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Eric Schmidt's words concerning why the Nexus One was created and how we dont need number Two.
Initially, Google felt that they needed to build a device to help Android along so they worked with HTC to create the Nexus One handset. Schmidt says: “The idea a year and a half ago was to do the Nexus One to try to move the phone platform hardware business forward. It clearly did. It was so successful, we didn't have to do a second one. We would view that as positive but people criticised us heavily for that. I called up the board and said: 'Ok, it worked. Congratulations - we're stopping'. We like that flexibility, we think that flexibility is characteristic of nimbleness at our scale."
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technolo...-Schmidt-You-can-trust-us-with-your-data.html
Heh, google is the inverse of apple
...I would like a Nexus Two though?
What about a 1280x720 4" IPS screen, sub-10mm thickness, aluminum/carbon fiber construction, HDMI port, front-facing camera, Tegra 2 SoC, battery life that is amazing, and capacitive touch buttons that are actually silk screened right?
And of course, a unicorn detector
oh well, there's the answer to that. now we all just wait for the next developer phone, whoever google decides to use. let's hope HTC again or maybe motorola.
i would like to see SE get into the game and develop a phone that is 100% backed up by Google. they make good phones.
I thought the title was a joke. lol
Wow, damage control ahoy.
arcticreaver said:
i would like to see SE get into the game and develop a phone that is 100% backed up by Google. they make good phones.
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+1 on this. SE really dropped the ball when they attacked the smartphone market. The W series phones were cutting edge in terms of being music centric. The K series were really good too, my K750i has the best 2 megapixel sensor of any camera. The K850i was a real stormer of a phone too.
I don't know what happened in SE HQ when they moved onto touchscreen phones and the like. They were ahead of the curve back in the day but maybe their UI let them down?
Samsung are another company who made good hardware but ****ed it up with their clunky software.
I'm not sure how these guys turn the ship around but HTC came from nowhere and are one of the biggest mobile phone manufacturers about now. Surely SE and Samsung can make a cracking phone again and win some of the market share back.
Another issue might be locking down access to root or bastardising Android with a clunky shell. HTC avoided that with a pretty nice UI in Sense.
britoso said:
Heh, google is the inverse of apple
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That's why I love em.
Knew it and have been saying it all along.
The Nexus One was never supposed to outsell any other phone or become an income source for Google. It was meant to drive the Android OS and the hardware platform and as Schmitty says, it "clearly worked".
Android market share has rocketed and continues to do so and even today, 7 months later from intro, new Android phones are STILL catching up to the specs of the Nexus One.
markouk said:
+1 on this. SE really dropped the ball when they attacked the smartphone market. The W series phones were cutting edge in terms of being music centric. The K series were really good too, my K750i has the best 2 megapixel sensor of any camera. The K850i was a real stormer of a phone too.
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I don't know about you, but that's what I dislike about SE. Why couldn't they just combine the best walkman and camera in one phone? Instead, they made two phones out of almost the same hardware and charge a high price for each of them...
RogerPodacter said:
oh well, there's the answer to that. now we all just wait for the next developer phone, whoever google decides to use. let's hope HTC again or maybe motorola.
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Hey Roger, do you mean the next developer phone that's not under a carriers control and gets updates ota directly from Google?
I guess I am kinda confused since I assumed Google is never gonna dip their hand in the smartphone market again besides supplying android.
Namuna said:
The Nexus One was never supposed to outsell any other phone or become an income source for Google. It was meant to drive the Android OS and the hardware platform and as Schmitty says, it "clearly worked".
Android market share has rocketed and continues to do so and even today, 7 months later from intro, new Android phones are STILL catching up to the specs of the Nexus One.
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Amen!
I love the N1, and can't wait for a future device done the same way (without any branding). I seriously hope HTC is the manufacturer. Can't see myself using a phone not made by them.
ap3604 said:
Hey Roger, do you mean the next developer phone that's not under a carriers control and gets updates ota directly from Google?
I guess I am kinda confused since I assumed Google is never gonna dip their hand in the smartphone market again besides supplying android.
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Since android's beginning, there has always been Google's developer phone, the one that Google uses to write the android OS on. First was the g1, now its nexus. It will always be a vanilla android version, not HTC sense or MOTOblur or whatever. Perhaps the next one will be sold thru a carrier, but I think they will ensure it can be purchased unlocked too. We don't know, this is new territory, and The nexus kinda set the standard. So I'm anticipating Google will make sure the next phone can be had without the carrier influence as well.
I actually don't think there should be a Nexus 2 from Google. They should just stick to what they do best and make great software. I don't think selling physical products is their thing and the Nexus One has served it's purpose of demonstrating the potential of Android.
Hopefully the plan is to dramatically improve the UI with Gingerbread and convince manufacturers like HTC and Motorola to run vanilla Android. They can release new versions of Android and leave it up to the manufacturers to deliver the updates.
I'm done with SE, myself. I followed them for a little while with a P990i, then Xperia X1 and was going to get an X10... but glad I got a Nexus One instead.
High-priced pieces of trash, they are. I know the X1 was HTC built and rebranded, but WinMo was so laggy on it and SE slapped an $800 price tag on it. Enough to wake you up.
So there won't be a N1 successor ??
adamwjohnson5 said:
I actually don't think there should be a Nexus 2 from Google. They should just stick to what they do best and make great software. I don't think selling physical products is their thing and the Nexus One has served it's purpose of demonstrating the potential of Android.
