Database Users

Hero rushed out the door?

So after spending two days with the new official ROM I am dumbstruck that HTC let the Hero out the door as it was initially.
If you guys are like me you read online gadget blog reviews of new phones and you base your purchasing decisions to a lesser or greater extent on the reviews posted on these sites. The Hero received generally favorable reviews across the board BUT they were ALL tarred with the issue of the lagginess and unresponsiveness of the UI. Typical comments were "Sense UI is great but the hardware is not up to the task" etc. Hero was always compared to the iPhone and initially it was a more frustrating experience navigating the UI.
Clearly HTC have the ability to release software without these issues (new ROM proves that!) so why did they? I feel like they *really* hurt the sales and market potential of Hero and Sense UI by releasing an 'unfinished' product.
Can you imagine what Engadget's review (for instance) might have been had they reviewed a Hero with the new ROM?
I bought a Hero despite those reviews because I could see the potential in the handset but I know of others that steered clear because of the massive 'BUT...' at the end of most online reviews.
Its an opportunity missed I fear as the Hero is no longer a 'new' device.
I'm very glad that HTC have made my handset waaaaay nicer to use but seriously HTC... big, BIG ball drop!

Well... the Android phones are not really for the average Joes out there... they are for us techies and gadget lovers that love the freedom of doing cool and neat things with a phone.
We don't want to be tied up in an bondage game conducted/directed by a fruity company... and that is also why we choose a company we know.
Good enough?
You really thought we would feed a troll?

I honestly thought my post was a valid topic in a discussion forum about the HTC Hero.
@Thiesen
Wha?!? I really don't understand what your reply has got to do with my post. I think you've misunderstood the subject of my comments (perhaps if I had written in binary it might have been clearer?)
A broader acceptance of any platform is enabling and will benefit all users from 'techies' to 'average Joes'. Its not a matter of IF Android will become more mainstream but WHEN. I'm sorry if this makes you feel less special.
Troll indeed...

We're early adopters. We like to find bugs. We like to find glitches. And we take great pride in reporting them back to the devs and makers.
The average Joes just want things to work. They are not early adopters. They should get an iPhone then.

Thiesen said:
We're early adopters. We like to find bugs. We like to find glitches. And we take great pride in reporting them back to the devs and makers.
The average Joes just want things to work. They are not early adopters. They should get an iPhone then.
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I'm sorry mate but i think thats total rubbish, you wouldn't buy a car knowing it didn't work and happily waste your own time feeding back problems to the manufacture to bring it up to speed. You wouldn't go out and buy a brand new state of the art car and happily put a new engine in it would you knowing the one you had paid for was crap?
AND might I ad, the research and R+D that is put in to these items is all reflected in the price of them. If HTC were giving these phones away for beta testing or what not then fine, but for a £400 handset, i totally agree with the comments made by ShiroEd.
I have had no end of nokia handsets where i have thought nokia have been guilty of the same issue, releasing what could be classed as unfinished products.

Personally, I always though the tech sites overplayed the whole lag issue on the original ROM. Yes it was there, but in my experience the net effect was quite limited and in my case it didn't really limit my ability to use the device. I'm not saying that the issue didn't (or doesn't! ) exist, just that in my opinion it was acceptable for a device of this nature (please no flames from those who disagree).
This may be because I didn't load my home screens with tons of apps, and one of the first things I did do with my Hero was to remove the People and Weather widgets, and set up Peep appropriately.
The average Joes just want things to work. They are not early adopters. They should get an iPhone then.
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That would presume that the iPhone isn't possessed of the same issues that the Hero is/was. Google "iphone lag" and you'll see loads of posts complaining about lag on the iPhone, even for the latest OS and the 3GS.
In addition, you will probably find that the *vast* majority of people who've purchased the Hero have never even heard of XDA-Developers, and probably will never install another ROM. We are in the minority, not the "average joe" when it comes to Hero ownership!
Whilst I disagree with the OP, I don't think he was trolling.
Regards,
Dave

Thiesen said:
We're early adopters. We like to find bugs. We like to find glitches. And we take great pride in reporting them back to the devs and makers.
The average Joes just want things to work. They are not early adopters. They should get an iPhone then.
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Click to collapse
Agreed with crash. Thats just rubbish.
Entirely valid topic, and entirely valid point. Nothing remotely troll like about it.
Regardless of the people on this site, the Hero is definitely aimed at the average consumer, as a direct competitor in the iPhone market. Hence the multimedia, Facebook, etc.
Rushed to market I agree, but no idea why... Could just be lack of QA.
Many of the bugs reported here and elsewhere have been met with surprise by HTC, as if they really didnt know they existed. Do they not have a QA department that actually uses the phones in real life? Takes them home, plays with them, uses them all day and night to report the bugs?
Still, the update is great, the phone is flying now. If they could just sort out the crappy contact photo issue, the album caching, and the horrendous lack of bluetooth file transfer, I'd be a happy chap..

I think they shipped out the preview models and early review versions to people in the hope that they'd ignore any slowdown. Most of the review sites seem to have mentioned this in some form, saying that it can be a bit laggy but the final release could be good and the software shows potential - obviously it was never fixed for the first release.
To be fair, we're all early testers for the new HTC interface. If the Hero sells well and works well for everyone then we'll obviously be getting the same thing in future phones.
I don't think HTC is expecting any particular phone to be the next killer phone, they're just working on improvements with each new model.

While it does not make it ok... it seems to be the norm these days to get the product out and iron out bugs in a later release. As long as the quality is respectable, which I feel it was in this case, I can live with it. Particularly since the alternative would be to make do with buying an older model or waiting longer for the handset.
Zuber

Just give us an example of one single gadget that was not rushed out of the door!
The iPhone? Hellooo, the original iPhone didn't even have 3G. Have you ever tried GPRS speed (Go to wireless settings and pick "2G only"), not even funny. Talk about being rushed out of the door!

and apple offered a free upgrade to the 3g version when it was released! So yes may have been rushed out the door but no financial gain in the long run.

Was this a free upgrade that did not involve commuting to a contract ?
If not, then its not free...
Zuber

the handsets weren't free in the first place... you want to split hairs then fine.

The uninformed might think Apple were so caring and generous that they were willing to swap out the phones for "no financial gain"...
You can say many things about Apple, but generous isn't one of them
Zuber

Zuber said:
The uninformed might think Apple were so caring and generous that they were willing to swap out the phones for "no financial gain"...
You can say many things about Apple, but generous isn't one of them
Zuber
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Agreed However i thought it wasn't a bad deal as i have always thought the handsets were a rip off...coming to think of it the tariffs are aswell. I work for network rail and get 30% off all o2 shop tariffs and i still opted for the hero on orange which was a miles better deal!
(sorry for the partial hi-jack! )

crash_194 said:
and apple offered a free upgrade to the 3g version when it was released!
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Free upgrade! Just sign on for another 12 months of the 60+EUR/month (AT&T US) plan

Ok, I was one of the early adoptors of Hero. I got it right after its launch and I didnt really had too many complains about the device.
I never ever bought any HTC phone hoping it to be perfect. I always bought HTC knowing it will not be a perfect device out of box but community efforts will make it much much better device over time.
This applies to WinMo devices, and android. Why do we have xda here???

