Related
There is a very nice article on the performance of high end Android phones at
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/btl/benchmark-showdown-high-end-android-smartphones/39206
Good read but old news
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Resume
See Attached pictures. The major blow is that there will be no joy in upgrading stock to A2.2
The memory speed in SGS is superior to the competitors. The processor is basically the same ARM 1GHz. But the overall performance lags 4 to 6 times depending on how you account performance. Respectively, the battery drain will be inferior and the lags continue to drag on.
Most likely, the infamous time lag issue that is related to "inefficient" memory management plays the role. There was no official Samsung reaction upon the issue. Considering how memory management is done now (the device -most likely- minimizes memory triggering, doesn't close unused apps despite significant battery drain [200+ hours after boot up, wifi, 2G cell, no apps touched vs. less than 24h if you use apps along the way]) and the deliberate ignorance of the situation on Samsung's side, one can conclude that there is a reason. It could be a short life time for the memory cells, i.e. trade off speed vs number of write cycles. Or something else of the sorts.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=402289&stc=1&d=1284656758
http://forum.xda-developers.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=402290&stc=1&d=1284656758
I agree, it's a decent article that helps explain some of what composes each benchmark. I do, however, believe it missed one key point regarding the 2.2 beta benchmarks. From everything I've read, the Froyo beta ROM hasn't even enabled (muchless optimized) the Dalvik JIT compiler that accounts for the huge differences in CPU performance shown on Page 2. Essentially, the graph shouldn't show the 'Froyo / beta ROM' result in green quite yet. We're also not shown the great benchmarks resulting from lagfixes. I don't know if that's also true with the Froyo Legend, but it certainly discounts the full potential of our Galaxy S phones.
Seeing how well the Galaxy S ranks otherwise leaves me thinking it remains the best Android hardware available today. And with all the positive feedback I'm hearing about software fixing both the lag and GPS issue, I'm quite excited. But only time will tell and I, for one, can wait for the devs to finish tweaking and testing things for us. Now if there were a port of Quadrant for jailbroken iPhones, we could compare those too. (There are a few Linpack attempts but they don't seem to be reliable.)
Error all over the place
First of all I didn't like this article at all.
Also, someone should notify them that their conclusion is wrong. The Hummingbird is 45nm, not 65nm
Yeah, I think it's weak they're comparing a Galaxy with an unofficial Froyo install versus ones that have had matured Froyo for a while. And it's their only data point for claiming that the Snapdragon cores benefit from Froyo more than the OMAPs or Hummingbirds... kind of a weak claim before we have some more data.
Patience,and time, will show what the Vibrant will perform much better with actual 2.2 vs. the builds used in the review.
I'm from the UK and have an unbranded SGS running JM9 with voodoo.
Now I think that's besides the point as I was running JM5 out of the box and had many 'features' that Froyo is supposed to bring. I've seen multiple articles and videos waxing lyrical about turning the SGS into a hotspot whereas I've had this feature since July.
Leap view has come via Launcher Pro and I cannot see any reason as to the point about Froyo seeing as it is being perceived as 'laggy'.
Now I'm sick of people complaining about their SGS and it has battery drain and it 'lags'.
There are a multitude of lag fixes out there and I can't fault the battery considering it's a 4inch Super AMOLED, it is constantly pulling data, using wifi.. it has one of the largest batteries in it's class and there is NO smartphone out there with a large screen and decent battery life.
I must also add that GPS has not been a problem on my device and I cannot fault my SGS at all. I'm not a fanboy.. I love all technology and the iPhone is marvellous, however I don't see why it isn't free just like all phones and the SGS can do everything it can, if not more.
People need to realise that Froyo was never going to change much when your phone is at the top of the Android pile until dual core chips and the new Power VXR GPU's come to town.
Just be happy that you can do what you can and stop being so impatient.
Add an overclocked kernel.
Put in one of the many lagfixes out there.
Look into Voodoo.
Stop relying on Quadrant, it's inflated, and uses many loopholes to make you think your devices are better than they are.
The real test is you.
People harped on about getting froyo but I think most folks really just wanted a set of bug fixes and performance improvements, I'd have settled for a really good 2.1 firmware.
2.2 is important not only for its features but also because of the apps that need it. (ex: new gmail)
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2.2 is still young and the new gmail doesn't bring that many features to make you want it.
Car Home? Doesn't matter.
My point is that there aren't any speed increases and the appset for 2.2 isn't large.
+1 to the sentiment but I do think Froyo is important as it is the next step along the development path which for current SGS owners will probably end with Gingerbread.
I am very very happy with my 2.2 JPM build and await further improvements both from Samsung and the Dev communities.
tameracingdriver said:
People harped on about getting froyo but I think most folks really just wanted a set of bug fixes and performance improvements, I'd have settled for a really good 2.1 firmware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
JM9 with a variety of mods from xda make the phone perfect.
Samsung have never been known for good hardware when it comes to phones. Well to be fair, they've been rubbish up until this year other than their TV's.
Hey
First of i would like to say that i have been reading on xda since the old winmo days where i rooted and customized my phones. Now it is my time to write my first post here, which i have close to doing many times, im from Denmark by the way.
