Database Users

Still Deciding between X1 and Touch Pro (FUZE)

When the X1 was first announced, I was all over it. Then the Touch Pro with TF3D was announced, and I thought... the X1 is too 'raw' compared to the 'slick' Touch Pro, so Touch Pro for me!
Then I tried the FUZE (AT&T's Touch Pro) and I was disappointed in a few areas where I was not expecting to be disappointed (details below).
So, as it stands today, I am leaning back toward the X1 over the FUZE (TP). But it's a close call, and I'm still undecided. Here’s why:
1. Xperia hardware looks like a device that I would be proud to be paired with. In other words, just like Apple, Sony understands that a gadget can also be a fashion accessory. That’s a 2-fer in terms of value-add.
2. I have found the FUZE to be too heavy and bricky to be really pocket-friendly. This was a major disappointment when I checked it out at AT&T last week! I was all ready to buy the FUZE when I realized that it would take a serious adjustment to have that kind of weight and thickness in my pocket. It remains to be seen how I feel about the X1’s weight and thickness (since it's not released yet in the States). But, in terms of the specs published, the X1 looks to be about .5oz lighter than the FUZE. NOTE: The FUZE for some odd reason seems to be .5oz heavier than the Sprint Touch Pro and the HTC Touch Pro. No idea why.
3. The X1 has more hard buttons on the front panel, and more easily pressed hard buttons on the front panel. I have heard serious complaints about the “up” arrow on the X1 d-pad, but I will have to see for myself if that is insurmountable. I have played with FUZE, and the front panel buttons are not confidence-inspiring. I feel like it’s a negotiation with each press of the dpad.
4. The absence of the g-sensor on the X1 is stunning, and quite disappointing. What a huge bummer. What the heck was Sony thinking? G-sensors = cool + fun. Xperia = cool+fun. What am I missing?
5. The FUZE is about $175 w/plan on AT&T, and the X1 will be around $700 retail in a few weeks (with coupons, etc.). Yikes, that’s not a marginal difference in price, is it? I’m not sure I can justify a 4x price difference for a phone that is about 1.5x as good. Or, can I? Well, it’s like buying clothing: I can spend $200 on a shirt or $10 on a shirt. They both cover my torso about as effectively, but which one do I want people to see me paired with? This goes back to the gadget-as-accessory frame.
6. Panels. I figured they would be a dead platform as soon as 09, but the new facebook panel could be a game-changer. It shows how Panels could be the equiv to iPhone apps! Will panels have market mojo? What incentives are Sony peddling for developers to get on board? What kind of penetration can panels have if limited to only 1 device? Very chicken/egg situation here, and kind of a risk for X1 owners if they are relying on panels to breathe life into WM6.1.
7. TouchFlo 3D on X1. If this really ends up being portable to the X1 with 100% functionality and no bugs, then the X1 ends up being the more flexible device of the two. But 100% compatibility seems to be a ways off still, for many good reasons. Conversely, it is highly unlikely for several reasons that the TP would ever get panels. Sure, they might be portable over to the TouchPro HD, but that’s not the TP/FUZE, is it?
8. Keyboards. I’ve read some horrific reviews of the X1 keyboard, but they’ve been scattered and not consistent. So, I guess I’ll have to wait to actually try one myself to see how bad it really is. I tested out the FUZE keyboard, and I know it gets rave reviews, but coming from my HTC S710/Vox, I found the lack of space between the keys troubling. I’m sure I’d get used to it, but it seems like the X1’s layout (with spaces between keys) is more like my S710’s layout, which I find quite comfortable to type on. I am quite concerned about the lack of tactile feedback on the X1 keyboard, though. If there’s no feedback, then what’s the point of a hardware keyboard? Again, reviews have not been satisfactory around this aspect of the X1, so I’ll have to wait to see for myself.
9. Touchiness. I found the FUZE to be fiddly with touch sensitivity. Too often, a swipe was interpreted as a select, which was quite annoying. I've read that the X1 has a better touch experience, but that will be something I'll have to xperience myself, I guess.
10. Screen rotation. OK, big minus for X1 to have no G-sensor, but big plus for X1 for its apparent "instant switch" technology between landscape and portrait modes! I've seen some videos and it's quite impressive in Opera. One of the reasons why I 'dread' to go to my slide-out keyboard on my S710 is due to the lag. It's just painful to wait. If there were no "wait tax" on using the slide-out keyboard, I might go to it more readily.
11. Dpad+ features. The FUZE has the circular zoom thang, and the X1 has the glidey thing. No idea which is preferable. Both are interesting in their own way.
So, this is where I am right now re: X1 v. FUZE. To be honest, I am kind of looking for excuses to cheap out and get the FUZE just so I'm not spending $700 on a friggin phone. But the thickness and weight are things that I'd have to adjust to.
Does anyone have any thoughts/comments/additions to this analysis?
Jon
[cross-posted on X1 and Raphael forums so I can get both viewpoints]

