Everything started a while ago, sd card stopped working properly with error "sd card unexpectedly removed", then wifi begins to drop connection.
Nothing to lose, i thought. I read that baking helped some G4 users. Disassembled the phone, took out motherboard and put it in an oven for 7mins (185C/365F)
Results: It worked! Sd card works fine, wifi is good. But effect lasted only for 4 days =). This morning I’ve got "sd card unexpectedly removed" again. Wifi is still working though.
This is my experience I’d like to share.
PSA: I've googled much for sd-card and wifi issues with g3, and if you've experience any of these: sdcard, sim card, wifi, display issues - it's the beginning of the end. You'd better start looking for a replacement.
Also, I’d strongly recommend you not to buy used G3. The risk you'll get phone that won't last long is very high.
(sorry for poor english)
Hi mate, sorry to read this story, but exactly same situation happrned with my fiancee g3. Exact the same order of things, i was also trying to bake it but it didnt helped.
PS. It was also bought 2nd hand.
This makes no logical sense at all. Could someone please explain to me what you think baking the mainboard does?
The only possible reason for doing this that I can think of is to dry it out if it got submerged in water for an extended period of time. However, the phone naturally gets hot enough to evaporate any internal moisture quite quickly so there goes that theory.
I think what is happening for the strange folks that do this, is just the process of disassembling and reassembling the phone cleans up the ribbon connections and helps dirty contacts.
I strongly recommend no one with any common sense bake their mainboard.
The only possible reason for doing this that I can think of is to dry it out if it got submerged in water
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The idea is to reflow solder joints. (at least google says so =)
think what is happening for the strange folks that do this, is just the process of disassembling and reassembling the phone cleans up the ribbon connections and helps dirty contacts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. The phone was reassembled millions times before with no such effect. And it never been in water.
Anyway, this is quite popular recipe to "fix" G3 and G4. I'm not claiming it will help. Just share my experience.
https://www.reddit.com/r/LGG3/comments/550a3u/just_bake_it_in_the_oven/
https://www.reddit.com/r/LGG3/comments/5e0nx7/info_for_those_thinking_about_baking_their/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikFbhcyO3Nk
UvarovG said:
The idea is to reflow solder joints. (at least google says so =)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea, sorry, you can't believe everything you see on the internet. Even this! lol. But, anyone experienced in soldering will tell ya that to repair a bad solder you need to remove all existing solder, re-apply flux, and re-solder (usually on a room temp bread board! lol). If you just re-heat existing solder you will usually increase resistance and weaken the solder contact even more.
Furthermore, I'm not aware of any solder points on the G3 board that sustain any kind of wear or movement. AND, when you bake the board you're also baking the SoC! :crying: If you got bad solder contacts because of overheating, then your SoC is probably fried anyways.
Whole thing smells bad to me, and I caution others to stay away from this.
There might not be enough heat inside a mobile phone to melt the solder joints, however the continuous stress from heating up and cooling down will weaken the crystaline structure and eventually make the solder joint break.
If you can manage to apply flux to the cracked solder you can usually recover the joint by reflowing it, however in case of BGAs (Ball Grid Array) microchips with hundreds of contacts (balls), where all solder joints are "sandwiched" between the PCB and chip , it's very hard to do so without the access to professional tools.
Reflowing in a household oven is usually just a temporary fix, as no flux manages to reach the broken joint, so all you do with reflowing is melting the cracked solder, which will stay weakend after cooling down again. New cracks in the crystaline structure will form pretty quickly. That's why baking will make the device work for a limited period of time.
The use of less reliable / proven solder compositions (aka leadfree vs leaded solder) also plays a role in this. Leaded solder is usually superior to lead free solder in regards to long time solder joint stability.
A better type of fix would be to reball the BGA, however this usually involves the ues of special tools. When you reball a chip you remove it from the circuit board (usually using hot air) and remove all the old weakend solder and put new, healthy solder blobs (balls) on the chip and then reassemble it.
Cheers.
AlwaysLucky said:
Yea, sorry, you can't believe everything you see on the internet. Even this! lol. But, anyone experienced in soldering will tell ya that to repair a bad solder you need to remove all existing solder, re-apply flux, and re-solder (usually on a room temp bread board! lol). If you just re-heat existing solder you will usually increase resistance and weaken the solder contact even more.
Furthermore, I'm not aware of any solder points on the G3 board that sustain any kind of wear or movement. AND, when you bake the board you're also baking the SoC! :crying: If you got bad solder contacts because of overheating, then your SoC is probably fried anyways.
Whole thing smells bad to me, and I caution others to stay away from this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Might as well bake away...because the phone is going to be dead soon anyway.
It's probably not a wear/movement issue - it's an LG quality issue. They had a bad run of boards that made it into the field. Anything from board contamination/improper handling, poor soldering techniques, bad solder, etc. can cause faulty solder joints that fail over time as the soc heats and cools over and over. Better R&D and higher quality standards at the manufacturing plants should prevent issues like this, but hey - sh*t happens sometimes. At least we didn't have the G4 bootloop issue caused by... "After a prolonged investigation, LG has identified the source of the problem as a “loose contact between components” and vowed to repair it..." http://www.androidauthority.com/lg-admits-g4-bootloop-problem-hardware-fault-669603/
Some people "fixed" their issues temporarily by either: a)putting tape on strategic parts of the board which then creates enough pressure when the phone is reassembeld to temporarily "fix" the faulty solder joint(s); or b) by - frighteningly (but doing so as a last resort, so I get the reason for trying it) - baking the mother board for another temporary "fix" of the faulty solder joints. And yes, from personal experience trying to repair a friend's phone, it does actually work for a short time until the solder joints fail again.
