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I'm a .NET server-side developer who's 100% new to PDA programming. I know the various SDKs exist but I haven't downloaded them or their associated emulators. I've skimmed the MS docs, but I haven't played with them to see what they can really do.
I'm looking for the sort-of opposite of an emulator.
We have PDA-connected software that we're demo-ing at a tradeshow. But the real demo is of the server-side stuff we've built; the PDA is essentially a dumb terminal using only its built-in browser & Outlook.
We need to run the demo on the real PDA but have the results visible to a large audience. So the goal is to somehow make the PDA's screen appear on our VGA projector that'll spray the image on the large screen behind the presenter.
Right now our first-cut plan is to have the PDA connected to a PC via the sync cradle. Then all we need is some software on either the PC or the PDA that'll drag the real-time screen image to the PC.
Does anyone know of such a program?
In the alternative, do the MS SDK emulators include the full functionality of a typical PDA, such as browser & Outlook so I can simply use the emulator and the PC's network connection to simulate the browser/Outlook & over-the-air connectivity, with no real PDA in the demo? The demo doesn't need any telephony capability, just TCP/IP connectivity.
If the emulators do have that capability, which one(s) do I need? There are a bunch of SDKs and emulators available & I don't really have time to grab them all and uninstall - reinstall hunting for the right one. We're looking for something that's American-market compatible and we don't much care which specific hardware device(s) it's emulating.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I'll return the favor somehow.
hi,
if you need to show the PDA acreen on your PC monitor then you can use aprogram called PPC controller.
it even anables you to control the PDA from the PC.
http://www.soti.net/
hope thats what you are looking for.
Thanks, that was EXACTLY what I was looking for.
It'll also be a big hit around here for a bunch of other uses. All that and inexpensive as well.
Thanks again, and the next time you have some server-side .NET headscratcher, send me a note. I owe you one.
Another option is the free powertoy for PocketPC MS Remote Desktop Control and Activesync.
If the device has Bluetooth like the XDA2 then you can ActiveSync using Bluetooth and the presenter can wander within about 10 meters of the PC with the bluetooth connection and teh projector.
Hey there, now that I've got my shiney new XDA Exec, with its VGA Screen and inbuilt Wi-fi I want to have a play with the Terminal Services Client to control my PC...I'm pretty sure that's what it can be used for right?
Well anyway from what I've read TSC can connect to (among other things) Win XP Pro computers with remote desktop enabled...however my computer only has XP Home so I can't do this, so can anyone recommend an alternative (possibly better?) program that I can use to control my XP Home PC using my XDA Exec....
cheers!
VNC (free)
GoToMyPC (not free)
There is more information in the "terminal services full screen" thread in this forum.
I have been using GoToMyPC for a long time. It's a subscription-based service. But I am happy with it. Very stable and functional. And full-screen.
prob with those apps is, terminal services connects to all modern windows operating systems and no extra software is needed, im not running round the country installing vnc onto everything, if its already got RDC/Terminal Services intergrated. On my work network i have access to 36k+ machines, yer 36,000 machines. all 2000,XP,2003, the other 30k machines are still NT or 98, upgrades aint a overnight thing!!!
so you see, not an option im afraid
*edit* what really grinds me is that i would have thought it was obvious to M$ that fullscreen should be an option, but as with the diabolical MSNM, the most obvious upgrades never appear, surlly in that groups aint a hard thing to do. and turn the bloody beeping off when ppl sign in.
Obvious things strategicly lost??
use www.logmein.com man its freakin great and you can use for free
if you put your device in landscape it is a clean view too
z2remote2pc works a little better than logmein, I think. A little more control of the desktop with z2. LogMeIn is nice though.
but do these apps use the RDC protocol ? i cannot amend 30k+ machines just to do remote desktop, it has to be compatible else its pretty useless to me soz
Carnivor, I presume your request is satisfied?
Why on earth 30,000 machines? Heyzus!
What PDA are you using?
