Database Users

Camera is terrible in low light, under all builds and kernels tested

First of all, I'd like to thank the XDA-Dev community. Without you, my poor Vogue would still be running WM6.1
I've been trying the Android builds for quite some time now, and while I'm in love with the buttery smooth UI, the wonderful responsiveness, and the general geeky goodness of having multiple OSes on a phone, there's still one issue that prevents me from fully embracing Android and flashing it to the NAND.
The camera.
Perhaps it would be better illustrated in picture form. Here are two pictures I took about five minutes ago of the desk beside my monitor. (I've resized them down, of course.) It's not dark here, but there's no light directly shining into the lens. Still plenty to take a decent snapshot, right?
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I'll give you three guesses as to which photo was taken under Android. And the first two don't count.
I've tried virtually every kernel and build I've come across on this site, from 1.5 to 2.0.1, using various zImage dates and combinations of those and the builds, and have still had no luck whatsoever.
Help me, someone. Please point out the obvious solution that I'm overlooking, so that I can use Android as a daily OS.

There is no obvious solution. Recent kernels are better (they have automatic whitebalance) but there are still noise issues. If I had to guess it's probably setting the camera's sensitivity (ISO) incorrectly, or lacking some sort of noise filtering that Windows Mobile's camera driver has, but Martin or another kernel developer would know more.
No magic noise switch, sorry.

bri3d said:
There is no obvious solution. Recent kernels are better (they have automatic whitebalance) but there are still noise issues. If I had to guess it's probably setting the camera's sensitivity (ISO) incorrectly, or lacking some sort of noise filtering that Windows Mobile's camera driver has, but Martin or another kernel developer would know more.
No magic noise switch, sorry.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it is seriously noise that causes that?

Have no fear...we have some great devs here! Someone will crack the mystery of the grainy lens! LOL

jamezelle said:
it is seriously noise that causes that?
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Click to collapse
i'm not a camera expert but that 100% looks like a lighting issue! this camera stinks to begin with so i never use it anyways

It's been like this since day one with droid builds on the vogue. So far the only repsonse is " you're lucky it even works" I don't expect a fix anytime soon.

so dzo is the only one that has done work on the camera in the kernel so far (zimage or the .nbh is where the camera code is located). he has singlehandedly brought android to the vogue, and he has be the single most committed developer. I don't know what he is working on now, but if I gave you a list of all the latest updates, you would notice that they are all more important than the camera. and yes, importance is a matter of opinion, but basic features like bluetooth, the phone not crashing after calls, booting from the nand, etc etc, take priority for most.
if you have not followed this project from the beginning, or at least have not taken the time to read through the old forums to see where we came from (BGPS is an example - before gps we all used to be located somewhere in san franscisco driving on some highway out there), save your complaints. it is people who complain about sh** without contributing sh** that causes our good developers to say "fu** it, peace out" and then, guess what? who will make your camera better for you then?
we all know the camera isn't the best. but yeah, here's that response again, AT LEAST IT WORKS. there was a day when it didn't. and there are still things that don't. live with it; or roll up your sleeves, do some reading, and update it yourself. we'll all be waiting for your contribution. and when you give us something to test, instead of complaining how it isn't perfect yet, we'll say great job, thanks for contributing, and we'll help you figure out how to make it better instead of just saying "this sucks."

bri3d said:
There is no obvious solution. Recent kernels are better (they have automatic whitebalance) but there are still noise issues. If I had to guess it's probably setting the camera's sensitivity (ISO) incorrectly, or lacking some sort of noise filtering that Windows Mobile's camera driver has, but Martin or another kernel developer would know more.
No magic noise switch, sorry.
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Click to collapse
Unfortunately neither photo came with ISO numbers in the EXIF data. I'll try hunting down some custom camera apps on both OSes and see if I can replicate the Android results under Windows - that way I'll at least know exactly what's causing it.
Thanks for the suggestion, and thanks Reddog80p, I'm sure one of us can figure it out.
And thanks tatnai for showing me that even Canadians can be pompous, arrogant, and rude. One world, one love.

tatnai said:
so dzo is the only one that has done work on the camera in the kernel so far (zimage or the .nbh is where the camera code is located). he has singlehandedly brought android to the vogue, and he has be the single most committed developer. I don't know what he is working on now, but if I gave you a list of all the latest updates, you would notice that they are all more important than the camera. and yes, importance is a matter of opinion, but basic features like bluetooth, the phone not crashing after calls, booting from the nand, etc etc, take priority for most.
if you have not followed this project from the beginning, or at least have not taken the time to read through the old forums to see where we came from (BGPS is an example - before gps we all used to be located somewhere in san franscisco driving on some highway out there), save your complaints. it is people who complain about sh** without contributing sh** that causes our good developers to say "fu** it, peace out" and then, guess what? who will make your camera better for you then?
we all know the camera isn't the best. but yeah, here's that response again, AT LEAST IT WORKS. there was a day when it didn't. and there are still things that don't. live with it; or roll up your sleeves, do some reading, and update it yourself. we'll all be waiting for your contribution. and when you give us something to test, instead of complaining how it isn't perfect yet, we'll say great job, thanks for contributing, and we'll help you figure out how to make it better instead of just saying "this sucks."
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+1
[ten character]

