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Hi all,
i read more and more people wanting to sell their brand new exec, BARELY USED... Are people disappointed by it and think it doesn't worth the money ???
I am really wondering what is wrong with it... and i don't have one yet, but i am thinking about getting one... now reading more and more bad reviews on it, dispointment and people selling it after less than a week of use... i am really hesitating to buy it, even though i ve waited it for many months !
What is your opinion about it and do you think it really worth 1000 € ??
Thanks,
Mike.
I would NEVER recommend it for a housewife, but if you are just a little bit tech savvy, AND have a weekend to spare setting it up according to guidance on these forums, it's great. If you do not, you could be extremely miserable with the speed and unacceptable bugs such as BT turning off.
I think a lot of it is people hoping to make a quick buck. I mean, £229 + £8 x 12 = £325 total outlay. People are selling them for upwards of £400 pretty much the same day with just about no risk and keeping a free 5mb/month sim card. Either that, or they just don't need a new handset and are taking advantage of the demand for Universals.
As a phone its no good for me just too fiddily, i use it as a data centre and pocket pc with a seperate phone, for this it is perfect
I think its a great little device. Don't get me wrong, if you expect it to have no bugs you will not be happy but as with all new technology, it will take time to iron them out.
In the meantime, I am happy to live with the minor glitches. It wont take long until the Exec is supported better (and also WM5) and this should be when this device comes into its own.
As for the functionality as a phone - I really am getting used to it
xiasma said:
I think a lot of it is people hoping to make a quick buck. I mean, £229 + £8 x 12 = £325 total outlay. People are selling them for upwards of £400 pretty much the same day with just about no risk and keeping a free 5mb/month sim card. Either that, or they just don't need a new handset and are taking advantage of the demand for Universals.
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Click to collapse
This is spot-on. That's exactly what a few people are doing. Sure there are some people who have been disappointed with theirs, but honestly, what were they expecting? Most people who are complaining are either newcomers to the PDA/Phone world, or they're installing every damn WM2003 software they've ever bought and killing their machines with incompatible software. IMHO
I couldn't ever personally justify €1000 for any phone/PDA device, but for €500 it is an excellent machine. I love mine. Perhaps I'm biased. Just remember that it's an early release of WM5 and there are a few bugs. They'll be fixed in time though and they're not fundamental IMHO.
@xiasma, which tariff is £8 per month? Can you purchase this online?
I agree with what's been said so far. If someone came to this even from a Nokia smartphone I think they could be disappointed, as they are phones first and pda/gadgets/whatever second whereas the Universal is more like a high-end pda with a phone that happens to be built in. Even coming from a non-phone PDA (as I did) takes a little getting used to imho, since I used to have a far more cavalier attitude to installing stuff on my ipaq whereas now with the Universal I need to consider "will people still be able to ring me if I install this shareware demo?". Stability and reliability is very important for a phone, but for a small portable computer I tend to think that features and what-can-I-install-next are key. These are almost mutually exclusive characteristics and so finding the right compromise is a fairly personal decision I think - although it will probably divide into those two camps.
Going off-topic a bit, it would be nice if there were a 'phone only' kind of safe mode on the Universal, so if you do get something buggy going on you can set it to phone-only mode until you get round to sorting the problems, safe in the knowledge that at least the phone will work.
What do you think?
jah said:
@xiasma, which tariff is £8 per month? Can you purchase this online?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's the Data 5 tariff - purchase from an O2 shop, not online. You maybe able to buy it over the 'phone.
I think people are after quick bucks as well, to me the Exec is buggy, not because of the device but rather the reliablities of WM5. Performance wise it's decent even with O2 active, my major issue is I can't get most of my most often used softwares to work properly in WM5.
Size wise, I was really surprised as it's not nearly as big as I originally imagined, it's only slightly bigger than my old IIs. I think couple ROM upgrades, I'd love this thing
I am glad you guys started this thread. I too want to purchase an HTC Universal, but was having second thoughts because of the bad comments I read about it.
I do have one question though, "Is it plague with soft resets?" How often do you have to perform a soft/hard reset?
First, my hypocrisy: I have an XDA Exec, I've let the opportunity go by to return it and I'm probably going to persevere.
Next, the rant...
I think it is a complete disgrace for this product to have been released as it currently is. It shouldn't be necessary to spend a weekend getting a consumer device up and running. The bugs in the software are not "kinks", they are key pieces of functionality that simply do not work. Microsoft, O2, Vodaphone would have picked up these within 1 day of normal operation without installing ANY other software and yet they release the product and charge you for it.
Here are some of my most obvious examples:
* The phone pad T9 entry method does not work. On a clean O2 active install, this works until the first soft reset and then no more. Using the corporate mode, it works for a while and then stops.
* Microsoft Voice command, which has a link for purchase displayed directly on the Windows Mobile 2005 MS website does not display contact information when dialing a contact.
* About the first thing you have to install is an app to properly close applications because the memory management is so poor that you're constantly having to soft reset, or go into settings and close all programs. Ok, perhaps not a bug, but surely within a day of using a beta of the device ANY MS employee could go "oh, well, I guess our backgrounding method of memory management doesn't work".
I have hard-reset my device many times and yes, it's possible to make it work provided you put enough attention into it, but it's supposed to be a productivity tool and yet it's taken many more hours to use than it's saved.
This is the kind of experience the world had to put up with when Windows 95 was launched and I thought Microsoft had finally reached a point where they were able to release decent software (like Windows XP), but clearly they're still happy to release rediculously low quality products.
What I do plan to do is to harrass O2 as much as possible regarding this. Make them wish they'd never sold the product because of what it's costing them to support. As MS now have OEM resellers carefully positioned between the end user and themselves perhaps doing this will eventually put pressure on MS to stop insulting us.
What's sad, is that they're doing it again - Palm have just decided to start running Windows Mobile, so it's only a matter of time until the Microsoft monopoly has been extended to PDAs as well. And the crazy thing is that this isn't because of it even being a nice product to use (bugs aside). How can MS (who have been developing software for such a long time) be so completely clueless when it comes to software design. Reading this site confirms that I'm by no means the only one complaining:
* Nice, expensive crystal clear screen, brand spanking new OS and web browser. Oh, you can't browse in 640 X 480. Never mind...
* No full screen terminal services. Never mind...