Ops wanted to post this somewhere else sorry :-(

xperia has same hardware + bigger screen but no tv out and accelerometer. these are unuseful for me, and touchflo3D from touchHD runs great on x1
we have xda, we don't have to choose a device for his software, and xperia is indeed an HTC device so ALL tweaks and programs are compatible. x1 looks better and seems to be less fragile, i purchased xperia and now I tweak it with all i need from others devices

I have the same problem. Still unsure what device to buy, but tend towards the X1. I've used both devices.
Keyboard:
X1 wins for me. Its just more clear and more intuitive to use with the 4 row layout. Yes, the keys are small, but I had absolutly no problem with hitting the right one. The feedback was okay and definitely not a problem. The sliding mechanism is better as well, as is the depth of the slide-out part. It just seems more stable, better to hold and easier to use. Of course, A CRTL button and a CAPSlock LED would have been nice.
Size and weight:
X1 wins big time. The X1 is a little thinner and much more lighter. It just feels better in the hand and in the pocket.
Display:
Possibly the biggest advantage over the touch pro. The display is sharp as hell and web browsing is a pleasure. The fast and almost instantaneous swith between landscape and normal view is just awesome.
And some minor things like battery and the nice optical Joystick when internet surfing ...
Some cons:
X1 display not leveled. But when I used the X1 the first time I was surprised that its not a problem at all. the display itself is a little smaller than the cutting in the cover. So I had no problem pushing the X-Button or Start-Button.
No G-Sensor. Its just sad SE didn't implement that. Would have been nice, but its not a no-go ...
Will order it next week I think, but will take a last look at the touch pro to be sure ...

10. Screen rotation. OK, big minus for X1 to have no G-sensor, but big plus for X1 for its apparent "instant switch" technology between landscape and portrait modes! I've seen some videos and it's quite impressive in Opera. One of the reasons why I 'dread' to go to my slide-out keyboard on my S710 is due to the lag. It's just painful to wait. If there were no "wait tax" on using the slide-out keyboard, I might go to it more readily.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well, after you loaded more softwares in your phone, it will get quite laggy especially in some softwares, dunno about others, but it does lag here

nap007 said:
well, after you loaded more softwares in your phone, it will get quite laggy especially in some softwares, dunno about others, but it does lag here
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmmm... so is the lag gap because one is running TF3D and one isn't? How bad does the lag get? And is it from installed apps, or running apps?

it will be running (or even run) apps which are causing it. However a soft reset once every few days should ensure it runs smoothly all the time.

yeah i have to find a decision, too
i think i will buy the x1, because the dimensions the depth is 1mm smaller then the touch pro. currently i use the wizard, its a really fat door stopper.

I am fortunate to actually own both these devices at the moment (thanks to an upgrade on my contract) so I can tell you what my findings are:
:: Hardware X1 problems ::
My battery cover refused to stay on. I was forced to get a small screwdriver and push the little metal tabs (near the SE logo) down a bit lower. This has been noted in other forums. The battery cover is a pain to get off if you don't have long fingernails.
The soft-reset button is under the said battery cover! I mean who decided that was a good idea??
The speaker is situated in a place that is often covered up by the palm of your hand (if you are right handed) and subsequently blocks the sound. The same can be said for the positioning of the camera lens, which frequently gets covered by fingers as you hold the phone in a natural camera position.
Notification LED's that are just too dim to see as they are located in between the keyboard and top panel. They have a rather confusing display of colours and none of them give you signal/bluetooth status for example.
There is a much documented report of a potential problem with case cracking.
No G-Sensor and the keyboard lacks the tactile feel and separate number keys of the Touch Pro.
But...
It has a fantastic screen response, very smooth. Fast landscape rotation on opening the keyboard, which glides out in a smooth curve. Dedicated hardware buttons and a cool optical sensor which works really well in web pages. GPS is really fast and accurate. A proper separate headphone socket.
:: Hardware TouchPro Problems ::
Unpredictable button presses
Lack of hardware buttons, especially a windows key and an OK key (also missing from the keyboard) No camera button, this is a serious omission.
Screen is not very scratch resistant (2 on mine caused by the useless case that is supplied) It's also very unresponsive, I find myself 'jabbing' the stylus at it sometimes to get it to acknowledge a response.
Poor battery life. Heavy/Bulky.
But...
has a beautiful VGA screen, the BEST keyboard I ever used on a mobile device, has a G-Sensor, a magnetic stylus which turns on the device on removal, touch sensitive D-Pad (Ok can be hit and miss sometimes but great for zooming) and has TV out.
:: Software X1 ::
The panels are disappointing. You can only set up 9 at a time, so if this really takes off you're going to have to sacrifice a few of your favourites. That's assuming that the panel idea is not going to turn out to be a flash in the pan. The ones supplied are a tad dull.
No YouTube application
Not all software works with the WVGA screen. Especially games. I found about 20 of my favourite apps weren't supported. Ok, this may change when developers bring out new releases but some may never work.
:: Software TouchPro ::
TouchFlo 3D looks sexy, but it is probably the biggest cause of crashes. I found myself constantly soft-resetting. Eventually after reading other users comments, I turned it off and a lot of problems disappeared.
----------------------------------------------------
In conclusion....
Obviously pros and cons with both. I think none of us will ever be satisfied with everything. What aggravates me is that HTC (who make both devices) don't seem to take all the good stuff from past models and make the perfect device! You get used to one feature only to find it missing the next time you upgrade.
So we have to see which feature is important to us and decide.
Here is the clincher....
The TouchPro / FUZE is probably the MOST UNRELIABLE PDA I have ever owned. I constantly have to reset and cope with weird behaviour on a daily (no hourly) basis. Very unstable.
The X1 is probably the most RELIABLE PDA I have ever owned!!!! and has coped with a mountain of stuff I have loaded on to it, and it continues to cope admirably! I don't have to worry about using it.
This is the most important feature for me and is why ultimately I am selling the TouchPro very shortly.
Hope this helps you decide.

