The phone (Mi Mix 5g) is struggling to go into deep sleep and occasionally registers 0% in accubattery stats (for 'deep sleep'). I have followed all the guides and threads posted here and tinkered with all the obvious settings. The phone is not rooted and running stable android 9 MIUI 10. Sometimes I get 98% deep sleep which is what I am looking for, other times I get 40-60% (not acceptable) and other times 0%. I have installed Greenify to try and shutdown apps but something seems to be hampering it, everything is greenified accept battery stats and Nova. I do get a notification on greenify to say that the screen lock was to fast for greenify to operate but I cannot see any setting in MIUI10 to change the time between sleep and turning off the screen (although I do remember seeing this on previous android versions).
Any clues as to what is causing this and how I could go about diagnostics to see what service/app is causing the issue.? As i said before I have tried hard reset, soft reset before sleep and all the settings outlined in previous posts here on the forum. One possible issue is poor reception inside the house which causes it to jump bands regularly, could this be waking the phone up in deep sleep?
eagerly awaiting your suggestions.
Might be good play services. Have you tried stopping them and erasing the data?
Sent from my Mi MIX 3 using Tapatalk
PWn3R said:
Might be good play services. Have you tried stopping them and erasing the data?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for your reply, I had seen this and cleared the cache of the play services as mentioned in another thread. Did not seem to have any noticeable effect for me.
Small update for anyone experiencing similar woes. I changed the setting in clear recent apps from 'after 10 mins' to 'never' which seems to have had effect, since this I have been getting multiple +60% deep sleep figures. Reset the phone yesterday evening which produced 96% deep sleep result. This is acceptable and what we are seeking however resetting the phone nightly is not.
Update.
I have resolved this by going into data usage - system apps and clearing the cash of the top data users. Also clear cache on play services and play store. I am now achieving deep sleep in the region of 90-100% of screen off time.
pow01 said:
Update.
I have resolved this by going into data usage - system apps and clearing the cash of the top data users. Also clear cache on play services and play store. I am now achieving deep sleep in the region of 90-100% of screen off time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Additional update.
The problem appears to be intermittent and requires regular maintenance using the steps above combined with soft reset.
Related
Hi! Was anyone around here able to FIX deep sleep reboot problems on Koshu's otherwise amazing CM10 ROM for TPT?
From what I could gather and observe on my TPT, the reboot in deep sleep occurs when the device is approx. 30 minutes in deep sleep - actually I'd say EXACTLY after 30 minutes, but I can't back that up with any solid evidence. However I managed to wake device after 28 minutes and 31 seconds after going to deep sleep (according to CPU Spy). Another "test" strengthened my suspicion: I turned off the screen today at 19:36 and at about 20:11 a reboot occurred (device usually waits about 3-4 minutes before going to deep sleep, so the 30 minutes figure fits right in).
I'm 100% positive that the problem is connected to deep sleep, since after I installed and set up "Wake Lock" app with PARTIAL_WAKE_LOCK setting, which prevents CPU from entering deep sleep, reboots stopped. I get similar results with the "Soft Locker Free" app. (Hope this workaround might help some of you out there.)
However I'm asking if anyone has found any FIX, since Wake Lock / Soft Locker workaround increases battery drain, since CPU is not going into deep sleep anymore. Or some less battery-draining workaround - I was thinking about an app that could periodically (lets say every 25 minutes) wake CPU from deep sleep for few seconds? (I'm sorry if that's not possible or is a stupid idea, I'm quite new to the whole "Android business", haven't programmed any app and my TPT was the first device rooted / flashed and that happened just a few days ago.)
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Should Koshu stumble upon this post (since I can't post to dev forums just yet), this is the information I can give you right now:
Pre-install Android: Stock ICS
Device version: ROW (without 3G)
ROM version: v.0.8.1
CWM version: 6.0.1.2
CM version: 10-20121015-UNOFFICIAL-IndigoF
Build: cm_IndigoF-userdebug 4.1.2 JZO54K eng.koshu.20121015. 172049 test-keys
My installation procedure:
- wipe data / factory reset
- wipe cache
- wipe dalvik
- wipe battery stats
- format /system
- format /sectmp
- flash ROM .zip from internal sd card
- flash 3G update from internal sd card (just to be sure that this doesn't somehow fix the deep sleep problem)
- wipe data / factory reset
- wipe dalvik
- fix permissions
I'm happy to provide any other data from my device, but I'm afraid you'd have to help me on how to get them.