V
30k machines is roughly the number of client machines the company i work for has. i have access to them all via TS, not that i need them all, i mainly access a handful of desktops that are mine, and the clients servers.
its quite handy to be able to wifi my desktop in the room next door when im standing at a rack in the server room as there is nothing but racks in there and an additional desktop in there would get easilly spotted.
im on a Jasjar btw, happy to test your app wink wink**
and i have VS 2005, is it poss for a 2003 project to be loaded into VS 2005 and compiled??? if you aint got it yet its a possibility
ps, ohh yes, im satisified, its what should have been done on theyre attempt ( M$ )
Carnivor - I have Visual Studio 2005 Beta 2. I'm waiting on RC1 because the tools I use in Beta 2 don't work properly on the WM5 emulator. As soon as I get a new version of VS2005, I'll sort through the WM5 issues and bang out a preliminary version for you guys to try.
The current version should still work nicely even on Wm5, but only in Portrait QVGA. However, a full landscape VGA version should follow soonish.
If you've got a spare VGA PDA, send it my way! I'm desperate :wink:
V
Microsoft Visual Studio 2005
Version 8.0.50727.42 (RTM.050727-4200)
Microsoft .NET Framework
Version 2.0.50727
thats the version i have
I have used the TSC in WM5 and it works fine, now thinking I would like full screen so looking at sl9 and Vijays full screen TSC, but I keep seeing lots about VNC too? What is it, any better than TSC or any worse?
Answers on a postcard please, or here will do, thanks
Simon
they work differntly, VNC is bitmap based ie it paints the picture of the remote screen, where TSC is vector based, it dosent paint the screen, it uses coordinates of items etc, ie, desktop colour, startmenu, its all cached on your machine, so in effect, the more you use it the faster it will get.
so if bandwidth is no issue then its your choice of what you use, but where there are speed issues, then tsc will probably be far more efficient.
i use TSC clients for, probably, 14hrs a day at hone and at work, and at work using servers at home, all TSC based and Tivoli another bitmap based product we use appears to suffer greatly compared to TSC, you know, were all tsc'ing to home whilst were at work, and its 10 to 1 faster than tivoli.
its only my theories based on usage
I would mostly agree - TSC is more GDI object based, client server, where the PDA does most of the rendering. VNC is mostly brute force screen copying.
The beauty of VNC is that you can use it against many more devices - Win95, Linux, Macs etc. TSC needs a dedicated terminal service on the other end that may not even be installable on your home machine.
Could someone please point me to sl9's full screen TSC client. I cannot find it anywhere.
Thanks
-Rob
what also works like a charm is logmein.com. you need to install software on your desktop, then login the logmein page on your pda and you're clear to go. the software on the MDA also autoscales the desktop to 640*480 (and back when you're finished). free aswell.
I use logmein to surf etc when at work, perfect to have an 5 Mb connection available on my MDA
I generally agree with what has been said. Most of my work involves remote administration of servers. I use as a first choice on desktop a program called Radmin, unfortunately this is not available on PPC. Radmin is very similar to VNC but is much faster and also supports file transfer and command prompt only.
But what has not been said about this type of software, VNC/Radmin is it allows you to run multiple clients viewing the same session. This is great for training and seeking help on a problem with third parties. So i do sometimes use VNC on the Universal, but only if i need to share a session.
TSC on the other hand will open a fresh session and allow, depending on the version of OS on the destination machine allow multiple independant sessions. I do use a lot of TSC sessions on my desktop as well.
Regarding letmein never really appealed to me. Dont really want a third party running my sessions for me and to be honest see no advantage in it. But i guess for me I have external ip adreses everywhere so i guess that helps. I can log to my hone PC or office and othe rsite networks from any where in the world over a 2/3g connection on the universal anyway.
