Problems with Bluetooth Stereo Earphones and A2DP - 8525, TyTN, MDA Vario II, JasJam General

Hellow,
I bought one Sony DRBT20NX Bluetooth headphones for my X01HT (SoftBank ROM+Asukal patch for translate to English).
I paired both devices (Hands Free and Wireless Stereo services), but now I don't know what I have to do for listen music from my earphones. I switch on bluetoth on both but music is in he loudspeaker of the X0HT.
Also, I don't know how to make work AVRCP.
Thanks
Sesaru

sesaru said:
Hellow,
I bought one Sony DRBT20NX Bluetooth headphones for my X01HT (SoftBank ROM+Asukal patch for translate to English).
I paired both devices (Hands Free and Wireless Stereo services), but now I don't know what I have to do for listen music from my earphones. I switch on bluetoth on both but music is in he loudspeaker of the X0HT.
Also, I don't know how to make work AVRCP.
Thanks
Sesaru
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should have a 'Connect' button on your headset... check your manual. I have a diferent headset, but on mine I short-press the power button and an icon appears at the top of the screen.

This topic has been discussed quite a bit. Please use the forum's SEARCH feature. It's quite useful at times. AVRCP, for one, will not work unless you're using a media player that actually supports it, such as MortPlayer.

@sesaru
i use this headphones on X01HT too. just bought few days ago. if you want engilish manual for this pm me. push play pause in your headphones then open media player. this will open A2DP music mode (Wireless Stereo). AVRCP works with media player i dont know any other work one. imusic and gsplayer dosent work. if you push dark blue bar button you will open HFP (hands free). i have bad news too. i cant get good quality of sound. there is some noise when i listen music with it. user manual write it can be about 2.4 ghz wireless device. like microwave oven, wireless LAN and cordless telephone. all thing is what tokyo is haven of them. you must be 10m far from all of them. and this is mean i must to go 10m away tokyo to listen clear music. if you get good quality pls write me. i hope all this will help you.

Just to confirm i have these headphones and they work with all my windows mobile devices.
My hermes is WM5 but they work fine with my Universal with WM6
Someone already said it but yeah pushing the play pause button re-pairs them for a2dp. I think sometimes i push it twice to get it to do it.

Hello,
I fixed when I updated to WM6. But sounds is not good, so I installed Widcomm stack. But I have a new problem.
After install Widcomm stack (I have Windows Mobile VI - BLACK EDITION v1.2 but also happended with WM6 for Hermes LVSW Edition), I can't sync via USB. My computer don't detect the Hermes! Is if like I didn't connect to it.
Any idea?
UPDATE: Fix is here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=1072534&postcount=59

sesaru said:
Hello,
I fixed when I updated to WM6. But sounds is not good, so I installed Widcomm stack. But I have a new problem.
After install Widcomm stack (I have Windows Mobile VI - BLACK EDITION v1.2 but also happended with WM6 for Hermes LVSW Edition), I can't sync via USB. My computer don't detect the Hermes! Is if like I didn't connect to it.
Any idea?
UPDATE: Fix is here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=1072534&postcount=59
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh!! I just realised now I can't switch on the phone module of the comm manager (>_<) So It doesn't work; I give up.
Can you post where exactly is the fix for this? I'm reading a lot, but I can't find it ...

Hello,
What I did is this:
I installed WM6 ROM in my X01HT and WC Stack. After That, I did this:
1. Close BT Manager and turn BT off.
2. Open registry (need Resco Registry plug-in) and make the following changes (no need of soft reset after them):
[HKLM\Software\Widcomm\BTConfig\Applications\0001]
Change ComPortNumber from 8 to 7
[HKLM\Software\Widcomm\BTConfig\Services\0001]
Change ComPortNumber from 9 to 6
Rename [HKLM\Drivers\BuiltIn\Serial8] to [HKLM\Drivers\BuiltIn\Serial6] and change these subkeys acordingly
"FriendlyName"="Bluetooth Serial Port COM6:"
"DeviceArrayIndex"=dword:00000006
"Index"=dword:00000006
When you have changed this, suspend (off) the PDA for a few seconds and turn it on again. Then goto Bluetooth Settings- Services-Serial Port-Advanced and verify that thet ports that Widcomm is using are 6 & 7
But now I can't switch on the phone App. When I open the Comm App, and push the "Phone" button, it didn't start.
Please, somebody let me know what I'm doing bad.
Thanks
Cesar