I agree with you that the only way to truly fix it is to remove the old solder, clean everything up, reflux and resolder - but that isn't cost feasible for most people who don't have a bga solder machine laying around. Bottom line is once the G3 acts up and re-soldering is the only way to bring it back to life - it's time to start shopping for a new phone.
startswithPendswithOOH said:
Might as well bake away...because the phone is going to be dead soon anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, and you will kill it much faster by baking it at 185C to soften the lead-free solder. If you do that, you will ruin the SoC which is only meant to handle temps up to 80C. Not to mention you will increase electrical resistance at the solder points.
I know, that would be sooo cool if this had any kind of possibility of doing any good at all. But, the science and physics is simply not there. This is an old-wives tale, a myth, a hoax. Call it what you will, but never encourage anyone to do this. Ever.
AlwaysLucky said:
Call it what you will, but never encourage anyone to do this. Ever.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. Never bake electronics. It's common sense.
Now if the phone is dead anyway and someone has nothing to lose & wants to give it a shot that's up to them, but even if it does help it won't be long lasting. Just buy a new phone and save the frustration.
relevant link https://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/5tw0ev/fix_your_nexus_5x_by_tossing_the_board_in_the_oven/
While using an "oven" to solder components is an actual technique, it's certainly not done in a home oven, and certainly not done the way most of those guides show.
I have repeated countless times in countless LG G3 threads with issues but no one wants to listen -- DO NOT PUT YOUR MOTHERBOARD IN THE OVEN.
This is not actual, proper repair steps. You might get lucky, and start working for a few days, and then it will be worse. As explained by many others in this thread, if not done properly, you will only further weaken the bad solder connections.
It has been caused that problems in the phone are caused by connections getting loose/overheating over time. Not all phones are prone to it, and surely use scenario will have something to do with it.
A better repairing technique for this would be applying pressure with a thermal pad to the SoC. This technique can also be found in many places around the forum. Another small non-conductive piece like paper or plastic from an old debit card would work as well, but thermal pads are best suited so they can help with the heat dissipation.
@UvarovG linked a great thread with a lot of relevant content in it if you are actually interested in learning.
Here are some links:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Shn7LdIrViQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1AcEt073Uds
And others.
Related
Hi,
I disassembled my N1 for changing the main flex cable (cutted power button) and in the disassembling procedure I noticed that one of the SMD components on the motherboard was de-soldered or not correctly soldered (twisted). I re-accommodated with a pair of tweezers and it did not hang loose (yet!).
What kind of function does this SMD do? Can I expect the phone to work?
I have experience with soldering iron but think this is too small for me.
I can't test it right now because my new main flex has not arrived yet.
Maybe you can solder it with an oven for CMS ?
firewave said:
Maybe you can solder it with an oven for CMS ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not very familiar with oven soldering; dunno if I will kill other components or If i need some kind of flux.
Also a heat gun would do the work but probably desolder other components.
I broke off a couple of the smd components right next to that connector (the screen connection) they effect color on the screen. Mine showed only red after I broke 2. It was usable but not pretty.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk
_Dennis_ said:
I broke off a couple of the smd components right next to that connector (the screen connection) they effect color on the screen. Mine showed only red after I broke 2. It was usable but not pretty.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for your answer.
You broke those very same components?
As soon as I get my main flex i will try it and see if it report problems. It probably will as that component is there for something.
You might be able to re-flow it with a heat gun.
Rusty! said:
You might be able to re-flow it with a heat gun.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for your answer.
Actually I'm looking for a chinese reflow station with a hot air gun with a tiny nozzle. Probably will do the work but...
Should I use some kind of flux? Any recommendations? Never done a hot air reflow.
Looks like the same but hard to tell in the pics. I can't really see on my phone.
Sent from my HTC Desire using Tapatalk
that is a set of inline resistors, meaning it is quite a few connections, the best way is to use some flux from a needle and a soldering iron with a small tip,you could use a hot air machine but on a fully assembled board i would not recommend it.. flux is needed but you may be able to get away with a large soldering iron.
My advice would be to pay someone to fix it.. that way if they mess up ya get a new phone
Find someone with a reflow air knife, anyone who does SMT work would have one. It'd take 5 seconds to put that RP back on as long as you didn't break any of the pads doing whatever it is that you did that caused you to break it. Yikes.
May i ask you where u got the power cable? I need one too, how much was it? And is it hard to replace?
N1
I bought it on www.aliexpress.com
It was around USD$45.
I still don't receive it, as soon as I recive it I will report if the phone works and if it is an easy repair.
Best Regards.
The phone it's not turning on.
I tried it disassembled with the new main flex cable, motherboard and only lcd conencted.
Nothing happened when I press the power button.
The only sign of life is the ambar led that turns on when you connect the charger.
