Database Users

Xperia X2 will still lag with the X1 CPU...

"The response of Windows Mobile 6.5 as presented by XPERIA X2 is not that good as we expected from the latest high-end smartphone of the company. There are noticeable and annoying lags at times, not to mention that scrolling in the new Windows "main menu" causes some visible screen re-rendering stutter as you move up and down. It seems the graphics subsytem needs tweaking or plainly put - more processing power. Perhaps that's understandable as only now did we find out that the XPERIA X2 runs on the same CPU as the X1." -GSMArena

and that's where the big FAIL comes in...

gundamboy said:
and that's where the big FAIL comes in...
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I know but ... some people are trying to hide that fact and say that the phone is perfect with that processor.. There is absolutely no logic to that, and that is pissing me off.

I really anticipated a lot from this phone, the specs are SO disappointing.
These are upgrades that should have been in the first release =/

look... its still beta software...
hopefully sony can get it optimized... but i'm with you guys i dont think it'll ever be as fluid as other OS's.
oh well at least its WIMO... so there's a high possibility that the software will be ported back to x1

ryousuke said:
oh well at least its WIMO... so there's a high possibility that the software will be ported back to x1
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that's true, and that would be a good thing. I'm only into the X2 because of its camera, and slightly larger screen.
If it ever drops to $400 or lower, I'd consider it.

Guys,
I wonder if Sony is going to pay Qualcomm for the video drivers this time around. Because if they're still sticking with the same POS chip and not pay for the driver....then it makes me wonder why Sony Ericsson still even exists. It's almost like a big slap in the face to anyone who stays loyal to SE. They think their consumer base will -always- buy whatever they throw at them, even if it's ****ty products.
Cheers.

someone in se camp is in trouble

Guess what - it's the good old 7200A that is the CPU of X2. And from what I read in gsmarena - there are plenty of lags around the UI and the video playback speed is far from superb (comparing to some other new devices). All in all, it's the old X1 with new look and camera. I don't think that's worth even considering as X1 upgrade. It's a strange thing SE is doing with this X2.

thelucius said:
Guess what - it's the good old 7200A that is the CPU of X2. And from what I read in gsmarena - there are plenty of lags around the UI and the video playback speed is far from superb (comparing to some other new devices). All in all, it's the old X1 with new look and camera. I don't think that's worth even considering as X1 upgrade. It's a strange thing SE is doing with this X2.
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They are learning from apple. The X4 update would have xenon flash

x2 has x1 cpu
Loved my X1 especially that nice screen and hires.....but after using the HTC magic, I can't go back, the speed and responsiveness overcomes my love of my X1.
I even flashed the X1 with the EnergyROM with 6.5 etc in an attempt to want to keep it, but just find it lagging, espically if you are doing something, then phone rings and your try to answer.....ARGH, it takes 3 seconds to finally answer.......
Sadly my X1 goes for sale next week, my Magic, flashed with the Hero ROM is snappy, and does just about everything I want it to (I miss Tom Tom )
Maybe the X5 will do it for Sony....
poetryrocksalot said:
"The response of Windows Mobile 6.5 as presented by XPERIA X2 is not that good as we expected from the latest high-end smartphone of the company. There are noticeable and annoying lags at times, not to mention that scrolling in the new Windows "main menu" causes some visible screen re-rendering stutter as you move up and down. It seems the graphics subsytem needs tweaking or plainly put - more processing power. Perhaps that's understandable as only now did we find out that the XPERIA X2 runs on the same CPU as the X1." -GSMArena
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Click to collapse

I love my X1 and X2 is not much different, but I am hopeful new software will work fine on my X1.
I have read a lot of posts on how people feel about X1 and I think I am the only person who likes the panel interface . Anyway if the new panels are nice and slick and I can use them on my X1 I will be happy they made an X2, but for the camera and bigger screen alone I cannot pay for a new phone.
I haven't seen anything convincing to make me upgrade, and I am not sure about all the love that Android and iPhone products get, but for now I am sticking with WinMo. I got a lot of software I know and like. I suppose a slicker, full-featured OS would convince me, but iPhone is not full-feature, and I don't know about current Android software availability.
If there were an Android device with 850/1900Mhz HSDPA and a qwerty keyboard maybe I'd give it a shot, but until then X1 is king in my book.

http://www.glbenchmark.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=glpro&showhide=true&D1=SonyEricsson X1i XPERIA&D2=SonyEricsson X2 XPERIA Vulcan
not too impressive :S
p.s. to get to the page copy paste the link as the forum breaks the url

?
BuddyLee said:
They are learning from apple. The X4 update would have xenon flash
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Fracking loled. Sadly, it is true.
Back to OP.
How can some people defend this mockery by SE is beyond me.
"It is still an early version", "The soft will be optimized", etc.
Use your brains folks. More power hungry hardware and software CANNOT run better on the same old parts. It is simple logic that even a 3 year old can understand...
I get that your expectations were for more and that you are disappointed. I felt the same way after TP2 came out. This is no reason to deny the obvious truth and be blind fanboys though.
This is just a laughable attempt of SE to earn lots of cash while providing the smallest number of upgrades. In other words, they want to spend less and gain huge ammounts. I am sorry, but people are not that stupid and those kind of tricks won't work.
This is actually worse than the TP2 and iPhail upgrades lol.
I think that the X1 with better processor and everything else the same would have been a far better "upgrade" than this joke. Keep your useless 8mpx camera and accelerometer and give us the 800mhz - 1ghz cpu. You fail SE. You fail more than Apple and that is something I thought no one could achieve......

