I really want this phone. I have the S7 edge and was waiting for this for daydream mostly. The problem is that i don't like the specs.
These are the shortcomings i've seen.
5" inch version has only 1080.
XL version only has 3440mah batter vs s7 3600
10 grams heavier than S7
Camera sensor seems bad.
The camera got a great review from a site most of us haven't heard much about before but they are sure popular today. DXOmark got alot of traffic after google announced they gave it a high score. I've read the review thoroughly and feel it was tipped in Google's favor by choice. The S7's best strength is the 1.7sensor and the Dual phase focus. Both are weaknesses of pixel, but the overall scores don't reflect it. For autofocus for example, they state that the pixel couldn't focus consistently yet gave it a score of 93. I made the mistake of taking a tilted review before (LG G3 camera) only to find issues later.
So does anyone really think the f2.0 camera on the pixel really is the best out there?
Compared to the S7, I am truly afraid the Pixel camera will disappoint you. My wife's S7 shoots the most amazing photos I've seen from a cell phone. I tried comparing them to my Nexus 6P and even my iPhone 7 and the S7 pictures are just so freaking crisp with perfectly accurate colors.
I don't think you can reasonably expect the Pixel's camera to compete with the S7. Especially without OIS.
5" inch version has only 1080 - This is 441 PPI compared to 336 of iPhone 7. This Also means less processing needed to move the pixels around.
XL version only has 3440mah batter vs s7 3600 - This is a 5% difference. It is also running an under clocked 821 that should be pretty efficient. Also sounds like Google has done a lot of optimization.
10 grams heavier than S7 - 5% I don't think that is very significant.
Camera sensor seems bad. - What? Where do you get this from? It sounds like at a minimum it take 6p quality photos but much faster.
orateam said:
I really want this phone. I have the S7 edge and was waiting for this for daydream mostly. The problem is that i don't like the specs.
These are the shortcomings i've seen.
5" inch version has only 1080.
XL version only has 3440mah batter vs s7 3600
10 grams heavier than S7
Camera sensor seems bad.
The camera got a great review from a site most of us haven't heard much about before but they are sure popular today. DXOmark got alot of traffic after google announced they gave it a high score. I've read the review thoroughly and feel it was tipped in Google's favor by choice. The S7's best strength is the 1.7sensor and the Dual phase focus. Both are weaknesses of pixel, but the overall scores don't reflect it. For autofocus for example, they state that the pixel couldn't focus consistently yet gave it a score of 93. I made the mistake of taking a tilted review before (LG G3 camera) only to find issues later.
So does anyone really think the f2.0 camera on the pixel really is the best out there?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
DXOmark is an extremely well known camera review site. They've only started reviewing phone cameras in the past 5 years or so, but they are definitely legit.
DXO is the gold standard.
The DxO review is pretty fair at calling the Pixel out in areas for improvement. The overall score is high, but that doesn't mean it's better than other cameras in EVERY aspect. It just means that all things considered they like the Pixel the best.
Something else to consider is that the camera hardware specs are just part of it. Many people at the event commented on/praised the software improvements (improved HDR+, no shutter lag, video EIS using gyroscope). I'm anxious to see a more in-depth review and I'm hopeful that it's as good as they say.
Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk
orateam said:
Camera sensor seems bad.
The camera got a great review from a site most of us haven't heard much about before but they are sure popular today. DXOmark got alot of traffic after google announced they gave it a high score. I've read the review thoroughly and feel it was tipped in Google's favor by choice. The S7's best strength is the 1.7sensor and the Dual phase focus. Both are weaknesses of pixel, but the overall scores don't reflect it. For autofocus for example, they state that the pixel couldn't focus consistently yet gave it a score of 93. I made the mistake of taking a tilted review before (LG G3 camera) only to find issues later.
So does anyone really think the f2.0 camera on the pixel really is the best out there?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You need to learn a little more about camera hardware dude. The sensor seems bad? You are wrong.
It is using a 1/2.3" size sensor. A sensor that size is something that some DEDICATED point and shoot cameras use. It is one of the largest sensors in a smartphone available. The 2016 Samsung phones are using a 1/2.5" sensor, which is inferior comparatively. The Pixels will have larger pixels (heh) to take in more light, resulting in better detail capture and low light photography. This combined with HDR+ (the newest iteration which is really yet to be seen) is going to be incredible.
HDR+ captures RAW images and uses software processing to combine the best of these images into a single JPEG. What does this mean for you? It means incredible dynamic range, the likes of which no other smartphone can compete. Why? Because HDR+ is EXCLUSIVE to Google. Nobody can process HDR as well as them in 99% of cases. I even did a comparison of my 6P against a $1,000 Sony RX100 IV (top of the line point and shoot camera). The 6P had better exposure and far better dynamic range in the vast majority of photos, straight out of the camera. Obviously the RX100 is much more capable and can certainly take better photos, but from a point and shoot perspective, the 6P was superior in terms exposure and dynamic range except in extreme low light. It blew my mind, pissed me off, and made me return that camera because I realized for my purposes, a smartphone camera is all I really need.
The Samsung phones having f/1.7 over f/2.0 is an advantage in some ways, yes, but not an outright advantage. It results in better bokeh (depth of field) effects, but also a more narrow focus range. If you want a lot of stuff in the frame in focus, especially if it's a close-up shot, you're not going to have a good time with Samsung's camera. With f/1.7 there are times you can't even get full focus on an entire object up close, because the focus range is so narrow. It also means the lens itself allows more light in, which can result in a better nighttime photo. But look up some night comparisons of 2016 flagships (including Samsung) vs the 6P. Here is one: http://www.androidheadlines.com/201...galaxy-s7-vs-htc-10-vs-lg-g5-vs-nexus-6p.html
Despite the 6P having f/2.0, it had better night photos in most cases. How? Because of its larger sensor. But wait - the HTC 10 has the same sensor, AND f/1.8 - how did it beat the HTC 10 in most cases? Because of HDR+. I will say it again - no other company beats Google's HDR+ processing in the vast majority of cases. It is incredible. Turn off HDR+ and you will regret it. The downside of using it on the 6P is processing time and shutter lag. That is no longer a problem with the Pixels. Leave it on all the time.
