Database Users

Droid X has a locked bootloader or "how motorola killed the Droid X for me"

i was really looking forward on getting myself a droid/milestone X/2 when it's available in europe. but i just read that the droidX (and maybe all upcoming motorola devices according to http://community.developer.motorola...OMs-and-Motorola-s-Android-Handsets/ba-p/4224) will have a completely locked bootloader as the original milestone had. it's as of today not possible to flash a custom rom on a >7 month old milestone, how weak is that?!
although i like the hardware of the moto-devices and really wanted one, this is definitly a no-go for me and defeats the purpose of android as a open(source)/linux os! i'm done with motorola, just ordered a galaxy s which is completely open!
i don't believe that motorola cares if 10.000 geeky people won't buy theire device because it's locked but it would nevertheless be good to show them that we care!
i'm curious what others think about that!

I think it's horse**** that they are locking it
I mean what's it to them if we can flash our phones??
Maybe they don't want their rom software to be leaked out? besides that I see no other reason for this

sp1kez said:
I think it's horse**** that they are locking it
I mean what's it to them if we can flash our phones??
Maybe they don't want their rom software to be leaked out? besides that I see no other reason for this
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that's my point. if i buy a piece of hardware, i should own it completely and do with it what i want! also one would think that motorola would (or at least could) appreciate a bunch of developers modding and patching their devices to make them more appealing to the community. i just installed cm6 (froyo) on my htc magic. it works better than ever, how cool is that! would not be possible with a locked bootloader...
example milestone: although no custom rom's can be booted (the bootloader boots only moto-signed kernels) the device can be rooted and so it should be no problem to get a rom-dump. so that can't be the reason...

I was ready to pull the trigger on the Droid X until I heard this. I hate it. You are right, we buy the phone we should own the phone. I still might buy this phone, a vote of confidence to the devs.
I want the large screen. There's nothing out there with as large a screen. The evo, but I've already been burned by that. Maybe if they swap the screen for a better one.

I'm just as angry at Motorola, but I'm still going to purchase a Droid X. It has everything I'm looking for in a phone hardware-wise, and I can't wait any longer to dump the dumbphone I've been using for years. I'm a huge fan of tweaking every piece of technology I have (e.g. hackintosh netbook just for kicks), but I'm going to stick it out with a one-year contract on the Droid X until a better phone comes along.
I've taken a look at the Galaxy S/Fascinate, but it looks far too much like an iPhone to appeal to me, rootable as it may be. Samsung's post-release support is also less than stellar. As closed as Motorola may be by using this bootloader, they are still providing 2.2 to the original Droid this summer, which is more than can be said of a /lot/ of manufacturers.

Yea I had it preordered and everything til I figured out they locked it down, guess they are okay with losing sales by turning unto an apple type company stupid
Sent from my Incredible using XDA App

Mikerrrrrrrr said:
...
I've taken a look at the Galaxy S/Fascinate, but it looks far too much like an iPhone to appeal to me, rootable as it may be. Samsung's post-release support is also less than stellar. As closed as Motorola may be by using this bootloader, they are still providing 2.2 to the original Droid this summer, which is more than can be said of a /lot/ of manufacturers.
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i agree. i don't like the iphony-look of the galaxy-s either and i feel like the droid X casing is much more stable. also the omap seemed more appealing to me than samsungs hummingbird. and so on ...
while i think it's a good thing that motorola supports their older devices with updates (at least they do with the droid) my point is/was that a open device enables the community to push the software further ahead. for instance: atm. i still have a htc magic. i just installed cm6 running froyo about a week ago. my device is running better and faster than ever. this would not be possible with a locked bootloader. i would be at the mercy of htc to supply me with an update "sometime in the future", quite frustrating ...
i just don't understand their reasons for this! if it's all just about warranty they could implement a "root and unlock" feature in the settings which would void your warranty e.g. by sending a request to a moto-server or something similar.
maybe it has something to do with drm-stuff as i also wondered that one can only use the (awesome) hdmi-out for self-made media ... kills >50% of the potential of the hdmi-out in my opinion.

