The REAL truth about N1 touch screen - Nexus One General

Well - hate to break it to ya all... the touch sensor is not true multi-touch. It's not iPhone-like full matrix capacitive touch screen. Yes- it can pinch to zoom and might do some limited rotate (very limited) but it's based on the same technology of common touch pads - it can do only single finger tracking. The pinch gesture can be recognized but if you are thinking you can have apps like the iPhone piano or guitar - or for that matter - a multi touch keyboard - well - it will not happen with the N1 touch screen.
Not to say that it is a problem - multi touch is over hyped as-is. The pinch-to is just good enough and the zoom bar on previous HTC phones was just as useful.
But don't expect the N1 to detect the position of more than one finger.
Given that - I wish they stayed with resistive touch screen where you could use a stylus to type - 15 days with the N1 and still I find it harder to type with my finger that using a stylus with my now sold HTC HD.
But there is no comparing old WinMo with Android. N1 is a keeper.

Hum, so how come you can find a multi-touch keyboard in the market ?
http://www.androlib.com/android.application.net-cdeguet-smartkeyboardpro-wnzt.aspx
And, not that I don't believe you, but do you have any real proof of what you are saying ?

I've downloaded that app. Couldn't see any multi-touch - it would just press the key I put my last finger on.. just like it should if it was what we call a 2-way touchpad.
I work in developing touch solutions so I know a little bit about them.. The N1 screen, to the best of my experience is not true multi-touch.

dnts:
You could download "MultiTouch Visualizer" and see how N1 handles multitouch, it should be in the market.
If that app is correct, the N1 can distuingish between 2 points at a time which as far as I know is exactly the same as on iphone.
edit:
Just a comment about pinch to zoom, wouldn't this be impossible without multi-touch? The center point between your fingers do not change and as such it has to be multi-touch to allow this gesture. Correct me if I'm wrong.

dnts said:
I've downloaded that app. Couldn't see any multi-touch - it would just press the key I put my last finger on.. just like it should if it was what we call a 2-way touchpad.
I work in developing touch solutions so I know a little bit about them.. The N1 screen, to the best of my experience is not true multi-touch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In your OP you say the screen is a specific type that doesn't support it... general user experience of an app in BETA stage isn't a good way to determine that...
Do you have any other reason to claim the hardware of the N1 does not support multi-touch?

OP has zero clue what hes talking about.
He contradicts himself several times.
Theres MT visualizer as mentioned and theres numerous fingerpaint drawing apps that let you do 2 fingers at the same time.
Why not start a post with N1 doesnt have a true trackball.

xManMythLegend said:
Why not start a post with N1 doesnt have a true trackball.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The trackball is a lie!

There could be some merit to this statement. The form of multitouch the touchscreen on the G1 and Magic (perhaps more, but I'm not sure) used was capable of "2x1d" positioning. That is, if you touched the screen in two places, it knew the two x coordinates being touched and the two y coordinates being touched, but had to way of correlating which x was paired to which y... this was handled in software.
This was fine for pinch gestures, but recall in Luke Hutchison's videos where he showed that the software could become confused and pair the x and y incorrectly, which would lead to the system registering the opposite corners of the touch "box" between your fingers.
You can still see the effect today on some multitouch applications in the Market on the Nexus One. Like multitouch pong or the multitouch plugin for ethereal dialpad. In each case, the software can directly determine the initial touch points usually, but when points cross in the x or y axis they will "snap" together in that axis, and when moving from that position may become confused. This makes games like Multitouch Pong unusable on the Nexus One because it is just not reliable. However I have no way of knowing if this is a hardware limitation or a limitation in the touch software, and nobody has really talked about it.
This is contrasted to the iphone, whose touch screen allows it to keep track of touch points as two (x,y) coordinates without any sort of axis snapping.

Uejji said:
There could be some merit to this statement. The form of multitouch the touchscreen on the G1 and Magic (perhaps more, but I'm not sure) used was capable of "2x1d" positioning. That is, if you touched the screen in two places, it knew the two x coordinates being touched and the two y coordinates being touched, but had to way of correlating which x was paired to which y... this was handled in software.
This was fine for pinch gestures, but recall in Luke Hutchison's videos where he showed that the software could become confused and pair the x and y incorrectly, which would lead to the system registering the opposite corners of the touch "box" between your fingers.
You can still see the effect today on some multitouch applications in the Market on the Nexus One. Like multitouch pong or the multitouch plugin for ethereal dialpad. In each case, the software can directly determine the initial touch points usually, but when points cross in the x or y axis they will "snap" together in that axis, and when moving from that position may become confused. This makes games like Multitouch Pong unusable on the Nexus One because it is just not reliable. However I have no way of knowing if this is a hardware limitation or a limitation in the touch software, and nobody has really talked about it.
This is contrasted to the iphone, whose touch screen allows it to keep track of touch points as two (x,y) coordinates without any sort of axis snapping.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is software... even the iPhone has issues with tracking the X,Y pairs when they run into one another, but they have 3 generations of of software developement to help sort it all out. Even with that, you can still confuse the iPhone's multi-touch... make an "X" shape on the scren by running your fingers togther than apart in two "V" shapes, and 99% of the the time it will register it is two seperate lines crossing, and not two actual V's... as well, if you try to cross your fingers it can get even crazier!
The N1 does have a ways to go in terms of multi-touch software and app support to catch up to the iPhone, but I don't see anywhere that supports the claim it is a hardware limitation.

