Database Users

[Q] The Tab and the future

Hey
First of i would like to say that i have been reading on xda since the old winmo days where i rooted and customized my phones. Now it is my time to write my first post here, which i have close to doing many times, im from Denmark by the way.
Not long ago i sold my beloved Htc hd2, which i had running Android, and i bought the Nokia N8 due since i am heavy on the music and photos. My plan was to get a 7 inch tablet with android for the rest of my needs, which the N8 could not for fill, and even though i had read some places that the tab was slower than one would expect i got myself a used one ( like new) for about half the retail prize.
Now i must say that i am really bugged out about this Tab, it is super slick, the screen and the form factor is nice, the internals are great ( much the same as the new google developer phone, that should be good?) but still this thing runs poorly on froyo 2.2. Really i dont see people saying this is acceptable, since i really dont think it is, i dont mean to flame, since i love android and phones in generel, but even my Htc hd2 had smoother performance than the tab, i find that hard to be true.
It is not slow in generel use, its proberly about what a galaxy s with stock would be, but in things such as the web browser, which should be essensial for a tablet, the galaxy tab really sucks, it is so bad that my nokia n8 with opera mobile nearly handles the web better, and thats really saying something! I tryed about all browsers in the android markedplace and ofcourse one can find a much better one than the stock ( of course you have to turn flash off, even through i think it is a shame)
I ended up using Opera Mobile since it is by far the fastest, it seems to me through that its not running the native res of the tab, could i be right?, is it true that some apps will show fullscreen without being the full res of the tab? i looked allover the web for days trying to get a grip of things without luck, really hope to get some answers
Now what would love to learn some more about would be the future prospects of the Galaxy tab, Is it in the hands of many developers?, will we see custom roms? (since i am not much for stock and touchwizz). Can we expect the Tab to be get much faster, should it not have the same or similar performances as the Nexus S or Galaxy S?
A final thing that i was wondering was about the res of the tabs screen. Is that whats coursing the troubles, the lagg? is that what makes it slow someplaces and makes the webbrowser work like a windows mobile 6.5 stock browser (or worse )
The reason why i am thinking that now is that i just read on Engadget that the Galaxy tab 2 will have Tegra 2 and that it seems very likely that Tegra 2 will be the processor in allot of gingerbread android tablet. Is the hummingbird to slow to handle higher resolution screens? (I really, REALLY hope that is not the case)
Maybe someone with a Archos 101 could prove me wrong (or another android tablet with higher res)???
Well thats it for me, really hope to get some answers since i know this is the best place to ask this sort of questions!

i'm on JM6 and somehow i still dont get what people say about silkky or buttery smooth >.<
mine is kinda laggy (still), and the stock browser gets laggy too when get scrolled up or down, i'm going back to miren browser
i do love putting widget though in my screen, but when i see homescreen post, some of them got a lot of widget too
wonder what's wrong with mine
already using launcher pro, better in term of scrolling than touchwiz with lots of pages (App Drawer)
but scrolling screen still gives me lag
quoting everybody else, after tegra 2 maybe there will be a tegra 3 or whatsoever so if you wait and wait, you'll wait for the rest of your life
i'm jumping on the wagon here, and i'm pretty satisfied actually, but since this is my 1st android phone, i have nothing to compare
gingerbread is definitely come to us , so i dont really care if the requirements need tegra 2
if my tab can handle it, so rock on, if it cant, then just wait for another device capable of gingerbread and sell this one
but since nexus S is using the same 1ghz and using gingerbread also, i dont think tegra 2 is necessary for it
maybe for honeycomb, we'll never know
keep crossing ur finger ^^

Thanks for your quick response. I hope your right with the requirements since it really makes sense that the nexus s would be apple to opgrade.
To me miren Browser is very laggy i really want to use it just don't run smoothly. Thinking about trying flashing one of the roms out there maybe I should wait for a official.

It's not the processor, it's the OS! and Gingerbread aint gonna fix it because it aint designed for tablets. Honeycombe is 'supposed' to be designed for use with tablets so you'll have to wait until 3Q 2011.
I don't know why people are surprised when they realise this as 'sticky', 'laggy', 'freezing' were words all mentioned in every review i've ever read about the tab.
Unless of course you only read Samsungs own review which would be slightly bias.

simon2901 said:
[...]
The reason why i am thinking that now is that i just read on Engadget that the Galaxy tab 2 will have Tegra 2 and that it seems very likely that Tegra 2 will be the processor in allot of gingerbread android tablet. Is the hummingbird to slow to handle higher resolution screens? (I really, REALLY hope that is not the case)
Maybe someone with a Archos 101 could prove me wrong (or another android tablet with higher res)???
[...]
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Click to collapse
I once had a Toshiba Folio 100 with a Tegra 2 processor (for 5 days ) and it was just as fast/slow as the Tab. Don't know if Gingerbread is going to make the nvidea processor perform a lot better. As far as I know it is a driver thing.
Except for the browser, I think the Tab is fast enough for me.

This performance thing is relative. For example simon2901 you said htc hd2 has better android performance. I have both tab and hd2 now, nearly tried every android build for hd2 but cant find anything that has the performance that makes me feel really usable. But you think the opposite and this shows how relative this thing can be.
I flashed my tab to jm6 as Justin^Tan and i am agree with him. People say it is silky or very smooth but i all can say is it is smoother then my stock rom. Another proof of how this can be relative.
And i agree with appleflap except browser tab is enough for me too. Browser is enough in most cases for me too but when i browse a fully loaded page with flash it really is a pain.
As from the Gingerbread i only expect is make power drain of some apps more reasonable.