If you ask me, it's actually a great device. I've had far worse :/
I think people kinda underestimate how difficult it is to make good software. And how difficult it is to properly test stuff like this as well.
Next to that, it's always a comprimise. They want the software to be good, but also get the device out as fast as possible. The faster a (good) device is out there, the better that is for HTC in this case. It's a very competitive market, there just isn't enough time to keep working on the software until it's perfect.
The software should be 'good enough' and not perfect. I'm 100% sure they have a bugtracker or something else to keep track of major and minor bugs. At some point someone has to make a decision what will and won't be fixed before launch. And what shall be fixed right after launch.
For a new OS with a new UI like on the Hero I think they did very very well on the first release.
Now I fully agree with the OP, the lag/speed issue with the first ROM was not in HTC's favour. It was something that came up in every review, and people still believe that's a big Hero issue even while it's fixed. On the other hand, there might have been more important things that were fixed during development.
Usually speed improvements and tweaking stuff like that is something you do last. Other bugs and stuff has to be fixed first.

I don't think HTC rushed the phone out the door. The software was good enough so the phone functioned as a phone. It's a smartphone designed with the capability to upgrade the software. As long as the hardware is good quality, then you can work with the software and polish it as you go along.
I never really noticed the lag - it's only put to shame when you compare it with the new software. Look at the problems people are having with the iPhone 3.1 software release and you should be thankful that HTC have actually first delivered useable phone software and then improved it only a month after release. And HTC got some nice innovations to boot with the first release. They were perhaps a bit ambitious with the first release - where the phone did a lot of things when it first came out of sleep or switched screens, including the clock "flipping" animation.

RaptorRVL said:
If you ask me, it's actually a great device. I've had far worse :/
I think people kinda underestimate how difficult it is to make good software. And how difficult it is to properly test stuff like this as well.
Next to that, it's always a comprimise. They want the software to be good, but also get the device out as fast as possible. The faster a (good) device is out there, the better that is for HTC in this case. It's a very competitive market, there just isn't enough time to keep working on the software until it's perfect.
The software should be 'good enough' and not perfect. I'm 100% sure they have a bugtracker or something else to keep track of major and minor bugs. At some point someone has to make a decision what will and won't be fixed before launch. And what shall be fixed right after launch.
For a new OS with a new UI like on the Hero I think they did very very well on the first release.
Now I fully agree with the OP, the lag/speed issue with the first ROM was not in HTC's favour. It was something that came up in every review, and people still believe that's a big Hero issue even while it's fixed. On the other hand, there might have been more important things that were fixed during development.
Usually speed improvements and tweaking stuff like that is something you do last. Other bugs and stuff has to be fixed first.
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Some of these bugs are quite known more or less right out of the box, for instance logging into the market, you couldn't do this unless you actually entered your google credentials when you first setup the phone.
People are going to compare the Hero with the likes of the iPhone, it's the only comparable handset out on the market at the moment. But what i'm afraid of is the lack of future support for the Hero, as yet another handset is on the horizon from HTC. OK, maybe Apple have got it right in respect of only having to supporting one handset (and very simalar firmwares, agreed) which means more time focusing on bug fixes and upgrades.
I hope HTC do not put the Hero to the back of the pile and focus on new handsets

Invitation to discuss the full potential of a rooted Android phone

Hi everyone,
I'm in the midst of trying to understand the full potential of a rooted Android phone, and have started a thread here. I wish to invite users with good knowledge of what a rooted phone could do to contribute to the thread here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=6210151#post6210151
Looking forward to your participation.

potential
This phone is going to be incredible!!! the nexus one and its insane price tag will eat it bad on this one. Plus the Incredible is hands down better than the nexus, and thats just on paper!!! wait till it in our hands!!! lol I have a ROOTED Droid Eris (selling to help compensate for incredible) thats a month old, a ROOTED and OvrClocked Moto Droid thats a week old, and I already have pre-ordered a shiny new HTC Incredible (soon to be rooted lol).

about the droid
the droid is not hands down better then the nexous one
they are the same phones same processors and almost same everything
the droid has a better camera and more ram
thats it
so how is that hands down a better phone
i ordered mine and got it yesterday for my wife she is on verizon
i have the nexous one and after hella playing with both and testing both there about the same
my nexous one is faster but its rooted
i like the droids looks and how skinny it is but its not hands down better then the nexous one
also its does not have the Noise Cancellation technology but from what i can tell there both great call audio

p71ricky said:
This phone is going to be incredible!!! the nexus one and its insane price tag will eat it bad on this one. Plus the Incredible is hands down better than the nexus, and thats just on paper!!! wait till it in our hands!!! lol I have a ROOTED Droid Eris (selling to help compensate for incredible) thats a month old, a ROOTED and OvrClocked Moto Droid thats a week old, and I already have pre-ordered a shiny new HTC Incredible (soon to be rooted lol).
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3 new phones in a month? Wow. Can your reverse the root on the Eris and Droid and return them? I thought people had 30 days to evaluate and return.

He's a collector

sn95chico said:
the droid is not hands down better then the nexous one
they are the same phones same processors and almost same everything
the droid has a better camera and more ram
thats it
so how is that hands down a better phone
i ordered mine and got it yesterday for my wife she is on verizon
i have the nexous one and after hella playing with both and testing both there about the same
my nexous one is faster but its rooted
i like the droids looks and how skinny it is but its not hands down better then the nexous one
also its does not have the Noise Cancellation technology but from what i can tell there both great call audio
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Well for one. It has better touch sensor technology, 8gig of internal memory for music/media/whatever/, actually can get reception? The noise cancel tech isn't really important and doesn't always work flawlessly. Just the better touch senor and reception make it FAR superior to the nexus one. Plus it has an Fm modulator and an 8mp cam that apparently takes great pics and video soo,

the droid is not hands down better then the nexous one
they are the same phones same processors and almost same everything
the droid has a bett
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Well for one. It has better touch sensor technology, 8gig of internal memory for music/media/whatever/, actually can get reception? The noise cancel tech isn't really important and doesn't always work flawlessly. Just the better touch senor and reception make it FAR superior to the nexus one. Plus it has an Fm modulator and an 8mp cam that apparently takes great pics and video soo,
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See if you still feel the same when N1 is running Froyo while INC is still stuck on Eclair many months from now lol

modidlee said:
See if you still feel the same when N1 is running Froyo while INC is still stuck on Eclair many months from now lol
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Please tell me you're joking.
I'm gonna throw this out there right now:
The Nexus One is JUNK.
Between the crap screen, crap touch sensor, crap network (mine was tmo), there's no arguing that the Incredible is better.
And check this out. You're probably unfamiliar with the concept, so I'll help drop some knowledge on you....
Custom Roms.
When Froyo is released for any phone, someone will package it for the Incredible (and every other device under the sun. Maybe we'll have to wait a week or two, maybe we won't. But I'll tell you this - I won't miss clicking my 'Browser' icon on my desktop and the piece of $h!t touchscreen sensor mistaking it for 'Phone'.