Stylus...
Im sorry but resistant touch screens are the worse screen to be on. Typing on a resistance touch screen is the worst experience ever. Go try a Samsung Omnia I or HTC Touch Diamond.
If your on a all screen device with no keyboard, capacitive is the way to go. Its obvious that the OP doesnt know what he is talking about or doesnt have past experience with resistant touch screens.
If your fingers too big and you need a stylus thats your problem, not a problem of the device.

The Nexus One uses a Synaptics ClearPad 2000 touch screen.
ClearPad 2000 Series benefits
ClearPad 2000 is the original ClearPad solution, offering DualTouch capabilities and easy gesture integration in firmware. In addition to the core ClearPad benefits, ClearPad 2000 Series offers:
* Proven Success—Since its introduction in 2007, ClearPad continues to set the standard for touchscreen performance.
* Exceptional User Experience—Two-finger interaction and gestures (i.e., Pinch, Pivot Rotate) provide an intuitive user experience.
* Best-in-Class Performance and Accuracy—Synaptics’ track record in design and testing ensures successful products that integrate ClearPad 2000 touchscreens.
ClearPad benefits
All ClearPad solutions bring you the wide-ranging benefits that come from choosing an industry-leading solution:
* Solution Stack—Synaptics’ comprehensive solution offering covers all critical capabilities, from design to testing to supply/support.
* Seamless Integration—Mount ClearPad touch panels beneath a product’s casing for a sleek, smooth appearance.
* Superior Optics—ClearPad touch panels minimize internal reflections.
* Accuracy—ClearPad delivers best-in-class accuracy, including resolutions of 500+ dpi, without requiring calibration.
* Durability—ClearPad touch sensors, mounted beneath a device’s top plastic, can be designed with a glass or PET substrate.
* Lower Consumption—Doze, sleep, and deep sleep modes maximize battery life and use less energy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

So, the nexus one is only dualtouch and the iphone is multitouch

Thank you guys for flaming me... but that will not change the fact the our N1s have a simple surface capacitance touch screen that has the ability to distinguish up to 2 fingers provided that they don't cross axis with each other (i.e. each finger stays in it's perimeter so either X or Y axis don't align).
I've designed several touch pads and other touch solutions in the past few years and have pending patents on that technology. You can say what you'd like about my lack of experience - ha - it will not change anything and I couldn't care less.
You can check out this patent application (soon to be granted, I hope):
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2009/0046827.html
So believe me guys and gals - it ain't no multi-touch and don't expect to have multi tocuh capabilities. Pinch to zoom.. maybe rotate... or some 2-finger flicking... that's all. No good and working multi touch keyboard.. no piano or guitar app... simply cannot be done with this hardware...
That said, this hardware provides better accuracy, lower power consumption and is free of patent issues (Apple's multi touch is heavily patent protected).

dnts said:
Thank you guys for flaming me... but that will not change the fact the our N1s have a simple surface capacitance touch screen that has the ability to distinguish up to 2 fingers provided that they don't cross axis with each other (i.e. each finger stays in it's perimeter so either X or Y axis don't align).
I've designed several touch pads and other touch solutions in the past few years and have pending patents on that technology. You can say what you'd like about my lack of experience - ha - it will not change anything and I couldn't care less.
You can check out this patent application (soon to be granted, I hope):
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2009/0046827.html
So believe me guys and gals - it ain't no multi-touch and don't expect to have multi tocuh capabilities. Pinch to zoom.. maybe rotate... or some 2-finger flicking... that's all. No good and working multi touch keyboard.. no piano or guitar app... simply cannot be done with this hardware...
That said, this hardware provides better accuracy, lower power consumption and is free of patent issues (Apple's multi touch is heavily patent protected).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it is multitouch for me, and you can say what you want. Maybe you should write an article in iphone fanboy sites like engadget and gizmodo, because they would love to hear your scientific findings.
Maybe you could sell your technology to apple or microsoft.
Everyday, since the launch of Nexus, and especially after the OTA there is a scientist picking up no Nexus, because people cannot comprehend that it is better than their iphone. They got stack with steve jobs talking crap about icrap technologies and now cannot bear the shock.
Keep walking, Johnnie Walker.