* Let's not bother with a task switcher. It's much easier to go through the menu every time.
* Why provide a decent file explorer, people will never use it.
Every time, the support community comes up with nice freeware apps that fill all the holes and on the next release of the OS, all the same holes are there. It's like MS lock all the app designers and developers in a room and don't let them near an end user.
Believe it or not, this post not from an old Microsoft hater, but I'm surely becoming a new one.
There, I'm done...
Dave
It is better than the BlueAngel!!!
I received mine in from O2 the other day and from just running Win2005 and included software, this device really seems to be an improvement over my MDAIII, which I have never yet been able to work solidly in a years's time of playing with it. The build quality is very good. However, my 2 primary 3rd party applications - Goodlink push email and Tom Tom Navigator 5 - do not intall and work. I have been told that the Tom Tom will work if the CABs are transferred in manually, but I have not yet tried that. My Dictionary and Bible programs installed and work fine from their SD chips. But the only thing now is to wait for everybody to tweak apps to Microsoft 2005. This device should start to take off after that starts to occur. However, once HP with their iPaq 6515 upgraades to 2005, then that should be major competition to HTC - even though HTC makes those as well :lol:
There are absolutely, catagorically, 100% certainly, no arguements, LESS BUGS in my brand new WM5 JasJar than any WM2003SE device I've owned previously.
I agree with some points made though, software which works on WM5 is few and far between, and even if you find some which says it works, it may still cause problems...Look at SPB Pocket Plus which slows the JJ to a crawl if you put a storage card meter on your today screen.
My advice is to be patient and accept that because you've bought the first WM5 device, there will be some time to wait until there's software available that's not only "Compatible with...", but actually "Designed for..." WM5.
Very pleased I didn't own a WM2003 device older device then. It still doesn't change the fact that they've released a product with full knowledge that it doesn't work.
In terms of other applications, I completely accept that installing old apps on WM2005 may cause problems. I'm refering to the product "out the box".
daveb1976 said:
It still doesn't change the fact that they've released a product with full knowledge that it doesn't work.
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Click to collapse
What "doesn't work"?
Everything that came with my JasJar works perfectly.
Your t9 problem is not something I've heard anyone mention before. If you've done a hard reset and it still doesn't work, I'd send it back to O2 and get them to replace it?
I've already taken it back twice and it's been swapped out both times. There are a number of people on this forum who have had the same problem. Here's one posting.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/viewtopic.php?t=30591&highlight=
I guess it's possible that if I were to flash to the imate ROM it might work, but then I lose my warrantee.
TBH, I disagree with just about EVERY point on your list
I'm certainly not aware of glaring bugs or omissions. Quite the opposite, in fact. I'm using an MDA Pro - perhaps the XDA Exec's extra software is the cause for most gripes.
daveb1976 said:
* The phone pad T9 entry method does not work. On a clean O2 active install, this works until the first soft reset and then no more. Using the corporate mode, it works for a while and then stops.
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Click to collapse
I hate T9 so I've never tried it on the Universal. Then again, with a full keyboard, why would I?
* Microsoft Voice command, which has a link for purchase displayed directly on the Windows Mobile 2005 MS website does not display contact information when dialing a contact.
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Click to collapse
I use voice command all the time and it works PERFECTLY for me. That's well beyond my expectations. Now I can't say I've noticed your issue with contacts, but then again, when I use voice command it's when I'm not really using the screen or keyboard.
* About the first thing you have to install is an app to properly close applications because the memory management is so poor that you're constantly having to soft reset, or go into settings and close all programs. Ok, perhaps not a bug, but surely within a day of using a beta of the device ANY MS employee could go "oh, well, I guess our backgrounding method of memory management doesn't work".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally and utterly disagree
First of all, MS are trying to get people away from traditional Windows thinking of starting and stopping applications. They want to give the perception of everything just always being there and ready. This wasn't an easy decision for them, but I believe it was the right one. OK, for all us techies and PC-savvy types, yeah, we know what's going on in memory. But lots of consumers (your mum, for example) don't. And this is actually a behavior of the APPLICATIONS, not of Windows Mobile. Take a look at the developer's guidelines and you'll see.
Also, if you want to *terminate* an application that was not designed to be terminated using the (X) button, go to Settings, Memory, Running Programs. You can close any or all applications there. And that's been part of Windows Mobile since at least 2002, if not sooner.
I have hard-reset my device many times and yes, it's possible to make it work provided you put enough attention into it, but it's supposed to be a productivity tool and yet it's taken many more hours to use than it's saved.
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Click to collapse
That's your experience, but so far removed from mine it's untrue! Then again, I've installed almost nothing extra on my Universal.
[snip]
* Nice, expensive crystal clear screen, brand spanking new OS and web browser. Oh, you can't browse in 640 X 480. Never mind...
* No full screen terminal services. Never mind...
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Click to collapse
yeah, I'm in 100% agreement on these two.
:evil: :evil:
* Let's not bother with a task switcher. It's much easier to go through the menu every time.
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Click to collapse
See my comment about Settings/memory/Running programs. You can use this as a task switcher too. But the idea really is to discourage this kind of Windows NT/XP mindset.
* Why provide a decent file explorer, people will never use it.
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Click to collapse
Another brave decision for MS is to try to make files easier for consumers to understand. The idea is
"I don't really understand file systems. Why can't I keep all my documents together? In fact, why do I even need to know where my documents are kept? I just want my spreadsheets to be presented to me when I go to Excel; I want my pictures to be presented to me when I go to picture viewer; etc"
MS had a stab at this with Windows 95 and "My Documents". They have abandoned this in Windows Vista in favour or something more like Windows Mobile's "show you what you need when you need it". All these utilities really will become obsolete for all but the most techie users. My companies products are following the same ideology in desktop and mobile software.
sub69 said:
daveb1976 said:
It still doesn't change the fact that they've released a product with full knowledge that it doesn't work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What "doesn't work"?
Everything that came with my JasJar works perfectly.
Your t9 problem is not something I've heard anyone mention before. If you've done a hard reset and it still doesn't work, I'd send it back to O2 and get them to replace it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The T9 PhonePad bug is described in other threads on this forum and I've found that my device has the same problem. However, I don't personally find this in any way restrictive since the Universal has ...umm... a full, usable, hardware keyboard.