The only advantage I see Samsung truly having is autofocus. The dual pixel AF system is ABSURDLY fast and accurate. Also DxOMark is a very reliable and thorough source...
sn0warmy said:
Compared to the S7, I am truly afraid the Pixel camera will disappoint you. My wife's S7 shoots the most amazing photos I've seen from a cell phone. I tried comparing them to my Nexus 6P and even my iPhone 7 and the S7 pictures are just so freaking crisp with perfectly accurate colors.
I don't think you can reasonably expect the Pixel's camera to compete with the S7. Especially without OIS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is just not true. The Pixel camera will absolutely not disappoint. Samsung also does not have anything close to perfectly accurate colors. Samsung has been known to oversaturate, which can look better to most peoples eyes, but it is not going to be always accurate to the scene. I'm not saying Samsung hasn't been destroying the camera competition this year, because they absolutely have been... but to down talk the Pixels already is shortsighted and unfair. The lack of OIS a letdown. It means you will need to try to be as steady as possible when taking photos, especially at night. I think they either did this to avoid the camera bump (which would be a terrible reason to omit OIS), or because their software EIS is so gyroscope dependent that OIS would inhibit its effectiveness... but the V20 uses EIS and OIS quite well, so I sort of doubt this. Google could be using their own, different EIS method though, so we'll have to wait and see just how good it is. I don't think EIS will apply to photos, but it could - Sony does it with their Xperia cameras.
Nitemare3219 said:
*Lots of informative information.*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great post. Admittedly, I do tend to like the look of the photos my wife's S7 takes, but I don't doubt what you've said is true.
Personally, I'm still excited for the Pixel's camera. S0 much so that I returned my iPhone 7, which I mainly bought for the camera, to purchase the Pixel. The iPhone definitely took some amazing photos this past weekend. I wish I would have had both phones to do a direct comparison.
Here are samples taken with the iPhone 7. If the Pixel camera can take similar/better photos I'll be extremely happy.
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
When the Pixel arrives I'll get up to the same area and try to get some photos with similar lighting to see how it fairs, in comparison.
@sn0warmy
Well I'm pretty sure the 5X takes photos as good as these ones. So there's no reason the Pixel wouldn't take same or better quality photos.
I'll upload some I took here
thesebastian said:
@sn0warmy
Well I'm pretty sure the 5X takes photos as good as these ones. So there's no reason the Pixel wouldn't take same or better quality photos.
I'll upload some I took here
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Looking at the pictures closer, compared to how they look in Apple Photos, Flickr really managed to degrade the quality quite a bit.
Is there a better host site you use that maintains the high quality?
sn0warmy said:
Looking at the pictures closer, compared to how they look in Apple Photos, Flickr really managed to degrade the quality quite a bit.
Is there a better host site you use that maintains the high quality?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I use imgur. But I think it also reduces the quality a bit.
Anyway....I took these ones with the 5X (and Nexus 5 2013 camera wasn't bad compared to the one in 5X/6P. So since the N5 2013, Google is keeping the good quality)
http://imgur.com/a/TwJwd
thesebastian said:
I use imgur. But I think it also reduces the quality a bit.
Anyway....I took these ones with the 5X (and Nexus 5 2013 camera wasn't bad compared to the one in 5X/6P. So since the N5 2013, Google is keeping the good quality)
http://imgur.com/a/TwJwd
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Once we all have our pixels, we can just use Google Photos for all our photos.
orateam said:
I really want this phone. I have the S7 edge and was waiting for this for daydream mostly. The problem is that i don't like the specs.
These are the shortcomings i've seen.
5" inch version has only 1080.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's not a shortcoming, that's an ADVANTAGE. Less pixels = higher performance.
XL version only has 3440mah batter vs s7 3600
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So you're going to whine about 160 mAh? Also, the s7 has the SD820, which will consume more power than a like-clocked SD821 (like the pixel), so you'll gain that back.
10 grams heavier than S7
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Roughly a single grain of sand.
Camera sensor seems bad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, its a PHONE, not a camera. ALL phone cameras suck. Just be happy that it apparently loads and shoots FAST.
If you want a good camera, get a good DSLR.
craig0r said:
Once we all have our pixels, we can just use Google Photos for all our photos.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I still gonna wait a few months to the price drop. (I don't want to pay more than 550€ for a Pixel so maybe I'll have to wait to next year).
However, I don't know if I really like to have all my photos in "Google Photos".
What I'm doing now is, every-time I reach 3-8GB of Photos+Videos I move all the photos to my PC to a folder where I have all my photos. And that folder is shared with Google Photos Windows app (using the free quality option).
So I only use Google Photos to be able to search all my photos and have them anywhere. But I'm not using google photos to actually "save" my photos. To do that I use my PC's drive + an external backup drive.
If you pass your all the photos to Google Photos (using the unlimited option) and you use the "Delete from device" option when you need space. How do you move all your Google Photos' photos to a folder in Windows to make a backup?
thesebastian said:
What I'm doing now is, every-time I reach 3-8GB of Photos+Videos I move all the photos to my PC to a folder where I have all my photos. And that folder is shared with Google Photos Windows app (using the free quality option).
So I only use Google Photos to be able to search all my photos and have them anywhere. But I'm not using google photos to actually "save" my photos. To do that I use my PC's drive + an external backup drive.
If you pass your all the photos to Google Photos (using the unlimited option) and you use the "Delete from device" option when you need space. How do you move all your Google Photos' photos to a folder in Windows to make a backup?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does the Google Photos app for Windows not allow you to pull the pics down from the cloud? (I'm not being rhetorical, I actually don't know, I've never used it.)
craig0r said:
Does the Google Photos app for Windows not allow you to pull the pics down from the cloud? (I'm not being rhetorical, I actually don't know, I've never used it.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think its just a tool to upload photos. I only use it when I want to resync all my photos.
Sent from my Nexus 5X
doitright said:
That's not a shortcoming, that's an ADVANTAGE. Less pixels = higher performance.
Well, its a PHONE, not a camera. ALL phone cameras suck. Just be happy that it apparently loads and shoots FAST.