jodue said:
i agree. i don't like the iphony-look of the galaxy-s either and i feel like the droid X casing is much more stable. also the omap seemed more appealing to me than samsungs hummingbird. and so on ...
while i think it's a good thing that motorola supports their older devices with updates (at least they do with the droid) my point is/was that a open device enables the community to push the software further ahead. for instance: atm. i still have a htc magic. i just installed cm6 running froyo about a week ago. my device is running better and faster than ever. this would not be possible with a locked bootloader. i would be at the mercy of htc to supply me with an update "sometime in the future", quite frustrating ...
i just don't understand their reasons for this! if it's all just about warranty they could implement a "root and unlock" feature in the settings which would void your warranty ...
maybe it has something to do with drm-stuff as i also wondered that one can only use the (awesome) hdmi-out for self-made media ... kills >50% of the potential of the hdmi-out in my opinion.
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I agree, but as it stands, I'm still going to get the phone and hoping out hope for root, although this link (http://www.mydroidworld.com/forums/...-locked-down-let-me-tell-you-what-i-know.html) has me worried about that too.

Mikerrrrrrrr said:
I agree, but as it stands, I'm still going to get the phone and hoping out hope for root, although this link (http://www.mydroidworld.com/forums/...-locked-down-let-me-tell-you-what-i-know.html) has me worried about that too.
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i hope the best for you mate. maybe it's not that bad and in 2 weeks we are laughing about motorola because some 14 years old hacker has already torn the bootloader apart

I am officially passing on the x droid2 and whatever else Motorola decides to release sorry but I would rather have an open galaxy s than a locked down droidx. IPhone like ui can be changed with a launcher. But their isn't much hope for a double locked bootloader

whoops... has root

Am I wrong to say that the Milestone is still stuck at the OS ver. that it was sold with? And if so, I hear that 2.2 is coming to the X by the end of the summer. I'm sure and exploit can be found in the update process, or hope so.

I'm going to switch to this, simply because I believe that the devs WILL find a way to get around this problem. This is XDA we're talking about, along with a bunch of other communities dedicated to this stuff. Someone will find a way to pull it off, it's just a matter of time. But I plan on having this phone for at least a year, so I have the patience for it.

jodue said:
while i think it's a good thing that motorola supports their older devices with updates (at least they do with the droid) my point is/was that a open device enables the community to push the software further ahead. for instance: atm. i still have a htc magic. i just installed cm6 running froyo about a week ago. my device is running better and faster than ever. this would not be possible with a locked bootloader. i would be at the mercy of htc to supply me with an update "sometime in the future", quite frustrating ...
i just don't understand their reasons for this! if it's all just about warranty they could implement a "root and unlock" feature in the settings which would void your warranty e.g. by sending a request to a moto-server or something similar.
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i think you explained 2 reasons for the lock down.
1 is warranty issues
2 is that motorolla can control the life of their product. if after 2 years they give updating the software then you'll be left in the dust and forced to upgrade if want new features.
it's like dlc for games. what used to be free by modding communities has now become a way to squeeze more money out of gamers.

I also agree with you on point 2. This phone is pretty powerful even for me. I consider myself a power user but dont really see how I need a faster phone that this.
This phone, If completely hacked, can have a very long lifespan.

this takes one moto dev
to be on the modder's side.
All this takes is one dev to mess with an official moto update, and this will be tossed due the massive amount of phones that are bricked.
total BS. Knowing Verizon, and why they were late jump on the android bandwagon(because they couldn't "control" an open source opertaing system), this probably came from Verizon pushing Moto to do this. Moto is so desperate to corner the market(unlike HTC) with Verizon, they said yes'maam. Sure no problem you are giving ungodly sums of money why cant we "scratch" your back.
bull****

Let's say that we DON'T unlock this phone.... Would anyone be surprised to see Motorola keep up to day within months of releases in the future???
I see people mentioning the reasoning for it being locked it to control the life of the device.... But seeing how powerful this is and how it is you could say Moto's Flagship model, wouldn't it be int their best interest to keep their customers happy????
Or does everything sell and do you really think they will fall behind on updates...??

Seriously if you really hate the device being locked this much work on an email. I will be shooting an email over to Motorola and Verizon Wireless Customer Support. I can post the email that I am sending on here if you guys want, when I finish typing it.
As for the device being locked it is extremely sad, but many hardware developers are starting to do this. The thinking is that the more they can control what the user does the better the end experience is. That is hardly the truth so just keep cracking the devices so that they get the message we want our own control on the device.
Other than that good luck to all the dev crews out there working to crack the device.

i second the email plan. if enough people fight for an open device, motorola will listen...

