Database Users

Can the abuse be toned down please?

Dunno what people's beef is on here ?
Yes there are new members and so on, but some of the foul mouthed attacks I have seen here is disgraceful.
If your mother/wife/daughter or whatever logged on here would you want her to be subjected to such abuse ? No? Thought so!
Tone it down please - if you don't have anything constructive to add to a post, don't bother.
If it makes you feel better about yourself because you feel superior as you know more about HTC/Windows mobile etc. than other people - go back to your ZX81 or whatever but please stop the swearing and nastiness.
Sorry, just never seen such animosity on a forum in my life!

I wish I could say I feel your pain man, but I am a noob as well however I feel the more seasoned vets on here are just tired of the same stupid repetitive questions typically posted by none other than us new guys. I am not saying its right but the way I see it, its kinda like having a little brother or sister that keeps asking the same question over and over and over again while your trying to get something done. My occupation is sales and has been for almost a decade and the first thing I always try and do is look at something from all sides. In doing this it A) Makes me do a search before asking and B) Not feel as bad if I get checked by someone. Just my .42. Additionally I have found if I really cannot find something then I will pm someone I feel is approachable and let them educate me.

From what I have seen lately, the "abuse" has toned down big time around here, were you recently flamed or something, that made you think this?

donzx6 said:
If your mother/wife/daughter or whatever logged on here would you want her to be subjected to such abuse ? No? Thought so!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
bit sexist

Truly!
ChaoticDruid said:
From what I have seen lately, the "abuse" has toned down big time around here, were you recently flamed or something, that made you think this?
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Click to collapse
I agree. The replies on this site have become MUCH more mature, helpful, and professional in the last few weeks.
I hope you're not referring to 'now' ... or maybe you're reading through the historical posts to avoid getting flamed.
This is another reason why, no matter how many times a question's been asked, the old-timers should carefully think about the legacy their words will leave behind on these forums.
I find the repeated questions unbearable sometimes, too. But the historical traces of the blatant abusive and immature replies will live with these boards for a very long time, making it unlikely that anyone will like to search for an answer before posting the same question over and over and over and....
-pvs

swtaltima said:
I wish I could say I feel your pain man, but I am a noob as well however I feel the more seasoned vets on here are just tired of the same stupid repetitive questions typically posted by none other than us new guys.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They make the choice to read the questions then respond in an abusive manor. Its not like a brother or sister who hunt you down to annoy you. I have tried searching for a good tutorial on how to build packages and what not to build my own ROM but the usual thread I see is, "Google It and learn it the way I did." It almost like no one really wants to share their knowledge on certain areas of ROM building. I've tried googling etc. But I have still not run across a decent tutorial. I'd be willing to help make a tutorial if I knew the complete process. I've seen others claim this forum is for XDA "developers" and if you are not a developer you should look elsewhere for "help." The only way to become a developer is to learn. Most people learn by reading and asking questions. I just don't understand why people insist on berating others for asking innocent questions. I have searched for answers before and not found it. Then later I am reading a thread and I do see the answer to my question but it was not worded the way I say things possible because of language differences. So it slipped throught the cracks of the search. Should I be verbally abused for asking my question? Probably not, especially seeing as how the diversity on this forum is great. Many different primary languages and knowledge levels. It seems like before ROM cooking for Hermes was possible people were all fine and cordial with each other. Then boom, cooked ROMs became possible and it turned into if you cant help me finish my ROM and let me put the donte link in my signature I don't want to help you.
Well thats my take.
PS- if someone helps me grasp the art of ROM building I will make a tutorial and do my best to make it simple to understand for everybody.
Jokinawa

There are still a few bad apples around thou & most of us know them but just keep to our selfs, too much of that n00b flame go read wiki or search google, they can tell you to read the wiki but too lazy to type a quick fast reply to a simple question....

I just wanna know but have my replies been helpful?? :s

jokinawa said:
They make the choice to read the questions then respond in an abusive manor. Its not like a brother or sister who hunt you down to annoy you. I have tried searching for a good tutorial on how to build packages and what not to build my own ROM but the usual thread I see is, "Google It and learn it the way I did." It almost like no one really wants to share their knowledge on certain areas of ROM building. I've tried googling etc. But I have still not run across a decent tutorial. I'd be willing to help make a tutorial if I knew the complete process. I've seen others claim this forum is for XDA "developers" and if you are not a developer you should look elsewhere for "help." The only way to become a developer is to learn. Most people learn by reading and asking questions. I just don't understand why people insist on berating others for asking innocent questions. I have searched for answers before and not found it. Then later I am reading a thread and I do see the answer to my question but it was not worded the way I say things possible because of language differences. So it slipped throught the cracks of the search. Should I be verbally abused for asking my question? Probably not, especially seeing as how the diversity on this forum is great. Many different primary languages and knowledge levels. It seems like before ROM cooking for Hermes was possible people were all fine and cordial with each other. Then boom, cooked ROMs became possible and it turned into if you cant help me finish my ROM and let me put the donte link in my signature I don't want to help you.
Well thats my take.
PS- if someone helps me grasp the art of ROM building I will make a tutorial and do my best to make it simple to understand for everybody.
Jokinawa
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
By the way, they do hunt people down with PM, e-mail, IM, etc...
Here my take
The Art of ROM building does not happen overnight and it is not for everyone. You are also correct there are no A-Z tutorials on how to do it. Nonetheless, there is a lot of information on how to get your feet wet. It requires certain skill set in order to develop good cooked ROM.
Skill set: Search and Read both threads and wiki, Development (someone with a development background is preferred), Cab (building and extracting) PPC registry, Windows Mobile OS (understanding how things work), device infrastructure (understanding how things work with that particular device, because they are not all made equal), understanding you could brick your expensive device with the one wrong turn. Most important patience and keep you changes to a minimum until you get the hang of it.
The list of requirements can go on but I figure with the above information you should have an idea. It takes months of reading, searching, and trying things out in order to understand how to cook. While you are researching you also want to keep with new findings, that means you have to stay on top of up coming new threads. It is a crazy cycle and some of us can keep up with it but I assure you it is not for a lot PPL.
Oh, I forgot one more thing, you also have keep up with your full time job (you know, the one you get paid for).