If you want a good camera, get a good DSLR.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Higher performance is not really noticeable in day to day use... or even gaming with the latest Adreno. More like battery life. But the Pixels are going to be using pentile AMOLED displays, so 1080p is kind of an issue, ESPECIALLY for VR. 1080p AMOLED with pentile is nowhere near the visual sharpness of a 1080p OLED with true RGB pixel arrangement. People seem to ignore this fact.
Also, phone cameras have come a hell of a long way. They're good enough for the vast majority of people, and can take some damn good photos in the right hands.
thesebastian said:
I think its just a tool to upload photos. I only use it when I want to resync all my photos.
Sent from my Nexus 5X
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just checked http://photos.google.com and it's real easy to do a bulk download. You can shift-select items in the web interface, go to the menu and click "Download" and you get a zip file.
from the Camera specs looks they double dipped on the IMX 377. If that's the case you will get pictures on par with the Nexus 6P with minor improvements. The camera will no doubt be solid just not a major improvement over the previous generation.
orateam said:
I really want this phone. I have the S7 edge and was waiting for this for daydream mostly. The problem is that i don't like the specs.
These are the shortcomings i've seen.
5" inch version has only 1080.
XL version only has 3440mah batter vs s7 3600
10 grams heavier than S7
Camera sensor seems bad.
The camera got a great review from a site most of us haven't heard much about before but they are sure popular today. DXOmark got alot of traffic after google announced they gave it a high score. I've read the review thoroughly and feel it was tipped in Google's favor by choice. The S7's best strength is the 1.7sensor and the Dual phase focus. Both are weaknesses of pixel, but the overall scores don't reflect it. For autofocus for example, they state that the pixel couldn't focus consistently yet gave it a score of 93. I made the mistake of taking a tilted review before (LG G3 camera) only to find issues later.
So does anyone really think the f2.0 camera on the pixel really is the best out there?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow.
DxO is a well respected site that tests camera equipment, typically DSLR's and mirrorless cameras and lenses. They take a very scientific approach to rating gear. It's been a few years since they started rating smartphones as well, and is one of the leading resources in rating smartphone camera performance.
The Pixel's camera sensor at 1/2.3" is larger than just about all other smartphones out there. For comparison, the Galaxy S7, S7 Edge and Note 7 use a 1/2.5" sensor, and the iPhone uses a 1/3" sensor. Just to be clear, the smaller the bottom number, the better.
Although the Pixel does have a smaller aperture at f/2.0, the larger sensor factors into the equation.
Related
Welcome to my camera comparison!
2/15/2015 - Updated to include the iPhone 4s, for people who were offended by comparing the flagship killer to a flagship which is newer and twice as expensive (this, despite all flagships being more expensive than the OPO, and the Nexus 6 for example—which uses the same sensor as the OPO—being both newer and more expensive).
Landscape
Great Lighting
Indoors Person
Indoors Fine Detail
All pictures were taken at highest quality with autofocus. For each scenario I provided a gallery of 8 shots:
- OPO AUTO = OnePlus One, stock camera, Auto mode
- OPO HDR = OnePlus One, stock camera, HDR mode
- OPO GOOGLE AUTO = OnePlus One, Google Camera, HDR disabled
- OPO GOOGLE HDR = OnePlus One, Google Camera, HDR enabled
- 6PLUS AUTO = iPhone 6 Plus, stock camera, HDR disabled
- 6PLUS HDR = iPhone 6 Plus, stock camera, HDR enabled
- NEXUS5 AUTO = Nexus 5, stock camera, HDR disabled
- NEXUS5 HDR = Nexus 5, stock camera, HDR enabled
My thoughts:
If I had to choose one, it would be the iPhone 6 Plus without a second thought. It opens in one second, has OIS and catpures an HDR shot in a split second, captures more low light detail in either mode regardless of overall lighting, and in general it captures fine detail better than the OPO (check the keyboard in the Indoor Fine Detail gallery) or, at worst, the same albiet with better color reproduction. Between the OPO with either camera app, and the Nexus 5, I find the Nexus 5 to be preferable because it has OIS which means I'm able to get more fine detail than the OPO despite the OPO's higher resolution, and further the Nexus 5 is able to pull more detail out of the highlights and shadows of shots that have extremes of both (like a foreground subject backlit by a bright sky). Overall the OPO camera is incredibly disappointing; It takes forever to take HDR shots or Clear Image shots, and I can't get consistently good shots in any mode with any camera app. What's more, the only time OPO doesn't seem like it has an 8MP shooter is in Clear Image mode, which is unfortunately plagued by being as inconsistent as any other shot by the OPO in any other mode with any other camera app. In dim-ish to low light, you'd be better off drawing a picture by hand than trying to capture anything useful with the OPO.
I've taken some really fantastic shots with the stock camera on my OPO, I honestly believe it's just a matter of knowing how to use it and playing to its strengths.
Transmitted via Bacon
timmaaa said:
I've taken some really fantastic shots with the stock camera on my OPO, I honestly believe it's just a matter of knowing how to use it and playing to its strengths.
Transmitted via Bacon
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
These camera shootouts and other comparisons have always been useless IMO. The OPO has consistently taken great photos for me; knowing the angles the camera needs to capture more light and using some common sense about where to take photos goes a long way. If being able to snap a photo anywhere is a must for you buy a DSLR
Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk
Renosh said:
These camera shootouts and other comparisons have always been useless IMO.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's just an objective demonstration and comparison. If it's of no use to you then who am I to complain. It is what it is.
timmaaa said:
some really fantastic shots...it's just a matter of knowing how.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not here to talk **** about the OPO camera, even if I do think it's terrible. I did the comparison for myself (and decided to publish it after the fact) precisely because I think it's terrible. So to me it's curious how people are happy to defend it. For example, your statement is the opposite of what a marketing team would want to say, and I'm sure it's the opposite of what smartphone camera software engineers aim for. These are intended to be point and shoot, not for people who "just know how." Per OPO's own ad, it's supposed to take "astounding shots, any time, day or night, without suffering the problems of other cameras." Without a doubt the nighttime performance of this camera is horrendous, but even it's automatic performance falls short. The fact that you have to wrestle it into submission even during reasonable conditions is a testament to how far they missed the mark with this.