It's the OS... I come from an OS for which bloggers like to make fun (WM 6.5.5), however the custom ROMs for my TP2 were in the end quite fast. And I feel like I had more functionalities
This has nothing to do with Samsung's hardware. The Hummingbird is actually as (more) powerful as what you find in the iPad (And we have more memory with our Tab)
If I were you I would not expect too much from Gingerbread. Doesn't look like much more than a minor upgrade with a few tweaks. Quite different from the move from 2.1 to 2.2 let's put our hope sin Honeycombs...
It's kind of normal, it's a young OS and to be honest it's impressive to see the work that has been accomplished since the first versions of android. Given its quick growth we can hope to see more and more good apps and hopefully improved support for custom ROMs. That said teh Tab doesnt seem so popular among modders and chefs (maybe because of the price ? Or just because Clockwork seems more difficult to develop ?) so I ma not sure we can hope that much for the future for us

Gingerbread actually does have some performance improvements imho. Running it on my nexus one and the screen transitions have improved over Froyo (dare I say - as silky smooth as on the ipad? ). So I would expect the Tab to feel a bit slicker too once it gets some Gingerbread love. Personally, I'm not finding the Tab to be sluggish at all. Running Launcher Pro, JM6 firmware, Miren browser, a few widgets, tons of apps, no live wallpaper, and it's all very smooth.

Jm 6 is that a custom rom or just a minor update, how does it compare to stock, since mine certainly not smooth with miren. I laggs so much only opera is useable
Sent from my GT-P1000 using XDA App

simon2901 said:
Jm 6 is that a custom rom or just a minor update, how does it compare to stock, since mine certainly not smooth with miren. I laggs so much only opera is useable
Sent from my GT-P1000 using XDA App
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Click to collapse
JM6 is a Euro firmware that's been posted in the dev section here. I'm not sure it improves performance compared to stock, but then I flashed this pretty much the same day as I got the Tab so can't really compare . I believe it has some performance improvements with the stock browser, but I prefer Miren anyway. I really don't see any lagging with Miren, or at least none that I can't attribute to poor wifi connections etc. It's certainly way slicker than the stock browser. The pinch to zoom font rendering on stock is appalling whereas on Miren it preserves quality. Not tried Opera on the Tab though I hear it's fast...
Have you tried using a different launcher than stock Touchwiz? Launcher Pro or ADW should both give you improvements in performance.

That so many people's first experiences with it are probably as a demo unit, I can see why they say it doesn't feel as smooth as an iPad.
Aye, you can swap launchers and tweak settings.
But most stores have them running loaded up with widgets, running some livewallpaper, and touchwiz. It IS jerky. Or rather, not as smooth as the iPad.
Ok, so the job still gets done, and as a techy myself, I'm happy with what's doable, but that perception amongst most users is that it's not as smooth as it could be seems to be an obvious win if they can sort it out.
Even on the Tab, bringing the Notifiction bar down; sure it's fast enough, but it doesn't animate as it scrolls down (though if it did, personally I'd want an option to turn that off so it insta dropped!).
That all the hardware coming out now has pretty decent openGL support now, I can see that'll be the main thing in future UI improvements, moving more of it to hardware acceleration. I get a feeling that it's all being done in software.
It can only get better from here. A bit of polish on the first thing most users will see will be hugely beneficial later.

I find almost all of the above judgements entirely false. The OS workd perfectlyt for me without any lag or any kind of lag fixes. Im on JK5.
All it takes is a few shrewd decisions on the software that you use with the OS. My browser doesnt lag - I use the Fennec nighly builds which are silky smooth with opengl rendering and without.
I have removed bloatware and services that clog up the purity of googles stock 2.2.
I do use a task manager to kill certain services on a selewctive basis.
I get 2 days light use out of it, which is just fine!
And there is never any lag anywhere.

Now i must say that i am really bugged out about this Tab, it is super slick, the screen and the form factor is nice, the internals are great ( much the same as the new google developer phone, that should be good?) but still this thing runs poorly on froyo 2.2. Really i dont see people saying this is acceptable, since i really dont think it is, i dont mean to flame, since i love android and phones in generel, but even my Htc hd2 had smoother performance than the tab, i find that hard to be true.
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This is acceptable.
There, I said it. I find it to be perfectly smooth, not sure why you're having a problem with it.
Use DolphinHD as the browser as it offers far more functionality than the default, and use ADW or LauncherPro as the homescreen as they both offer more functionality and better performance than the default.
As mentioned, gingerbread will offer a performance increase, but it's unlikely to be significant. It's entirely possible that Samsung will never port Honeycomb to the tab as they'll want to use it as a selling point for the Galaxy Tab 2 when it eventually comes out (and who knows when that'll be), the future is most likely going to come from custom ROMs if you want to improve the device as it stands.
I always purchase hardware with what CAN be done with it in mind, not what MIGHT be done to it in the future. Hoping for upgrades is a waste of energy, if you don't like the hardware in its initial state, or a state that you can transform it to straight away (rooting it, flashing already available ROMs etc) then don't purchase it, simple as that.

