Database Users

"Sprint expects to launch Android 2.2 in the near future" (except Hero and Moment)

"Sprint expects to launch Android 2.2 in the near future" (except Hero and Moment)
A bit misleading... Link goes to Sprint's BAW forum where the excitement quickly turned to anger about Sprint abandoning currently shipping phones and users stuck in contracts. Despite the headline, only the Evo will be getting the 2.2 upgrade from Sprint.
Originally Posted by twitter.com/sprint:
Sprint expects to launch Android 2.2 in the near future - http://bit.ly/d0HRgj
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From Sprint link...
SprintEmployee JGatSprint says:
... 2.2 will not be available for HTC Hero or Samsung Moment
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I thought that when 2.2 was announced at the big Google press event, HTC's CEO was quoted as saying that all currently shipping HTC phones would be getting the upgrade...? I'll see if I can dig up that quote.
Ah, nevermind. I found the quote and it was regarding 2.1.

I just saw the tweet, and I don't think it includes the hero, but I did hear something on that about them getting 2.2..
Sent from my HERO200 using XDA App

cool! good job for sprint!

radxcoresteven said:
I just saw the tweet, and I don't think it includes the hero, but I did hear something on that about them getting 2.2..
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No, you heard that all currently available Android phones would be getting the 2.1 update. That was when all us Hero owners were clamoring for the 2.0 upgrade.

Oh, and the good news is that we don't need HTC or Sprint to do this for us. We're fortunate enough to have a community of developers that are working hard to put out a Froyo update compatible with the Hero. Remember to tip them well, kiddos, because Sprint just left you behind. Oh, and tell your Sprint rep that this is why you rooted your phone.

They're melting down over at the official sprint forums.

gunnyman said:
They're melting down over at the official sprint forums.
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Drop a bomb that size, you better expect nuclear fallout. If darchstar, damageless and TrevE can get Froyo on the Hero, Sprint and HTC could as well. They just want people to keep upgrading. Good business sense; poor customer support.

All you need to do is have enough of publicity about this and they'll have to do something about it.
Imagine top tech headlines;
"Sprint drops support for currently shipping phones... refuses to update firmware", "Would you trust Sprint again...", "Angry Sprint Android owners demand a refund"
...and the last one "Sprint agrees to update older android phones’ software after many complaints from customers"

obsanity said:
All you need to do is have enough of publicity about this and they'll have to do something about it.
Imagine top tech headlines;
"Sprint drops support for currently shipping phones... refuses to update firmware", "Would you trust Sprint again...", "Angry Sprint Android owners demand a refund"
...and the last one "Sprint agrees to update older android phones’ software after many complaints from customers"
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Good luck with that. I'm not sure they care. It's business. Besides, like I said, just tell them these types of decisions are why *ahem* some dude you know *cough* rooted his phone and he knows some guys that are working on putting 2.2 on the Hero right now.

subcypher said:
Oh, and the good news is that we don't need HTC or Sprint to do this for us. We're fortunate enough to have a community of developers that are working hard to put out a Froyo update compatible with the Hero.
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Posts like this are a pet peeve of mine. Not to discredit the great work that the community dev's do, but community generated ROMs that are cobbled together from other devices are NOT the same as vendor-genuine ROMs from HTC/Sprint. While in MANY ways the community ROMs are far superior, they lack the hardware-specific code (kernel drivers, etc...) that only the OEM can provide. Consistently, the most stable and fully-functional community ROMs are those based off of hardware-accurate vendor ROMs (like Fresh, based off of the shipping RUU). The ROMs derived from other devices are far more likely to have caveats such as "fully-functional except for the camera, sensors, martini shaker, ..." (I don't know what part of the term "FULLY-functional" is unclear to some devs).
While it is inevitable that the community devs WILL create a 2.2 ROM, it will not be of the same caliber that would be possible with a genuine vendor ROM to use as a starting point.

i guess you havent run. darchdroid heh
Sent from my HERO200 using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk

cmccracken said:
Posts like this are a pet peeve of mine. Not to discredit the great work that the community dev's do, but community generated ROMs that are cobbled together from other devices are NOT the same as vendor-genuine ROMs from HTC/Sprint. While in MANY ways the community ROMs are far superior, they lack the hardware-specific code (kernel drivers, etc...) that only the OEM can provide. Consistently, the most stable and fully-functional community ROMs are those based off of hardware-accurate vendor ROMs (like Fresh, based off of the shipping RUU). The ROMs derived from other devices are far more likely to have caveats such as "fully-functional except for the camera, sensors, martini shaker, ..." (I don't know what part of the term "FULLY-functional" is unclear to some devs).
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Darch Droid is fully functional now. Took some time to get things figured out but now that he knows how to get it working. It shouldn't be any issue on future releases...once we get kernel code.
Not to mention that, our drivers are there in these roms, just quirky.