Apprentice,
That was a fantastic comparison/review. Thank you so much for your insights. So, the X1 does not seem "bulky" even though it's only 1mm thinner?

not at all. its quite small in person. xperia all the way

Thank you apprentice for your review, and to JonDeutsch for starting this thread. I could have written your questions/opinions almost word for word. I am in the same place trying to decide which of these 2 phones to get.
I currently have a 8125 (Wizard) that I have flashed WM 6.1 w/M2D. When I had WM5 loaded it was slow and I was having all kinds of lockup & misc problems. Since flashing wm6.1 the phone seems to be on it's second life (faster and no lockups), so now I'm not is as much of a hurry to get into something else.
I went to the att store a few days ago to look at the Fuze. I walked out more confused about which to get. I was not impressed with the Fuze at all. To me, it seemed slow and sluggish for a new model with a cpu that is >2x faster than mine. Comparing it side by side with my 8125 the size was smaller and thinner, but the screen was physically smaller even though they are both supposed to be 2.8".
I was really looking forward to the Omnia also, but since I don't know if it will ever be coming to the US I've moved on to these two models. I also like the Touch HD, but not having 3G for the US won't pass the test either.

JonDeutsch said:
So, the X1 does not seem "bulky" even though it's only 1mm thinner?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
exactly

Hi
I think all is said. I owned both devices and I selled my TP. Why?:
1) G-sensor is nice but I dont use it.
2) TV-out is nice but I only used it once to see a film in a hotel but hasnt full support with CorePlayer so the quality isnt very good.
3) Screen is much better in X1. Now you can really surf a web in your sofa.
4) GPS performance is much better in X1
5) Stability is much better in X1
..
So no doubt for me....
Dani

What led me to the X1 was a combination of the following:
- much longer standby time
- not much bigger than a default cell phone
- I like the X1's keyboard layout better (matter of taste...)
- standard headphone jack
- I prefer "rotate only when keyboard's slide out" to "Oops, I rotated the screen accidentally!". Though I admid the G-sensor would be fun for games. But then again, most games don't even support WVGA, not to mention a propietary G-sensor extension that makes the apps incompatible to everything but a couple of HTC devices...
- X1 is a bit faster in most tests. Though that's probably only a driver thing, the Touch HD is faster than X1 and Raphael with almost the same hardware and WVGA display (more pixels than Raphael).
- I thought the panels are an interesting idea. However, by now I don't give a dime to that. Too propietary, too slow, too limited (few available, max 9 at a time), clumpsy handling (press panel button, touch on screen, wait - every time you want to switch to another panel...), ...
- The WVGA screen - though that's been more of a developer decition, so I've got a test device for that. Otherwise, I would have preferred the more compatible and bigger (in size per pixel) VGA display.
- X1 looks better
- and it was a bit cheaper...
In hindsight, Panels, as mentioned, turned out as a flop for me, and having to use WVGA fix for some games is quite annoying. But otherwise, the additional screen estate is really great (browsing in landscape, lots of infos on the Today screen, more entries in lists, ...), the keyboard is way better than I expected after some reviews, and I like how it feels more like a "dump" cell phone in my pocket and regarding standby time.
The "optical joystick"s really nice in some apps (esp. for slow scrolling - for fast scrolling flicking is better imho), while sometimes a bit too sensible in others. I wish there was a better "(don't) use in that application" configuration then just the few fixed apps (iirc, PIE, contacts, and messaging). But if you don't like it at all, you can just deactivate it completely...