knightnz said:
As mentioned, gingerbread will offer a performance increase, but it's unlikely to be significant. It's entirely possible that Samsung will never port Honeycomb to the tab as they'll want to use it as a selling point for the Galaxy Tab 2 when it eventually comes out (and who knows when that'll be), the future is most likely going to come from custom ROMs if you want to improve the device as it stands.
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Click to collapse
Well, by the time the Galaxy Tab 2 comes out, I would think Samsung would stop officially selling the Galaxy Tab 1 so it wouldn't matter if the Tab1 had Honeycomb or not. Its' not like it would be cutting into Galaxy Tab 2 sales.

well im glad some have good experiences with the web and smoothness of the device, i think i forgot to say that i am currenty on stock rom as i bought it, i read that there is some good performance improvements in the leaked firmware updates, still i would wait rooting, doing all that stuff untill things settle down a bit, it all seems confusing to me atm ( maybe it just is more complicated compared to winmo, htc hd2).
Well reading about the newer firmware out there got me in a better mood, knowing that samsung knows that things are not right yet is very comforting, i mean, i would assume all tabs sold in Denmark have the same firmware as mine, and that means bad performance compared to even the galaxy s, that is not acceptable, not at all.
Saying that this is a phone os and so on and therefore things dont run as expected. is neither acceptable since it should not run worse on a bigger device, i mean android do not discriminate? I am not looking for Ipad performance, since i got one in the household, and i still prefer using the tab, even though browsing is better on Safari (Flash dont work properly atm, rather just use the new youtubeclient, which i enjoy except the quality should be higher( proberly will be in time)
It is great to read your comments, gotta love xda

even if they stop selling galaxy tab 1, if they did release honeycomb into tab 1, people would hold onto their tab 1 if there's no significant upgrade on hardware
but if they dare only giving honeycomb onto tab 2, some people would definitely jump onto tab 2 for sure

It is never ending search for perfection that does not exist.
Something will come tomorrow with better CPU/GPU/screen.....
My experience is good enough. I turned of animation - major cause of lags, left one widget. Everything works just fine for my taste.

Hmm well is that fine Having to turn of animations and not use widgets? i just hope we will see custom roms with newer versions. What firmware v. are you using?
I'm really thinking about trying newer builds
Sent from my GT-P1000 using XDA App

I still don't get the "lag"that everyone is noticing.I'm using dolphin HD and it's perfectly smooth for me. I did root and lagfix, not sure if that is the difference.

paulshields said:
Gingerbread actually does have some performance improvements imho. Running it on my nexus one and the screen transitions have improved over Froyo (dare I say - as silky smooth as on the ipad? ). So I would expect the Tab to feel a bit slicker too once it gets some Gingerbread love. Personally, I'm not finding the Tab to be sluggish at all. Running Launcher Pro, JM6 firmware, Miren browser, a few widgets, tons of apps, no live wallpaper, and it's all very smooth.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cool good to know about the perf improvement
Sad to see the ipad is still "the" reference

SGSII My thoughts on this Phone and Android

I've had the SGSII for about a week now after moving from a Nexus One running CM7, and wow I am impressed.
I know that in the grand scheme of things it's an incremental upgrade - the main reason I left it a while to move - however the SGII has in my view made a significant leap.
The main thing is that the UI is now as smooth and as refined as the iOS devices. I don't know what Samsung did that nobody else in the Android market has managed, but they've finally managed to make things as smooth as the iPhone.
I finally get that delicious feeling of having the UI elements "stick" to my finger as I move them around, rather than chase behind.
While we all know this is a superficial thing and adds little to the actual functionality, I believe this has finally closed the gap in terms of delight in using the device. I hate to use the sickening Apple term, but surely the average user will find just as much "magic" in using the SGSII as any iOS device.
Web browsing is now super smooth (hardware accelerated?) as are the home screens. Going back to my N1 I really feel the difference.
The SGSII is even more buttery smooth than my Asus Transformer running honeycomb.
Hopefully whatever Samsung have done, whether it be related to the chips in the phone or software tweaks, will be copied by all Android devices, and we can put the nagging sense of UI inferiority behind us (and I know the lack of smoothness bugged you no matter how hard you denied it).
Let's hope Android has put stuttering and lagging behind it forever. Well done Samsung.
P.S.
I haven't used the HTC Sensation so I don't know if they too have achieved this, but this is based on my observations of the hardware at my disposal.

About the same as my view of the phone thats why i find it hard to understand the this is a crap phone posts can i have sense on it is their an IOS4 rom for it etc . A if i thought the phone was crap i would have returned it B if i wanted sense i would have bought sense phone .
But yes with Android customers have choice across a broad range of phones and that is why its winning the sales drive .
Looking forward to more Android improvements as this is only really year two of development .
jje

Dont get your point.
I find the IP4 laggy compared to the SGS2 . The i9100 is by far smoother in my opinion

I haven't used or seen a better smartphone. My sgs2 is borderline biblical!