All these PDA/phone machines have been best after several experiments with their configuration. I did a hard reset this morning so that I cleaned off all my experimental applications' legacies and now I'm running trusted, tested apps that work well and bring huge positive benefits.
However, people who just want a machine to work out of the box will find Microsoft's core applications are crap and empty of features. I fully agree with daveb1976 about that. I disagree that they're particularly buggy though.
Fortunately I (and many others on these forums) actually enjoy messing about with the configuration and tweaking the machines to get them working 100% the way we want. It's part of the pleasure of owning them IMHO. Not everybody will share this pleasure, though, and so some frustration is understandable.
SiliconS said:
However, people who just want a machine to work out of the box will find Microsoft's core applications are crap and empty of features. I fully agree with daveb1976 about that. I disagree that they're particularly buggy though.
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Click to collapse
Again, I completely disagree. In fact, of almost ALL the 100s of computers I've used and owned, I'd say that it is less true of the MDA Pro than it is any other computer (maybe except the Z88)
Fortunately I (and many others on these forums) actually enjoy messing about with the configuration and tweaking the machines to get them working 100% the way we want. It's part of the pleasure of owning them IMHO. Not everybody will share this pleasure, though, and so some frustration is understandable.
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I'll agree with all of that though
Hello fellow Uni users,
I could see quite a lot of people referring to them using TomTom 6 (and yes it also is listed on tomtom.com in the list of compatible devices). However I preferred MN5 over TomTom earlier on due to refined interface and NAVTEQ maps (which are so much better than TeleAtlas, in my opinion and from my experience of course).
My grudge against it was that it consumes lots of RAM and can't free it up easily (except Quitting and restarting software). But I managed to get it working all right on my Universal.
I waited for MN|6 for PDA's quite a long time. They have released PNA's with MN|6, then a version for Symbians, but no luck for PDA. And recently their web site began to take preliminary orders for VERSION 6, T.B.D. on December 28th.
Imagine my disappointment when I saw that the website lists no Exec under O2 brand, and if you select (similar) MDA Pro, it says "this model is unsupported!"
Well... AA Navigator was also unsupported under XDA II, but I made it work.
=========================
* I wonder if anybody has used NAVIGON Mobile Navigator|5 on their Universals?
* I would appreciate if anybody who gets their paws on MN|6 (may be for their other PDA's) would let us know their experiences of using it on the Universal. Don't want to waste £100 on something that most probably won't work or will work with limitations...
* I wonder if the reason for no support is because Universal is low on available RAM? In this case all you need is just to soft reset your PDA before going somewhere. IF - that's a big IF - MN|6 just needs more RAM in which case... TOUGH
* I would appreciate if you note which Sat Nav software do you use for your Universals - I can guess TomTom 6 will be in the list.
But, any others?
I tried running this PNA version on my Qtek 9000, but it didnt work at all. used tweaks i found somewhere, but never passed the startup screen...
Was there a release planed for PDAs?
Dunno if the navigon 6 maps work on navigon 5?!
HansiHusten said:
I tried running this PNA version on my Qtek 9000, but it didnt work at all. used tweaks i found somewhere, but never passed the startup screen...
Was there a release planed for PDAs?
Dunno if the navigon 6 maps work on navigon 5?!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, MN|6 for PDA's can be ordered from Navigon beginning on 28th December. The b***ers delayed the PDA release so they could crop the PNA market and then Symbian Mobile phones. Now looks like the time has come.
The problem is, they say MN|6 is not supported on MDA Pro - a similar class device and since I think that may be due to enormous amount of RAM it uses while running (MN|5 kept drawing memory with each search or map zoom, so it was best to quit after you got there and start anew - that somehow reclaimed the memory) and lack of RAM within Universal.
Anyway I am not ready to pay £100 for upgrade before I know for sure it works on Exec. I own MN|5 but upgrade incentive is disappointing -- just £25 off the regular price...
If MN|6 requires more memory even and doesn't like the Exec, I'll have but three choices -- drop it altogether and move to TomTom (likely) or CoPilot (unlikely), stay with MN|5 (bo-o-oring! ) or get myself a new XDA Orbit (unlikely )
Mhh.... ur sure it will use much more RAM?
Lets just wait and see, i´m optimistic Navigon 5 with latest update runs realy great and i wont stop trying V6 until i get it to run, awesome app, better than tomtom imho.
HansiHusten said:
Mhh.... ur sure it will use much more RAM?
Lets just wait and see, i´m optimistic Navigon 5 with latest update runs realy great and i wont stop trying V6 until i get it to run, awesome app, better than tomtom imho.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with you that it's better made than TomTom. You can see all signs of a luxury sat nav system -- and TomTom is deffo lacking refinement. Voice destination entry is just awesome, very convenient and people's jaws drop.
Navigon 5 ran more or less OK, albeit after you finish your destination it always failed to release memory - it requires lots of RAM to operate, so if I were going somewhere far away, I'd always softreset my system beforehand.
I tried to think why would it be incompatible, and some cheaper WM5 models would be. Definitely not CPU. Hardly also incompatible due to Bluetooth issues, even though for some models you'd see partial compatibility -- as in "incompatible with BiCeiver". I doubt they'd screw up Bluetooth stack from a perfectly working version in MN|5. So for now I'd blame it on MN|6 requiring more RAM to run -- and the Universal is famously low on memory especially in standard setup (non-Corporate mode), but that's only my guess. If that's the case, in Corporate mode there should be no problems running it.
Anyway, I've sent a message to Navigon asking why exactly is MN|6 not compatible with Universal. Hope to get an enlightening answer.
And yes, I'll be willing to try it all right and if it works properly after my tweaks, just buy it like I did with MN|5. Right now, a Torrent with what poses as "MN|6 für PDA" is stalled at 94% working since 20th...
Merry Christmas!
Official answer from Navigon support team
"Dear Mr. <EastExpert>,
thank you for your request and your interest in Mobile Navigator 6.
We regret to inform you that none of the following HTC Universal clones
is compatible with NAVIGON's latest PDA navigation solution (MN|6):
- O2 XDA Exec
- Qtek 9000
- T-Mobile MDA Pro
- Vodafone VPA IV
Whether the incompatibility of the HTC Universal clones is due to there
hardware architecture, their ROM image or both is unknown to the support
team. Sorry.