I have the exact same problem. Reboots exactly 30 minutes. I have a ROW 64GB with Ericsson 3G.
Edit: I seem to have resolved the problem by setting keep Wi-Fi on during sleep to "Always".
I have exactly the same problem. I'll try the "always" option. Btw, does anyone know if there's a reason for the region setting being automatically set to Europe?
- Thanks for the suggestion, I'll try the "wifi always on" setting ASAP and post results.
- I am from Europe, so I haven't noticed this (and I unfortunately I have no clue why that happens).
Sent from my ThinkPadTablet using xda app-developers app
This issue occurred for me frequently when I initially flashed CM10. The tablet would essentially turn off after what I observed to be 30 minutes or so, requiring the tablet to be booted up again from off.
I have not had this issue for about 1 week after I reflashed the ROM. Formatting the system in recovery seemed to do the trick. The steps I took are as follows (which you have seem to have done as well with additional steps):
Wipe cache
Wipe data (factory reset)
Wipe dalvik cache
In Advanced Options, format system
Flash ROM
Wipe cache
Wipe data
Reboot
Also I set wifi to always
Hope this helps.
Did a little bit of testing. Its not in the installation procedure, its in the wifi settings. Managed to get 36 and later 33 minutes of deep sleep with "Wifi always on" setting and all CPU locking apps disabled without any reboot. Will do another test during the night for a longer period of deep sleep, but I think you helped me get a prefect workaround (AFAIK this wifi setting should not significantly increase battery drain) and I might say that a fix is not even needed now (at least for me). Thanks again to everyone.
Sent from my ThinkPadTablet using xda app-developers app
Michael Bloodspell said:
Did a little bit of testing. Its not in the installation procedure, its in the wifi settings. Managed to get 36 and later 33 minutes of deep sleep with "Wifi always on" setting and all CPU locking apps disabled without any reboot. Will do another test during the night for a longer period of deep sleep, but I think you helped me get a prefect workaround (AFAIK this wifi setting should not significantly increase battery drain) and I might say that a fix is not even needed now (at least for me). Thanks again to everyone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Glad it helped. WIFI should always be set to on anyway so you get notifications. Not sure why the default is off.
To be honest I didn't even know about this setting - never tinkered with wifi settings before and I would have never even dreamed about this being the issue causing deep sleep reboots.
And I can further confirm that this indeed was the cause of reboots, since I got sweet 3 hours 11 minutes of deep sleep since I last turned off the screen about 3 hours and 15 minutes ago with only 3% of battery drained, which is almost a miracle compared to nearly 15% with cpu locks and about 25% with reboots for the same period of time.
Glad to hear you got the issue resolved
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda app-developers app
Thanks for posting this :good:, I was stuck with this issue for a while.
stupid question probably, but where to are the settings for wifi always on?
Sent from my ThinkPadTablet using xda app-developers app
Go to Settings, then Wifi. There you can see three dots in a column (usually symbol for "more settings" in apps). Click on it and a menu will appear, where you can see the "Advanced" option. The rest is really easy.
Sent from my ThinkPadTablet using xda app-developers app
Is anyone having trouble with deep sleep after update of Google Play Services 5.0.77 ?
I've installed the apk from android police and since then my deep sleep is gone. Fortunatelly i've identified the trouble and uninstalled the version, but i would like to know if anyone else had trouble with this update.
Note: I've tried to install it many times and it always vanishes my deep sleep.
prog19 said:
Is anyone having trouble with deep sleep after update of Google Play Services 5.0.77 ?
I've installed the apk from android police and since then my deep sleep is gone. Fortunatelly i've identified the trouble and uninstalled the version, but i would like to know if anyone else had trouble with this update.
Note: I've tried to install it many times and it always vanishes my deep sleep.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My phone (Nexus 5, Cyanogenmod 11 M7) update Google Play Services automatically to 5.0.84 and I've had the same issue. Over the course of today, it's used a good deal of my battery and prevented my phone from sleeping. I've tried changing my location settings, disabling wi-fi (and wi-fi location) and nothing seems to allow my phone to sleep.
