are very tasty... can't wait to get my hands on Axura 2.2 soon also.

maybe we should point out who the REAL developers are, and who are the wannabe's like people that take others work and just theme it.
Maybe just maybe then, these people that are rushing to hand over fists of money would donate to the people that actually put things out, and not the winzip blender wannabe's.
I "had" respect for some of these people until I first hand decompiled their rom to find out it wasn't there's at all. Adding a theme and transitions to Windows, does not make it mine.. how hard can that be to understand?

s15274n said:
I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM WITH IT!!I mean come on, they release them to the public anyway.... is it okay for you to whine about not getting something sooner, that you had no part in creating/making.... what gives YOU the right???.
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well i really hope youre not referring to me......i have a good paying a job and if i really wanted to pay for a ROM i would, but i dont......check my signature, i AM still runnning JI6, i dont use Macnut or Obsidian (neither ever required donations). I am speaking purely based on observation, not personal experience.
I mean if i was stuck stuck with JI6 forever, i wouldnt be thatdisappointed, because i have my phone setup exactly how i want it. Im not a fan of leaked ROMs, never have been. So i wont be waiting up all night waiting for Nero to go public either.
Please dont confuse me for one of those crybabies who just HAS to get their greedy fingers on the newest ROM right away just to be with the "in-crowd"...thats not what im about
s15274n said:
if this is a method for them to beta with a small group and reward those who support them/him, than I think they should take advanatage of that... and if it leads to developers earning a bit more than they would normally, awesome for them
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please dont misunderstand me, you have to read carefully what im trying to say....i have absolutely NO ISSUE with devs receiving money....none. they often deserve it. i just dont like the way the concept of "donating" is presented sometimes. The way you outlined it ^^ is a great way of wording the way it SHOULD be appraoched....unfortunately it isnt always approached that way, and THOSE are the instances im referring to in my OP

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_General_Public_License
This issue is that a custom ROM is built upon the work of thousands of other people that all licensed their work under the GPL because they wanted to it to be used that way. When someone takes their work and sells it, they are expressly misusing the work of others.
I think its fantastic that people are willing to put their time into developing ROMs, but at the same time it's very disrespectful and illegal to not follow the wishes of the people whose work the ROMs are built on. Ultimately, ROMs are very, very minor tweaks to what has been the result of almost twenty years and millions of man hours of work. If you want to be a part of that, that's great, but you have to play by the rules. After all, those rules are what made ROM development possible.

I can understand why they do it. Most people don't know how many hours go into just developing a theme let a long a full rom. So I understand them wanting to make some money for their time, but I also do agree with people who think they should not have a donation requirement to download, they should label it as a pay to download / theme or rom.
Here is an example of why I think devs do a required donation:
Here is the Nexus Theme I made (Did not ask for donations): http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=860198
To date this has had: 318 downloads
Amount of donations recieved: $0
Time Spent making it: 10+ Hrs
Here is the Frobuntu theme I made (Asked for Donations): http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=846285
To date this has had: 333 Downloads
Amount of donations recieved: $20
Time Spent Making it: 20+ hrs
So I can see why they do this. It makes a difference when you ask for the donations, but... again there should not be a required donation. That is called "selling" your rom/theme. They could do it the way I did the Frobuntu rom where I "Highly Suggested" a donation amount in big letters in the header of the post, but still gave it away to those who cannot pay.
Just my two cents. I would never flame or look down upon a dev for choosing to require a donation, that is their decision. I just choose not to do that myself.

No offense but most custom roms have a couple issues, needing to be fixed in the next release, meaning in a few days your gonna have to flash again, then the cycle continues, another bug so needing a new release... But the new release isn't faster, better or any cooler than the release before...lol
I'm on stock jk6 with my tweaks, my mods, and my setup, I was on customs for a bit, but all this donation crap has made me not wanting to try custom roms from anyone here, especially with all the drama :d
Needless to say I've never donated anything other than to xda itself..... I would never give my money to people just doing this for fun just like I do.... Donate to me then lol...
Anyways, id advise against donating to get a early release that ain't any better than the one before....lol
All I can say is suckeeeeers... Sorry but true, you have been hustled...
P.s. Anyone with a donate to me sign in their sig or whatever are completely retarded imo..... Lol

My thoughts against unthankful users.

Just wanted to mention that all the users who attacked the devs have changed their tune since oem support is crap.
I've been holding my feeling against all the ignorant users who attacked the devs.
Thanks, that is all.

I'm not sure exactly what you were trying to say, but I got the gist of it.
And I agree.
That is all.

Translation:
All those who attacked the devs and coined them faildev.team are all of a sudden changing their tune now that they are speaking out about their projects, and OEM support has been so crappy.
Sad that people act like this.

I dont undestand why anyone would attack the developers. They aren't obligated to do anything, what they do is out of their own will and desire to better the device. If people have a problem with the phone then blame the manufacturer, not the people picking up after their mess.

Thanks for the translation...