Not long ago i sold my beloved Htc hd2, which i had running Android, and i bought the Nokia N8 due since i am heavy on the music and photos. My plan was to get a 7 inch tablet with android for the rest of my needs, which the N8 could not for fill, and even though i had read some places that the tab was slower than one would expect i got myself a used one ( like new) for about half the retail prize.
Now i must say that i am really bugged out about this Tab, it is super slick, the screen and the form factor is nice, the internals are great ( much the same as the new google developer phone, that should be good?) but still this thing runs poorly on froyo 2.2. Really i dont see people saying this is acceptable, since i really dont think it is, i dont mean to flame, since i love android and phones in generel, but even my Htc hd2 had smoother performance than the tab, i find that hard to be true.
It is not slow in generel use, its proberly about what a galaxy s with stock would be, but in things such as the web browser, which should be essensial for a tablet, the galaxy tab really sucks, it is so bad that my nokia n8 with opera mobile nearly handles the web better, and thats really saying something! I tryed about all browsers in the android markedplace and ofcourse one can find a much better one than the stock ( of course you have to turn flash off, even through i think it is a shame)
I ended up using Opera Mobile since it is by far the fastest, it seems to me through that its not running the native res of the tab, could i be right?, is it true that some apps will show fullscreen without being the full res of the tab? i looked allover the web for days trying to get a grip of things without luck, really hope to get some answers
Now what would love to learn some more about would be the future prospects of the Galaxy tab, Is it in the hands of many developers?, will we see custom roms? (since i am not much for stock and touchwizz). Can we expect the Tab to be get much faster, should it not have the same or similar performances as the Nexus S or Galaxy S?
A final thing that i was wondering was about the res of the tabs screen. Is that whats coursing the troubles, the lagg? is that what makes it slow someplaces and makes the webbrowser work like a windows mobile 6.5 stock browser (or worse )
The reason why i am thinking that now is that i just read on Engadget that the Galaxy tab 2 will have Tegra 2 and that it seems very likely that Tegra 2 will be the processor in allot of gingerbread android tablet. Is the hummingbird to slow to handle higher resolution screens? (I really, REALLY hope that is not the case)
Maybe someone with a Archos 101 could prove me wrong (or another android tablet with higher res)???
Well thats it for me, really hope to get some answers since i know this is the best place to ask this sort of questions!
i'm on JM6 and somehow i still dont get what people say about silkky or buttery smooth >.<
mine is kinda laggy (still), and the stock browser gets laggy too when get scrolled up or down, i'm going back to miren browser
i do love putting widget though in my screen, but when i see homescreen post, some of them got a lot of widget too
wonder what's wrong with mine
already using launcher pro, better in term of scrolling than touchwiz with lots of pages (App Drawer)
but scrolling screen still gives me lag
quoting everybody else, after tegra 2 maybe there will be a tegra 3 or whatsoever so if you wait and wait, you'll wait for the rest of your life
i'm jumping on the wagon here, and i'm pretty satisfied actually, but since this is my 1st android phone, i have nothing to compare
gingerbread is definitely come to us , so i dont really care if the requirements need tegra 2
if my tab can handle it, so rock on, if it cant, then just wait for another device capable of gingerbread and sell this one
but since nexus S is using the same 1ghz and using gingerbread also, i dont think tegra 2 is necessary for it
maybe for honeycomb, we'll never know
keep crossing ur finger ^^
Thanks for your quick response. I hope your right with the requirements since it really makes sense that the nexus s would be apple to opgrade.
To me miren Browser is very laggy i really want to use it just don't run smoothly. Thinking about trying flashing one of the roms out there maybe I should wait for a official.
It's not the processor, it's the OS! and Gingerbread aint gonna fix it because it aint designed for tablets. Honeycombe is 'supposed' to be designed for use with tablets so you'll have to wait until 3Q 2011.
I don't know why people are surprised when they realise this as 'sticky', 'laggy', 'freezing' were words all mentioned in every review i've ever read about the tab.
Unless of course you only read Samsungs own review which would be slightly bias.
simon2901 said:
[...]
The reason why i am thinking that now is that i just read on Engadget that the Galaxy tab 2 will have Tegra 2 and that it seems very likely that Tegra 2 will be the processor in allot of gingerbread android tablet. Is the hummingbird to slow to handle higher resolution screens? (I really, REALLY hope that is not the case)
Maybe someone with a Archos 101 could prove me wrong (or another android tablet with higher res)???
[...]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I once had a Toshiba Folio 100 with a Tegra 2 processor (for 5 days ) and it was just as fast/slow as the Tab. Don't know if Gingerbread is going to make the nvidea processor perform a lot better. As far as I know it is a driver thing.
Except for the browser, I think the Tab is fast enough for me.
This performance thing is relative. For example simon2901 you said htc hd2 has better android performance. I have both tab and hd2 now, nearly tried every android build for hd2 but cant find anything that has the performance that makes me feel really usable. But you think the opposite and this shows how relative this thing can be.
I flashed my tab to jm6 as Justin^Tan and i am agree with him. People say it is silky or very smooth but i all can say is it is smoother then my stock rom. Another proof of how this can be relative.