Thank You
lpsi2000: Thank you. I almost have it down. The only issue I had was one of my apps did not make the start menu icon and I posted it in a thread directed towards one of the kitchens and thus far has been ignored for a week or so. I posted what I put in the initflashfiles.dat etc. It makes a shortcut but appears as a folder link to the /Windows directory and not a shortcut to the EXE. I will get it eventually though.
DAFTEK: I totally agree. Why say use search or the wiki when you could post a link to the search results or the exact thread.
mrvanx: Yes, you are always very helpful.
Thank You all.
jokinawa
<polish>Shines his new Senior Member badge.</polish>

I agree that is has gotten much better in the past few weeks. I also use the ignore list to block out a couple of folks who repeatedly belittle others with their uneducated and profane flaming.

Here is my take. WTF cares
you want a bucket to catch those tears?

jokinawa said:
lpsi2000: Thank you. I almost have it down. The only issue I had was one of my apps did not make the start menu icon and I posted it in a thread directed towards one of the kitchens and thus far has been ignored for a week or so. I posted what I put in the initflashfiles.dat etc. It makes a shortcut but appears as a folder link to the /Windows directory and not a shortcut to the EXE. I will get it eventually though.
DAFTEK: I totally agree. Why say use search or the wiki when you could post a link to the search results or the exact thread.
mrvanx: Yes, you are always very helpful.
Thank You all.
jokinawa
<polish>Shines his new Senior Member badge.</polish>
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The way I get around some of the issues with applications not working properly, I flashed the ROM, take a copy of device registry and files then install the app on the device and then compare it to see what was changed. From there I normally address it with my cooked ROM.
I must disagree with this comment " DAFTEK: I totally agree. Why say use search or the wiki when you could post a link to the search results or the exact thread." although I have done it at time when the search is not obvious.
If you spoon feed the search every time, then the person will never learn how to search. I have seen PPL on this board expecting other people to do search for them and also provide the answers. Trust me there are a lot of lazy people on this forum.

mrvanx said:
I just wanna know but have my replies been helpful?? :s
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Exteremely, MrVanx... EXTREMELY! Only to be outdone by your wonderful guides...easy to follow and up to date. You provide a wonderful service to these forums, and I always look forward to your posts.
Sorry I haven't yet made a donation in your direction. It will be coming soon.
All the best,
-pvs

austinsnyc said:
Here is my take. WTF cares
you want a bucket to catch those tears?
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Click to collapse
Easy there bro... that kinda attitude got the elf kicked out of the house...

You know I would go easy just everytime my faith is restored in the people here the stupid bug seems to bite again. like asking questions that where answerd in a post right above or someone wanting to be spoon fed its almost to the point where no one wants to do anything for themselves. that's pretty sad if you ask me im sure most of the cooks here did not receive the amount of help that has been given in just the past month. I understand helping people but I also understand earning respect and until that's done give me a reason why I should spoon feed when there is a search button and google.

mrvanx said:
I just wanna know but have my replies been helpful?? :s
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Click to collapse
pretty obvious answer(s)

why create another thread in 'Hermes Mobile 6', this should be put in the 'General Section'
and as far as i have seen it the abuse has been dramatically in the past few weeks

Sometimes the abuse is (IMHO) justified.
This post generally makes my blood boil http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=311698 - the asshole keeps appearing in many guises, doesn't want to help but only make money. If this is the first post you see when you log on you get pissed off, then get carried away with the 'Flashing LSVW bricked my V3' type of threads.
In my opinion, ronfin44 was perfectly justified in (mildly) flaming this guy.

mrvanx said:
I just wanna know but have my replies been helpful?? :s
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Click to collapse
Awww fishing for praise now? ahhahah!
Of course it's been helpful.. Honestly, I'm pretty impressed with the impartial, well thought replies that you always give.
[mumbles]Wish I could say the same for me hee hee![/mumbles]

[SUGGESTION] ROM Reviews, Comparisons, Rankings,

With the dozens of ROMS out there for our device, it would be nice and helpful if a thread was made where people could post an in-depth comparison between these roms and possibly even a ranking system in terms of downloads, review score, user feedback etc. Another possibility is a guide that would help them choose the best ROM for them.
I've been on my custom rom ever since but that decision came after hours and hours of research and reading the threads of the other ROM chefs and visiting other websites as well. It would be really helpful to the newer members who would like to modify their phones to have a dedicated review thread/area where everything is there to read.
I know this sounds lazy but it would save hundreds of research hours and make choosing the right rom suited for each individual faster and easier.
I could do it if I had the proper experience and knowledge, but sadly, I am but a noob.
I'm just throwing ideas around and see if this is a good idea. Anyone interested in this? The community will be in gratitude if this becomes a reality

i think i posted in the wrong subforum? uhmm... sorry mods. Please move if inappropriate.