The tiny little SMD part fell off the mother board so it is completly unsoldered. Could this be the cause of not turning at all?
Looking forward to your answers.
Yes, if a single component is missing or even has a bridge in the solder, it could cause complete failure. There is a reason for it being there. If it were me, I would try to resolder it. Grab an iron and some wick and get what you can off of the board. Then try to reflow the part back on. If it works, great. If not, you still have a nice looking paperweight.
Well, I soldered the little SMD back with a soldering/hot air station but the motherboard still don't turn on.
It was working before, maybe I'm doing something wrong.
Thanks for your support.
This is the way I fixed the wifi\bluetooth error with continuous rebooting on my Atrix.
I did not come up with it, and I do not guarantee it will work in your device, I'm simply sharing this because it's information that's hard to find and understand. I fixed my device in this way, so have others. I do not take responsability for any damage you might make to your device attempting this fix, and I do not claim it will work forever - it's been two days for me and still great!
For completeness sake, if you guys want to check other proposed fixes and some reasons why they might or might not work, here is this great post by mvniekerk, a person more far more knowlegble then me when it comes to these technological issues:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1655071
I'd also like to thank John-aurelio, junior member, who initially posted about this fix here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1655071&page=4
All credit goes to him!
So, what did I do?
1) I cut out two rectagular pieces of plastic from a pill tin, glued them on top of each other with scotch tape. I think any thin piece of plastic should do.
2) Opened up my Atrix by removing screws with a T5 Torx screwdriver. If you don't know how to do this check out this teardown by ifixit: http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Motorola+Atrix+4G+Teardown/4964/1
3) Slightly raised the motherboard and placed the plastic rectangle under it, with a little bit sticking out into the battery compartment.
To my amazement it worked, it is still working.
I wanted to tell you guys why, but I don't know. Perhaps one of you guys wants to experiment applying pressure to each component separately to find out the culprit?
Also, I'm curious to know if this will work for all of you, or just some of you.
Here are the pics:
This last one is the piece of tin\plastic with tape, side by side with a pencil for scale. Its not the tin I used, but its basically the same, but the one I used has white paint, I don't know if should make a difference. If you're worried about shorts just cover the whole thing in tape or cut plastic from a bottle or something.
The first two are how its supposed to look in the end.
[EDIT]: Here are some more pics:
This is the piece of plastic I used. It doesn't show, but it is very thin, one milimiter thick, if even.
These are of the open device. In the last one the plastic piece is a little eschewed, but you get the idea.
Cheerios
Huh. This is similar to the fix some people did with the digitizer problem. Seems like the the connectors on this phone tend to come loose, to where pressure in the right direction will fix it.
Sent from my MB860 using xda app-developers app
Newbleeto said:
This is the way I fixed the wifi\bluetooth error with continuous rebooting on my Atrix.
I did not come up with it, and I do not guarantee it will work in your device, I'm simply sharing this because it's information that's hard to find and understand. I fixed my device in this way, so have others. I do not take responsability for any damage you might make to your device attempting this fix, and I do not claim it will work forever - it's been two days for me and still great!
For completeness sake, if you guys want to check other proposed fixes and some reasons why they might or might not work, here is this great post by mvniekerk, a person more far more knowlegble then me when it comes to these technological issues:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1655071
I'd also like to thank John-aurelio, junior member, who initially posted about this fix here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1655071&page=4
All credit goes to him!
So, what did I do?
1) I cut out two rectagular pieces of plastic from a pill tin, glued them on top of each other with scotch tape. I think any thin piece of plastic should do.
2) Opened up my Atrix by removing screws with a T5 Torx screwdriver.
3) Slightly raised the motherboard and placed the plastic rectangle under it, with a little bit sticking out into the battery compartment.
To my amazement it worked, it is still working.
I wanted to tell you guys why, but I don't know. Perhaps one of you guys wants to experiment applying pressure to each component separately to find out the culprit?
Also, I'm curious to know if this will work for all of you, or just some of you.
Here are the pics:
This last one is the piece of tin\plastic with tape, side by side with a pencil for scale. Its not the tin I used, but its basically the same, but the one I used has white paint, I don't know if should make a difference. If you're worried about shorts just cover the whole thing in tape or cut plastic from a bottle or something.
The first two are how its supposed to look in the end.
Sorry for no open device pics, I did this yesterday and don't really feel like opening my phone, but if you guys think its needed I'll do it later.
Cheerios
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A detailed How To to show us what to do exactly, we can do much ourselves with just this pics. :/
EDIT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYz_RiuFVRk had anyone seen this?
Will try this with my wifi broken atrix tomorrow.
guidoido004 said:
A detailed How To to show us what to do exactly, we can do much ourselves with just this pics. :/
EDIT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYz_RiuFVRk had anyone seen this?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's literally as simple as opening the atrix and placing the plastic under the motherboard, I don't think it gets any easier then that. But I'll try to take more photos.
As for that video, there are reports of people killing their mobiles by breaking the piece holding the battery or killing the nearby ICs trying that. That guy is just too rough. Also, it doesn't show the battery actually being replaced. If you wanna try to replace the battery, better do it gently and stay clear of that video
Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2
If the solution is to apply pressure to certain parts of the board then it's likely similar to the infamous nVidia issues from around 2008 where the chips were getting hot enough to expand and brake the solder connection or in some cases, rip some of the pads from the board. If that is the case, be careful, as flexing the board the wrong way could eventually lead to making it worse over time.