Hopefully the plan is to dramatically improve the UI with Gingerbread and convince manufacturers like HTC and Motorola to run vanilla Android. They can release new versions of Android and leave it up to the manufacturers to deliver the updates.
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Sure is nice having Google dictate what goes on the phone and not T-Mobile or AT&T or whoever. I think I'd opt for a slightly weaker phone over one with Sense UI and branding all over it.
I guess I'll be buying whichever dev phone is popular at the time, or making damn sure the phone has Cyanogen et al behind it and that it is vanilla.
No N2?!? Oh come on! It's not like they have to do much. Just make it a 4" screen, swap in a better 3D co-processor, slap a real keyboard on it and call it a day. I'd buy that off-contract any day!
I would agree that the N1 put android on the map, at the centre. They have multiple partners now SPAMMING rediculously good phones for android, the consumers know about it and WANT it, theyve done their task. Let them get back to making the OS orgasmic, and let HTC etc make phones that can vibrate
Like a guy said eariler this is whats called damage control. The N1 didn't start anything with Android OS, it was the Droid that did that. The N1 is a tiny blip on the radar of Android sales. The N1 failed and this is an arrogant look at the N1. The fact of the matter is HTC was planning 1ghz phones regardless of the N1 existance or not, remeber that phone list that was leaked last year of all the phones coming out this year? I love my N1 but lets face it google dropped the ball on it.
1. restrictions on the subdizing
2. restrictions on the type of plan
3. No dummy phones for TMO stores
IMO if they would have stuck the N1 in stores made it easy like Droid, Samsung Vibrant, and EVO, then N1 at the time would have been a mega hit. It was the first phone (that I can remember) with a ghz processor ppl would have went nuts for it because of the speed and its a really sexy looking phone.
Samsung should take notes from Motorola.
The Droid 2 is breaking records in sales, mostly due to
marketing the Android 2.2 software and UI. Samsung has to hurry and get Froyo to the masses of Galaxy S owners and sell the hell out of it.
They have to keep up with the Jonses in order to sell these phones.
I think T-Mobile should step in and push this with their partners and have a huge re-launch of the phone. The vibrant is a great phone It just needs better marketing and cutting edge UI.
What do you think?
That's why it's called Samsung and T-mobile.
I'm thinking Samsung will announce something at IFA, which starts September 2nd. Their twitter keeps saying they're making a lot of big announcements. I'm hoping to get a definitive date for froyo then or at very least, the GPS fix.
Yeah I definetly agree with you. These Galaxy S phones have the hardware, but not the killer software to match it.
I was set on buying an iPhone, because I had no clue a phone like this even existed on my network.
But Samsung is by no means stupid and have been making some really indicative suggestions that we will be seeing some big changes in software in the next couple of months.
I'm more than sure that we will get Froyo, GPS fixes, and more by the end of September.
WHAT?!?!
FIRST:
the X doesn't have froyo. They have a leaked version with piss poor benchmarks.
SECOND:
the galaxy is always having a commercial on tv.
Their also selling very well.
He's referring to the "Droid 2", not the "Droid X."
I think that us techno gadget geeks here on xda certainly care about Froyo. But out of all the people I know that are in the market for a new smart phone, or actually have android phones, they don't care about froyo, or even really know what that is if you mentioned it. I think the masses care about getting on facebook and taking a picture with their phone, etc... I think the silly things like having avatar on it are a bigger selling point to the masses compared to which version of android it has on it.
jeremiah_mn said:
I think that us techno gadget geeks here on xda certainly care about Froyo. But out of all the people I know that are in the market for a new smart phone, or actually have android phones, they don't care about froyo, or even really know what that is if you mentioned it. I think the masses care about getting on facebook and taking a picture with their phone, etc... I think the silly things like having avatar on it are a bigger selling point to the masses compared to which version of android it has on it.
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i'm lost, you want to put food on your phone and that is supposed to be a selling point...
People don't even know what android is. They go around asking if that's the droid phone. I'm sure they aren't aware of different versions of software or why it matters.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
disturkis4u said:
People don't even know what android is. They go around asking if that's the droid phone. I'm sure they aren't aware of different versions of software or why it matters.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
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Lol. I get that all the time, I switched from the iphone 4 to the vibrant and everyone of my friends calls it a droid. Verizon spent alot of money on marketing, but i guess any "droid" exposure is good.
Yeah + let's not forget motorola's other phones sitting on 1.5 with blur...even the behold 2 got 1.6 lol nothing to strive for
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
LOL get the same thing.
Google was probably so pissed Motorola.
jeremiah_mn said:
I think that us techno gadget geeks here on xda certainly care about Froyo. But out of all the people I know that are in the market for a new smart phone, or actually have android phones, they don't care about froyo, or even really know what that is if you mentioned it. I think the masses care about getting on facebook and taking a picture with their phone, etc... I think the silly things like having avatar on it are a bigger selling point to the masses compared to which version of android it has on it.
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I agree, I think that most people want to hear "it's like an iphone" not "it's running android 2.2 with a 1ghz blah blah blah...."
Sent from my Vibrant using XDA app
dabezt1 said:
Lol. I get that all the time, I switched from the iphone 4 to the vibrant and everyone of my friends calls it a droid. Verizon spent alot of money on marketing, but i guess any "droid" exposure is good.