cmccracken said:
Posts like this are a pet peeve of mine. Not to discredit the great work that the community dev's do, but community generated ROMs that are cobbled together from other devices are NOT the same as vendor-genuine ROMs from HTC/Sprint. While in MANY ways the community ROMs are far superior, they lack the hardware-specific code (kernel drivers, etc...) that only the OEM can provide. Consistently, the most stable and fully-functional community ROMs are those based off of hardware-accurate vendor ROMs (like Fresh, based off of the shipping RUU). The ROMs derived from other devices are far more likely to have caveats such as "fully-functional except for the camera, sensors, martini shaker, ..." (I don't know what part of the term "FULLY-functional" is unclear to some devs).
While it is inevitable that the community devs WILL create a 2.2 ROM, it will not be of the same caliber that would be possible with a genuine vendor ROM to use as a starting point.
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Doth mine ears deceive me? Are you saying that just because an Android developer works for HTC and Sprint that he's better than the hobbyists that hang out here? I think you missed the whole point of open source.
And, yes, fully-functional may take some time, but it usually happens. Kernel and drivers always come out and are adjusted as needed. As gunnyman said, Darchdroid 2.7 is fully functional. My point is that they're doing what they're doing and doing it well. Sprint/HTC could do it, but they're choosing not to, forcing users to upgrade. Again, one of the benefits of open source.
So, why the pet peeve? I'm just curious. I'm not sure if you're serious or trolling. You're on these forums, so either you're into custom ROMs or you're some kind of troll. If you're into ROMs, why are you bashing devs, because whether you meant to or not, that's what you're doing with this post. You're basically saying, "Cool painting, Picasso, but you'll never be Monet." WTF?

subcypher said:
Good luck with that. I'm not sure they care. It's business. Besides, like I said, just tell them these types of decisions are why *ahem* some dude you know *cough* rooted his phone and he knows some guys that are working on putting 2.2 on the Hero right now.
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I gotta keep this phone until next March so I'm kinda stuck unless I wanna shell out 500 for another phone with this one is 2.5 months old. Well, I don't want to and I can't afford to play this game. So, when we get a 2.2 for the Hero that works like it's supposed to I can hopefully stick with Flipz FreshROM and i'm donating at least 50 to that guy. Between him, Damage and all the other guys with the time and skill to do this they've earned 100x that.

subcypher said:
And, yes, fully-functional may take some time, but it usually happens. Kernel and drivers always come out and are adjusted as needed. As gunnyman said, Darchdroid 2.7 is fully functional. My point is that they're doing what they're doing and doing it well. Sprint/HTC could do it, but they're choosing not to, forcing users to upgrade. Again, one of the benefits of open source.
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cmcraken has a point though, Darchdroid is only fully functional because it is based on the 2.1 RUU made specifically for the hero. Until that RUU hit the streets, every previous 2.1 ROM was handicapped in some form or other. If Sprint/HTC doesn't develop a 2.2 RUU specifically for the Hero, the best the devs will be able to do is get us as close as possible, but never spot on.

subcypher said:
Doth mine ears deceive me? Are you saying that just because an Android developer works for HTC and Sprint that he's better than the hobbyists that hang out here? I think you missed the whole point of open source.
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I'm saying that the community developers will never have access to the resources that the vendor devs do. They will never have access to the low-level engineering data that the vendors keep behind locked doors, nor the source code for things like SenseUI. Reverse engineering can only get you so far.
I understand full well what the point of open-source is. the problem is that these phones as a whole are definitively NOT open-source. Only a small portion of the total package is open-source, and even a major portion of that (the Linux kernel source code) is a colossal PITA to get our hands on. Despite the open-source sales pitch on Android phones, they aren't very open-source in implementation.

cmccracken said:
I'm saying that the community developers will never have access to the resources that the vendor devs do. They will never have access to the low-level engineering data that the vendors keep behind locked doors, nor the source code for things like SenseUI. Reverse engineering can only get you so far.
I understand full well what the point of open-source is. the problem is that these phones as a whole are definitively NOT open-source. Only a small portion of the total package is open-source, and even a major portion of that (the Linux kernel source code) is a colossal PITA to get our hands on. Despite the open-source sales pitch on Android phones, they aren't very open-source in implementation.
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I see your point and concede to you on this. Well played, sir. I think, though, that given the status of what has come before, that we can expect great things from reverse engineering. Hopefully, with the things I've been reading about Google and Android specifically, that things will change with Froyo. I've heard rumblings about making Android one package, the things HTC wants to do another package and the things Sprint wants to do a third package, that way Android updates can continue and the other guys have to keep up if they want us using their stuff.
Longshot? Yes. The way it should be? Yes.