I don't think this is such a good idea, to be honest
First, it might be cause for some rather immature users to go about saying this or that is the best or this is better than that in so and so ROM etc. It's hard to find people who can give good reviews because no matter what, there's always that bias and sense of loyalty. Even comparative reviews may be hard to come by because I don't think a lot of people use a particular ROM for a long enough period of time before jumping to try another one (or they just try one, and stick to that one for whatever reason..be it because they're satisfied already, or aren't the type to want to try everything out) then once they settle on one they like, they can't really say much in terms of comparison about others they've tried before since ROMs constantly get updated. Like I may have stopped using a particular ROM because of bugs and such and move on to something else but who knows, those bugs could've been addressed already by then etc.
The thing of it is, someone will always have a different user experience from someone else. And it really depends on the person's usage of the phone. And it's really upto the user to do his/her own research. Because if we just have a thread where people will just look for whatever has the most reviews then they're just gonna jump right in to flash it perhaps without further in depth reading.. We already have a thread which is a constantly updated index of the ROMs already available. People can just start off from there, check out whatever seems appealing based on the description and jump to that thread for some further reading or ask their questions there. Opening up a thread like this might further fragment support around here. People might start asking questions on that thread, submit their complaints, ask for help, report problems etc. Even if you tell people to not do those things in that thread..well not everyone likes reading through all of the first post.
And unfortunately, not everyone is accustomed to use the ever helpful search box so they end up posting questions that already have been answered over and over again. And instead of checking out the step by step guides, they have people walk them through the process. Some people are so in a hurry to jump into custom ROMs that they end up making mistakes and bricking their phone. Some..how you say..rude users even go so far as to blame the ROM maker or the beta testers for not doing a good job because they have this or that freak bug they happen to get.
Not that I'm against helping people, especially newbies (I'm a helper on Doc's thread) but I think it would be a benefit to people especially new users to do some of their own research and discover things on their own. The respective threads of the ROMs provide more than enough information, reviews, complaints, help, guides etc.
People won't ever learn if they're spoon fed information and such all the time. I'm all for trying to make the whole experience easier for any kind of user, but I'm also all for people to do some of their own work and learn on their own. It's not just a matter of trying to save people time, it's a matter of letting people get the best user experience for them. It's not a matter of lessening the amount of people asking for help, but it's a matter of wanting them to learn.
Sometimes saving people time and effort isn't the best idea if it just gives them problems later they can't figure out on their own.
Sorry for the lengthy reply. Just my 100 pesos. Lol.
I don't mean any offense or whatever to anyone, okay? I love helping people when I have time and I just think helping people help themselves is the best. You know like..give a man a fish and he eats for a day, teach a man to fish and he eats for a lifetime..that kinda stuff.
I hope my post came off as logical and with all due respect.
Peace~

Preach
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App

anoneemooz said:
I don't think this is such a good idea, to be honest
First, it might be cause for some rather immature users to go about saying this or that is the best or this is better than that in so and so ROM etc. It's hard to find people who can give good reviews because no matter what, there's always that bias and sense of loyalty. Even comparative reviews may be hard to come by because I don't think a lot of people use a particular ROM for a long enough period of time before jumping to try another one (or they just try one, and stick to that one for whatever reason..be it because they're satisfied already, or aren't the type to want to try everything out) then once they settle on one they like, they can't really say much in terms of comparison about others they've tried before since ROMs constantly get updated. Like I may have stopped using a particular ROM because of bugs and such and move on to something else but who knows, those bugs could've been addressed already by then etc.
The thing of it is, someone will always have a different user experience from someone else. And it really depends on the person's usage of the phone. And it's really upto the user to do his/her own research. Because if we just have a thread where people will just look for whatever has the most reviews then they're just gonna jump right in to flash it perhaps without further in depth reading.. We already have a thread which is a constantly updated index of the ROMs already available. People can just start off from there, check out whatever seems appealing based on the description and jump to that thread for some further reading or ask their questions there. Opening up a thread like this might further fragment support around here. People might start asking questions on that thread, submit their complaints, ask for help, report problems etc. Even if you tell people to not do those things in that thread..well not everyone likes reading through all of the first post.
And unfortunately, not everyone is accustomed to use the ever helpful search box so they end up posting questions that already have been answered over and over again. And instead of checking out the step by step guides, they have people walk them through the process. Some people are so in a hurry to jump into custom ROMs that they end up making mistakes and bricking their phone. Some..how you say..rude users even go so far as to blame the ROM maker or the beta testers for not doing a good job because they have this or that freak bug they happen to get.
Not that I'm against helping people, especially newbies (I'm a helper on Doc's thread) but I think it would be a benefit to people especially new users to do some of their own research and discover things on their own. The respective threads of the ROMs provide more than enough information, reviews, complaints, help, guides etc.
People won't ever learn if they're spoon fed information and such all the time. I'm all for trying to make the whole experience easier for any kind of user, but I'm also all for people to do some of their own work and learn on their own. It's not just a matter of trying to save people time, it's a matter of letting people get the best user experience for them. It's not a matter of lessening the amount of people asking for help, but it's a matter of wanting them to learn.
Sometimes saving people time and effort isn't the best idea if it just gives them problems later they can't figure out on their own.
Sorry for the lengthy reply. Just my 100 pesos. Lol.
I don't mean any offense or whatever to anyone, okay? I love helping people when I have time and I just think helping people help themselves is the best. You know like..give a man a fish and he eats for a day, teach a man to fish and he eats for a lifetime..that kinda stuff.
I hope my post came off as logical and with all due respect.
Peace~
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fair enough. Well said kabayan! Initially, i thought that this was a good idea. Looking at things now, it's not so attractive after all. haha. Salamat!
MODS: Kindly requesting the closure and deletion of this thread please. Thanks!