And i agree with appleflap except browser tab is enough for me too. Browser is enough in most cases for me too but when i browse a fully loaded page with flash it really is a pain.
As from the Gingerbread i only expect is make power drain of some apps more reasonable.
It's the OS... I come from an OS for which bloggers like to make fun (WM 6.5.5), however the custom ROMs for my TP2 were in the end quite fast. And I feel like I had more functionalities
This has nothing to do with Samsung's hardware. The Hummingbird is actually as (more) powerful as what you find in the iPad (And we have more memory with our Tab)
If I were you I would not expect too much from Gingerbread. Doesn't look like much more than a minor upgrade with a few tweaks. Quite different from the move from 2.1 to 2.2 let's put our hope sin Honeycombs...
It's kind of normal, it's a young OS and to be honest it's impressive to see the work that has been accomplished since the first versions of android. Given its quick growth we can hope to see more and more good apps and hopefully improved support for custom ROMs. That said teh Tab doesnt seem so popular among modders and chefs (maybe because of the price ? Or just because Clockwork seems more difficult to develop ?) so I ma not sure we can hope that much for the future for us
Gingerbread actually does have some performance improvements imho. Running it on my nexus one and the screen transitions have improved over Froyo (dare I say - as silky smooth as on the ipad? ). So I would expect the Tab to feel a bit slicker too once it gets some Gingerbread love. Personally, I'm not finding the Tab to be sluggish at all. Running Launcher Pro, JM6 firmware, Miren browser, a few widgets, tons of apps, no live wallpaper, and it's all very smooth.
Jm 6 is that a custom rom or just a minor update, how does it compare to stock, since mine certainly not smooth with miren. I laggs so much only opera is useable
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simon2901 said:
Jm 6 is that a custom rom or just a minor update, how does it compare to stock, since mine certainly not smooth with miren. I laggs so much only opera is useable
Sent from my GT-P1000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
JM6 is a Euro firmware that's been posted in the dev section here. I'm not sure it improves performance compared to stock, but then I flashed this pretty much the same day as I got the Tab so can't really compare . I believe it has some performance improvements with the stock browser, but I prefer Miren anyway. I really don't see any lagging with Miren, or at least none that I can't attribute to poor wifi connections etc. It's certainly way slicker than the stock browser. The pinch to zoom font rendering on stock is appalling whereas on Miren it preserves quality. Not tried Opera on the Tab though I hear it's fast...
Have you tried using a different launcher than stock Touchwiz? Launcher Pro or ADW should both give you improvements in performance.
That so many people's first experiences with it are probably as a demo unit, I can see why they say it doesn't feel as smooth as an iPad.
Aye, you can swap launchers and tweak settings.
But most stores have them running loaded up with widgets, running some livewallpaper, and touchwiz. It IS jerky. Or rather, not as smooth as the iPad.
Ok, so the job still gets done, and as a techy myself, I'm happy with what's doable, but that perception amongst most users is that it's not as smooth as it could be seems to be an obvious win if they can sort it out.
Even on the Tab, bringing the Notifiction bar down; sure it's fast enough, but it doesn't animate as it scrolls down (though if it did, personally I'd want an option to turn that off so it insta dropped!).
That all the hardware coming out now has pretty decent openGL support now, I can see that'll be the main thing in future UI improvements, moving more of it to hardware acceleration. I get a feeling that it's all being done in software.
It can only get better from here. A bit of polish on the first thing most users will see will be hugely beneficial later.
I find almost all of the above judgements entirely false. The OS workd perfectlyt for me without any lag or any kind of lag fixes. Im on JK5.
All it takes is a few shrewd decisions on the software that you use with the OS. My browser doesnt lag - I use the Fennec nighly builds which are silky smooth with opengl rendering and without.
I have removed bloatware and services that clog up the purity of googles stock 2.2.
I do use a task manager to kill certain services on a selewctive basis.
I get 2 days light use out of it, which is just fine!
And there is never any lag anywhere.
Now i must say that i am really bugged out about this Tab, it is super slick, the screen and the form factor is nice, the internals are great ( much the same as the new google developer phone, that should be good?) but still this thing runs poorly on froyo 2.2. Really i dont see people saying this is acceptable, since i really dont think it is, i dont mean to flame, since i love android and phones in generel, but even my Htc hd2 had smoother performance than the tab, i find that hard to be true.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is acceptable.
There, I said it. I find it to be perfectly smooth, not sure why you're having a problem with it.
Use DolphinHD as the browser as it offers far more functionality than the default, and use ADW or LauncherPro as the homescreen as they both offer more functionality and better performance than the default.
As mentioned, gingerbread will offer a performance increase, but it's unlikely to be significant. It's entirely possible that Samsung will never port Honeycomb to the tab as they'll want to use it as a selling point for the Galaxy Tab 2 when it eventually comes out (and who knows when that'll be), the future is most likely going to come from custom ROMs if you want to improve the device as it stands.