m1k3- said:
Please tell me you're joking.
I'm gonna throw this out there right now:
The Nexus One is JUNK.
Between the crap screen, crap touch sensor, crap network (mine was tmo), there's no arguing that the Incredible is better.
And check this out. You're probably unfamiliar with the concept, so I'll help drop some knowledge on you....
Custom Roms.
When Froyo is released for any phone, someone will package it for the Incredible (and every other device under the sun. Maybe we'll have to wait a week or two, maybe we won't. But I'll tell you this - I won't miss clicking my 'Browser' icon on my desktop and the piece of $h!t touchscreen sensor mistaking it for 'Phone'.
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Im going to throw this out there for you....
Nexus one is far from junk.
I have it and I am on Tmo, I have excellent reception, the screen is loads better than many phones, and my touch screen works fine.
My Co-worker just got the incredible under my advisement when it became clear that verizon was passing on the nexus. I have played with it and put swype and the 3d gallery on it for her. It is a nice phone, sure it has some upgrades compared to the nexus but is is far from an "OMG this phone pwns" type of a situation.
As far as the firmware issue...not everyone wants to void their warranty and put custom firmware on their device, some people just want a legit OTA update in a timely fashion...me I always void warranties.
Different opinions are fine, but you dont have to be a closed minded douche about it.
Mike

I agree with Mike the N1 is not junk. I made the switch from the N1 to the Incredible. While I freaking love the Incredible (especially the fact that the touchscreen isn't laggy/glitchy) and have found it to be markedly more polished, I will always regard my N1 fondly. It was so nice knowing that root access was waiting for me before my device even arrived (it may be a while before this happens with the Incredible), and the level of customization available for the N1 made it a blast to play with (and made it fast as hell too). What I don't understand is why people get so pissy in these threads. I mean c'mon, we are only dealing with phones here. I would hate to see how some of these folks react in situations that actually matter

it's called credibility....
Until you guys, NOT MENTIONING ANY NAMES, can say that something "is better THAN" something else instead of "better THEN" you sound like an uneducated idiot. And I can't even finish reading your post because anything you say has no CREDIBILITY. sorry.
Ok but seriously, i'm on verizon, have had the vogue, hated WINMO, switched to blackberry pearl flip, which was nice to me, except locked gps, then found this awesome site, unlocked my vogue, put a 6.5 rom on it (thanks nfsfan) tried most of the android distros, and realized that a phone pumping some power paired up with android is the way to go. Ordered my incredible online, it arrived friday, waiting on me when i got home from work, and haven't looked back. I don't have direct comparison to a N1 or Eris, or any other android phone for that matter, but it is AWE-SOME..... Screen is brilliant, connectivity is easy, feels good in the hands... i also work for a company that sells sprint, so i will get to do a side by side with the EVO that is supposed to conquer anything else that is currently out. we'll see....

mike105105 said:
Im going to throw this out there for you....
Nexus one is far from junk.
I have it and I am on Tmo, I have excellent reception, the screen is loads better than many phones, and my touch screen works fine.
My Co-worker just got the incredible under my advisement when it became clear that verizon was passing on the nexus. I have played with it and put swype and the 3d gallery on it for her. It is a nice phone, sure it has some upgrades compared to the nexus but is is far from an "OMG this phone pwns" type of a situation.
As far as the firmware issue...not everyone wants to void their warranty and put custom firmware on their device, some people just want a legit OTA update in a timely fashion...me I always void warranties.
Different opinions are fine, but you dont have to be a closed minded douche about it.
Mike
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Uh, are you familiar with the touch controller's tracking issues? And that's not even to mention the 3g issues. Screens spontaneously cracking? N1 has issues.
As far as people wanting to keep their phones stock... To each their own for sure on that one.
However if you're one of those people, why would you even be here?
The point was that the Incredible wouldn't get Froyo for "several months" after the N1 does. That's a BS statement and I called him on it. If that makes me a ****, I'll take the hit.

Personally the N1 seems like a better phone because I don't have to deal with the bugs. But thats only because I don't own one of them yet.

m1k3- said:
Uh, are you familiar with the touch controller's tracking issues? And that's not even to mention the 3g issues. Screens spontaneously cracking? N1 has issues.
As far as people wanting to keep their phones stock... To each their own for sure on that one.
However if you're one of those people, why would you even be here?
The point was that the Incredible wouldn't get Froyo for "several months" after the N1 does. That's a BS statement and I called him on it. If that makes me a *****, I'll take the hit.
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Click to collapse
First off, the touchscreen issue is a combo of software and crap buildup on the screen, once I took care of those issues it hasnt happened again.
Like I said I have no issues with 3g.
A few random people out of a couple hundred thousand phones does not make the screen cracking a real issue, more than likely a user problem...though I am not placing blame just stating a very real possibility.
If you know what this site is like then you must know that many people come here for things other than custom firmware, from apps to Q&A, this site has more to offer than custom firmware.
And as for his original statement on froyo, he is probably right in that the nexus will get an OFFICIAL upgrade before the other phones.
And you are a **** because you used the term ****
Mike

mike105105 said:
First off, the touchscreen issue is a combo of software and crap buildup on the screen, once I took care of those issues it hasnt happened again.
Like I said I have no issues with 3g.
A few random people out of a couple hundred thousand phones does not make the screen cracking a real issue, more than likely a user problem...though I am not placing blame just stating a very real possibility.
If you know what this site is like then you must know that many people come here for things other than custom firmware, from apps to Q&A, this site has more to offer than custom firmware.
And as for his original statement on froyo, he is probably right in that the nexus will get an OFFICIAL upgrade before the other phones.
And you are a **** because you used the term ****
Mike
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Congratulations on not having the 3g issues like thousands of other people have had. Maybe it's because you're not a ****? Or maybe your N1 is magical? Or maybe you're just in denial about it?
At any rate, I don't believe your touchscreen issues were resolved with a kleenex. Many believe it's due to the actual controller in the phone. Maybe it could be fixed with software, maybe not. Either way nothing's been done about it to this point, so the issue still exists. But since we've established your N1 may be magical, you may not have these issues.
As far as an OFFICIAL SUPER DOPE FROYO RELEASE.
Hey, if you're naive enough to run a completely non-optimized stock ROM on your phone..... Have at it.
Again, your point was that we Incredible users would have to wait SEVERAL MONTHS for Froyo. We won't. Deal with it.

In terms of a Development Community the Nexus is the way to go(CyanogenMod, need i say more?).
But as far as a 'features' comparison goes the Incredible wins.
Also as far as a reliable network outside of major metro areas Verizon owns T-Mobile.
When the Incredible has root user access and superuser permissions enabled there will be less that separates the two assuming Sense is able to be removed and native 2.2 is able to be installed on the Incredible.
As a Verizon customer who wants reliable coverage, I had to go with the Incredible. If we all wait for the 'next best phone' well we would never buy a phone b/c that happens monthly. Let's do out best to support the developers and not piss off the Nexus one developers too much because if we are nice and supportive maybe they will work to enable the features that the Nexus One has with root access to our Incredibles, cyanogenmod included.