Related

A2DP for Alpine

Is there a download for A2DP for the Imate PDA 2 that is available and reliable ?
I see some of the other devices are getting this to work, but I haven't seen for the Alpine ? I'm trying to get this to work with a Bluesonic Blue ant bluetooth speaker. It works with the speaker in phone mode but the audio qulity is poor (phone quality).
A2DP is perfectly work on Alpine. Even with keys support!!!
Hmmm- I've had a reasonable go at trying. Anywhere i can get some information on how I should be doing this ? Maybe I am missing something ?
my xdaIIi run A2DP perfectly.
After you install the patch, setup an extra partnership with your BT earpiece or speaker whatever with the high quality audio mode under the BT manager.
After the setup, connect the device and press the talk button in your earpiece, play the music and the sould is perfect (almost)
A2DP for Alpine... where is this patch?
Hello,
So... it works perfectly... but with a patch. Good news.
What patch is that?
Where can we find it?
How do we install it?
Thanks in advance!
-Lostgweilo-
Re: A2DP for Alpine... where is this patch?
lostgweilo said:
Hello,
So... it works perfectly... but with a patch. Good news.
What patch is that?
Where can we find it?
How do we install it?
Thanks in advance!
-Lostgweilo-
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
here is it. After installation, you can find the high quality audio and keyboard setup in the bluetooth manager
My I-Tech R35 works nearly perfectly with the alpine. Every now and then the sounds cuts out for a second or two and then comes back. As if there is not enough 'bandwidth'
Any ideas? Any reg tweaks?
Thanks
Sounds like a CPU priority issue...
I found out what the problem was....
Wifi interferes with the bluetooth
Doh! Can't stream BBC Radio 1 anymore lol
Thanks
moghisi101 said:
My I-Tech R35 works nearly perfectly with the alpine. Every now and then the sounds cuts out for a second or two and then comes back. As if there is not enough 'bandwidth'
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, could you use the forward and backward keys on your i-Tech R35?
I use r35 also, but can not use >&< or pause keys
frankrick said:
moghisi101 said:
My I-Tech R35 works nearly perfectly with the alpine. Every now and then the sounds cuts out for a second or two and then comes back. As if there is not enough 'bandwidth'
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, could you use the forward and backward keys on your i-Tech R35?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, I could not. The play/pause also did not work. However, I believe that they do work with TCMP (I use PocketMusic). Volume buttons work regardless. Also, the A2DP profile does not pair automatically with the R35 even if I press the Multi-Function Button!! But damn, the audio quality is amazing now.
All the media buttons work when used with my A2DP hacked Wizard (o2 XDA Mini S)
cya
moghisi101 said:
No, I could not. The play/pause also did not work. However, I believe that they do work with TCMP (I use PocketMusic). Volume buttons work regardless. Also, the A2DP profile does not pair automatically with the R35 even if I press the Multi-Function Button!! But damn, the audio quality is amazing now.
All the media buttons work when used with my A2DP hacked Wizard (o2 XDA Mini S)
cya
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thx, I got it! I might have a try with TCPMP player on my XDA IIi. I just wonder why they don't provide the AVRCP patch at the same time.
Anyway, I checkd the picture of XDA IIi's PCB board and found that the bluetooth module of XDA IIi is UGXZ5 which manufactured by ALPS, a japanese company. This UGXZ5 supports the Ver1.2 of bluetooth spec. However, HTC utilizes the bluetooth driver software that coming from Broadcom.
This may be an obvious question, but how do you install the BT patch mentioned above?
Cheers;
pc
Download the CAB file to your PC, then transfer it with Windows Explorer or ActiveSync to your PPC (Go to My Computer and then Mobile Device or click Explore in the ActiveSync window) and then on your PPC use a file manager program (File Explorer) to browse to the directory you saved the CAB file to, and then click it. It should automatically install and then delete the original CAB afterwards.
Flawless; Thanks a lot.
Cheers;
pc
Hi,
Is there a patch that will allow the BT to work without the phone being on, as currently need the phone on to use BT.
Thanks
Gordon
has anyone got A2DP to work with the htc820 + windows media player? I have had it working with tcmp but after taking a call the audio isn't rerouted via the headset?
Just pause TCPMP before answering phone. And then music will resume ok.