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Ha. Same here. People at work ask me questions about my "droid phone". My co-worker said she almost bought a droid the other day. I asked her which one and she said, "you know, the droid phone," as if there's only one. I've explained to them before what android is but it clearly doesn't sink in. I think its safe to say most people that aren't tech nerds are clueless. Even my iphone sporting friends don't know what Android is.
Pretty much they only care can about the surface stuff really. My brother in law has a news girlfriend who had a hero and didn't even know about the market on it at all. She didn't even know it was android.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Yea I will have to agree that the mainstream consumer isn't going to know what version of android they're running/if they have an android phone/care about updates. All they're going to see is the big screen and avatar on the vibrant and want to buy it. The tmobile store demos has a little sign listing the specs like 1ghz processor but a good mass of people won't have a clue what that even means.
Hopefully froyo comes in September because I decided to not go the rooting route this time and just patiently wait it out. I would be annoyed if they waited until the fascinate came out to release froyo.
Where do you see the Droid 2 is breaking sales records? Have you seen the numbers for Galaxy S phones? They expect to sell 10 MILLION over the next 12 months. That's more than iPhone 4 by itself. Samsung has got the Galaxy S on pretty much every provider in every country, I would have to call that pretty damned good marketing. The fact that a few hundred or every a few thousand people are chomping at the bit for Froyo doesn't even begin to move the needle enough for them to even care. The fact that they are moving forward and will be pushing updates and Froyo soon enough means that all the gearheads like us will be recommending the phone to everyone we know.
Missing the boat? I beg to differ, I would say they built the damned boat this year and are fully in charge of its direction.
I really don't understand how the OP says that Samsung is missing the boat with Froyo. They already announced that it will be released in the early part of Sep. A few extra weeks won't KILL YOU!
backslide311 said:
I really don't understand how the OP says that Samsung is missing the boat with Froyo. They already announced that it will be released in the early part of Sep. A few extra weeks won't KILL YOU!
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No, it won't kill us, but it will make me think about getting another Samsung.
If Samsung wants to add TouchWiz on their phones, then they should be prepared to react quickly when a new OS upgrade arrives. They've certainly had enough time before the Froyo original announcement.
The fact that they are lagging behind with what is supposed to be their flagship device, makes me nervous about how long it will take for the upgrade to OS 3.0, which will be a much more significant upgrade.
MacGuy2006 said:
No, it won't kill us, but it will make me think about getting another Samsung.
If Samsung wants to add TouchWiz on their phones, then they should be prepared to react quickly when a new OS upgrade arrives. They've certainly had enough time before the Froyo original announcement.
The fact that they are lagging behind with what is supposed to be their flagship device, makes me nervous about how long it will take for the upgrade to OS 3.0, which will be a much more significant upgrade.
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What makes you think they will ever upgrade the galaxy s lineup to 3.0?
I'm a proud Vibrant owner, rooted with Nero 4.1 & Voodo. I have a 16gb external SD card filled with personal files, music, and movies. I purchased my Vibrant for a little over $450 at T-Mobile and spent exrta money on a 16gb SD card, and a protective cover.
Today (01/14/2010), I can go to Best Buy and use a special 'Buy Back' program and they will give me $165 for my Vibrant on a in-store gift card. I can then turn around and purchase a Nexus S with it.
Nexus S is $529.99 - $165.00 = $364.99 + %8.29 (Sales Tax) = $395.10
Knowing how close the Nexus S is to the Vibrant, would you shell out 400 clams for the 'Pure Google Experience'? Whats your take? I have an idea, but why should I buy something that my rooted Vibrant can do except a FFC?? Opinions?
The Nexus S doesn't even have an external SD slot.
Yes you getting google updates but you are missing the sd slot. Thats a total buzzkill for me.
Im just going to continue supporting the dev's here at xda and maybe be brave and install the ffc.
not unless the money was burning a hole in my pocket
they're practically the same phone. not worth it imo
At the time I bought the Vibrant the only real difference between it and others in its class was the up to 48 gigs of storage (16 internal, up to 32 external). Save your money you have a great phone, thanks in large part to the devs here. We'll have Gingerbread soon.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
Absolutely not.
You're basically getting 30% of the total value of the phone. The vibrant, even without the updates, is still worth more then $165.
The nexus S is definitely worth $400, but if your giving up a device thats worth more then $165 to get the $400 price tag, nuh uh. Don't do it. Not worth it at all.
you could get more $$ in here in the marketplace....a then use that money to buy any other phone you want...
Not at all. It just doesn't feel like the additions to the S make it any better than a rooted Vibrant especially with the loss of the SD slot.
Never, don't ever purchase anything made by samsung, even if the software is controlled by google, the answer is no no no no no!
Let google learn a lesson too, maybe in the future they will choose another hardware manufacturor.
SamsungVibrant said:
Never, don't ever purchase anything made by samsung, even if the software is controlled by google, the answer is no no no no no!
Let google learn a lesson too, maybe in the future they will choose another hardware manufacturor.
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I agree with everyone about the bad marketing decisions Samsung is taking. Which explains how every Galaxy S series phones throughout the world received Froyo except for the 4 sim-lock carriers in the US.
-but-
Respectfully, I disagree with you about the Nexus S. Even though the hardware is from Samsung (which NO other phone out there can beat the Super AMOLED screen). Google has already sent an update to the Nexus S to 2.3.1. Owning a Google phone like the Nexus S is guaranteeing Android updates.
the nexus s is already outdated
wait for more dual core 4g phones coming out this quarter
No. My next phone will have a dual core processor.
lolcopter said:
the nexus s is already outdated
wait for more dual core 4g phones coming out this quarter
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DITTO on that! Except I heard that dual core is a drain on the battery. We don't have battery technology as of yet to give a substantial user experience to last as long as what superphones do now.