FDro said:
I dont undestand why anyone would attack the developers. They aren't obligated to do anything, what they do is out of their own will and desire to better the device. If people have a problem with the phone then blame the manufacturer, not the people picking up after their mess.
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People demand instant gratification, and when they do not get it, they get ugly because they think for some reason, they are owed everything. Then there is the jealousy factor. Then there are those who think the devs withhold stuff from the community.
Then there are those who just attack me because they can.
The android community is young, and due to it being user friendly, it attracts young folks. Some just happen to be very immature. It *should* get better with time.

All this cool and dandy...
However developers also have some room to improve situation on the forums.
As adrynalyne pointed here there is a lot of childish behavior here. But developers, being leaders of community, not always behave as such.
I understand all sorts of emotions etc. I personally fall victim of them... Sorry if I hurted somebodys feelings.
But, I cannot stand some sort of elitism growing here.
Devs, please do not threat rest of the crowd as a bunch of morons! It will reflect positively on you as well.
If you have time to read all crappy posts on the forums and post aggravated responses, why do not spend this time typing meaningful response, holding grain of knowledge? If not, just stay calm and do not feed flame.
I do not want to repeat myself again and again. Just want to see some professionalism and respect in forums. It's not going to help moving to IRC, twitter or whatever. Root cause must be resolved.
Personally I was really impressed, more by anything else, of adrynalyne responding to that guy posted leak on other forums. Seriously! It was so different from how I percept him at forum. Like completely different person.
Respect!

While moving to irc may be unfortunate for some...it provides real time interaction for development. That simply is not possible on a forum. I work with a lot of people, and can fix problems 90% faster in real time.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App

FDro said:
I dont undestand why anyone would attack the developers. They aren't obligated to do anything, what they do is out of their own will and desire to better the device. If people have a problem with the phone then blame the manufacturer, not the people picking up after their mess.
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I totally agree, the devs have my support in anything that they do, in whatever time frame they can make happen. Still better then the OEM time frame for an "update".

i hope the poster(s) who jumped all over the devs awhile back (i forget who) arent using anything that they have done recently and will avoid froyo/gb unless it comes from verizon/samsung

nitsuj17 said:
i hope the poster(s) who jumped all over the devs awhile back (i forget who) arent using anything that they have done recently and will avoid froyo/gb unless it comes from verizon/samsung
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agreed
10char

adrynalyne said:
While moving to irc may be unfortunate for some...it provides real time interaction for development. That simply is not possible on a forum. I work with a lot of people, and can fix problems 90% faster in real time.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
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And that's OK. Unfortunately it doesn't leave any footprints anywhere else.
That's why we same questions everyday... Technical or whatever. The commonality between them is that they do not have posted answers here.
I'm talking for myself only. Please do not take it personally in any way and keep in mind that my English is not my native language, so something might sound harsh.
Like I got an understanding that RIL is the problem, by I was unable to find any technical explanation why, what was done to overcome etc. So, I asked here... I even do not want to think about what resulted. And all I wanted to have some technical answer, and may be share some ideas, because I'm in the IT field as well...
Now, looks whats going on around. Punkkaos got it working at least partially. I understand that other people contributed, and work probably started not 10 minutes ago. But nonetheless RIL is in progress or already done.
How I suppose to feel about this? I'm mixed.
Fist of all I'm THANKFUL for you guys who put all time and efforts in this! I'm not going to use it immediately, but I like that secure feeling that phone will not become a paperweight in 6 months down the road. I definitely will enjoy results of this work in the close future.
But, I need to admit that I have another side, as well. It's not necessarily dark, just kind of human nature, I guess. It kind of disappointment...
I ask myself - well, if it is done and done pretty quickly, why it didn't happened before? Months ago...
Like, just an assumption, please do not take it personally.
I think what if devs took a quick look and it didn't worked immediately and samsung promised update soon. People think - OK, we will wait for update, not worth to spend time on it. But time goes and goes and there is no update or leak... And tension is going up and up. And all this is OK and well understood. But doesn't solve the problem.
Yesterday, I've created twitter account (yes, call me a dinosaur) and specifically asked punkkaos how he addressed the problem. And guess what, he answered as expected that RIL is basically adapted and he does call result translation between old and new one. This is exactly how I would personally approach this problem myself.
My point here is that aside of actual work to be done, it is not rocket science. It is well known approach in programming.
And now you can throw all rocks you have into me, saying that if I so smart ass why I do not do it myself. That, right.
But, I know my limits and I'm not going to wipe out one of my comps, partition it to install Linux, to install tool chain, sources etc, to reinstall Windows and all crap me and my family needs in everyday life, just to try adapt RIL knowing that I will fail, because of my zero knowledge of subject. Or, even worse without knowing that it was already attempted and failed. And it was attempted by someone who is really ample to do it. Do you see holding factors?
That's why I asked questions. And being this question answered properly, who knows, may be another brave soul would had managed to accomplish what punkkaos did, but one month earlier, simpler or better. I feel like bad temper and communication let community down, at least temporarily.
And I think we are all at fault here. No need to point fingers.