I can't believe this actually worked. Been using my Atrix for the whole weekend on WIFI. Also finally been able to use my Lapdock properly.
Thanks so much for such a simple fix.
If its any help to anyone, I ended up using an old debit card, as its seems the perfect height to give enough pressure on the board.
It did take a few goes, but as long as you persist with it, it works really well. Plus no more over heating too.
Thanks again
holy crap. 5 minutes and its fixed! thank you
Cause found??
Hi everybody,
I might have an idea what causes the wifi errors. As the wifi gets fixed by changing the motherboard's position, the motherboard is not fastened properly. This might be caused by the vibration function that is located on the part of the motherboard you would need to move up.(see the location of the vibrationfuction in the attachment.)
If so, should this function be less used then?
Thanks Newbleeto! I was so frustrated with this issue. I was initially trying based that youtube video link by someone else which never worked for me. I later decided to try your solution and it worked for me the very first time Appreciate your help!
Thanks, seems to work!
What an interesting tweak. There some validity to this. The Atrix 4G is notorious for wifi, bluetooth, and GPS dropout. This is largely due to kernel and rom. However I have seem plenty of Atrix4Gs with loose antenna clamps. Usually I apply a little pressure in the outside of the clamp to reform it slightly so it will maintain hold on the reciever socket. Second thing I look at is the shielding around the mainboard. This acts as a heatsink and guard. If depressed in anyway will cause massive heating along with grounding. The antenna clusters are not well separated from RF interference from one another to begin with. Metal in general will restricted RF signals considerably depending on its frequency. The greater the frequency the lower it's ability to perpetrate materials.
From the looks of it your directing RF crossover and bounce back away from each antenna. This is a good thing. It also means as long as the phone is not held on its edge towards any receiving end it won't effect talk and data very much.
My experiments with the Atrix4G always had a bit of unpredictable outcome when it came to pressure on the ribbon connections. This would result in the screen blacking out, digitizer over sensitive or non responsive, failure to boot and so on. Pressure is a big deal with these phones so be careful.
Happy tinkering
IT WORKS
after nearly 4 months of this bug i finally had the guts to open up my phone and do this fix.
and it is working , my wifi is back thank you OP. :highfive::highfive::highfive::highfive::highfive::highfive::highfive::highfive::highfive::highfive::highfive::highfive::victory::victory:
This method works wonderfully. Thanks, OP!
sangyum said:
This method works wonderfully. Thanks, OP!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Spoke too soon. This fix stopped working after two days.... Back to Wifi Error and boot loop. :crying:
I got my wifi to work again, there are two snap on connectors on the same side of the phone. I put 2x pieces of toilet paper cardboard between the frame of the phone and the connector, pushing the connector tighter to the other side.
I'd like to confrm that it works to me !
Thank you, I spent dozens of hours to try solve it.
Newbleeto said:
This is the way I fixed the wifi\bluetooth error with continuous rebooting on my Atrix.
I did not come up with it, and I do not guarantee it will work in your device, I'm simply sharing this because it's information that's hard to find and understand. I fixed my device in this way, so have others. I do not take responsability for any damage you might make to your device attempting this fix, and I do not claim it will work forever - it's been two days for me and still great!
For completeness sake, if you guys want to check other proposed fixes and some reasons why they might or might not work, here is this great post by mvniekerk, a person more far more knowlegble then me when it comes to these technological issues:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1655071
I'd also like to thank John-aurelio, junior member, who initially posted about this fix here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1655071&page=4
All credit goes to him!
So, what did I do?
1) I cut out two rectagular pieces of plastic from a pill tin, glued them on top of each other with scotch tape. I think any thin piece of plastic should do.
2) Opened up my Atrix by removing screws with a T5 Torx screwdriver. If you don't know how to do this check out this teardown by ifixit: http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Motorola+Atrix+4G+Teardown/4964/1
3) Slightly raised the motherboard and placed the plastic rectangle under it, with a little bit sticking out into the battery compartment.
To my amazement it worked, it is still working.
...
Cheerios
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did this as well, and it's been working perfectly for over a week now. Battery life has tripled to 24h (back where it used to be, what a relief) and the wifi is back to being perfect.
In my case, I cut a small piece out of an old credit card and inserted into the section highlighted in the attached picture, inside to out (from the battery bay towards the side). There are flat cables/strips underneath and you probably don't want to insert your spacer material from the outside in. Make sure that the plastic strip fits completely underneath the board, otherwise you won't be able to properly close the back.
Thanks!
To add some data to this can all of you confirm the kernel and rom you are useing before and after this mod. Would help all of us in the future for reference. Thanks.
Cab121 said:
To add some data to this can all of you confirm the kernel and rom you are useing before and after this mod. Would help all of us in the future for reference. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sure, no problem!