JonDeutsch said:
Apprentice,
That was a fantastic comparison/review. Thank you so much for your insights. So, the X1 does not seem "bulky" even though it's only 1mm thinner?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're welcome!
I can't recommend the X1 enough to be honest.
As for the bulkiness issue... it may only be 1mm less in depth (which I didn't realise as it looks a lot more than that!) but it's the difference in width that makes it less bulky. Also long and slim is way easier in your pocket. Finally the corners are nicely rounded. It really handles and looks like a regular 'candy bar' type phone.

user experience X1
I'll provide you with my point of view. Since i'm someone who actualy uses this for it's business functionality, i'm not that interested in sound quality / video playback/ camera functionality/ games/ eyecandy. My previous phone was a TYTN/ HERMES (last 2 years), prior to that I owned a jam/ qtek100 (20 months).
NOT having owned a TP/FUZE I won't be able to comment on it's pros and cons but having an X1 i can add some points which I think have been exagerated or been overlooked imho. I did look at a TP in a shop but wasn't impressed by it's feel, too plasticky/synthetic. The X1 looks and feels like a premium lifestyle accesory whereas the TP would be a top of the line 'gadget'.
Keyboard
The keyboard is one of the main issues in the reviews. I'm not bothered by it it but it is not as good as my HTC TYTN keyboard. Having said that, it's not as awful to me as some reviews implied, it's pretty usable to me. If you have bigger hands/fingers the TP might be a better option.
G-sensor
Looked like a lot of fun, but it would probably annoy me more than it would improve my life:
I do a lot of excel / powepoint/ word stuff on my phone and sometimes i'd like to pass my phone over to someone else to give them a glance of the figures i'm working on. With a g-senor the screen would tilt with eacht flick of the wrist putting some columns or rows beyond the visible area. Not having had that on my previous phones I decided I wouldn't be missing it.
TF3D/panels
At first i discarded the panels, flashed a lite rom and loaded tf3d. I thought TF was a bit slow , buggy and did not add any value for me so i went back to the plain WM screen.
Last week i reinstalled the panels, including the spb one and i 'm beginning to appreciate it. especialy the spb that has shortcuts to programmes and settings so i don't need the startbutton that much anymore (one handed operation!!) Best thing: it has a 'soft reset' button so no more picking at the battery cover to reach the reset hole (bad decission that is to have a reset button out of reach on a windows device). The SE panel is my main panel because i can display the next 5 or 6 upcoming appointments on one screen. TF can only display 2 appointments on the start screen afaik.
Dpad (touchscreen)
As stated above I used tf3d for a while. The fingerprints on the screen drove me mad. the same kind of scrolling can be achieved with the d-pad after a few days of usage and growing accustomed to its usage and responsiveness. I realy like the dpad now (allthough it could have been a bit more higher or the borders surrounding it could be a tad lower). Having this experience i was confinced i don't want multitouch or a full surface screen.
Arrow keys
This was the reason I nearly didn't buy the X1; I Liked them and used them a lot on my TYTN but after practising on the old TYN with the joystick instead of the arrow buttons I decided I could live with it. So not really missing them since the dpad has replaced this functionality. I admit it requires some effort to get a bit used to putting your thumb on the dpad instead of the keyboard itself but it's easy to grow accustomed to (after 2 solid years with my previous phone and it's arrowkeys).
Screen
Biggest gain. I can finaly look at full webpages on my phone and don't need to revert to the mobile version of a webpage. Clear and sharp but i can appreciate the argument that you need a bigger screen (i.e. touc HD) for this kind of resolution. For me and my sharp eyes it works fine , someone with less sharp eyes can use the zoom function of Opera .
Dimensions
Roughly about the same size as a normal Nokia candybar business phone. Some people complain it's a bit too heavy but i like that. Makes it feel solid.
Conclusion
My main conclusion up till now: it has the wow factor (someone actually said 'Wow' in a bar when i pulled it out). Thank god i didn't go for a full touchscreen without hardware buttons: the fingerprints would drive me crazy.
I'm happy with my choice but would understand if there are just some little things that would convince someone to buy a TP; just a matter of priorities.
The X1 is also too expensive to reccommend to everyone. I decided that the premium look and feel was worth it combined with the top of the range specs and the software flexibility. if it was a SE manufactured phone with symbian I wouldn't have bought it, the micro sd card and mini usb charging and the ROM enhancements are the reason i prefer HTC devices.
I hope the above helps....

Best thing: it has a 'soft reset' button so no more picking at the battery cover to reach the reset hole
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are other tools for that as well. Additionally, you can simply press the power switch for a few seconds. If you phone isn't crashed completely, a message box whether you really want to switch off is shown (and if it hangs, you're not able to launch something from a panel either...). Turning it on immediately afterwards does the same as a soft reset.
(bad decission that is to have a reset button out of reach on a windows device).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not only for those. Sometimes I wished for a reset button on other cell phones, too. But yes, the location sucks. Sometimes it faster to temporarily remove the battery...