I remember having this problem before, but I was thinking that I simply restarted it to fix it. That's not doing anything this time.
This is working for me on CM11 M7. Install Disable Service then go to "system apps" > "Google Play Services" and check "SystemUpdateService".
I tried disabling location services and related settings one at a time to try to figure out what exactly was causing the problem, but none of that worked. Eventually I uninstalled the updates to Google Play Services and that let my phone go back into deep sleep. After that, I re-enabled my settings, one at a time, to see if one of them triggered the problem again. Fortunately, I've enabled everything that I had before and my phone seems to be deep sleeping like normal.
Once again note that I am using a Nexus 5 rather than a 4, but I would think that the solution could work on both.
I am coming from a Droid Turbo - best phone I ever had -and never had any issues with it. Perfect right from the start.
I now have a DT2 and I get this immense battery drain at random times. The phone runs super hot and the drain is equivalent to 1% per minute. REAL BAD!
I even had the phone replaced and the problem persisted, so I know it's not a hardware issue.
The drain goes away in safe mode as well. So it must be software!
I've dwindled everything down with no positive results.
So I started looking at GSAM to get better stats on the battery.
It's showing Google Services eating up all of my battery with gmail trailing close behind.
So I look at my accounts and they seem to be constantly syncing. As soon as one stops, the other starts and they keep cycling like that.
All of my accounts are set to Push and I have very few items in my account checked off to sync.
Just the basics like people details, mail, calendar, contacts, google keep and g+. Everything else is turned off.
FYI, I also have an exchange account on there set to push and am on the latest Marshmallow update.
I've attached 3 screenshots to help visualize what's going on.
The most notable one is the standard batter app. The big dip is when the phone started getting hot and draining.
Does anyone know whats happening or how to fix it? I never had this problem with my original Droid Turbo, even with the same accounts.
wow, nothing so far?
dragonash said:
wow, nothing so far?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe it's syncing too often ? Try to limit permissions for Google apps , or turn off data sync for a while and check if that fix it
Finally someone with the same problem as me. I've noticed the exact same behavior in Gmail (constant rotating sync which makes the phone hot and kills battery). However, Gmail doesn't show up in my battery stats as a battery drain, which is strange - but I do see Google Services. Unfortunately I have no permanent solution, but clearing the cache AND data for the gmail app solved the problem for about a week. Now it's back again. I have 7 google accounts in my phone, but sync is turned on for only 4.
Looking at other forums, many say that google play services is the cause, but I haven't been able to find any solid answers other than "restart", "clear cache/data", or the dreaded "factory reset". I hate having to factory reset to solve problems. Hopefully someone else who has had the same issue, or maybe someone who knows what's going on can help us troubleshoot.
cromag.rickman said:
Finally someone with the same problem as me. I've noticed the exact same behavior in Gmail (constant rotating sync which makes the phone hot and kills battery). However, Gmail doesn't show up in my battery stats as a battery drain, which is strange - but I do see Google Services. Unfortunately I have no permanent solution, but clearing the cache AND data for the gmail app solved the problem for about a week. Now it's back again. I have 7 google accounts in my phone, but sync is turned on for only 4.
Looking at other forums, many say that google play services is the cause, but I haven't been able to find any solid answers other than "restart", "clear cache/data", or the dreaded "factory reset". I hate having to factory reset to solve problems. Hopefully someone else who has had the same issue, or maybe someone who knows what's going on can help us troubleshoot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've contacted Motorola and they just want to give me a new phone. I'm on my 3rd from Verizon.
And yes, it is Google Services causing the issue as that operates a load of apps. However, we need greater details. If we got root on the phone, GSAM might be able to get more detailed information on the drain or the real app causing it.
Unfortunately, it looks like it's a Marshmallow bug.
Here are 2 work arounds that do not include clearing cache or factory resetting.
If you notice it getting hot,
1: toggle airplane mode until it cools
2: Download an autosync toggle widget to turn on/off sync
I do #2.