subcypher said:
Longshot? Yes. The way it should be? Yes.
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Ditto. The vendor support (or lack thereof) and OS fragmentation is absolutely killing Android. 1.5 million iPhone 4's sold so far despite it being inferior to the Evo on all fronts. The reason? Apple. They fix bugs for their devices and provide added functionality via regular software updates. iOS 4 is provided as an upgrade to the iPhone 3G, released July 2008. Sprint can't even provide updates for a phone that's less than a year old. These Android vendors have got to get on the same page and start playing by Apple's rules if they want to compete with Apple.

subcypher said:
Drop a bomb that size, you better expect nuclear fallout. If darchstar, damageless and TrevE can get Froyo on the Hero, Sprint and HTC could as well. They just want people to keep upgrading. Good business sense; poor customer support.
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100% agree

GPS Fix and Froyo ETAs

Since a new thread seams to pop up every day asking for ETA's I suppose we can have a thread specifically discussing what we ACTUALLY know. Here is what "I" know at the moment.
GPS Fix
Currently there is a leaked firmware (see development forum) that looks like it improves the GPS functionality nicely. This has a build date of Sept 7th so it is fairly new. Due to certain issues, this appears to be a beta still. However, it does have the TMO apps on it so it is further along than a pre-carrier build. Given a beta cycle of a couple of weeks, if this goes out as an OTA, it would look to be at the end of the month at best.
It has been reported in another thread that TMO will start rolling out a GPS/Lag fix on Sept 20th. This is most likely based on, or is, the leaked ROM that you can find in the dev section. So far, reports on the GPS fix are "mostly" positive.
Froyo (Android 2.2.)
There have been no leaked ROMs for the Vibrant yet although there is for international versions. Samsung_mobile on twitter said Froyo at the end of September. Given the information in the previous section, it seems an interim build may be coming to TMO first, before a Froyo is pushed out. This one though is a complete unknown besides from that twitter post.
It is currently expected that Samsung will release a Froyo build TO CARRIERS on Sept 23rd. We are not likely to see a Froyo update for at least 45 days after that if not longer depending on how long it takes TMO to "wiz it up"

GPS is working very nicely for me on that new rom with no issues.

I was locking onto 6 birds yesterday. All stock. WHATUP NOW
Still take some froyo though haaa
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

While I appreciate that the leaked ROM may be working for you, a lot of people dont want to mess with ROMs and are more interested in an official update. Although you can install that ROM today, we have no actual date of an official release.

KerryG said:
While I appreciate that the leaked ROM may be working for you, a lot of people dont want to mess with ROMs and are more interested in an official update. Although you can install that ROM today, we have no actual date of an official release.
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Yeah, if we are lucky, we may get it by the time Google releases Android 3.0 in October....
I am sooo disappointed that every Android manufacturer locks down their product so tight, that without their cooperation, the phones are simply not upgradable to the new OS versions. In a way it's worse than dealing with the iPhone

Wake up dude. It has nothing to do with that and EVERYTHING to do with testing and finishing drivers, UI, etc. People complain about a buggy release then demand updates right away. Its not going to happen.

couped said:
Wake up dude. It has nothing to do with that and EVERYTHING to do with testing and finishing drivers, UI, etc. People complain about a buggy release then demand updates right away. Its not going to happen.
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Nope.
Samsung can test the OS in advance, so they can get their drivers ready for launch. Both HTC and Moto did it, and Moto is hardly the most responsive company out there.
And the UI, it's crap, IMO. But if Samsung thinks TouchWiz is so great and important, then spin it off and make it available in Market, when ready.
There is really no good excuse for the delay. Samsung is just not dedicating the resources they need to.

MacGuy2006 said:
Nope.
Samsung can test the OS in advance, so they can get their drivers ready for launch. Both HTC and Moto did it, and Moto is hardly the most responsive company out there.
And the UI, it's crap, IMO. But if Samsung thinks TouchWiz is so great and important, then spin it off and make it available in Market, when ready.
There is really no good excuse for the delay. Samsung is just not dedicating the resources they need to.
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are you serious?
I think you need a new hobby...

There is really no good excuse for the delay.
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Obviously someone that hasn't been in the software development field.

Amen.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

In T-mobile/Samsung's defense...
When the first update for the G1 came out, it released in the UK before it hit the U.S.
Turns out that there was some kind of security bug in it, and they actually had to stop offering the update.
The testing aspect is why these updates take so long. It takes longer to test (and fix minor issues) than to correct the main problem.
What it boils down to is that no one really knows these devices in and out. You have cameras from one company, radios from another company, GPS chipsets from a third company, processors from a 4th, etc... and on top of it all your OS is written by a company that is very new to the electronics business.
The problem is the pace of technology.... sure you could pay 2 or 3 geniuses $100,000 a year for 2 years to learn every idiosyncrasy of ONE of your devices... but does that make sense when you have 2 or 3 new models going to market in 6 months?
Apple is probably the best suited company to have a team of experts who know their ONE device in and out... and even they screw it up (proximity sensor, antenna debacle).