Stick with your Vibrant or sell it on Craigslist or Ebay or something, but getting $165 for it is a complete rip-off.
lolcopter said:
the nexus s is already outdated
wait for more dual core 4g phones coming out this quarter
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have fun with manufacturer based skin and late OTAs (or OTAs not even happening)
.. your phone may not have the latest hardware specs, but it will always have the latest android version
its a matter of compromising latest hardware vs latest software
zephiK said:
have fun with manufacturer based skin and late OTAs (or OTAs not even happening)
.. your phone may not have the latest hardware specs, but it will always have the latest android version
its a matter of compromising latest hardware vs latest software
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can the nexus s even record HD video?
life won't end if you're not running the absolute latest OS. besides, that's what XDA is for... NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT GPS
in the end, the technology advances so quickly, no matter what you buy you will have buyer's remorse within six months. phones are evolving at a faster pace right now than PCs did a few years back
lolcopter said:
can the nexus s even record HD video?
life won't end if you're not running the absolute latest OS. besides, that's what XDA is for... NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT GPS
in the end, the technology advances so quickly, no matter what you buy you will have buyer's remorse within six months. phones are evolving at a faster pace right now than PCs did a few years back
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it doesnt matter if rooted ROMs are available, what matters is that Samsung isn't open sourcing the kernel for 2.2.
Open sourced kernels allows development to move even further. OC'd kernels for the Vibrant are based off the I9000 kernel, which results into poor battery life.
Also, all ROMs built for the Vibrant are pretty much using the base of TouchWiz. Now im not complaining about TouchWiz, I do like a lot of the aspects from it. The Power Widget on the notification bar was a great start; but the fact is that Samsung is not reliable when it comes to software updates. The one plus with TouchWiz is the video codecs.
The Nexus S is a unlocked bootloader from the very beginning with easy commands to unlock and lock it. It is made in mind that its a device primarily made to be hacked with. It is backed by Google.
Not to mention.. the Nexus S at this point has more love from CyanogenMod than the Vibrant. The Vibrant and Galaxy S series dev community is too split between each other. The Nexus S is the same in the UK and USA, therefore.. it allows further collaboration with each other.
In the end, it really depends what you want. What can you fight against? hardware or software? Since most of us are tight on cash, im sure a lot of us would lean towards software. In this case, the Nexus series would be the winner since it is backed by Google (or any device that is supported by CyanogenMod).
And dont even start with HD recording.. OH MY! we all have to realize that a phone has its limitations. If you're looking to take pictures or do a lot of video recording, just do yourself a favor and get a dedicated camera.... not to mention with TouchWiz, have fun taking HD recording for a long period of time... when it hits the 15% mark, have fun recording or taking pictures buddy
life won't end if you're not running the absolute latest OS. besides, that's what XDA is for... NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT GPS
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Oh really....? Tell that to the people who are filing lawsuits and enraging because Samsung isnt releasing a 2.2 OTA.... OH WAIT?! we have rooted ROMs with 2.2... does that justify the idea that they aren't doing OTAs to maintain their products? But instead to just release new ones without committing to their current products?
Go tell that to people who stuck a two-year contract with a MOTOROLA CLIQ, Droid Eris, and all those phones that the manufacturer didnt commit to upgrading their existing phones. The reason why there aren't more people who are furious about this is because they aren't tech savvy and just care about the phone working.
zephiK said:
In the end, it really depends what you want. What can you fight against? hardware or software? Since most of us are tight on cash, im sure a lot of us would lean towards software. In this case, the Nexus series would be the winner since it is backed by Google (or any device that is supported by CyanogenMod).
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i want a fast phone that works. i have that.
And dont even start with HD recording.. OH MY! we all have to realize that a phone has its limitations. If you're looking to take pictures or do a lot of video recording, just do yourself a favor and get a dedicated camera.... not to mention with TouchWiz, have fun taking HD recording for a long period of time... when it hits the 15% mark, have fun recording or taking pictures buddy
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lol @ the "it's not a feature until we get it" mindset. iphone much?
my battery never gets down to 15% anyway, because nero is awesome on battery life
Oh really....? Tell that to the people who are filing lawsuits and enraging because Samsung isnt releasing a 2.2 OTA.... OH WAIT?! we have rooted ROMs with 2.2... does that justify the idea that they aren't doing OTAs to maintain their products? But instead to just release new ones without committing to their current products?
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i understand the anger towards samsung, and it's completely valid. however, if you want it done right you have to do it yourself. xda has allowed that for many many people. lawsuits and complaints about manufacturers might as well fall on deaf ears, because nothing will happen around here because of that
Go tell that to people who stuck a two-year contract with a MOTOROLA CLIQ, Droid Eris, and all those phones that the manufacturer didnt commit to upgrading their existing phones. The reason why there aren't more people who are furious about this is because they aren't tech savvy and just care about the phone working.
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i would tell those people to do their research before making such a large purchase. i knew full well samsung's history when i bought my vibrant. i knew there might be a good chance they'd jerk consumers around and delay updates. if i was running stock, i would be furious... but i bought an android phone full well knowing that i would be modding it... a lot.
lastly, team whiskey > cyanogenmod
Nope..