austinchimp said:
The main thing is that the UI is now as smooth and as refined as the iOS devices. I don't know what Samsung did that nobody else in the Android market has managed, but they've finally managed to make things as smooth as the iPhone.
I finally get that delicious feeling of having the UI elements "stick" to my finger as I move them around, rather than chase behind.
While we all know this is a superficial thing and adds little to the actual functionality, I believe this has finally closed the gap in terms of delight in using the device. I hate to use the sickening Apple term, but surely the average user will find just as much "magic" in using the SGSII as any iOS device.
Web browsing is now super smooth (hardware accelerated?) as are the home screens. Going back to my N1 I really feel the difference.
The SGSII is even more buttery smooth than my Asus Transformer running honeycomb.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
u could not have said it any better
what u explained is the MAIN reason i bought this phone
there is no " lag " its just wonderful
what would make this phone perfect is a ROM based of AOSP
which im still waiting for team hacksung to finish its version of CM7

austinchimp said:
The main thing is that the UI is now as smooth and as refined as the iOS devices. I don't know what Samsung did that nobody else in the Android market has managed, but they've finally managed to make things as smooth as the iPhone.
Web browsing is now super smooth (hardware accelerated?) as are the home screens. Going back to my N1 I really feel the difference.
The SGSII is even more buttery smooth than my Asus Transformer running honeycomb.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
samsung has hardware accelerated many parts of the UI. the web browser for example is hardware accelerated, as well as a few other places.
this is why i blast google. they should have been using hardware acceleration from day 1 to give the same smooth UI experience as the iphone. the SGS2 is not doing anything special, its not the dual core making it so smooth. its simply because samsung took the time to optimize the SGS2 with graphics chip, rather than putting the burden on the CPU 100% of the time.
the nexus one would be just as smooth. look at WP7 devices. they all use the same hardware as the n1, but use hardware acceleration and proper drivers, and are the smoothest devices in the world right now.

Well that was my point - How come it's taken so long, and a few generations of Android devices for this to be done? I honestly didn't think it was possible for an Android 2.3 device to be so smooth, I thought there was something fundamental in the architecture that was going to always mean a little lag.
I'd given up any of this generation of Android phones achieving true smooth motion, and here Samsung have done it without this development even being publicised that much.
I totally agree Android should have been like this - it just blows my mind that it's taken so long, and I can see no excuse for any top tier device from any other manufacturer not to match what Samsung have done.
Also, if it is just a case of tuning the software, why haven't/didn't Samsung do it with the SGS I ?

The "this is a crap phone" posts probably mostly come from people who don't own this. ...I know that might sound a little odd but trust me, even in Android communities there are fan-boys, and some actually go that far...

yup. time to throw my htc legend. i play the pinball game. the ball look like teleporting...
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA Premium App

I went from a Nexus One to an iPhone 4, and then to this amazing device. All I have to say is that its been the best experience yet. I actually had lag on my iPhone 4... And very little to none on the SG2. I agree that most people bashing this phone probably don't even own one. I'll definitely be buying an SGS3. Goodbye HTC and to their ****ty voice/speaker quality and locked bootloaders. And hello Samsung.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk

Its hard to understand why people love this device soo much unless you actually ownit. This phone seems to give the feeling that android should have been this fluid from the beginning. There is no device (including the sensation) that operates as smoothly as the sgs2. I love this phone.

gstar_raw said:
I went from a Nexus One to an iPhone 4, and then to this amazing device. All I have to say is that its been the best experience yet. I actually had lag on my iPhone 4... And very little to none on the SG2. I agree that most people bashing this phone probably don't even own one. I'll definitely be buying an SGS3. Goodbye HTC and to their ****ty voice/speaker quality and locked bootloaders. And hello Samsung.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk
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Click to collapse
GS3! Wow...the rumours, are TOO GOOD. Anything Apple pull out of the bag, even next year would simple pale in comparison to the GS3.

Posts like these makes me anxious to get mine. Still waiting on UPS!
If Samsung did some hardware/driver acceleration magic, I wonder if CM7 and the other AOSP ROM project will be able to take advantage of this as well. I don't want the stock ROM to be the only super smooth and slick ROM available.

austinchimp said:
Well that was my point - How come it's taken so long, and a few generations of Android devices for this to be done? I honestly didn't think it was possible for an Android 2.3 device to be so smooth, I thought there was something fundamental in the architecture that was going to always mean a little lag.
I'd given up any of this generation of Android phones achieving true smooth motion, and here Samsung have done it without this development even being publicised that much.
I totally agree Android should have been like this - it just blows my mind that it's taken so long, and I can see no excuse for any top tier device from any other manufacturer not to match what Samsung have done.
Also, if it is just a case of tuning the software, why haven't/didn't Samsung do it with the SGS I ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it hasnt taken too long. the original galaxy s also had hardware acceleration in the browser for example. only the international version, but it was lightening fast and smooth as butter. it only is because samsung took the initiative and did a custom job. google certainly hasnt implemented it yet, and in ice cream sandwich they claim it will come.
i'm right there with you, manufacturers should have been pushing for a UI experience that matches apple's.

since the op is sharing thoughts about the device, i'll share mine too. i FINALLY received it in the mail today. opened the box, the device is bigger than it looks in the online review (coming from a nexus s 4g). the thin factor is impressive, but not as impressive as i was expecting. the smoothness is there as expected, but the "S" boot image is freakishly laggy--no big deal.
camera-really good
screen-what can i say? super amoled plus looks great,
hardware finish/quality-pretty good...but i prefer the smooth back over the textured back--no big deal
touchwiz 4.0-hmm, this is tough, i need to play with it some more. samsung obviously put a lot to this UI, but so far it doesnt seem as refined as other skins...for example, the default lock screen is kind of laggy, and is a pain sometimes to fully move the lockscreen so that it unlocks. numerical battery percentage would be nice without having to go into settings...other than these minor gripes, i love the touchwiz widgets.
obviously samsung has really tried to outdo itself and competitors, and the sgs II is perhaps the best android phone out there. but as of right now, it doesn't really give me that "wow" factor despite all its features. but i've only had it for one day and haven't gotten to test out the dual core, dlna, and other features.