supergodie said:
So, the nexus one is only dualtouch and the iphone is multitouch
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dual touch (two finger) IS multitouch. The common definition of mutitouch is more that one finger. The Iphone is rumored to use the same screen. Apple doesn't reveal it's suppliers.
* ClearPad 3000 Series—Our premium ClearPad solution provides the ultimate in touchscreen innovation and excitement with MultiTouch capabilities (up to 10 fingers simultaneously). A powerful new chip delivers 48 sensing channels and excellent power management for a differentiated user experience. Click here to see the 3000 Series demo demo with gestures like Crumple and Scratch.
* ClearPad 2000 Series—ClearPad 2000 Series—the original ClearPad solution—brings exceptional DualTouch (2-finger) touch capabilities to a wide range of handheld devices. High performance and accuracy combined with seamless gesture integration make ClearPad 2000 Series the proven touchscreen leader seen in the market.
* ClearPad 1000 Series—ClearPad 1000 makes touch capabilities available to mass-market handheld devices. This SingleTouch solution provides exceptional gesture integration and a flexible zero-border sensor design. For cost-effective touchscreen capabilities, ClearPad 1000 is the right choice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Guys I was looking the synaptic webpage and I found this :
ww.synaptics.com/about/press/press-releases/synaptics-clearpad-on-nexus-one-smartphone
Nexus one has a CLEARpad 2000 capacitive touch screen sensor, so it's dual touch , the clearpad 3000 it has support for multitouch .
So the nexus one doesn't have multitouch only has dual touch ...
I was testing the piano application from Iphone and It's recognize a lot of points on the screen , anybody know which hardware display have the iphone? .
PD: I sold my iphone 3GS and now I have a nexus one .
Sorry, my english is bad .

htcmagic said:
it is multitouch for me, and you can say what you want. Maybe you should write an article in iphone fanboy sites like engadget and gizmodo, because they would love to hear your scientific findings.
Maybe you could sell your technology to apple or microsoft.
Everyday, since the launch of Nexus, and especially after the OTA there is a scientist picking up no Nexus, because people cannot comprehend that it is better than their iphone. They got stack with steve jobs talking crap about icrap technologies and now cannot bear the shock.
Keep walking, Johnnie Walker.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well.. you obviosly don't want to understand what I am saying and if you are a happy camper with your N1 - so be it.. I will not ruin the fun for you...
But the Clearpad 2000 technology is lacking. We all know the palm wrapping problem offsetting our finger touch if we don't hold the device careful enough... root cause of this is HW and software may ease things up slightly but cannot rid of that problem (which is #1 problem with N1 screen for me).
I never owned an iPhone. I don't like anything Apple.. don't like being a fanboy either. Not for WinMo and not for Android.
I like my N1. A leap from the HD. A keeper for me. But that doesn't stop me from pointing out stuff when I see it.
All the best...

dnts said:
Well.. you obviosly don't want to understand what I am saying and if you are a happy camper with your N1 - so be it.. I will not ruin the fun for you...
But the Clearpad 2000 technology is lacking. We all know the palm wrapping problem offsetting our finger touch if we don't hold the device careful enough... root cause of this is HW and software may ease things up slightly but cannot rid of that problem (which is #1 problem with N1 screen for me).
I never owned an iPhone. I don't like anything Apple.. don't like being a fanboy either. Not for WinMo and not for Android.
I like my N1. A leap from the HD. A keeper for me. But that doesn't stop me from pointing out stuff when I see it.
All the best...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I
I for one, find this all very interesting, and from the sounds of it, this guy knows his stuff and it seems pretty factual.
People, its not exactly a bad thing the N1 doesn't have true-multitouch, it is not as if the average consumer will realize this. They will look at whatever involves two fingers as exactly what the iPhone has.
Exactly why though would we need multiple fingers on the screen, other than two? I guess for things such as piano and guitar, but I do not believe this would contribute to many other things..

balabok said:
Dual touch (two finger) IS multitouch. The common definition of mutitouch is more that one finger. The Iphone is rumored to use the same screen. Apple doesn't reveal it's suppliers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
" today announced that the Nexus One™ phone uses its ClearPad™ 2000 capacitive touchscreen sensor."
So sad to see that ... I would rather pay an extra 50 bucks for a ClearPad 3000 if 50 is enough, though so far 2 fingers response is enough for me Hope the 2000 is not the source of the touch screen problem.
Looking forward to see info about the chip that N1 uses: "T1007A, 2 0927, AMP08P"

Oh no! Can I only use two fingers with my Nexus One?
Now I must sell it and buy something better... I must use at least three fingers when using the facebook app! An playing the piano on my phone is something i wish to do every day.
Seriously guys... Even if the Nexus has single touch it beats every phone out there today imho. Stop whining what it could have been and just be happy and have some fun with it... =)

Related

Would you recommend it?