I will not buy anything else made by Samsung. Back in the 80's / 90's they built the absolute best quality products with great support. I've been fighting with my GPS for too long and they didn't make it right. There was going to be a 2.2 update in August and it still hasn't happend (except for the great XDA devs). My first Android device was a HTC (g1) and my next one will be as well.
lolcopter said:
i want a fast phone that works. i have that.
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It's not all about you. People have their different reasons for having phones:
1) Flash Addict: Always wanting something to flash. With a developer phone like Nexus S (or any other phone that is popular in the modding community)
2) Normal user
.. and so forth. All ROMs in general has one thing in mind: increasing its speed.
lol @ the "it's not a feature until we get it" mindset. iphone much?
my battery never gets down to 15% anyway, because nero is awesome on battery life
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Again.. this is not all about you at all. Some people are more heavy users when it comes to battery than others. Nevertheless, the 15% mark is annoying and should be removed. Hacked camera.apk does this but not incorporated in all Vibrant ROMs.
i understand the anger towards samsung, and it's completely valid. however, if you want it done right you have to do it yourself. xda has allowed that for many many people. lawsuits and complaints about manufacturers might as well fall on deaf ears, because nothing will happen around here because of that
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What you said makes absolutely no sense. Grammar check. I personally don't care about Samsung not updating to 2.2 because I don't use a Vibrant anymore, but I still have the phone.
All your points aren't even valid. You're just trying to start a war without pointing out what I said but going AROUND them because you can't defeat my points.
My point is that it just depends on what kind of person you are. And you can say whatever your opinion is about CyanogenMod and Team Whiskey, you just seem like a ignorant individual who is difficult to argue with because they are so close minded. They're both composed of great developers but the additions that CyanogenMod includes is just too significant to add. Am I saying that you're wrong for believing what you do? No.. you have a opinion, I'm not going to try and beg you to change your mind.
CyanogenMod actually complies from AOSP source whereas Team Whiskey base their ROMs from the OTA. You wouldn't understand this since you don't use a phone that is CyanogenMod supported (don't even start with G1.. that phone is so outdated that it isn't even capable of taking full advantage of CM7).
I'm sure when CM7 stable is released, TW will start basing their releases off CM7. And you know what? It is built on top of CM7... so whos the better team then? I'm not going to go for one particular side because a developer is a developer. They aren't in this to get any accreditation from the community. They just do it as a hobby. Quit thinking that CyanogenMod & TW are like the rivalry between NVIDIA & AMD/ATI.
Thanks.
http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/mar2011/tc20110324_269784.htm
Google says it will delay the distribution of its newest Android source code, dubbed Honeycomb, at least for the foreseeable future. The search giant says the software, which is tailored specifically for tablet computers that compete against Apple's iPad, is not yet ready to be altered by outside programmers and customized for other devices, such as phones.
almostinsane said:
http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/mar2011/tc20110324_269784.htm
Google says it will delay the distribution of its newest Android source code, dubbed Honeycomb, at least for the foreseeable future. The search giant says the software, which is tailored specifically for tablet computers that compete against Apple's iPad, is not yet ready to be altered by outside programmers and customized for other devices, such as phones.
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More beta BS. I'll sell you a car but we only completed the frame.
Yup - Its why I just sent my Xoom back to Moto.
Perhaps it's time to change your ID to "completelyInsane".
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
_RTFM_ said:
Perhaps it's time to change your ID to "completelyInsane".
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
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LMAO!
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA Premium App
i dont understand what will make it "ready" if they are planning on eventually releasing it what will keep it from being ported to phones then. If its a matter of incompleteness then what's changed since Cupcake which everyone agrees was more .8 than 1.0. Releasing it to dev's will allow for bugfixes and tweaks to get merged upstream.
It will leak eventually. It always does...
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
Yea I dont understand google some times. I understand the the OS isnt ready, but if it really is that bad and that unstable then why even put it on a tablet. And really what harm does it do the put out the code, so people will port it to other devices, you can keep doing what you will but make lots of devs happy.
They say they're worried about a poor user experience. Who do they think these users are? "I he4rd on the int3webz I can haz h0neycombz on my G1?" I mean we already know that the percentage of people running custom Roms, while large for what it is, is not the bulk of people using Android. And we know that what we're doing may not be the smoothest experience. The SDK has already been ported to pretty much everything, and they're worried about the actual 3.0 being a poor experience? Come on Google, what's this really about?
This wasn't the best source to quote from. Google said they don't want developers trying to port it to phones yet since they can't guarantee a good user experience on phones. They're afraid XDA is going to port it, people try to run it on their phones and then say how crappy it runs on a phone even though that's not what it was designed for. You know it would happen, and word would spread that it sucks on phones and yada yada it doesn't get a fair chance.
Sent via EVO
As much of a ROM guy as I am, I admit this makes sense from a business stand point. Google makes $ from licensing and distribution (with regards to Android). The hacker communities do not make up said market for the most part.
The worst thing companies combat these days is negative publicity.
I owned an iPhone, two iterations, the 3G and the original. Why did my mother never purchase one, nor my sister? Simply because of how locked down they are due to MY advice. Were they ever going to buy said device due to their hackability? Hell no. But because I said it was sh**** that Apple locks their stuff down so much, they declined to buy said hardware.
Releasing the software for Google could have a lot of negative effects on a BRAND NEW operating system for a BRAND NEW market for Google. If people are throwing this on phones, you search it out on the internet, and everything is Honeycomb this sucks, and honeycomb that sucks, due to people using it on phones, most people who try to do basic research, like my mother, or sister,
will only see "THIS SUCKS".