orelsi said:
?
Fracking loled. Sadly, it is true.
Back to OP.
How can some people defend this mockery by SE is beyond me.
"It is still an early version", "The soft will be optimized", etc.
Use your brains folks. More power hungry hardware and software CANNOT run better on the same old parts. It is simple logic that even a 3 year old can understand...
I get that your expectations were for more and that you are disappointed. I felt the same way after TP2 came out. This is no reason to deny the obvious truth and be blind fanboys though.
This is just a laughable attempt of SE to earn lots of cash while providing the smallest number of upgrades. In other words, they want to spend less and gain huge ammounts. I am sorry, but people are not that stupid and those kind of tricks won't work.
This is actually worse than the TP2 and iPhail upgrades lol.
I think that the X1 with better processor and everything else the same would have been a far better "upgrade" than this joke. Keep your useless 8mpx camera and accelerometer and give us the 800mhz - 1ghz cpu. You fail SE. You fail more than Apple and that is something I thought no one could achieve......
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What a bull****.
It's absolutely more new stuff than Apple or TP2. Why do you make
these whining false statements.
I mean we would all welcome more and more, but why this whining.
None of you touched this even once.
So you also USE YOUR BRAIN.
Or this is too emotional for you....

Seems like orelsi wants to be the forum's conscience and bring us poor, misguided fanboys back to hard reality...

frive said:
Seems like orelsi wants to be the forum's conscience and bring us poor, misguided fanboys back to hard reality...
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Well he has many many valid points.
But other's have conscience as well.

orelsi and doministry both have really good points, but constantly arguing over it won't change anything.
the truth is:
Its a sexy new phone, of course there are some features that appeal and some that don't, but that doesn't change that its NEW or that its a SUCCESSOR.
Similar to the iphone 3GS, minor upgrades, but still popular around the world.
So we can just conclude it with a "Hey, that phone looks like my Xperia X1! I think..."

doministry said:
What a bull****.
Or this is too emotional for you....
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Better look at your own posts. Those two sentences apply to them perfectly.
frive said:
Seems like orelsi wants to be the forum's conscience and bring us poor, misguided fanboys back to hard reality...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't project your own desires on me.
I don't see you making any constructive comments anyway.
gundamboy said:
So we can just conclude it with a "Hey, that phone looks like my Xperia X1! I think..."
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I can live with that .

orelsi said:
Better look at your own posts. Those two sentences apply to them perfectly.
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Sure I do look.

first hd2 rival

look at this device http://www.gsmarena.com/motorola_shadow-3092.php
itseems like it is running the new snapdragon processor qsd8650a at 1.3 ghz
keyboard and 4.3 in display 1080p video decoding your opinions please

Almost the perfect device... but it's Android. Will be interesting to see what they say about it though.

Its ugly, and that thing at the bottom... wth?!?! Thats such a no go for me!

hd2 > that...wouldnt mind the camera though (has to better than the feeble thing on the hd2!)

Yuck! I hate Motorola... they usually don't update their existing devices and instead opt to make new ones to get more money out of their users.

It doesn't even exist yet, not even in prototype form judging by the photoshop picture used.
It'll be a while before this comes to market.

480 x 854 pixels, 4.3 inches can I laught now?

Its going to happen eventually... many phones will get released that match or beat the HD2, in the same way the HD2 owns everything else at the moment.
Just a note though I cant see any mention of the CPU or its speed on that link.

moto sucks

Since the nexus has only recently become available, I'm predicting with 100% certainty that that post is as accurate as the recent "official" HD3 post on this site. Basically, rubbish.

*Moto Sucks
*Resultion ! lol
*Ugly Phone
But there will be a HD3 With a 3.8-3.7 screen + Full hd resultion and HD video capture.. same 1Ghz processor .. When ? Dunno
And 8gb Mem + Memory card

Why is everyone laughing about the screen resolution? A 16:9 screen would be a significant improvement on the HD2's screen for video playback - would allow for playback of anamorphic NTSC DVD rips without any loss of resolution. (On the HD2 you either have to crop or play it at 800x450). Or, in general, it would allow for full-screen playback of any 16:9 material without cropping and without the black bars which seem to distress everyone so much.

phones come N' go but my next one is the HD3. I'm ready to buy it without looking at the spec or any reviews whenever it will be available... Kinda lord of the rings trilogy to me
1) Resolution? IoI
2) 4.3 inch and keyboard.. pocketable? IooI
3) Android? IoooI
...
n) MOTO sux... IooooooooooooooooI

johncmolyneux said:
Since the nexus has only recently become available, I'm predicting with 100% certainty that that post is as accurate as the recent "official" HD3 post on this site. Basically, rubbish.
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although iam the person who posted this post iam with you this post is rubbish and there is no hd3 this year nither this bad moto the new htc is the obsession and it is not a really upgrade to the hd2 it is downgrade in my opinion and it will not named hd3

Ahhhhh.... This is a "Moto Suxs" thread, lol. Or is that "succs"?
Screen resolution.... Think I'm missing the point here too - if you're "lol-ing" at that, then you want to get out more. If it said 320x240, then yeah, lol.
A physical keyboard would add 5 or 6 mm to the HD2. I'm willing to bet $1,000,000 that that device will be pocketable, because you would have a perfect device. No more griping about the software keyboard or screen sensitivity...
When the HD3 is anounced that has a 5 inch screen and hardware keyboard, I will "lol". Hope it won't suk, shuk, shuck...

hoss_n2 said:
look at this device http://www.gsmarena.com/motorola_shadow-3092.php
itseems like it is running the new snapdragon processor qsd8650a at 1.3 ghz
keyboard and 4.3 in display 1080p video decoding your opinions please
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Click to collapse
YES. YES. YES. Finally an Android phone and not the dying WM OS on really attractive hardware. Hope this is real. Hate having a keyboard, but in view of the other apsect, I'd forgive this shortcoming.