@anoneemooz,
Just a hypothetical question, if it happens that Samsung release a froyo rom (2.2 only) and it comes with your native language locale with Swype as well would you still be in the latest rom, or would you stick to the rom with those features?
Not trying to flame, but would like an honest opinion about this.
Maraming salamat sa inyo!

g00ndu said:
@anoneemooz,
Just a hypothetical question, if it happens that Samsung release a froyo rom (2.2 only) and it comes with your native language locale with Swype as well would you still be in the latest rom, or would you stick to the rom with those features?
Not trying to flame, but would like an honest opinion about this.
Maraming salamat sa inyo!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not a flame at all haha!
Well, I'm pretty used to everything being in English and I'd prefer it actually. It's a major language in the Philippines. It's my first language too so I wouldn't switch. Maybe I'd install the Swype with Filipino, but I might rarely use it since I usually stick to English or Chinese except for the occasional Filipino words which I can just type out if need be.
As for the phone's locale..I'm happy with United States or France so I'd stick to custom ROMs probably for forever. 2.2.1 ROMs have been awesome and knowing our awesome devs around here...2.3 will be even better~

anoneemooz said:
I don't think this is such a good idea, to be honest
First, it might be cause for some rather immature users to go about saying this or that is the best or this is better than that in so and so ROM etc. It's hard to find people who can give good reviews because no matter what, there's always that bias and sense of loyalty. Even comparative reviews may be hard to come by because I don't think a lot of people use a particular ROM for a long enough period of time before jumping to try another one (or they just try one, and stick to that one for whatever reason..be it because they're satisfied already, or aren't the type to want to try everything out) then once they settle on one they like, they can't really say much in terms of comparison about others they've tried before since ROMs constantly get updated. Like I may have stopped using a particular ROM because of bugs and such and move on to something else but who knows, those bugs could've been addressed already by then etc.
The thing of it is, someone will always have a different user experience from someone else. And it really depends on the person's usage of the phone. And it's really upto the user to do his/her own research. Because if we just have a thread where people will just look for whatever has the most reviews then they're just gonna jump right in to flash it perhaps without further in depth reading.. We already have a thread which is a constantly updated index of the ROMs already available. People can just start off from there, check out whatever seems appealing based on the description and jump to that thread for some further reading or ask their questions there. Opening up a thread like this might further fragment support around here. People might start asking questions on that thread, submit their complaints, ask for help, report problems etc. Even if you tell people to not do those things in that thread..well not everyone likes reading through all of the first post.
And unfortunately, not everyone is accustomed to use the ever helpful search box so they end up posting questions that already have been answered over and over again. And instead of checking out the step by step guides, they have people walk them through the process. Some people are so in a hurry to jump into custom ROMs that they end up making mistakes and bricking their phone. Some..how you say..rude users even go so far as to blame the ROM maker or the beta testers for not doing a good job because they have this or that freak bug they happen to get.
Not that I'm against helping people, especially newbies (I'm a helper on Doc's thread) but I think it would be a benefit to people especially new users to do some of their own research and discover things on their own. The respective threads of the ROMs provide more than enough information, reviews, complaints, help, guides etc.
People won't ever learn if they're spoon fed information and such all the time. I'm all for trying to make the whole experience easier for any kind of user, but I'm also all for people to do some of their own work and learn on their own. It's not just a matter of trying to save people time, it's a matter of letting people get the best user experience for them. It's not a matter of lessening the amount of people asking for help, but it's a matter of wanting them to learn.
Sometimes saving people time and effort isn't the best idea if it just gives them problems later they can't figure out on their own.
Sorry for the lengthy reply. Just my 100 pesos. Lol.
I don't mean any offense or whatever to anyone, okay? I love helping people when I have time and I just think helping people help themselves is the best. You know like..give a man a fish and he eats for a day, teach a man to fish and he eats for a lifetime..that kinda stuff.
I hope my post came off as logical and with all due respect.
Peace~
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1, i agree with you.

g00ndu said:
@anoneemooz,
Just a hypothetical question, if it happens that Samsung release a froyo rom (2.2 only) and it comes with your native language locale with Swype as well would you still be in the latest rom, or would you stick to the rom with those features?
Not trying to flame, but would like an honest opinion about this.
Maraming salamat sa inyo!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As English language is a working language in India, most of the users would prefer a phone with English as default. There would be some who use Hindi also. But they wouldn't miss Hindi on their phone.

[UPDATE:16.10.12]ATRI Atrix ThatRom Installer v2

hello, i've made an Automated Atrix ThatRom Installer.
This script will help noobs to do everything without any troubles.
The file is a rar archive with all firmware files + installer.
here is a link http://www.mobile-inform.com/content/view/1148/1/
this is early alpha. you take all responsibility on yourself. I do not recommend you to use this rom, but if you still want to use it - here it is
UPD Updated To ThatRom v2 (AtrICS)
all thanks to the author of ThatRomv2 (AtrICS), i made only the Installer!
With best regards
the_fly

I don't think that it's a good idea to make an automatic installer of something that it's no stable for someone who doesn't even know how to use fastboot nor flash a zip. Maybe when this finally reaches the stable "level", then you should do the Installer.

BravoMotorola said:
Maybe, until you're not annoying, you should stfu. Seriously stop trying to tell people what to do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow dude, that was really uncalled for. He is actually right because now the op has put himself in a position to be harassed by anyone who tries this and messes up their phone even though they should and do know the risks. He was just trying to be helpful, he wasn't attacking the op for making it.

I agree making an unstable, untested, developer test build easily available to newbies is a very bad idea. If they can't at the VERY least learn how to use fastboot and adb, they should come nowhere near this ROM. Unless of course you really want to be held responsible for dozens of bricked and/or unusable phones, and be expected to provide extensive support at all times.

if they are noobs - it is their problem. Everything is written befoure me.
Everyone takes responsibility for their actions.
There were several noobs who were crying about ICS even if they do not know what to do. and they are happy now, despite the bugs.
I am not, but i made for those who are. I am not going to tell anyone to install it, i did only help, but i suggest nobody to install it.