KerryG said:
Obviously someone that hasn't been in the software development field.
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Actually, part of what I do is pay people to do software development.
Again, if this was a priority for Samsung, we would have 2.2 now. They have control over more hardware in the Galaxy than most other phone manufacturers.

Maybe old news by now, but Androidspin is reporting Froyo for the international version with a Sept 23 release date.
noob user, can't post links. visit android spin for the story.

MacGuy2006 said:
Actually, part of what I do is pay people to do software development.
Again, if this was a priority for Samsung, we would have 2.2 now. They have control over more hardware in the Galaxy than most other phone manufacturers.
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Ill agree with this, if Samsungs priority was 2.2 it would have been done by now, easily. I mean 2.2 has been out since may. Its 4 months later, they could roll it out now if it had been properly and timely worked on.

It's not like all Samsung makes are phones.
....
I'm still waiting for the HTC TV, HTC Washer and Dryer, maybe a Nokia Refrigerator....
When the other Companies start making all of this stuff, then u can compare

MacGuy2006 said:
Actually, part of what I do is pay people to do software development.
Again, if this was a priority for Samsung, we would have 2.2 now. They have control over more hardware in the Galaxy than most other phone manufacturers.
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So... your the accountant? Or someone who contracts with vendors to do development for the company you work for? Supply the funding?
Sorry, not a ringing endorsement for understanding the development cycle without more details.
I'm guessing you meant to say, "if this was a TOP priority for Samsung, we would have 2.2 for now".
I'm guessing it's not, for a variety of business reasons. I'm sure it is in the mix with a lot of other efforts.

mjpacheco said:
So... your the accountant? Or someone who contracts with vendors to do development for the company you work for? Supply the funding?
Sorry, not a ringing endorsement for understanding the development cycle without more details.
I'm guessing you meant to say, "if this was a TOP priority for Samsung, we would have 2.2 for now".
I'm guessing it's not, for a variety of business reasons. I'm sure it is in the mix with a lot of other efforts.
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Well, I do a bit of most of the above.
So, you are a fanboy?
If HTC and Moto could do it, so could have Samsung. Especially since the Galaxy S is supposed to be their weapon with which to take over the smart phone market.... And since they have more control over key components than their rivals.
Anyway, what's your point? That writing drivers is so tough it takes years?
Or that we should not expect much from Samsung products, because they are a diversified company and can't focus on any particular product?

MacGuy2006 said:
Actually, part of what I do is pay people to do software development.
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I pay 400 people to do software development, and I agree with the other guy.

MacGuy2006 said:
No, I run a company.
So, you are a fanboy?
If HTC and Moto could do it, so could have Samsung. Especially since the Galaxy S is supposed to be their weapon with which to take over the smart phone market.... And since they have more control over key components than their rivals.
Anyway, what's your point? That writing drivers takes years?
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Ha, no. I'm OS and hardware agnostic across all platforms.
My point is realistic expectations. If the GPS update was top priority for Samsung and/or easy to fix (it very well may not have been), it would be done.
As the owner of a company, you know more than anybody the tradeoff's that need to be made when making business decisions. It easy to complain when you are individually impacted about the priority of some specific piece of work, but for Samsung you know they made concious decisions about release scheduling.
Given recent news, it looks like the GPS/hardware fix is being release seperately from 2.2. I'm a little dissapointed in this, it's seems likely that means we will not get the 2.2 fix before the end of September. Ideally they would be rolled together if 2.2 was close... unless the fix just took so long the release timeframes have been squeezed together. And all assuming the GPS fix is merged with 2.2.
Anyway, I'm rambling, no way to know unless we sit in on Samsung development meetings and what challenges they have had with the 2.2 release.
My 'guess' is Samsung had marketing dates to meet with the original OS and released the product before everything was baked in. There are lots of oddities and bugs in the phone I have not seen in other platforms (like HTC), and these are hopefully fixed and may explain the extra time.
I agree with you re: the UI. For those that care, and it likely the more technically savy are the ones that care, it's easy to change... one of the compelling things about any android device.

The Tab is nearly ready to launch. I'm sure it has been tested with 2.2 for a number of weeks, if not months. The have the drivers ready. They are likely devoting tine and energy to hardware releases at this time. It would be nice if they would release vanilla android then the other stuff in the market. They already do that for the samsung home and car apps.
It is really frustrating that these companies cripple good devices with bloatware and make you root to uninstall it. Gingerbread will be nice because all of these extras will be apps. Which is how it should have been from day one.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

Speculation.