Lifespan of the screen?

Hi guys,
I'm curious. What is the lifespan of the HTC Touch HD's screen? I know it's a seemingly random question, but I was just wondering. I tend to keep my devices for a very long time so this would be valuable information in helping me decide if this is the phone for me.
Cheers.

Well, I have noticed that the screen is a bit scratch sensitive as the top layer is made of plastic. Screen responsiveness is mediocre and clarity and picture quality are good to very good. Overall I like the screen. =]

antrak said:
Well, I have noticed that the screen is a bit scratch sensitive as the top layer is made of plastic. Screen responsiveness is mediocre and clarity and picture quality are good to very good. Overall I like the screen. =]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Antrak,
Thanks for that input. I appreciate it. However, I was wondering about the touch screen's duration, as in, how many years before the touch screen will crap out on you. Any idea?
Also, the screen's responsiveness can be fixed by using a registry editor and looking for the responsiveness setting. I think you can hop on over to the X1 to see what the registry mod is.
Cheers.

PoisonWolf said:
Antrak,
Thanks for that input. I appreciate it. However, I was wondering about the touch screen's duration, as in, how many years before the touch screen will crap out on you. Any idea?
Also, the screen's responsiveness can be fixed by using a registry editor and looking for the responsiveness setting. I think you can hop on over to the X1 to see what the registry mod is.
Cheers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No problem. Ah in that way. Well I think that if you take good care of your device and handle it carefully, the touch screen won't fail any sooner then other components of the device will. I still have a device that's way over it's preservation date and the screen still functions the way it's supposed too, so I don't really think you will have any trouble with that.
I did the registry settings and tweaks, I still find it mediocre though. In my mind I put it in this list -Touch HD Mediocre - Touch Diamond 2 Good - Capacitive Excellent -.
But thing is, the bigger the screen is on a resistive screen type device, the more pressure you need to give, not incredibly much but still.

antrak said:
No problem. Ah in that way. Well I think that if you take good care of your device and handle it carefully, the touch screen won't fail any sooner then other components of the device will. I still have a device that's way over it's preservation date and the screen still functions the way it's supposed too, so I don't really think you will have any trouble with that.
I did the registry settings and tweaks, I still find it mediocre though. In my mind I put it in this list -Touch HD Mediocre - Touch Diamond 2 Good - Capacitive Excellent -.
But thing is, the bigger the screen is on a resistive screen type device, the more pressure you need to give, not incredibly much but still.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Antrak,
Thank you for that input. You've given me confidence in wanting to get this phone now (I would have gotten it already, but I was scammed about 2 months ago and I had to save again)! How is the usability of the phone using fingers alone? How often would you need to use the stylus?
Cheers.

PoisonWolf said:
Antrak,
Thank you for that input. You've given me confidence in wanting to get this phone now (I would have gotten it already, but I was scammed about 2 months ago and I had to save again)! How is the usability of the phone using fingers alone? How often would you need to use the stylus?
Cheers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Too bad to hear that you've been scammed!
It is a really great device, I loved it from the moment it came out of it's nice black box.
I actually never use the stylus, and I have decently fat fingers. With a screen this size, I have no problems whatsoever navigating through the windows mobile 6.1 screens and I can't understand how some people actually use a stylus on this thing. For me, it's -completely- (including small 6.1 buttons) finger friendly.

agree with antrak =) it is a wonderful device =) I still use the stylus at times though, mostly for the transcriber input mode =) never recall any time where I was forced to use the stylus instead of fingers =)

figner use is quite ok.. though i agree touch HD screen is not as responsive as ..say compared to X1

leobox1 said:
figner use is quite ok.. though i agree touch HD screen is not as responsive as ..say compared to X1
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
leobox,
Well, that is perfectly fine with me. Not-as-responsive-screen > Eventually-cracking-case.
May I ask where you blokes purchased your Touch HD from (US folks). Also, do you need any sort of data plan to be able to use navigation software? I ask because Im not sure if aGPS systems require that or do you only need to pay for Navigation software? I'm also going to guess that using your phone as a GPS-System will eat the battery faster than you can say "The THD is teh sheetz!" ?
Cheers.

another one bites the dust... good bye xperiancers... :(

guys. it was pure JOY to be an owner of SE Xperia, but enough is enough. I just got another cracks so I've decided to let it go and got myself new htc hd2.
seriously, typing in landscape on it is not that bad and comparable speed/accuracy wise with that not so perfect x1 physical qwerty. btw... speed. snapdragon. do I need to say more?
anyway... I guess no x2 for me after what I've seen on videos. no n900 either, even if I was considering getting one. x2 is daaaamn tooo slooooooww (seems to stutter even more than x1) and n900 unfortunately is a one big bug and shortcoming.
wish me luck...
see You on other parts of the forum. bye...
BTW: anyone knows what've happened with orelsi?? I almost miss that crazy bugger always knowing better... maybe his xperia finally cracked and he commited seppuku?? lol

lol good luck with your hd2, im thinking of buying one myself as a second device
btw, i too was wondering what happened to orelsi lol, havent seen him around here for a while, let's hope he aint clocked out