With kind regards
__________________
Navigon Support Team
A. M*******" (name provided)
So, they are SORRY.
For feck's sake, is it not enough that Universals cost about £600, must I buy again - some PNA - just to keep up with new version?!
Hardly.
I call bullsh*t. I'll believe this when I'll install MN|6 onto my device and it refuses to work outright. Before that, the question will remain open as to whether it works with Universals.
I'll have a look on TomTom 6 and CoPilot that will come with XDA Orbits... only CoPilot is nowhere to be found for trials... more work to do therefore!
Just to let you know, MN|6 for PDA's is now available on the markets (white and black as well).
Now I gotta find somebody to test MN|6 on their Exec to prove or disprove the "not supported" claim.
I have been waiting for Navigon MN6 too, since Navigon MN5 has the best street coverage in Sweden where I live.
I have also been testing TomTom 6 and I-Go 2006 and I am very satisfied with I-Go when it comes to speed and flexibility. Simply the best navigation solution right now.
But since the street coverage in MN5 was really good I had to test the new MN6 and went out and bought it to day.
Just as I thought MN6 was compatible with my Universal. It would install and start well and the interface is clean and easy to navigate.
The street coverage is also very good as I thought it would be.
BUT, and there is a big BUT, the SPEED! MN6 is painfully slow, the animated menus and especially when browsing the map. Sometimes you have to wait seconds for things to happen. I dont know if this is a problem with the Universal, but I dont think so, it has enough processing power and memory.
Speed was one of the disadvantages with MN5 when I used it on my WM2003 PPC, and speed is why I will go back to I-Go today. I-Go is so much smoother... Sorry MN6!
dape16 said:
BUT, and there is a big BUT, the SPEED! MN6 is painfully slow, the animated menus and especially when browsing the map. Sometimes you have to wait seconds for things to happen. I dont know if this is a problem with the Universal, but I dont think so, it has enough processing power and memory.
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That, my friend, is what I suspected... The program itself would run, but Universals are famous for their lack of RAM to operate programs. Even MN|5 required so much memory, it would leave 4-6 out of 22-24 available... shame actually, 'cause the program was really lovely and had that "luxury" feeling oozing from it. I guess MN|6 requires even more, probably as much as 20+MB. This makes a lot of swapping and this is probably why you experienced such slow operation... -- and why the NAVIGON decided to deem Universals incompatible. The processing power in Uni is abundant - Bulverde 520MHz is not bad at all!
For comparison, TomTom 6, which I decided to try as an alternative, happily lives in 6-8 MB (not forgetting to give the memory used by it back at the end of the session). Having seen this, I reenabled PocketBreeze on my XDA Exec and it still has plenty of memory to operate -- I feel so much happier after these few months... I intend to try playing MP3 while navigating and see how it fares along. Pure tests
Also TomTom showed Tunnel mode, availability of TomTom Plus service where you can subscribe for ~£33 for a year of Traffic updates (via mere GPRS - no need to buy yet another £170-210 TMC-enabled receiver!) and Speed (err, Safety) Camera updates... that's nothing if you ask me Operated very fast in my tests, 2-3 seconds long route recalculations, convenient & configurable menus (yes, you can make your own ONLINE!).
You also get camera data freely available from the Net if you don't feel like paying for TomTom Plus subscription. Other things I liked about TomTom is gradually increasing precision as you approach the maneuvre point (.1 miles then .05 then 50 yds then 25 etc... till 5), Race Against Time mode where you enter time you wish to be at your destination and it shows you how are you faring on it! Also very sensible routing algorithms (btw compared to MN|5 -- I just get there faster!). What totally killed me was Full UK Postcode search that just required me to copy a few files into installation directory and it worked straight away! Only AA Navigator had a comparable Full UK Postcode database... the problem is, it didn't support Address search (as in "Town/Street/Number" mode). So TomTom won here as well.
Re: iGO 2006, some colleagues of mine have tried it and have split feelings: 1) the program they say is just excellent, but 2) the map coverage in the UK where we are is disappointingly incomplete. I guess this is just a teething problem (growth problem) since iGO was designed in Hungary, so they say its Eastern European coverage is much better. And I think iGO definitely has future. I read the manual and was pleasantly impressed by amount of features available. (And a bit disappointed by reviews that said UK coverage is currently far from perfect).
In other words, I now have moved to TomTom 6 for now.
As for MN|6, seems like while we retain our Universals, we're in the ditch with it. Oh, tough. Until there's a comparable device (VGA and Phone and GPRS and 3G and WiFi and even GPS may be) -- I'll cling to my Universal.
Seems like I was wrong about the compatibility after all...
I have done some more testing here and it seems like it is the Universals lack of RAM thats the problem.
When I tried to do some door-to-door navigation with MN6 the Uni gave me memory allocation errors or it would simply freeze.
I have Helmis AKU 3.5 ROM and about 22 MB RAM free after soft-reset. Maybe I should try with Ivans, I read in his thread that with his ROM you start with about 30 MB free.
But I am not sure that would solve the problem, I found this thread and some people there have been testing MN6 with Ivans ROM.
http://www.ppc-welt.info/community/showthread.php?t=102846
By the way, I cant belive that MN6 is eating so much RAM. They have had a couple of years do redesign MN5 but still it needs more then twice as much as TomTom.
Since Navgions maps are the best where I live, I am thinking about trying MN5. EastExpert, did you get it to run well on your Uni? Was it compatible with VGA?
My test with MN|6, wasn't encouraging.
1st Out of memory.
Reset. Next 3 or 4 goes, it was very slow and lagging in switching between dialogue boxes to the point were it would be doing the same thing 3 times because you thought you had not pressed the on screen buttons.
It looked very nice and certainly more polished than TT, but certainly not something to use for your daily business unless someone comes up with a superROM with a large amount of free mem and no leakage.
You can use it, but you need to be really careful, press a button and sit there, wait for the result, then do the next thing. I'm going to try i-Go next, to see if it fits my needs better than TT.
Shame; MN|6 looked pretty cool.
Cheers
Fish
There is some interesting info at the thread I linked to earlier, some guy saying that according to Navigon support the Universal will be compatible with the next update for MN6. Exciting!
dape, yes I used to run MN|5 on my Uni. Granted, it wasn't without problems. When I went somewhere far away, I always soft reset the beast, otherwise it could easily run out of memory somewhere on the go.