m1k3- said:
Congratulations on not having the 3g issues like thousands of other people have had. Maybe it's because you're not a *****? Or maybe your N1 is magical? Or maybe you're just in denial about it?
At any rate, I don't believe your touchscreen issues were resolved with a kleenex. Many believe it's due to the actual controller in the phone. Maybe it could be fixed with software, maybe not. Either way nothing's been done about it to this point, so the issue still exists. But since we've established your N1 may be magical, you may not have these issues.
As far as an OFFICIAL SUPER DOPE FROYO RELEASE.
Hey, if you're naive enough to run a completely non-optimized stock ROM on your phone..... Have at it.
Again, your point was that we Incredible users would have to wait SEVERAL MONTHS for Froyo. We won't. Deal with it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Look, I really wish this didnt have to spiral into childish bull. The whole point was you were acting like an **** before, and then you continue to act like an ****. Just GROW UP!! My phone is not magical it is just the fact that NOT EVERYONE HAS THOSE ISSUES.
Do some damn reading, capacitive touchscreens can be affected by conductive buildup on the screen...like greasy fingerprints and sweat, so yeah I have CM installed and I keep my screen clean and I have not had the issue again. How can it be the controller when that same controller is used in many other devices.
And once again, just because many people do have 3g issues doesnt mean everyone does. I have a constant 3g connection and have no issues, no magic involved.
And your last ridiculously stupid comment about running stock froyo...what is wrong with people possibly wanting to stick to a stock OS...that was not the original argument, the original argument was who was going to get an official update first, not weather stock is better than custom.
The problem with your arguments is that you are using an all or nothing logic, if some people have an issue it means everyone has that issue...regardless of what they tell you. You just make some nonsensical statements about their phone being magical, and some weak attempts at witty put downs.
THE ONLY THING THAT WAS BEING ARGUED IN THE BEGINNING WAS THE WAY YOU WERE ACTING.
TREAT PEOPLE WITH SOME RESPECT!
Mike

So the person that started name-calling (you) is lamenting that the thread has spiraled into something childish. Oh, the irony.
Why haven't there been a rash of complaints about touchscreen inaccuracy on any other android phone (at least not to the extent of the problems with the N1)? Oh wait, I know! N1 users must have greasier fingers than the average users of other android phones, right?
Wipe the screen? That's your fix? Seriously? I've used touchscreen phones for about 5 years now:
2 treos, 2 iphones, 3 android phones.
The ONLY touchscreen I've ever had ANY issues with is my N1. To be fair, the treos obviously weren't capacative, but still.
My argument isn't an all or nothing argument. Heck, I never even said the Incredible 'totally pwns' the N1. My only point is that the N1 had way too many bugs when it was first released. My opinion is that for the cost of the phone, some of the parts are a bit questionable.
And again, when it comes to Froyo, don't roll up on what's probably the largest android custom rom development site bragging about how the Incredible isn't going to get an OFFICIAL Froyo update until way after the N1. Because the 99% of us that are here are using custom roms (yourself included) and we just don't give a ****. Again, deal with it.
Thepoint in saying what he did about Froyo was basically 'HAHA THE N1 IS GONNA HAVE FROYO AND ALL OF ITS DOPE FEATURES MONTHS BEFORE YOUR INCREDIBLE WILL'. Again, it's simply not true and we all know it.
In the end, it's just my opinion about a phone.

MY problem is you made a bunch of matter-of-fact statements, I said that is not so with my phone, then you go and start mocking me saying that my phone must be magical.
Ok so you have used touchscreen phones for years...I am an electronics technician and an embedded systems programmer...but go ahead and tell me, because you know better, that a dirty capacitive screen, along with a sensor gain turned up too high in software cant cause the exact issues. I mean a bunch of people admitted that the problem went away after they changed firmware.
As far as the N1 having too many bugs, didnt the incredible already get an OTA because of a few major bugs.
And once again your lack of logic shows....the froyo thing....I will say it again, it doesnt matter how many people come here for custom firmware, most does not equal all so stop saying that just because many of the people here use CF, that is all everyone here uses. The point is still valid, the N1 will probably get an OFFICIAL update first. That word I used, official, is a qualifier...that means the argument I am making is based on that point being true.

mike105105 said:
MY problem is you made a bunch of matter-of-fact statements, I said that is not so with my phone, then you go and start mocking me saying that my phone must be magical.
Ok so you have used touchscreen phones for years...I am an electronics technician and an embedded systems programmer...but go ahead and tell me, because you know better, that a dirty capacitive screen, along with a sensor gain turned up too high in software cant cause the exact issues. I mean a bunch of people admitted that the problem went away after they changed firmware.
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Click to collapse
Word. Your theory could hold water. However, I'm a Linux Sys Engineer going on about 10 years now, so I do know a thing or two about Linux. And what I know leads me to believe otherwise. From the stock ROM, to the several versions of CM, to a few versions of KingClick's Desire ROM, ALL of them exhibit the touchscreen issues on my phone. This is probably due to the fact that while each one might run slightly modified kernels, the module that handles the touchscreen support is the same in all of them, since it's ultimately built from the same sources. Maybe it's my specific phone, but I find that hard to believe given the scope of complaints I've read here and elsewhere on the Internet.
mike105105 said:
As far as the N1 having too many bugs, didnt the incredible already get an OTA because of a few major bugs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indeed, sir. But as far as I know it was only to resolve an exchange support issue. I'll gladly deal with this issue to have a properly working touchscreen. Again, I never said or even implied the Incredible is perfect.
mike105105 said:
And once again your lack of logic shows....the froyo thing....I will say it again, it doesnt matter how many people come here for custom firmware, most does not equal all so stop saying that just because many of the people here use CF, that is all everyone here uses. The point is still valid, the N1 will probably get an OFFICIAL update first. That word I used, official, is a qualifier...that means the argument I am making is based on that point being true.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're arguing with yourself on this one, dude.
My logic was quite lucid. My point was essentially that I believe 99% of the people who frequent these forums run custom ROMs on their handsets. Therefore other than using them for the purposes of building custom ROMs, no one really gives a rat's a** about 'official' ROMs, because 99% of the people here probably don't run them on their phone.
Furthermore, the 99% of us that do run custom ROMs will be running the Incredible's version of whatever Froyo ROMs are available.... Probably within a week or two of when they're available for the N1. We will not have to wait 'several months' as the other dude stated earlier.

Losing it's charm?

As much as it hurts to say it, my Vibrant is really starting to lose it's charm.
When I first got it, the hardware was great, and the phone ran perfectly. Now after having it for over a month, this is what I'm starting to see:
Lack of life in the market. I see no new innovative games or apps. All the cool apps I downloaded have been on the market for a while.
Lack of development here. There hasn't been much progress in developing in cool ROMS that would make a huge difference on my phone.
The phone is becoming more slow, and not as fluid. Even the 1 or 2 second delays just bothers me to be honest.
Lastly, lack of initiative from Samsung. I know we have all been complaining about Froyo, but it just boggles my mind how little Samsung has been paying attention to it's existing customers. I hope it comes back to bite them sometime in the near future.
These things are becoming more and more apparent to me, and every time I look at and use my phone, I don't feel like I am using a solid, fluid phone, that I can try a lot of new things with in the future.
This is not a complaining thread, so flamers - gtfo.
I just wanted to see if anyone out there sees the same things I am seeing, and if there really is not potential left.

i fail to see how the lack of quality apps in the market falls on the vibrant

lolcopter said:
i fail to see how the lack of quality apps in the market falls on the vibrant
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True. This is my first Android phone, so I paired the OS with the hardware.