It doesn't work and you know it. It's as if there was some paid software that people want, and you made a crack/patch for it, and then you say you don't advise using it. Do you really think people will stay away just because you advised so? No, they won't. In fact in that case your disclaimers make no difference whatsoever, you are equally at fault for making it available as they are for using it. Why do you think all anti-piracy companies always go after crack makers and distributors and not so much after users? I mean many crack makers also advise against using their cracks. But people are stupid and never listen, and in in the eyes of many crack makers are the original offenders.
Or if you want a different analogy - go find a mentally unstable person who can't really think straight (may seem offensive but noobs who want test builds on their phones clearly do not know what they're doing), then place a bottle of some drugs and a fresh needle within easy reach, and then tell them you advise not using it. Observe what happens.
IMO this kind of things are best dealt with preemptively, by not even making the potentially controversial stuff easily available.

you see, i've made first script of unlocking the boot a year ago. a lot of peole thanked me. they were happy - they unlocked once and than used other ways to change the firmware. They were noobs, but happy noobs. 18 000 downloads (i think some of them were same persons, for example me - while i was testing, or when i was unlocking for my friends), but only 4!!! broken phones. 2 of them caused by bad motherboard and 2 of them by ignoring the manual and all the warnings.
This one is more easy one. less questins. less work. just use it.
and if person already have unlocked boot there will be no problem with this FW
and i want to mention it again some users are happy enought with this fw. Some do not have reboots, some have but for them it is ok.

You should tell everyone that this is a very alpha rom. It does run without multiple reboots for most people per the forums. I personally have tried all methods and cannot get it to run.
I appreciate your efforts but this is not something that noobs will get any value from. You should be very clear upfront.
Sent from my MB860 using xda app-developers app

agurzhiy said:
hello, i've made an Automated Atrix ThatRom Installer.
This script will help noobs to do everything without any troubles.
The file is a rar archive with all firmware files + installer.
With best regards
the_fly
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks agurzhiy!
I am a proud noob who used your unlock script and will use this one.
For all the pros which have a problem with this- you have the same approach as Motorola - "It's complicated you can't understand this". It's my choice what to do with my phone and agurzhiy providing us noobs with a possibility to participate in the effort to make it better.
The bottom line is instead of criticize why don't you spend this time and energy on creating and helping the community. Remember you were ones noobs too.
Sent from my MB860 using xda app-developers app

e07015 said:
You should tell everyone that this is a very alpha rom. It does run without multiple reboots for most people per the forums. I personally have tried all methods and cannot get it to run.
I appreciate your efforts but this is not something that noobs will get any value from. You should be very clear upfront.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i think everyone knows that it is alpha rom. nobody is going to install a script if if nobody knows what's inside. But i will add that it is alpha

ComX said:
For all the pros which have a problem with this- you have the same approach as Motorola - "It's complicated you can't understand this".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're missing my point entirely here. But that's okay. I don't want to argue anymore.

Is this just a fastboot script or an bootloader unlocker and ram fix etc etc

ravilov said:
You're missing my point entirely here. But that's okay. I don't want to argue anymore.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do not think that this is an argument. It is more like sharing different views on a subject.
I know what you mean, you want to prevent (or at least warn) noobs from taking the risk of bricking their phone and you are right 100%. But let me ask you how many of XDA readers are dumb enough to download some thing like this without reading at least a bit about it(*). Give ppl a little credit, most of us will stop on red light although it is possible to continue. Take me for example: I wanted to use nebtop but had a difficulty to understand how to root. Than mramirezusa came out with Automatic bootloader for noobs like me and boom - now I'm using the atrix as a streamer and without this tool I couldn't do this on my own. My point is that having a possibility to do stuff is highly appreciated.
* Ryan Dunn: If You Gonna be Dumb - You Gotta Be Tough.

this is a fastboot script to make it faster and easyer for a noob

UPDATE:
added the 32 bit version for x86 Windows

agurzhiy said:
UPDATE:
added the 32 bit version for x86 Windows
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dude, you've only been thanked here 7 times... Stop thinking so highly of yourself.
Unless you are going to stick around the forums helping these guys out when they have issues with your release, because they won't have anywhere else to go, and because other devs are busy with their own stuff, than you should probably refrain from posting anything that makes it easier to flash dangerous software.
Unless you're willing to help "guy xyz" (since quotes seem to be in) on "page 74" when he asks again, "why am i having video issues after flash", because your main post lacks important details and explanation and your web link is not multi-lingual, please refrain from posting content which could be perceived as harmful to use.
Any good software community recommends first releasing to a smaller test group in order to work out major bugs and minimize any potential impact the software may have on the device... And, any good service community would recommend first releasing to a smaller test group in order to create a base to compare full deployment scenarios against... In no cases would they make it easy to install buggy software on devices of users who can not adequately report issues during alpha stages of software.
Why is it so hard to understand how that applies here?

Zeljko1234 said:
IMO, you should stop spending so much time here on the forum arguing with people. Don't get me wrong but your posts are usually quite offensive (example what I saw today). You post almost in every thread, smartassing noobs, playing to be moderator... If you know something, share it, if post or thread is against the rules, report it.
Now you're arguing with guy who made first script of unlocking the bootloader and in the same time insinuate that many of xda members are just dump.
Forum, especially xda, is about sharing knowledge not giving useless advise/comment or to google it.
P.S.
Sorry everyone for off topic.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We try not to feed him, Zeljko1234... Just let him be.
Your point is well deserved; but don't feed the trolls.