The problem with Android phones is that there are not many good GPS apps for it so I'll stick with my HD2 . I don't like Google Maps.

gregormax said:
The problem with Android phones is that there are not many good GPS apps for it so I'll stick with my HD2 . I don't like Google Maps.
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Sygic is a very good GPS software. Not inferior to TomTom I have to say.

gregormax said:
The problem with Android phones is that there are not many good GPS apps for it so I'll stick with my HD2 . I don't like Google Maps.
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I don't like Google Maps for navigation either but Google Navigator (The one from Google.) is an absolutely amazing piece of navigation technology and will change the way people think about navigation in the future.

balane said:
I don't like Google Maps for navigation either but Google Navigator (The one from Google.) is an absolutely amazing piece of navigation technology and will change the way people think about navigation in the future.
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google navigator is the best

will the 30fps plague ever be lifted??

coming from a samsung galaxy s capable of 60fps , i bought a dell streak for a gaming device because of the screen size, to find put its only capable of 30fps???
every game i pop in there plays very jittery , angry birds for example, when u launch the bird its very very jittery and blurry when the bird flys and actually gives me eye strain and a headache, so before i bring back my att dell streak is froyo 2.2 guaranteed to lift the 30fps plague??

most likely not. from the looks of the ****ty roms from dell, its not promising at all. if you're looking for performance, might as well buy a desire hd or something. htc has much more experience in making android.

damn sucks , welp gunna get a refund from.dell now , thanks for the reply

And BTW Don't forget that the Galaxy S haves 3 times faster GPU than the Streak!

there's phones with way less power then the streak thats able to do 60 fps,
at 30fps the screen really bothers my eye while scrolling, the problem is the phone is CAPPED at 30fps , im just confused on why dell would choose that root knowing this is there first phone, usually first impressions are a must

Probably because of the HDMI out option in the phone.
Shame on Dell, this phone sounded like a dream a year ago.
They released too late.
The hardware is rather old now.
30fps cap
Proprietary connector
android 1.6
Phone was DOA per the above.

how much bull can there be in a thread?
the 30fps cap is down to the hdmi, some of us are looking at removing it.
the galaxy s doesn't have a 3x faster gpu. it has a seperate one, yet I can beat the quadrant scores with what you seem to think is the oh so **** streak.
angry birds really doesn't look jittery here, at any point.
The streak doesn't have a proprietory connector, it uses pdmi, it would be good if dell had told us, and even better if other manufacturers used it as well, so we could get cheaper accessories!
the hardware is the same as HTC are currently releasing, obviously out of date.

Fards, I love you for defending the Streak! Hey, this is my 2-week old baby
Surely it can't be out of date already!
Angry birds looks amazing and wife can't wait for the publication of the full game.

An old ipod 2g plays angry birds like butter, if u think the dell streak plays angry birds with smooth graphics you must have bad eyes, oh and dont bother selecting smooth scrolling in mozilla because its fine the way it is loooooool ,

horses for courses.
one of the main reasons I ditched my Galaxy S was because of the laughably tragic GPS implementation (it looks as though Samsung may be the un-named party in SkyHook vs Google which may explain a few things ...)
the lag issue on the SGS makes it a joke too, "yeah mum all you need to do is flash a rooted ROM using Odin and apply a lagfix - but then don't update to Froyo without wiping and re-partitioning the phone first" - um, no
I'm keeping my SGS around for as long as possible, in case CyanogenMod is released this lifetime ....
30fps is actually as fast as TV and faster than film, yet no one except Jim Cameron complains (and he wants 48fps).
high fps is only part of the story for smooth motion, also cartoons are 12fps but nobody mentions that either, ever. it could be the Streak is stuttering below 30fps, I'm sure a constant 30fps would be perfectly acceptable.
so I don't really see what a big deal a 30fps cap is, but then I prefer Starquake and Dynamite Dan over COD and Halo.

30fps tv??? do u have wood surrounding your tv screen, and does it weigh 900 pounds,
amazing i feel so much dumber talking on this forum, don't expect me to re post,so u can talk among yourself s while this piece of 30fps **** goes back to dell

Its a fact. Cinema is 24fps. many bluerays fix the refresh to 24fps to match the speed of cell cameras. It looks great. And anyone who bought a 200hz tv is an idiot. It will not improve motion it is just a resample and any resampling will degrade quality. So with that out the way ill end by saying 30fps is more than adequate. My girlfriend has the sgs and while its a great phone the streaak is a better device on so many levels
Sent from my Dell Streak using XDA App

cowballz69 said:
30fps tv??? do u have wood surrounding your tv screen, and does it weigh 900 pounds,
amazing i feel so much dumber talking on this forum, don't expect me to re post,so u can talk among yourself s while this piece of 30fps **** goes back to dell
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thanks for not coming back

cowballz69 said:
30fps tv??? do u have wood surrounding your tv screen, and does it weigh 900 pounds,
amazing i feel so much dumber talking on this forum, don't expect me to re post,so u can talk among yourself s while this piece of 30fps **** goes back to dell
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand why you feel so dumb while there are much smarter people on this forum...

angry bird on android runs at higher resolution than on iPhone. it might look good on 3GS or older model, but not on iPhone 4 with its high resolution screen.
so it's not a surprise to see an old iPod touch to play angry bird smoothly..
i wonder how it gonna handle angry bird with high reso like the one we have on android!

so pleased I won't have to explain frames vs fields, progressive vs interlaced, whew!

maybe u should?