nearblack said:
As much as it hurts to say it, my Vibrant is really starting to lose it's charm.
When I first got it, the hardware was great, and the phone ran perfectly. Now after having it for over a month, this is what I'm starting to see:
Lack of life in the market. I see no new innovative games or apps. All the cool apps I downloaded have been on the market for a while.
Lack of development here. There hasn't been much progress in developing in cool ROMS that would make a huge difference on my phone.
The phone is becoming more slow, and not as fluid. Even the 1 or 2 second delays just bothers me to be honest.
Lastly, lack of initiative from Samsung. I know we have all been complaining about Froyo, but it just boggles my mind how little Samsung has been paying attention to it's existing customers. I hope it comes back to bite them sometime in the near future.
These things are becoming more and more apparent to me, and every time I look at and use my phone, I don't feel like I am using a solid, fluid phone, that I can try a lot of new things with in the future.
This is not a complaining thread, so flamers - gtfo.
I just wanted to see if anyone out there sees the same things I am seeing, and if there really is not potential left.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bye bye ...
But I want to point out some flaws in your logic ...
Lack of life in the Market? Maybe you should change what you are searching for our use some alternative markets, as there are tons of new apps ...
Lack of dev here? Ummmm I have had like 7 diff custom roms on my phone and had it less than 2 months ..
phone slow? I am sure that is caused by all the crap you installed, that really is the only thing that slows the phones down, is having 17 million things running.
Not gonna defend Samsung, but just so the info is correct, Samsung sent 2.2 to all the carriers at the same time, so actually it is Tmobile that is slowing it down, not that makes the wait any less painful ...
And the big thing I wanted to say is ending your post by saying "flamers -GTFO" is like dumping a gallon of gasoline on yourself and running into a burning building and expecting not to catch fire , smarter thing would have been to not even post.

But.. all in all, it's a phone. There can only be only so many cool games for your phone. Great games for consoles and PCs don't come around all the time either. Sometimes you have to wait years for something great to come around again that's a "must have." We are talking about a phone. It's mobile, has some cool stuff to play and do on it... but it's still a phone. It makes and recieves calls, text, pictures, data, etc., lets you browse the web, and other cool little things. It's not, nor ever will be a desktop replacement. No mobile device is perfect. If you want something better, try making it yourself, otherwise, just deal with what we have and work with it.
The "newness" is probably wearing off, but that happens with anything.

This topic is painful.

I can complain and nitpick with the best of them, but my personality sort of forces me to put things into perspective.
Firstly, I'm extremely pleased with my Vibrant. Though GPS at times has a mind of it's own with the post JI2 fixes it performs adequately for me while driving. I'm sure there are those who have a vested interest in the GPS being more reliable and accurate to be sure, I'm just not one of those people.
Getting beyond the GPS there is very little I can complain about. Among my friends there are a wide variety of smartphones. Several iPhones (3gs, 4), EVO 4G, several 3g Slides, several more MT3G's, and two friends with "other" Galaxy S phones, a Fascinate and an Epic 4G. I come from a past filled with a Behold II, a G1, a Palm Centro, and an original iPhone. And this phone is way better than any phone I've ever had and generally better than most of my friends phones I've played with.
In a forum like this one we have a tendency to get "tunnel vision". Forums like this exist for users to help and inform one another, but through this minor snags can get blown up into major headaches. I'd invite anyone angsty about the Vibrant to go see how the other half lives over in the HTC, Motorola, and LG threads and see that it's relatively a bed of roses for us in comparison. At least that's my take given my casual peeks into the forums for the other new smartphones out.
This doesn't mean I'm giving Samsung or T-Mobile a "get out of jail free" card. Both Samsung *AND* T-Mobile have horrible histories when it comes to updating Android devices, either in a timely manner or even AT ALL.
T-Mobile, to it's discredit has yet to have a single successful (meaning the update wasn't pulled at some point for problems it created) OTA of any android device since 2009.
From looking at Samsung's handling of the Galaxy S, given a cursory glance at it's own wonky revisioning system, it's no wonder that it's taken far too long for 2.1 to get fully fixed and 2.2 to progress beyond beta. Releasing this platform on a ridiculous amount of carriers, whilst simultaneously trying to cater to those carriers customization demands has obviously led to an extremely fragmented development process for us. A victim of runaway success, or a victim of their crappy development processes, it's difficult to say.
Either way as consumers we should be adamant that T-Mobile and Samsung take responsibility for their products. But, at the same time, we should step back and realize this is a smartphone and ask ourselves if it's doing what we want it to do.
If it is, then take a deep breath and count to ten. If it isn't, then take a look at how the rest of the smartphone universe is really functioning before you jump ship, only to be disappointed all over again.
Some of peoples ire here is buyers remorse, focused and whipped into extremes because of where you happen to be focusing your attention. Do what I'm about to do, which is pick up my Vibrant and call some friends so we can all go unplug with some tasty sushi and sake!

masterotaku said:
I can complain and nitpick with the best of them, but my personality sort of forces me to put things into perspective.
Firstly, I'm extremely pleased with my Vibrant. Though GPS at times has a mind of it's own with the post JI2 fixes it performs adequately for me while driving. I'm sure there are those who have a vested interest in the GPS being more reliable and accurate to be sure, I'm just not one of those people.
Getting beyond the GPS there is very little I can complain about. Among my friends there are a wide variety of smartphones. Several iPhones (3gs, 4), EVO 4G, several 3g Slides, several more MT3G's, and two friends with "other" Galaxy S phones, a Fascinate and an Epic 4G. I come from a past filled with a Behold II, a G1, a Palm Centro, and an original iPhone. And this phone is way better than any phone I've ever had and generally better than most of my friends phones I've played with.
In a forum like this one we have a tendency to get "tunnel vision". Forums like this exist for users to help and inform one another, but through this minor snags can get blown up into major headaches. I'd invite anyone angsty about the Vibrant to go see how the other half lives over in the HTC, Motorola, and LG threads and see that it's relatively a bed of roses for us in comparison. At least that's my take given my casual peeks into the forums for the other new smartphones out.
This doesn't mean I'm giving Samsung or T-Mobile a "get out of jail free" card. Both Samsung *AND* T-Mobile have horrible histories when it comes to updating Android devices, either in a timely manner or even AT ALL.
T-Mobile, to it's discredit has yet to have a single successful (meaning the update wasn't pulled at some point for problems it created) OTA of any android device since 2009.
From looking at Samsung's handling of the Galaxy S, given a cursory glance at it's own wonky revisioning system, it's no wonder that it's taken far too long for 2.1 to get fully fixed and 2.2 to progress beyond beta. Releasing this platform on a ridiculous amount of carriers, whilst simultaneously trying to cater to those carriers customization demands has obviously led to an extremely fragmented development process for us. A victim of runaway success, or a victim of their crappy development processes, it's difficult to say.
Either way as consumers we should be adamant that T-Mobile and Samsung take responsibility for their products. But, at the same time, we should step back and realize this is a smartphone and ask ourselves if it's doing what we want it to do.
If it is, then take a deep breath and count to ten. If it isn't, then take a look at how the rest of the smartphone universe is really functioning before you jump ship, only to be disappointed all over again.
Some of peoples ire here is buyers remorse, focused and whipped into extremes because of where you happen to be focusing your attention. Do what I'm about to do, which is pick up my Vibrant and call some friends so we can all go unplug with some tasty sushi and sake!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well said. The only thing that bugs me with the Vibrant is how long its taking to get the GPS fix out but other than that I am 99% satisfied.