After about 20 minutes, Pandora keeps closing. Battery management for the app is off. I've tried uninstalling, restarting the phone, but nothing has helped.
Is anyone else experiencing this?
Yep. Already tried turning off battery optimizing for pandora and giving it the proper permissions.... I suspect it is due to oos aggressive battery mgmt
This is a sign from the Universe to switch to Spotify. You have bright futures ahead.
Experiencing the same. Very annoying.
you guys figure this out?
I've had the same issue with Google Play Music. The only solution I have found so far is to lock the app in memory. After that, I've never had issues with it just closing randomly.
No issues at all with Pandora. I'm on 9.0.11. I have the app set to optimize, but I've got adaptive battery turned off because reasons.
I experience this all the time with the direct from Oneplus 6T. However, my wife's T-mobile 6T doesn't do this. What the heck?
I'm on 9.0.11, still does this with Pandora despite turning off battery optimisation and adaptive battery...has anyone else figured this out yet?
No issues here. May be Pandora's problem. Maybe they need to fix the app.
Pandora stops after 20 minutes ~
Was experiencing the same thing. I turned my background restriction off under battery usage, seems to be fixed on mine now. Nope shut down again
Apps stop working fix on armor phone. Mine is armor 6E
Press app main button near your home button. Then you can either swipe away running apps or press one of the two buttons which are clear all, or go into running apps settings (same screen, not main settings). This allows you to either have all apps stop after a certain time or individually have apps turn off automatically once screen times out after a certain amount of time. I hope this helps! Took me forever to find.
woflx said:
No issues here. May be Pandora's problem. Maybe they need to fix the app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with this post. I also noticed that when using pandora while using the waze navigation app that you can skip or pause but, are not able to replay a song. I have contacted both pandora and, waze about this issue and, they just blame each other. In the end no fix. I have pandora plus btw
I understand this may only help a few people, but what fixed it for me was going to settings > battery > adaptive battery > restricted apps... And then removing Pandora (from the list I forgot I added it to, upon the phone's prior suggestion)
Hi all,
from yesterday on I encounter an abnormal battery drain (15% in about 30 min) while doing nothing with the screen turned off. The Phone gets very warm. Rebooting doesn't help. Does anybody know this problem or can help me with a solution?
Best regards
sporc10 said:
Hi all,
from yesterday on I encounter an abnormal battery drain (15% in about 30 min) while doing nothing with the screen turned off. The Phone gets very warm. Rebooting doesn't help. Does anybody know this problem or can help me with a solution?
Best regards
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
did it happen after you updated/installed an app? Then it's probably a bug in app.
Have a look at settings
check "battery usage" (tap 3dots to incl system apps)
check "memory used by apps"
crack "running services"
any app stand out an using more resources than normal?
I checked the battery usage, but there wasn't any strange entries.
Where do I check the running services?
I ended up with a factory reset and charged the phone to 100% in the evening, the next morning(today) it was totally empty and turned off.
sporc10 said:
I checked the battery usage, but there wasn't any strange entries.
Where do I check the running services?
I ended up with a factory reset and charged the phone to 100% in the evening, the next morning(today) it was totally empty and turned off.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you need to turn on developer options, go to settings> about phone and then tap build number until you are a dev. Then back out to settings then system> advanced> developer options and you should see the running services & also check memory. Is there anything that looks out of place? I used to use cpu monitoring app eg Trepn which could show how much cpu was bring used, but they just seem to work with Android Pie
if nothing stands out boot into safe mode so your downloaded apps don't run & see if battery drains. If not then you have a bad app.
IronRoo said:
you need to turn on developer options, go to settings> about phone and then tap build number until you are a dev. Then back out to settings then system> advanced> developer options and you should see the running services & also check memory. Is there anything that looks out of place? I used to use cpu monitoring app eg Trepn which could show how much cpu was bring used, but they just seem to work with Android Pie
if nothing stands out boot into safe mode so your downloaded apps don't run & see if battery drains. If not then you have a bad app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In safe mode I can observe the same strange battery drain (without usage, even in flightmode!).