12yan said:
i second the email plan. if enough people fight for an open device, motorola will listen...
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Nope. Every single Droid and Droid X user could email Motorola and they wouldn't care unless it affected sales. The bottom line speaks the loudest. Hell, more than that, it's the ONLY line that speaks

To all those who complain about HTC

At least they never pulled this ****...
http://www.mobilecrunch.com/2010/07/14/droid-x-actually-self-destructs-if-you-try-to-mod-it/
http://www.mydroidworld.com/forums/...-locked-down-let-me-tell-you-what-i-know.html
Edit: As usual, the hype machine might have ran with this one and many (including myself) got sucked in. Likely not as bad as originally thought. Apparently these eFuse chips are in all omap3 devices (including the milestone and original droid) so they likely are not as scary as some fear, but with the hard line Motorola is taking with the DroidX, who knows for sure?
http://stevenbird.info/2010/07/15/droidx-today-is-the-day-more-security-info/
And who would have THOUGHT a techcrunch based site would be overly dramatic to drive traffic? lol

WOWWW... jaw dropping...

Haha HTC still on top.always knew Verizon is the cdma version of AT&T.I guess Motorola following crapple's footsteps.no wonder that evil red eye on the Droid x keep watching if u do something funny with ur device.lol
Thanx for posting
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App

Ahh, eFuse chips for hardware bricks....That sucks.
Really lame that they are doing everything possible to prevent rooting their phone/using ROM's. I guess I can't recommend a Motorola anymore.

Wow that's crazy... this kind of scares me. What if htc decides to follow in the footsteps of these manufacturers. Hopefully they remain just and fair. If u pay for the device, its ours. No longer does yur hand need to be involved.
Sent from my evo

xavier1022 said:
Wow that's crazy... this kind of scares me. What if htc decides to follow in the footsteps of these manufacturers. Hopefully they remain just and fair. If u pay for the device, its ours. No longer does yur hand need to be involved.
Sent from my evo
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I think HTC takes a different approach. Motorola is like Apple, HTC is like Google.
I'm sure HTC sees the benefit of a few people rooting their devices so they remain in the media, show how "cool" the phone can be and all the added features. Fewer still will take the plunge and root their phone. I wonder how many rooted EVO's there are, probably around 2-3% I would guess, if not less. Sure, HTC takes "token" steps to lock us out, but nothing that hasn't taken more than a few days to break into, and I think HTC knows that.
It's a good trade off that Motorola just doesn't understand, and I'm sure HTC's phones will continue to sell very well.
It could have been a stipulation from Verizon too...but I doubt it.

HOLY hell !! that's crazy !!

Thats brutal! i hope that HTC understands a similar move would KILL their handsets.
but i have a question. if it's a hardware security feature, whats to keep someone from simply desoldering the chip?

Heh,
between
w_ww.mobilecrunch.com/2010/07/14/nope-ios-4-1-doesnt-fix-the-death-grip-antenna-issue/
and this Apple's Fix:
discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2480165&tstart=0
Things looking up and up for htc / sprint!
sorry for the link -- cant post it, "new users are not permitted to post outside links..." hey mods, fix this please?

SilverStone641 said:
Thats brutal! i hope that HTC understands a similar move would KILL their handsets.
but i have a question. if it's a hardware security feature, whats to keep someone from simply desoldering the chip?
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My understanding is that the chip also holds the firmware, or part of it, so desoldering the chip would brick the phone. It may be possible to desolder the chip and replace it with a new one and copy over the firmware information. But how many would be able to do this? Very very few..probably only a handful.

Sirchuk said:
My understanding is that the chip also holds the firmware, or part of it, so desoldering the chip would brick the phone. It may be possible to desolder the chip and replace it with a new one and copy over the firmware information. But how many would be able to do this? Very very few..probably only a handful.
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Imagine how much you could fetch on ebay for one though.....*drool*

I might be mistaken about this, but doesn't the original Droid have an unlocked bootloader? I mean, from what I hear, it's regarded as the original developer phone, and I can't see it gaining that title with a locked bootloader AND eFuse.

Mecha2142 said:
I might be mistaken about this, but doesn't the original Droid have an unlocked bootloader? I mean, from what I hear, it's regarded as the original developer phone, and I can't see it gaining that title with a locked bootloader AND eFuse.
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The original droid had unlocked bootloader cuz of moto's business dealings with google at the time, which was out of the norm for them. Apparently this efuse chip was in the droid, milestone, and droidx and does the the advertised capability to brick your phone, it just isn't being utilized by motorola apparently. or thats what I've gathered so far.