Mass Placebo Effect on Lag

Seriously I have yet to experience any lag. I've heard much less on the subject for the 12 edition in the galaxy note than the new 14 edition of the note and I've used both daily for high intensity work applications. My 12 edition has been rooted deodexed debloated and is still way slower than my 14 edition unrooted stock. I have to say either xda has been hijacked by apple fans or those early reviews really put a bunch of people with a very critical outlook. Anyway I'm enjoying it......just my 37 dollars in change

jaztech said:
Seriously I have yet to experience any lag. I've heard much less on the subject for the 12 edition in the galaxy note than the new 14 edition of the note and I'very used both daily for high intensity work applications. My 12 edition has been rooted deodexed debloated and is still way slower than my 14 edition unrooted stock. I have to say either xda has been hijacked by apple fans or those early reviews really put a bunch of people with a very critical outlook. Anyway I'm enjoying it so that's all that matters to me....just my 37 dollars in change
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Click to collapse
I think people may have been hypersensitive to lag after the first few main reviews seemed to focus on the lag in the My Magazine app and a few other samsung apps. I know I was looking for it right out of the box because of them. I don't see much at all and consider it a very fast tablet that will probably only get faster in time

atg284 said:
I think people may have been hypersensitive to lag after the first few main reviews seemed to focus on the lag in the My Magazine app and a few other samsung apps. I know I was looking for it right out of the box because of them. I don't see much at all and consider it a very fast tablet that will probably only get faster
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+1

OTA update may have also helped, it came out after reviews.

ddavtian said:
OTA update may have also helped, it came out after reviews.
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Click to collapse
Ah yes that too...forgot about that!

What I didn't like about all reviews that complained about the lag was that they had no videos of it like they normally do in reviews, so I called BS from thr start. It felt like everyone just wanted to bash Samsung because they weren't Apple.

the 2012 edition had lots of reviews with lag. i believe the verge caught hell because they wined about the lag but had battery saving turned on. the defended themselves and said the lag was still there after turning it off.
there is real lag in the device, especially in heavy graphic websites. but since this lag/stutter seems to be there in every android device i've had i'd say it's an android thing instead of device specific - i'm at 21 android tablets owned at one time or another. it's on phones too, even on the snapdragon s4 but phones are so small that the stutters and imperfections are reduced to the point they're not as noticeable.
one thing i noticed yesterday is that holding the tablet vertically (portrait) induced less lag in reading the desktop version of theoldreader than holding it landscape. i'm sure there was another tablet that was under fire for not using the gpu equally in vertical and horizontal orientation.
also, i'm still on the shipped rom as i haven't taken the update yet, so some of my issues may be fixed after the update.

It appears to be one app causing the lag and not the UI or anywhere else. Some of the reviews even point out it is probably a problem with the third party app. Some kind of photo album app?
As far as the device IMO:
1. Priced $50 too high for both verisons. Seems that should have been prices for a 32/64 gb model.
2. Why no 3.0 USB? This must be produced in a different place, else would have had same connector as the Note 3.
3. Should have had a a little bigger battery.
4. Even though no 3.0, NICE there is a standard usb rather than special connector- I hate those.
5. Too much bloat (as usual)
6. Why no HDMI out??
I was going to get the Asus 701, but I know it will have a special connector and apparently will be different than the 700 version. I will probably wait for the 32GB Samsung 2014 version to be at a lower price during some kind of sale, or whatever. My Nook HD+ will cover my Android needs for now. I also have an iPad 4 that covers commercial gaming. HD+ is for comics, video and emulators.

Why the fascination with Kit Kat?

I see so many posts with people gnashing their teeth with anticipation for the upgrade to Kit Kat. I have to ask: Why? Most of the features that we experience are no longer in the Android OS but in Google Play Services. Google does that on purpose so that we, the users, can get upgrades to features without relying on the OEM or phone carrier. The Android OS has become the layer that talks to the hardware.
I've had Kit Kat on my original Galaxy Tab 10.1 for months and don't really notice any features that aren't on my Note 10.1. In fact, with the changes in the way the XD card is handled in Kit Kat I'd think that one would want to avoid it for a while until that's resolved (if ever).

I don't care about the actual android version, what I'm looking forward to is bugfixes and performance/stability improvements to the OS from Samsung.
Like the screen shaking for example. Needs to be fixed imho.
In short: I'd rather have a perfect 4.3 than buggy 4.4!