Bluetooth Headset - no music

Hello @ all
I get a new Headset from Sony DR-BT20NX.
It works nice with the telephone, but now I also want to play my music.
I tried to install the cab from this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=263735
But only the Bluetooth headset has a new entry in the Bluetooth-device-folder.
"Wireless stereo"
But nothing happend.
I did softreset, and on/off and so on...
But I have the feeling, that something is missing.
And what is AKU2, and where can I get it for my XDA NEO with german O2-properties
Thank you very much,
Peter
Download VjVolubilis application, and install on the device. After turning BT on, press the AGOn icon and the audio output will be transferred to the BT headset.
NB. For me only works if Volubilis is installed on device not on storage card. My headset is Motorola H500.
Hi, thank you...
The tool is great,
but no way to enable Audio-Gateway.
When I click on it, it takes a while and then the message appears:
- Bluetooth On
- AG Audio failed
Maybe, there is something missing on my device???
Nobody here with the same problem?
Thnx Peter
I really don't know why it is not working for you.
The only thing that comes to mind is either headset incompatibility, or the fact that I had added a2dp to my AKU2.0 Rom before installing VjVolubilis.
Maybe you can try to install a2dp if not already installed.
I don't think it is related to a2dp. I was using VjVolubilis for Skype calls without any problems long before I installed a2dp on my AKU2 rom... Maybe its a hardware problem?...
I have tested this. You just need to go into the bluetooth preferences for your device, enable 'headset' and disable 'wireless stereo'. The sound quality is terrible in comparison to the A2DP module. Don't expect music out of it.