miker71 said:
so pleased I won't have to explain frames vs fields, progressive vs interlaced, whew!
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As a general rule just ignore anyhing that isnt progressive. In this day and age theres no excuse for interlaced
Sent from my Dell Streak using XDA App

here's a good starting point
http://www.100fps.com/how_many_frames_can_humans_see.htm
more fps may indeed be more "real" however i think the key is a consistent framerate without stuttering.
we are asking our phones to do more and more and do it well - i'm more than happy with what the dell streak offers today despite perhaps a weaker GPU (wait - phones have a GPU!!!! honestly, seeing this tech evolve over the years shows an amazing journey and some very clever engineering no matter where your brand allegiances may lay)
what i find ironic is that ARM + PowerVR are mobile darlings that were written off in the nineties as the Windows juggernaut became unstoppable.
(remember PowerVR losing to Voodoo 3Dfx ... who has the last laugh!!)

cowballz69 said:
every game i pop in there plays very jittery , angry birds for example, when u launch the bird its very very jittery and blurry when the bird flys and actually gives me eye strain and a headache, so before i bring back my att dell streak is froyo 2.2 guaranteed to lift the 30fps plague??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If its jittery it's not running at 30fps is it? Angry Birds is beta anyway...
I don't think you actually understand...

Se limiting fps to 30 max?

I tried to benchmark my sony ericsson xperia x10 with FPS2D...
It seems that it limits the speed to 30FPS MAX... it tries to go higher but it keeps getting blocked at 30fps wtf is wrong>?

They locked it down to 32fps ... Nothing can be done until we can cook custom ROMS or SE decide to unlock the cap. Its just like EVO 4G.

I wonder why they felt they had to limit it? I noticed when doing the GLBenchmark1.1 test that it maxed out at 32fps. The N8 is hitting 60fps, why dont SE just allow it to go above 32fps?
Does anyone know why HTC limited the Evo 4G? Could explain why SE did it to.

POLO_i780 said:
I wonder why they felt they had to limit it? I noticed when doing the GLBenchmark1.1 test that it maxed out at 32fps. The N8 is hitting 60fps, why dont SE just allow it to go above 32fps?
Does anyone know why HTC limited the Evo 4G? Could explain why SE did it to.
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HTC removed the 30 fps cap in one of the latest updates, afaik.
Does anyone know if this limit on X10 will be broken with 2.1?
otherwise I'll think I might buy another phone

tuxo87 said:
HTC removed the 30 fps cap in one of the latest updates, afaik.
Does anyone know if this limit on X10 will be broken with 2.1?
otherwise I'll think I might buy another phone
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Click to collapse
Why? What difference does it make?

The telephone is much smoother @60fps. dunno if it affects touchscreen responsiveness too (or the way you feel it )
its hard to explain, but if you manage to try an iphone 4 you'll surely notice the difference.

You know, until this thread, I doubt anyone on here even knew/cared about the FPS.
It's nice to see that the Android fanboys haven't disappointed me with their endless pursuit of meaningless higher numbers.

iead1 said:
You know, until this thread, I doubt anyone on here even knew/cared about the FPS.
It's nice to see that the Android fanboys haven't disappointed me with their endless pursuit of meaningless higher numbers.
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umm... can you explain to me what is meaningless about it? is having more horsepower in a car meaningless? is having a larger house meaningless? is having more money meaningless?
yeah i bet you answered no to all those questions, if not then somethings wrong with you.
these numbers that are limited to something less than what the hardware is capable of is stupid. the pursuit of higher performance on a device that is MORE than capable of it (due to the lack of software to support it atm), is something very viable...
as for the android fanboy comment... thats just stupid lol

Did you honestly notice any performance issues before this thread?
If your eye can really tell the difference between 60 and 30 fps, I applaud you.
My point isn't the fact that it's actually locked (I don't care either way), I just find it funny that as soon as an Android fanboy finds out their numbers are lower than someone else's, they freak out.

Its possible that they decided to cap it after finding stability issues at higher frame rates... even then, how does it actually affect anything? I mean, do videos become visibly smoother at higher frame rates? (I honestly don't know, so I'm asking)
And wrt the android fanboy comment - If you don't find android fanboys at xda, where else would you find them

actually i kinda care, coz one of my games, hyper jump i think has a refresh line split straight down the middle and i can't see scrap my when... etc. etc.
but yea i like things to look smooth, what's the fps on the iphone coz it looks so slick

pngface said:
Its possible that they decided to cap it after finding stability issues at higher frame rates... even then, how does it actually affect anything? I mean, do videos become visibly smoother at higher frame rates? (I honestly don't know, so I'm asking)
And wrt the android fanboy comment - If you don't find android fanboys at xda, where else would you find them
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It doesn't affect videos, because the video would have had to be made at the higher FPS to actually benefit. FPS only benefits games, and the goal is always 30 FPS. Higher is nice, but not needed for most games. I would be surprised if iPhone games ran higher.
Maybe I should've wrote "X10 Fanboys" ahaha. Always wanting that 2.2, 16,000,000, 3.0, 512, ect.

pngface said:
Its possible that they decided to cap it after finding stability issues at higher frame rates... even then, how does it actually affect anything? I mean, do videos become visibly smoother at higher frame rates? (I honestly don't know, so I'm asking)
And wrt the android fanboy comment - If you don't find android fanboys at xda, where else would you find them
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Click to collapse
Dunno about videos but the android interface would be sensibly smoother. it's like playing a 3d game. is it more playable at 60 or 30 fps?
I seriosly thinks that the FPS cap limits the touchscreen responsiveness too.

tuxo87 said:
Dunno about videos but the android interface would be sensibly smoother. it's like playing a 3d game. is it more playable at 60 or 30 fps?
I seriosly thinks that the FPS cap limits the touchscreen responsiveness too.
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60fps is better only if it doesn't fall from 60 to 20 fps which i think will happen just too often thanks to Adreno 200(while playing 3D games at least)

When playing Asphalt ive noticed skipping/jerking of frames, and im betting thats due to the cap. The Andreno200 seems to be capable of upto 45fps, thats what the Desire is reflecting in the benchmark tests, im sure the extra 13fps will make a significant difference when gaming, i love playing games on my X10's gorgeous 4" display, the phone is so great to hold and play games on, but it sucks when you run into jerkyness here and there due to a dam limit, when the hardware is far more capable.