No one is at 'fault' here. Your sense of entitlement is astounding; you are not owed anything. This OP was directed at people like you.

phooky said:
No one is at 'fault' here. Your sense of entitlement is astounding; you are not owed anything. This OP was directed at people like you.
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Did I ever said that I'm owed? My grief is about this particular community in general. And because we all members, we all equally responsible for a atmosphere here. Or you think that bashing somebody here helps a lot?
And you know what? OP is right at the moment, I'll stay away from any custom roms or mods or whatever. At least for now. Because to be "cool" is not only thing in my life anymore. I outgrown it long time ago.
My crave for update is stemming not from desire to have highest score in quadrant, but from wish to have stable, usable and secure platform, from which IMHO any current phone is far away.
Out of the box SF is fairly usable, thought not ideal. Having Froyo and GB, means that I can get all bug fixes, improvements and new features such as native code extensions for applications and games, enterprise stuff etc.
Using rooted phone might be OK for me, but definitely not for my wife or children. So, manufacturer support is still important. Unfortunately my believe in Samsung faded out very quickly. And that essentially raised importance of independent developers proportionally. I do not see anything wrong with it.

phooky said:
No one is at 'fault' here. Your sense of entitlement is astounding; you are not owed anything. This OP was directed at people like you.
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this guy does not seem to be in the entitlement crowd. He even states that english is a second language and to cut him some slack. I think what he was trying to say is that he was disappointed that samsung kept getting everybodies hopes up, which may have pushed devs off of working on getting things rolling for this device (why wouldn't they wait when they are being told froyo is on the way? From what I understand it would be easier to rip through that and make changes than to pull it off a different phone and sort of start from scratch). This doesn't sound too "tinfoil hat" to me, and certaintly doesn;t come off as entitled. More like he was pointing out one possible contributing factor as to why there has been a lot of waiting around (not complaining here guys, statement of fact. Did/do appreciate all the nonfroyo/gb roms and fixes that have been pushed out for us) for word of froyo. Now that Kaos/JT/Birdman have gotten some Froyo alpha's posted up, I am getting the feeling that the floodgates are about to open.

2 cents
I am not a developer.
My phone was decent out of the box.
Thanks to all the developers hard work, that i don't yet have the ability to do, my phone has gone from decent to fantastic.
The best part is that they aren't done yet
The future is exciting and if i ever think i am entitled to anything from someone elses work then, please, someone on here ***** slap me.
To all developers on here....you have my respect and gratitude. You have improved my life and saved my ass more than once. (Or twice)
Please keep doing your thing. And when i learn how to help i will.
Sent from my fascinate through xda app.

Well, the goal isn't to instill hostility, but to bring awareness to be thankful.
I can see what CNemo means because he doesn't understand what's going on. I can assure you that there is no intended elitism going on. Most of the roms tested in irc are shared here as soon as they are determined to be stable enough for testing.
It may seem like there is no transparency, but actually if you care, there is... The source codes are public. You can see what the devs are doing on github.

Yeah I've tried the whole, "Im just gonna throw it out there on the forums" thing. It does not work well, and you end up ticking people off when things stop working. Always best for the IRC crowd to muddle through the stuff first.

adrynalyne said:
Yeah I've tried the whole, "Im just gonna throw it out there on the forums" thing. It does not work well, and you end up ticking people off when things stop working. Always best for the IRC crowd to muddle through the stuff first.
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I agree and disagree. I disagree because it's nice to have this stuff in the forums where more people can try it. On the other hand, no matter how many warnings you give, there are going to be those who AREN'T comfortable with ADB, etc and go ahead and do it anyway... then we as a community lose valuable time while you fix everyone's fubar. It's frustrating to me, I can only imagine being on the other side. As far as Devs go, I don't envy them... It's the utimate "Damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario.
Aside from donations and thanks, the other way to support the Dev community is to PAY for apps. I have quite a few paid apps on my phone. The only caveat to that is when I'm looking at an app and I'm unsure if I want/need it. From time to time I'll grab it from ********* and give it a 5min test spin. If it works, I uninstall and grab it from the Market. If it doesn't, I just uninstall. I know (for the most part) that we're talking about two separate types of devs, but the point is the same... if you're using someone's work... support them!
In response to the post above, I think I get what he was saying... I've done some programming (old school, mostly... BASIC, MS Acess) and while that doesn't really apply to Android at ALL, there may be some of us that have ideas that could help. In the end, a variable is a variable is a variable. I've thrown questions and ideas out only to be ignored. I don't take it personally, but even a "no, dip****... it doesn't work like that" would be appreaciated

No seriously, the guys in IRC will flash anything thrown at them... Some of them will end up with serious issues that were found to be seriously flawed.
Here's an example. VooDoo 5. When it first started rolling around in IRC from jt, it was considered unstable. It did not have the tools required for the average user to repair their phone. Adrynalyne preemptively produced the DI01 all in one ROM to repair everything from the radio, the kernel, the MBR, the recovery even... Did Adrynalyne have to do that? No, he did it because he knew that kinds of issues that would arrive when VooDoo 5 was introduced. Then VooDoo 5 was released.
Compared to VooDoo 4, the amount of incidents are exponentially less because of Adrynalyne putting a fix out there.
Also with phone repairs, it's much easier to help someone fix something in real time than it is to wait on them to try something, post, wait for response, in that sequence than it is to discuss the repair live in a chatroom.
BTW, this is in no offense to anyone. This is to clarify why some of the people are perceived as elitists. It's not that the IRC crowd are elitists, it's that they're more up to date with the latest development because they're busy flashing and screwing up their phones first so that you don't have to. On the same token, if you want to learn/test latest development, hop on IRC and ask any of the guys in #Samsung-Fascinate for help. It's very friendly in there contrary to what you would think (as long as you're not wozzy/sherwood1).