My vogue camera exibits the same behavior.
The noise in the android picture is static for me, and it would be easy to fix. I just need to take a picture with the lens blocked (a dark frame that contains just the noise) and substract the noise from the actual picture I want to take. This could probably be implemented on the software side.

tatnai said:
so dzo is the only one that has done work on the camera in the kernel so far (zimage or the .nbh is where the camera code is located). he has singlehandedly brought android to the vogue, and he has be the single most committed developer. I don't know what he is working on now, but if I gave you a list of all the latest updates, you would notice that they are all more important than the camera. and yes, importance is a matter of opinion, but basic features like bluetooth, the phone not crashing after calls, booting from the nand, etc etc, take priority for most.
if you have not followed this project from the beginning, or at least have not taken the time to read through the old forums to see where we came from (BGPS is an example - before gps we all used to be located somewhere in san franscisco driving on some highway out there), save your complaints. it is people who complain about sh** without contributing sh** that causes our good developers to say "fu** it, peace out" and then, guess what? who will make your camera better for you then?
we all know the camera isn't the best. but yeah, here's that response again, AT LEAST IT WORKS. there was a day when it didn't. and there are still things that don't. live with it; or roll up your sleeves, do some reading, and update it yourself. we'll all be waiting for your contribution. and when you give us something to test, instead of complaining how it isn't perfect yet, we'll say great job, thanks for contributing, and we'll help you figure out how to make it better instead of just saying "this sucks."
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Click to collapse
The OP was asking a question. Stop flaming noobs and pick on someone with your same amount of posts. It's because of responses like YOURS that drive noobs away. He deserves the benefit of the doubt, there was nothing rude about his question, he was not expressing any contempt for any developers, he never complained about Android, just asked for help with the camera. He did more than most noobs would, he posted pics, and expressed his attempts at finding the solution himself. People who flame noobs have little man's syndrome, they are bullies. Your answer is completely worthless and makes you look like a jackass.

petermg said:
The OP was asking a question. Stop flaming noobs and pick on someone with your same amount of posts. It's because of responses like YOURS that drive noobs away. He deserves the benefit of the doubt, there was nothing rude about his question, he was not expressing any contempt for any developers, he never complained about Android, just asked for help with the camera. He did more than most noobs would, he posted pics, and expressed his attempts at finding the solution himself. People who flame noobs have little man's syndrome, they are bullies. Your answer is completely worthless and makes you look like a jackass.
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This shouldn't be a flame fest. Tatnai didn't mean to "flame" anyone I don't think. Nor did he mean to come across as pompous, but he was just preemptively dealing with issues that his forum has seen in the past.
Anyone hurt or insulted, on either side... this is not a big deal. Let's just all settle.
I don't remember this camera getting good results even in WinMo...

yea, my camera never worked passably in WinMo either

Anyone who has ran a NFSfans Win-Mo rom knows the camera is capable of producing pretty decent pictures. When it come to HTC's camera lenses we all know they can improve dramatically.

The camera in android is controlled by our open source libcameraservice.so and in kernel. Here is the code for libcameraservice http://github.com/dzo/VogueCamera

tatnai said:
so dzo is the only one that has done work on the camera in the kernel so far (zimage or the .nbh is where the camera code is located). he has singlehandedly brought android to the vogue, and he has be the single most committed developer. I don't know what he is working on now, but if I gave you a list of all the latest updates, you would notice that they are all more important than the camera. and yes, importance is a matter of opinion, but basic features like bluetooth, the phone not crashing after calls, booting from the nand, etc etc, take priority for most.
if you have not followed this project from the beginning, or at least have not taken the time to read through the old forums to see where we came from (BGPS is an example - before gps we all used to be located somewhere in san franscisco driving on some highway out there), save your complaints. it is people who complain about sh** without contributing sh** that causes our good developers to say "fu** it, peace out" and then, guess what? who will make your camera better for you then?
we all know the camera isn't the best. but yeah, here's that response again, AT LEAST IT WORKS. there was a day when it didn't. and there are still things that don't. live with it; or roll up your sleeves, do some reading, and update it yourself. we'll all be waiting for your contribution. and when you give us something to test, instead of complaining how it isn't perfect yet, we'll say great job, thanks for contributing, and we'll help you figure out how to make it better instead of just saying "this sucks."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did a lot of development for modifications for multiple RTS games like Empire Earth and Civilization III & IV, so to an extent I understand your frustration and even agree with you.
But that was plain out of line and rude. There is a better way of going about giving someone info than that and you really need to work on internet rage dude. Not everyone is a developer and not everyone will have something to contribute. It's the people who test the programs, find the bugs, and then report them that help advance the development process. People saying things like this, hinder it.
Besides all that, I do have the same issues with my camera and only recently did I even manage to get the camera to work. I've been talking with a couple of developers I know here at my school (DeVry for the geekyness win) and we've started working on finding a solution. Hopefully I'll have something to show for it soon.