But maybe i am missing something regarding using letmein to gain speed, if you have an office network with 5mb connectionwhy not just connect directly to your office on the TSC on the univrersal, why do you need letmein? the main portal i use for TSC is a server in a COLO of mine with a burstable GB ethernet connection directly into a tier 1 ISP and the bottleneck here is actually the speed it takes for the screen to be drwawn on the universal and the connection to the server.
Also be warned that TSC on the 2/3g connection can chew a lot of BW. When i was doing a lot of this i was getting a new orange connection every 3 months and getting the free 1gb per month for the first 3 months with orange(£25 permonth). on a sim only deal with no phone on the lowest 3g package. Worked out as £55 per month when you add the 9 months at £10 for 1gb per moonth with 200 free mins. Then after 3 months change it to a 2g off peak only deal at £10 per month. or use it as a second phone.
At any time i might have upto 6 remote sessions active, but it can get very weird when running full screen TSC on your desktop as you some times end up in a lop going from one server to another then another and back to the first one again with out realising. It has the similar effect to lokiing into one mirror with an identical mirror behind it and creating a series of cascading views. Can be abit wierd sometimes, especially when you start telnetting from one command prompt on one machine into something like a cisco and then right back to where you started. I know this sounds crazy but if you have a work station with twin 21" lcd monitors with 1200x1600 displays and 4 gb of ram at the end of a 12 hour session I often end up with in the order of 60+ windows open over my destop. And that does not include the windows open on all of the remote desktops!
I think i lost it a bit in the post there towards the end but i think you get the picture.
Charlie
i have the new ROM and i am registered with LOGMEIN.com (a remote desktop/file tran etc site), its all free to use and it works perfectly with the universal, you can zoom in or have the desktop fit to screen (best in landscape mode), its so easy, i can connect throw our corp filewall, ive tested it connecting to XP Pro SP2 and also Server 2003, both look so good on the phone :lol:
Has anyone else tryed this site or anyone have the full account (have to pay for that) so i can see if its worth buying (not that you ever have too)
echo that, I think it's a fantastic service!
This is amazing - it even suppots duel monitors.
I agree!
It certainly made my life easier. No more USB key!
I tried the following before settling to Logmein Free:
1. GotomyPC - Excellent speed and interface but very expensive for private users.
2. WebEx - very good, slower than GotomyPC, much cheaper.
3. Logmein Pro - Identical to Logmein Free but extra features such as File Transfer, Print to local printer.
I would say even if you are fairly competent at setting up your own remote access using other software, Logmein free is still worth a look.
P.S. The place where I work has a Plasma display(Wifi connected)that needs to be changed almost on a daily basis. I do this by Logmein to my office computer and use VNC from my office computer to update it!
I discovered it a few months ago and it's fantastic. I am not decided yet on whether to upgrade to Pro, though if I did the only reason really would be the filesharing option.
VNC was my previous choice, but it's much slower - even when connecting over the local network. With logmein I can be sat on the sofa at home, controlling the PC upstairs and chatting on MSN. I've also used it from work to control the home PC. I can't believe how fast it is.
Cheers
Ant
my girlfriend uses it at wrk as msn etc and a forum she goes to is blocked, howvever she uses og me in to use or computer to use msn and go to her forums etc lol
how is this different from the remote desktop feature that is built into windows xp?
jab1a said:
i have the new ROM and i am registered with LOGMEIN.com (a remote desktop/file tran etc site), its all free to use and it works perfectly with the universal, you can zoom in or have the desktop fit to screen (best in landscape mode), its so easy, i can connect throw our corp filewall, ive tested it connecting to XP Pro SP2 and also Server 2003, both look so good on the phone :lol:
Has anyone else tryed this site or anyone have the full account (have to pay for that) so i can see if its worth buying (not that you ever have too)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hold on, it's free and fantastic? What's the catch??
OK, just installed it.
This folks, is FANTASTIC.
If I forget to start my downloads after I've left for work, no problems. Just log onto my PC and start the program!
Id I need a file from my PC, just log into Outlook and email it, to myself!
Wow, just WOW. And p1ss easy to set up.