Another thing that really peed me off was that if I tried to do something beyond usual navigation (i.e. enter the address and press go), like select a car park nearby, or a petrol station, it would start to mix new screen on top of the old one... same would happen if I were to enter next destination after having arrived at the first one -- clear signs for me (a long-ago former software developer) that there's not enough memory.
It was a properly bought version (used an upgrade offer from AA Navigator I've been using before) and I lived with it for several months, but never was quite content with the fact I hadn't free memory enough to run the program -- this could build an inferiority complex in some other person! . Then eventually I've gotten sick and tired of it and decided to seek for alternatives.
I dropped the forum link you provided into Babelfish to translate into English, and there was an interesting phrase there -- the sense was that there will be an update to MN|6 that will make it compatible. Hmm. That could be interesting! I guess I'll keep watching the arena!
UPDATE: You have just posted the same and you were faster
fishtastic, looks like your findings actually corroborate the theory of MN|6 being all too big for the usual memory amount in Universal.
One can't really work like that -- not freely using all the MN|6's advanced features and having to wait and soft reset without end.
iGO seems not an option for me yet -- all the reviews I've read mention far from ideal coverage of UK where I dwell. Nice software, though, I'll give it a go when the next version arrives.
O2 UK is now providing XDA Orbit (= HTC Artemis) and recommends ALK CoPilot 6 with it. I wasn't too impressed by its screenshots, looks like TomTom and iGo are better. Haven't got my mitts on a version of CoPilot I could install and try though. May be O2 had their reasons when selecting CoPilot for their XDA orbit.
P.S. I wonder what happens next -- me finding anything better than TomTom 6, or me moving to a next BMW with in-dash Sat-Nav support?... LOL
EastExpert said:
P.S. I wonder what happens next -- me finding anything better than TomTom 6, or me moving to the next BMW with Sat Nav in the dashboard?... LOL
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Are these BMWs that you speak of more or less expensive than a universal? And do run WM5? ;-)
Er, seriously, a lot of guys in work, have beemers and several use TT-ToGo, the only guy with dashboard satnav drives a Jag. Me being the poor IT guy doing the essbase and SQL Server stuff surrounded by these rich accountants catches the train to work. Boo.
I suppose the thing with TT is that it works fairly well. I just wish they would tart it up a bit and tidy the interface.
Oh well,
Good Luck to anyone else trying. Oh, I should have said before that I'm using the original shipping Rom on an O2 Exec from Nember 2005.
Cheers
Fish
Being in IT myself, and not a sales, solicitor or accountant, I think the first is more likely to happen and my next BMW would probably cost about as much as a new Universal...
Err... but I digress.
You're right about TT - it "just friggin' works", period. You just start it and it does what's on the tin. And compared to version 3 it's really a much better product (that was my previous experience with TT).
I'll be watching the space though - the hint about potential update that will support Execs is taken. Next iGO will be worth trying, I guess. And that's about it -- sometimes you just want to have something that works for a while
Many thanks to you guys for your feedback. Now, we know
Small addition:
MN|6 appears to switch off the power management i.e. the turn off the backlight after 3 mins bit. Confused me when I opened it and it was on.
Also, anyone with the problem with their battery is getting a bit old and turning off at 30odd%, if you have installed MN|6, at what point does it now do it at? Has it changed?
Cheers
Fish
The battery problem you mention is quite strange, because my 5 months old Uni suddenly started to turn of at about 30% power...
I can confirm that this is a battery problem, it has not anything to do with ROM version or something. Only a new battery solved my problem.
dape16 said:
The battery problem you mention is quite strange, because my 5 months old Uni suddenly started to turn of at about 30% power...
I can confirm that this is a battery problem, it has not anything to do with ROM version or something. Only a new battery solved my problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, it's well known that it's a battery problem, but mine went from 30-odd% to ~90% just after installing, that prompted the question. Personally I believe it's a coincidence that it changed so dramatically. My battery is 1 year and 3 months old and I think it's heart just gave out. I ordered a new battery a few days ago, before MN|6, and so hopefully it won't be too long before the new one arrives.
I was just wondering if anyone had experience such a jump? I'm guessing it is my battery's particular circumstances in this case.
Cheers
Fish
The whole thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=267448 is dedicated to Exec battery problems. I have added my 2p there recently, too...
In a nutshell, it looks like even the original batteries have only about a year's life and then start to suck big time. And replacements from third parties are rare sh!te, most displaying problems with short life, having not enough energy to operate Exec's parts like phone or SD card too early, some always displaying charge at 100% and all of them not even approaching the stated capacity of 1750 mAh...
Only a few people tried to generalize, but I'd say: some report problems starting when they installed AKU 3.x from this forum, some blame charging via USB connection to PC, some blame just abysmal quality of batteries (probably true for 3rd party replacements), and some blame age (probably true, too - 1 year and then you gotta replace your battery or it gets less and less capacity until you get something like I have... unable to support phone already at 92% by meter and turning off at 85%...)
One day I'll just peddle it off eBay. I had many, many problems with this device. XDA I and II were (and II still is ) flawless and fast. I don't know what's wrong with Exec, but it was problems from the very beginning.
Good news!
With Ivan's new Rom (AKU3.5 beta 2), MN6 is working!!!!!
I installed MN6 to storage card, not to main memory.
I'm testing it for two days now, no problems at all.
I'm using Navigon's Trireceiver with tmc and even tmc works.
YOU SHOULD GIVE IT A TRY!
Best regards, Leo
But I've never bought one! Every time Apple come out with a new product I want to rush out and get one. Then, I don't. This has happened for the iPod, Apple TV, iPhone, new iPod, Mac, etc. There is always some limitation that is a deal breaker (and the high prices). With the iPhone, it is locked to AT&T or O2 or whoever. Take it overseas and your going to be paying incredible roaming fees. You can buy an unlocked 3GS in Europe (Italy) but it costs around $1100 (that is US dollars) and you probably won't find one without a contract. It won't play xvid/divx etc. The Apple TV looks awesome. Ahh, but you're locked in to iTunes and supported formats are not that great. The iPod Touch - wow, that looks fantastic. But I keep having to pay for upgrades? And it's not a phone? It just goes on an on.