OP posted a critique of the current android camera, with a hint of sarcasm, and ended with a question that was neither constructive or helpful or focused on future development. The state of the camera in android is nothing new, we have all used it and seen it. Framing his observations about the camera the way he did,
I'll give you three guesses as to which photo was taken under Android. And the first two don't count.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and
Help me, someone. Please point out the obvious solution that I'm overlooking, so that I can use Android as a daily OS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
in a flippant manner, like it is a bug that needs fixing, is quite disrespectful of the hours of work that dzo put into building the camera driver FROM SCRATCH. A little reading of the forums about android would have brought this to light, and would have produced a post more along the lines of "hey dzo, I see the camera has not been updated in a while, I would love to help take it to the next level with my skills - who wants to pitch in?" rather than "this sucks, who knows a fix?"
We have had developers leave the project due to posts like the OP. Some might say, well that is just childish for people to get their feelings hurt by a simple post. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. But post after post of thoughtless criticism by people who have not taken the time to see WHY there is an android on the vogue in the first place, wear on the people who pour countless hours of there time into this project. You'll note that the two posts who acknowledge value in my original post are also from people (jamezelle, TheKartus) who have been around to see this happen before.
I love noobs as much as the next guy (we are all noobs in one area or another), and that's why you see me troubleshooting for people in threads all the time. We always need more people giving feedback, but please, give it in a way that is respectful of the time and energy and love put into the project by its creators, and in a way that shows you've taken the time to know the background of the subject you are addressing.

well lets get on track and fix it. the code is open source so anyone can have a look and fix it.

Here is the photo the G1 dev took, using his reverse-engineered Eclair driver. It comes out with very low noise.
Does the G1 have hardware noise-reduction that we don't? Or is there something in their driver? It's been a while since I've written C so I'm still digesting what all the code actually does. I've asked the devs of the G1 driver if they have a guess... hopefully they are not too busy to provide insight.

Bye Bye Vibrant =(

So today I returned my Vibrant and removed my Nexus One from Ebay. It's sad that such a beautiful phone had to be returned but I couldn't cope with some major issues:
1) GPS (I dont care if there is a fix, it SHOULD work out of the box)
2) Laggy Market
3) Laggy Homescreen
4) Tethering issues (Using barnacle and IPad)
I will miss the screen... it was amazing... along with some of the features of touchwiz. However, the fact that TMobile confirmed that they will be launching an HSPA+ phone this summer makes me feel that much better about waiting to upgrade.

Let me get out my violin.
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Feel better? Goodness it's like at least 5 people have to start this type of thread on every board I visit for any type of device. I can't wait for the usual people to come in and make this a 10 page thread

And when the TMO releases the new HSPA+ phone it will have a plethora of issues on its own, good luck

Just trying to save people the trouble from upgrading from their Nexus if they have one. Thanks for the violin though! ;p

I really don't set the point of these types of posts, so you are unhappy and experience issues that not everyone is. Does that mean I should annoyingly post about how great mine is working? My HD2 gave me problems everyday but I didn't post about it. My slide worked perfectly but I didn't post about it. Again gps is not everyone, I have tried the following apps:
Yelp
Yellow book
Find me
Places directory
Maps
Where
Layers
And google
ALL were able to find my location (locked)
Everything else hasn't happened to my phone yet
So really what is the point in posting that you are returning the phone, because I'm sure you have already posted the problems.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

heygrl said:
Let me get out my violin.
Feel better? Goodness it's like at least 5 people have to start this type of thread on every board I visit for any type of device. I can't wait for the usual people to come in and make this a 10 page thread
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh man you should have seen the Evo 4G forums then. This is nothing compared to that.

If i'd've had a N1, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have a Vibrant now. N1 to Vibrant is probably not that big an improvement, but G1 (even rooted) to Vibrant is HUGE!

Sorry you didn't like your Vibrant!
I personally have had none of those issues, in fact, I have had not one force close or restart, the phone has been on and running without a single hitch since the day it was released and I picked it up at the T-mobile store.
This has been the best out of box experience I have ever had with a phone, especially one that was just released.

OolonColuphid said:
If i'd've had a N1, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have a Vibrant now. N1 to Vibrant is probably not that big an improvement, but G1 (even rooted) to Vibrant is HUGE!
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danpaganelli said:
This has been the best out of box experience I have ever had with a phone, especially one that was just released.
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Click to collapse
I agree on both accounts. When we get 2.2 OTA or mod it will prove to be the best phone available.

Your patience (or lack thereof) got the best of you.phone had only been out a week. Name me one device that was perfect upon release? Take care and cya, I'll enjoy the vibrant for you =)
Sent from my Samsung Vibrant

What he said. ^^^^

DKYang said:
What he said. ^^^^
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lmfao! blah 10 char!

sccpmusc26 said:
1) GPS (I dont care if there is a fix, it SHOULD work out of the box)
2) Laggy Market
3) Laggy Homescreen
4) Tethering issues (Using barnacle and IPad)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. will work after OTA
2. Did you root? Haven't heard of significant issues pre-root
2. thats because it's filled with bulky widgets. Remove a few. I'm running 5 widgets (2 of the samsung ones) and a live wallpaper with no lag (did no lag fixes or anything)
4. Barnacle doesn't work without root. Doesn't work consistently with root because the phone just came out and they haven't added support for it yet. New hardware for a currently unsupported root feature. Hopefully it'll be included in 2.2, but if not, the tether programs should be updated soon.

I think you should have waited before getting the phone in the first place. Nothing come out perfect.

I also purchased the Vibrant to use as a wireless hotspot with my iPad. I am going to give it time. I probably wouldn't have upgraded from an N1 though.