.psd said:
I'm not here to talk **** about the OPO camera, even if I do think it's terrible. I did the comparison for myself (and decided to publish it after the fact) precisely because I think it's terrible. So to me it's curious how people are happy to defend it. For example, your statement is the opposite of what a marketing team would want to say, and I'm sure it's the opposite of what smartphone camera software engineers aim for. These are intended to be point and shoot, not for people who "just know how." Per OPO's own ad, it's supposed to take "astounding shots, any time, day or night, without suffering the problems of other cameras." Without a doubt the nighttime performance of this camera is horrendous, but even it's automatic performance falls short. The fact that you have to wrestle it into submission even during reasonable conditions is a testament to how far they missed the mark with this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You were claiming you're making an objective comparison yet you were biased from the beginning. Nice try though. You probably half assed your way to get the results you expected.
Using marketing ads to form an opinion is dumb, they'll all exaggerate. Use the camera figure out it's strengths and enjoy it. I don't have the luxury of a secondary phone. Came from a G2 though and it took similarly good photos. Still had to figure out angles and right conditions to take shots, as well as a steady hand helps. Only camera that I've had that was downright abysmal was the Nexus 4.
Next time you wanna compare phones do it for yourself to make a choice on which phone to keep or whatever reason you did it. There are tons of sites like gsmarena that do these comparisons. Once you start comparing anything between phones instead of liking something for what it can offer, it never ends
Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk
.psd said:
I'm not here to talk **** about the OPO camera, even if I do think it's terrible. I did the comparison for myself (and decided to publish it after the fact) precisely because I think it's terrible. So to me it's curious how people are happy to defend it. For example, your statement is the opposite of what a marketing team would want to say, and I'm sure it's the opposite of what smartphone camera software engineers aim for. These are intended to be point and shoot, not for people who "just know how." Per OPO's own ad, it's supposed to take "astounding shots, any time, day or night, without suffering the problems of other cameras." Without a doubt the nighttime performance of this camera is horrendous, but even it's automatic performance falls short. The fact that you have to wrestle it into submission even during reasonable conditions is a testament to how far they missed the mark with this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not trying to defend it, it has flaws, like any smartphone camera does. For example, Samsung shots are over-saturated and look awful. Nexus 5 HDR shots are too aggressive and look ridiculous (but then again, 99% of smartphone users have no idea what HDR is, how it works, how to use it, or even when you should be using it, they just use it because they think the result "looks cool"). Like the other fella said, forget whatever the marketing guys say because they're paid uber dollars to make you want something. They exaggerate, they lie.
Transmitted via Bacon
its amazing what coloros has on camera quality. It blows cm or cm s out of the water
Sent from my A0001 using XDA Free mobile app
bachera said:
its amazing what coloros has on camera quality. It blows cm or cm s out of the water
Sent from my A0001 using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And now you can use it on CM.
Transmitted via Bacon
timmaaa said:
And now you can use it on CM.
Transmitted via Bacon
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
am testing it haha
Sent from my A0001 using XDA Free mobile app
Thanks for your comparison. To really compare the picures, I think you guys should download them and watch them on your PC.
I will do so later, so I won't comment on them now.
Speedwise I can say, the opo camera from latest OTA opens in one second too.
I made a small collection of pictures where I think they are caught really good. These are by far not the best motives, just some examples to show what
can be achieved with a smartphone camera. All taken with the standard camera app, some are auto, some hdr, I think it is visible which are which...
Would you call them incredibly disappointing?
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/72qofxzgo2d9tjg/AAARPpNIsAQFkFPFAK3k87joa?dl=0
and no, these were not the best shots taken out of 20 made, but basically the only ones I took in these situations, especially at the Harry Potter expo which was really crowded!
Download them, as they are badly compressed when opened through dropbox online.
I can't believe people are so down on this comparison just because of its conclusions. Especially because I agree 100%. Nexus 5 camera was better than the OPO's, which is a huge disappointment to me.
All this nonsense about finding the right angle, etc, is just that - nonsense. Yes, it is good to know the limitations of the hardware and do your best to overcome them, but that doesn't mean the limitations are OK and you shouldn't acknowledge them/"stop complaining".
Both on XDA and the OPO forums there is always a huge amount of backlash against any criticism of this phone and the company, and I think that's really terrible. The OPO is a good phone but it isn't perfect and it and the company are certainly not above reproach.
The OPO camera subsystem in particular was poorly designed. 13mp with 6 lenses sounds great, but without OIS it falls down against camera's whose spec sheets don't read as nice.
The iPhone 6+ should be expected to take better pictures, being a generation newer and 2.5x the cost. This isn't exactly a level playing field.
Renosh said:
You were claiming you're making an objective comparison yet you were biased from the beginning. I don't have the luxury of a secondary phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The comparison is objective. My opinion doesn't bear on the actual content of any given picture, and the fact that reviewers tend to agree with my assessment is just coincidence. I went in open minded because, unlike you, I do have the luxury of having other devices. Here's the thing: almost any camera can take a good shot "sometimes" or "if you use it right", but the reason marketers don't say "this is an incredible smartphone camera sometimes, if you use it right" is because that's basically the same as saying, "as a flagship killer smartphone camera, this misses the mark."
CafeKampuchia said:
The iPhone 6+ should be expected to take better pictures, being a generation newer and 2.5x the cost. This isn't exactly a level playing field.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What if the iPhone 4s on iOS 6—cheaper and older by far—performs better, or at least favorably? What would you say then? And what about the Nexus 5—older and the same price (cheaper used)?
Anyways, I should have clarified in the OP that I did this comparison for myself because I own the phones and it seemed the OPO camera was terrible compared to my memory of the Nexus 5, so I wanted to test my memory against reality. I only published it after the fact in case others might find value in it.
AcmE85 said:
I made a small collection of pictures where I think they are caught really good.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Appreciated, but of course we don't know how other cameras would have performed...
I originally came from a Nexus 5, and I agree that for general day to day use I would rather have the Nexus 5 camera. OIS makes a huge difference, and the google camera software works well, however it is quite limited when it comes to features (like setting exposure times and what not, this is where the OPO camera is better). Really not surprised that the iPhone 6+ delivers the best results all around, as this was the consensus among internet reviews.
I honestly think that the OPO's camera performance is moreso a result of poor software optimization more than anything (other than the lack of OIS). I have used CM for previous phones (samsungs, HTC) and I always found picture quality to be worse on CM than on stock software. And for those bashing the comparison, if you are gonna call yourself a "flagship killer", be prepared to be compared to said flagships.