Sirchuk said:
I think HTC takes a different approach. Motorola is like Apple, HTC is like Google.
I'm sure HTC sees the benefit of a few people rooting their devices so they remain in the media, show how "cool" the phone can be and all the added features. Fewer still will take the plunge and root their phone. I wonder how many rooted EVO's there are, probably around 2-3% I would guess, if not less. Sure, HTC takes "token" steps to lock us out, but nothing that hasn't taken more than a few days to break into, and I think HTC knows that.
It's a good trade off that Motorola just doesn't understand, and I'm sure HTC's phones will continue to sell very well.
It could have been a stipulation from Verizon too...but I doubt it.
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i agree htc is like google but im going to go a step further amd say they "want" to let us customize it as much as possible. what i think is that HTC, to keep their sales ranks, tries to comply with cell companies because, from what i understand, they are the ones that dont want us rooting mainly because of the wifi situation. im guessing also because of the bricking going on by novices lol
what moto is doing with the droid x is just wrong. intentionally bricking a device for a owner trying to customize is pure sabotage! if this happens i dont doubt theyll know the owner tinkered with it and not honor a replacement. that just sucks

Locked bootloaders...a new trend?

I read that the new Motorola Droid X and Droid 2 will have digitally signed bootloaders. Which means that only approved Motorola ROMS can be flashed. I wonder how long it will be before HTC and everyone else starts doing this? This could put an end to all of our fun! Of course the cellular providers will save a lot of money if they don't have to replace all of those bricked phones. It will be interesting to see what happens to the bootloader in future OTA and Froyo updates for the DInc...

this belongs in general

Lexus One said:
This could put an end to all of our fun!
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It will always be a cat and mouse game. Rarely ever ends. We always find another way around.

We should as a community all patition the cell phone companys for a truely open handset.

acezhi said:
We should as a community all patition the cell phone companys for a truely open handset.
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Petitioning? What are you some kind of tree loving hippie? JK That **** never works though. Petitions, protesting, etc is for idiots who think it will accomplish something.
They are even stupider for locking these down. Sure people mess up phones trying to mod them. Now they are making ways for you to totally brick your phone. Don't they think more people will now make insurance claims even more if you try to mod your phone and mess it up.

Moved as not development.

reagianicparable said:
It will always be a cat and mouse game. Rarely ever ends. We always find another way around.
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Possibly. But it takes a hell of a lot longer when you're up against encryption. You usually only win this battle if someone on the inside leaks the key. And by then there are new phones coming out and this keeps getting lower and lower on the priority list. Personally, I don't think we can win the encryption battle...

its not a new thing its a motorola thing... htc likes to give its buyers what they like.. and since we all like it a little different I dont see them locking their bootloader anytime soon... they made the nexus one which is the only true open source phone so far but they messed up on the marketing of it... all 3 phones you mention are motorola and the only htc phone I see with any kind of restriction would be the HTC aria on ATT cause you can't install 3rd party apps but that is due to ATT not HTC restrictions

two_cents said:
its not a new thing its a motorola thing... htc likes to give its buyers what they like.. and since we all like it a little different I dont see them locking their bootloader anytime soon... they made the nexus one which is the only true open source phone so far but they messed up on the marketing of it... all 3 phones you mention are motorola and the only htc phone I see with any kind of restriction would be the HTC aria on ATT cause you can't install 3rd party apps but that is due to ATT not HTC restrictions
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Granted, HTC *may* never lock their bootloader, but what is to stop Verizon from demanding it? Verizon is permitting it in the Motorola. What if this turns out to be a profit maximizer for them? Could HTC next? Time will tell...

I don't see locking up phones as a way to "make money" if anything it will alienate your customer/developer base and no one will buy the phones with the locked bootloaders. Especially if HTC doesn't trend up and continues to be a nice company. Motorola has already LOST A LOT of preorders on there Droid X because of the encrypted bootloader. Doesn't matter...they can't seem to keep them in stock anyway. Good riddens to a WAY to large handset with a crappy UI overlay.

What it boils down to is PROFIT. Verizon will weigh the revenues and decide with their pocketbooks. It doesn't make any difference whether HTC likes it or not. Verizon calls the shots. If HTC says no, they're gone. Samsung or LG or someone else will pick up the slack. As for losing customers, it doesn't matter. Money is what matters. Just ask any of our greed driven cellular companies if you don't believe me. Personally, I don't think there are that many people who re-flash their ROMS and would care if the bootloader is locked or not. I think we are a very small percentage of the total.