Well always good luck with the device you wish beeing the best for you.
Capactive screen is like seppuku for me,
As for HD2.
Actually I wonder more and more often what will I do in the future.
Even considering that I'll get my X2, I assume capactive will become
a ****ing tendency soon.
In this case I don't imagine using TouchScreen anymore!

well there will be two of us ... i hate so much capacitive ... but there might be some explanation for this ... my hands get really wet often and touching with the sensitive part of my fingers and swaping around gives me the nerves so i always touch the screen with the nails or top finger ... and not to mention the stylus problem ... I hope there are more people who dislike this thing... Ive heard there are also screens hybrid ... capacitive and resistive screens around.
And what the hell ... I dont get it this finger typing is by default non precise how can you make objects so big that you can use only your finger in such a small screen ... Web pages are not so big and with buttons there are also links ...
This is all Iphone fault

the snapdragon really makes a big difference in the speed and performace compared to slow x1 doesnt it??
i too dumped my x1 for a snapdragon phone. the lower-profile acer s200. lol. (hd2 a tad too big for me).
now i can watch hq wmv videos with no stutter at all.

i was looking at that phone as a replacement but just cant afford a new one when the x1a is still fullfilling my needs.
good luck with that phone, looking forward to reading your xperience (pun intended) with the hd2. hopefully next year i will replace my x1a with the hd2 or maybe an hd2 pro in the future.

well... still here. waiting for hd2 (delivery on monday, great deal with o2).
do not get me wrong, as I am not trying to convert anyone to hd2, but this whole need for resistive screen and real qwerty is becoming less and less obvious for me.
capacitive screen, read - toughened glass, hard to scratch, forces companies like ms to improve ui on their systems. see... the only good uses for styli are handwriting (are You handwriting with Your mouse on a pc?) and drawing (again, are You so much better with drawing using mouse on a pc comparing to sketches made with finger on a capacitive touch screen??). imho multitouch is more important than stylus.
qwerty... well... again - do some tests as I did. spb keyboard 4.1.1 trial, landscape fullscreen with clicking sound for better typing feel. I couldn't believe my eyes, as it wasn't much slower (if it was at all) or less accurate.
all I'm going to miss is xperia's still shot quality. some pictures shot in daylight are comparable quality with real cameras, and not those ****ty ones.
... but hey. I won't have to convert videos anymore.
anyway... I will keep my x1 as a backup device and I'll come back in here to share my hd2perience from ex x1 user point of view.
btw, I am not beeing paid for it.

bronx said:
well... still here. waiting for hd2 (delivery on monday, great deal with o2).
do not get me wrong, as I am not trying to convert anyone to hd2, but this whole need for resistive screen and real qwerty is becoming less and less obvious for me.
capacitive screen, read - toughened glass, hard to scratch, forces companies like ms to improve ui on their systems. see... the only good uses for styli are handwriting (are You handwriting with Your mouse on a pc?) and drawing (again, are You so much better with drawing using mouse on a pc comparing to sketches made with finger on a capacitive touch screen??). imho multitouch is more important than stylus.
qwerty... well... again - do some tests as I did. spb keyboard 4.1.1 trial, landscape fullscreen with clicking sound for better typing feel. I couldn't believe my eyes, as it wasn't much slower (if it was at all) or less accurate.
all I'm going to miss is xperia's still shot quality. some pictures shot in daylight are comparable quality with real cameras, and not those ****ty ones.
... but hey. I won't have to convert videos anymore.
anyway... I will keep my x1 as a backup device and I'll come back in here to share my hd2perience from ex x1 user point of view.
btw, I am not beeing paid for it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i am torn between the HD2 and the X2
X2 = slow and keyboard
HD2 = Fast and no keybard
But i am so tempted to get the HD2 - to be honest i cant ever see my self using like the tilewave etc on x2 >.<

yeah... spb ms 3.5.x and manila are mos def better option than panels. have You tried that test with onscreen keys that I mentioned above? this and a visit in local o2 shop to get the feel of it convinced me to give it a go.
the last thing I was worried about was the lack of d-pad, but... honestly I do not play games much. other thing is that with recently hacked multitouch api apps like fpsece could use it in the future for virtual onscreen pad.

bronx said:
BTW: anyone knows what've happened with orelsi?? I almost miss that crazy bugger always knowing better... maybe his xperia finally cracked and he commited seppuku?? lol
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I think he bought a 3GS and is ashamed to show his face around here.

lol... You actually may be right

WhyBe said:
I think he bought a 3GS and is ashamed to show his face around here.
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that would be really funny if it were true.