Um, locking the frame rate results in smoother graphics, not jerky ones.
If you're experiencing jerkiness, then the frame rate never reached the limit when you were using the software. The whole point of locking the frame rate is so things appear smooth at all times.

iead1 said:
It doesn't affect videos, because the video would have had to be made at the higher FPS to actually benefit. FPS only benefits games, and the goal is always 30 FPS. Higher is nice, but not needed for most games. I would be surprised if iPhone games ran higher.
Maybe I should've wrote "X10 Fanboys" ahaha. Always wanting that 2.2, 16,000,000, 3.0, 512, ect.
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Click to collapse
Part of the desire comes from other Android handsets already having these features eons ago. There's nothing wrong with wanting the best performance from your phone.
I bought mine because it had the best specs at the time and I was assured that updates would soon follow, not minor updates but major ones.
It seems in all your posts you do nothing but defend the X10 and shoot down everyone who isn't 100% satisfied like you are. I admit that I've been negative in the past but I've forked out more than half a grand for a damn phone, and yes, I did do the research. I thought SE would have killed the Android market with the way they fluffed up their phone and boasted in all their marketing pieces.

why don't you think it the other way around, maybe SE has limited the FPS to save you from a crashing OS, it's a common knowledge that X10 is one of the highest specs phones in the market till today, and it's a common knowledge also that SE has modified the Android 1.6 too much to be able to work on that specs, and in their process to do so they admittedly limited the functionality of the phone maybe to keep the OS working smooth without any flaws till they issue the long delayed Android 2.1 update.

Its a common fallacy, people assume that bigger numbers mean better. That is only true if there is a noticeable difference...
A bigger house is of no use to you if all the extra rooms are locked.
... and there is no extra "cost" or detrimental effect...
A bigger house is great, if it doesn't mean it suddenly costs you more than you can afford.
To address those points, it is generally accepted that the human eye cannot resolve movement at much higher framerates than 28-32 FPS. Any film you have seen at the cinema, and any TV you have watched has been at 24FPS and that certainly has never seemed jerky to me.
So is 60 FPS better? Well no not really, as you cant see the difference. And whilst you may be able to argue you can see the difference between 25 and 35FPS (Note 30FPS sits in the middle ) If you make the claim you can differentiate all the way up to 60, im going to need serious proof.
Its worth noting at this point that a lot of hoohah is often made about framerates, especially in 3d gaming. This is NOT because of the user experience, its because its a good way to compare hardware performance. Past a certain point (around 30fps) it makes little to no difference to the user experience.
Now onto the second part of my awesome house analogy, why bother locking it anyway? Because to produce MORE than 30 FPS, i.e. to go beyond the boundry at which the user can tell a difference, requires more power.
More power means poorer battery performance, amongst other things (although in mobile device design power consumption is a chief concern). The key point here being that it requires extra juice but delivers no increase in user experience. Essentially just chucking power out of the window, to nobodies benefit.
Finally, those people experiencing "lags" in games, that's not due to frame capping. That happens when the frame rate drops BELOW the cap (considerably below) therefore the cap has had no effect.
Finally, a disclaimer, im not blindly defending SE here, i think their software and post sales support leaves a LOT to be desired, but lets ***** and flame about something that deserves it:
Books are for people too poor to buy a TV. Discuss.

bongd said:
Part of the desire comes from other Android handsets already having these features eons ago. There's nothing wrong with wanting the best performance from your phone.
I bought mine because it had the best specs at the time and I was assured that updates would soon follow, not minor updates but major ones.
It seems in all your posts you do nothing but defend the X10 and shoot down everyone who isn't 100% satisfied like you are. I admit that I've been negative in the past but I've forked out more than half a grand for a damn phone, and yes, I did do the research. I thought SE would have killed the Android market with the way they fluffed up their phone and boasted in all their marketing pieces.
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Click to collapse
More like I hate stupidity, and most of my posts are defending intelligence. I'm convinced that 75% of this board are high school students living with their parents in their basements, buying phone's with daddy's credit card.
Anyway, the poster above me explained it perfectly.

DHD vs. EVO 4g

Hey everyone (this is my first post although I've been following the forum for a couple of weeks now!)
Like most everyone I've been eagerly waiting for the Desire HD and getting impatient for the delay. I just watched a video comparing Desire HD and EVO 4g on engadget, in which the guy says the Desire HD 3G won't work in the US? I'm an absolute newbie and have never had an Android phone...can anyone confirm this? Thanks!
Here is the said video:
engadget.com/2010/10/30/htc-desire-hd-vs-evo-4g-fight/
EDIT: I just found another similar thread that answered my question...wanted to delete my post but don't know how...well at least there's that engadget video ...