knigitz said:
Dude, you've only been thanked here 7 times... Stop thinking so highly of yourself.
Unless you are going to stick around the forums helping these guys out when they have issues with your release, because they won't have anywhere else to go, and because other devs are busy with their own stuff, than you should probably refrain from posting anything that makes it easier to flash dangerous software.
Unless you're willing to help "guy xyz" (since quotes seem to be in) on "page 74" when he asks again, "why am i having video issues after flash", because your main post lacks important details and explanation and your web link is not multi-lingual, please refrain from posting content which could be perceived as harmful to use.
Any good software community recommends first releasing to a smaller test group in order to work out major bugs and minimize any potential impact the software may have on the device... And, any good service community would recommend first releasing to a smaller test group in order to create a base to compare full deployment scenarios against... In no cases would they make it easy to install buggy software on devices of users who can not adequately report issues during alpha stages of software.
Why is it so hard to understand how that applies here?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why don't you argue with epinter or any other person who put ThatRom?
Why are you arguing with me?
i made the thing easier, but i am not responsible for the uncomplete software. some people are lazy to use fastboot, but they know how to use it (i have flashed my phone 3 times while testing some of options to find out how it works)
other do not have enough knowledge to flash, but it's thair dream to have it, they are ready for the bugs and they alwas can ask me to help them to flash any other FW. And if they have unlocked boot - they can use CWM.
And the last group - the people who are just afraid to install after a lot of information about locking bootloaders. In russian community forums i've read 10 such questions from people who i know, from people who know how to use fastboot.
And if person do not want to install it - he may not install it!

I'm thankful to everyone who share knowledge. Even if I don't use everything, I usually download or read just to learn how. Without such guys, Internet itself will be mostly useless.
Do not blame anyone (especially epinter) for your mistake. He and many others guys spend a lot of their private time to figure how to do something, developing, supporting... and then sahre for free! As I can see, very rare they get donation. Almost never for the most loudest complainers which just wait that someone else will do something for them.

As I explained, as long as you are willing to stick around and help people with issues they encounter after flashing this, and provide more detailed instructions that people can read in your first post, it's not an issue.
Low thank count makes the more seasoned members cringe, as people release stuff that brick phones then disappear (it happens), leaving the community in a state of unrest trying to figure out the full impact of an unmaintained release, how many users were affected by the release, and a common way to fix the issues, and it leaves it up to other developers to explain to every xyz person to read this thread, read that thread, or flash this to fix.
Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

Dont ban me lol

Id like to thank the D-bags for stressing Ax out!!!......Bravo[emoji19]

Seriously though why can't people just try and help themselves. I hardly post cause I hate being that guy. I don't even know how XDA could help the newbs but I totally understand how ax feels. It sucks cause I bet you people will not even take the time to read that post of his and then ask some dumbass question or complain.
Wow I just noticed he had the thread closed. Man come on people wtf!! He totally gave everyone a chance to back off and I'm sure more than half of the people here didn't even know

Been around a longtime. Unfortunately this isnt anything new. Im old, but Ax is older. We came from a generation taught to respect others. Thats long gone. Next time your out in public, look around at the people around you. Those younger folks are the future. Its a damn shame that respect means nothing anymore. Ax does fantastic work, he doesnt deserve to be treated like that. Those complaining had no business even flashing. They werent smart enough to follow instructions. +1000 for Ax
Sent from my SM-N910W8 using XDA Free mobile app

This is unfortunately what XDA has become. You either accept it or you don't because I don't see it changing any time soon. Continuing to open and close a thread because it's not going how you expect it to, I don't feel is the answer. You either do it because of your love for Android development and for the users that support your work and ignore lazy people. Or you just don't do it. Just my 2 cents.

So I have an idea. We have a great noodles friendly thread already open. Maybe we should just post a link to that thread as a response to every question that obviously should not be in a development thread.
I am just having a hard time believing there are that many incompetent people out there now that can't Google and find the answer for themselves.
Or maybe XDA needs to make it so the owner of the thread can pick who is allowed to post in it. Or allow people to down vote posts and if you get too many down votes you get blocked from the thread.
Just think something needs to change XDA used to be so peaceful and cooperative now I have to scan through 10 pages of arguing of flaming before I find any useful information.
Sent from my SM-N910T using XDA Free mobile app

It would be great on these beta roms if you had to be an advanced user with so many thanks/posts to even be able to download the rom. Way too many users have no idea what they are doing and refuse to try and learn. There were countless helpful posts and instructions in the op that were easy to follow. Im still running the US version with no issues.
Sent from my SM-N910W8 using XDA Free mobile app

Nothing that you guys will change em.. They have all been spoon def and people keep feeding. Helping is one thing and doing it for them is another. Feel sorry for the guys that did come here and glad that one of my friends didn't get this phone.. It is what it is and u till we all start letting them fend for thenselfs nothing will ever change. Look at how many lollipop is coming threads they have and still opening. It sad. Looking forward to be change.
BAD ASS NOTE 4

No one. I repeat no one should bug the devs. I'll come and see you.
But, isn't it a compliment when people are interested in your work and posting in your threads and pm'ing you at all hours?

How could you be glad people aren't here?
We have the only cool rootable and customizable phone.
You think the s6 will have this many devs?
Do you even flash roms?
Aren't you Mr. Stock rooted?

I think what really started the whole "do everything for me movement" was when a lot of stuff, like root tools became automated. When I first joined XDA, to even root your phone you had to know how to use a command prompt and ADB. If not, you were screwed. So it gave you the incentive to read and try to learn all you could. If you got stuck at a certain part there would always be someone willing to help you get through it but it was mainly up to you. Now, there isn't a whole lot that isn't automated. So new people get use to having everything done for them so there really is no incentive to learn. Then if something is not fully automated and you have to read or think a little bit people get lazy and would rather it be done for them. Actually it's not just XDA, it's pretty much our society in general. Myself, I loved trying to figure out how to do things and became somewhat addicted to it. Now had everything been automated when I first got into Android, who knows, I may be the same way.