Hi,
I am currently using a Samsung F480 and I really have to say the difference in the touch screen experience is very much noticeable compared to my HTC Wizard (I'd probably call it Apple-esque - even though I never actually used their phone), however at the very same time I also have to admit that I am really missing the possibilities Windows Mobile offers.
So when I first read about the Touch HD it seemed it would unify all those. Well, meanwhile I found out that the touch screen technology basically remained the same so I'd really be interested to hear how you would actually rate it? Does one still have to press/push the screen or does a simply touch do it as well?
Apart from the touch screen topic I am also a bit uncertain after reading threads like this and in particular vangrieg's posting. How would you rate the overall performance?
Basically what I would be looking for would be a compact phone with a good display, easily extensible (Windows Mobile) and a nice touch screen experience (Apple) ....
i have it for a week now and i am very satisfied with it. Not one program crashed and no reboot so far. Internet browsing is fast and really usable. For the first time ever i really like to surf the net while commuting on the subway. GPS with TomTom7 is great - i locks in seconds even when in downtown surrounded by skyscrapers.
regarding the touchscreen, i find that i have to press really hard to get a reaction. at first i even was reluctant to press so hard because i thought i would break it with the stylus. but now i am glad that it does not react to simple touching because i usually carry it in the pocket of my trousers and touch the display when handling it and it should not react to simple touching in my view - and it does not.
Thanks kkrammer, so you havent noticed respectively cant confirm the lag mentioned by donbronzi and jon- in the indicated thread. I am asking in particular because vangrieg stated the used Qualcomm processor shouldnt be the fastest.
As to the touch screen, this is certainly a subjective matter but personally I really like Samsung's way to respond even to a very very light touch without having to actually press it. So you would say one actually has to press it, a light touch doesnt do it?
Touch HD finger pressure
After owning a Touch Diamond, I feel that the screen is much more responsive. I dont have to press hard at all. I really like it so far. Yes it is a bit bigger and heavier, its still thin. All my programs are working great.
Thanks wfhowell, actually I just went to a store and expectedly they didnt have an HD yet, however there was the Diamond and considering my touch tests I slowly begin to understand the Apple fanboys. Coming from the Samsung F480 I was almost unable to use it. So how much would you say was the HD improved in this area?
Maybe someone who used Apple's, the F480 and the HD could outline where he/she would see the differences.
hi drzoid
i know what you mean about the screen but thats the difference between the two different screen technologies. if you want the ability to use a stylus the phone can only detect it if you push. iphones can measure the current through your finger with a lot less screen pressure.
that said i use rhe advanced configuration tool from the diamond forum to make the screen more sensitive. not as nice as iphone but close
Its the best phone till today... awesome tough still not perfect..
Unless you still think that a phone requires a QWERTY keyboard (I haven't missed on yet on this awesome phon) I'd run to my local dealer
Is it worth paying £500 to upgrade from the diamond? I'm not sure wether to go for it or not? Is the HD just a diamond with a bigger screen? Its a lot of money to pay just for that.
marcel808 said:
hi drzoid
i know what you mean about the screen but thats the difference between the two different screen technologies. if you want the ability to use a stylus the phone can only detect it if you push. iphones can measure the current through your finger with a lot less screen pressure.
that said i use rhe advanced configuration tool from the diamond forum to make the screen more sensitive. not as nice as iphone but close
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks Marcel, I know Apple's touch screen as well as - probably - the F480's measure via the skin but nonetheless I was "shocked" today when I saw what touching means in terms of the Diamond.
How "close" would you say is the sensitivity you mentioned?
Can someone who has experience with the Wizard and the HD tell if there is an actual difference in the sensitivity.
I'd love to get an HD - even if its price is currently almost prohibitive - but I am not sure whether I'd really like to go back.
mwatson said:
Is it worth paying £500 to upgrade from the diamond? I'm not sure wether to go for it or not? Is the HD just a diamond with a bigger screen? Its a lot of money to pay just for that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
its not worth the upgrade in my opinion.
I found you have to push a fair bit harder with the stylus on the screen than with your finger. If you use your finger it responds to a very light touch in comparism and is very responsive.
Thanks, for a real-world example, how hard would one have to press to slide the tabbar on the home screen left and right. Would just placing the finger without actual pressure be enough?
hi drzoid
how sensitive is the screen on mine...not sure how best to answer.
On an iphone I hardly have to touch the screen. As soon as the skin touches, thats enough.
With the HD, if I press the screen, I have to push until the top of my finger squashes by 1mm. Does that makes sense??!
So try pushing on a hard surface so 1mm of your finger squashes...and thats an HD
marcel808 said:
On an iphone I hardly have to touch the screen. As soon as the skin touches, thats enough.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just like with the F480.
marcel808 said:
With the HD, if I press the screen, I have to push until the top of my finger squashes by 1mm. Does that makes sense??!
So try pushing on a hard surface so 1mm of your finger squashes...and thats an HD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you Marcel, perfect explanation, even though I am not sure whether this is really close if one has to push 1mm into the screen .
Somehow my excitement gets colder, unfortunately
F480 has a capacitive screen, just like the iPhone and G1, so the HD would be worse touchy-wise (resistive screen), but according to reviews HD's screen is quite close to iPhone's sensitivity. Anyway, you can't write with the stylus on those and you can on the HD
Insaneboy said:
F480 has a capacitive screen, just like the iPhone and G1, so the HD would be worse touchy-wise (resistive screen), but according to reviews HD's screen is quite close to iPhone's sensitivity. Anyway, you can't write with the stylus on those and you can on the HD
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, personally I dont really need a stylus, although the magnetic of the HD makes a precious impression. Anyhow Samsung's screen is what I would really define as touch screen. It would be interesting how close it is, but the 1mm Marcel mentioned doesnt sound too close .... I guess I will have to wait until I can see the HD live.
What a shame almost
For me, the ability to use stylus is a big plus. I like the option of being able to use product such as Netfront Browser. It is a lot easier to click on links and to type quickly on keyboards as compared to using finger. Don't get me wrong, I'm not against fingers. In fact, 99% of the time I use my device with just fingers. There are times when I feel that stylus is a lot easier. I consider this to be a plus over iPhone actually. I wish iPhone can support both, because then I need not zoom in before activating a link.
I would say it's about the same as using a touchpad on a laptop if using your finger, it's pretty good
mwatson said:
Is it worth paying £500 to upgrade from the diamond? I'm not sure wether to go for it or not? Is the HD just a diamond with a bigger screen? Its a lot of money to pay just for that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have both the diamond (business phone) and, recently, the HD (personal phone). The HD is a step change in a number of ways. The larger screen, in purely size terms, makes sense of the touchflo interface. Buttons are big, and useable, and I'm rarely (if ever) pulling out the stylus. Also the software itself is faster, more developed (losts of little changes - like answering a call uses a finger gesture, rather than pressing a button - which means you are much less likely to inadvertantly answer an incoming call in your pocket. a little thing, but one of a myriad of significant little changes). The stock ROM is blisteringly fast in comparison (my diamond is the t-mobile version, and a shocker in comparison). Given that they are roughly the same hardware it shows what the diamond may become capable of. The screen is spectacular. The sensitivity (though lacking multi-touch, no biggie for me) feels just right. The battery life literally takes my breath away. I've run it for two lumps of two days, and not yet got the battery below 50%. My diamond corpses after about 24 hours.
It's the best WM device I've had by a country mile, and I've had a few. I still like my diamond, though. It's little and I can look after it much better when I'm out for a riotous night on the town. The HD is big, and until I can get a silicone case for it, it's a dropped smashed phone waiting to happen (I hate having to remove a phone from a case to use it, it massively increases the chance of accidents).
Philio25 said:
I would say it's about the same as using a touchpad on a laptop if using your finger, it's pretty good
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really? If I judge it from my Acer Aspire I would then actually call it decent.
I really have to find a store where you can try it out .
eaglesteve said:
For me, the ability to use stylus is a big plus. I like the option of being able to use product such as Netfront Browser. It is a lot easier to click on links and to type quickly on keyboards as compared to using finger. Don't get me wrong, I'm not against fingers. In fact, 99% of the time I use my device with just fingers. There are times when I feel that stylus is a lot easier. I consider this to be a plus over iPhone actually. I wish iPhone can support both, because then I need not zoom in before activating a link.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I can talk only for the F480 which actually has Netfront and there you can click links without zooming, even if you have aim well sometimes.
Lets say I am not against a stylus but I am for the touch experience the F480 brings .