nubicurio said:
Hey everyone (this is my first post although I've been following the forum for a couple of weeks now!)
Like most everyone I've been eagerly waiting for the Desire HD and getting impatient for the delay. I just watched a video comparing Desire HD and EVO 4g on engadget, in which the guy says the Desire HD 3G won't work in the US? I'm an absolute newbie and have never had an Android phone...can anyone confirm this? Thanks!
Here is the said video:
engadget.com/2010/10/30/htc-desire-hd-vs-evo-4g-fight/
EDIT: I just found another similar thread that answered my question...wanted to delete my post but don't know how...well at least there's that engadget video ...
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Click to collapse
to be honest. i think only a retard would sell his Evo 4G to DHD. as i personally think the EVO 4G is superior to DHD in many ways its not even funny.
its kinda like the europen/asia/middle eastern people got a stupid low version of the EVO 4G.
1- no 4G
2- No second camera
3- no kick stand
4- no mini hdmi port
are they serious ?
and on top of all that, there are some hardware problems with the DHD it self that needs to be fixed " sensor, touch panel etc".
i think the DHD is a total fail. with all respect to everyone who bought it.
and i really hope it bombs hard to htc think twice before f****ng up their customers outside the US.
too bad the evo is CDMA only. i would have paid 700$ for it :/

4g hasn't even been released in many places outside of america, it's capable of handling hspa+ speeds..
I don't know anyone who actually uses the secondary camera. I've had it on my n95 and touch pro 2 and never missed it going onto my nexus one.
No hdmi port because we have dlna.
How is the desire hd a fail? It's been noted worldwide that it is one of the best, if not the best android phone out at the moment.

teihoata said:
4g hasn't even been released in many places outside of america, it's capable of handling hspa+ speeds..
I don't know anyone who actually uses the secondary camera. I've had it on my n95 and touch pro 2 and never missed it going onto my nexus one.
No hdmi port because we have dlna.
How is the desire hd a fail? It's been noted worldwide that it is one of the best, if not the best android phone out at the moment.
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Click to collapse
1- just because its the best in europe doesnt mean its the best world wide.
the evo 4 G destroys it and its an older phone. the DHD is stipped down version in terms of hardware " dont give me newer cpu crap that no one actually use. the android is running super fast on a hd2 . let alone evo "
2- just because you and others dont use the front facing camera doesnt mean its not important. most of my calls are video calls for your info. its more fun and i actually see the girl/guy i am talkin to before we decide to go out and have fun etc
3- dlna is nice. but i am sorry. not all HDtvs have dlna. including my 2 years old Sony Bravia . full hd. hdmi port. no dlna " as far as i know. nothing in the options when i checked "
should i go now and buy a new HDtv ? please. and many others are like this too.
sure the HDMI output is NOT a standard on Mobiles. but the EVO has it. why on earth they took it off from DHD. they are friggin charging the same price for evo as dhd. why should i be ok with the dumped version ?
i am sorry you are ok with the dhd. i hope u have fun with it. but there is no way in hell i am going to let htc get my money on this.
they should have a released a superior phone than Evo considering the evo is old now. but no. we get a worst version for the same price. and on top of that, it has some hardware problems.
oh yeah no **** off
4- the Evo is CDMA only. so its not released any where outside the US. and its sprint exclusive too. so even if i import it. it wont work

How about a newer gpu? I couldn't run asphalt on my nexus one smoothly (it ran the same chipset as the evo) but it runs just fine on my desire hd. I suppose the bump up in inbuilt memory as well as the increase in ram means it is still stripped down hardware wise? It's a 50% increase in both cases.
Do you really walk down the street while your video calling? People who video call in public are ignorant lol don't you use facebook to see who you are going to date?
DLNA is standard for most tv's today, if you don't have a compatible t.v. for dlna then use a ps3, xbox 360 or a computer to stream it. If you're going to watch something off of a t.v. you're more likely to stream over dlna than carry a cord around with you. Who watches stuff off of their phones anyway, get apple or google tv if your serious about your media
We have an updated chipset, what more could you want?
Sure people talk about the gpu and cpu improvements but it also brings support for more video codecs (we can play divx natively whereas the old snapdragon can't), uses less power and has the 8th generation built in gps engine (its a lot quicker to lock on). Not to mention speeds of up to 14.4mbps HSPA+. "4g" that you are referring to barely reaches 3mbps for most people in america. All of these features are things people use on a daily basis.
You sir are crazy to prefer the evo over the dhd

teihoata said:
How about a newer gpu? I couldn't run asphalt on my nexus one smoothly (it ran the same chipset as the evo) but it runs just fine on my desire hd. I suppose the bump up in inbuilt memory as well as the increase in ram means it is still stripped down hardware wise? It's a 50% increase in both cases.
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Click to collapse
you couldnt run asphalt 5 on nexus ? what on earth you were doing to ur phone? i was running it fine on a friggin HD2 man :/
also. since when CPU run asphalt 5. i hope you are talking about the GPU.
all this crap about new CPU/ GPU doesnt really mean anything. the galaxy has a monster of gpu. and what games take advantage of that? zero .nothing really is new in this tech crap. more of a tweek to the CPU. the software isnt even supporting it. i have smooth experience in my hd2 after tweeks. and so in my galaxy s. " i had hd2 "
my point is users like you and i are not noobs. we come here and tweek devices so we dont go like morons and buy anything new a company spit on our face under new cover and call it a day. dont be that guy
teihoata said:
Do you really walk down the street while your video calling? People who video call in public are ignorant lol don't you use facebook to see who you are going to date?
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Click to collapse
yeah most of my calls are really using the front facing camera. specially when i am inside home " my home or friends home" nothing has to do with dating. and no wtf i dont use facebook to date.
teihoata said:
DLNA is standard for most tv's today, if you don't have a compatible t.v. for dlna then use a ps3, xbox 360 or a computer to stream it. If you're going to watch something off of a t.v. you're more likely to stream over dlna than carry a cord around with you. Who watches stuff off of their phones anyway, get apple or google tv if your serious about your media
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sure i can use my DLNA on ps3 or my 360. but the idea of mini hdmi output was if u want to watch at your friends house. why would i plug my mobile to tv if i am at home already and can plug my external hard disk or laptop ?
also, why we are arguing about this? EVO has hdmi output. DHD doesnt. EVO win. period. whatever u will ever use it or not. its there for you if you ever did.
same thing for front cam. 1 day you might be kinky and ur at your work. u call ur gf at home and tell her to show u her ass so u can rub 1 in the bathroom office. the cam is there she can use it lol
teihoata said:
We have an updated chipset, what more could you want?
Sure people talk about the gpu and cpu improvements but it also brings support for more video codecs (we can play divx natively whereas the old snapdragon can't), uses less power and has the 8th generation built in gps engine (its a lot quicker to lock on). Not to mention speeds of up to 14.4mbps HSPA+. "4g" that you are referring to barely reaches 3mbps for most people in america. All of these features are things people use on a daily basis.
You sir are crazy to prefer the evo over the dhd
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Click to collapse
are you trying to bring video codec to this now ? where is my old dusty htc magic. let me download vplayer from the market. it will play everything. put a rock in its face and it will play it.
dont bring something not related to the cpu please.