These are the running processes right now (not in safemode, cellular on, wifi off):
- com.qualcomm.qcrilmsgtunnel
- com.google.android.ims
- Google Play:
- CollectionService
- GmsCoreStatsService
- EmergencyPersistentService
- DeviceConnectionWatcherService
- LockScreenService
- GoogleLocationService
- GoogleLocationManagerService
- ClearcutDebugDumpService
- GcmService
- com.google.android.gms.persistent
- com.google.android.googlequicksearchbox:search
- com.google.android.ext.services
- com.google.android.inputmethod.latin
I am on the newest official build: PPR1.181005.099
sporc10 said:
In safe mode I can observe the same strange battery drain (without usage, even in flightmode!).
These are the running processes right now (not in safemode, cellular on, wifi off):
- com.qualcomm.qcrilmsgtunnel
- com.google.android.ims
- Google Play:
- CollectionService
- GmsCoreStatsService
- EmergencyPersistentService
- DeviceConnectionWatcherService
- LockScreenService
- GoogleLocationService
- GoogleLocationManagerService
- ClearcutDebugDumpService
- GcmService
- com.google.android.gms.persistent
- com.google.android.googlequicksearchbox:search
- com.google.android.ext.services
- com.google.android.inputmethod.latin
I am on the newest official build: PPR1.181005.099
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've had battery drain issues in the past on many devices including the PH-1. I recently was noticing a larger than normal drain on my battery while my phone was idle. One of the tricks I've done to resolve my battery drain issue was to open Settings -> Apps & Notifications -> See all [insert number] apps. Click the vertical ellipsis in the upper right corner and click the option "Show system".
First I clicked on Google Play Store. I clicked Force stop, then clicked on Storage. I clicked Clear cache then Clear storage (then clicked yes to the prompt). Click back to go back to the list of apps and select Google Play services. I did not have a force stop option so I clicked Storage, Clear cache. Next I selected Google Play Framework. I clicked Force stop, then went to Storage. I clicked Clear cache then Clear storage (then clicked yes to the prompt). Once this was complete I rebooted my phone and let it idle. I observed how much drain per hour I was getting and it was back to draining around 1% per hour.
If that doesn't help, sometimes it can be Google running the backup procedure in the background. You can try to temporarily disable it in Settings -> System -> Advanced -> Backup. Depending on your preferences you can decide if turning it off permanently is best for you, otherwise don't forget to turn it back on after observing your battery drain.
sporc10 said:
In safe mode I can observe the same strange battery drain (without usage, even in flightmode!).
These are the running processes right now (not in safemode, cellular on, wifi off):
- com.qualcomm.qcrilmsgtunnel
- com.google.android.ims
- Google Play:
- CollectionService
- GmsCoreStatsService
- EmergencyPersistentService
- DeviceConnectionWatcherService
- LockScreenService
- GoogleLocationService
- GoogleLocationManagerService
- ClearcutDebugDumpService
- GcmService
- com.google.android.gms.persistent
- com.google.android.googlequicksearchbox:search
- com.google.android.ext.services
- com.google.android.inputmethod.latin
I am on the newest official build: PPR1.181005.099
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looks good. Btux I right, try his suggestions
btux81 said:
I've had battery drain issues in the past on many devices including the PH-1. I recently was noticing a larger than normal drain on my battery while my phone was idle. One of the tricks I've done to resolve my battery drain issue was to open Settings -> Apps & Notifications -> See all [insert number] apps. Click the vertical ellipsis in the upper right corner and click the option "Show system".
First I clicked on Google Play Store. I clicked Force stop, then clicked on Storage. I clicked Clear cache then Clear storage (then clicked yes to the prompt). Click back to go back to the list of apps and select Google Play services. I did not have a force stop option so I clicked Storage, Clear cache. Next I selected Google Play Framework. I clicked Force stop, then went to Storage. I clicked Clear cache then Clear storage (then clicked yes to the prompt). Once this was complete I rebooted my phone and let it idle. I observed how much drain per hour I was getting and it was back to draining around 1% per hour.
If that doesn't help, sometimes it can be Google running the backup procedure in the background. You can try to temporarily disable it in Settings -> System -> Advanced -> Backup. Depending on your preferences you can decide if turning it off permanently is best for you, otherwise don't forget to turn it back on after observing your battery drain.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for your suggestions. I tried what you described but it doesn't help. still the same drain - over 10% per hour.