another one bites the dust... good bye xperiancers... :(

guys. it was pure JOY to be an owner of SE Xperia, but enough is enough. I just got another cracks so I've decided to let it go and got myself new htc hd2.
seriously, typing in landscape on it is not that bad and comparable speed/accuracy wise with that not so perfect x1 physical qwerty. btw... speed. snapdragon. do I need to say more?
anyway... I guess no x2 for me after what I've seen on videos. no n900 either, even if I was considering getting one. x2 is daaaamn tooo slooooooww (seems to stutter even more than x1) and n900 unfortunately is a one big bug and shortcoming.
wish me luck...
see You on other parts of the forum. bye...
BTW: anyone knows what've happened with orelsi?? I almost miss that crazy bugger always knowing better... maybe his xperia finally cracked and he commited seppuku?? lol
lol good luck with your hd2, im thinking of buying one myself as a second device
btw, i too was wondering what happened to orelsi lol, havent seen him around here for a while, let's hope he aint clocked out
Well always good luck with the device you wish beeing the best for you.
Capactive screen is like seppuku for me,
As for HD2.
Actually I wonder more and more often what will I do in the future.
Even considering that I'll get my X2, I assume capactive will become
a ****ing tendency soon.
In this case I don't imagine using TouchScreen anymore!
well there will be two of us ... i hate so much capacitive ... but there might be some explanation for this ... my hands get really wet often and touching with the sensitive part of my fingers and swaping around gives me the nerves so i always touch the screen with the nails or top finger ... and not to mention the stylus problem ... I hope there are more people who dislike this thing... Ive heard there are also screens hybrid ... capacitive and resistive screens around.
And what the hell ... I dont get it this finger typing is by default non precise how can you make objects so big that you can use only your finger in such a small screen ... Web pages are not so big and with buttons there are also links ...
This is all Iphone fault
the snapdragon really makes a big difference in the speed and performace compared to slow x1 doesnt it??
i too dumped my x1 for a snapdragon phone. the lower-profile acer s200. lol. (hd2 a tad too big for me).
now i can watch hq wmv videos with no stutter at all.
i was looking at that phone as a replacement but just cant afford a new one when the x1a is still fullfilling my needs.
good luck with that phone, looking forward to reading your xperience (pun intended) with the hd2. hopefully next year i will replace my x1a with the hd2 or maybe an hd2 pro in the future.
well... still here. waiting for hd2 (delivery on monday, great deal with o2).
do not get me wrong, as I am not trying to convert anyone to hd2, but this whole need for resistive screen and real qwerty is becoming less and less obvious for me.
capacitive screen, read - toughened glass, hard to scratch, forces companies like ms to improve ui on their systems. see... the only good uses for styli are handwriting (are You handwriting with Your mouse on a pc?) and drawing (again, are You so much better with drawing using mouse on a pc comparing to sketches made with finger on a capacitive touch screen??). imho multitouch is more important than stylus.
qwerty... well... again - do some tests as I did. spb keyboard 4.1.1 trial, landscape fullscreen with clicking sound for better typing feel. I couldn't believe my eyes, as it wasn't much slower (if it was at all) or less accurate.
all I'm going to miss is xperia's still shot quality. some pictures shot in daylight are comparable quality with real cameras, and not those ****ty ones.
... but hey. I won't have to convert videos anymore.
anyway... I will keep my x1 as a backup device and I'll come back in here to share my hd2perience from ex x1 user point of view.
btw, I am not beeing paid for it.
bronx said:
well... still here. waiting for hd2 (delivery on monday, great deal with o2).
do not get me wrong, as I am not trying to convert anyone to hd2, but this whole need for resistive screen and real qwerty is becoming less and less obvious for me.
capacitive screen, read - toughened glass, hard to scratch, forces companies like ms to improve ui on their systems. see... the only good uses for styli are handwriting (are You handwriting with Your mouse on a pc?) and drawing (again, are You so much better with drawing using mouse on a pc comparing to sketches made with finger on a capacitive touch screen??). imho multitouch is more important than stylus.
qwerty... well... again - do some tests as I did. spb keyboard 4.1.1 trial, landscape fullscreen with clicking sound for better typing feel. I couldn't believe my eyes, as it wasn't much slower (if it was at all) or less accurate.
all I'm going to miss is xperia's still shot quality. some pictures shot in daylight are comparable quality with real cameras, and not those ****ty ones.
... but hey. I won't have to convert videos anymore.
anyway... I will keep my x1 as a backup device and I'll come back in here to share my hd2perience from ex x1 user point of view.
btw, I am not beeing paid for it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i am torn between the HD2 and the X2
X2 = slow and keyboard
HD2 = Fast and no keybard
But i am so tempted to get the HD2 - to be honest i cant ever see my self using like the tilewave etc on x2 >.<
yeah... spb ms 3.5.x and manila are mos def better option than panels. have You tried that test with onscreen keys that I mentioned above? this and a visit in local o2 shop to get the feel of it convinced me to give it a go.
the last thing I was worried about was the lack of d-pad, but... honestly I do not play games much. other thing is that with recently hacked multitouch api apps like fpsece could use it in the future for virtual onscreen pad.