See when people try to use the kickstand as a valid point for how the EVO is a better phone, you just realise that they are clutching at straws.
Front facing cameras have been available on phone in Europe for near enough 6-7 years, times I or anyone else I know have used one = Zero
The "4G" argument, fair does the US has WiMAX, but it is not fully available all over the US.
The kickstand, come on. Never have I ever thought to myself, know what, I wish my phone had a kickstand so I could watch stuff a little easier.
The DHD has an upgraded CPU and GPU, that right now might not have many more advantages over the EVO, but in the future it will do. When the OS becomes more demanding, the older first generation of Snapdragon devices will become less supported officially for updates etc. That coupled with 256mb more RAM backs that up.
The HDMI port is a bit of a bummer, but for me it is hardly a deal breaker. It would be nice to have, but I can just stream to my PS3 or my TV wirelessly, seems like a fair trade off. Why go digging around the back of my tv which is a cable jungle when I can just do it through wireless?
Anyone who says that the lack of front camera or kickstand is a deal breaker is obviously either a total idiot who just wants more more more regardless of how much they will use it, or is just a spec junkie who wants to brag or look cool online.
The vast majority of phones out there dont have a kickstand or a front facing camera or HDMI out, does that make them bad phones, not at all. It is only recently that people have became fixated by such things, to the point where they are fooling themselves into believing that they matter.

Just my thoughts. To me the DHD is the next step up. I would say it's personal choice, but really the tech is much better with the DHD. I'm in the states, and am much happier with the DHD (even on 2G only. I'm always by wi-fi, so it doesn't matter) than I would be with the Evo. All the things the DHD can do blows the Evo out of the water. Maybe it is just me, but like one poster pointed out, some of the things the DHD can do can't be matched by the Evo. Plus Evo is Sprint only, and I'm on T-Mobile, and plan to stay here. There is no other 4.3 Android for T-Mobile (not that I would care since the DHD rules the world).

ll_l_x_l_ll said:
1- just because its the best in europe doesnt mean its the best world wide.
the evo 4 G destroys it and its an older phone. the DHD is stipped down version in terms of hardware " dont give me newer cpu crap that no one actually use. the android is running super fast on a hd2 . let alone evo "
2- just because you and others dont use the front facing camera doesnt mean its not important. most of my calls are video calls for your info. its more fun and i actually see the girl/guy i am talkin to before we decide to go out and have fun etc
3- dlna is nice. but i am sorry. not all HDtvs have dlna. including my 2 years old Sony Bravia . full hd. hdmi port. no dlna " as far as i know. nothing in the options when i checked "
should i go now and buy a new HDtv ? please. and many others are like this too.
sure the HDMI output is NOT a standard on Mobiles. but the EVO has it. why on earth they took it off from DHD. they are friggin charging the same price for evo as dhd. why should i be ok with the dumped version ?
i am sorry you are ok with the dhd. i hope u have fun with it. but there is no way in hell i am going to let htc get my money on this.
they should have a released a superior phone than Evo considering the evo is old now. but no. we get a worst version for the same price. and on top of that, it has some hardware problems.
oh yeah no **** off
4- the Evo is CDMA only. so its not released any where outside the US. and its sprint exclusive too. so even if i import it. it wont work
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Click to collapse
1. I'm sorry but the DHD actually has faster hardware than the EVO, end of discussion.
2. I have NEVER seen anyone use a front facing camera on a phone. Why would HTC include one if 90% don't want/need it? It's like demanding a 6,3mm jack on the phone because a couple poor guys have headphones that use a 6,3mm jack even though 95% of people use 3,5mm.
3. A lot of new TV's do have DLNA even though your cheap Bravia doesn't. Again, seriously. How often do you use a HDMI output? Again, I have never seen anyone use it.
Why are you even comparing DHD to the EVO when they are not even intedended to be sold on the same continents for god sake. Besides Android is way better imo than WM which I believe the EVO has. Oh and no, it doesn't have hardware problems except for the first batch of phones, so no, you can't generalize that "the DHD has hardware problems"..
PS. Learn to write for God's sake.