TabGuy said:
I see so many posts with people gnashing their teeth with anticipation for the upgrade to Kit Kat. I have to ask: Why? Most of the features that we experience are no longer in the Android OS but in Google Play Services. Google does that on purpose so that we, the users, can get upgrades to features without relying on the OEM or phone carrier. The Android OS has become the layer that talks to the hardware.
I've had Kit Kat on my original Galaxy Tab 10.1 for months and don't really notice any features that aren't on my Note 10.1. In fact, with the changes in the way the XD card is handled in Kit Kat I'd think that one would want to avoid it for a while until that's resolved (if ever).
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Kitkat is optomized to run on lower end hardware leading to great speed and stability increases on high end hardware. More stable faster and smooher. Can't argue with that. And Google does that so they can still say android is "open" while controlling our experience all the same
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TabGuy said:
I've had Kit Kat on my original Galaxy Tab 10.1 for months and don't really notice any features that aren't on my Note 10.1. In fact, with the changes in the way the XD card is handled in Kit Kat I'd think that one would want to avoid it for a while until that's resolved (if ever).
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Click to collapse
I agree with that. I installed Kat Kat on my S4 recently and biggest change I see as a user is several of my apps are broken because the new SD Card limitations in Kit Kat. Depending on your priorities you may be better off with 4.3

Duly.noted said:
Kitkat is optomized to run on lower end hardware leading to great speed and stability increases on high end hardware. More stable faster and smooher. Can't argue with that. And Google does that so they can still say android is "open" while controlling our experience all the same
Sent from my SCH-I605 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see no speed difference with the S4. Rooted S4 with 4.3 is just as fast and same battery life. No exaggeration here, since really do not see a difference. It is already fast.
Seems the only marginal way to improve speed would be kernel level. My Note 2014 is peppy already too.
Apps open as instantly as could be expected and smooth performance.

hopes for kitkat is mainly for their new optimizations for the tablet. korean's 4.3 latest patch increased our tab's performance greatly, unfortunately the US model doesn't have as much luck.. yet. i hope to see kitkat and wishing that their optimizations will make this tab manage memory better, the stock apps working smoother, and overall touch wiz integrations becoming more fluid.

rushless said:
I see no speed difference with the S4. Rooted S4 with 4.3 is just as fast and same battery life. No exaggeration here, since really do not see a difference. It is already fast.
Seems the only marginal way to improve speed would be kernel level. My Note 2014 is peppy already too.
Apps open as instantly as could be expected and smooth performance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While you might not see a difference personally most people have reported a significant speed increase between 4.3 and 4.4 on every device. When hacked 4.3 compared to 4.4 it might not be as noticeable but hacked 4.4 blows hacked 4.3 out of the water. Of course it might not be so in your personal perceptions
Sent from my SCH-I605 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

I want KitKat because I hope that the multi user support is also included.

Duly.noted said:
While you might not see a difference personally most people have reported a significant speed increase between 4.3 and 4.4 on every device. When hacked 4.3 compared to 4.4 it might not be as noticeable but hacked 4.4 blows hacked 4.3 out of the water. Of course it might not be so in your personal perceptions
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unhacked S4 4.3 vs unhacked S4 4.4 is about the same performance-wise. It looks like they may have sped up the animations a bit (but I could have done that myself before). By the time animations finish and screen finishes redrawing is about the same time.

foo said:
I want KitKat because I hope that the multi user support is also included.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Multi-user support is on my Note. But I won't use it. When I used it on my rooted Tab 10.1 it slowed things down and consumed battery life. Unless you absolutely need it, say for kids, then I'd stay far away from multi-user.

I'm hoping for a better integration with bt keyboard, I rooted my device and installed an app called blue tooth keyboard monitor so it doesn't drop the connection after 5 seconds now but I've seen a lot of other people with the same problem and samsung referred by complaint to a product specialist so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that there will be a better solution

sequence2469 said:
I'm hoping for a better integration with bt keyboard, I rooted my device and installed an app called blue tooth keyboard monitor so it doesn't drop the connection after 5 seconds now but I've seen a lot of other people with the same problem and samsung referred by complaint to a product specialist so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that there will be a better solution
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I use a Logitech keyboard with my Note and it's never lost connection. Been using it all day for the last week. Maybe 8 hours per day.

TabGuy said:
I use a Logitech keyboard with my Note and it's never lost connection. Been using it all day for the last week. Maybe 8 hours per day.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
interesting I have a Logitech k810 which I've tested with my s3 an iPad and an asus transformer with no loss of connection, I've seen people who say it could be a h/w problem but since the performance has improved since rooting and the addition of the bt app I was hoping that it isn't a h/w issue especially since I've already rooted it I've tried changing every setting possible

Any update would be welcome in Europe. The performance boost and the multiuser support of MK1 are still USA only for most users.

TabGuy said:
Multi-user support is on my Note. But I won't use it. When I used it on my rooted Tab 10.1 it slowed things down and consumed battery life. Unless you absolutely need it, say for kids, then I'd stay far away from multi-user.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, kids I have a 4-year-old son and he loves to play angry birds on the tablet. I usually keep an eye on him when I give him the tablet but I would feel better if there was no way he could "press the wrong button".

Duly.noted said:
While you might not see a difference personally most people have reported a significant speed increase between 4.3 and 4.4 on every device. When hacked 4.3 compared to 4.4 it might not be as noticeable but hacked 4.4 blows hacked 4.3 out of the water. Of course it might not be so in your personal perceptions
Sent from my SCH-I605 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its fine for you not to notice a difference. Most of us however notice a major dofference between kk and jb. Its a matter pf perception. If you were happy already you wont notice it as much if at all. We notice it instantly because kk is much much smoother.
Sent from my SCH-I605 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