Honestly77 said:
I don't see locking up phones as a way to "make money" if anything it will alienate your customer/developer base and no one will buy the phones with the locked bootloaders. Especially if HTC doesn't trend up and continues to be a nice company. Motorola has already LOST A LOT of preorders on there Droid X because of the encrypted bootloader. Doesn't matter...they can't seem to keep them in stock anyway. Good riddens to a WAY to large handset with a crappy UI overlay.
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I think you may be overestimating the percentage of android users who are interested in rooting their phones. Motorola will make a tiny bit less money on phone sales, but they will also lose less money on unnecessary replacements.

TNS201 said:
Petitioning? What are you some kind of tree loving hippie? JK That **** never works though. Petitions, protesting, etc is for idiots who think it will accomplish something.
They are even stupider for locking these down. Sure people mess up phones trying to mod them. Now they are making ways for you to totally brick your phone. Don't they think more people will now make insurance claims even more if you try to mod your phone and mess it up.
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Just adding to it. Not saying petitioning and protesting would work, but:
Petitioning and protesting only work through fear. When it's you > the company, then the company will give in. If we have 20 thousand people say that we want truly open handsets, they still won't, because they know theres another hundred thousand that will still buy it. If they fear that if having a locked handset will make them no sales unless they give in, then they will.

Motorola tried leaving it unlocked with the Driod, but then, for whatever reasons, they locked the bootloader in the X. Why do you suppose Motorola would do this? Do they have incompetent marketing people? Remember they have the numbers...we don't. So we can only guess as to why they chose the way they did. Perhaps Verizon had something to do with it? I can't wait to see what they do to the bootloader in the next OTA for the DI.

Asterdroid said:
I think you may be overestimating the percentage of android users who are interested in rooting their phones. Motorola will make a tiny bit less money on phone sales, but they will also lose less money on unnecessary replacements.
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I agree with the notion that the vast majority of android users are not interested in rooting their phones; however, i think that the frequency with which carriers replace phones bricked due to customization is overestimated. I mean I have flashed customs ROMs, radios, recovery images, etc. onto my N1 and my DI dozens upon dozens of times and never run into a problem that couldn't be fixed with a battery pull and a restore (at the most). In contrast, I bricked three iphone 3GS's in six months while attempting to customize them. Obviously, apple is notorious for locking their **** down, so I am not convinced that the notion that verizon will have to replace fewer X's than, say, DI's holds water

Motorola Milestone 2?

How long do you think it will take until a Motorola Milestone 2 releases?
I'm pretty envious of you Americans getting this phone. It won't work on any network here in Canada.

i think in september

I have been waiting for a Milestone replacement for aaages! Would love to see the GSM version of the Droid 2.
...boo CDMA and EVDO....3.5G ftw!

I'm wait that too.....
GSM version Milestone 2......
rush 2 me plz..............

There is not going to be a milestone 2 but there is going to be a droid pro.
EDIT- Never mind the milestone 2 has been leaked.......http://erictric.com/2010/08/31/offi...ne-2-promotional-video-accidentally-released/

Motoblur???
I freaking hope that the rumor that I saw today is wrong about the milestone 2 having motoblur! I'm waiting for this phone to come out to replace my hero but I will not buy it if it as motoblur on it!

Kukussi said:
I freaking hope that the rumor that I saw today is wrong about the milestone 2 having motoblur! I'm waiting for this phone to come out to replace my hero but I will not buy it if it as motoblur on it!
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I don't think it's a rumor, it is in the official press release :/
But hey, is motoblur that bad ? I don't really know what it changes except the Home (that we can change with ease).

Please tell me it'll be able to flash roms! If so il consider retiring the n1... I can't believe theirs already so many new phones! Android ftw!
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

Leimi said:
I don't think it's a rumor, it is in the official press release :/
But hey, is motoblur that bad ? I don't really know what it changes except the Home (that we can change with ease).
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there's alot of account integration that i'm not pleased with. i thought android handled that on its own just fine. i don't like this hand-holding that motorola developed. i feel like they've added steps to the same process that already existed.