I absolutely love reading our SF dev forum. Despite being confident enough to root/flash, I'm one of those folks holding out for the official release, given that I haven't been waiting as long as most of you. So here's my observation:
The people making the most noise about Froyo (or lack thereof), are likely running it right now its leaked (beta) form. Samsung must know this. Is anybody else concerned that this might sway their timetables since some of the incentive has been relieved? I won't even delve into "leak might have been intentional for appeasement" factor. It's probably not very productive to think about this but knowing the internals of companies like this, along with the promises made by Samsung during CES, I can't help but wonder.

Skrazz said:
Is anybody else concerned that this might sway their timetables since some of the incentive has been relieved?
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I don't see this as even a remote possibility. Samsung has sold over 10 million Galaxy S phones (worldwide). The percent of users that not only have simply rooted, but actually installed a leaked version of 2.2 is, I'm sure, not even a blip on the radar screen. I don't think the users here are representative in any way of the owners as a whole. So while we may see certain things as an issue, I don't think it makes one bit of difference in Samsung's plans or timetables.

Heres my theory, these "leaks" are let out purposely... for all of us to test and for them to gather info from the forums. Then they tweak, fix bugs, then release. Hundreds or even thousands of unpaid crash test dummies running these beta roms through everyday life to expose all the bugs...what do you think of that?
Sent from my stock 2.1
unrooted, fully bloated (for now) Fascinate

Nonsense.
If they were "leaked purposefully" the devs wouldn't have to go to so much trouble to clean out watermarks in order for them to be distributed

BS
Companies have there own test cycles (QA scripts) etc...
now if i was a engineer working on a phone: i can see him/her leaking out version of code to see what issues problems develop. No company would do such a thing.

onemotodroid said:
BS
Companies have there own test cycles (QA scripts) etc...
now if i was a engineer working on a phone: i can see him/her leaking out version of code to see what issues problems develop. No company would do such a thing.
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Your crazy to think no company would do this... why not? Its all about money and accomlishing as much as you can while paying out as little as possible. There are no rules or morals. Their test scripts could never put the software through as much as us in such a short amount of time. What if you owned the company?
Sent from my stock 2.1
unrooted, fully bloated (for now) Fascinate

I used to think this was likely, but realize now that too many variables are introduced for any data they gather to be useful. Merging the DL30 leak with CM, AOSP, root apps, etc. doesn't provide them with much useful info regarding the performance of DL30 on the average bloated phone. And that is where they need it to work.

ziggy484 said:
Your crazy to think no company would do this... why not?
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Sure, some companies release official, private and sometimes public beta versions of software to help in testing. But whenever it's done, they provide clear, established means for users to submit error reports which often include some sort of memory dump to aid in pinpointing problems.
Now consider that just to get 2.2 on our phones, we've had to be rooted and we're using the kernel and rom with a mismatched baseband. Now consider that the majority of people aren't even using the stock rom, but a cleaned or otherwise modified version. Now consider the number of people who're using one of the many further modified themes.
No company seriously looking to test software would even entertain wasting the time to follow the reports of people who've hacked the system half way to hell and back. Just getting 2.2 on our phones introduces so many variables as to make any discovery of issues worthless - there's just no way to determine what might be causing the problem.
And I'm not criticizing anything we do, I'm thrilled to have 2.2 running, bugs and all. I'm just saying there's no way in hell Samsung reps are following these forums to report on any issues we might find.

ehhh... I can see what your saying, but i think theres a good chance they are interested in what goes on here.
Sent from my stock 2.1
unrooted, fully bloated (for now) Fascinate

Samsung does not condone nor sanction any software leaks. Its quite the opposite.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App

Thanks for the great replies! It is a bit silly to suspect Sammy of something as shady as that... I shall embrace DL30's promise!

How lucky we all are

Just got done reading a petition about motorola's locked bootloader.
While sifting through the comments people made, pleading for motorola to remove their locks. I could only think of how so many members ridicule samsung. does everyone realize that they (samsung) gave us a great phone? That its almost unbrickable.. Sure froyo took a long time, but they admitted publicly that getting froyo out was a disaster and that they will take measures to make sure it won't happen again. And they even attempted to reach out to the community through samsungjohn.. even if it was just an attempt to calm the community, it shows samsung supports the community.. Or at the very least that they care about what we think and say.. Samsung could be a lot more like motorola, and completely overlook the needs and desires of the small percentage of users that our communities consist of.
my next phone will be a sgs2
Sent from my Rocking dj05, themed superdark w/o swype mod, voodoo 5, with custom boot and shutdown.. With premium xda app.

Yea. With htc following Motorola's path of locking down the bootloader, seems like samsung is one of the last to be developer friendly.
Sent from my SCH-I500

neh4pres said:
my next phone will be a sgs2
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... unless they lock that too.