Just my 2c, but I can see their stand point. Until they can find a way to keep it off the phones, I see this as an issue for google.
~m
familiarstranger said:
They say they're worried about a poor user experience. Who do they think these users are? "I he4rd on the int3webz I can haz h0neycombz on my G1?" I mean we already know that the percentage of people running custom Roms, while large for what it is, is not the bulk of people using Android. And we know that what we're doing may not be the smoothest experience. The SDK has already been ported to pretty much everything, and they're worried about the actual 3.0 being a poor experience? Come on Google, what's this really about?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Uhmm, are we reading the same forum? Where people knowingly purchased a device that didn't have flash or lte or an ad card working at launch but are still *****ing and whining and returning their xoom regardless? What I mean is, those same people will install Honeycomb and complain that google released a lousy product.
Sent via EVO
thegeektern said:
I understand the the OS isnt ready, but if it really is that bad and that unstable then why even put it on a tablet. And really what harm does it do the put out the code, so people will port it to other devices, you can keep doing what you will but make lots of devs happy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My understanding of that article is that Google doesn't feel its ready for phones. It's not that its not ready for tablets. They understand that they won't be able to stop people from using HC on phones, but trying to stave off the inevitable...
this HC thing looks like crap.... oh.. on my phone. In the end.. we are talking about a company here.. a company that needs to keep it's image.. and products.. (or software as you may call it).. as good as possible.
I don't think it's the best move Google could have made, but I think Google should do things in it's best interest to keep itself as a company in good standing. Long and short of it.. if things go south for google.. we'll all be unhappy. Just getting things out for the sake of allowing devs to play doesn't mean its the most sound decision for the company making it.
Yes, I know.. it's 'open source', but it is still a work-product. I think it's also entirely likely this is just a marketing ploy to say 'we told you so'.. and then it will get leaked and everything will go back to normal. But I still think people often forget that this is still a company that has to keep itself together to survive.
EDIT: So many things get written in the same time when you respond to a post! It seems as though I am joining the choir of.. this isn't so bad.
Sirchuk said:
This wasn't the best source to quote from. Google said they don't want developers trying to port it to phones yet since they can't guarantee a good user experience on phones. They're afraid XDA is going to port it, people try to run it on their phones and then say how crappy it runs on a phone even though that's not what it was designed for. You know it would happen, and word would spread that it sucks on phones and yada yada it doesn't get a fair chance.
Sent via EVO
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well that hasn't stopped devs on xda porting it already - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=978939
Darn you almostinsane, I was just about to post this but you beat me to it!
Its really unfortunate that Google is doing this, whatever happened to a completely open source OS? In my honest opinion I think they should release it to the public and let the various devs have at it and see what can be improved and take those improvements into consideration for the next release of Android. If the OS was only meant for tablets who is to say that x developer can port it to a handheld flawlessly? It would be a HUGE leap ahead for us and for big ol' G.
Either way, it'll happen with or without Google releasing the source as our one dev spacemoose1 has shown us with making a near perfect port to the Samsung tab of honeycomb.
Stinks money is such an issue, Google doesn't really need anymore haha.
Done with my rant now
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App
Another business reason for this decision: Google may not have programmed Honeycomb well.
An obvious(?) repercussion for grimy source code going public is more bashing of Honeycomb's alleged "beta-ness". The more app developers that use the ...poisonous open-source code, the more ...poisoned apps there will be.
Or, they want to curb full-blown Honeycomb from appearing on devices other than the Xoom for just a little longer.
you're right. I just hate that its true. Your sig shows you remember the G1 days when we were all just so happy about what our phone COULD do. It's gotten a lot whinnier around here since then.
Sirchuk said:
Uhmm, are we reading the same forum? Where people knowingly purchased a device that didn't have flash or lte or an ad card working at launch but are still *****ing and whining and returning their xoom regardless? What I mean is, those same people will install Honeycomb and complain that google released a lousy product.
Sent via EVO
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As a ROM enthusiast; yea this sucks. Business it's understandable; but as the former it doesn't make me happy.
My NC sorely needs a aosp honeycomb, HC's tablet interface is superior to even CM7 on it.
Honestly though it's a lot of speculation here on why, but it really just sounds like an excuse (Bad one) to quiet the devs while really being a straight business decision.
How is not releasing honeycomb aosp right away not being open? Would you like all your roms without SD card support right now? Honeycomb is most likely stable enough for normal use for the average consumer and Google had to make footprint in the tablet industry before ipad2 was announced. Things were obviously rushed so i rather wait for them get everything situated. I think this unfortunate news but I'm not gonna cry foul when its something that's probably for the better. Google has proven with each iteration of android they have released source so just be patient
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk
almostinsane said:
Yup - Its why I just sent my Xoom back to Moto.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't understand the logic here. What alternative are you seeking? Take it back for the Galaxy 10.1? It runs the same OS. Take it back for an iPad? It runs a closed OS.
The AOSP release is delayed ... maybe. Why would you return your Xoom because of this?
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA Premium App
Ok what if google can get updates out like apple does to its devices. Notice sprint does not even have ics yet for the nexus s since sprint is launching the galery nexus soon so I bet sprint just only,let a few phone get the ics update as a beta if you will as then user would not buy the newer ics phone. So if google charged a small update fee provided your phone meets the requirements. Or why does google even allow all these add ons like sense and touchwiz. Why not have the pure google non skinned version for like a few dollars and if you want the custom sense then wait for htc samsung to release it a year later.... cough cough fryo.... cough cough gingerbread....