I turned on the phone and I'm not kidding I went straight to ever screen and removed every widget and turned off all but one screen. I mean I really don't need 7 screens when I use the same few apps all the time.
I think the only issue's I've noticed is.
- Camera FC on me once.
- Antenna boucing all over the place signal wise. Full Bars, half bars, no bars. Who knows, but it still works.
I think the only rock solid phone I've ever purchased and it just worked was my old Side Kick. It wasn't fancy or flashy and of course doesn't do half the stuff that these newer phones do.

For me:
Notifications keep phone awake
I get FC when I try to add picture to contact
Slow market (rooted)
Antenna bars jump left and right, but it doesnt seem to effect the signal....

It's a genuine concern. Stop getting so defensive that people are having issues. Not everyone can afford to drop $500+ every two months on the latest and greatest. A new smartphone is an investment, and if it doesn't work as advertised, that's not the fault of the consumer. Also, keep in mind, 14 days is not a lot of time. We don't even know for sure if this is something that Samsung can or will fix.
Some of you are willing to accept that risk, and trust that a fix is coming. That's fine. Some of us are not as bold when it comes to such investments.
So, yes, we may get an announcement, by the 15th day, that everything is going to be fixed and we won't have to worry. But what if that announcement never shows up? What if they just shrug their shoulders and say, "Eh, good enough"?
Well, like I said, $500+ is a lot of money to gamble when it comes to the good faith of a corporation. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little bit nervous about them supporting this device properly.
I love my Vibrant, save for these reception issues with the various radios. I live in one of the best coverage spots in my city, and I've been having calls go straight to voicemail all week; my GPS takes 5 minutes to even lock, and when it does, the radius is 2-4 blocks wide; the compass does not work at all, and the phone will assume I'm driving and moving when I'm stationary because of these problems. As of today, it does not appear as if either company is acknowledging the issue. That said, if a statement isn't released soon, I'll be returning it to sit on the sidelines until a fix is announced -- as much as I'd miss the display.

sccpmusc26 said:
So today I returned my Vibrant and removed my Nexus One from Ebay. It's sad that such a beautiful phone had to be returned but I couldn't cope with some major issues:
1) GPS (I dont care if there is a fix, it SHOULD work out of the box)
2) Laggy Market
3) Laggy Homescreen
4) Tethering issues (Using barnacle and IPad)
I will miss the screen... it was amazing... along with some of the features of touchwiz. However, the fact that TMobile confirmed that they will be launching an HSPA+ phone this summer makes me feel that much better about waiting to upgrade.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
nick_karstedt said:
1. will work after OTA
2. Did you root? Haven't heard of significant issues pre-root
2. thats because it's filled with bulky widgets. Remove a few. I'm running 5 widgets (2 of the samsung ones) and a live wallpaper with no lag (did no lag fixes or anything)
4. Barnacle doesn't work without root. Doesn't work consistently with root because the phone just came out and they haven't added support for it yet. New hardware for a currently unsupported root feature. Hopefully it'll be included in 2.2, but if not, the tether programs should be updated soon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
DKYang said:
What he said. ^^^^
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Click to collapse
Precisely.
Go start a blog or post on the tmobile forums. Every one of your issues can be solved with patience.
Buhbye.

coolguy949 said:
Oh man you should have seen the Evo 4G forums then. This is nothing compared to that.
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Click to collapse
It's just getting started. Not only that, when they return the phone it'll continue to pester on. Oh x -- x and x doesn't work, it's this and that.. no, I haven't exchanged it or I've gotten 5 already and it's not going to be fixed because once I do this, that happens.. and on and on and on and on and on and..

Cyanogen 6.0. Is it way over rated?

Here is a question for everyone. It's not a trolling question, nor is it designed to provoke anger. As a faithfull user of cyanogen 6 since its inception (nightly updates, RC1, RC2, and Full) Lets boil this down.
Things that work:
1. Its fast as hell.
2. No sense (makes it fast as hell).
3. Highly customizable
4. ADW tweaks are nice.
5. Feel free to add something else in here.
6. Nice screen rotation for car mounting.
7. Oh ya....its fast as hell and, as has been posted in here a million times, "...is buttery smooth."
Things that still don't work at all or work well:
1. HDMI
2. 4G
3. Radio
4. MMS with picture or voice (tried it again yesterday)
5. Voicemail issues (we all know what they are)
So......essentially....except for some modest, user appreciable "non-sense" speed boosts....this ROM actually removes some pretty darn important features.
Explain the logic of this to me?
Cyanogen has done excellent work. I am not trying to squelch that, but he (and his team) seem to be unable to resolve issues EVO users should and do find important.
With the new sense roms out there and their subsequent kernal releases, they perform, user appreciably, nearly the same as this rom with all the above MAJOR FUNCTIONS working. (Linpak, FPS2d, and Quadrant scores for which I can reproduce screen shots)
So, you get a fast rom with few of exceptional functions / features this phone is capable of.
Do you think maybe....the rom is a crutch for the phone.
Just one man's humble opinion. Maybe further versions with the important features useable will kick butt. For now......Come on. What is the obsession?
Would someone please explain my confusion on this seemingly obvious question.
So....Ill keep it as a nandroid backup. For what? I don't know.
-JZ

Pro: Stagefright AAC decoding patch implemented in CM6
Con: Bluetooth prevents phone from sleeping

I agree.. seems ridiculous to me. I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole.

I don't really want to get nit picky, but I agree with your points, and it's personally not the rom for me. At least not in its current state.