A bunch of crap.
Had a N5 before and the picture quality can't compare. Learn to take pics and don't blame the lack of OIS.
The OPO camera is one of the best ones on Android's out there. Everyone say's that, but there is always some lame cheap ass with a lame crappy test trying to prove everybody is wrong.
And yes my opinion is not gonna change based on biased tests. I had two of the devices compared up there and clearly the N5 camera is a piece of crap on quality.
IPhone > Top tier Samsungs > OPO > lots of devices > Nexus
lordneopt said:
A bunch of crap.
Had a N5 before and the picture quality can't compare. Learn to take pics and don't blame the lack of OIS.
The OPO camera is one of the best ones on Android's out there. Everyone say's that, but there is always some lame cheap ass with a lame crappy test trying to prove everybody is wrong.
And yes my opinion is not gonna change based on biased tests. I had two of the devices compared up there and clearly the N5 camera is a piece of crap on quality.
IPhone > Top tier Samsungs > OPO > lots of devices > Nexus
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I feel like saying "learn to take pics" doesn't make sense - if the OP doesn't know how to take pics, their incompetence is constant over all devices ... in which case the comparison is still valid :highfive:
I didn't come here to defend the OPO camera, I've made a bunch of ****ty pictures with it myself, but in this test I actually like the OPO pictures the most. I downloaded them to check if maybe it's only because I'm looking at a downsized version, but even so they really seem the best.
I actually think this is one of the most OPO favoring comparisons I have seen.
You did name them correct, right?
MarkusLi said:
I didn't come here to defend the OPO camera, I've made a bunch of ****ty pictures with it myself, but in this test I actually like the OPO pictures the most. I downloaded them to check if maybe it's only because I'm looking at a downsized version, but even so they really seem the best.
I actually think this is one of the most OPO favoring comparisons I have seen.
You did name them correct, right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ya they're named properly, I was very careful about that (I'm sure the metadata will confirm as well). Anyway you seem reasonable, you even gave the pictures a close inspection; and I'm not here to fight either, so I'm curious whether you feel the OPO outperformed objectively (and if so, where), or if you just like its pictures best subjectively?
Off topic: I've done the iPhone 4s pictures too now, I'll upload them tomorrow. Spoiler alert: 4s does a damn fine job for a 3.5 year old phone without HDR on a 2.5 year old OS (I keep it on iOS 6 because **** an iPhone 4s on iOS 7 or higher). Figured I'd do it for the haters saying its unfair to compare the OPO to newer, more expensive devices.
We all give Sony a hard time for releasing flagship devices with mediocre camera performance. I personally can verify that my previous HTC phones (One mini, One S, and even the Ville aka MyTouch 4G) dating back nearly 4 years all had better color reproduction, white balance, indoor performance, and faster focus and shutter response. None of those were even considered flagship devices at the time of release. We assumed Sony's problem was the software, so many of us searched for 3rd party camera apps such as Google Camera, A Better Camera, Camera FV-5, etc... and some even claimed to get better results using these apps. I've tried just about all of them (free versions only) and never saw any dramatic improvement to make me replace the default camera app. I finally decided to compare shots side by side on a couple of my personal favorite camera apps and here's what I noticed:
The 3rd party apps over-exposed the scene with far too much flash, giving it that cold LED light look, and washing out some of the natural colors. But worst of all, they weren't as clear when zooming in as the default app was. Pay close attention to the can of WD40 in the back. Only the stock app makes the word "Directions" visibly clear. All photos were taken using Auto Mode at 8MP - the setting the average person will use daily.
Sample Photos In Order (from left to right):
- Sony Stock Camera App
- Google Camera App
- OpenCamera App
https://goo.gl/photos/ihkstAg95Ag8rybX7
I took a few comparison shots in scenes that I thought would cause the stock app to falter, but it kept coming through and beating the competition. For example, when taking a picture of a poster that was covered by a slight shadow, the stock app was the only app smart enough to use flash; thereby making the words of the poster much clearer. In another indoor scenario, the competition once again over exposed the scene with too much flash, washing out the colors again. I may post these photos later if you request them.
Moral of the story:
Compared to other smartphones (especially flagships), Sony's camera is simply one of the worst performers. <-----(This is a click-able link to the results of a test article) There is no argument here and someone from Sony needs to do something about it. But as for the stock Sony camera app, it appears to utilize the camera better than 3rd party apps can. So if you want to make the best of out our bad situation, stick with the stock camera app.
I agree that the camera on the Z3C is somewhat lacking.
Outdoors in good light it can produce some really nice photos (some of the time) although even in good conditions it still seems to make a mess of things on occasions. Indoors and low light it's just plain terrible. I've done a back to back comparison with my rather elderly SGS3 and in most circumstances the SGS3 knocks the spots off the Z3C.
The problem is marketing.
In order to produce compelling marketing material, Sony developed the 20MP sensor and put this in all their flagship phones. This is way too many MP for such a small sensor and as such the quality suffers badly in anything other than bright sunlight. Even when interpolating the image down to 8MP you still see way more noise than the equivalent true 8MP sensor and the details are mushed to buggery. I'd be happy for the resolution on smartphones to top out at 10MP, which should be enough for 4K video and multiple aspect ratios (not that I think 4K video from a smartphone has much use).
sensor not bad, driver sometimes is...
Exmor IMX220 Shoot Out – Meizu MX4 Pro vs Sony Xperia Z3
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Wajk said:
sensor not bad, driver sometimes is...
Exmor IMX220 Shoot Out – Meizu MX4 Pro vs Sony Xperia Z3
indeed sony's pic are washed out but the looking at the "lay's" and "muji" comparision, meizu's pics are blurred.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We all know auto mode sucks isn't that right? Well Sony hasn't designed this phone for you, i have taken some absolutely stunning photos that my friends think were taken with a proper camera. The truth is that I'm a photographer that tries to push the hardware and software to the limit and if your having a good day you can produce stunning works of art. Sure there's a bit of noise but you can't expect fullframe image quality on this sensor. Taking a backwards step from my Nex7 to the Z3 compact was a great learning experience. If you're a photographer that likes to push the limits of a camera this one is for you, if your the average joe your wasting your time. Think about it, when you buy a camera what is the point of using auto mode when it limits the amount of control you have over a photo. Its like driving an automatic transmission car at a drag race.