640k said:
there's alot of account integration that i'm not pleased with. i thought android handled that on its own just fine. i don't like this hand-holding that motorola developed. i feel like they've added steps to the same process that already existed.
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well moto took certain options out i guess to make it easier for the retards who buy smartphones and don't have any idea how to use them and also they apparently assume that everyone who owns a smartphone is a social networking freak.
If I ran moto Id release certain phones with Vanilla Android and others with Blur. So that way certain phones can be marketed to the 12 year olds all over myspace and facebook all day long, and others towards more grown up people who dont let other peoples status's run their lives.

jerseyh22accord said:
well moto took certain options out i guess to make it easier for the retards who buy smartphones and don't have any idea how to use them and also they apparently assume that everyone who owns a smartphone is a social networking freak.
If I ran moto Id release certain phones with Vanilla Android and others with Blur. So that way certain phones can be marketed to the 12 year olds all over myspace and facebook all day long, and others towards more grown up people who dont let other peoples status's run their lives.
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Phones should be more like PCs. The vanilla OS should only exist in ROM, while all of the extras exist in RAM. A recovery file could exist in ROM that would format and overwrite RAM (read: NOT SD) so that the device could be brought back to stock with a factory restore. That way, we can choose to uninstall the garbage we don't want and regular consumers still retain store-bought functionality.

True and I agree on the vanilla + blur sales combo... But some ppl advertise on fb, ms, or twitter (club promoters, music industry, anything else self published, etc). some ppl use it as work... some ppl have lots of friends and are interested in what their doing... motorola has to market for everyone. But I guess that's why you don't run motorola
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

ChongoDroid said:
True and I agree on the vanilla + blur sales combo... But some ppl advertise on fb, ms, or twitter (club promoters, music industry, anything else self published, etc). some ppl use it as work... some ppl have lots of friends and are interested in what their doing... motorola has to market for everyone. But I guess that's why you don't run motorola
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
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i'm not reading what you're getting at. It's all about the underlying OS. When you purchase a PC from manufacturers like Dell and HP, you get bloat-ware OSes that have had advertisers comission space in, in order to keep PC pricing down. I'm sure the same is happening with phones. Everyone has a little share in the market, and they don't want to let that go. Each manufacturer is trying to identify themselves from the rest of the crowd.
If every Android phone was exactly the same, except for the hardware specs, how would the average consumer decide on which phone to buy? Word of mouth? That only goes so far, so you're stuck with some sort of solution.
HTC uses Sense...
Moto uses Blur...
It's all used to differentiate themselves from the crowd. I say, let them do it, but find a better way of doing so. Memory is so cheap these days, why can't they just build the phones so that advanced technophiles can separate out the junk, while Joe Schmoe just runs the device as is.
If time and money to script the logic is a driving factor, maybe manufacturers need to re-assess their market.

Shame Motorola, shame!

Maybe Motorola should learn a thing or two from its competitors. I am this close to losing faith in this phone.
http://pulsene.ws/15Zld
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App

So they release the source code to kernels for phones that are over a year old?

LancerV said:
So they release the source code to kernels for phones that are over a year old?
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The Incredible S is not.

LancerV said:
So they release the source code to kernels for phones that are over a year old?
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ha,ha good one

The Incredible S is a new model.

HTC's always been on the up-and-up regarding GPL and posting source code. It doesn't surprise me that Moto has taken a completely opposite stance regarding openness.

agentdr8 said:
HTC's always been on the up-and-up regarding GPL and posting source code. It doesn't surprise me that Moto has taken a completely opposite stance regarding openness.
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I think Motorola takes that stance to make themselves more appealing to the carriers.
If you really think about it, the more "open" carriers like T-Mo and Sprint don't really have any Moto devices.
EDIT: minus the Cliq and Charm, but those are low end.

Not to argue but, Samsung's Galaxy series was on all carriers and could be heavily modded. Not to mention that Samsung included unlock codes in the phone itself for one of their models.
HTC Inspire, Nexus One, Desire/HD/Z, etc were on major carriers.
My guess is that Moto doesn't have the manpower/balls to deal with warranty support for people who brick their phone by rooting. Or they just don't care.

i.mac said:
My guess is that Moto doesn't have the manpower/balls to deal with warranty support for people who brick their phone by rooting. Or they just don't care.
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this should be a non issue. You root the phone, or otherwise modify beyond manufacturer intentions, you void the warranty. case closed.