Atrix 4G (Bell Canada)
Unlocked and rooted by yours truly (don't ask how, I'm still not sure I know what I did)
CynaogenMod 10.1 from epinter: Megathread or linuxmobile.org site, builds 2013-08-07 + hporch32 kernel (before and after mod) & 2013-08-26 + hporch32 kernel (after mod)
Radio: Telstra N_01.87.00R
I just stumbled upon this:
http://www.irevivespray.com/
Supposedly it can bring water damaged devices back to life. They claim it removes the corrosion and hence any shorts that may have been caused. Looks like a total scam to me, but I was wondering if anyone has this or has any experience with similar products.
Also it would be great of one of the hardware savvy guys could comment on whether it's possible to "repair" water damaged devices at all. My (basic) understanding is that the electrical components in the phone/tablet etc. can be permanently damaged by exposure to water and all the minerals typically found in water. Moreover, even if they survive the initial submersion, there's no guarantee that they will not slowly corrode and fail in the future.
Here in Germany all official repair companies refuse to repair water damaged devices, because they are required by law to a guarantee for their work and they claim it's impossible to guarantee that a water damaged component will continue to function even after being properly cleaned.
Any comments?
Have to admit it does sound a bit dodgy, although I use something that may be similar on bearings - Skanunu Bearing Cleaner is good for cleaning rusted bearings (and I mean so rusted they didn't move), although I'm not sure I'd want to put anything like that on electronics. I can't seem to find any chemical info on it...
Iamnotacrook said:
Have to admit it does sound a bit dodgy, although I use something that may be similar on bearings - Skanunu Bearing Cleaner is good for cleaning rusted bearings (and I mean so rusted they didn't move), although I'm not sure I'd want to put anything like that on electronics. I can't seem to find any chemical info on it...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I suspect it's just branded 99% alcohol Still I am curious whether simply cleaning the salts and minerals left by the water can possibly "repair" a device.
Water damaged phones can be repairable depending on the level of submersion and whether the owner is enthusiastic with the power button or not. If I try to repair a water damaged phone I do a full stripdown and clean aggressively with a brush and pure alcohol. It can work sometimes but quite often water damage is terminal. I've had plenty of people phone me and say they dropped their phone in water so I say 'bring it to me and definitely don't turn it on' then they phone me back later and say 'i turned it on and it's ok now so don't worry' but it may work short term but water destroys electronic components very fast.
This spray, as el_commandante said is probably branded alcohol and while it may work in extracting water, it will not clean properly without any agitation.
Sent from my 1.8ghz Xperia Play!
BensJammin said:
Water damaged phones can be repairable depending on the level of submersion and whether the owner is enthusiastic with the power button or not. If I try to repair a water damaged phone I do a full stripdown and clean aggressively with a brush and pure alcohol. It can work sometimes but quite often water damage is terminal. I've had plenty of people phone me and say they dropped their phone in water so I say 'bring it to me and definitely don't turn it on' then they phone me back later and say 'i turned it on and it's ok now so don't worry' but it may work short term but water destroys electronic components very fast.
This spray, as el_commandante said is probably branded alcohol and while it may work in extracting water, it will not clean properly without any agitation.
Sent from my 1.8ghz Xperia Play!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If by agitation you mean cleaning the inside of the phone with a brush, they do say you should do that. In fact they have videos on YouTube in which they show you how to do that Still, it feels a little scammy to claim a $30 bottle of alcohol will fix your water damaged phone in 90% of the cases They even offer money back guarantee, which is pretty bold.
It seems to me that if you drop a working phone in water and the water finds its way to its internals and shorts one of the components it doesn't really matter how well you clean it Then again there are plenty of info online about devices that have successfully survived encounters with water so the policy of the manufacturers is indeed a little questionable...
el_commandante said:
If by agitation you mean cleaning the inside of the phone with a brush, they do say you should do that. In fact they have videos on YouTube in which they show you how to do that Still, it feels a little scammy to claim a $30 bottle of alcohol will fix your water damaged phone in 90% of the cases They even offer money back guarantee, which is pretty bold.
It seems to me that if you drop a working phone in water and the water finds its way to its internals and shorts one of the components it doesn't really matter how well you clean it Then again there are plenty of info online about devices that have successfully survived encounters with water so the policy of the manufacturers is indeed a little questionable...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For the most part you are right. I do phone repairs as a side business but I will rarely touch a water damaged one. Phones can be repaired provided no damage was done when it shorted, and providing no power is applied until it is totally dried 100%. I use a brush to agitate the board with alcohol and this removes and conductive materials on the board (which could even just be damp dust). I have rescued a couple, but for the most part I leave them alone. I would be very dubious about this spray though. I'm sure there's some small print regarding the money back guarantee!
Sent from my 1.8ghz Xperia Play!
I've repaired many Android, & non-Android phones, & I can tell you this... Water damage is completely random, & completely various. Many times, it is not as terrifying as everyone makes it out to be. There was a point in time when I was actually hunting for water damaged phones to repair.
As I said, it's completely random, & is determined on a case by case basis. The damage will not always be the same. Maybe the speaker will blow out... replace the speaker. The hardware buttons are malfunctioning now... replace the ribbon cable for the buttons. Many times, people say the phone died & won't turn on anymore, when really, the LCD screen blew out... replace the screen, problem solved. Many times, the main ribbon cable is not good, causing the device to not turn on, or other multiple problems... replace the ribbon cable. Sometimes, it can be a headache though, because many different components will all blow out at that time, or, you'll fix some, & others will go or malfunction soon after.