As a photographer, you of all people should understand that a camera phone is not likely to be used when taking serious photos. This is designed to be a point and shoot replacement for selfies, pictures of food, group photos of friends in a restaurant, etc... This phone's camera isn't a complete failure by any means, but it simply doesn't perform as well as phones from 2-3 years ago under the most basic condition (indoors). I'm just finding it difficult to explain why my $500 flagship phone takes overexposed, blurry photos when my old phones (none of which were even flagship models) did not.
Starlith said:
We all know auto mode sucks isn't that right? Well Sony hasn't designed this phone for you, i have taken some absolutely stunning photos that my friends think were taken with a proper camera. The truth is that I'm a photographer that tries to push the hardware and software to the limit and if your having a good day you can produce stunning works of art. Sure there's a bit of noise but you can't expect fullframe image quality on this sensor. Taking a backwards step from my Nex7 to the Z3 compact was a great learning experience. If you're a photographer that likes to push the limits of a camera this one is for you, if your the average joe your wasting your time. Think about it, when you buy a camera what is the point of using auto mode when it limits the amount of control you have over a photo. Its like driving an automatic transmission car at a drag race.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am also a photographer (enthusiastic amateur and no expert for sure) who has worked for a software company in the digital imaging industry for 7 years. I get to sample a lot of cameras; including pre-production test mules, some of which never make it due to unrecoverable issues. I have tried the Z3C in every conceivable mode and it's still a disappointment in low light and unpredictable when it's good light. A brief summary of the biggest issues I've seen would include:
1) Poor light performance - It's not even low light, the performance is poor in moderate lighting conditions (20MP is too much for such a small sensor and lens)
2) Unpredictable auto focus - It misses what should be an easy AF fix more often than it should do
3) Too much NR - TBH this is a personal criticism of almost every camera currently made, but the NR on the Z3C is a bit nasty
4) Even the best shots seem to lack "definition"
I'm not saying that the camera is a complete dead-loss, but for a flagship smartphone it's not as good as I would expect. I don't think that I've taken a single picture with it where I've got home, uploaded it to my PC and thought it was really good. I've checked back through my SGS3 pictures and at a glance the best images look like they've come from a "proper" camera, I can't say that for many of the Z3C images. I'd really like to be able to get RAW images out of the camera to see what is possible with decent post processing, but it doesn't seem like that is going to happen any time soon.
If you could give some hints about how to get the most out of the camera, then I for one would very much appreciate it.
mad-marco said:
I am also a photographer (enthusiastic amateur and no expert for sure) who has worked for a software company in the digital imaging industry for 7 years. I get to sample a lot of cameras; including pre-production test mules, some of which never make it due to unrecoverable issues. I have tried the Z3C in every conceivable mode and it's still a disappointment in low light and unpredictable when it's good light. A brief summary of the biggest issues I've seen would include:
1) Poor light performance - It's not even low light, the performance is poor in moderate lighting conditions (20MP is too much for such a small sensor and lens)
2) Unpredictable auto focus - It misses what should be an easy AF fix more often than it should do
3) Too much NR - TBH this is a personal criticism of almost every camera currently made, but the NR on the Z3C is a bit nasty
4) Even the best shots seem to lack "definition"
I'm not saying that the camera is a complete dead-loss, but for a flagship smartphone it's not as good as I would expect. I don't think that I've taken a single picture with it where I've got home, uploaded it to my PC and thought it was really good. I've checked back through my SGS3 pictures and at a glance the best images look like they've come from a "proper" camera, I can't say that for many of the Z3C images. I'd really like to be able to get RAW images out of the camera to see what is possible with decent post processing, but it doesn't seem like that is going to happen any time soon.
If you could give some hints about how to get the most out of the camera, then I for one would very much appreciate it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with you, it does have its limits and they are really weird limits. For example when in manual mode anything that is set to auto including white balance and focus is either hit or miss, there is no touch metering, i have taken some stunners but they required me to work hard for it such as adjusting wb, iso, focus mode. Even the background defocus app which produced amazing photos btw i had to work really hard for. All that work on a phone is exhausting. Too many apps complicate the camera app and the post processing algorithm is inconsistent. Im interested what the results would be with a lens similar to the iPhone 6. The best thing about the camera is the wide angle lens but no one really cares for that.
Starlith said:
I agree with you, it does have its limits and they are really weird limits. For example when in manual mode anything that is set to auto including white balance and focus is either hit or miss, there is no touch metering, i have taken some stunners but they required me to work hard for it such as adjusting wb, iso, focus mode. Even the background defocus app which produced amazing photos btw i had to work really hard for. All that work on a phone is exhausting. Too many apps complicate the camera app and the post processing algorithm is inconsistent. Im interested what the results would be with a lens similar to the iPhone 6. The best thing about the camera is the wide angle lens but no one really cares for that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I personally don't even like the wide angle lens. It just forces me to stand that much closer to my subject to properly frame the shot. Then, if using flash, you blind them because you're standing 1 foot in front of their face. Anyway, I thought a sony branded lens/sensor was being used on most high end phones these days... even the iPhone? We just got stuck with poor image processing.
PuffDaddy_d said:
I personally don't even like the wide angle lens. It just forces me to stand that much closer to my subject to properly frame the shot. Then, if using flash, you blind them because you're standing 1 foot in front of their face. Anyway, I thought a sony branded lens/sensor was being used on most high end phones these days... even the iPhone? We just got stuck with poor image processing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When you buy a phone you don't expect it to take pictures like an SLR Camera would, that being said though I still think 20 mp is more than enough for taking snapshots. If you complain about the camera quality then you shouldn't have bought a phone in the first place and buy a DSLR instead.
and if you came from a Nokia flagship this difference is even bigger ....
Revontheus said:
When you buy a phone you don't expect it to take pictures like an SLR Camera would, that being said though I still think 20 mp is more than enough for taking snapshots. If you complain about the camera quality then you shouldn't have bought a phone in the first place and buy a DSLR instead.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've already got several DSLR's thanks very much. I don't think that anyone is expecting DSLR like quality, in fact you seem to be the only person who has brought this up.