Duly.noted said:
Its fine for you not to notice a difference. Most of us however notice a major dofference between kk and jb. Its a matter pf perception. If you were happy already you wont notice it as much if at all. We notice it instantly because kk is much much smoother.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree (on the S4) kit kat is much smoother (which I think of as: more consistent frame rates during the animations, lack of stutter). Most of the apps loaded pretty quickly in 4.3 though and I've not noticed much difference with those. Some improvements I have noticed: some apps that were particularly laggy before (S. Memo, Dialer (when switching to and from contacts), and Calculator) are zippier now.
I've also noticed that there are some improvements (not performance-related though) in the way the email app handles exchange accounts.

sequence2469 said:
I'm hoping for a better integration with bt keyboard, I rooted my device and installed an app called blue tooth keyboard monitor so it doesn't drop the connection after 5 seconds now but I've seen a lot of other people with the same problem and samsung referred by complaint to a product specialist so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that there will be a better solution
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have to agree with the poster who also responded to you.. I was using a cheap "Poetic" keyboard initially and it would drop connection all the time. Since then I have switched to a Kensington keyboard and the connection stays solid all day every day. Paid more for that keybooard too, of course.

cyburke said:
I have to agree with the poster who also responded to you.. I was using a cheap "Poetic" keyboard initially and it would drop connection all the time. Since then I have switched to a Kensington keyboard and the connection stays solid all day every day. Paid more for that keybooard too, of course.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So it sounds like I possibly do have a hardware issue, which is strange because I thought that if the bt antenna didn't work properly I would have no connectivity at all. Actually the first thing I did after trying to change every setting possible was to buy another keyboard (that actually cost less than the Logitech k810; which I believe to be a quality product ). Unfortunately I had the same problem with the connection dropping after a short period of inactivity. I've read just about every thread on xda, and have yet to resolve the problem, so I may be stuck. Since I've already rooted my device I doubt there is any chance of returning it, at least not very easily. hmm?

Nexus 9 and Tegra based tablets are "Tablets to Avoid"

My nexus 9 recently started doing this...
Credit to Andrew Spyker
I've always had Nexus items.. First gen Nexus tablet, second, 3rd.. hell I have a nexus Q
So with this new issue I've run the gamut of Nexus 9 issues. Frisbee backplate, speed that, so you have a reference understandable to the human mind, ill describe as glacial. Charge to 100% eta. 2017. I got stuck on android 5.0.0 because.. who the hell knows. And now randomly my tablet has what I can only describe as seizures. HTC wants me to RMA it.. but you know what, I do not want to RMA it because then I'd be given another one and I would rather have the current one blow up in my face then to subject myself to the false hope of receiving a replacement and assuming, nay believing that all is well.
This is twice Nvidia has been contracted to put a processor in a Nexus and this is the second time the result has been total complete garbage. The entire Nexus9 experience has gotten me closer than I have ever been to buying an Ipad.. Google's and to an extent all Android tablet makers ability to get a tablet produced that even comes close to an Ipad in its ability to run the same way every day has been weighed and measured and found wanting.
The phones, which by all accounts are still their main focus have not suffered like the tablets so I will continue to enjoy them.
They seem to be unable to produce a table that is consistent or compelling and are thus going through the motions and just making a tablet because they have to.. So the Ipad decision is because quite frankly Apple does "going through the motions" better than Samsung/Google/HTC apparently can.
Maybe this will all change.. maybe it will not. At some point I will make the change these manufacturers will not. One thing I will not do is be suckered into a new tablet every 12 months.
More...

I'm not happy with my Nexus 9 either. It's lacking in both hardware and software.
Hardware:
- backlight bleeding
- too heavy
- flex in the back cover
- battery life is not that great
Software:
- random reboots / crashes
- RAM bug (causing chrome tab reloads for example)
- slow performance occasionally (probably caused by the RAM bug)
- software updates were rather slow for a Nexus device, we had to wait months for 5.1.1
I don't have any hope that Android M will fix any of the software problems. The Nexus 9 has been out for almost a year and there hasn't really been much improvement since the release.
I would like to buy an iPad mini 4 (never owned an iPhone or iPad, but I think there are no good Android tablets out there), the problem is that the Nexus 9 has a bad resell value (<250€) and the iPad mini 4 costs 389€ and I really don't feel like spending that much on a tablet again considering that I haven't even had the Nexus 9 for a year.

Asus zenpad 8.0 S. ... Love mine, sold my Nexus 9 to buy it. Super thin, great screen but get the CA version

I jumped on the bandwagon and bought the 32gb N9 from Google Play in December. After a month of use I felt it was an "okay" tablet. Last month I inherited an iPad Air 1st gen. The iPad gives a much more gratifying user experience.
I feel that Google really blew it with the N9, rushing to get a tablet out and winding up with a rush product at a premium price. I will be much more reluctant to go with another Google product in the future.

I don't know but I actually love my tablet... The biggest gripe I have with it is the tabs in Chrome refreshing, but besides that the tablet works great... There is a small light bleed but nothing as bad as my G3... Sorry to hear you guys had a bad batch, but what might have helped my tablet experience is that I rooted mine and running dirty unicorn...
Sent from my Nexus 9 using XDA Free mobile app

cables2590 said:
I don't know but I actually love my tablet... The biggest gripe I have with it is the tabs in Chrome refreshing, but besides that the tablet works great...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here. And my N9 is bone stock.

hardware is fine, but the drivers running it are crap. stutters, background task getting killed, refresh on tabs when browsing, touching the screen ramps up the processors (it's why the browser uses more power than the screen, each touch takes a crap-ton of power. a few updates back fixed it to 1/2 but still is too much. lowering it to 800 and it stutters, my other tablets only ramp up to 300 with no stutter)... as crappy as samsung is with support i'd have gotten a better tablet sticking with them. i've tried four different roms with the same results and was on stock/rooted for the longest with fire-ice kernel.