As far as the cpu itself, from what I've seen, these things are BGA components. They are soldered on with a BGA interface. Not only that, they are also plastered down with a ridiculously strong super glue adhesive as well. They are completely airtight. NO water will EVER get underneath there.
Yes, it is always very important to clean everything off with pure alcohol & a q-tip. Alcohol is best for cleaning off electronic components, & it evaporates very fast too. About that spray you've posted, I didn't even look at it, but I've seen plenty of those same type of marketing schemes for a long time. Basically, it's just alcohol they pour into a bottle with their fancy looking label, & sell it to you for a ridiculously high price, claiming that it's magic. A page right out of apple's book, in my opinion.
3ndymion218 said:
A page right out of apple's book, in my opinion.
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Haha, absolutely! But as we all know, there are plenty of suckers in the world
Thank you for your detailed explanation. The bigger question for me at least is whether you could really be sure that a phone has been repaired once water has entered inside. It sounds like there's some merit to the claim that once water enters the device, you can never be sure that some components will not fail in the near future. Now the next question is how hard it actually is to water proof the key components inside. It seems to me that it's relatively trivial to do a relatively good job water proof most of the phone to a good degree...
Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk 2
el_commandante said:
Haha, absolutely! But as we all know, there are plenty of suckers in the world
Thank you for your detailed explanation. The bigger question for me at least is whether you could really be sure that a phone has been repaired once water has entered inside. It sounds like there's some merit to the claim that once water enters the device, you can never be sure that some components will not fail in the near future. Now the next question is how hard it actually is to water proof the key components inside. It seems to me that it's relatively trivial to do a relatively good job water proof most of the phone to a good degree...
Sent from my GT-N7100 using Tapatalk 2
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From what I've seen, it is true that there could always be headaches down the line with some components starting to give out, but I've never seen the most important things take any damage. Those being the cpu & other memory chips. The cpu is really plastered on there, & I think the other important chips too. It's usually only components that take damage, such as buttons & the main ribbon cable.
Then again, most of my experience is with various HTC devices, which relied more & more on ribbon cables the newer they got. I believe some manufactures still use a big board with everything on it. I don't know how bad those would take to water damage, or if they have main ribbon cables that can be replaced. As far as water proofing a phone, I don't think it's really possible without some kind of exterior, water proof case. The housings have way too many opportunities for water to pour right in.
3ndymion218 said:
From what I've seen, it is true that there could always be headaches down the line with some components starting to give out, but I've never seen the most important things take any damage. Those being the cpu & other memory chips. The cpu is really plastered on there, & I think the other important chips too. It's usually only components that take damage, such as buttons & the main ribbon cable.
Then again, most of my experience is with various HTC devices, which relied more & more on ribbon cables the newer they got. I believe some manufactures still use a big board with everything on it. I don't know how bad those would take to water damage, or if they have main ribbon cables that can be replaced. As far as water proofing a phone, I don't think it's really possible without some kind of exterior, water proof case. The housings have way too many opportunities for water to pour right in.
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The problem I have found is that if you get it working again easy enough, your customer comes back saying there's something wrong with it again in a week or so. Most of my experience is with iPhones and although a lot can be repaired, there's usually more that needs replacing, headphone jacks, mics etc and it gets expensive which is why I avoid water damage repairs now.
There's always Liquipel though. The sooner manufacturers start investing in this the better!!
Sent from my 1.8ghz Xperia Play!
el_commandante said:
I just stumbled upon this:
Supposedly it can bring water damaged devices back to life. They claim it removes the corrosion and hence any shorts that may have been caused. Looks like a total scam to me, but I was wondering if anyone has this or has any experience with similar products.
Also it would be great of one of the hardware savvy guys could comment on whether it's possible to "repair" water damaged devices at all. My (basic) understanding is that the electrical components in the phone/tablet etc. can be permanently damaged by exposure to water and all the minerals typically found in water. Moreover, even if they survive the initial submersion, there's no guarantee that they will not slowly corrode and fail in the future.
Here in Germany all official repair companies refuse to repair water damaged devices, because they are required by law to a guarantee for their work and they claim it's impossible to guarantee that a water damaged component will continue to function even after being properly cleaned.
Any comments?
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I would like to get my hands on this
BensJammin said:
The problem I have found is that if you get it working again easy enough, your customer comes back saying there's something wrong with it again in a week or so. Most of my experience is with iPhones and although a lot can be repaired, there's usually more that needs replacing, headphone jacks, mics etc and it gets expensive which is why I avoid water damage repairs now.
There's always Liquipel though. The sooner manufacturers start investing in this the better!!
Sent from my 1.8ghz Xperia Play!
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Yes, that is true. The headaches will come from people, & not so much from the device itself. If it's your phone, no problem. You can always replace whatever else starts to go. But when you're fixing things for other people, whether it be phones, or cars, or whatever, it's ALWAYS your fault. Once you touch it, anything that happens is blamed on you. It gets really annoying after a while.
Didn't some of the motorola tablets use Liquipel?
Hobbzey said:
Didn't some of the motorola tablets use Liquipel?