I always purchase hardware with what CAN be done with it in mind, not what MIGHT be done to it in the future. Hoping for upgrades is a waste of energy, if you don't like the hardware in its initial state, or a state that you can transform it to straight away (rooting it, flashing already available ROMs etc) then don't purchase it, simple as that.
knightnz said:
As mentioned, gingerbread will offer a performance increase, but it's unlikely to be significant. It's entirely possible that Samsung will never port Honeycomb to the tab as they'll want to use it as a selling point for the Galaxy Tab 2 when it eventually comes out (and who knows when that'll be), the future is most likely going to come from custom ROMs if you want to improve the device as it stands.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, by the time the Galaxy Tab 2 comes out, I would think Samsung would stop officially selling the Galaxy Tab 1 so it wouldn't matter if the Tab1 had Honeycomb or not. Its' not like it would be cutting into Galaxy Tab 2 sales.
well im glad some have good experiences with the web and smoothness of the device, i think i forgot to say that i am currenty on stock rom as i bought it, i read that there is some good performance improvements in the leaked firmware updates, still i would wait rooting, doing all that stuff untill things settle down a bit, it all seems confusing to me atm ( maybe it just is more complicated compared to winmo, htc hd2).
Well reading about the newer firmware out there got me in a better mood, knowing that samsung knows that things are not right yet is very comforting, i mean, i would assume all tabs sold in Denmark have the same firmware as mine, and that means bad performance compared to even the galaxy s, that is not acceptable, not at all.
Saying that this is a phone os and so on and therefore things dont run as expected. is neither acceptable since it should not run worse on a bigger device, i mean android do not discriminate? I am not looking for Ipad performance, since i got one in the household, and i still prefer using the tab, even though browsing is better on Safari (Flash dont work properly atm, rather just use the new youtubeclient, which i enjoy except the quality should be higher( proberly will be in time)
It is great to read your comments, gotta love xda
even if they stop selling galaxy tab 1, if they did release honeycomb into tab 1, people would hold onto their tab 1 if there's no significant upgrade on hardware
but if they dare only giving honeycomb onto tab 2, some people would definitely jump onto tab 2 for sure
It is never ending search for perfection that does not exist.
Something will come tomorrow with better CPU/GPU/screen.....
My experience is good enough. I turned of animation - major cause of lags, left one widget. Everything works just fine for my taste.
Hmm well is that fine Having to turn of animations and not use widgets? i just hope we will see custom roms with newer versions. What firmware v. are you using?
I'm really thinking about trying newer builds
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I still don't get the "lag"that everyone is noticing.I'm using dolphin HD and it's perfectly smooth for me. I did root and lagfix, not sure if that is the difference.
paulshields said:
Gingerbread actually does have some performance improvements imho. Running it on my nexus one and the screen transitions have improved over Froyo (dare I say - as silky smooth as on the ipad? ). So I would expect the Tab to feel a bit slicker too once it gets some Gingerbread love. Personally, I'm not finding the Tab to be sluggish at all. Running Launcher Pro, JM6 firmware, Miren browser, a few widgets, tons of apps, no live wallpaper, and it's all very smooth.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cool good to know about the perf improvement
Sad to see the ipad is still "the" reference
I bought a Nexus 7 for my son and I've been dealing with software issues since day 1. Apps crash regularly, when I hit the home button, many games don't stop (you can hear the music play in the background), web browser stops for 1-3 seconds occasionally, and this morning when I clicked on Settings it was frozen for 10 seconds and came up with "Settings is not responding". Even though I hit "Wait", it rebooted itself.
If I compare this 3-day old device to my highly skinned Samsung Note 10.1, I'd go with the SGN any day, because not one app crash or random reboot happened so far (I've had it for more than a month). Please note that I'm running the exact apps/games on the SGN. When I had a Galaxy Tab 2 10.1" and 7" in the past, the experience was the same (problem free).
The tablet that I had before SGN was a Toshiba Excite 10.1 running a stock ICS (Toshiba only added few of their apps, that was it). It was a nightmare as well. Web browser crash, frozen screen, random reboots. etc. happened all the time.
The root of the problems could be hardware related, but both Nexus/Asus and Toshiba with stock Android had numerous similar issues. At the end of the day, with my limited experience, I'm a non-stock Android believer, not to mention all the extras Samsung built on top of stock Android (e.g., multiscreen, mini apps, etc). Yes, I do understand that updates are delayed with non-stock Android versions, but I'd rather use a problem-free device and wait a little longer for an update.
I agree with you on the Nexus, mine is stock and even launching apps like Wallet my tablet freezes almost everytime. I don't think it's a hardware issue, I think it's more a software issue. As for as the GN101, so far I have found it solid without the need for any ROM changes at all.
The obsession with stock came from a time when devices were underpowered and didn't have enough RAM. Manufacturer overlays really bogged down performance. So the XDA devs went on a quest to offer AOSP/AOKP alternatives. Back then, going naked really did improve device usability.
With quad-core processors and 1.5/2 GB of RAM becoming the new standard the overlays really don't interfere the way they used to. They also add a lot of value with additional audio and video codec support, faster alternative toggles and menus, more functions added to apps (EG: camera), usability features (EG: SmartStay), and better integration between apps which helps people be more productive.