nearblack said:
As much as it hurts to say it, my Vibrant is really starting to lose it's charm.
When I first got it, the hardware was great, and the phone ran perfectly. Now after having it for over a month, this is what I'm starting to see:
Lack of life in the market. I see no new innovative games or apps. All the cool apps I downloaded have been on the market for a while.
Lack of development here. There hasn't been much progress in developing in cool ROMS that would make a huge difference on my phone.
The phone is becoming more slow, and not as fluid. Even the 1 or 2 second delays just bothers me to be honest.
Lastly, lack of initiative from Samsung. I know we have all been complaining about Froyo, but it just boggles my mind how little Samsung has been paying attention to it's existing customers. I hope it comes back to bite them sometime in the near future.
These things are becoming more and more apparent to me, and every time I look at and use my phone, I don't feel like I am using a solid, fluid phone, that I can try a lot of new things with in the future.
This is not a complaining thread, so flamers - gtfo.
I just wanted to see if anyone out there sees the same things I am seeing, and if there really is not potential left.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I completely agree with every point you made! It kind of being a let down, coming from having 2G, 3G, 3GS iPhones...I really sometimes miss the availability of all apps on the apple app store...HOWEVER...I think Andriod is going to surpass Apple app store and OS, just give it a little bit of time and you are going to be much happier.... I remember having the same type of frustrations when the 2G came out, specially not being able to forward messages, copy and past, lack of updates....etc... and plus the drop calls of iphone/att.. So give some time for Samsung and Andriod to grow and I think all of us going to be much happier with Froyo.

And the big thing I wanted to say is ending your post by saying "flamers -GTFO" is like dumping a gallon of gasoline on yourself and running into a burning building and expecting not to catch fire , smarter thing would have been to not even post.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I lold so hard.
And if ur phone is laggy how about, oh, I dunno, a lagfix? And uninstall all those "japanese sexy girl" apps.
-------------------------------------
Sent via the XDA app

/FACEPALM

nearblack said:
...
[*]The phone is becoming more slow, and not as fluid. Even the 1 or 2 second delays just bothers me to be honest....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Galaxy S has never really been "fluid."
Scrolling has a "jerky" feel, which is immediately apparent if you compare it to the iPhone.
The EVO is also noticeably smoother than the Samsung (although still not as fluid as the iPhone).

MacGuy2006 said:
The Galaxy S has never really been "fluid."
Scrolling has a "jerky" feel, which is immediately apparent if you compare it to the iPhone.
The EVO is also noticeably smoother than the Samsung (although still not as fluid as the iPhone).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The "jerky" feel is due to the OS rather than the hardware as the vibrant has an equal or faster processor than the iPhone according to Anandtech review not to mention a much faster GPU. Also in the review it called the SGS as the fastest android even after using the EVO previously. I agree that the iPhone has the smoothest scrolling as I used to have the 2G and even on that, scrolling was extremely smooth.

sp4rky said:
Well said. The only thing that bugs me with the Vibrant is how long its taking to get the GPS fix out but other than that I am 99% satisfied.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This. I bought my phone day one as soon as the store opened, and I still love everything about it, especially now that JI2 has fixed my GPS.

With all the little quirks and mishaps i've had with this device (none of which have been a deal breaker for me) I am still very pleased i purchased this phone. To me it just seems to be getting better and better. Yes just like anyone else I would love to have Froyo and would love for my GPS to work 100% all the time but that is just a chance you take with technology and new devices. You learn to cope and deal. Really isnt that hard to grasp.

Only because it runs rock solid for me, I don't need to do anymore tweaks or anything.
Hoping Froyo brings in more developers and makes things a little more fun.

Vibrant too is my first android phone and also my very first smart phone. Although, I have owned 3 different iPod Touches, so that at least gives me some perspective of how a "smart" Mobile OS should be such as Android, iOS, etc.
I am very please with the hardware, and Android in general. However, coming from iOS, android does felt short in terms of upgrade path. ROM from independent developers are great but the lack of proper channel for official OS update really is the "nail in the coffin" kinda of thing.
With the exception of iOS 4 which excluded 2g, 3g iPhone; Apple users can expect an update on a timely yearly basis which usually adds features and bug fixes. It just makes you feel better when you know that an official update is definitely coming. We are kinda stuck in the situation where we are depended on Samsung to push for the update. Sigh.
Other than that, I am really glad I made the switch, the notification bar is my all time favor and of course Multitasking.

Samsung has dropped the ball in a lot of ways. I am inclined to say that the superior Android maker is HTC--just my opinion. Nevertheless, this phone its really growing on me, perhaps because of all of its nuances. I have learned a lot trying to mod the phone and create my own fixes. The hardware on this phone is rather amazing, so I know that if I get the software right I will love it. The first glimpse of that was when I installed Bionix 1.3. If you do not have it, then go get it in the dev thread. 1.4 should be releasing soon. Bionix has rejuvenated my interest in the Vibrant.
Sent by my Android.

Wahhhhhhh go get an iphone!
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

Why do people expect everything to come out fast by big companies? Motorola's wireless division, which is probably still small compared to when they were big in the past, only concentrates on Android, thus faster releases. HTC has been in the ball game since day 1 and is basically purely concentrating on Android until WP7 comes out. Samsung, well, I don't even know. There division makes all kinds of phones and working on different OSs while HTC and Motorola are concentrating only on Android. Oh, everyone should know how slow T-mobile is with updates. Really, they aren't the fastest ones around. With T-mobile, it's always been quality over speed.
Anyways, stop making pointless complaint topics, we don't need any more to clutter this forum. That's what I'm basically trying to say.

Google better not abandon or neglect N1 for this NS

Google better not leave us Nexus One owners out to dry for this Nexus S. Im talking about being the first to get updates like Gingerbread and Honeycomb (at least up to Honeycomb).
I still love my Nexus One and don't see any overwhelming reason to change to the Nexus S. Especially since HTC has been SO good to me.
Who's with me? Any of you thinking about jumping ship? Why?
Best

im with you, i dislike the general look of samsung hardware, looks like an iphone to me...

I'll stick with the Nexus One because it's still great and will get the latest updates.
And I agree with the guy above.
Oh, see this comparisation of the Nexus S, Nexus One and Galaxy S http://www.google.com/phone/compare/?phone=nexus-s&phone=nexus-one&phone=samsung-galaxy-s

try posting this in the right section... this is for apps and themes

lol, don't kid yourself, Google abandoned the N1 3 months after it came out. The N1 is getting shafted. Thanks Google.

If Google F's us over we still got the Dev. and XDA to save the day.

I don't see them leaving us in the dark.
As for getting the new one. At this point, nope. Not enough there to justify the $529. More memory, but no expansion?? 2nd Camera that I would never use. The Gyroscope. Eh.
Really the only thing there is Android 2.3. It will come out eventually for the N1. Even if not right away I will wait for it. I might try it when it comes time to upgrade the latest Desire Port but I have been happy with Sense UI and want to keep that in the long term so no big deal.

Not worried about Google as long as we have XDA!

galaxys said:
Not worried about Google as long as we have XDA!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there nothing to add

I would like to definitely try it. The only thing that kinda bothers me is the built in memory, but then again I have 8GB on the nexus one and I don't really feel the need to upgrade to anything more yet. If I switch to the nS is because of the front camera and (hopefully) a better digitizer, I hate the half baked one of the n1.