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
Well to answer your question, nope, since we got amazing devs here to satisfy our quench for updating XD
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
Fire n mage said:
Well to answer your question, nope, since we got amazing devs here to satisfy our quench for updating XD
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True for people who are rooted but what about the average non xda type of user who waits for offical ota?
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
Defiantly not, why should we? You don't pay Apple for updates.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
samsungd700 said:
True for people who are rooted but what about the average non xda type of user who waits for offical ota?
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
those average non xda people dont even know root or the latest software means it more of a phone to call and text and browse internet. they dont care if their phone has the latest and greatest updates.
mark8503 said:
Defiantly not, why should we? You don't pay Apple for updates.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You buy the phone from apple, and they also make the software. We buy the phone from Samsung, and Google makes the software. Big difference. You seriously wouldn't shell out like 5 dollars to get ICS like 4 months ago, fully working and smooth? Gonna call bs on that.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA
mark8503 said:
Defiantly not, why should we? You don't pay Apple for updates.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't pay Apple for anyting. Lol
/trollface
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
mark8503 said:
Defiantly not, why should we? You don't pay Apple for updates.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sure you do its called OS/X.... which is i-os is somewhat based on...
muyoso said:
You buy the phone from apple, and they also make the software. We buy the phone from Samsung, and Google makes the software. Big difference. You seriously wouldn't shell out like 5 dollars to get ICS like 4 months ago, fully working and smooth? Gonna call bs on that.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well i disagree on that one as Google does also makes phones called the Nexus and the Motorola Mobility line as Google no owns Moto Mobility. And from what i understand its the stuff like touchwiz and sense that make it harder to get the updates a quickly since the carriers must test everything for like 90 days or more and if it fails then they start the process from the beginning.
I say google should only have one uniform look to android like how apple does with i-os. (i however do not like apple as too expensive for the rich people) If you want a custom launcher like go you can download it but it would not be apart of any official rom from the maker / carrier.
thomasskull666 said:
I don't pay Apple for anyting. Lol
/trollface
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol I don't either. Meaning we don't buy it. PERIOD!!!!
samsungd700 said:
Sure you do its called OS/X.... which is i-os is somewhat based on...
Well i disagree on that one as Google does also makes phones called the Nexus and the Motorola Mobility line as Google no owns Moto Mobility. And from what i understand its the stuff like touchwiz and sense that make it harder to get the updates a quickly since the carriers must test everything for like 90 days or more and if it fails then they start the process from the beginning.
I say google should only have one uniform look to android like how apple does with i-os. (i however do not like apple as too expensive for the rich people) If you want a custom launcher like go you can download it but it would not be apart of any official rom from the maker / carrier.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i have to say; it looks like youve just taken random sentences and thrown them together here.
austin420 said:
i have to say; it looks like youve just taken random sentences and thrown them together here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
And for real there is a Galery Nexus coming soon? I will compare it with the Galaxy Nexus to check which one is better.
And back to the thread. I won't pay, but there is people which pay to others for root their phones, so I think they will pay.
Sent from my Epic 4g with CM9
csmasn said:
+1
And for real there is a Galery Nexus coming soon? I will compare it with the Galaxy Nexus to check which one is better.
And back to the thread. I won't pay, but there is people which pay to others for root their phones, so I think they will pay.
Sent from my Epic 4g with CM9
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i would pay for official updates if it means they come as soon as google releases them. perhaps google should not release any updates until all carriers and manufacturer are ready to push them to all phones that meet the requirements. Do what microsoft does and they just push them to all phones at the same time so the carriers dont have a say in the matter... sort of like windows update on the pc. just check for the update and then install... carriers and manufacturer have too much power to decide who gets what...
I'd love to have mine done in a timely manor. I hear it's nice this time of year!
NO way wouldn't pay! Plus its totally unrealistic considering the different devices and bloatware! Apple has one device line to update! But don't forget Apple owns the software! You get caught messing with it they "Kill" your phone!
MTD (EL30)
BLENDED CLEAN GB 1.12 With Various mods
SHADOW V3.0
(in the voice of lil john)
YAAAYUUUUUHH!!!!
Robalboa said:
NO way wouldn't pay! Plus its totally unrealistic considering the different devices and bloatware! Apple has one device line to update! But don't forget Apple owns the software! You get caught messing with it they "Kill" your phone!
MTD (EL30)
BLENDED CLEAN GB 1.12 With Various mods
SHADOW V3.0
(in the voice of lil john)
YAAAYUUUUUHH!!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well how does microsoft do it then with windows phone 7 and with the pc's? As long as if the phones meet the minimum requirements then good to go. This would work simply because it would get rid of the custom interfaces from the makers like htc sense or samsung touchwiz. If you want those they would only be available as a download apk from the market like how go launcher and adw desktop are. Google needs to take a stand on the custom overlays and how they devalue android with lack of updates as the makers think somehow that sense or touchwiz add somesort of value to the phone when in fact it does not. android 4 is perfect interface and with android 2.x and 3.x its good enough or download some aftermarket one like go launcher. Otherwise i would pay for updates like how i do on my laptop. they can also make money off the updates as well like $25 per phone again as long as it meets the requirements. and now google owns motorola mobility so google is now just like appple. So goolge / Moto Mobility does control the hardware and software
samsungd700 said:
well how does microsoft do it then with windows phone 7 and with the pc's? As long as if the phones meet the minimum requirements then good to go. This would work simply because it would get rid of the custom interfaces from the makers like htc sense or samsung touchwiz. If you want those they would only be available as a download apk from the market like how go launcher and adw desktop are. Google needs to take a stand on the custom overlays and how they devalue android with lack of updates as the makers think somehow that sense or touchwiz add somesort of value to the phone when in fact it does not. android 4 is perfect interface and with android 2.x and 3.x its good enough or download some aftermarket one like go launcher. Otherwise i would pay for updates like how i do on my laptop. they can also make money off the updates as well like $25 per phone again as long as it meets the requirements. and now google owns motorola mobility so google is now just like appple. So goolge / Moto Mobility does control the hardware and software
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
who is to say that custom launchers are devaluing android? if anything, they bring more to the table. i think a lot of the people here would say that they prefer some of the asthetics and options that touchwiz includes. i cant speak to sense or motoblur as i havent used them.