Tiffany84 said:
I think what really started the whole "do everything for me movement" was when a lot of stuff, like root tools became automated. When I first joined XDA, to even root your phone you had to know how to use a command prompt and ADB. If not, you were screwed. So it gave you the incentive to read and try to learn all you could. If you got stuck at a certain part there would always be someone willing to help you get through it but it was mainly up to you. Now, there isn't a whole lot that isn't automated. So new people get use to having everything done for them so there really is no incentive to learn. Then if something is not fully automated and you have to read or think a little bit people get lazy and would rather it be done for them. Actually it's not just XDA, it's pretty much our society in general. Myself, I loved trying to figure out how to do things and became somewhat addicted to it. Now had everything been automated when I first got into Android, who knows, I may be the same way.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just had a flash back to my original "ddrrrroooiiiiidddd". Hours to adb root it seemed.
Sent from my SM-N910W8 using XDA Free mobile app

donnyp1 said:
I just had a flash back to my original "ddrrrroooiiiiidddd". Hours to adb root it seemed.
Sent from my SM-N910W8 using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly. But it made you better

I love the vision roms.
Definitely flashed them on a lot of phones.
But, wouldn't a simple Q&A thread in Q&A like every other rom have prevented this drama?
Then people that like helping could help the noobs.
And, people that don't like spreading the android wealth could f### off.

Cant we just get along.
Even this thread is starting to bash each other about how they should run their thread or rom post. Everyone does things diffrent, and that does not mean they are wrong. We just need to respect each other and give thanks to everyone who develops-themes-assists in making these roms. Alot of time and trial and error goes into making these great roms, themes, and add-ons. All roms have their problems and all dev work hard to fix the issues and to bring you a working rom. If you want to vent then you get on the phone with ATT, Verizon, Sprint, TMO and complain to them. They are the ones that make this difficult not the developers.
It is very simple to post a question, or about an issue you are having,
1. read thru the posts to see if anyone else posted about the same problem you are having.
2. read to see if a fix has been posted about the issue you are having.
3. use the xda forum search and or use google to search your issue.
4. if you did all the above, then post your question or issue you are having, with a detail description of what you did to cause the problem, and lastly post a logcat of your issue.
5. then wait patiently for the dev or one of folks that are working on the rom to post a reply.
6. when your problem is fixed. then thank that person/s for their help.
7 Simple, it doesnt get any easier than that.
Alot of issues that most user have are created by themselves, by choosing not to read the directions, post throughly before flashing the item to their phones
Sorry i just had to vent.
Remember PLEASE and THANK YOU will get more help, than saying hey you need to help me out now.

Rooting and unlocking phones has come along way from back in the tmobile g1 days. These Samsung phones are stupidly easy to root and are already unlocked. I too remember the better years of XDA of educating yourself first by reading and then if you run into a problem asking for help.
Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

sad to see him go, but i agree we should only have advance users post or even have access to certain threads...like a test of some sort, on basic andriod knowledge, with just enough time to google answers lol

He's closed those threads a lot and reopened them. Let's just hope he opens them again instead of having a debate.

10-K said:
He's closed those threads a lot and reopened them. Let's just hope he opens them again instead of having a debate.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol! If that's the case then maybe he just needs a break. Not really sure what the need is for drama. You can't let annoying people and newbs drive you crazy. I've been around xda for almost 9 years now and have seen many devs come and go. As great as devs are to xda, they need to remember this is just a hobby and the contributions here shouldn't be stressful. If it is... Then it's time for a break. Simple as that. There will always be irritating folks who want hand holding past the point of what is reasonable. Just ignore them after pointing in the correct direction if they continue. I'm not saying don't help. Helping others is everyones role here. You can't let the one's that take advantage of your help to abuse you or your generosity. There is a fine line and a lot of grey area in these regards but it obviously depends on the particular situation. My point is... this should be fun. If it isn't anymore then it's time to step back for a while.

10-K said:
I love the vision roms.
Definitely flashed them on a lot of phones.
But, wouldn't a simple Q&A thread in Q&A like every other rom have prevented this drama?
Then people that like helping could help the noobs.
And, people that don't like spreading the android wealth could f### off.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The problem is that the noobs who create these types of situations are the same ones who would NEVER use a Q&A thread. 99% of what they need to know can come from using the thread search tool, yet they refuse to do that. Believe me, I'm sure that what made it into the threads from these isn't half as bad as some of the stuff he's getting in PMs. I did same thing Ax did and walked away, as I would get PM after PM demanding help, complaining about known issues that were being fixed, demanding ETAs, etc. This is supposed to be FUN. Sad fact is that the noobs don't understand that NONE of the devs here on XDA or anywhere else HAVE TO release their work. They could post screenshots of it and nothing else if they chose to.
---------- Post added at 06:22 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:18 AM ----------
galaxyuser88 said:
Cant we just get along.
Even this thread is starting to bash each other about how they should run their thread or rom post. Everyone does things diffrent, and that does not mean they are wrong. We just need to respect each other and give thanks to everyone who develops-themes-assists in making these roms. Alot of time and trial and error goes into making these great roms, themes, and add-ons. All roms have their problems and all dev work hard to fix the issues and to bring you a working rom. If you want to vent then you get on the phone with ATT, Verizon, Sprint, TMO and complain to them. They are the ones that make this difficult not the developers.
It is very simple to post a question, or about an issue you are having,
1. read thru the posts to see if anyone else posted about the same problem you are having.
2. read to see if a fix has been posted about the issue you are having.
3. use the xda forum search and or use google to search your issue.
4. if you did all the above, then post your question or issue you are having, with a detail description of what you did to cause the problem, and lastly post a logcat of your issue.
5. then wait patiently for the dev or one of folks that are working on the rom to post a reply.
6. when your problem is fixed. then thank that person/s for their help.
7 Simple, it doesnt get any easier than that.
Alot of issues that most user have are created by themselves, by choosing not to read the directions, post throughly before flashing the item to their phones
Sorry i just had to vent.
Remember PLEASE and THANK YOU will get more help, than saying hey you need to help me out now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What?? You mean posts like "My phone doesn't has data. how to flash?" aren't helpful? LOL
I agree 100%. Problem is that as I've noticed in life, the smart/hard-working are being outnumbered by the stupid/ignorant/lazy They be multiplying like rabbits.