I think I might upgrade to a N900 after I save enough money - the X1's reception issue is a nightmare, even after testing 8 radio versions. At least with Nokia there is assurance of reception quality - what use is a smartphone if I can't even access 3G?! Or any thing except for WiFi, for that matter. Reception is sporadic at best, and at worse it doesn't even pick up a signal but my Nokia does display full signal strength...

bronx said:
BTW: anyone knows what've happened with orelsi?? I almost miss that crazy bugger always knowing better... maybe his xperia finally cracked and he commited seppuku?? lol
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Click to collapse
I think he got 3 crack,

informatico said:
well there will be two of us ... i hate so much capacitive ... but there might be some explanation for this ... my hands get really wet often and touching with the sensitive part of my fingers and swaping around gives me the nerves so i always touch the screen with the nails or top finger ... and not to mention the stylus problem ... I hope there are more people who dislike this thing... Ive heard there are also screens hybrid ... capacitive and resistive screens around.
And what the hell ... I dont get it this finger typing is by default non precise how can you make objects so big that you can use only your finger in such a small screen ... Web pages are not so big and with buttons there are also links ...
This is all Iphone fault
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Well exactly my points.

I am not sure why everyone so upset with X1, except for kinda wimpy 7200 chip.
I like keyboard, and don't really care about resistive or capacitive touchscreen. I am fine with either.
The one thing I don't use that much, but I am certain I would greatly miss is the physical keyboard. I don't think I am going to switch until there is a full keyboard on a snapdragon.
The cracks that everyone complains about are really just a cosmetic issue, and I don't really care too much about it (although I did re-shell my phone to make it black).
It is always kind of interesting to me the various types of devices that people decide to get and why. For the most part I understand each individuals reasoning, but I am yet to be swayed that there is a better device for me.
If anyone knows of a full QWERTY hardware keyboard unit with a snapdragon that is on the horizon PLEASE let me know.
Also, I miss Orelsi in a weird way. I suppose it was just his belligerent insistence on his perspective. I bet he got an iPhone too,
EDIT: I forgot about one thing that greatly aggravated me (although I had same problem on Kaiser) was that the keyboard goes bad and needs cleaning. Because of that I reshelled because I figured if I am gonna tear it apart anyway I might as well make it look like new.

Hannigan174 said:
If anyone knows of a full QWERTY hardware keyboard unit with a snapdragon that is on the horizon PLEASE let me know.
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actually there's one announced quite recently,LG eXpo GW820, 1 Ghz+qwerty,plus finger print security and a detachable projector as an optional accessory. it was initially announced for the american market and didnt mention european market,so we shall wait n see.
you might also want to keep an eye on toshiba n Acer as well,since they both got on the 1 Ghz ladder pretty early but havent make it go with qwerty yet.
btw,I am on the same boat with you, just want a decent processor with qwerty win mobile, not fussy about how advanced the bloody touch screen is going to be whatsoever...

bronx said:
BTW: anyone knows what've happened with orelsi?? I almost miss that crazy bugger always knowing better... maybe his xperia finally cracked and he commited seppuku?? lol
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
he said he was using his phone to get on the net as his pc broke, i bet his x1 broke (cracked) so he cant get on the net anymore lol

ok guys. I just got it.
wow... that's all I can say. all You nonbelievers go to Your local mobile phone stores to have a look. bit too large, but I'll get used to it. speed... omg, I never knew that winmo can be that snappy. it's so iphone 3gs fast and smooth that I think I'll jizz in my pants. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pXfHLUlZf4)
one last thing, try it, and forget about anything other than snapdragon. seriously.

johhn said:
actually there's one announced quite recently,LG eXpo GW820, 1 Ghz+qwerty,plus finger print security and a detachable projector as an optional accessory. it was initially announced for the american market and didnt mention european market,so we shall wait n see.
you might also want to keep an eye on toshiba n Acer as well,since they both got on the 1 Ghz ladder pretty early but havent make it go with qwerty yet.
btw,I am on the same boat with you, just want a decent processor with qwerty win mobile, not fussy about how advanced the bloody touch screen is going to be whatsoever...
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Yeah, actually I knew of that, but I am afraid of leaving XDA, so I guess I meant an HTC-based device with physical QWERTY and snapdragon
Nothing in particular against LG, but I am not sure I want to deal with their ugly iPhone-like interface.

Should HTC have provided a stylus with HD2?

I am finding clicking links which are quite small a bit hit and miss and the lighter the touch the easier it is to register a click Also registry tweaks on things like total commander are very difficult and I miss a stylus for things like this. I beleive a capacitive stylus should have been provided and left to the user to use or not. What do you think?

Nope - capacitive screens don't need styli. What they should have done is made all of the wm 6.5 menus finger friendly and maybe added a safari-type magnifying glass for clicking links in Opera.