I think that what people would like is the the camera on Sony's flagship smartphones to be comparable with other smartphones, especially the ones that have the same sensor hardware!!! It's a disappointment that the 2/3 year old SGS3 produces superior photos than the current Sony flagships, the current Samsung 16MP cameras are vastly superior.
Revontheus said:
When you buy a phone you don't expect it to take pictures like an SLR Camera would, that being said though I still think 20 mp is more than enough for taking snapshots. If you complain about the camera quality then you shouldn't have bought a phone in the first place and buy a DSLR instead.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have completely missed the point of this thread. It has nothing to do with expecting DSLR quality from a camera phone. We just don't want pictures to look like they were taken from a flip phone from 2006 - which is what this camera looks like when taking photos indoors. A flagship phone needs a flagship camera, and Sony's image processing has left us without, while all other major manufacturers are using some form of Sony image sensor and getting much better results.
But as my original post indicates, the best photos I've been able to get from this camera are with the stock camera app. All others seem to fall short when viewed on a larger screen.
ray_J13 said:
Wajk said:
sensor not bad, driver sometimes is...
Exmor IMX220 Shoot Out – Meizu MX4 Pro vs Sony Xperia Z3
indeed sony's pic are washed out but the looking at the "lay's" and "muji" comparision, meizu's pics are blurred.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seems to me the camera glass on her Z3C was a bit smudged... That would explain the haze.
And the small details on the Z3C look much better and cleaner at 100% zoom than on the Meizu, even if the Z3C was a bit out of focus.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm so disappointed in this camera. I took my Z3C and my old HTC Droid Incredible 2 to a concert last night. Inc2's pics were much crisper and cleaner. The videos were better as well (at 720p), though the sound on the Z3C's vids were better. Inc2 is what, 4 years old?
Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk
Crewville96 said:
I'm so disappointed in this camera. I took my Z3C and my old HTC Droid Incredible 2 to a concert last night. Inc2's pics were much crisper and cleaner. The videos were better as well (at 720p), though the sound on the Z3C's vids were better. Inc2 is what, 4 years old?
Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, this is our point exactly! The Z3C camera has far more advanced technology in it, yet the results are sub par to midrange and outdated phones. Care to share any of your pics for reference?
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact
PuffDaddy_d said:
Yes, this is our point exactly! The Z3C camera has far more advanced technology in it, yet the results are sub par to midrange and outdated phones. Care to share any of your pics for reference?
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can upload the vids and couple pics. None of the pics are really the same for comparison since i was in the crowd at the concert though. But you can get a general idea.
PuffDaddy_d said:
Yes, this is our point exactly! The Z3C camera has far more advanced technology in it, yet the results are sub par to midrange and outdated phones. Care to share any of your pics for reference?
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here's my vids. One is from my old Droid Incredible 2 (2011, running GB) the other is from my Z3C (2014, running LP). I'll let you guys judge which vid is better.
That concert looks like it was a lot of fun! I watched both videos on full screen and i personally think the top video looks better - less grainy and handled the bright lighting much better.
PuffDaddy_d said:
That concert looks like it was a lot of fun! I watched both videos on full screen and i personally think the top video looks better - less grainy and handled the bright lighting much better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep, just cleaner and sharper overall. Thats the Droid Incredible 2 video (720 only as well, Z3C is at 1080 lol).
I just bought this phone, and I'm extremely disappointed in the camera. My wife has a note4 which takes great photos, which I've been using pretty much every day as we recently had a child (our first). My main reason for buying a new phone was to always have a good camera on hand for taking photos of our son. I hate big phones though, hence why I didn't buy the note4.
Anyway, after buying the z3c, it turns out that I hate the photos it takes They are all completely lifeless and cold. When I take a photo with the note4, what I see on the screen is pretty much exactly what I see in real life. With the z3c I can clearly see the difference right away (and it's not just the phone screen). I've tried experimenting with settings in manual mode as well, but I'm not having much luck. Granted I'm not claiming to know much about these things. I don't care if it's not the highest resolution or the sharpest details (or not at this stage at least), I just want some colors that looks like what I'm seeing with my eyes. I've gone back to using the camera from my wifes phone again despite my own phone only being a week old, which is a bit sad.
Is there anything I can do about this? I feel like there should be a simple adjustment somewhere, but I can't find it. The colors on the screen were horrid as well, but I've adjusted those by using the "white balance" settings (where I significantly increased red and green while leaving blue at 0). Is there a similar setting for the camera or is there a different app I can download where I can make this adjustment?
I just want to be able to use my camera...
Here is an example. I took two photos, one after the other, using the z3c and the note4. He moved a little bit so they are not identical, but zoom in on his face and you'll see what I mean. One of the photos has got some color and in the other he looks pale and lifeless. The color in the first photo seem to match what I am seeing in real life (he is half asian, so somewhat yellow skin tone) It's a bit hard to show, but you'll just have to trust me that the photo which has more yellow in it is significantly more accurate. This is not even the worst photo either, this one is probably passable if looked at in isolation, but just one example I quickly snapped just now. They are all like this (or often worse) and it has led me to not wanting to use my camera at all.
EDIT: as a new user I was not able to add a link, but as this is just to dropbox, I hope it's OK that I present it like this. You will have to piece it together if you want to view it:
www dropbox com/sh/vb68vqquykxj13m/AAArXwsdSZHKdJCzz25Tu3Qxa?dl=0
Any suggestions on how I can fix this without having to manually post process the photos are much appreciated. I should note that I really love the phone in all other aspects so far, but the main reason I bought it was for the camera as mentioned.
EDIT: sorry, maybe this belongs in the questions forum. If so I apologize and feel free to move it.
EDIT: to clarify, I found what looks like a white balance setting, but it's only 4 preset modes. But maybe that is all we've got. I'll try and experiment with them and see if any produces better result than wb auto.
EDIT: those settings above seems to seriously mess with the colors, at least in current low light room I'm in. Despite loving the phone, I'm considering cutting my losses while it's still current and try to sell it In which case i would probably pick up a Samsung galaxy s6 instead, which should have an equivalent camera to the note 4. It's much bigger than I prefer though, and inflated price due to hype and being a new model as well
The s6 has a better camera in most conditions. That said the difference isnt that bad. On my screen both photos look very similar.