So I went out and bought the HTC Hero. I absolutely love this thing. I'm not saying it is perfect, but there are only a few faults so far. Once I turned off that silly clock on the home screen it became quite snappy. The browser is amazing. Bookmarks are easy to access, though I wish you could do it with a finger swipe. Or at least cycle through open pages that way. Integration with Google accounts (maps, gmail, contacts) is fantastic. The maps work great with both GPS and just the cell tower information. Using Google street view and sky is really cool. The device knows its orientation at all times. Enable compass mode in street view and when you face North, the phone will show you that view. Turn in a circle, it will follow. I bet Google will eventually do turn by turn and 3D navigation. Why not? They'll make loads of money on it. The PDF reader is actually very useful. Since the Hero did not come with a manual, I downloaded the manual (all 220 pages) and actually skimmed it very easily with the PDF reader! That was amazing. Come to find out, the manual was actually on the included SD card, but there was no file manager to access it (but there is an app!) Now maybe this phone is so awesome because I'm getting ~4mbps throughput (yes, throughput) with my HSDPA connection....but it works pretty good on Edge too. The Wifi antenna is reasonable for the size of the phone, though my laptop usually gets a stronger signal. The ability to switch from the Sense UI to the normal Adroid environment sweet. I don't know why they have to still call it Touch Flo though. That is just confusing (but I can deal with it!). Start up time (boot) for the Hero is abysmal. I have not timed it but probably on the order of 1 minute. Hope you don't need to call the hospital or something. Have no idea how the iPhone compares. My solution, just leave the phone on.
The day after I bought the phone I set it next to my friends iPhone. I thought, ohh no! His screen is much bigger. This is going to be a train wreck. After a week, I much prefer the Hero size screen. It is so much easier using with one hand. I can type and browse fairly easily with one hand. Plus, when you actually use the Hero as a phone (to your ear) you don't look like you're talking into a small TV. It fits in my pocket much better than the iPhone. Still looking for a really good case that protects and is small. I do wish the "back" button was on the other side of the phone as it is a bit awkward. I guess the designer was a lefty. I can deal with that. The build quality is quite nice, though the back panel is quite flimsy. I hope they sell replacements because it is going to break sometime.
HTC Hero, what I always really wanted my Dell Axim X51v to be.
clobber said:
..... I do wish the "back" button was on the other side of the phone as it is a bit awkward. I guess the designer was a lefty. I can deal with that....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
... bought mine couple a days ago, when breaking my Diamond.
just to say: I love the "hero". and as Im "lefty" I love it even more...
Now just waiting for decent outlook calendar syncing program (funambol) for android to be ready and good offline navigation option, as usually I need navigation when out in foreign country and roaming fees are quite high then.
P.S. I will never go back to WM... never ...
Another satisfied Hero customer here as well And I second the WM opinion, I had a XDA Exec for years - and although the hardware was good the OS just ruined it!
clobber said:
You can buy an unlocked 3GS in Europe (Italy) but it costs around $1100 (that is US dollars) and you probably won't find one without a contract. It won't play xvid/divx etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you have an android divx player? Link please!
Kudos to the thread starter, I agree completely!
Hear hear(o)!
I had the iPhone 3g , good phone loved it , but I hated apple , their restriction have ruined it for me , I felt like if I was renting it and not actually owning the thing , but over all good phone .
You're right. I don't see a divx/xvid player yet.
clobber said:
You're right. I don't see a divx/xvid player yet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You had my hopes up.
guys ... what should i say ... i was WM usr for years ... and tested one interface after the other (wisbar advanced desktop, touch flo 2d manilla, and so on)
but this here (YES I GOT A HERO, TOO) is just awesome... will be a hard fight for microsoft to bring me back ... (maybee windows mobile 7 - we will see)
but this phone is the best i ever had my hands on ... and i'm workin for a big german provider, so i touched much phones
LOVING THE HERO
Ok, folks. Having read through this thread (clicky) and others, having learned about the variety of GPS solutions for navigation, I'm still trying to decide on which one is the right for me.
I've been using TomTom since my HX4700 days, migrated to TomTom on my Kaiser and now have been using it on my HD2 with with the 9192_V_Black_noBT cab which works great. The reason I'm asking the question and posting the poll here is that now TomTom has decided to abandon the WM platform, I'm seeking a solution that I can rely on going forward. It's been great, but it's time to move on.
Google maps is NOT an option because I travel in areas where data (and even cell signals in general) are unreliable due to topography. Whatever I choose must be a standalone product that uses the internal GPS hardware, though I completely understand that enhanced features like traffic and weather are data-dependent. The system will be used primarily in the Continental US. No plans to travel overseas, but I can't rule it out, either.
So I'm curious to know what you guys have decided on over time, and why.
If you vote(d) for TomTom, please indicate what your plans are for the future as the company has abandoned the WM platform and the probability of new features and continued usability on our devices becomes less likely due to the unavailability of 3rd party CABs for the system.
Looking forward to seeing your votes and reading your feedback.
I'm currently using Waze. It's free and it works. I'm sure some of the paid programs are better, but if you are looking for a free solution, check out Waze.
BillTheCat said:
The reason I'm asking the question and posting the poll here is that now TomTom has decided to abandon the WM platform, I'm seeking a solution that I can rely on going forward.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tomtom is abandoning the WM platform for one good reason - the WM platform itself is being abandoned. So your question doesn't make much sense as we can't talk about durability anyway. So for now continue using the Tomtom you're using now on your HD2. Then, as your next phone most likely won't be a WM6.5 phone anymore, you'll have to make that decision at that point for the new platform you'll choose anyway.
Who said Tomtom have abandoned Windows Mobile?
I Googled it but the only thing I managed to find was another xda thread where someone said : "TOMTOM has officially abandoned the US market for TOMTOM Navigator 7 and above, "Due to difficulties with US Cell Service providers""...
kilrah said:
Tomtom is abandoning the WM platform for one good reason - the WM platform itself is being abandoned.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First I'm hearing about this. Links and references please? In the meantime, one other way to look at it is to pick a solution from the above based on what other OS platforms they support.