You'll hear people talking about being "bloat free." By the time someone's done loading third party versions (sometimes multiples because one won't work for everything) of apps that come pre-installed they have more crap on their device than the OEM version. I truly wonder if a lot of people even use their devices to do anything. You see post after post about how lag free their transitions are but you never hear them talk about actually using any of the apps they have installed or trying to accomplish a specific task.
As for your situation with the N7 I think a lot of the issues are h/w related. You don't hear people on the SGS3 or Note II forum running in to similar issues. There are h/w related issues on Asus' premium tablets so if anything their budget tablet shouldn't be expected to perform any better.
Mainstream shoppers like overlays. In the Apple case it came out that Samsung sold only 500K Galaxy Nexi. That's a pretty embarrassing number considering all the chatter about "pure Google" and the cult following Nexus devices are supposed to have.
Definitely not SW issue. Vanilla android is as stable as it gets. It can only get worse from there. The nexus 7 is an Asus device, which are known for i/o issues as described. The reason aosp is always 'buggy' on (insert device) is because alot of modifications are needed to get it running on most devices, making for a possible unstable build. Manufacturer's skins absolutely slow down the device, but with the newest gen dual/quad core processors, the newer devices run pretty darn fast stock...
Try cm10 on the note and you'll see how much more efficient it is... But you'll also see minor issues like camera not working
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prenedo said:
Definitely not SW issue. Vanilla android is as stable as it gets. It can only get worse from there. The nexus 7 is an Asus device, which are known for i/o issues as described. The reason aosp is always 'buggy' on (insert device) is because alot of modifications are needed to get it running on most devices, making for a possible unstable build. Manufacturer's skins absolutely slow down the device, but with the newest gen dual/quad core processors, the newer devices run pretty darn fast stock...
Try cm10 on the note and you'll see how much more efficient it is... But you'll also see minor issues like camera not working
Sent from my GT-N8013 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess I don't understand the point "Vanilla android is as stable as it gets........The reason aosp is always 'buggy' on (insert device) is because alot of modifications are needed to get it running on most devices, making for a possible unstable build". If each manufacturer needs to modify it to run it on their device, then which device runs the "vanilla" android?
tenderidol said:
I guess I don't understand the point "Vanilla android is as stable as it gets........The reason aosp is always 'buggy' on (insert device) is because alot of modifications are needed to get it running on most devices, making for a possible unstable build". If each manufacturer needs to modify it to run it on their device, then which device runs the "vanilla" android?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nexus devices. Manufacturers add more functionality and appearance to stock android (ie, TW, sense, blur) which present more of an opportunity for errors/bugs.
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prenedo said:
Nexus devices. Manufacturers add more functionality and appearance to stock android (ie, TW, sense, blur) which present more of an opportunity for errors/bugs.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
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Click to collapse
It's ironic, because I'm having issues with a Nexus device while the SGN with Touchwiz works without any issues.
tenderidol said:
It's ironic, because I'm having issues with a Nexus device while the SGN with Touchwiz works without any issues.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The theory of Nexus is much different than the practice. Different radios and even bands make it as fragmented as a skinned device.
Well I have a note 10.1 and nexus 7. Note is completely stock and runs flawless. My nexus 7 is running stock rom with custom kernel. That runs flawless also. Even before custom kernel, superstock, it ran extremely well without any issues for me. My nexus 7 never had issues OP described. Nexus 7 is stable as a mofo never had any issue with that Asus tablet. So lets not go there with since its an Asus, its automatically bad/defective or whatever..lol.
I also have a SG3 which is great superStock.
tenderidol said:
I bought a Nexus 7 for my son and I've been dealing with software issues since day 1. Apps crash regularly, when I hit the home button, many games don't stop (you can hear the music play in the background), web browser stops for 1-3 seconds occasionally, and this morning when I clicked on Settings it was frozen for 10 seconds and came up with "Settings is not responding". Even though I hit "Wait", it rebooted itself.
If I compare this 3-day old device to my highly skinned Samsung Note 10.1, I'd go with the SGN any day, because not one app crash or random reboot happened so far (I've had it for more than a month). Please note that I'm running the exact apps/games on the SGN. When I had a Galaxy Tab 2 10.1" and 7" in the past, the experience was the same (problem free).
The tablet that I had before SGN was a Toshiba Excite 10.1 running a stock ICS (Toshiba only added few of their apps, that was it). It was a nightmare as well. Web browser crash, frozen screen, random reboots. etc. happened all the time.
The root of the problems could be hardware related, but both Nexus/Asus and Toshiba with stock Android had numerous similar issues. At the end of the day, with my limited experience, I'm a non-stock Android believer, not to mention all the extras Samsung built on top of stock Android (e.g., multiscreen, mini apps, etc). Yes, I do understand that updates are delayed with non-stock Android versions, but I'd rather use a problem-free device and wait a little longer for an update.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try vanilla android on a samsung device like the galaxy nexus and you will have a very different experience. Asus devices are fine once some tweaks have been made, but my tf300 was extremely sluggish on stock. Just got the note and it blows the doors off my tf300 in every category except the note does not have jellybean yet and the tf300 does.
demandarin said:
My nexus 7 never had issues OP described.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here's what I've learned by researching IO on Asus' tablets. People who have no issues and people *****ing about lag etc. are both right. It depends on what you're doing with the device. People with a lot of syncs running in the background or that have multiple apps or a single multithreaded app going that create concurrent processes are more likely to experience issues. Here's a post from someone I know well talking about it. I actually shipped him his N7 from the States. If he says it lags, it lags. His post is in a 67 page thread aptly entitled "The LAG Thread."