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Not sure but I'm surprised more companies haven't jumped on the waterproof bandwagon. I would love a waterproof tablet as I read magazines in the bath and most publications are going digital now due to costs and there will definitely be a need for waterproofing. Although capacitive touch screens can react awkwardly when they're wet though.
The Sony xperia z is totally waterproof already so the technology to do this is already there. Just not sure if I trust it.
Sent from my 1.8ghz Xperia Play!
BensJammin said:
Not sure but I'm surprised more companies haven't jumped on the waterproof bandwagon. I would love a waterproof tablet as I read magazines in the bath and most publications are going digital now due to costs and there will definitely be a need for waterproofing. Although capacitive touch screens can react awkwardly when they're wet though.
The Sony xperia z is totally waterproof already so the technology to do this is already there. Just not sure if I trust it.
Sent from my 1.8ghz Xperia Play!
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I don't think it's so much having to do with technology, but more in how they design the casing. Other things, like watches, use o-rings to seal the casing & make it waterproof. I wonder how Sony did it??? I especially wonder what they did about the speaker & mic openings. I'd really like to see that phone opened up. Yes, it would be nice if other companies joined in too. They probably don't want to spend the money researching how to make their cases watertight.
it sounds too good to be true
3ndymion218 said:
I don't think it's so much having to do with technology, but more in how they design the casing. Other things, like watches, use o-rings to seal the casing & make it waterproof. I wonder how Sony did it??? I especially wonder what they did about the speaker & mic openings. I'd really like to see that phone opened up. Yes, it would be nice if other companies joined in too. They probably don't want to spend the money researching how to make their cases watertight.
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On the mass scale that these companies sell their phones I wouldn't think it would cost them too much in the long run to invest in liquipel. That protects the mics, speakers and even jacks. I'm sure someone I know will smash their xperia z soon so I look forward to ripping that apart
Sent from my 1.8ghz Xperia Play!
BensJammin said:
On the mass scale that these companies sell their phones I wouldn't think it would cost them too much in the long run to invest in liquipel. That protects the mics, speakers and even jacks. I'm sure someone I know will smash their xperia z soon so I look forward to ripping that apart
Sent from my 1.8ghz Xperia Play!
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I think it was the Motorola Xyboard's that used it...?
Hobbzey said:
Didn't some of the motorola tablets use Liquipel?
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I wish my xoom had it, my son dropped it in the bath tub, it got nearly no water in it worked for about a week more
then died completely. I'd almost be willing to try this if it really did work
I know there's a rust to primer stuff out there, but that's a bit simpler
---
I hate jelly beans, Google's jellybean is alright though.
Sent from my sickeningly sweet Galaxy Note II
I think it works,becoz all service centers will have this.
................................................................................................
Dropped my phone on concrete. It BOUNCED - thank god for cases. It seems fine, except for this... (see attached image)
Yeah.... One of the NFC pins snapped off. As you can imagine, my NFC no longer works. At all. As I use NFC on a very regular basis, this is not OK.
Anyone have something like this happen to them? Any ideas on how to fix it? I was considering a drop of solder, but I really am not sure about what to do.
Thanks in advance.
mtmerrick said:
Dropped my phone on concrete. It BOUNCED - thank god for cases. It seems fine, except for this... (see attached image)
Yeah.... One of the NFC pins snapped off. As you can imagine, my NFC no longer works. At all. As I use NFC on a very regular basis, this is not OK.
Anyone have something like this happen to them? Any ideas on how to fix it? I was considering a drop of solder, but I really am not sure about what to do.
Thanks in advance.
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these NFC pins contains some internal circuits if you apply solder on it , then you will going to short circuit the hole circuit which may damage your NFC coil . you may damage your coil due to extensive heat due to solder . so please go to service center.
yep, that's right, try not to diy this one. the circuit may tolerate a bit of heat but my main concern would be EM parasite charges from your solder iron. These can screw the gain for the amplifying circuitry linked to the nfc coils. This is also true for the GSM/GPS antenna and in some measure for the WLAN.
however it should be an easy fix for a service center since they have ESD safe equipments.
This is a heavily rooted/ROMed/otherwise modified device. Would Samsung even take it back? I thought my warranty was long gone?
since your warranty is expired so stop bothering about root . as far as NFC pins are concerned replacement will not cost to much (NFC parts costs few dollars ) ..service charge is what you have to pay. so go to service center and stop bothering about root and rom.
Alright, I'm not sure what I need to do to here, I've never gone to a service center before.
Does this (image attached) work as a place to go?
yes , that's the place you have to go . i think they are going to take your phone for 1 to 2 days so keep an backup phone with you.
rishav754 said:
yes , that's the place you have to go . i think they are going to take your phone for 1 to 2 days so keep an backup phone with you.
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Well ****. I don't have a backup phone. This is gonna be REALLY annoying.
I am predicting not sure.......
Sent from my C2305 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
or i could just replace the module itself....
look at this: http://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Galax...8&qid=1400003697&sr=8-1&keywords=N7100+SD+sim
i guess i'll just be replacing it by hand.
looks good ... its the cheapest way to fix your phone ...:victory:
please ensure that i case of manufacturing defects they will going to replace it ( there may be chance manufacturing defects so be cautious )
go on replace the circuit board ...