Didn't you post this in the CM6 thread?

all the features in cm6 currently PWN 4g and hdmi. for those that other are either fooling theirselves or havent really actually played with the rom
-i mean really, hdmi is nice, but you cant even use it to its full extent now...why waste the time? a saying that comes to mind "if you gonna do something, do it big" or "why halfass when you'll just have to come back and finish it up later"
sorry i just dont think a HALF working hdmi in sense or even stock roms for that matter are worth bragging about.
-4g is NICE, however its only ONE phone that has this option as of right now (excluding the samsung epic that just launched today). It makes NO sense at all to focus on a feature that is only exclusive to ONE phone...not to mention the code for 4g is intricately woven into Sense, so it takes some time to remove and code for it
-Radio? Seriously? It just seems like yer being a hater here.... I do realize having the FM radio is nice and all....but even in the stock roms you have to have gay ass headphones.
With all the pandora radio, stitcher radio and other podcast..... is it REALLY that big of a deal? i think not especially since i dont have to be on a leash with headphones and can play through my speaker
-NO other rom has a higher bitpool for bluetooth aka if you use a2dp to stream to your car's stereo...unless your using cm6.... your stream is gonna sound like ****!!! This is a BIGGGG feature
and whas the issue with MMS? the 160 char limit thing? I dont seem to suffer from that problem....maybe its a hit or miss?
as far as the voicemail...i dont use sprint's voicemail on this phone....i link it to my gvoice....but i can definitely understand the frustration not being able to get to your vmail.
i guess people like cm6 because it pwns and own all while not being a bloatware king and slowing **** down

ya....i wasn't sure where the "most appropriate" place to post it was. You know how folks won't answer your question/quandry, but rather say, "this isn't the appropriate place for this." So....pre-empting that I posted it in both places in case one gets deleted.

They do great work for other phones, but I think the EVO 4G was just to complex.

it pwns? with modest appreciable speed increases (seriously.....post some objective data for me....not subjective)?
4g, hdmi, (ill give you the radio), mms (not sending messages with photos or sound or both attached) are not little things. Also....if you have a decent HDMI set it will recognize the settings and accomodate....so come on. OBJECTIVE not SUBJECTIVE.
The sense roms have comprable linpak, quadrant, and BETTER fps2d scores.
Im not hating....just posting OBJECTIVE findings.

rubixmaster said:
They do great work for other phones, but I think the EVO 4G was just to complex.
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Click to collapse
My thoughts exactly.

Nope.
HDMI? Why would I want that in a phone?
4G? I'm not in a 4g area.
Radio? Haha.. why? It never worked right for me anyway and my Zune gets better reception.
MMS - I sent my wife a picture just yesterday. No issues there.
VM - I use GV and always have. No issues.

jasonziter said:
it pwns? with modest speed increases (seriously.....post some objective data for me....not subjective)?
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Click to collapse
Bro, I'm not going to do research for you. If you haven't already, flash CM6 final on your phone. If it doesn't fly compared to a Sense ROM, you are doing something wrong or you need to return your phone.

goodelyfe said:
and whas the issue with MMS? the 160 char limit thing? I dont seem to suffer from that problem....maybe its a hit or miss?
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Click to collapse
That is SMS (aka texting) and the 160 character limit is the CDMA technology limit, has nothing to do with a ROM. MMS (aka picture/multimedia mail) is what he is referring to. But I'm not sure exactly what problems he's referring to, because I though MMS worked fine on my phone when I had CM on it.
You feel it is faster by far then other roms, that is your opinion, hard factual numbers do not necessarily agree with you. I didn't want to get into the nit picky, as I stated before, because honestly I respect CM for doing things I could never dream of doing. But your post reads as if a one sided defensive retort. Prove him wrong in his stance, saying it feels faster does not do so, because that is one of it's few claims to fame.
And yes, I've run multiple nightlies, and ran RC1, I did not care for any of them enough to keep me around long. I am waiting however for 6.1 and look forward to trying it out.

Thats it......too complex. I can't think of anything else. The argument that
1 there really isnt that much 4g out there
2 HDMI really doesnt work
3 who really sends pics / voice MMS anyhow.
4 are you really using your FM radio (no.....im not but thats not the point in the whole picture)
5 voicemail issues - just move to SOMTHING ELSE (gvoice etc)
These are poor agrguments. Post objective findings on why Cyanogen 6.0 for the EVO is such a better rom. Give me some FreakEvo vs Cyanogen quadrant photos (what ever kernal you like to use). Set cpu settings equal and EVO switch settings equal.
Post some photos. Show me why CM6 is better. Don't show me emotionally.....show me with objective data. Then.....ill understand the "non-sense" and stop my silly confusion. Thats my whole point with my silly quandry. I really DO like CM6...I just want the features my phone is capable of (which.....most of them I do use...) to work.

jasonziter said:
Thats it......too complex. I can't think of anything else. The argument that
1 there really isnt that much 4g out there
2 HDMI really doesnt work
3 who really sends pics / voice MMS anyhow.
4 are you really using your FM radio (no.....im not but thats not the point in the whole picture)
5 voicemail issues - just move to SOMTHING ELSE (gvoice etc)
These are poor agrguments. Post objective findings on why Cyanogen 6.0 for the EVO is such a better rom. Give me some FreakEvo vs Cyanogen quadrant photos (what ever kernal you like to use). Set cpu settings equal and EVO switch settings equal.
Post some photos. Show me why CM6 is better. Don't show me emotionally.....show me with objective data. Then.....ill understand the "non-sense" and stop my silly confusion. Thats my whole point with my silly quandry. I really DO like CM6...I just want the features my phone is capable of (which.....most of them I do use...) to work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're asking him to do the testing to back up his point, when you're the one with the challenge?
BUT
I might have just found something I'm interested in and maybe I'll do the testing you're asking for today during my afternoon at work.
Fresh installed FreakEvo and Fresh CM 6.0 running the gambit.