[???]Captain Obvious asks a dumb question

OK here goes, the question that is probably obvious to alot of the dev types on these forums, and maybe to some of the non as well. (And yes I full expect to get flamed throughout this thread for my thoughts on this so bring it on).
Question?
Has the business model of the world become so internallized that companies such as our beloved samsung *cough cough choke* , and tmobile really think that they can turn a a semi-blind eye (yes I know that they are aware we root, and flash custom roms) to the incredible talent that is out there? And that becasue they are the giant that the masses will still support them?
Now my thoughts
Samsung has taken months to produce a version of froyo that they could put out to the masses, I really do believe that tmobile plays a heavy part in that as well, adding the bloat and crap that we inevidably remove. Both of them together are to blame.
Now at the same time we have these teams of programmers and graphic artists, designers, and coders that within days (sometimes hours) of new source being leaked they have built stable, custom roms, themes, mods, kernels, lagfixes,,,etc. And these make our phones into what samsung could have only dreamed about.
Also you will never convince me that the leaks are not at times done to help samsung, tmobile, or whoever fix a problem they can't figure out INTERNALLY. (back to the internal business question again)
Now stay with me and remember that I am only questioning big business practices and arrogance,,,don't hate on me!!!
To me the answer to all of this is obvious in the dreamwold state that I am in, so here is what I really don't understand,,
Why are Samsung and T-Mobile not contracting with Teams like Team Whiskey, and Master to build custom roms, with designers like Jdan, and Tonicacid to build themes, with Eugene and Krylon360, chainfire, Whitehawkx, and supercurio, to build custom kernels, and modems? (I know i missed alot of talent,,,sorry if I missed you)
Yes, I like having the opportunity to get all this for free. (BTW I have at one time or another donated to almost everyone I mentioned above. If i use your stuff and like it I pay for it) Giving the source code to these people and contracting them to build freely (freedom is the key to the builds) would benefit everyone I think. I would pay $10 for a rom, $5 for a cool theme, and $2or $3 for a cool mod.Doesnt sound like much, but the quantity of those out there doing it would generate a sizeable amount of money. In fact I am sure that there are people with the means to request a complete custom setup for the right price, and you know that to have a truly one of a kind set up with custom icons coloring and such people would pay for it. And if these were available in a controlled setting that johnny homeowner could do safely, or have done at a store, the possibilities are limitless.
I can understand the potential liability of people flashing their phones, and bricking, but I'm sure that problem could be somehow solved (to a point there are always stupid people out there).
Ideas? Thoughts? Rants?,,,
I am now officially off my sopabox, let the hating begin,,,,,

Let me tell you why, because people who works at sansumg...for them its a job. On the other hand for the devs here, its a passion or hobbit. When is the last time you see someone going to their office and enjoys their work? So they dont work as fast or even.slacks off here and there. Not many right? Also. The dev here can get away with posting rom that bricks because they usually have a disclaimure reliefing them of responsibilities, samsung doesnt get that with tmobile or the public thus it takes them longer to make sure everything works, and because of that they cant try more radical approches like those being incorporated into the roms here. Monetary support is also a factor, supporting an old phone doesnt make you money, unless you charge for firmware update like apple used to.

Like any other big business there are many different players with many different desires. That's the game of politics... They have to take into account the liability they could take on by using something that could cost them too much money....
That being said...I completely agree with you! They need to take on the talent that the world has to offer. Android is Open Source for a reason...to allow for everyone to throw their ideas at it. Google has given everyone the opportunity to show what they can do. I appreciate the Devs we have here on XDA. If anything I would like to thank all the hard working Devs & XDA for giving us a centralized place to access all the riches the world has to offer.

PaiPiePia said:
The dev here can get away with posting rom that bricks because they usually have a disclaimure reliefing them of responsibilities, samsung doesnt get that with tmobile or the public thus it takes them longer to make sure everything works, and because of that they cant try more radical approches like those being incorporated into the roms here.
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This is exactly the reason. Let's not pretend that everything the devs do here is perfect. It's not.

PaiPiePia said:
The dev here can get away with posting rom that bricks because they usually have a disclaimure reliefing them of responsibilities
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Hang on there PeePants. These devs are GIVING their work away! They do their best to beta release them first! And there is almost NO SUCH THING AS "A ROM THAT BRICKS YOUR PHONE" since it is so easy to Odin back.
pdefazio said:
This is exactly the reason. Let's not pretend that everything the devs do here is perfect. It's not.
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Click to collapse
Nor do you have any right to demand perfection. Maybe that's why they call it 'Development'!!!