I have never used the backup option, hence it is deactivated.
sporc10 said:
Thanks for your suggestions. I tried what you described but it doesn't help. still the same drain - over 10% per hour.
I have never used the backup option, hence it is deactivated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i have same issue on a different phone...no bad app nothing or weird wake lock...im think it radio issue...because i took my sim out and airplane mode and it didn't lost a single percent over night.
sporc10 said:
Thanks for your suggestions. I tried what you described but it doesn't help. still the same drain - over 10% per hour.
I have never used the backup option, hence it is deactivated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Did you clear storage as suggested also? I'd take it a step further and clear all apps (have to do it individually on android 9).
Another good suggestion by techsavvy that it might be radio, try reset all radio option ie reset wifi, mobile & BT as well as his suggestion.
Hi, I´am experiencing the same issue. I´m using the phone for little more than two weeks. I received Unlocked one form Ebay, Installed the last update (Pie, and the security update few days later) It behaved really well until this saturday (15.10). Abnormal drain, gets really hot (around the fingerprint sensor) when using or charging. Now I discovered that the battery drain happens even when completely switched off. (?!)
I did a factory reset, cleared the cache of Google Play Store services, etc.
I found few threads with similar issues: https://forum.xda-developers.com/essential-phone/help/ph-1-losing-30-40-battery-powered-off-t3857667
https://forum.xda-developers.com/essential-phone/help/idle-battery-drain-t3707037/page2
So far no real help. Some users report the issue going away after while ? Some returned the phone.
Returning is a bad option for me as I bought it from e-bay and imported it to Eu which cost me around 170USD (Cutoms + shipping).
Do you guys have another suggestion?
Not much help, but just wanted to chime in and say that I'm also having the same issue with excessive battery drain even when switched off, so it appears this may be an issue with the last update. In addition to all the steps above, I also tried flashing the November security patch and even back to the final (July) Oreo version, but to no avail (it may be that this didn't work properly or something).
If anyone has any insight would be great to know, but I guess we might just have to wait to see if it is fixed!
Same issue, had the phone for about a month. This just popped about a day ago.
Since Saturday (15.12) I have the same problem. I removed the Simcard and did a factory reset but it did not help.
Hawk79 said:
Since Saturday (15.12) I have the same problem. I removed the Simcard and did a factory reset but it did not help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This was going to be my next step to try and get this under control. This is not what I wanted to hear
I'm getting about 6 hours of battery life right now. Last week I was getting 30+ with about 4 hours of SoT. This is frustrating.
I have the same problem. I've done countless resets and back to stock flashes and no luck, so I'm pretty sure it's a hardware issue. I'm gonna send it to Essential for warranty, hope they're gonna help. Do you think I should relock the bootloader before sending it?
So after few days and more than few tries to repair it with factory reset, charging and discharging without starting the phone, factory reset in the fast boot mode I´m losing hope. Do you guys also have the Halo Gray?
edit: Not saying it is related, but could it be something like bad batch of phones? It seems strange to see multiple people with the same issue almost at the same time.
cammaris said:
Do you guys also have the Halo Gray?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have Halo Gray.
Surely, that's not related....
Right?
YTHero said:
I have Halo Gray.
Surely, that's not related....
Right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not related. I have the halo gray, on the latest stock and I'm not having that issue. Slightly higher drain when idle with pie than Oreo, but not crazy bad, maybe and additional 1% an hour. It doesn't spend as much time in deep sleep on pie.
xXxNobodyxXx said:
I'm pretty sure it's a hardware issue. I'm gonna send it to Essential for warranty, hope they're gonna help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
cammaris said:
Do you guys also have the Halo Gray?
edit: Not saying it is related, but could it be something like bad batch of phones? It seems strange to see multiple people with the same issue almost at the same time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
YTHero said:
I have Halo Gray.
Surely, that's not related....
Right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
several of you have mentioned you have just got your phones, so possibly yes a new batch (I have an old halo grey, which is OK), though my money would be on a possible software bug that is only showing on the new batch maybe due to an alternative chip being specked or an updated chip or something like that, so they may be able to update software.