Me too...still love my nexus one even can not afford google maps 5.0 on gingerbread...

i doubt google will leave the nexus one behind, especially since the N1 and NS are very similiar in hardware, the NS is supior in power, but not enough to make it get updates the N1 won't
Also google has already said the N1 will be getting gingerbread in a few weeks, and i'm sure both phones will be getting honeycomb when it eventually comes out.

neok44 said:
i doubt google will leave the nexus one behind, especially since the N1 and NS are very similiar in hardware, the NS is supior in power, but not enough to make it get updates the N1 won't
Also google has already said the N1 will be getting gingerbread in a few weeks, and i'm sure both phones will be getting honeycomb when it eventually comes out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats a very good point Neo, Thanks.

I'm pretty sure they did ages ago and just handed over everything to HTC, who will probably get rid of all N1 support in about 6 months when the last warranties expire.
In terms of software though, it BETTER get Gingerbread and Honeycomb.

sirjoeyg said:
Google better not leave us Nexus One owners out to dry for this Nexus S. Im talking about being the first to get updates like Gingerbread and Honeycomb (at least up to Honeycomb).
I still love my Nexus One and don't see any overwhelming reason to change to the Nexus S. Especially since HTC has been SO good to me.
Who's with me? Any of you thinking about jumping ship? Why?
Best
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Let me paraphrase that for you.
I have a Nexus One, a year old phone, that is being surpassed by superior hardware on a slew of devices. Google better continue specializing their production of Android based on my year old device, those bastards. If they move forward and advance phone tech and its corresponding software I'm gonna be pissed!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Joking aside ; even if Google does abandon us, as you say, it's certainly not the end for the Nexus One. Look at the G1 running Froyo for crying out loud. There are a lot of N1's floating around out there, and the demographic of its users are almost all tech heads like ourselves - A LOT of whom are even developers/programmers.
Don't concern yourself with the matter, if your phone does what you need it to and you like it... keep it. If you need to be first in line for updates directly from Google for the next year, I would suspect the NS would be the way to go.
Personally, I'm hanging on to my N1 until there are some respectable multi-core phones on the market. When that day finally comes I intend on having my Nexus framed; this has been the best phone I've owned and I don't think I could find it in myself to sell it.

GldRush98 said:
lol, don't kid yourself, Google abandoned the N1 3 months after it came out. The N1 is getting shafted. Thanks Google.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That N1 has never gotten shafted, seriously. Give an example. The reality is that 11 months after its release we are still at the head of the line for OS updates. What is it with the ridiculous persecution complex among some N1 owners??

We should as a community make sure that google doesn't leave us.
we must remind them that as we were loyal to them, and they'd better not do an apple thing and ditch us.
Our phone's still more than capable compared to any other phone out there....
Send them a msg @
Here
Although XDA community's gr8, we should get their support too.

negroplasty said:
Look at the G1 running Froyo for crying out loud.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This alone should be enough to console the worried. A 2 year old phone, with incredibly outdated hardware, is still getting major support from developers -- if even Google abandons us.. hopefully there is one place that won't.
I bet the G1 itself is going to get a Gingerbread port.

pfmiller said:
What is it with the ridiculous persecution complex among some N1 owners??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indeed, +1
I dont get why anyone gets so defensive about a phone, whatever it may be. Choose the phone which does what YOU want it to do, what it does NOW, not what it may or may not do in the future. Then, when you've made the choice, don't try and tell everyone else what they should or shouldn't choose.
As for the NS, looks nice enough, but I wont buy one for 2 reasons. First I've just bought an iphone 4 and second I'm reluctant to buy anything from samsung - I've had very little luck with their products - not just phones, and its always been a frustrating ownership experience - and worse - when its time to sell on, the resale value is terrible.

sirjoeyg said:
Google better not leave us Nexus One owners out to dry for this Nexus S. Im talking about being the first to get updates like Gingerbread and Honeycomb (at least up to Honeycomb).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Google owes you nothing. The N1 was primarily a reference dev device for Eclair/Froyo. The NS is the new reference dev device for Gingerbread/2.4.
It's called progress, get over it.

Would you buy a NEW Nexus S for $395.10?

I'm a proud Vibrant owner, rooted with Nero 4.1 & Voodo. I have a 16gb external SD card filled with personal files, music, and movies. I purchased my Vibrant for a little over $450 at T-Mobile and spent exrta money on a 16gb SD card, and a protective cover.
Today (01/14/2010), I can go to Best Buy and use a special 'Buy Back' program and they will give me $165 for my Vibrant on a in-store gift card. I can then turn around and purchase a Nexus S with it.
Nexus S is $529.99 - $165.00 = $364.99 + %8.29 (Sales Tax) = $395.10
Knowing how close the Nexus S is to the Vibrant, would you shell out 400 clams for the 'Pure Google Experience'? Whats your take? I have an idea, but why should I buy something that my rooted Vibrant can do except a FFC?? Opinions?
The Nexus S doesn't even have an external SD slot.

Yes you getting google updates but you are missing the sd slot. Thats a total buzzkill for me.
Im just going to continue supporting the dev's here at xda and maybe be brave and install the ffc.

not unless the money was burning a hole in my pocket
they're practically the same phone. not worth it imo

At the time I bought the Vibrant the only real difference between it and others in its class was the up to 48 gigs of storage (16 internal, up to 32 external). Save your money you have a great phone, thanks in large part to the devs here. We'll have Gingerbread soon.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

Absolutely not.
You're basically getting 30% of the total value of the phone. The vibrant, even without the updates, is still worth more then $165.
The nexus S is definitely worth $400, but if your giving up a device thats worth more then $165 to get the $400 price tag, nuh uh. Don't do it. Not worth it at all.

you could get more $$ in here in the marketplace....a then use that money to buy any other phone you want...

Not at all. It just doesn't feel like the additions to the S make it any better than a rooted Vibrant especially with the loss of the SD slot.

Never, don't ever purchase anything made by samsung, even if the software is controlled by google, the answer is no no no no no!
Let google learn a lesson too, maybe in the future they will choose another hardware manufacturor.

SamsungVibrant said:
Never, don't ever purchase anything made by samsung, even if the software is controlled by google, the answer is no no no no no!
Let google learn a lesson too, maybe in the future they will choose another hardware manufacturor.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with everyone about the bad marketing decisions Samsung is taking. Which explains how every Galaxy S series phones throughout the world received Froyo except for the 4 sim-lock carriers in the US.
-but-
Respectfully, I disagree with you about the Nexus S. Even though the hardware is from Samsung (which NO other phone out there can beat the Super AMOLED screen). Google has already sent an update to the Nexus S to 2.3.1. Owning a Google phone like the Nexus S is guaranteeing Android updates.

the nexus s is already outdated
wait for more dual core 4g phones coming out this quarter

No. My next phone will have a dual core processor.

lolcopter said:
the nexus s is already outdated
wait for more dual core 4g phones coming out this quarter
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
DITTO on that! Except I heard that dual core is a drain on the battery. We don't have battery technology as of yet to give a substantial user experience to last as long as what superphones do now.