No. Just like I would not pay extra for gas to have someone else come out and pump it for me. In both cases we already pay too much, for gas, for the phones, service and insurance. If all phones were free I would think about it. But you pay more for a better phone, it damn well better be updated in a reasonable timely manner.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
The manufacturer should be providing timely updates as part of buying the phone. We should expect new versions of the OS until at least the EOL and then bugfixes and security updates for another two years past that as a minimum.
Now that we're done with fantasy land, I wouldn't mind paying a nominal charge for a version update provided that they have a stable bug-free version of the current OS. IMHO Samsung never got there with the Epic.
samsungd700 said:
True for people who are rooted but what about the average non xda type of user who waits for offical ota?
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The average non-xda user wouldn't know what 'stock' android is, and frankly, they probably wouldn't be impressed with it for this reason right here
--vvv---
austin420 said:
who is to say that custom launchers are devaluing android? if anything, they bring more to the table. i think a lot of the people here would say that they prefer some of the asthetics and options that touchwiz includes. i cant speak to sense or motoblur as i havent used them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't used Sense, but from my limited experience, Blur is horrid. TW smokes it by a mile. I enjoyed some of the features of Touchwiz, no joke.
And OP, while Google may now own Motorola Mobility, it doesn't mean they own all the hardware. It just means they kind of do with Motorola. They still don't with Samsung, HTC, LG, Sony, etc etc etc.
I'm still a firm believer the biggest reason Google bought Moto was for the patents, not to try and complete with Apple by owning both hardware/software.
EDIT: For the record, I think the number one way to go about the issue is this: all android phones, stock, come with their own skin out of the box by default. However, the user has the ability to go with stock Android upon bootup or something like that. Maybe a tutorial that guides users stating what that skin brings to the table. Maybe something saying here's what you'll have with the skin vs without it, and list off apps and features associated with it.
This way, us android-heads can get any phone we want with stock android, and the average user still has the same options as today.
I wanted to put something of worth within this thread as a conversation topic, but it has become rather vexing trying to pick apart the compilation of sentences that the OP's has been using lol, though me saying I mean no offense would not help I don't think heh.
In regards to paying for an upgrade, it does occur in iOS when the next incremental upgrades come to the iPod Touch Line, for iPhone's a user is guaranteed that update due to being on a monthly plan with their device unless that device is gradually replaced in which case it goes no further upgrade wise as there is a new iteration close to it in price and internal size, if iPad's are affected in the same way being on carrier/off carrier I'm unaware, I also haven't upgraded my iPod Touch in a long while either to test the validity of that, so I'm open to correction. Though iOS has been on 5.x for a bit anyways.
In this case.
Android lacks something iOS does in this case, uniformity, which is how Apple portrays their control over their platform and why it's so popular and simple to use, they limit what can be used and what is used and set a basis forward to keep compatibility in the long run. The Nexus Line is controlled by Google and their partner in each step of the way, more by Google however because they essentially get to pick and choose what they want which works well in the whole grand scheme of things, which means timely updates are to come. They don't have control over LG, HTC, Sony, or Samsung for that matter in their other endeavors in Android and what "crap"(lack of more proper word) that's proprietary they decide to put within the platform for the sake of bragging rights, they're their own entities which for the most part have added to the overall disconnection of Android across the board. Buying out that specific aspect of Motorola was a play for patents to avoid lawsuit not a play for control.
Saying you'd pay money for an update to Android on your phone becomes problematic, in our case, ICS. If you paid $10 because you to have the update when it came out, in the following months it'd be very likely it'd have problems, and you'd be the prime benefactor of said problems. You paid $10 for an update, now what about the update to address that issue? Or the update following that update to address the following issues? Or what if you paid for an update and never got an update in the long run, just for the sake of not having one?
Would those be paid as well? I'm only throwing forth baseless scenarios, because this arrives to the entitlement aspect of things. Paying to get an update makes you entitled to said update, when a company can G.A.F less about an older piece of hardware having support when they've devices in their minds which are twice as good as last years model. I understand where you're going with this thread but, paying for your update in software wouldn't make the fact that your phone is aging any better, nor would it make Android any more uniform, it'd only make it more annoying of a platform due to it. It's not a better alternative than just waiting it out on what you're currently using until you can upgrade your line to something new. Spending more money to have your phone officially supported is rather foolish. In my opinion though.
/endrant
And essentially the Epic isn't EOL/EOS. It just happens to be on it's last legs. So whether it's last update is stable or not won't matter at that point.