Anyone know what the data throughput it - I'm gonna test it now with 3G on, instead of through Wifi - hopefully the speed will still be decent, but I don't want to be stung for huge data download charges.
EDIT: Speed via GPRS and 3G is still well usable.
What a find OP!
How do i access it using opera browser from my pda, it seems that logmein only work with IE, but is seems that there is nothing on the screen.. do i need to install java for it? where can i get this java apps..?
thxs
Hmm ja very strange, in opera and PIE I get the same message, saying "A Windows Pocket PC 2003 or newer is required...." and then asks you to download some "downgrade" CAB...which I install but it still doesnt work neither IE or Opera... Im a bit clueless what the problem is since the FAQ also doesnt mention anything about that.
Edit: Ok, after a reset of the universal it works. Speed is pretty lame over GPRS but what can you expect...its for free and its great. I can even control my Linux machine via VNC from the Windows Remote machine that I access via Logme in...Thanks a lot for that great tip!
I have used both Remote Desktop (the server is built into Windows XP PRO and Windows 2003) and LogMeIn.com.
Remote Desktop doesn't have a full screen mode.
Remote Desktop is faster. But, since my computer is behind a wireless router, I wasn't able to make it work - no matter how I configure the router, it can't connect.
So I use LogMeIn.com, the free version. It's slower but it has a full screen mode. I have absolutely no problems related to the firewall (wireless router). It just works.
Absolutely fantastic.
I use logmein pro for my 'always on' HTPC and the free version for our laptop. It is, quite simply, wonderful.
Runs well from my work network and my trusty Himalaya. I wonder if there is a way to use it to set up an activesync alternative to get around the lack of wifi support now :?:
Been using this since September last year. Awesome product and I still can't believe it's free.
excuse me, but using it with netfront 3.3 or opera 8.5 it just permit me file transfer. non desktop control!
what am i doing wrong?
i'm accessing it with a jasjar
lucazaffiro said:
excuse me, but using it with netfront 3.3 or opera 8.5 it just permit me file transfer. non desktop control!
what am i doing wrong?
i'm accessing it with a jasjar
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Since you have IE on the handheld anyhoew, think of your IE exclusively as your interface for LogmeIn.
belfast-biker said:
lucazaffiro said:
excuse me, but using it with netfront 3.3 or opera 8.5 it just permit me file transfer. non desktop control!
what am i doing wrong?
i'm accessing it with a jasjar
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Since you have IE on the handheld anyhoew, think of your IE exclusively as your interface for LogmeIn.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes but from my desktop i see a lot of oppotunity to use my "controlled" pc. with NETFRONT i see just the option "file transfer". with opera after installing a specific cab i'm not allowed to connect
any hint?
that is strange but i can only think that it has something to do with the way those 2 bits of software handle ActiveX, IE is very good at it, the last person was right, just think of ~IE as your excusive logmein.com browser for remote desktop, its a hardship but somethings you have to live with :wink:
You should be aware that this service exposes you to being hacked, it uses SSL to encrypt between LOGMEIN.com & your PC & PDA but has to unencript all the data on the LOGMEIN.com server as you can't have back to back SSL connections.
Anyone hacking the server would be able to connect to your PC or PDA as if they were you.
Suggest at the very least that you don't leave an open connection & have a short timeout to a login screen on your PC.
Mike
Its a great bit of software.... I havent really played around with any other software like this, but this seems to do the job for me quite well....
i do however agree with the security issue... Yes you are opening a potential hole in your security albeit a very small one
I'm running WM6 (and WM5 behaved the same way) Remote Desktop and need the desktop resolution of 1024x768. I understand I will do some scrolling because of the native 640x480. I'll just do quite a bit less than on my 8525 (TyTn).