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1776538
There's another recently discovered issue that occurs when available storage drops below 3GB. Performance hits the wall. So one or both are probably causing OP's issues.
http://www.gottabemobile.com/2012/09/17/nexus-7-performance-issues/
Well I have a galaxy nexus and ever since jellybean its smoother than ever, sometimes even better than on my note 10.1 except if its on cm 10
Just look at the size of the ROMs cm10 is 150 mb while for example high on android is 750 mb, there's definitely a difference performance wise
If you ran stock JB on Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 and then the skinned JB (when it finally drops) and you'd see a difference I'm sure. Not AS much since this tablet is a beast, but you'd see improvements.
If vanilla android was the issue, skinning it could only make it worse. They are still utilizing all of the code of vanilla android, and adding their own stuff to it. That can only bog things down. It does on every device I've ever seen.
Finally, I've never heard or see these issues on the Nexus 7. Sounds like you got a lemon. Everything I've heard is that it's the most fluid tablet to date.
Sent from my EVO using xda app-developers app
PsiPhiDan said:
If you ran stock JB on Samsung Galaxy Note 10.1 and then the skinned JB (when it finally drops) and you'd see a difference I'm sure. Not AS much since this tablet is a beast, but you'd see improvements.
If vanilla android was the issue, skinning it could only make it worse. They are still utilizing all of the code of vanilla android, and adding their own stuff to it. That can only bog things down. It does on every device I've ever seen.
Finally, I've never heard or see these issues on the Nexus 7. Sounds like you got a lemon. Everything I've heard is that it's the most fluid tablet to date.
Sent from my EVO using xda app-developers app
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You should visit the Nexus 7 sub-forum (especially the Lag thread) for an alternate view.
The 'obsession' with AOSP stems from a Linux purity thrust. Most OEMs do NOT release their mods to android back as open source contributions, which technically, under the gnu gpl, they should. Samsung-skinned android OS is kind of like Linux mint as opposed to Linux Fedora. Fedora comes out of the box with ABSOLUTELY NO proprietary software, whereas Linux mint ships with flash, Google search (which is NOT open source). So when you run Konqueror (stock KDE browser) you have to download and choose Google as your search engine. Otherwise, it uses duckduckgo, which I prefer..I use ddg on my android tablets even.... I just don't like my search history being chronicled.
AOSP was started in this spirit, which is why gApps are separate and have to be flashed independedntly. Check out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjaC8Pq9-V0&feature=youtube_gdata_player for more information, and a ton of geeky fun.
GT-P6800
GT-N8013
The 'obsession' is because in the past vanilla Android was clearly faster/more stable than skinned versions. If I compare the Galaxy S to the Nexus S, touchwiz was a slow laggy joke while vanilla Android outperformed it in every way.
Add to that much faster updates, which was much more important as Android matured, and a stellar dev community, and you have a group of people who have preferred Nexus devices over any other.
It has also been easier to flash Nexus devices, and they are virtually impossible to brick. You dont need to use anything like Kies/Odin/Heimdall etc, just install the Android SDK and use fastboot/ADB to set it up, then off you go. Unlocking a bootloader is a single command you use once, and you dont need to flash new bootloaders for updated versions of Android (updating my A500 was a complete pain compared to my Nexus S because of this).
The current generation of Samsung devices are IMO the first gen where Touchwiz works really well. I have absolutely no desire to flash any ROM over the stock Sammy ROM because it works so freaking well. If i get a Note 2 i'm sure it'll be the same, but i am still waiting to see what the new Nexus devices will look like.
I think with the Note 10.1 we have an excellent device that helps us forget just how buggy and crap Touchwiz has been in the past.
poid, most of those problems you mentioned are still true.
Adding the manufacturer's customisations to Android still results in fewer and slower Android OS updates, still results in slower, clunky software (this is not so much a problem on extremely powerful processors like in the Note - more noticeable on slow processors like the Tab 2 - why they downgraded the processor in that I'll never know).
Touchwiz has indeed improved a lot, but the fact that it is a customised version of Android still means that Samsung has more work to do in order to push out upgrades and optimise the new software to run smoothly on the device.
tenderidol said:
It's ironic, because I'm having issues with a Nexus device while the SGN with Touchwiz works without any issues.