cegna09 said:
this should be a non issue. You root the phone, or otherwise modify beyond manufacturer intentions, you void the warranty. case closed.
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But people who don't fully understand rooting or the consequences of rooting would contact the manufacturer for a warranty repair/replacements.

i.mac said:
But people who don't fully understand rooting or the consequences of rooting would contact the manufacturer for a warranty repair/replacements.
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and the answer would be the same. That is how it works. If you were dumb enough to try something without fully understanding the consequences if it went wrong, too bad. you should always educate yourself on a topic before delving into it blindly.

i.mac said:
Not to argue but, Samsung's Galaxy series was on all carriers and could be heavily modded. Not to mention that Samsung included unlock codes in the phone itself for one of their models.
HTC Inspire, Nexus One, Desire/HD/Z, etc were on major carriers.
My guess is that Moto doesn't have the manpower/balls to deal with warranty support for people who brick their phone by rooting. Or they just don't care.
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You make a good point but the Galaxy series has only one variant on Verizon and AT&T, whereas, it is making multiple appearances elsewhere.
**This is only referring to Android devices (phones)
Look at Motorola's lineup on Verizon - Droid, D2, DX, Droid Pro, Citrus.....then look at AT&T - Backflip, Flipside, Bravo, Flipout, Atrix.
Now look at Samsung - Verizon: Fascinate and Continuum / AT&T: Captivate
That's 10 - 3 (not including tablets)
Then you can throw in HTC - Verizon: Incredible and Thunderbolt (even though HTC tried to lock down the TB) and AT&T: Inspire and Aria
That's still 10 - 7 in Motorola's favor. (You can't include the N1 because AT&T refused to carry it in their lineup, even so, Motorola still gets the nod)

I definitely do get your point of view. And you bring up a great point that carriers that want to milk you out of your money do like Motorola devices. I wonder though if this is to please the carrier or save there warranty/repair costs. If they do do it to cut costs/risks it directly benefits the carriers. So it works in their advantage both ways.
But, like what happened with Netflix's unwillingness to come to Android, Motorola's steps might pay off. And a lot of people got upset with Netflix's decision and wanted manufactures/carriers to do something about it.
Do we as users just expect too much?

i.mac said:
I definitely do get your point of view. And you bring up a great point that carriers that want to milk you out of your money do like Motorola devices. I wonder though if this is to please the carrier or save there warranty/repair costs. If they do do it to cut costs/risks it directly benefits the carriers. So it works in their advantage both ways.
But, like what happened with Netflix's unwillingness to come to Android, Motorola's steps might pay off. And a lot of people got upset with Netflix's decision and wanted manufactures/carriers to do something about it.
Do we as users just expect too much?
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Just as cegna09 said, if you damage your phone through rooting/modding, you void the warranty so it would only seem that they do it to appeal to the carriers.

It seems HTC is jumping on the bandwagon as well.
http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/24/htc-locks-down-incredible-s-against-custom-roms-too-starts-a-fi/
I see a strategy here. Motorola, and now HTC, seem to be making their phones harder to crack and more difficult to mod. What this tells me is that they are trying to reduce the dev community down to just the hardcore players in an attempt to improve their profit margins. How? Well, if you can't update the phone yourself through something like flashing a custom rom or add your own features then they will have more control over the choice selection in their phones. One example would be the Atrix itself, while it has the hardware Moto could restrict the software and then in the future they could release a phone with the software but not the hardware. Does anyone ever ask themselves why can one phone have a certain feature and not another one?
This is what's going to happen people. Get used to it. We are in the hands of the worst kinds of people - "Big Cellular"

Edit: same info as above

A part of me wants to just a get a Nexus S and be done with. I may.
Their development threads are flooded. I know our might pick up, but it'll never be the same.

Why doesn't doesn't the same thing apply to our phone as did with the iphone, why aren't were covered under the DMCA? Iphone users can freely mod/jailbreak their handsets because of this and not only that apply has to still cover them under warenty. How is this any different?
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App

drock212 said:
Why doesn't doesn't the same thing apply to our phone as did with the iphone, why aren't were covered under the DMCA? Iphone users can freely mod/jailbreak their handsets because of this and not only that apply has to still cover them under warenty. How is this any different?
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App
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If Apple can prove your device was jailbroken then it voids your warranty. It is in their License Agreement.

live4nyy said:
If Apple can prove your device was jailbroken then it voids your warranty. It is in their License Agreement.
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Only until you don't restore.