I assume you've done a full wipe and ruled out it being a software bug?
If the company is offering to RMA a defective unit in favor of a non-defective one and you turn them down how is that Nexus/HTC/Android/whomever's fault other than your own?
Other than the backlight bleed I don't have too many issues with my Nexus. And that was purchasing a refurb scratch/dent 32gb model from Amazon Warehouse for $290. Is it what I'd expect for a $290 tablet? Absolutely.
I'd consider an iPad Air 2, but those guys are $600 and won't sync up quite the same as all my other crap. Or alternatively the Mini 4 ($500).

Mine is on Preview M unencrypted. I really like it. My 10 is a fine tablet, as well. The 7's I've had I've never really liked.
The apple tablets I've tried seem no different to me. I've even changed my Window animation scale 1, Transition animation scale 1 and Animator duration scale 1.5 and it acts just like an apple tablet.

The freeze on OP's video is caused by an undervolt-powersave thing. It has been reported many times and only an RMA can save you from that.
The RAM deficiency is caused by the one and only Chrome that consumes a ****load of ram on any platform. It fills my G3's 3 GBs of ram in just 5 tabs.
Just use another browser.

ive got a sluggish n9, backlight bleed and a few reboots. battery life is weak...
love aspect ratio though and still think this is still a good tablet overall...

There is no way anyone that is happy with this tablet uses multiple profiles on a regular basis.
If you fresh boot and sign into one user things are ok... not horrible or super fast but ok. Sign in to an additional profile and the tablet goes to complete hell. Stutters, stalls, crashes, etc.
Really sucks because its shared between myself and my girlfriend. This has been the case since 5.0.1 through 6.0 preview 3.

People are never happy with what they have. Yes the tablet has a few issue here and there. Very little consumer grade electronics are "perfect" there will always be something that bugs you.
I like this tab, took a little tweaking, as it usually does with any device to reach the standards of a "current XDA'r".
But at the very LEAST i would disagree with this being a tab to avoid.
Sent from my Nexus 9 using Tapatalk 4

No offense but your optimism does not apply here. Get off the koolaid

osiris355 said:
No offense but your optimism does not apply here. Get off the koolaid
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The incredible pessimism doesn't apply here, nor belong, either. Get off the juice.

RickInHouston said:
The incredible pessimism doesn't apply here, nor belong, either. Get off the juice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
His post is misleading and mine is not pessimism when its reality. Everyone knows this tablet has issues worse than typical bugs or hardware annoyances.
Edit: I just finished flashing 6.0. I can't believe I am saying this but it looks like google has finally fixed most of the performance issues. I can finally load up multiple profiles/chrome browsing and it doesn't start hanging/crashing. 1 year later and they finally got it right. Too bad it still heats up when gaming but that's not as big of a deal.

I love mine personally, there is a tiny hint of backlight bleeding but it's hardly noticeable. Battery life isn't that great, but that's the only downside for me. It always gets me through 2 days of use anyway since I have a phone for other functions. I also would gladly take a slight issue or two for the vastly superior sound setup for media consumption. Apple could maybe get my buck if they integrated FF speakers, and good ones at that. Until then the Nexus is the best for me. I was also thinking about the Asus 8.0 too, it looks good but it's too damned small. I actually think my Nexus is a bit small too, but it's the biggest and best tab I could get for under $300

I've had all sorts of issues with my Nexus 9. Software is better now than it used to be. But up until 5.1.1, multitasking made me want to kill kittens. It's more usable now with the latest 5.1.1 revision on the Pure Nexus ROM and Fire kernel. Except for Chrome, even XDA makes it choke. HD video performance is hit or miss, MX player with Tegra plug-ins was OK and other media apps stutter with high bit rates. I'm not on M now but when I tried it the battery life improved so there is that to look forward to.
The screen bleed on the bottom has gotten worse.
I learned my lesson and won't buy Nexus products again till they are on the market for a while and are thoroughly reviewed/patched.

Stock feels a little clunky on the Nexus 9. Installed CM and it feels much smoother. Overall, I am fairly pleased with mine.
Then again, I do not use Chrome, rather I use Firefox with Adblock+.

I have has both gen 7, and now the 9. I have also had iPads' and a Sony Tablet.
The 1st gen 7 was my favorite. Its form factor felt the best in my hand, the 2nd while faster was uncomfortable to hold. I'm not an Apple fan but work gave me an iPad 2. I rarely used it. Seemed okay. The Sony Z3 Tablet Compact has AMAZING quality. I just wish I could put AOSP on it, not a fan of the Sony tweaks, but over all its made from great materials and its very smooth to operate.
The 9 for me has been great so far. I did the following as soon as I got it, these are things I generally do to EVERY Android device when I get it.
* Change DPI to the screens native DPI (288 in this case)
* Added a line in build.prop to enable hardware UI rendering. <-- not sure if this is really needed anymore so I continue to add it until I'm told its not.
* Hard code the DNS used to the Google DNS servers
* Set all animation scales to .5
* Force GPU rendering to ON
I have never had any crashing or RAM management issues. I DO have the light bleeding issue, but not bad enough to really complain about.