again... BLUETOOTH ISSUES

hello everyone!
i just got my first bt headset, its an anycom aris21.
the pairing with my blueangel worked like a charm, but after a day of useage, i noticed several issues i kinda dislike....
- i can not start a call (start phone) with my headset, when blueangel is not in PHONE menu! is this normal? can this be changed?
- how can i disable the phone's speaker (and mic), when using the headset? its pretty anoying to know, that the caller could be heard by bystanders...
- people seem to have problems hearing me! can i change the microfone volume of the bluetooth headset on the ba?
- how can i find out what BT stack i have?
- i have now helmi_c's WM06 installed, no changes to bluetooth made.
what recommended changes/updates/patches/... should i try for better performance?!
what to install for best results?!? is that BroadcomBT1.7 still the way to go? what cabs do I need?!
i know, that some issues have already been adressed, but things are changing so fast here, that i have problems being up to date about all issues! so forgive my ignorance and please help me!
i would be very thankful!!!
regards,
krz
Yeh, the Blue Angel is a bit strange with some bluetooth devices.
I have the following issues with WM6 on my BA, which did not exist with 2003SE:
1) When Bluetooth is active, the device turns on by itself every minute or so. I understand that this is a hacked "feature" to prevent the bluetooth from turning itself off. This is probably the most annoying thing about WM5/WM6. Is there any fix I am not aware of?
2) When I start from scratch and pair my carkit (Parrot), everything works OK, except that BA's sound putput, i.e. for Microsoft Voice Command, is coming from the BA instead of the car kit. This is too low a volume, to be clearly understandable in a car. With my Universal (also on WM6) this does not happen.
3) After pairing my Asus GPS, nothing works. If I delete all paired devices and just pair my Asus without being in range of the car kit, it will work. If both devices are turned on (car kit and GPS Receiver), none works properly.
I don't use my BA on a regular basis anymore, because I have my Universal, which works flawless. However, I see no paint in upgrading to WM5/WM6 if one ends up with LESS functionality than the original 2003SE.
The only feature I will be missing is the fact that no RAM memory is used, which means one does not loose everything when the battery drains.
Are there any tips to solve these three problems?
The WLAN "bug" is not really a problem: even with 2003SE I had to occasionaly start and restart the WLAN for it to work properly.
Cheers,
vma
@vma:
1. Well, not at the moment; maybe if someone who can play with the dll's can fix this.
2. I use a Logitech hands-free, and i have no problems.
3. No problem here using a NoBrand BT GPS receiver and the hands-free in the same time.
Overall, my BA work much better on WM6; its just my experience.
problems i still have:
- i can not start a call (start phone) with my headset, when blueangel is not in PHONE menu! is this normal? can this be changed?
- how can i disable the phone's speaker (and mic), when using the headset? its pretty anoying to know, that the caller could be heard by bystanders...
- how can i find out what BT stack i have?
- i installed that Boradcom stack 1.7 without having any succes in getting my headset to work. with or without patch1 and htcheadset! any ideas?!?
- what excactly is that HTC HEADSET ADDON ?
please answer soon, any help is very much appreciated!!!!
thx in advance,
krz
1. Same here; i think is my hands free set limitation.
2. I get the same using the Broadcomm stack; use the MS stack.
3. Depends; if you use Broadcomm/Widcomm, you have an "about" box; if you use MS, i don't know.
4. i get it working, but with audio in hands free AND speakers; annoying.
5. don't know, try Google.
DANDANA said:
@vma:
1. Well, not at the moment; maybe if someone who can play with the dll's can fix this.
2. I use a Logitech hands-free, and i have no problems.
3. No problem here using a NoBrand BT GPS receiver and the hands-free in the same time.
Overall, my BA work much better on WM6; its just my experience.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What Bluetooth Stack you use ?
First, I use the existing MS Stack on Helmi WM6. BT GPS and Handsfree couldn't run at the same time.
Second, I use Broadcomm Stack 1.71. BT GPS and BT Stereo could run at the same time, but Hands-free function didn't run at all.
Give me a light please.
your bluetooth headset
A few of your problems could be from the bluetooth headset you are using now-- such as when people can not hear you clearly. I currently have a sound id sm100 bluetooth headset and it works flawlessly....although i still can not activate voice calling from it(it activates it on my BA so i have to talk into my BA and not my headset). It could just be your headset.
shazzy84 said:
A few of your problems could be from the bluetooth headset you are using now-- such as when people can not hear you clearly. I currently have a sound id sm100 bluetooth headset and it works flawlessly....although i still can not activate voice calling from it(it activates it on my BA so i have to talk into my BA and not my headset). It could just be your headset.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, Bluetooth in BA really sux... you have to choose your bt handsfree wisely, make sure you try it on BA properly before buying it... currently I am using i clip II mini, and it is giving me the same behaviour as shazzy84's
KRZTF said:
hello everyone!
i just got my first bt headset, its an anycom aris21.
the pairing with my blueangel worked like a charm, but after a day of useage, i noticed several issues i kinda dislike....
- i can not start a call (start phone) with my headset, when blueangel is not in PHONE menu! is this normal? can this be changed?
- how can i disable the phone's speaker (and mic), when using the headset? its pretty anoying to know, that the caller could be heard by bystanders...
- people seem to have problems hearing me! can i change the microfone volume of the bluetooth headset on the ba?
- how can i find out what BT stack i have?
- i have now helmi_c's WM06 installed, no changes to bluetooth made.
what recommended changes/updates/patches/... should i try for better performance?!
what to install for best results?!? is that BroadcomBT1.7 still the way to go? what cabs do I need?!
i know, that some issues have already been adressed, but things are changing so fast here, that i have problems being up to date about all issues! so forgive my ignorance and please help me!
i would be very thankful!!!
regards,
krz
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well I found a way to solve the BTA2DP problem. It supports stereo & is just fantastic. you can find these by the following link http://www.teksoftco.com/index.php?section=freeware & this software works too http://www.trianglepowers.com/PPC/ViewApp.aspx?ID=52 (have to register to download). I prefer Teksoft freeware as I am using it. Sometimes it takes a while after a few toggle u get it right
Lost in China
I have a problem with a Chinese Dopod HS-01 BT Stereo Headset!!!
Phone works, but the Stereo Headset starts for a second or two and then it is gone!
Please, help!
Admire people who can bring an answer!
I myself only good in learning physical languanges. So need MP3 HeadSet!
Also using SuperMemo CE the most beautiful tool for language learnig!
Is there any other solution then to change the registry and the things?
Using:
WM6 5.2.1938 (Build 18538.0.7.0.PV.HAT)Touch & Office 6.1 NetCF 3.5
No one to ask for help over here!
My MSN:
[email protected]
Skype:
janicic
MySpace:
www.myspace.cn/taijiyoga

Widcomm BT stack for orbit2?