Stick with your Vibrant or sell it on Craigslist or Ebay or something, but getting $165 for it is a complete rip-off.

lolcopter said:
the nexus s is already outdated
wait for more dual core 4g phones coming out this quarter
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
have fun with manufacturer based skin and late OTAs (or OTAs not even happening)
.. your phone may not have the latest hardware specs, but it will always have the latest android version
its a matter of compromising latest hardware vs latest software

zephiK said:
have fun with manufacturer based skin and late OTAs (or OTAs not even happening)
.. your phone may not have the latest hardware specs, but it will always have the latest android version
its a matter of compromising latest hardware vs latest software
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
can the nexus s even record HD video?
life won't end if you're not running the absolute latest OS. besides, that's what XDA is for... NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT GPS
in the end, the technology advances so quickly, no matter what you buy you will have buyer's remorse within six months. phones are evolving at a faster pace right now than PCs did a few years back

lolcopter said:
can the nexus s even record HD video?
life won't end if you're not running the absolute latest OS. besides, that's what XDA is for... NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT GPS
in the end, the technology advances so quickly, no matter what you buy you will have buyer's remorse within six months. phones are evolving at a faster pace right now than PCs did a few years back
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it doesnt matter if rooted ROMs are available, what matters is that Samsung isn't open sourcing the kernel for 2.2.
Open sourced kernels allows development to move even further. OC'd kernels for the Vibrant are based off the I9000 kernel, which results into poor battery life.
Also, all ROMs built for the Vibrant are pretty much using the base of TouchWiz. Now im not complaining about TouchWiz, I do like a lot of the aspects from it. The Power Widget on the notification bar was a great start; but the fact is that Samsung is not reliable when it comes to software updates. The one plus with TouchWiz is the video codecs.
The Nexus S is a unlocked bootloader from the very beginning with easy commands to unlock and lock it. It is made in mind that its a device primarily made to be hacked with. It is backed by Google.
Not to mention.. the Nexus S at this point has more love from CyanogenMod than the Vibrant. The Vibrant and Galaxy S series dev community is too split between each other. The Nexus S is the same in the UK and USA, therefore.. it allows further collaboration with each other.
In the end, it really depends what you want. What can you fight against? hardware or software? Since most of us are tight on cash, im sure a lot of us would lean towards software. In this case, the Nexus series would be the winner since it is backed by Google (or any device that is supported by CyanogenMod).
And dont even start with HD recording.. OH MY! we all have to realize that a phone has its limitations. If you're looking to take pictures or do a lot of video recording, just do yourself a favor and get a dedicated camera.... not to mention with TouchWiz, have fun taking HD recording for a long period of time... when it hits the 15% mark, have fun recording or taking pictures buddy
life won't end if you're not running the absolute latest OS. besides, that's what XDA is for... NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT GPS
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Oh really....? Tell that to the people who are filing lawsuits and enraging because Samsung isnt releasing a 2.2 OTA.... OH WAIT?! we have rooted ROMs with 2.2... does that justify the idea that they aren't doing OTAs to maintain their products? But instead to just release new ones without committing to their current products?
Go tell that to people who stuck a two-year contract with a MOTOROLA CLIQ, Droid Eris, and all those phones that the manufacturer didnt commit to upgrading their existing phones. The reason why there aren't more people who are furious about this is because they aren't tech savvy and just care about the phone working.

zephiK said:
In the end, it really depends what you want. What can you fight against? hardware or software? Since most of us are tight on cash, im sure a lot of us would lean towards software. In this case, the Nexus series would be the winner since it is backed by Google (or any device that is supported by CyanogenMod).
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i want a fast phone that works. i have that.
And dont even start with HD recording.. OH MY! we all have to realize that a phone has its limitations. If you're looking to take pictures or do a lot of video recording, just do yourself a favor and get a dedicated camera.... not to mention with TouchWiz, have fun taking HD recording for a long period of time... when it hits the 15% mark, have fun recording or taking pictures buddy
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lol @ the "it's not a feature until we get it" mindset. iphone much?
my battery never gets down to 15% anyway, because nero is awesome on battery life
Oh really....? Tell that to the people who are filing lawsuits and enraging because Samsung isnt releasing a 2.2 OTA.... OH WAIT?! we have rooted ROMs with 2.2... does that justify the idea that they aren't doing OTAs to maintain their products? But instead to just release new ones without committing to their current products?
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i understand the anger towards samsung, and it's completely valid. however, if you want it done right you have to do it yourself. xda has allowed that for many many people. lawsuits and complaints about manufacturers might as well fall on deaf ears, because nothing will happen around here because of that
Go tell that to people who stuck a two-year contract with a MOTOROLA CLIQ, Droid Eris, and all those phones that the manufacturer didnt commit to upgrading their existing phones. The reason why there aren't more people who are furious about this is because they aren't tech savvy and just care about the phone working.
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i would tell those people to do their research before making such a large purchase. i knew full well samsung's history when i bought my vibrant. i knew there might be a good chance they'd jerk consumers around and delay updates. if i was running stock, i would be furious... but i bought an android phone full well knowing that i would be modding it... a lot.
lastly, team whiskey > cyanogenmod

Nope..
I will not buy anything else made by Samsung. Back in the 80's / 90's they built the absolute best quality products with great support. I've been fighting with my GPS for too long and they didn't make it right. There was going to be a 2.2 update in August and it still hasn't happend (except for the great XDA devs). My first Android device was a HTC (g1) and my next one will be as well.

lolcopter said:
i want a fast phone that works. i have that.
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It's not all about you. People have their different reasons for having phones:
1) Flash Addict: Always wanting something to flash. With a developer phone like Nexus S (or any other phone that is popular in the modding community)
2) Normal user
.. and so forth. All ROMs in general has one thing in mind: increasing its speed.
lol @ the "it's not a feature until we get it" mindset. iphone much?
my battery never gets down to 15% anyway, because nero is awesome on battery life
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Again.. this is not all about you at all. Some people are more heavy users when it comes to battery than others. Nevertheless, the 15% mark is annoying and should be removed. Hacked camera.apk does this but not incorporated in all Vibrant ROMs.
i understand the anger towards samsung, and it's completely valid. however, if you want it done right you have to do it yourself. xda has allowed that for many many people. lawsuits and complaints about manufacturers might as well fall on deaf ears, because nothing will happen around here because of that
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What you said makes absolutely no sense. Grammar check. I personally don't care about Samsung not updating to 2.2 because I don't use a Vibrant anymore, but I still have the phone.
All your points aren't even valid. You're just trying to start a war without pointing out what I said but going AROUND them because you can't defeat my points.
My point is that it just depends on what kind of person you are. And you can say whatever your opinion is about CyanogenMod and Team Whiskey, you just seem like a ignorant individual who is difficult to argue with because they are so close minded. They're both composed of great developers but the additions that CyanogenMod includes is just too significant to add. Am I saying that you're wrong for believing what you do? No.. you have a opinion, I'm not going to try and beg you to change your mind.
CyanogenMod actually complies from AOSP source whereas Team Whiskey base their ROMs from the OTA. You wouldn't understand this since you don't use a phone that is CyanogenMod supported (don't even start with G1.. that phone is so outdated that it isn't even capable of taking full advantage of CM7).
I'm sure when CM7 stable is released, TW will start basing their releases off CM7. And you know what? It is built on top of CM7... so whos the better team then? I'm not going to go for one particular side because a developer is a developer. They aren't in this to get any accreditation from the community. They just do it as a hobby. Quit thinking that CyanogenMod & TW are like the rivalry between NVIDIA & AMD/ATI.
Thanks.