Not to many people realize how special this phone will be when we can overclock to 1.6ghz, that was mention in engadget i think. But this phone rocks with root and superclean. But the majority of people dont really take the time to explore android phones and all they offer. For example businessmen, my father who is in the insurance business used his droid x for almost everything. My brother rooted it and set up everything in a much more user friendly way. But just when everyone gets upset about no froyo (official) for fascinate, they forget the beauty of android, and thats its able to be edited by developers and that its open source. We arent supposed to have froyo yet most likely every fascinate owner on this forum has froyo.

sfournie said:
But just when everyone gets upset about no froyo (official) for fascinate, they forget the beauty of android, and thats its able to be edited by developers and that its open source. We arent supposed to have froyo yet most likely every fascinate owner on this forum has froyo.
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Not to nitpick... but I'd like to just add a little bit of an aside here. There has been no official release of Froyo, which means that according to Samsung and Verizon, we shouldn't have it. (of course, some one will speak up and say "leaked builds are just a sneaky way that samsung gets free public beta testing." To that I say "maybe. But I doubt it.")
Not only that, but most of the cool mods in the dev/themes section are done to precompiled files that have been decompiled, modded, then recompiled, which takes massive amounts of time, and is a dirty process that leaves behind dead code and mismatched signatures. People are jumping through massive hoops to do something because we don't have the source code to edit it directly. Saying that the stock ROM is open, is like saying a jailbroken iPhone is open. It's only "open" because people have poured countless hours working around the restrictions of an already compiled system, using tools that took countless hours to make.
Both of these issues are actually a major gray area of the law, and if a pesky legal team got bored, it's hard to tell what kind of trouble they might be able to stir up (especially when the judicial system is all about $$).
Even after we do get the source code (which we still don't have), there are still lots of binary "blobs" of data that are already compiled, reducing the amount of control we actually have over the hardware devices and proprietary elements of the stock rom.
So Android is mostly open source, but Samsung is only as open as it wants to be. Their delay in releasing the source, bad coding, and use of proprietary code still sets them fairly in the realm of developer unfriendly. They just aren't as bad as some of the others.

GizmoDroid said:
Not to nitpick... but I'd like to just add a little bit of an aside here. There has been no official release of Froyo, which means that according to Samsung and Verizon, we shouldn't have it.
Both of these issues are actually a major gray area of the law, and if a pesky legal team got bored, it's hard to tell what kind of trouble they might be able to stir up (especially when the judicial system is all about $$).
So Android is mostly open source, but Samsung is only as open as it wants to be. Their delay in releasing the source, bad coding, and use of proprietary code still sets them fairly in the realm of developer unfriendly. They just aren't as bad as some of the others.
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I am forever grateful for the dev teams hours spent on this phone to give us something that we shouldnt have. And I agree, I think its all about the money for the phone manufacturers. The nice thing about android is that you dont pay to upgrade, but thats also their downfall because whats in it for samsung if they work hard and release something that is stable for our phones. Loyal customers which is true and a big part of their business. But for the most part, their client base is so huge, our whining doesnt even put a dent in there sales. Furthermore, Verizon doesn't care about releasing the official froyo update because they have you in a 2 year contract. And as bad as the the wait has been to get froyo, I would never switch carriers because ATT is worse IMO, but who knows now that they bought T-Mobile.

neh4pres said:
my next phone will be a sgs2
Sent from my Rocking dj05, themed superdark w/o swype mod, voodoo 5, with custom boot and shutdown.. With premium xda app.
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I've been debating getting a Bionic but in thinking more and more about it I have to agree with you. my next phone will be the Sgs2. I absolutely love my sgs even if we don't have an official froyo build, the great devs we have have me rocking a super clean voodoo that blows all my friends various moto, htc, etc devices out of the water.
Do I wish verizon and samsung pushed an official froyo build? Sure
will that lack of support stop me from getting my hands on the sgs2? Hell no.

Dalamar1320 said:
Do I wish verizon and samsung pushed an official froyo build? Sure
will that lack of support stop me from getting my hands on the sgs2? Hell no.
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+1 I agree totally!!

Pretty sure that I'm going for the sgs2 as well. Bottom line: the Fascinate has been the best smart phone I've ever owned (even as only eclair). I enjoy all the flashing of Roms and Kernels too. Its kinda made owning the phone worth it. In other words, not having official release but trying out these leaks is great fun! I'm not nearly as bent out of shape as some others are about the lack of support by Samsung/Verizon. Sure, it would be nice if they were better about software releases but I ain't losing any sleep over it.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk

SOTK said:
Pretty sure that I'm going for the sgs2 as well. Bottom line: the Fascinate has been the best smart phone I've ever owned (even as only eclair). I enjoy all the flashing of Roms and Kernels too. Its kinda made owning the phone worth it. In other words, not having official release but trying out these leaks is great fun! I'm not nearly as bent out of shape as some others are about the lack of support by Samsung/Verizon. Sure, it would be nice if they were better about software releases but I ain't losing any sleep over it.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using Tapatalk
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Thats cool but allegedly thats going to have a signed bootloader too.
Used my fascinating voodoo powers

Lots of ROMs, theming and tweaking, BUT what about REAL IMPROVING?