Hi guys,
Ditched Orange and went to o2, just for their version of the Polaris!
(Also got fed up with Oranges' delays in bringing out decent phones, and their belief that the future of mobile devices is a clunky keyboard!).
Set up my orbit2 blue tooth with my BT stereo in the car... first time round, hands free worked fine, BT Audio worked too.
Coming back for the drive home in the evening, hands free still works fine, but the BT Audio is nowhere to be seen - no BTA icon on stereo, and playing music through WMP just comes out the handset.
So...
1) Anyone know why / fix?
2) Any Widcomm stack available for the Polaris / orbit 2 yet?
While i'm here...
Anyone know why WMP wont let me add mp3's stored on storageCard\music to the WMP library?
Thanks...
cy80rg said:
Anyone know why / fix?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Open the BT menu and tap and hold your BT car stereo.
Then select "Set as Wireless Stereo" and it will connect using A2DP.
While on certain ROMS you need to repeat this procedure there are others where you don't.
Sascha
That's great - works like a charm!
Sound quality's great too - thanks for your help mate

Possible to send all audio over bluetooth?

I've spent days searching and trying all sorts of tweaks but I can't get anything to work. Can anyone PLEASE help!
I use Tomtom 7 and I've always sent the voice instructions to the bluetooth speaker in my bike helmet (just a handsfree paired item). I've previously done this on HTC devices with BTAudio and a one line registry tweak. Can anyone offer a solution to send all the audio to a bluetooth handsfree on the HD2?
I really hope someone can help, I've got the HD2 setup just right except for this last remaining item.
Many thanks,
i have the same problem...
@noony i think u have already enabled in bt setting the option "manage system audio in handsfree device" if u didnt...try that
for me doesnt work maybe its a headphone problem i see a sort of "fhhh" when any sound is played on phone but still come out from the speeker
another issue... every time i start a call with bt the volume is at the lower level..internal and headphone too! and the last is very strange because with my artemis didnt do
xardus said:
i have the same problem...
@noony i think u have already enabled in bt setting the option "manage system audio in handsfree device" if u didnt...try that
for me doesnt work maybe its a headphone problem i see a sort of "fhhh" when any sound is played on phone but still come out from the speeker
another issue... every time i start a call with bt the volume is at the lower level..internal and headphone too! and the last is very strange because with my artemis didnt do
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes I've tried the "manage system audio in handsfree device" option. I can get some background noise on the headsets (I'm trying with a Scala Rider and Motorola 700 & 850) but I never manage to get any sound.
Can anyone please offer a solution? It's a big disappointment for me if this isn't possible. Any suggestions welcome, many thanks.
My Observations
I pared it with my BMW and for the life of me cant ger any audio (music) over bluetooth ( the phone works fine) I then tried it on a $20 bluetooth earpiece I ocassionally use for the phone and guess what I can play music over it fine.
I tried and tried again in the car but could not get it to work.
I think some bluetooth devices will not work. Is there a different specifiaation for bluetooth ir BT1 and BT2 ??
I havent checked into this yet.....
Fadetogrey said:
I pared it with my BMW and for the life of me cant ger any audio (music) over bluetooth ( the phone works fine) I then tried it on a $20 bluetooth earpiece I ocassionally use for the phone and guess what I can play music over it fine.
I tried and tried again in the car but could not get it to work.
I think some bluetooth devices will not work. Is there a different specifiaation for bluetooth ir BT1 and BT2 ??
I havent checked into this yet.....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It gives me some hope that you've got it to work with one bluetooth device. Can you please let me know exactly what you did to get the $20 bluetooth earpiece to work?
Thanks,
yeah that was my idea but without a stereo bt device i cant try to myself...i ordered to vodafone one with some of my tons of points...3 weeks and no answer!
I had the same issue and on my old phone, the HTC Touch HD, I used the following program to my satisfaction:
BTAudio
On my HTC HD2 however this doesn't seem to work anymore. :-(
it does the same thing of the inbuild bt option on hd2 its just a "quick link" to place on the bar