bronx said:
BTW: anyone knows what've happened with orelsi?? I almost miss that crazy bugger always knowing better... maybe his xperia finally cracked and he commited seppuku?? lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think he bought a 3GS and is ashamed to show his face around here.
lol... You actually may be right
WhyBe said:
I think he bought a 3GS and is ashamed to show his face around here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that would be really funny if it were true.
I think I might upgrade to a N900 after I save enough money - the X1's reception issue is a nightmare, even after testing 8 radio versions. At least with Nokia there is assurance of reception quality - what use is a smartphone if I can't even access 3G?! Or any thing except for WiFi, for that matter. Reception is sporadic at best, and at worse it doesn't even pick up a signal but my Nokia does display full signal strength...
bronx said:
BTW: anyone knows what've happened with orelsi?? I almost miss that crazy bugger always knowing better... maybe his xperia finally cracked and he commited seppuku?? lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think he got 3 crack,
informatico said:
well there will be two of us ... i hate so much capacitive ... but there might be some explanation for this ... my hands get really wet often and touching with the sensitive part of my fingers and swaping around gives me the nerves so i always touch the screen with the nails or top finger ... and not to mention the stylus problem ... I hope there are more people who dislike this thing... Ive heard there are also screens hybrid ... capacitive and resistive screens around.
And what the hell ... I dont get it this finger typing is by default non precise how can you make objects so big that you can use only your finger in such a small screen ... Web pages are not so big and with buttons there are also links ...
This is all Iphone fault
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well exactly my points.
I am not sure why everyone so upset with X1, except for kinda wimpy 7200 chip.
I like keyboard, and don't really care about resistive or capacitive touchscreen. I am fine with either.
The one thing I don't use that much, but I am certain I would greatly miss is the physical keyboard. I don't think I am going to switch until there is a full keyboard on a snapdragon.
The cracks that everyone complains about are really just a cosmetic issue, and I don't really care too much about it (although I did re-shell my phone to make it black).
It is always kind of interesting to me the various types of devices that people decide to get and why. For the most part I understand each individuals reasoning, but I am yet to be swayed that there is a better device for me.
If anyone knows of a full QWERTY hardware keyboard unit with a snapdragon that is on the horizon PLEASE let me know.
Also, I miss Orelsi in a weird way. I suppose it was just his belligerent insistence on his perspective. I bet he got an iPhone too,
EDIT: I forgot about one thing that greatly aggravated me (although I had same problem on Kaiser) was that the keyboard goes bad and needs cleaning. Because of that I reshelled because I figured if I am gonna tear it apart anyway I might as well make it look like new.
Hannigan174 said:
If anyone knows of a full QWERTY hardware keyboard unit with a snapdragon that is on the horizon PLEASE let me know.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
actually there's one announced quite recently,LG eXpo GW820, 1 Ghz+qwerty,plus finger print security and a detachable projector as an optional accessory. it was initially announced for the american market and didnt mention european market,so we shall wait n see.
you might also want to keep an eye on toshiba n Acer as well,since they both got on the 1 Ghz ladder pretty early but havent make it go with qwerty yet.
btw,I am on the same boat with you, just want a decent processor with qwerty win mobile, not fussy about how advanced the bloody touch screen is going to be whatsoever...
bronx said:
BTW: anyone knows what've happened with orelsi?? I almost miss that crazy bugger always knowing better... maybe his xperia finally cracked and he commited seppuku?? lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
he said he was using his phone to get on the net as his pc broke, i bet his x1 broke (cracked) so he cant get on the net anymore lol
ok guys. I just got it.
wow... that's all I can say. all You nonbelievers go to Your local mobile phone stores to have a look. bit too large, but I'll get used to it. speed... omg, I never knew that winmo can be that snappy. it's so iphone 3gs fast and smooth that I think I'll jizz in my pants. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pXfHLUlZf4)
one last thing, try it, and forget about anything other than snapdragon. seriously.
johhn said:
actually there's one announced quite recently,LG eXpo GW820, 1 Ghz+qwerty,plus finger print security and a detachable projector as an optional accessory. it was initially announced for the american market and didnt mention european market,so we shall wait n see.
you might also want to keep an eye on toshiba n Acer as well,since they both got on the 1 Ghz ladder pretty early but havent make it go with qwerty yet.
btw,I am on the same boat with you, just want a decent processor with qwerty win mobile, not fussy about how advanced the bloody touch screen is going to be whatsoever...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, actually I knew of that, but I am afraid of leaving XDA, so I guess I meant an HTC-based device with physical QWERTY and snapdragon
Nothing in particular against LG, but I am not sure I want to deal with their ugly iPhone-like interface.