These are really not the types of threads conducive to a development environment
This is basically a whining about the whiners thread
Developers who have lives and do this for a hobby, some times take on too much trying to please everyone....and forget to please themselves
And yes, members can be demanding, unfairly. This is where the other members of the thread should help out and politely guide and answer those members...taking the pressure off the developer. Official ROM Q&A threads are a great help.
But let Ax take a rest and come back even stronger than before...you are putting the same pressures on him with threads like this, though your intentions are good.
Thanks
Kenny

[DEVS] - Please Read - [Request]

Hi Developers,
You folks all do a great job of trying to sort out install issues and confusion regarding vendor images for our devices and whatnot and we less inclined to develop really do appreciate all you put into it for the rest of us.
That being said, one thing that I personally think should be included in the ROM's initial posting is a link to the **LINK---> FACTORY IMAGES<---KNIL** for our device.
I know that you all have the link memorized and every flavor imaginable already downloaded, but when a normal person flashes something and it doesnt work its a pain in the joint to try to remember where the list of imperatives is in the forum. The first place most look is to the thread where they were coming from.
It's ok if you flame me for this and I understand. Personally I'm usually all over it myself, but when I see questions in all of the ROM threads asking where someone got a vendor image and then they say they found it in the marlin thread it's just not right, if you know what I mean.
Anyway, thanks for considering it.
Regards,
Dtrud0h

If users don't know where the factory images page is they really shouldn't be unlocking their bootloader.
Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

dtrud0h said:
Hi Developers,
You folks all do a great job of trying to sort out install issues and confusion regarding vendor images for our devices and whatnot and we less inclined to develop really do appreciate all you put into it for the rest of us.
That being said, one thing that I personally think should be included in the ROM's initial posting is a link to the **LINK---> FACTORY IMAGES<---KNIL** for our device.
I know that you all have the link memorized and every flavor imaginable already downloaded, but when a normal person flashes something and it doesnt work its a pain in the joint to try to remember where the list of imperatives is in the forum. The first place most look is to the thread where they were coming from.
It's ok if you flame me for this and I understand. Personally I'm usually all over it myself, but when I see questions in all of the ROM threads asking where someone got a vendor image and then they say they found it in the marlin thread it's just not right, if you know what I mean.
Anyway, thanks for considering it.
Regards,
Dtrud0h
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I always just do a GOOGLE Search - "Factory Images Pixel Sailfish" and it comes up as the first or second link every time. Easy Peasy. I think you have to remember, it is not the Developers place to make life easy for anyone. They already did all the work by creating the rom in the first place. Everyone flashing a rom takes on a major responsibility to know what they need to do if something doesn't go right. if they can't figure this out by searching - or at the very least by TRYING to search first, they should never try in the first place. Of course if they do try on their own to figure something out and still need help - I am sure they will find it by asking.
Too many people have gotten to the point of EXPECTING the developers to hold their hand while they flash roms - why is it the developers place to do that? They didn't hold a gun to the persons head when they flashed - and frankly, I believe they expect each of us to at least try to find things out on our own first - they already put a huge amount of work into creating the rom and then chose to allow us to use it as well. I think they have done enough -
Just my two cents.

joetheshmo said:
If users don't know where the factory images page is they really shouldn't be unlocking their bootloader.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very true, but it seems a lot of people are doing so. I dont recall a new phone that had so many noobs to flashing. Not complaining, I help them out a lot. Just an observation.
And no, not the devs responsibility to help them. And if they posted links for flashing stock they would get inundated with requests to help with that.

Some phone forums on XDA are more user-friendly than others for flashing ROMs. It used to be so easy and I was (I thought) a pro - I helped others a lot. This phone confuses me more. You learn by doing, but people also don't want to risk $800 phones for the sake of learning.
I personally think it would be nice to include all crucial links as well, but most people on this forum are more inclined to believe you should just find it yourself, haha. I got a "let me Google that for you" response to a question this month, I recall.
When I was back in the Galaxy S3 or HTC One M8 forums, things were a little more noob-friendly but this place is full of nice people who help. It's just harder to do it yourself (without research or asking) because the threads are written at a more advanced level, in my opinion, and the steps are more complex than they used to be.

I agree, some forums are much more friendly than others. It is also easy for the ones that get in on the ground floor than it is for the ones that get in later. People sometimes answer questions in a more complex manner than is needed and probably without realizing it. Throw that in with someone that maybe hasn't had an unlocked bootloader in years and you have some uneasy and nervous people. Yet these guys have a right to get in there, get their feet wet, and eventually contribute. Imagine how clean a Dev's thread would be if not only a link to the firmware was given but if only a vendor image was needed, then that was provided as well. There would fewer questions about the little things and people going back and forth with one another about how stupid or lazy people are on one hand, and how unhelpful or rude people are on the other. I'm not a Dev though.

I agree with you all. lol. It is not the devs responsibility to make sure that your grass is covered, it's usually the first thing in all the threads, **Your Own Risk** I think are the key words. I haven't built any roms but I can get around the platform tools pretty well. But for the sake of keeping the rom threads clean and informative, especially with all the new variables related to most notably the Pixel, but android flashing in general supplying the correct files would probably cut thread clutter down by 40% and with uniform installs bug tracking would be a bit easier.
Anyway, thanks for looking and thinking about it, I appreciate all the points of view expressed.

I'm not complaining about anything, but I originally posted this in the Development Forum and it got moved to Guides and News...Whatever.
Starting to get a stiff neck from shaking my head at the posts in the rom threads, one right after the other asking where to find files, among other things that the user should know.
Just sayin'