These days, I'm seeing lots of supposed teams tossing zillions of ROMs that are no real improvement. I think I have tried 1 out 2 and I stopped the flashing game after I realized they are almost the same dog with a different collar.
Am I the only one? Is our Vibrant a stalled device in terms of REAL development? Come on, boys, less theming and more real improving!!

You're kidding, right?
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

I'm not kidding. Can you name a ROM that is not CM7 that is making real improvements like proper GPS with sensors and no path-sliding in Gingerbread, improved battery, no problems entering deep sleep and being fast?
Any ROM GB ROM that doesn't not suck, lasting less than 15 hours with moderate use?

You wanna go beg samsung to release source? Wait. Dont. By the way you type, you seem like a genius that can build us a source!

JMN... everyone jumped ship and started working on Gingerbread... without anything specific for our phone. I guess you could say we are stalled in that regard. Nobody wants 2.2.... and the 2.3.+ roms are missing a lot of the key things needed for what you seek. It is what it is.
Go pester T-Mobile and Samsung, not XDA/community/developers.
I do.

If it were as easy as you make it seem, I am sure our Vibrant would have a 100% working CM7 right now. Problem is, it isn't. We don't have any source code for Gingerbread, our GPS is from a half-baked file for the Galaxy S 4G, and Samsung decided to use several proprietary loops inside their source code that make the code counter-intuitive. As a result, our developers basically have to reverse engineer a good portion of the code itself.

Or you are more than welcome to start working on it yourself. Seems as up until JVQ dropped on I9000 I was the only one actually doing anything (with of course a couple other good people dropping in from time to time). From April until now we went from a build that was barely usable for more than a couple hours to builds that are definite daily drivers. Granted there are still some flaws but with less than a handful of people do any real developing on what free time we do have and for no incentive other than the thank you button and occasional donation I'd say we're doing pretty damn good.
In the words of someone famous you're either part of the solution or you're part of the problem. Which are you going be?
EDIT: My statement above is putting CM7/MIUI aside, different animal/problems/features/pluses/minuses.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App

I dunno man, I found a ROM that does everything that you listed. What you're asking is a lot of development time for marginal improvements.
Sent from my HTC Sensation

So what do you gotta say now bro?
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

its not that easy to build a rom thats so great people build on xda some can be slightly better than others but hey thats why u get updates, if ur looking for good battery life on gb use an i9000 port like simplyhoney and u wont be mad about the battery life on the other hand i use cm7 and have been on it ever since nightlies started being released i will tell u it came a long way from no gps and battery drain to a half working gps which is still functional to decent battery life and i am grateful for all the hard work but into it

Funny seems like JMN went silent!
I think he got served!
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App

Biting the hands that feed... smh

OK, OK.
Please, forgive me for my anger being unleashed. Maybe it was that I see newer devices having a plethora of updates and improvements, or maybe because with my previous device (HTC Polaris running Windows Mobile 6) there was a man (XDA member know as DZO) that reverse engineered it, driver by driver to make a fully fledged Android device.
I ask you for your understanding, and hope you pardon me. You're right: the real problem here is that T-Mobile and Samsung abandoned the Vibrant to its own luck.
Lots of devs jumped ships because of that. I don't make them guilty about this situation, although I did in my first post. Sorry about that.
I'm a dev myself, but not so low level. I cannot compile drivers or reverse engineer. Otherwise, I would really like to collaborate with Atinm and the others.
Please, don't abandon or blame the Vibrant and other Galaxy S devices and try to squeeze all the juice out of it. If we all switch to the latest device, manufacturers will always laugh at us selling slightly different hardware, not upgrades for our totally capable devices.
Nothing more to add. Sorry for my rough and disrespectful words I wrote before. Long live XDA-Devs.

My fellows, I went to the T-Mobile USA facebook site (http://www.facebook.com/TMobile) and published this on their wall:
"SHAME ON YOU, T-MOBILE! Where is Gingerbread for the T-Mobile VIBRANT???? Do you ever care about your users? Do you think we will eat every phone you release with no questions and wishing NO SUPPORT? We do buy devices with future in mind. A ONE-year-device has been ditched away because you are too busy selling the so called 4G version. Too obvious you're playing with us, playing the "buy me and forget me" game. Sorry, but never again to you, T-Mobile, or whatever you will be called after the merger."
I hope you could support me or write comments criticizing the way T-Mobile is acting upon us.
Thanks.

I just re-posted your message on T-Mobiles Facebook site. Not too sure where yours went. Maybe they deleted it.