Is the Incredible's touchscreen truly "revolutionary?"

One of the biggest hyped features of the Incredible is the new MaxTouch sensor. The makers boast infinite multitouch and a bunch of other advantages it has over competitors. So my question is, does the Incredible's touchscreen hold up to these claims?
Atmel claims that the MaxTouch sensor can recognize an infinite number of touches, enables the use of fingernails, gloves, and styluses. So far, people have been telling me that it can't recognize touch when you use your fingernails. What I'm more interested in finding out is the infinite multitouch.
Has anyone tried playing emulator games on the Incredible?
I read all that too. The fingernail thing is crap, although it's alot better at using the point of your finger even if you have fingernails.
that said, the DI screen is is definately a revolution over the N1 lol. I have zero missed touches and zero wierd behavior. It works exactly as advertised.
Once we have root, we can use the multitouch test to see where it's really at. It is surely a step in the right direction though, I haven't seen one bad review of the multitouch.
Yes, I haven't seen anything negative about its touch screen either. No weirdness with the screen nor the capacitive buttons... or really anything. But I'm definitely curious about the full extent of the Incredible's touchscreen's capabilities. Hmm, I also didn't realize you needed root access for emulators and stuff
I could be wrong... but isn't Android only capable of handling two points? This could be expanded upon in later releases though... if I'm even right.
I could be wrong... but isn't Android only capable of handling two points? This could be expanded upon in later releases though... if I'm even right.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See I only see that as a software issue. Well maybe a patent issue now that patents are being granted to certain companies for this such as multitouch gestures.
-------------------------------------
Sent from HTC Incredible via XDA Tapatalk App
I think the sensor is capable of using stylus and finger nails provided the screen surface isn't glass like ours. I'm curious about more than two touches as well.
Tracking infinite touches is not exactly true. There is aof coarse a limiting factor in touch area, the ability to detect 1 touch per I think 10mm, and the ability to process those touches. This sensor is not limited to portable electronics.
On at least 2 occasions, the screen would not respond to any of my touches till turned the screen of and back on with the power button. Not sure of the cause yet.
-------------------------------------
Sent via the XDA Tapatalk App

A43 touch screen

I got an A43 in part because it's got a resistive touchscreen so I can use it with an ordinary stylus (for instance, I am developing an astronomy app and want to be able to select individual objects on screen from a crowded field without any zooming, just as I can on my Palm). However, I've found that the A43 has the same problem with its resistive touchscreen that my Palm TX does: sometimes, when a touch is released, it registers a largish (0.25 to 0.5 inch) movement. This causes problems--it makes button presses in on-screen keyboards get registered in the wrong location.
Anybody else notice this?
On the Palm TX, the user community eventually figured out what the problem was and a third-party vendors manufactured a hardware solution. The problem was that Palm skimped and made a substandard plastic digitizer, which made it distort on release. The solution was that someone manufactured replacement glass digitizers you could install (you can still buy them for about $25) and those who got them were quite happy with them.
My A43 has a plastic screen, and not a very hard one at that. (My Clie stylus would scratch it lightly, so I had to switch to a softer-tip HTC stylus.)
With a good quality resistive touchscreen, it would be worth my while to put some effort into modifying AnySoftKeyboard to support sweeping a stylus through hexagonal keys in an an ATOMIK layout, with all the ASCII symbols available together, like in my PalmOS myKbd app, even if I end up being the only user (I get the feeling a lot of people don't like using a stylus).
not sure what to say about this, besides the fact that my current screen (Archos 43) is annoying because it doesn't allow me play emulators that require multitouch, pewpew, etc. (not that pewpew is a good game anyway). I kind of like the stylus because it feels more ergonomic than rubbing my fingers all over the screen, but I do have the same issues. I typically use Swype or Smart Keyboard Pro because Swype is _the best_ at predicting even if you swyping half-asleep texting your friend for no reason. Smart keyboard pro lets you configure swipe gestures to switch between regular keyboard w/ suggestions, arrow keypad+space (for time-wasting flash games), compact (two letters in one key), and T9, like an older phone's crap keyboard but with really nice prediction. Overall, I can't complain because my Archos has twice the features (camera, android, external speaker) of my older media device, for about the same cost ($230), even though it doesn't have a sexy AMOLED screen and days of battery life (still pretty nice though, and it doesn't feel so flimsy).
brb need to rewrite the past 10 minutes of this post, not sure why i'm talking about this
also, I use my nintendo ds lite stylus just because it works and I made a scotch-tape holster on the back of my Archos so I wouldn't use the black piece of cheap plastic. ಠ_ಠ
I sent my A43 back for RMA, and the one I got back is amazingly better. I can actually type with my thumbs on the on-screen keyboard. On the old one, even if I used a stylus, I'd get spurious keystrokes, sometimes even on keys that aren't next to the one I was pressing. I still get that on the new one, but less often.
Maybe it's because I'm keeping the screen protector on?
I also wonder if the issue isn't that a stylus is actually bad for these screens?
This is completely off topic but it's great to see you here Pruss. You greatly enhanced the Palm experience. I'm sure you will be a great asset to the Android community.
Neo Cortex said:
This is completely off topic but it's great to see you here Pruss. You greatly enhanced the Palm experience. I'm sure you will be a great asset to the Android community.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have much less time than I did when I was involved PalmOS. But I've made a few simple apps (you can search the market for "Omega Centauri"), and am planning an astronomy app.