The devs on here for the most part do it as a hobby. The amount of work whether it be hours or days, that goes into some of these roms ANNDDDD(for emphasis) the UPDATTTEESSS, we as a consumer would say eff that I can't afford this anymore.
Big business is in the market of making money with as little effort or cost as possible. Hardware is cheap, easy and linear so they grab the consumers attention by advertising this amazing machine's specs. The "average consumer guy" just sees blinking lights and "I am a man because of my awesome phone specs" stuff and buys it no questions asked. Out of 50 customers I can only assume 1 might come in and ask which version of Android is running on their phone.
We are a small SMALL % of their market so why would they bring in these amazing teams to update and develop if they can pay someone to get as little as possible on the table to satisfy the average consumer.
You want to share with the world? Get a 3rd party license to develop with T-Mobile and/or Samsung, which btw will cost you Millions, then hire on these guys and sell their "labor"(since Android is open source). Once all that is done, tell me how you plan to turn a profit at $5-10 or even $20 a ROM. Again, once contracted the devs will be charging for updates(labor) as well.
No flaming needed here, actually a good conversation.

Yes, they are ignoring talent, but companies don't give a **** about anything until it starts impacting their bottom line.
I've always been a firm of believer of "vote with your money." This is the first Samsung smart phone I've ever bought and every month that passes with Samsung ignoring the GPS issue cements my thought that it will also be the last.
We can lament all we want, but if next year you go and buy another Samsung phone/product, you're doing nothing to change things.

No.
Sorry to rain on your parade, but no dev that doesn't work with samsung can't.
The devs here are strictily MODIFIERS.
samsung is.the.creator.
Without them we have nothing.
They leak out kernels, and our devs modify to make it faster and stable.
NO dev here can make drivers for your phone.NO DEV can make kernels without using something from samsung.
I understand why u all hate samsung but be thankful their atleast giving leaks.
Also I agree with the guy above the devs here have an excuse , "u didn't read the disclaimer"
Also there have been plenty of roms that brick users.

hellcatrydr said:
Hang on there PeePants. These devs are GIVING their work away! They do their best to beta release them first! And there is almost NO SUCH THING AS "A ROM THAT BRICKS YOUR PHONE" since it is so easy to Odin back.
Nor do you have any right to demand perfection. Maybe that's why they call it 'Development'!!!
Click to expand...
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Obviously you can't hold a proper, intelligent and civil conversation without resorting to name calling and fanboy attitude. This is the second time you called me pee pants for no reason, you sir are going on my ignore list.
blizzard1017 said:
The devs on here for the most part do it as a hobby. The amount of work whether it be hours or days, that goes into some of these roms ANNDDDD(for emphasis) the UPDATTTEESSS, we as a consumer would say eff that I can't afford this anymore.
Big business is in the market of making money with as little effort or cost as possible. Hardware is cheap, easy and linear so they grab the consumers attention by advertising this amazing machine's specs. The "average consumer guy" just sees blinking lights and "I am a man because of my awesome phone specs" stuff and buys it no questions asked. Out of 50 customers I can only assume 1 might come in and ask which version of Android is running on their phone.
We are a small SMALL % of their market so why would they bring in these amazing teams to update and develop if they can pay someone to get as little as possible on the table to satisfy the average consumer.
You want to share with the world? Get a 3rd party license to develop with T-Mobile and/or Samsung, which btw will cost you Millions, then hire on these guys and sell their "labor"(since Android is open source). Once all that is done, tell me how you plan to turn a profit at $5-10 or even $20 a ROM. Again, once contracted the devs will be charging for updates(labor) as well.
No flaming needed here, actually a good conversation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Learn from this guy, he saw the situation from the same point of view as me, and he expanded on it rather than flaming.

Thread Locked

A kind reminder

Guys, please behave yourself and be polite toward the developers. They don't owe you anything and they are working left and right to make our phones better. Don't act like they intentionally go around and break any particular functions on your phones. If you feel like those functions are important to you, stick with stock ROM and STFU. Custom ROMs are not for you.
Comments should be used for feedback only, not to make any request or demanding any answers why x,y,z do not work on your phones. DO NOT pestering the developers over PM or emails. The people doing that kind of things are no better than scums. I have seen too many good developers left the scene and it's quite disheartening.
Just some reminder to make our community better.
P.S. No I am not the admin, just an angry xda member.

Thanks for this,
I know most people respect what devs try to do.
However it is the small minority that spoiled it the other day.
In my frustration I threw my Play against a wall and have smashed the screen.
I cannot afford to pay the £45 to get it fixed which is why I cannot continue to create ROMs
If some generous people out there would care to make some contributions to help me get it fixed I will definately continue development on MIUI the play..
Sorry to sound like a beggar but I just can't afford it

pricey2009 said:
Thanks for this,
I know most people respect what devs try to do.
However it is the small minority that spoiled it the other day.
In my frustration I threw my Play against a wall and have smashed the screen.
I cannot afford to pay the £45 to get it fixed which is why I cannot continue to create ROMs
If some generous people out there would care to make some contributions to help me get it fixed I will definately continue development on MIUI the play..
Sorry to sound like a beggar but I just can't afford it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well the small minority are just noobs they cannot do this themselves because they are clueless. If they want something they should be trying to support you not nag you. But Pricey I can't Donate I have no Paypal . And dude this should be in the "General" section of the forum!