I haven't heard any confirmation of WM being abandoned, but it makes perfect sense, the platform is dying. Developers don't want to develop for a platform which, come the end of the year, will no longer be put on any devices. There is no decent centralised source of apps (marketplace hasn't changed what it offers in the 5 months I've had a HD2) which causes developers concern about who will ever find their app to buy in the first place. Add that to the growing number of consumers ditching WM for iOS4, Android 2.2 and yes eventually WMP7, and you've got yourself a corpse of an operating system on your hands. Now tell me why would you spend time and money developing software for an OS whose market share is dramatically shrinking and in no way guarantees you profit return?
laserviking said:
I haven't heard any confirmation of WM being abandoned, but it makes perfect sense, the platform is dying.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been hearing this sort of 'rumor' about this platform since the days when it was called Windows CE while other OS's and platforms like EPOC for Psion others have fallen by the wayside. Yet here we are, almost two decades later, and there are ample apps on other sites than the Marketplace. So I'll ask everyone to please confine the discussion to the question asked, assume that Windows Mobile will still be around, and respond accordingly not on what might be, but what is for right now.
What are you using the GPS for? cant help you with street navigation but for hiking or 4wding i use Oziexplorer, I too once had a HX4700 for a few years and have been using Oziexplorer. You have to get your own maps and its not a street navigation type software. There are programs available to "rip" google maps and convert to maps usable by Ozi which works great!
BillTheCat rocks, lol!
BillTheCat said:
Ok, folks. Having read through this thread (clicky) and others, having learned about the variety of GPS solutions for navigation, I'm still trying to decide on which one is the right for me.
I've been using TomTom since my HX4700 days, migrated to TomTom on my Kaiser and now have been using it on my HD2 with with the 9192_V_Black_noBT cab which works great. The reason I'm asking the question and posting the poll here is that now TomTom has decided to abandon the WM platform, I'm seeking a solution that I can rely on going forward. It's been great, but it's time to move on.
Google maps is NOT an option because I travel in areas where data (and even cell signals in general) are unreliable due to topography. Whatever I choose must be a standalone product that uses the internal GPS hardware, though I completely understand that enhanced features like traffic and weather are data-dependent. The system will be used primarily in the Continental US. No plans to travel overseas, but I can't rule it out, either.
So I'm curious to know what you guys have decided on over time, and why.
If you vote(d) for TomTom, please indicate what your plans are for the future as the company has abandoned the WM platform and the probability of new features and continued usability on our devices becomes less likely due to the unavailability of 3rd party CABs for the system.
Looking forward to seeing your votes and reading your feedback.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You do know that the Bing mobile app does have free turn by turn navigation with voice prompts, right?
richo, given the programs in the poll, it's for mobile navigation.
dipalonv, per my original post, it needs to be a standalone solution.
BillTheCat said:
richo, given the programs in the poll, it's for mobile navigation.
dipalonv, per my original post, it needs to be a standalone solution.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My bad! You may want to look into CoPilot Live 8. I believe it's only $29.99 so not too bad price wise.
BillTheCat said:
I've been hearing this sort of 'rumor' about this platform since the days when it was called Windows CE while other OS's and platforms like EPOC for Psion others have fallen by the wayside. Yet here we are, almost two decades later, and there are ample apps on other sites than the Marketplace. So I'll ask everyone to please confine the discussion to the question asked, assume that Windows Mobile will still be around, and respond accordingly not on what might be, but what is for right now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haven't you followed the WP7 discussions a couple of months ago?
Windows phone 7 series that is due to be out at the end of the year has been announced by Microsoft as being based on a new concept, that makes all existing WM applications incompatible, unlike with all the previous WM revisions you mention where applications were reuseable. So, everything will have to be reprogrammed for the new platform. So not only will you have to wait for it to be out to buy a compatible program, but also no provider of navigation software has so far announced they would make something for it AFAIK. So for that kind of software just like all others, there will most likely be no offering until the platform proves to be profitable and developers have the time to reprogram everything for the new it, just like iPhone users had to wait for more than 2 years before a standalone GPS solution was available.
WM6.5 will be kept in parallel, "for low-end devices". As you have an HD2, I doubt you'll go for a "low-end device" in the future. And developers are abandoning it simply because it won't be the little remaining WM6.5 bit that will earn them money, it's the new WP7S where "all the hype" is. It's the incompatibility that will bury WM6.5, developers won't lose their time writing a second separate app for the old WM6.5.
Sooo... don't count on long-term useability. What you get today will only last you until you change phone, unless you stick to the "lower-end" future phones to stay on WM6.5.
I've just come back from a road trip in the States, i drove 2500 miles, using Co Pilot Live 8, and it worked a treat, no problems at all, and for the price it's a good deal
Hi, tried to use Copilot, paid the license
results: hd2 jammed,sd card (32gb) unreadable, lost of photos and videos, softs no more working, and of course copilot. Each start of the prog brings new damages.
see no one having that....
don't find a solution outside of replacing with my original sd card
greetings
croquemor
kilrah said:
Haven't you followed the WP7 discussions a couple of months ago?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, I haven't followed that. Can we all please focus on the question that was asked instead of going off on tangents?
I wonder if anyone can share their experience of using SGS2 as satnav with any of third-party software, which does not depends on mobile connection.
I've used it as a SatNav with Sygic and Navigon. Both works extremely well for me including fast lock time and also fast rerouting when I use other route instead.
So far, I say it is better than TomTom on the iPhone I use to have though it tends to use a little bit more battery than iPhone. With a charger, it will still drain the battery but at a very slow pace.
For the next few days CoPilot live new version is half price via the Android market .
http://blog.copilotlive.com/uk/2011/06/28/from-a-to-better-introducing-copilot-live-premium/
jje
Thanks a lot for the responses. Copilot offer looks interesting.
Is it ok to use a satnav app and listen to some music on teh phone simultaneously? What about answering calls while driving? Does it interrupt navigation?
Lets face it folks, android will never be up to the par of iphone until we get tomtom app. It really is that simple. TomTom is so much better than anything else available at the minute.
You can also use TeleNav for free on the SGS2 by following the instructions in this thread. It functions without cell towers which makes it better than Google Maps in certain situations. (Note: I didn't check international support)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1139482
Dannyboyni said:
Lets face it folks, android will never be up to the par of iphone until we get tomtom app. It really is that simple. TomTom is so much better than anything else available at the minute.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Matter of opinion really mate , can i ask why you rate tomtom so far ahead of others?? i admit the ui is simple and easy to use but co-pilot for example is a great piece of software .