Easy workaround
mtmerrick said:
Dropped my phone on concrete. It BOUNCED - thank god for cases. It seems fine, except for this... (see attached image)
Yeah.... One of the NFC pins snapped off. As you can imagine, my NFC no longer works. At all. As I use NFC on a very regular basis, this is not OK.
Anyone have something like this happen to them? Any ideas on how to fix it? I was considering a drop of solder, but I really am not sure about what to do.
Thanks in advance.
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I know it's been a while but thought somebody else looking up might benefit at least.
I had the same problem and I wish I knew how the contact broke off. I am a heavy NFC user and so all I did is simply take the inside of a bubblegum wrapper (the aluminium foil) and folded small enough to fit in the pit, yet big enough to make contact with the back cover. Cigarette packs also have such lining wrappers inside BTW. Then I simply have an extra full bubblegum wrapper (folded non conductive side up) and keep it behind the battery JIC I need to replace the hack when I open the back cover and loose the small piece from the contact point or may be miraculously when the other NFC contact also breaks off.
Also, conductive glue could be used to stick it if at all you want to go that far.
HTH!
Hi!
It suddenly rebooted once, I thought the LineageOS was too much for it since I have upgraded it a month ago (maybe two)
Then I had troubles downgrading to a stock FW which was a Lollipop 501 if I'm right. I had to restart the procedure with Odin 2-3 times until it worked.
To be able to get through the initial setup I had to let the phone rest for an hour to let it cool down.
I'm guessing the soldering between the board and the chip got loose or the contacts are imperfect because of the constant overheating.
Can it be? Would a threatment with a heat gun solve this? My PS4 was damaged because of bad cooling / overheating and I could repair it with the heat gun before. Easy-peasy.
It was borrowed from a friend living faaaar away, hence I haven't tried it with the S4 yet. I'm not sure tho' if I can use such a heat on a tiny phone board as on a much bigger PS4 board. (Even the cpu is bigger than the whole mobo of the phone)
One thing is sure, a hair dryer - with maximum heat dead close for 5 minutes - didn't do the trick But that's not even close to the performance of a heat gun.
Thanks!
Hair dryers don't get hot enough to melt solder. A heat gun would work but you have one big issue to overcome: the heat shield. You have to remove the heat shield from the motherboard, then wrap the entire board except the SoC in aluminum foil before applying the heat gun. However, I don't believe a heat gun will help you in this case.
I would get the device checked out by someone who repairs smartphones before attempting to take the device apart to apply the heat gun. The symptoms you are having are not consistent with a SoC lifting from the board.
Strephon Alkhalikoi said:
Hair dryers don't get hot enough to melt solder. A heat gun would work but you have one big issue to overcome: the heat shield. You have to remove the heat shield from the motherboard, then wrap the entire board except the SoC in aluminum foil before applying the heat gun. However, I don't believe a heat gun will help you in this case.
I would get the device checked out by someone who repairs smartphones before attempting to take the device apart to apply the heat gun. The symptoms you are having are not consistent with a SoC lifting from the board.
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thanks!
what else can it be? i can do a thing or two with electronic devices even if i don't have exact training in the field in question. let's put it this way: if you tell me what to do i can do it. also the board has got about 5 bigger parts and a bunch of small ones. it isn't "rocket surgery"
i don't know about heat shield, i removed the mobo and it looks just like this:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bd/Samsung_Galaxy_S4_I9505_mainboard.jpg
my second thought is that the memory (call it whatever you want) is at its lifecycles end? (too many read/writes, stuff like that?)
it isn't about software that's for sure. as the lcd works i can just buy another s4 broken in two with working mobo and deal with it that way. faster and seems easier (maybe also cheaper) if the heat gun thing wouldn't work.
The side of the board where the SIM card and MicroSD card slots are is the heat shield I was referring to. The card slots are actually stuck to the top of the shield using adhesive. Underneath that shield is the SoC and flash memory. In order to get the board to appear like the picture you likely removed the heat shield.
As to what it could be? A faulty surface mounted component on the board, but without a tech to diagnose it there's no way to know which component failed. If you can frankenstein one good phone out of two, assuming both phones are the same model, I would. The cost to repair it simply isn't worth it today.
Strephon Alkhalikoi said:
The side of the board where the SIM card and MicroSD card slots are is the heat shield I was referring to. The card slots are actually stuck to the top of the shield using adhesive. Underneath that shield is the SoC and flash memory. In order to get the board to appear like the picture you likely removed the heat shield.
As to what it could be? A faulty surface mounted component on the board, but without a tech to diagnose it there's no way to know which component failed. If you can frankenstein one good phone out of two, assuming both phones are the same model, I would. The cost to repair it simply isn't worth it today.
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yeah that's what i thought.
i think you are wrong with the sim-sdcard compartment. that i have already exchanged once when i had this "no sim card detected phone rebooting" annoying issue. under this sim-sd part is nothing but the plain board with a 2 sided sticky layer. but no chips, no nothing.
but it doesn't really matter since i'll just get a new(er) phone and that's it.
thanks anyway for the help!
cheers
g
@rigo88: You're most likely right. It was three years ago that I had replaced my SIM card tray, and I'm not about to take my S4 apart again just to check, even though it no longer serves as my daily driver.
I wish you luck with your new device.