All i see is f"""king stupid replies about " i dont use it so its not important" crap.
None is even semi smart with decent iq to know that the US got more hardware extras for their buck than the rest of the world. Seriously
Oh and now evo has WM....
I give up. I will bail out of this thread. If i read more of this **** my iq is gona drop

More hardware extras for their buck? So let me get this straight, you would rather have a kickstand than a faster CPU/GPU combo?! You would rather have a front facing camera than an extra 256mb of RAM?! That's pretty sad tbh. The hdmi output requires a cable to be bought. The DLNA doesn't need anything to be bought unless you have an old tv in which case you will be able to buy the HTC media link.
So let's recap, you would rather NOT have an upgraded CPU, upgraded GPU, 50% more RAM, but as long as you have a kickstand and front facing camera that's better. LOL!!
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App

HacKage said:
More hardware extras for their buck? So let me get this straight, you would rather have a kickstand than a faster CPU/GPU combo?! You would rather have a front facing camera than an extra 256mb of RAM?! That's pretty sad tbh. The hdmi output requires a cable to be bought. The DLNA doesn't need anything to be bought unless you have an old tv in which case you will be able to buy the HTC media link.
So let's recap, you would rather NOT have an upgraded CPU, upgraded GPU, 50% more RAM, but as long as you have a kickstand and front facing camera that's better. LOL!!
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App
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Click to collapse
agree 100%!
the DHD is simply a better phone than the EVO. End of story. Anyone trying to claim that the kickstand and FFC make the EVO better than the DHD are fooling themselves.

Sorry i just couldnt stop myself from doing this>
HacKage said:
More hardware extras for their buck? So let me get this straight, you would rather have a kickstand than a faster CPU/GPU combo?! You would rather have a front facing camera than an extra 256mb of RAM?! That's pretty sad tbh. The hdmi output requires a cable to be bought. The DLNA doesn't need anything to be bought unless you have an old tv in which case you will be able to buy the HTC media link.
So let's recap, you would rather NOT have an upgraded CPU, upgraded GPU, 50% more RAM, but as long as you have a kickstand and front facing camera that's better. LOL!!
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App
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Click to collapse
FTW!
but yeah seriously, if you're from US, by all means go for EVO, you outside get Desire H,enough said.

ll_l_x_l_ll said:
1- just because its the best in europe doesnt mean its the best world wide.
the evo 4 G destroys it and its an older phone. the DHD is stipped down version in terms of hardware " dont give me newer cpu crap that no one actually use. the android is running super fast on a hd2 . let alone evo "
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right...it destroys it? Desire HD in bold; Evo 4g in normal:
Display Type: LCD 16M colors | TFT 65K colors
Internal Memory: 1.5GB, 768MB Ram | 1GB, 512MB Ram
WiFi: B/G/N + DNLA | B/G
CPU: QSD8255 (45nm) | QSD8650
If you knew your stuff you would realise the new Snapdragons are actually smaller meaning less battery usage.
just because you and others dont use the front facing camera doesnt mean its not important. most of my calls are video calls for your info. its more fun and i actually see the girl/guy i am talkin to before we decide to go out and have fun etc
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you do phone dating or something? I know what my friends look like and if I'm going to go out and see them I'm not going to video call them. If I want to video call, i'll use Skype for free. PS. Most people haven't got a front facing camera, don't want to, or having got the connection.
3- dlna is nice. but i am sorry. not all HDtvs have dlna. including my 2 years old Sony Bravia . full hd. hdmi port. no dlna " as far as i know. nothing in the options when i checked "
should i go now and buy a new HDtv ? please. and many others are like this too.
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Click to collapse
DNLA is moving forward, quickly. Don't have DNLA on your TV? Don't be a tool and buy a new TV. Use your common sense and go buy the cable to connect the Desire HD to the TV. Its about 1/1000th the price of a TV.
sure the HDMI output is NOT a standard on Mobiles. but the EVO has it. why on earth they took it off from DHD. they are friggin charging the same price for evo as dhd. why should i be ok with the dumped version ?
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Click to collapse
See above..
they should have a released a superior phone than Evo considering the evo is old now. but no. we get a worst version for the same price. and on top of that, it has some hardware problems.
oh yeah no **** off
4- the Evo is CDMA only. so its not released any where outside the US. and its sprint exclusive too. so even if i import it. it wont work
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think by now you should realise that the DHD is a much better phone than the Evo. Yeah, the Evo is good - but the DHD pushes the boundaries a little further.
Technology can only go so far at times. You'll be back in a few months moaning how the Desire HD is better than the Dual Core HTC's because the battery life is shocking

ll_l_x_l_ll said:
All i see is f"""king stupid replies about " i dont use it so its not important" crap.
None is even semi smart with decent iq to know that the US got more hardware extras for their buck than the rest of the world. Seriously
Oh and now evo has WM....
I give up. I will bail out of this thread. If i read more of this **** my iq is gona drop
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Based on your writings I doubt your IQ can go any lower than what it already is.

Touch pro 2 is the best phone!!
...
Seriously, I would defend my phone if I had that one. NOw my touch pro 2 is broken and I ordered the DHD.
There is a lot of competition out there, not only the EVO 4G.
It's just what you prefer. Design?, the evo 4g probably wins. Inner hardware?, the dhd wins. The 4g has more outer hardware: kickstand, 2nd camera, etc.
So it does have more features. But then again, maybe it doesn't because HTC is comming with a lot of new features by software.
It's just what you like the most. When you only think of the phone design, the 4g wins. But then a lot of phones in the past were designed even better (touch pro 2 (A)) Fact is, the DHD has more power under the hood what makes it last a little longer.
Everyone uses their phone diffrently, so for the people who use the kickstand and front camera, go with the EVO 4g. But most people do not really use it, so the DHD probably is the better choice because it will last longer in the future.
The quality of a phone isn't just decided by strenght or just by design, but also the new technology. That's why a newer phone is almost always better then an old one.
in this case, there isn't really a winner.