The 8525 and the Athena give me the same server desktop size. On the 8525 I get scroll bars to scroll around the 640x480 virtual desktop using it's 320x240 screen. On the Athena I get the 640x480 desktop and no scrolling. Nice but since the program on the server needs 1024x768 I'm still stuck. Is there anyway to set the resolution like on the desktop version of the Remote Desktop Client? The only option is "fit remote desktop to screen" on the Athena.
I monitor multiple servers and some of the management tools need bigger than 640x480. My whole organization is Remote Desktop so installing another remote control system is not an option.
you can use vnc insted
Can't use VNC
hammermedia said:
....... the management tools need bigger than 640x480. My whole organization is Remote Desktop so installing another remote control system is not an option.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have 20 servers in our environment and installing VNC would be a chore not to mention. I don't like to install ANYTHING on production servers. Hence the need for 1024x768 in RDP.
It's odd that 320x240 allows you to scroll to 640x480 but no other resolution is available for 640x480.
By the way I love the old VNC. I used to use it on my PDQ Smartphone by Kyocera running Palm OS in 2001. Back then it would allow scaling. It seems silly that RDP can't do the same.
hammermedia said:
I have 20 servers in our environment and installing VNC would be a chore not to mention. I don't like to install ANYTHING on production servers. Hence the need for 1024x768 in RDP.
It's odd that 320x240 allows you to scroll to 640x480 but no other resolution is available for 640x480.
By the way I love the old VNC. I used to use it on my PDQ Smartphone by Kyocera running Palm OS in 2001. Back then it would allow scaling. It seems silly that RDP can't do the same.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
qvga screens have to allow scrolling otherwise the application would be unusable! Is there any way to scale your applications at the server end to be compliant with VGA resolution? what issues does it throw up? As far as I know VNC is your only alternative. You could try running remote desktop in portrait mode to see if that helps your cause any....
shame there's no application to allow resolution interpolation (as seen on 800 by 480 oqo UMPCs) this might 'trick' the remote desktop client into thinking it was running on a 1024 by 768 display and scale it accordingly.
I think I'm talking rubbish. Anyway maybe remote desktop client has a set resolution that it scales to: i.e. 640*480.
NYDITOT
I know Nyditot used to work on my ipaq but it's functionality on WM 6 is another story.
Does anyone have any experience with it on the Athena other than:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=1379191&postcount=1
The following link gives hope:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=1787128&postcount=11
The mocha client mentions that they didn't use higher resoutions because of licensing concerns and Microsoft. Bummer.
Vijay555 says the 640x480 resolution is hardcoded.
Does anyone have a microsoft contact to find out if there is an update coming in WM 6.1 / WM 7?
I had this working fine with the latest nyditot (you have to reboot with the keyboard disconnected) but dropped it when I went to the far far far superior Z2software remote 2PC
i used vnc from desktops but tinyvnc client connected without problems to windows RDP.(but colors is little shaped compared to ms rdp client)
in my sight your problem is good rdp client software.. try vnc, sources available maybe you can even find or implement rdp desktop image software zoom on pda.
Sort of ...
I did this yesterday, I RDP'd to a PC and then from there RDP'd to the server I needed access to. The PC connected to the server with a 1024 x 768 connection, so with scrolling I was able to move around the remote server's screen.
Not perfect by any means, but it does the job if needed.
ice_coffee said:
I had this working fine with the latest nyditot (you have to reboot with the keyboard disconnected) but dropped it when I went to the far far far superior Z2software remote 2PC
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
where you using Real VGA? If so did you have to go back to standard resolution reset then start nyditot then reset?