anyone of u have any problem with bt device volume? before i have an Artemis and 3 different device i used the device volume was every time the one i choose...now every time a new call starts phone volume its right but device volume jump to minimum level and every time i have to press + button like as i'm playing videopoker to dont miss fist seconds of a conversation
Works fine with Jabra 3030, all audio over it, music, system sounds and calls.
Maybe it's only working for bluetooth devices that are setup as stereo. Can anyone please offer a solution here?
I've installed a 6.5 rom (dutty v7 - thank you) on my HD and after a sprite restore (level 2) bluetooth audio divert works fine. Although I notived that the bluetooth options remained the old settings (possibly due to my backup restore) and the divert was done using the BTAudio. Sorry to keep asking but if anyone can shed light on this.
Is it possible to tweak the HD2 so that audio can be sent to any bluetooth headset/handsfree or is there some hardware limitation that stops this from being done?
I've tried every app and tweak that I can think of! Please can anyone help, even iof it's to let me know why this can't be done.
Thanks,
its what we all are trying to do......now i think its only a bt device problem...if it support bt2.1 and a2dp with edr seems to work all good....
i solved in car with headphone in the box...but bluetooth should be much and much better without any cable that always have to remove nodes (its the right word? sorry if not hehe)
I'm connecting to my HD2 using Jabra Stone, an A2DP headset. When I selected the stereo headset profile on the HD2, it redirected all system sounds to the headset: reminders, SMS alert, soundtrack for videos, audio player....except phone ring. I used BT Audio over a non-A2DP headset before with Diamond2, but the ausio is very poor, and the connection drops very often. Since I changed to A2DP headsets, the Diamond2 and HD2 supports it out of the box - no hack needed.
So look for A2DP headsets if you want to redirect audio.
Thank you to everyone that has helped with replies. I've now got my answer. If the bluetooth device supports A2DP then it works! (just won't work with mono etc)
I've now tested my HD2 with over a dozen bluetooth devices ALL A2DP enabled headsets regardless of if they are cheap or expensive!
Thanks again for everyone taking the time to help.
I have an LG HBM-220 bluetooth and cannot put audio to in, only phone calls!
How can i manage to do it?
I blame it on the stupid Widcomm Bluetooth stack... If the HD2 used the better MS stack, BT would play nice with with more of our periphirals and apps
I can't use MSVC properly with BT either....
the solution is to go to the bluetooth settings, select your device and connect the stereo audio connection.
Way back, Microsoft decreed that ONLY the phone app could use a mono BlueTooth headset, although any audio could be redirected to a stereo A2DP headset.
In order to get around this you need to fudge the sytem with something like BTAudio or TekSoft's BlueAudio.
The latter worked on my XDA Orbits (1 and 2) but does not work on my Touch HD with Dutty's R6 ROM (WM 6.5) possibly because BlueAudio requires the Microsoft BlueTooth stack and I suspect Dutty's ROM has the Widcomm stack. But I could be wrong about that.
BTAudio sort of works on my Touch HD, but outgoing audio is speeded up like I've been breathing Helium.
So no current solution to yet another idiotic gotcha from Microsoft.
Noony said:
Thank you to everyone that has helped with replies. I've now got my answer. If the bluetooth device supports A2DP then it works! (just won't work with mono etc)
I've now tested my HD2 with over a dozen bluetooth devices ALL A2DP enabled headsets regardless of if they are cheap or expensive!
Thanks again for everyone taking the time to help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmmm. When I conect via gprs to youtube aps I can hear the voice in my mono headset (jabra 2020) but via wifi and computer as modem voice is only in phone speaker. So maybe we should look gprs or youtube aps reg tweek.
Guys
i have a nokia HB-100 headset and i'm experiencing all kinds of strange behavours
sometimes system sounds including music ...etc get directed to the headset and some other time it just directs calls no matter how hard i try thru soft resets or unchecking then checking the "play system sounds ..." option!
very strange, any insights about this? is there a tweak to go with or is it a known WM defect?

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