Thanks a lot, dude. They have the site configured so you cannot see the posts that users write on the wall until you explicitly reveal them using the "Most recent" option (link http://www.facebook.com/TMobile?sk=wall&filter=1). It's there, I think. We need to cry out loud.

I absolutely approve of telling T-Mobile we are tired of waiting.....
Gingerbread = Security.

I posted this on their facebook, all we can do is hope one day they get the point.
"T-mobile, you have a very loyal customer base that bought one of 2010's best smartphones, the Samsung Vibrant. However, with the release of the Samsung Vibrant 4g, we have been left in the dark and seemingly ignored regarding security updates and notifications, specifically the gingerbread 2.3 update. We buy devices with the future in mind, and expect to have full support for the devices we spend our hard earned money on. We know that Samsung awaits your instruction to push the updates, and we respectfully request you do so immediately, in order to be up to date on stability, security, and support. This situation has bothered and frustrated many in the Vibrant community, we only ask that you extinguish that fire by providing us the update we deserve and earned, by being your customers."

people will never learn...
they cannot support devices forever. it seems like every single person thinks that once they buy a smartphone, they are guaranteed lifetime support. the cell phone industry is one of the fastest growing industries in the world. i would much rather them cut off my support and have a beast upgrade waiting for me, rather than them focus on constantly rolling out updates for every single device theyve ever created just to shut up *****y consumers. think about it, getting stuck with an outdated device makes it all that much better once you get your upgrade! its amazing im saying this, as i despise corporate america.
i realize the vibrant is just over a year removed, BUT THIS HAPPENS WITH EVERY SINGLE DEVICE. i guarantee if you go to ANY other forum for a device that is 1+ years old, 95% of them will be filled with threads like this. update this, update that, fix this, release this blahblahiwantmybottleblahblah. its not JUST tmobile. its not JUST samsung. these accusations are so narrow-minded. what would happen if they released gingerbread??? two months later, the cry babies would be right back in full swing, "wheres honeycomb?? release honeycomb source!!" it has to end somewhere, you can never satisfy everybody, let alone ANYBODY in the vibrant forum.
its the industry. its the way it works, so stop acting like we are the only ones who are "suffering". its such an ignorant, narcissistic way of looking at it. enjoy what you got, nothings ever built to last. youre "stuck" with a damn good device, it is what you make it. weekly threads begging for gingerbread, or ****ting on tmobile/samsung is clearly not getting it done. so maybe people should be spending their time differently instead of constantly *****ing: get familiar with linux, learn to compile/decompile, learn to theme...its amazing how much fun (yes, without source!) youll be able to have once you learn some stuff. keep yourself busy creating new things, youll take more pride in your device knowing its something that YOU created, as opposed to trolling around and downloading anything you can get your sticky fingers on.
gingerbread isnt here....but neither is the end of the world.

TopShelf10 said:
people will never learn...
they cannot support devices forever. it seems like every single person thinks that once they buy a smartphone, they are guaranteed lifetime support. the cell phone industry is one of the fastest growing industries in the world. i would much rather them cut off my support and have a beast upgrade waiting for me, rather than them focus on constantly rolling out updates for every single device theyve ever created just to shut up *****y consumers. think about it, getting stuck with an outdated device makes it all that much better once you get your upgrade! its amazing im saying this, as i despise corporate america.
i realize the vibrant is just over a year removed, BUT THIS HAPPENS WITH EVERY SINGLE DEVICE. i guarantee if you go to ANY other forum for a device that is 1+ years old, 95% of them will be filled with threads like this. update this, update that, fix this, release this blahblahiwantmybottleblahblah. its not JUST tmobile. its not JUST samsung. these accusations are so narrow-minded. what would happen if they released gingerbread??? two months later, the cry babies would be right back in full swing, "wheres honeycomb?? release honeycomb source!!" it has to end somewhere, you can never satisfy everybody, let alone ANYBODY in the vibrant forum.
its the industry. its the way it works, so stop acting like we are the only ones who are "suffering". its such an ignorant, narcissistic way of looking at it. enjoy what you got, nothings ever built to last. youre "stuck" with a damn good device, it is what you make it. weekly threads begging for gingerbread, or ****ting on tmobile/samsung is clearly not getting it done. so maybe people should be spending their time differently instead of constantly *****ing: get familiar with linux, learn to compile/decompile, learn to theme...its amazing how much fun (yes, without source!) youll be able to have once you learn some stuff. keep yourself busy creating new things, youll take more pride in your device knowing its something that YOU created, as opposed to trolling around and downloading anything you can get your sticky fingers on.
gingerbread isnt here....but neither is the end of the world.
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To be honest, support for the Vibrant has been pretty much nonexistent from T-Mobile, I don't think it's too much to ask for a GB ROM from them and Samsung, had T-Mobile been into providing us service instead of trying to sell out we could have had a beter chance at some real support.