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thats not because of vanilla android, its because of asus hw. the galnex with stock jellybean (the kind that it boots with, no cm or aokp) is just as solid as this, and most of the custom roms are as well. the galaxy nexus did not sell many units because not a lot of people know a lot about nexus and the android ecosystem, and it wasnt as hyped with all the commercials and ads as, say the gs2, gs3, or one x.
aletheus said:
The 'obsession' with AOSP stems from a Linux purity thrust. Most OEMs do NOT release their mods to android back as open source contributions, which technically, under the gnu gpl, they should. Samsung-skinned android OS is kind of like Linux mint as opposed to Linux Fedora. Fedora comes out of the box with ABSOLUTELY NO proprietary software, whereas Linux mint ships with flash, Google search (which is NOT open source). So when you run Konqueror (stock KDE browser) you have to download and choose Google as your search engine. Otherwise, it uses duckduckgo, which I prefer..I use ddg on my android tablets even.... I just don't like my search history being chronicled.
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Click to collapse
All 100% true. And meaningless to the 95% of Android users not considered "enthusiasts." The SGS2 sold 28MM the Note I 7MM and the SGS3 20MM in 100 days. The GN sold 500K. That kind of tells you what the general device purchaser thinks is important and it isn't AOSP. Performance isn't about h/w or s/w in isolation. The GN has a crappy camera, awful display, and horrible battery life. AOSP and JB or KLP can't fix that. Same thing with the h/w issues on the N7. Samsung's always done a great job of tuning the h/w and s/w on their devices to perform better together. Samsung's stock browsers have always blown away all others because of the h/w acceleration they include. Same thing with the additional codecs they provide for audio and video. It's nice to have options through the devs on XDA but not everyone views their devices as a science project.
MercuryStar said:
poid, most of those problems you mentioned are still true.
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The performance issues are pretty much gone because of more RAM and faster processors. I have a Teg3 One X and I love Sense. The integration between apps makes me more productive and allows me to get stuff done (EG: rejecting a call with a message and adding it as a task to Outlook to follow-up with one swipe) faster than diddling with a bunch of non-integrated third party apps. Since I actually use my devices getting a 1K higher score in AnTuTu or orgasming over screen transitions is less important than what they're capable of actually doing. The price you pay for an overlay is later (if at all) updates but to some that's an OK trade off. Ask the VZW and Sprint GN owners about getting updates on their "pure Google" devices. They may not agree that's a benefit that always works as described.
poid said:
The current generation of Samsung devices are IMO the first gen where Touchwiz works really well. I have absolutely no desire to flash any ROM over the stock Sammy ROM because it works so freaking well.
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Click to collapse
I can't root and ROM because of security and registering on foreign GSM networks when I'm traveling so I couldn’t if I wanted to. But I agree with you. The Note and my One X (after the last update) don't leave me wishing I could.
Nexus 7 is very flawed . but not its os
I will be getting my note 10.1 tomorrow or wed at the latest.
I see alot of nexus 7 talk in this thread and thought i would tell my story.
The nexus 7 software is very nice near flawless there is some issues with touch response and dead spots on the screen. The device itself has a huge design flaw . This is caused by two things. Number one being the bezel is to small under the screen . the lip on the left side has been reduced to allow for the digitizer connections this causes either the bezel to warp or the screen to become loose and lift up and move. This movement is causing screens to crack and shatter. There are issues with A Yellowish spots burn in on the screen as well as screen flashing from issues with light sensor calibration. CM 10 Does help with that issue some. but shutting off the sensor. There are people posting about the device making a squeeling sound then just going off and never coming back on Speakers going bad or not working head phone jack not working.. And so on..
I had a nexus pre order it came in with a few of the above issues. I got a advanced replacement had to send it back on the day it arrived because of huge screen issues. Due to the big hassle with trying to get a refund i sent the other back. its been nearly two months They have both devices back and all of my money..
IN SHORT the nexus 7 is plegued with issues if you have one and its working Lucky you.. But there are more bad then good.. it was pushed to market too soon in my opinion.. but the device i had ran very well and fast . its a great size to pack around but not so good for web browsing .screen to small..
Anyway my opinion only read the nexus 7 forum if you feel anything about is wrong . its all there ..
thanks all ... I eagerly await my note 10.1 tablet ..
Hi,
getting rid of my tf700t due to terrible stability problems and Asus not being one jot of help. I had sworn never to touch an Asus product again but seem v limited for options when considering a high-powered and high res screen.
Can people confirm that both performance and stability on this tablet is much improved over the tf700 as I cant put up with random reboots again?
Oh, and does CIFS work as may then just get the 16gb version?
Cheers
pinn___________ said:
Hi,
getting rid of my tf700t due to terrible stability problems and Asus not being one jot of help. I had sworn never to touch an Asus product again but seem v limited for options when considering a high-powered and high res screen.
Can people confirm that both performance and stability on this tablet is much improved over the tf700 as I cant put up with random reboots again?
Oh, and does CIFS work as may then just get the 16gb version?
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Some people have random reboots. I dont know about the frequency comapred to tf700 tho. (I dont have random reboots at all) I can respond with "yes" to all other questions
Cant speak to the stability as I've been running CM10 on mine since day 2... but its having used both its definitely faster. If you dont mind the lack of a keyboard dock or SD card slot, its definitely a step up in every regard.
Jotokun said:
Cant speak to the stability as I've been running CM10 on mine since day 2... but its having used both its definitely faster. If you dont mind the lack of a keyboard dock or SD card slot, its definitely a step up in every regard.