I have the same problem. My servers use 1024x768 resolution and many things dont work well with only a 640x480 desktop (which is what I get with Remote Desktop Mobile). I did try the mocha one and it works a little better, but only allows up to 800x600. I need one that supports at least 1024x768, anyone know of a RDP mobile client that would support 1024x768?
wildcard said:
I have the same problem. My servers use 1024x768 resolution and many things dont work well with only a 640x480 desktop (which is what I get with Remote Desktop Mobile). I did try the mocha one and it works a little better, but only allows up to 800x600. I need one that supports at least 1024x768, anyone know of a RDP mobile client that would support 1024x768?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes www.z2software.com supports what ever res your computer is running and gives you the option to zoom in to 640X480 or closer
@hammermedia, yes I was using real VGA it worked well all you had to do, when first activiating nyditot reboot with the keyboard disconnected ! and when you get into Remote desktop go into the settings and tick "FULL SCREEN" and "FIT REMOTE DESKTOP TO SCREEN"
I will suggest to check the LOGMEIN professional solutions ( www.logmein.com, the IT reach solution or the PRO solution. May be you will discover also that the FREE solution is enought ).
Test them for free.
I managed a medium sized IT company and the remote production machines management is ALWAYS a pain in.... and no solution is the "final solution".
In Logmein I love the resolution settings, (I use 800x600 resized on athena) and the settings to improve the speed and screen size on-the-fly
In 1024x768 on the athena I use the external mouse and just moving it in the corner the screen it scrolls in the direction needed, and is really fast.
The client is an IE or pocket IE plugin (firefox client available)
sergiopi said:
I will suggest to check the LOGMEIN professional solutions ( www.logmein.com, the IT reach solution or the PRO solution. May be you will discover also that the FREE solution is enought ).
Test them for free.
I managed a medium sized IT company and the remote production machines management is ALWAYS a pain in.... and no solution is the "final solution".
In Logmein I love the resolution settings, (I use 800x600 resized on athena) and the settings to improve the speed and screen size on-the-fly
In 1024x768 on the athena I use the external mouse and just moving it in the corner the screen it scrolls in the direction needed, and is really fast.
The client is an IE or pocket IE plugin (firefox client available)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Another thumbs-up on LogMeIn. I use the free version for home and the "Pro" version for work, which allows more features like file transfer. It allows resetting the resolution on the host, then scaling the display (auto or a certain percent) on the Athena so you can get optimal control. The touchscreen sends mouse events. Very usable.
ice_coffee said:
Yes www.z2software.com supports what ever res your computer is running and gives you the option to zoom in to 640X480 or closer
@hammermedia, yes I was using real VGA it worked well all you had to do, when first activiating nyditot reboot with the keyboard disconnected ! and when you get into Remote desktop go into the settings and tick "FULL SCREEN" and "FIT REMOTE DESKTOP TO SCREEN"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just checked it out, it doesn't look like it's RDP. Are there any RDP mobile clients that support 1024x768 resolution?
wildcard said:
Just checked it out, it doesn't look like it's RDP. Are there any RDP mobile clients that support 1024x768 resolution?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it's true that it does not use MS remote desktop, it uses there own s/ware but it is truly excellent ! far superior to the MS stuff
Do any solutions offer remote sound so that I can hear my pc's sound on my phone? I've tried LogMeIn, the Z2 app, and the normal MS RD. None of them will actually let me hear the sound of my desktop (i.e. if I play a music file). LogMeIn says it supports remote sound on the Pro version, but I tried it, and it must only work with other desktop pc's and not pocket pc's.
if you want to listen to music from your computer at home, I suggest you install ORB as it is free of charges and excellent ! (+ you can watch videos from home too)
The sound quality over RDP is poor and scratchy, it is also buffered badly
How about this one: http://www.zatelnet.com/zadesktop/main.php
Haven't tried it so no idea, but it does say it supports 1024x768 over RDP
excellent
i have just started using LogMeIn for remote desktop, it is significantly better than RDP although requires a bit of set up.
for remote admin and access to standard windows apps from the Athena it is really very good.
Mocha
I installed the Mocha client and it works pretty good for 800x600.
The whole point of RDP is that it's standard on Windows PC's and it works well in low bandwidth much better than VNC. Don't get me wrong, I love VNC and have been using it for almost 10 years on my home PC.
However, I have a dozen Windows servers that must run 24 hours a day and I don't install ANYTHING on them if I can help it. It's a matter of stability.