I know this is going to come off meanly, and I don't mean it that way, but seriously? So you let people tick you off so bad, you threw your phone against the wall and broke it... No wonder you're called Pricey.
I support development, but not stupidity, sorry. You'd be better off looking for donations for Anger Management counselling.

This is going to sound mean as well, but why should people donate if you broke the phone by something physical (chucking it at wall, which is obviously going to break it). If you had maybe bricked it (or something like that) while doing something to help the community, then people would be more likely to donate...

I didn't mean to say everyone has to pay for what I did.. just asked for a bit help that was all.
I'm just saying I cannot afford to pay to fix the phone which in turn would of meant my continued development and help to everyone in the community.
It wasn't just because of my frustration of what I was sent and demanded for, I have a house full of kids and a wife that drive me up the wall as well.
Sechko has kindly donated £5 (thanks buddy) towards the screen, I can put £10 myself so I just need a further £30 and that will be it.
I do want to continue as I have worked so hard on the Sony Beta version of MIUI it would of been a waste otherwise.

There are reasons why long term developers are so highly regarded. Not only do they possess the hard skills (code analysis, debugging, maths to make sense of all that), but they have soft skills like PR management, good team work abilities and the ability to see that the continuity of a project implies a personal investment, which will have a yield in the end.
Some long, peaceful breathing seems to be in order here. And after that, it's time for all of you to evaluate exactly that. Does whatever project you were involved in contribute to your personal growth? Pricey decided that it wasn't, and so he stopped.
Our role as a community is to ensure that developers can feel at ease to do what they like to do. As such, the community failed pricey. But then again, pricey can learn lessons from this. Both for his presence here, and for his real life.
XPlay-Swype

Logseman said:
There are reasons why long term developers are so highly regarded. Not only do they possess the hard skills (code analysis, debugging, maths to make sense of all that), but they have soft skills like PR management, good team work abilities and the ability to see that the continuity of a project implies a personal investment, which will have a yield in the end.
Some long, peaceful breathing seems to be in order here. And after that, it's time for all of you to evaluate exactly that. Does whatever project you were involved in contribute to your personal growth? Pricey decided that it wasn't, and so he stopped.
Our role as a community is to ensure that developers can feel at ease to do what they like to do. As such, the community failed pricey. But then again, pricey can learn lessons from this. Both for his presence here, and for his real life.
XPlay-Swype
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The way I see it, the Xperia play is already a strong device able to play ShadowGun with 30-60 FPS
If it's already powerful what do we need to keep modding it for?
The only mods that make sense now are hardware ones. and that is the new direction I'm headed
Mainly because I want my Xperia to pickup better signal while I'm out around and exploring new citys.

Since I've got my Xperia Play it's been on stock. No unlocked bootloader and not even rooted.
I like to keep it simple

Hogwarts said:
The way I see it, the Xperia play is already a strong device able to play ShadowGun with 30-60 FPS
If it's already powerful what do we need to keep modding it for?
The only mods that make sense now are hardware ones. and that is the new direction I'm headed
Mainly because I want my Xperia to pickup better signal while I'm out around and exploring new citys.
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Click to collapse
Why do we need to keep modding it? Dude, that's not really the perspective I expect from a developer. I think to summarize the general collective attitude of Android devolopers, I would have to say that the reason we keep modding any Android device is because we all want our phones to do everything. While we know it isn't possible for our phones to do everything, we want to push it as close as we can. Whether that involves tweaking the UI, the system, or hardware, we modify our phones because we can. As Android users, we don't have to settle for what our manufacturers or carriers provide us with. We can make our phones what we want them to be, and more!
That, sir, is why phones continue to be modded and supported by the development community, even far past their carrier end-of-life dates.

Calling hogwarts a developer might be a bit strong - He uninstalled bloat, installed V6, called it a ROM, promptly stopped updating, and disassembled his Play.
Re: OP, some devs actively irritate me. The aforementioned, our destructive little friend who posted earlier, and whichever member of FXP has a blood pact against the r800x... And yet, some devs here are amazing. Chevy's remarkably effective and problem-free conversions, Keiran's ridiculous productivity for all versions of our phone, despite lacking resources that other devs require prior to even trying to develop... And FXP, for all the work they've done, even if some comments do annoy me.
Tl;dr, devs are not sacred shamans and I don't mind calling them out for bull****, especially when said bull**** isn't impeding the dude ten years my junior who also has school to contend with.
Sent from my R800x using xda premium

While I do agree with you, for the most part, the fact still remains that there are some really ungrateful... people around here that do nothing but complain, nag, and demand things be given to them as soon as their post is made. While it is true that some developers aren't as awesome as others, they all do deserve to be treated with the same respect as everyone else. More than that should definitely be earned, of course.
The short of it? The Golden Rule, people. That shouldn't need to be posted, but alas, such is the world we live in.
Sent from my R800x using XDA