[email protected] Pao
@Jasonziter
lol dude!!! lol 'dont show me emotionally'
it seems you and maybe another are the ones who are getting upset/emotional
lol
you ask us our opinions, then you 'attack' us for them.....and your rebuttal is back it up with objective data....
dude its not that serious.
"you can lead a horse to the water well..... "

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I understand your curiosity about what makes it measurably better, but I don't undestand what makes you think anyone would be motivated to win you over..
I love CM6 and am very happy to be running it on my phone, it's smooth and reliable and I'm happy with it. I could give a **** if you like it or decide to start using it.
If you don't see the value, and if you prefere a sense based rom then use a sense based rom. If you want to know the difference then flash them both and run your objective tests and share the results with the community. It would be interesting to know but I don't forsee anyone providing you with this data in an attempt to convince you to become a CM6 user.
You want some objective data? CM is powered by unicorns.. does it get any better than that?

Zergburger that is a mighty quadrant score indeed. What were you OC'ed to in that?

nebenezer said:
You want some objective data? CM is powered by unicorns.. does it get any better than that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^this^ lol

My new Vibrant's GPS works better than my old one

It's no joke. Ignore the accuracy rating because it's just an estimate. Look at the SNR's between the two. It works much better in buildings, with Google Navigation, has no problem getting a lock, reported accuracy when driving is often 5-7 meters vs 10 then 40 then searching for GPS with the old phone. Never loses it's GPS lock, EVER and I've been testing it for a few days now. No big circles (stable lock)..
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just fyi, when someone says their GPS works fine - they might be telling the truth

Just curious, why did you get your phone replaced?

kdf2883 said:
Just curious, why did you get your phone replaced?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The headset jack

heygrl said:
The headset jack
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The replacement you got is JI6, correct?
Also if you leave it stationary, does the SNR jumps up and down or stays relatively stable?

heygrl said:
It's no joke. Ignore the accuracy rating because it's just an estimate. Look at the SNR's between the two. It works much better in buildings, with Google Navigation, has no problem getting a lock, reported accuracy when driving is often 5-7 meters vs 10 then 40 then searching for GPS with the old phone. Never loses it's GPS lock, EVER and I've been testing it for a few days now. No big circles (stable lock)..
just fyi, when someone says their GPS works fine - they might be telling the truth
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see you're using 3G on the new one, and wifi on the old one. I get faster locks with wifi off. Can you try them both setup exactly the same? Not saying this accounts for the difference, but I like to see exact comparisons on things like this.
Thanks.

It's the same with or without WiFi on. It was tethered to the other phone. aGPS data was already downloaded. I've tested it both ways and there is no difference, the new phone reports higher SNR's

heygrl said:
It's the same with or without WiFi on. It was tethered to the other phone. aGPS data was already downloaded. I've tested it both ways and there is no difference, the new phone reports higher SNR's
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cool. Thanks.

lqaddict said:
The replacement you got is JI6, correct?
Also if you leave it stationary, does the SNR jumps up and down or stays relatively stable?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's much more stable (obviously because of the increased SNR) but I don't know what the reasonable range is. Like I said below, it's cloudy so they should be unstable
Furthermore: off of WiFi for both like requested
It's cloudy today. The new Vibrant's GPS performed admirably when going under clouds while driving but accuracy did decrease. The old Vibrant is probably so bipolar because they are passing clouds. Maybe 2 minutes before I took that pic it had a better lock and as you can see, 4 minutes inbetween shots and the SNR has lowered and shifted on the new Vibrant but the older one completely lost it's (inaccurate) GPS lock.

heygrl said:
It's much more stable (obviously because of the increased SNR) but I don't know what the reasonable range is. Like I said below, it's cloudy so they should be unstable
Furthermore: off of WiFi for both like requested
It's cloudy today. The new Vibrant's GPS performed admirably when going under clouds while driving but accuracy did decrease. The old Vibrant is probably so bipolar because they are passing clouds. Maybe 2 minutes before I took that pic it had a better lock and as you can see, 4 minutes inbetween shots and the SNR has lowered and shifted on the new Vibrant but the older one completely lost it's (inaccurate) GPS lock.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You should be pretty much on the dot if your SNR is between 30 and 45, the higher the better obviously.

heygrl-
Just so I'm clear...are both of those phones set up identically, i.e., stock 2.1 JI6, etc.? No other differences in settings?