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Click to collapse
Thats's good to hear as I thought the dual core may have been a bottle neck but maybe the extra RAM helps.
Cheers
pinn___________ said:
Thats's good to hear as I thought the dual core may have been a bottle neck but maybe the extra RAM helps.
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
From what I've read Asus used really cheap flash storage in their TF201/300/700 tablets, which is pretty much the source of all their speed issues. The extra ram doesn't hurt though, and while the CPU is only dual-core, its based on ARM's A15 instead of A9 like the tegra.
Jotokun said:
From what I've read Asus used really cheap flash storage in their TF201/300/700 tablets, which is pretty much the source of all their speed issues. The extra ram doesn't hurt though, and while the CPU is only dual-core, its based on ARM's A15 instead of A9 like the tegra.
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Click to collapse
Cheers. Just been checking the reviews on Tom's hardware and he doesn't give the screen a very good rating, complaining that the colours are much more vibrant on the ipad. Bit of a bummer as apart from this, there's bugger all on the market of a decent spec.
Can anyone make a favourable comparison to the new ipad's screen?
Jotokun said:
From what I've read Asus used really cheap flash storage in their TF201/300/700 tablets, which is pretty much the source of all their speed issues. The extra ram doesn't hurt though, and while the CPU is only dual-core, its based on ARM's A15 instead of A9 like the tegra.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The tf700t and n10 use the same DDR3 RAM.
But the n10 is a HUGE step up from the tf700t.
Even if the Tegra 3 was clocked at the same speed Exynos' 2 cores are still about twice as fast as Tegras 4 cores. Before I got the n10 I was considering the tf700t mainly for the expandable storage and the cool keyboard dock with extra battery. In retrospect I made the right choice, 32GB is plenty and I have a case with bluetooth keyboard.
pinn___________ said:
Hi,
getting rid of my tf700t due to terrible stability problems and Asus not being one jot of help. I had sworn never to touch an Asus product again but seem v limited for options when considering a high-powered and high res screen.
Can people confirm that both performance and stability on this tablet is much improved over the tf700 as I cant put up with random reboots again?
Oh, and does CIFS work as may then just get the 16gb version?
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Running aokp here. Much much more stable than my tf700, much faster too.
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD
If you are sick of reboots I'd wait to see if next software version fixes it. I'm on my second device and they both reboot. 4.2.2 decreased it so far to about every 2 days for me. Like you, I have a low tolerance coming from a tf101 that had SOD issues after upgrade. Do some searching. Plenty of people say it reboots. Plenty say it doesn't. Which will you be?
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD
Definitely just my opinion, but I love my nexus 7 & my nexus 10, and my nexus 4 for what its worth, but I have worked with practically every major tablet brand/model/manufacturer (in usa) including my tf700 Asus and don't get me wrong my Asus is great but its just not close to my nexus. Some of this is due to the development available on both and the lack of development I guess you could say on my Asus. I mean all three of my Asus tablets are still going strong (my tf300, my 201, and my 700) but finding a good stable ROM with features or ui I like has been more difficult at certain times. That's not to say I haven't had any issues with the nexus 10 ROMs or anything, but its never been too much of a problem for me to just find a new or updated ROM and things always seem to run better in general. Of course every user has different experiences on every tablet especially when it comes to custom ROMs and other mods, so again this is just my experience/opinion.... The only feature that's missing from nexus models to me is the expandable memory source of a micro SD card, I've always loved having that option on phones and tablets. But lately there's no shortage of decent ROMs on the nexus and other mods are also not very difficult to add if you need them. I use my nexus 10 kind of as my every day driver and go-to tablet for the most part. I teach a class for beginner android users locally and most of the time I use the nexus because its reliable and has good battery life.
Currently running nexus 10 with twrp rec, ROM is rasbeanjelly latest build v4.2.2-r1(might switch it up with diff ROM, but still kinda like this build), kept kernel that rasbeanjelly normally uses, and keep the nexus toolkit by mskip loaded on my pc in case I need or want to make any quick changes or have any boot issues it just makes things easier with toolkit---thanks again mskip.
Sent from xda premium app on my Nexus 10 32gb running RasbeanJelly ROM android 4.2.2 --- by OneNOnlyCasper
Feeling that myTF101 was getting a little outdated, I decided to upgrade to the TF700t. I returned it after a few days after so many headaches. It would lag continuously no matter which ROM i loaded on there. The web browsing experience was lackluster at best despite the many tweaks i implemented. Also no ability to relock the bootloader after Asus latest update was the last straw since it would have voided my warranty indefinitely.
I decided to spend the little bit of extra money on the N10 with bluetooth keyboard case and I feel like i made the right decision. Everything is so smooth and speedy withno lags whatsover. I can even relock the bootloader if i need to.
I know I dont miss having the keyboard dock even though it wouldve helped with the battery life. But what's the point of having extra battery life if the user experience is lackluster to begin with?
I can confirm that this is a better tablet than the 700. that thing was a piece of crap all together. after extended use I found the wifi to become crap in and out. the thing lagged all the time. I can go on forever. I believe the nexus 10 is much more stable and quick.
posted by Droid DNA/ Nexus 10