While I was waiting for my phone to arrive, I had ordered a cheapo Pogo stylus "just in case". I've used it a few times when I first got the phone and started changing stuff in the registy, but got confident enough with my "finger poking" very quickly. Haven't used it in nearly 2 weeks now.

I think the HD2 is perfectly finger friendly. However, if HTC could have produced a stylus for the capacitive screen that was the same size as a normal stylus and managed to find room in the current case for a silo to hold it then I wouldn't have objected. Regardless of what the finger nazis would have you believe, you can still get more done faster with a stylus and ruling it out is as silly as ruling fingers out.

jakem said:
I think the HD2 is perfectly finger friendly. However, if HTC could have produced a stylus for the capacitive screen that was the same size as a normal stylus and managed to find room in the current case for a silo to hold it then I wouldn't have objected. Regardless of what the finger nazis would have you believe, you can still get more done faster with a stylus and ruling it out is as silly as ruling fingers out.
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I agree. The transition from stylus to finger may be ok for people with slim fingers but my fingers are not slim, I have bloke hands so a stylus for me is essential for some operations like editing the registry.
The possibility of screwing something up with a large fingered prod after using that slider thing to navigate to the right registry key doesn't bear thinking about. That alone stopped me in my tracks mid regedit and made me go to the bay and buy a pogo.
Koreans and snake hipped ladyboys might find styluses obsolete but some actual men use these devices, some of us have been doing so since they were invented and some of us are over 40
HTC ought to have included a stylus, whether the user chose to use it or not.

compact_bijou said:
...
Koreans and snake hipped ladyboys might find styluses obsolete but some actual men use these devices, some of us have been doing so since they were invented and some of us are over 40
...
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I am well over 40, neither Korean nor a ladyboy... but quite tall with quite big hands and not so small fingers...
And I got used to the touch screen after some practicing... after having some experience from Apple devices.
"Problem" is maybe that HD2 is really fast with everything. One has to get used to the sensibility of the screen and the sheer speed.

eyeofthetiger said:
Should HTC have provided a stylus with HD2?
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Yes.
Next question?

Im also using pogo stylus, works great and regarding registry editing on mobile i use CeRegEditor which basically connects from PC to mobile registry and on PC you can fast and easily edit it.

compact_bijou said:
I agree. The transition from stylus to finger may be ok for people with slim fingers but my fingers are not slim, I have bloke hands so a stylus for me is essential for some operations like editing the registry.
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Erm finger size not quite an excuse ... I've got slim fingers, true (I'm a girl), but instead I have long nails to contend with (and I mean long - they "stick out" by about half an inch) so I had to find the right angle to poke at. Agree with you that it would have been nice of them to include a stylus anyway and let the user decide.

i really need a slim stylus...i use VNC/RDP alot and with this phone it's quite impossible.

tictac0566 said:
One has to get used to the sensibility of the screen and the sheer speed.
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I'm getting there with the sensitivity of the screen vs the insensitivity of my digit (it's only been 6 hours) but I have to say that I'm delighted to have finally found a hand held device which fast enough to work my way.

Teetering on the edge of getting the HD2, but need clarification...

Hi all,
well as my x1's screen is not working and I may not be able to fix it on warranty (still working on that as I have to take it in to see) I am going to get a new phone, the HD2 seems to fit the bill as I do a lot of reading and watching vids on my phone... the big screen appeals but I use Pleco a chinese dictionary and so much more. It enables me to write in chinese and with a stylus this is fast and simple... however I am worried that I will not be able to use a stylus on the capacitive screen and thus it will render Pleco in operable or nearly useless (the ability to write Chinese characters is very important)... thoughts on this, will the finger be able to write accurately enough, can I get a stylus or make one to use (ie do I have to buy a special one or will a slightly thicker one work ok (compared to an x1 stylus for example)... thanks for any advice or info...

The iphone stylli even with tweaked screen sensitivity don't seem to work well on it. The Dagii stylus for the hd2 looks good though. Youtube it.

Thanks for the heads up... that might be what I am after although I have read there are issues with usability...

Shadowdh said:
Thanks for the heads up... that might be what I am after although I have read there are issues with usability...
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HTC have launched their own stylus for use on capacitive screens. I think they are available on Clove.co.uk and many other stores.

HD2 and Pleco
I have an HD2 and use Pleco almost every day. There is an option to use the whole screen to hand-write characters. You have to use your finger, but its not that bad. Sometimes when I try to go too fast the results aren't super accurate, but overall its really not any more inconvenient that having to pull a stylus out.
I'd say it doesn't impact usability at all, and the larger screen makes the software much better in my opinion.

I have tried every stylus I could find and none of them work very well with the hd2 at all. I have found that your finger is much easier to use and more responsive and accurate than any of the capacitive stylus'... so if it's an app that needs a stylus and isn't easy to use with your finger, you're going to have a difficult time with the hd2.