This is true, I traded my phone in because of gps, lag, freezing and crashing, etc...... Got a new phone and transferred all of my stuff to the new phone and the gps was dead on, no more lag and no more freezing, When I tried to use the bluetooth, no worky. tried everything, and so did tmobile, called in and ordered another one, it showed up and everything was great including the bluetooth, loaded in my apps and files and bluetooth quit working, went to tmobile store and they messed with it including a reset to stock and still no worky, pulled battery and it started working, reloaded my apps and files, no bluetooth again, pulled battery and it now works
I pulled the battery on the 1st phone twice and it made no difference????????
What can I say, I think the refurbished phones have been changed some how.....
The gps finds my location on a cold start in about 10 to 15 seconds and if I try it in navigator on a cold start it may take several minutes. on a hot start it takes about 5 seconds
The compass seems to work and when the car is stopped the arrow stays in one place on the map, but it may point in different directions.
If anyone has a phone that has lag issues and or the gps sucks, I would recomend that you do a warrenty trade in immediately, this sticks it to tmobile and samsung and should give you a phone that works

heygrl said:
It's no joke. Ignore the accuracy rating because it's just an estimate. Look at the SNR's between the two. It works much better in buildings, with Google Navigation, has no problem getting a lock, reported accuracy when driving is often 5-7 meters vs 10 then 40 then searching for GPS with the old phone. Never loses it's GPS lock, EVER and I've been testing it for a few days now. No big circles (stable lock)..
just fyi, when someone says their GPS works fine - they might be telling the truth
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe the reason your new one works better is because you haven't messed it up by tinkering with the GPS settings.
I've followed the GPS drama since the Vibrant came out, and remember reading your posts, you've messed around with the GPS settings a lot on your old phone.
Personally, I don't know who came up with all those fake GPS "fixes" for the Vibrant on this forum, they never worked, and just made GPS performance for me worse. I've had better luck on all stock settings. Seriously, why did the mods allow that thread to continue titled "GPS FIX" bogus, no fix at all.
Maybe going into your GPS settings and deleting data and tinkering with **** is not a good idea.
Enjoy your new phone.

I didn't touch the LBSTestMode settings on either phone. It's pointless stuff, it doesn't last/can make stuff worse for how ever long it lasts. Either way it doesn't really make a difference here. I recently lost everything on my old phone thanks to Eugene's FroYo and had to start fresh again. Even beforehand I haven't done anything in LBSTestMode. Changes in GPS software have to come from Samsung.

heygrl said:
I didn't touch the LBSTestMode settings on either phone. It's pointless stuff, it doesn't last/can make stuff worse for how ever long it lasts. Either way it doesn't really make a difference here. I recently lost everything on my old phone thanks to Eugene's FroYo and had to start fresh again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
how many exchanges have you done?

One at the crapshack and one from T-Mobile

heygrl said:
One at the crapshack and one from T-Mobile
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hopefully you won't need anymore. Enjoy your new phone.

Even when locked, my vibrant only accurate to 30 feet meh.

Gigamaster89 said:
Even when locked, my vibrant only accurate to 30 feet meh.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a problem, because even under these poor weather conditions (for GPS) getting down to 24FT/over my house on the map in my house is not a problem. Not any worse than the DROID X

The JI6 update OBVIOUSLY fixed the GPS lock and stable accuracy because it was listed on the bug fix list from Samsung and mine sure showed a very fast GPS lock via 3G even on a rainy cloudy day in California INSIDE the room upstairs a few feet away from the window and it worked at work place and a couple other spots even the phone was turned on after a full charge. And I love the Vibrant even more and I love GPS with the free nice looking voice guidance nav app from Google. And EVERYTHING that takes max cpu power and ram run smooth unlike other Android phones.

[REF]Signal/modem comparison

Figure I could start a signal/modem comparison thread and people could add to it if they wanted.
For my tests I used the following
Application Network Signal Info from the market (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.android.telnet&hl=en)
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Phone was sitting in same spot for all tests connected to same network and wifi router
Network being used was Rogers Wireless in Canada and I was located in Montreal
Rogers uses 850/1900 for 3G and 2G services. Same as Bell, Telus and ATT in North America
Phone is running latest ICS Wanam ROM based on XWLP7
Modems can be found in various places but the 2 locations I have gotten them from are
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1131950
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1277593
Speedtests where not performed since I was mainly testing for signal. You can add those results to your tests if you wish
For results measurements were taken every 2 min. Please note not all radios are supported by the app I mentioned and also I haven’t tested all of them so feel free to add your own results but please post he following
Location (country/city)
Provider
Frequencies they use if you know
Feel free to post your results but please do not post requesting someone test a radio for you. You can do it yourself so no need to have someone do the work for you. Post your results in here

Hey, that's great and all but... How do your results translate? Any impressions on these particular results?
**EDIT** Post taken from a random forum for information:
The difference between -72dB and -75dB won't be noticable because they are both well above the minimum threshold of somewhere around -100dB to -105dB for GSM. If you take the 3dB difference between -99dB and -102dB then it could mean the difference between dropping the call or not. Generally, you can say, for GSM:
-105 to -100 = Bad/drop call
-99 to -90 = Getting bad/signal may break up
-89 to -80 = OK/shouldn't have problems, but maybe
-79 to -65 = Good
Over -65 = Excellent
....but keep in mind, it's not the phones reception but it's uplink transmit power that limits the range of the phone.