When i had an iphone4 i went for co-pilot and not tomtom , i just think tomtom is over-priced compared to others
Its good for sure but so are the others avalible . Its all personal preference really but i doubt i would buy tomtom for android
buxz777 said:
Matter of opinion really mate , can i ask why you rate tomtom so far ahead of others?? i admit the ui is simple and easy to use but co-pilot for example is a great piece of software .
When i had an iphone4 i went for co-pilot and not tomtom , i just think tomtom is over-priced compared to others
Its good for sure but so are the others avalible . Its all personal preference really but i doubt i would buy tomtom for android
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For me: IQ Routes. The best route calculation I've ever seen, whereas other apps just don't get it quite right or just come up with horrible routes.
Tremium said:
For me: IQ Routes. The best route calculation I've ever seen, whereas other apps just don't get it quite right or just come up with horrible routes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its is well in front especially if you have the live traffic updates etc .
jje
I just used it for a 900-mile trip from Georgia to Iowa, using CoPilot Live 8, and it worked very well. For the money, CPL is the best navigation solution, at least in North America where the maps are pretty current. Google Navigation is pretty good too, although it's dependent on having a data connection to download maps, which can be an issue if you're driving in less-populated areas.
I downloaded the new CoPilot Premium USA package (CPL9) last night & used it on a short local trip this morning; the new version works at least as well as the old version.
As far as listening to music or handling phone calls while navigating, I didn't get a chance to test that on this trip. On previous trips, I've done both while navigating -- however, that was with CoPilot 8 on a WinMo phone. I suspect the phone's OS has a lot to do with this capability, and I haven't used Android long enough to know if it's up to the task; I suspect it will be, especially once the OS takes multi-cores into account.
If tomtom don't want to program their app for android, given the popularity of the platform, then its their loss TBH.
Going to Cyprus in a month or so and was wondering about SatNav as I'm hiring a car while we're there...
I was going to buy a 'block' of international data roaming that you can buy when on hols for the times when needing Internet access...but are there any cheaper short-term alternatives I shoulkd be thinking of?
Co-Pilot or Google Maps....??
Edit: CoPilot nor GM not coming up with any guidance for Cyprus!! This suprises me with the amount of people that head over to these type of holiday destinations, they could really be missing out on some serious revenue.... :-(
Don't forget that Google Maps is going offline soon!
engadget.com/2011/06/08/google-maps-navigation-to-go-offline-this-summer-garmin-and-tom I CANNOT POST LINKS YET
Quote "Dutch tech site All About Phones claims that Google Maps Navigation will get a true offline mode later this summer. In December the Android app received an update that cached routes and the surrounding areas, but without a data connection you still couldn't enter a new destination. A source inside the Dutch telco industry said that Goog would removing the requirement for coverage -- an obvious next step for the nav tool, especially with Ovi Maps bringing its turn-by-turn prowess to WP7. The move is also bound to be another thorn in the side of standalone GPS makers like Garmin and TomTom. After all, it's tough to compete with free."
Quarn said:
engadget.com/2011/06/08/google-maps-navigation-to-go-offline-this-summer-garmin-and-tom I CANNOT POST LINKS YET
Quote "Dutch tech site All About Phones claims that Google Maps Navigation will get a true offline mode later this summer. In December the Android app received an update that cached routes and the surrounding areas, but without a data connection you still couldn't enter a new destination. A source inside the Dutch telco industry said that Goog would removing the requirement for coverage -- an obvious next step for the nav tool, especially with Ovi Maps bringing its turn-by-turn prowess to WP7. The move is also bound to be another thorn in the side of standalone GPS makers like Garmin and TomTom. After all, it's tough to compete with free."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeh, it coudl put off some people from buying satnav apps or devices. However, I think it is more about functionality and paid apps could provide some more worth paying for.
Wanted to take up this CoPilot offer yesterday evening but was put off by poor reviews. People were complaining about the new version being not as good as the previous, problems with regestering and downloading maps. Still probably buy it over the weekend.
I have been using Sygic Aura for a while now, and the previous version since my Nokia 5800. The Aura version is a real eye-candy, super fast, 3D buildings, but the routing - at least in Brussels - can be a bit weird but it will get you there.
I installed Copilot Live Premium for Europe - the UI is not as nice as Sygic, but the routing seems more normal (for Brussels) - no better or worse than Google Navigation.
I Would like to see Garmin on my S2..
I Am using copilot on my S2 and it works very well....
TomTom - Dont go there!
TA123 said:
Yeh, it coudl put off some people from buying satnav apps or devices. However, I think it is more about functionality and paid apps could provide some more worth paying for.
Wanted to take up this CoPilot offer yesterday evening but was put off by poor reviews. People were complaining about the new version being not as good as the previous, problems with regestering and downloading maps. Still probably buy it over the weekend.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Got it yesterday, but only because of price reduction (EU 29 £)
The good:
Registration ... no problem
Download 4 GB maps ... no problem
Basic navigation ... no problem
The bad:
Missing integration with Contact (invoke navigation from within Contact Apps) ... embarrassing!
Facebook/Twitter crap ... annoying
POI import impossible (bug) ... annoying Edit: should be corrected http://getsatisfaction.com/copilotlive/topics/can_no_longer_add_pois_with_v9
Streetname text too small ... annoying
Hi must say that I am hoping that TomTom will come to Android. I use Co-Pilot and/or Google Navigation at the moment, and find that sometimes junctions get confusing, because the app doesn't zoom in sufficiently.
When I used to use TomTom on my old Windows Mobile Xperia X1, the program would zoom right in on junctions, making it easier to see where I need to go.
A few times on Co-Pilot/Google Navigation, I have got in a pickle on a Roundabout, meaning I have to around it twice to get the correct exit.
Does anyone else have this problem, and is anyone aware of a SatNav app that is as good as TomTom in this regard?
Cheers
Bcfaigg
TomTom is coming for Android
TomTom's Corrinne Vigreux (MD) says a TomTom app for Android is coming soon.
http://www.pocketgpsworld.com/We-Meet-TomToms-MD-Corinne-Vigreux-Before-Break-Free-Event-8910.php
HOWEVER she may be confusing it with Route66 which is coming for Android soon and is using TomTom maps (aka Tele-Atlas). As everyone knows - this is VERY far from the same thing. So lets hope she is not making such a crucial mistake.