[Q] Is the touchscreen resistive or capacitative

I've been thinking all along that Nexus 7 would have a capacitative touchscreen, like all modern quality tablets. Never did it cross my mind it could be the resistive, more crappy, kind found on many low budget Chinese tablets.
However the UBM TechInsights teardown threw off alarms on my head by showing two resistive screen controllers:
ELAN Microelectronics eKTF3624BWS – Controller for Resistive Touchscreen
ELAN Microelectronics eKTH1036BWS – Controller for the Resistive Touchscreen
Can someone already with the tablet confirm which kind it is and report back? I think a simple test is just trying to use the back of a regular pen.
If it works with the pen it's resistive, if not it's capacitative.
Thanks guys!
One thing Google DEFINITELY didn't and wouldn't skimp on is this.
Don't worry, it's a standard touch screen. Trust me, if it was resistive you'd know. The internet would be up n arms, and this tablet would NOT be successful.
Thanks elcapitaine, but after the MHL saga I'm hoping to be sure of this. The reviews have told us surprisingly very little about the the hardware side of things.
I was re-reading the Verge's review to see if they picked up anything and noticed this: "To my eyes, this is definitely a software problem, but I didn’t see similar issues on the Galaxy Nexus with Jelly Bean, so this will remain a question mark. Simply put, sometimes when you’re scrolling quickly (say, on the homescreen), the scroll will not follow your finger, and instead snap back the page to the one you were trying to move away from."
So users may be assuming that any inconsistent behaviour is down to software glitches, when in reality it's the touchscreen itself.
I'm really a bit worried about this.
i can absolutely guarantee you that it's capacitive.
if it was resistive then we would know from engadget, verge, ign, or one of any thousand blogs.
Can anyone now confirm this since it's actually out now? Saw some apple fanboy going on about how the N7 had a touch resistive screen on a blog at Engadget, but couldn't find much either way on the net. Can anyone do the pen test?
Because as much as I want the N7, a resistive touch screen would be sufficient to make suffer using this POS iPad 1 until the next go-around.
It's capacitive, this isn't 2002.
Sent from my Palm Pilot.
mmmdieselfumes said:
Can anyone now confirm this since it's actually out now? Saw some apple fanboy going on about how the N7 had a touch resistive screen on a blog at Engadget, but couldn't find much either way on the net. Can anyone do the pen test?
Because as much as I want the N7, a resistive touch screen would be sufficient to make suffer using this POS iPad 1 until the next go-around.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lmfao I don't think you know how hard resistive screens are to use.. They're **** and have crap multi touch.
OF COURSE the N7 is capacative, it'd be worthy of the garbage bin if it wasn't. Even $100 Chinese tabs are capacative these days.
Mungulz said:
Lmfao I don't think you know how hard resistive screens are to use.. They're **** and have crap multi touch.
OF COURSE the N7 is capacative, it'd be worthy of the garbage bin if it wasn't. Even $100 Chinese tabs are capacative these days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol. I know exactly how much a pain in the ass touch resistive is, thus my disinclination to purchase the N7 IF it truly did have a touch resistive screen.
Though I admit that TR screens have come a long way since we all learned to hate them on the early palm devices. Most of our high-end drafting tables for our engineers at my company use TR screens, because there are some legitimate benefits to having a resistive screen over a capacative screen when you're drafting. But I definitely don't want one on a tablet. At least until palms new TR/TC hybrid screens start gaining traction. I think then we'll start to see some neat haptic screen techniques that weren't possible before.
But thanks for assuring me the screen is TC. Think I'll purchase my N7 now (though I'd kill for a 3G variant...).

Categories

Resources