karendar said:
Hey, that's great and all but... How do your results translate? Any impressions on these particular results?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When dealing with signal measurements I would rather display the numbers and not give impressions.
Overall I have never had any issues with reception or speeds on my device but I still like knowing what I am actually getting in terms of stats from one radio to another. From the info I got seems XXLPR s worst 3G performer on rogers vs the other 2 radios having at least 6db difference. Other then that wifi difference was marginal from one to another.
We shouldn't start comparing impressions and statistical data. I would prefer this thread simply be about hard numbers.
People can have their own impressions. Obviously my results may vary from everyone else but still a thread like this could come in handy for people asking about radios. Results will vary depending on traffic, location ,router etc

fidorulz said:
When dealing with signal measurements I would rather display the numbers and not give impressions.
Overall I have never had any issues with reception or speeds on my device but I still like knowing what I am actually getting in terms of stats from one radio to another.
We shouldn't start comparing impressions and statistical data. I would prefer this thread simply be about hard numbers.
People can have their own impressions. Obviously my results may vary from everyone else but still a thread like this could come in handy for people asking about radios
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I personally hit alot of dead-zones with Fido/Rogers around my work area, which isn't really a justifiable test for modems... And anyways, I'm sure your results would be very similar to what I can pull.

karendar said:
I personally hit alot of dead-zones with Fido/Rogers around my work area, which isn't really a justifiable test for modems... And anyways, I'm sure your results would be very similar to what I can pull.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well if there are locations where you are on the limit of coverage doing these tests would be even more beneficial as radios will also perform differently based on reception available.
If your able to test please post what you can

it maybe be worth to also include battery drain for modems? i know this would be impractical to test out but atleast the testers could mention what they observe

WiFi performance has nothing directly to do with the baseband/modem...

zonehack said:
it maybe be worth to also include battery drain for modems? i know this would be impractical to test out but atleast the testers could mention what they observe
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For battery drain many more factors other then the radio that play a part such as display and applications so it may not be the best info to provide. Mainly want to focus on signal strength for network and wifi and maybe speeds also

LenAsh said:
WiFi performance has nothing directly to do with the baseband/modem...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know the kernel plays a big part but the modem has to also have a part in the wifi
maybe im wrong

Nope...

Funny thing is I've tested between different modems (kj1, lpq, lpj, lps, and lpr) and got the same results for all (89db). Really is there any point to this, flash any modem and receive the same results.

snappy123 said:
Funny thing is I've tested between different modems (kj1, lpq, lpj, lps, and lpr) and got the same results for all (89db). Really is there any point to this, flash any modem and receive the same results.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Some of those wont work with the app you should get a pop up saying so bu LPS and LPR should give variations.
Even without moving the signal should change once in a while

I think that the most important thing to a modem is the voice quality. Unfortunatelly, for the voice quality we can give only impressions and not numbers for comparing modems.
Best regards.

How about this people should post the carrier, country and frequencies the carrier uses and the modem they think is best and why
Seems we can't all agree on what to specify but let's at least post modem info and carrier/country info
I just figured people need a reference thread of this kind

Can you re-run the test at another time, say between 2am and 5am, and in a different order, you might find very different results.
Due to frequent network fluctuations, your results will vary considerably depending on the current state of the network.
In order to get a real handle on the best modem, you have to many back to back tests, at different times of the day.
I have done much testing myself of modems, and as it shows in your results, there is not much discernible differences between the latest ICS modems, but it's interesting none the less.
BTW wifi has nothing to do with the modem/radio, but is related to the kernel.

Damienoid said:
Can you re-run the test at another time, say between 2am and 5am, and in a different order, you might find very different results.
Due to frequent network fluctuations, your results will vary considerably depending on the current state of the network.
In order to get a real handle on the best modem, you have to many back to back tests, at different times of the day.
I have done much testing myself of modems, and as it shows in your results, there is not much discernible differences between the latest ICS modems, but it's interesting none the less.
BTW wifi has nothing to do with the modem/radio, but is related to the kernel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good to know maybe speeds can also be a focus for the modem info posted

snappy123 said:
Funny thing is I've tested between different modems (kj1, lpq, lpj, lps, and lpr) and got the same results for all (89db). Really is there any point to this, flash any modem and receive the same results.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If I recall correct this is caused by Samsungs software.
You should go to Settings > About > Status to see the actual signal reading.
Bare with me on the instructions as I'm doing this by degrading memory

mccune said:
If I recall correct this is caused by Samsungs software.
You should go to Settings > About > Status to see the actual signal reading.
Bare with me on the instructions as I'm doing this by degrading memory
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes Settings > About > Status is correct it will show the dbm level there too

mccune said:
If I recall correct this is caused by Samsungs software.
You should go to Settings > About > Status to see the actual signal reading.
Bare with me on the instructions as I'm doing this by degrading memory
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes, i checked the results there aswell. the one thing however since switching from kj1 (standard modem for vodafone in australia) to lpr is my battery life improved dramatically.
using betterbatterystat app the 'RILJ' now is under 10s wakelock, while kj1 had it in the 3-5min mark. both at about 10hours of usage.

Damienoid said:
BTW wifi has nothing to do with the modem/radio, but is related to the kernel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LenAsh said:
WiFi performance has nothing directly to do with the baseband/modem...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That can't be true.. I had an issue with not being able to connect to my work's wireless network. It worked with the KI4 modem, but not with KH3... If I flashed between them, I could connect to the wi-fi network. Surely that indicates that the modem has some bearing on the wi-fi functionality? Also, I guess GPS is unaffected by different modems?