I'd donate just because of the wife and kids driving you up the wall. I only have 22p in PayPal though. It's yours if you want it.
Sent from my R800i using XDA

Trygon said:
Calling hogwarts a developer might be a bit strong - He uninstalled bloat, installed V6, called it a ROM, promptly stopped updating, and disassembled his Play.
Re: OP, some devs actively irritate me. The aforementioned, our destructive little friend who posted earlier, and whichever member of FXP has a blood pact against the r800x... And yet, some devs here are amazing. Chevy's remarkably effective and problem-free conversions, Keiran's ridiculous productivity for all versions of our phone, despite lacking resources that other devs require prior to even trying to develop... And FXP, for all the work they've done, even if some comments do annoy me.
Tl;dr, devs are not sacred shamans and I don't mind calling them out for bull****, especially when said bull**** isn't impeding the dude ten years my junior who also has school to contend with.
Sent from my R800x using xda premium
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Remember that, while Keiran is a free agent (and an awesome guy btw), FXP is a team with certain rules and guidelines, which give them an edge over free agents that they need to keep. FXP hasn't touched the bootloaders of the 2011 Xperia line, and their support for devices which "shouldn't" ever have been unlocked, like the R800x, is not officially endorsed. That's the price they pay for, e.g, getting phones and source code directly from Sony as they did last year.
BTW, FXP has another teen in the group, namely Blagus. He was busy already with the older Xperias... it's hard to wrap your head around the concept of a 14 yo kid that can tear apart a phone's sotware just like that

Logseman said:
Remember that, while Keiran is a free agent (and an awesome guy btw), FXP is a team with certain rules and guidelines, which give them an edge over free agents that they need to keep. FXP hasn't touched the bootloaders of the 2011 Xperia line, and their support for devices which "shouldn't" ever have been unlocked, like the R800x, is not officially endorsed. That's the price they pay for, e.g, getting phones and source code directly from Sony as they did last year.
BTW, FXP has another teen in the group, namely Blagus. He was busy already with the older Xperias... it's hard to wrap your head around the concept of a 14 yo kid that can tear apart a phone's sotware just like that
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No joke, right? I consider myself smarter then the average bear, but some people on this forum make me feel like a drooling neanderthal.
As far as FXP's rules go, this is the first mention of them I've heard, and they keep teasing that r800x support will come 'eventually'.

Trygon said:
No joke, right? I consider myself smarter then the average bear, but some people on this forum make me feel like a drooling neanderthal.
As far as FXP's rules go, this is the first mention of them I've heard, and they keep teasing that r800x support will come 'eventually'.
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http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=15253598&postcount=217
This was FXP's stance in July 2011, and I haven't read anything reversing it.

Logseman said:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=15253598&postcount=217
This was FXP's stance in July 2011, and I haven't read anything reversing it.
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While their morals are in the right place, I can't say that I agree with their decision. I mean, look at all of the other manufacturers that are starting to lock down their bootloaders. Motorola is a big one, but HTC is another one that comes to mind. Sure, HTC posts unlocks, but most of the time, the community has already broken their bootloaders open by the time HTC gets around to it. When we tell Sony, "okay, we'll play by your rules," what we're telling them is that we're going to go ahead and take this stuff lying down. What happens next? We own these devices, and the argument of pretty much the whole development community is that since we own our devices, we should be able to do what we want, even if we end up bricking them. Go ahead and void my warranty, I did that to myself, anyway. That's what insurance is for.
There was a time that Sony was unlocking bootloaders on the R800x. It didn't last long, and I missed the ship on that one, but the reason they took it down wasn't because of an SE decision. Verizon, the only CDMA carrier that officially carries the Xperia Play, didn't want their users unlocking their bootloaders and rooting, which was the only way to root at the time, because they wanted their users to keep their bloatware on the devices. So it's not Sony that we're fighting on the unlocked bootloader issue. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Alejandrissimo's method, using SETool, made available by Sony? Regardless if that's the case or not, Verizon is who we're having to fight for our freedom, not Sony.

Logseman said:
Remember that, while Keiran is a free agent (and an awesome guy btw), FXP is a team with certain rules and guidelines, which give them an edge over free agents that they need to keep. FXP hasn't touched the bootloaders of the 2011 Xperia line, and their support for devices which "shouldn't" ever have been unlocked, like the R800x, is not officially endorsed. That's the price they pay for, e.g, getting phones and source code directly from Sony as they did last year.
BTW, FXP has another teen in the group, namely Blagus. He was busy already with the older Xperias... it's hard to wrap your head around the concept of a 14 yo kid that can tear apart a phone's sotware just like that
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Click to collapse
No offense but how does age matter if the developer is talented ? And you know what, I think the type of people that tend to annoy developers on this forum are the R800x owner. If you buy a locked down device from a ****ty wireless carrier like Verizon, it's your own damn fault. The developers didn't put a gun on your heads to ask you to buy them. If you can't unlock the bootloaders or flash your favorite ROM, it would be nicer to ask the developers nicely to develop another version for your phone. If he refuses then move on, learn from your mistakes and never buy another phones/sign the contract with Verizon. You have no one to blame but your own stupidity.
If you can't flash your damn ROM, it's not the end of the world, go do something else rather than sitting here whining to us and to the developers about it. If I am one of the developers, I will probably even give you guys the middle finger every time you guys say something rude to me. The developers don't owe you guys anything period so learn to behave. After all, it's only a phone, not your baby, etc... Stop making a big deal out of nothing and ruin the community. Next time, stop being cheap and buy an unlocked phone if you want to use xda and we can talk.

RandomXIII said:
No offense but how does age matter if the developer is talented ? And you know what, I think the type of people that tend to annoy developers on this forum are the R800x owner. If you buy a locked down device from a ****ty wireless carrier like Verizon, it's your own damn fault. The developers didn't put a gun on your heads to ask you to buy them. If you can't unlock the bootloaders or flash your favorite ROM, it would be nicer to ask the developers nicely to develop another version for your phone. If he refuses then move on, learn from your mistakes and never buy another phones/sign the contract with Verizon. You have no one to blame but your own stupidity.
If you can't flash your damn ROM, it's not the end of the world, go do something else rather than sitting here whining to us and to the developers about it. If I am one of the developers, I will probably even give you guys the middle finger every time you guys say something rude to me. The developers don't owe you guys anything period so learn to behave. After all, it's only a phone, not your baby, etc... Stop making a big deal out of nothing and ruin the community. Next time, stop being cheap and buy an unlocked phone if you want to use xda and we can talk.
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Dude, you've gone off on this one. I originally agreed with you, but seriously. I'm not just saying this because I have an R800x, but there are stupid noobs with every kind of phone there is. You can't just say, "oh, I see these guys don't like being singled out, so they must be complaining." Last I checked, there are a whole lot less of us R800x users here, and even fewer that actually complain about the roms that exist. Yes, we'll ask if they're compatible with our phones, but that's simply because of the difference within the devices themselves, despite the fact that they have the same name.
As for using a phone on a particular carrier, I'm going to have to guess that you don't live in America, you don't have your own plan, or both. Here in the states, we generally have to pick what carrier actually has service in our area, very much so in the rural areas. That being the case, if I were to go with AT&T or T-Mobile, I wouldn't be able to get signal where I live. My only options, given that, would be to go ahead and use Verizon, or use the smaller providers, or use prepaid. I've been on Verizon since before they even had feature phones, and at the time, the only prepaid service available here was TracFone. I'm not saying anything bad about TracFone, they were pretty good for the first year or two that I actually owned a cell phone. I made the switch to Verizon, and despite all of the complaints I've heard and read, I've never had a bit of trouble with Big Red. As such, I've stuck with the company I've always used. Heck, even on my previous smartphones, the CDMA bit didn't cause any problem with development.
And then I got an Xperia Play. The only problem I have with this phone is the fact that the R800x has been treated (to borrow a phrase) as the "red-headed stepchild" as compared to the other models of the R800 line. May I just say now that I didn't get the Xperia Play to hack my phone. I got the phone because I'm a gamer, and the game pad gave the phone much more appeal than the other available phones. But since I like to mess with phones, as I had on my previous ones, I decided to jump right in to the scene, as I had before.
Now, I've followed all of the recommended routes with this phone. I've paid to have the bootloader unlocked, read up on the things I need to know to manipulate this phone, and have tried to help other users in figuring out their phones. I'm not going to say I've contributed anything, really, because I call it just being a helpful person. Heck, I've even clicked the "Thanks" button a few times! While I can't say that all of the R800x users have followed the same path as I have, I can say that given the seclusion that we CDMA users have faced hasn't gotten the core of us down. In fact, as an example, chevyowner was single-handedly modifying the CM9 roms to work for us CDMA users, making the data and such work just as flawlessly as it does for GSM users. When he said he got a new phone and wouldn't be able to "port" it anymore, at least three members immediately stood up to take his place. If that's not a community coming together, I don't know what is.
Oh, and as for calling out the R800x noobs, take a look in the Q&A sections, the GSM threads, and heck, take a look at the thread that started this all, the MIUI thread. I see far more GSM members complaining, moaning, and bugging the devs than I do CDMA users. So before you single out a small group that has already been secluded time and time again, take a look at the bigger picture.
One more thing. People who can only get reliable CDMA signal in their area can't simply "stop being cheap and buy an unlocked phone." Your special unlocked GSM phones won't work on our network. Now before you say I'm complaining, I'm not. It's my choice to stay on Verizon's network, and truth be told, I don't mind having to look a little harder to mod the phones that I have available to me. I just happened to choose this one. It's not the limited support for the R800x that bugs me, it's elitists like you that think others should conform to your standards.

Hogwarts said:
If it's already powerful what do we need to keep modding it for?
The only mods that make sense now are hardware ones. and that is the new direction I'm headed
Mainly because I want my Xperia to pickup better signal while I'm out around and exploring new citys.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm just a user myself, but XDA is primarily a development site, not a user support site, people are here for the modding. Most people seems to forget this which is also why there are lots of trolls.
Anyway, to answer your question, I like my Android like my linux, not like iOS. Besides flashing radios can improve signal and other software factors has effects too.

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