Anyway the usual thing, try in manual mode 8mp, slightly lower expo, multi, and adda tiny bit of clarity in google photos - seems to give best results on average
bilboa1 said:
The s6 has a better camera in most conditions. That said the difference isnt that bad. On my screen both photos look very similar.
Anyway the usual thing, try in manual mode 8mp, slightly lower expo, multi, and adda tiny bit of clarity in google photos - seems to give best results on average
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not the best example, you probably have to zoom in on face to see the difference. I might try and take a better example photo, but basically I lose all yellow in his skin tone and all I get is white and red.
I'll try your suggestions as well. Thanks.
You'll see from my camera thread and others that the Z3 is simply a poor performing camera indoors. There's little you can do to fix it.
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact
PuffDaddy_d said:
You'll see from my camera thread and others that the Z3 is simply a poor performing camera indoors. There's little you can do to fix it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've read your thread now, and it doesn't paint a very positive picture. I still don't understand why it's so bad though, especially since the hardware seems good. From my point of view, I would be OK if pictures are not sharp enough or not capturing as much details as they could, but the poor color replication is a deal breaker.
Do you know if there is any sign that they are working on improving the software? Maybe with the release of z4/z3+ they might release a software update applicable to z3 as well? I know I'm grasping at straws, but still. You'd think they'd try and fix it. If nothing else, it's embarrassing that all competitors are significantly better despite using sonys sensor. This should be their absolute strongest point, their ace card, and instead they are getting destroyed.
White balance is the key for my photos... Auto WB always produces unatractive photos. Cloudy, and sunny settings add some warmth to the photo.
tompab said:
I've read your thread now, and it doesn't paint a very positive picture. I still don't understand why it's so bad though, especially since the hardware seems good. From my point of view, I would be OK if pictures are not sharp enough or not capturing as much details as they could, but the poor color replication is a deal breaker.
Do you know if there is any sign that they are working on improving the software? Maybe with the release of z4/z3+ they might release a software update applicable to z3 as well? I know I'm grasping at straws, but still. You'd think they'd try and fix it. If nothing else, it's embarrassing that all competitors are significantly better despite using sonys sensor. This should be their absolute strongest point, their ace card, and instead they are getting destroyed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I couldn't agree with you more. I read an article where someone managed to compare the display of the Z3 vs the Z3+ and noticed that the plus has a warmer tone. Probably still to early to know is the camera software has improved any though. Sadly, I've started to use filters on the shots that look too cold to help earn them up a bit... More of a workaround than a solution.
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact
tompab said:
I just bought this phone, and I'm extremely disappointed in the camera. My wife has a note4 which takes great photos, which I've been using pretty much every day as we recently had a child (our first). My main reason for buying a new phone was to always have a good camera on hand for taking photos of our son. I hate big phones though, hence why I didn't buy the note4.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've got a Z1c(not Z3c) and S6 but I think I can share you some ideas here. Sony tends to like cold WB while S6 produces warm WB. Indeed, they both got pros and cons in my experiences bcoz Samsung is also easy to produce over-warm coast and sometimes not real good, it is just too warm, though in your case I admit this time warm WB got real better result.
If you want a smaller phone, you can consider the upcoming S6 mini(SM-G9198) with 4.6" 720P, s808, 2GB ram, 16GB rom, NFC, 16MP rear camera, 5MP front camera. Sony focus is just all bad(actually the image quality isn't bad though you can't compete it with Note4/S6) and Samsung is like 10 times better when you talking about the speed and focus part.
TheEndHK said:
I've got a Z1c(not Z3c) and S6 but I think I can share you some ideas here. Sony tends to like cold WB while S6 produces warm WB. Indeed, they both got pros and cons in my experiences bcoz Samsung is also easy to produce over-warm coast and sometimes not real good, it is just too warm, though in your case I admit this time warm WB got real better result.
If you want a smaller phone, you can consider the upcoming S6 mini(SM-G9198) with 4.6" 720P, s808, 2GB ram, 16GB rom, NFC, 16MP rear camera, 5MP front camera. Sony focus is just all bad(actually the image quality isn't bad though you can't compete it with Note4/S6) and Samsung is like 10 times better when you talking about the speed and focus part.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I will be very interested to see how that 16mp cam performs, if its anything like the S5 or S6 I may very well convert. Especially if they get the nicer build of the S6 in too, Just please no glass back.
S6 build also means glass back. I have no problems with glass. I'm not too fond of the diplay, Pentile matrix means less subpixels (=less sharpness) and effective resolution similar to qHD. It's clearly visible (rubbih harpness/dottiness) and just bad for the money.
PuffDaddy_d said:
I couldn't agree with you more. I read an article where someone managed to compare the display of the Z3 vs the Z3+ and noticed that the plus has a warmer tone. Probably still to early to know is the camera software has improved any though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Z3+ takes warmer pictures indeed but there's even more digital noise reduction:
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majaczos said:
S6 build also means glass back. I have no problems with glass. I'm not too fond of the diplay, Pentile matrix means less subpixels (=less sharpness) and effective resolution similar to qHD. It's clearly visible (rubbih harpness/dottiness) and just bad for the money.
Z3+ takes warmer pictures indeed but there's even more digital noise reduction:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Honestly, I can't even see the difference in color tone between these photos. At most, I see that the plus didn't focus properly in this shot.
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact
PuffDaddy_d said:
Honestly, I can't even see the difference in color tone between these photos. At most, I see that the plus didn't focus properly in this shot.
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same here... its splitting hairs to say there is any difference in color tone. That could easily be randomness with the Z3 being warm in the next shot.
Look at the concrete. It's much warmer. Another pictures (from gsmarena):
Z3:
http://cdn.gsmarena.com/vv/reviewsimg/sony-xperia-z3/camera/gsmarena_015.jpg
Z3+:
http://cdn.gsmarena.com/vv/reviewsimg/sony-xperia-z3plus/camera/gsmarena_102.jpg
majaczos said:
Look at the concrete. It's much warmer. Another pictures (from gsmarena):
Z3:
http://cdn.gsmarena.com/vv/reviewsimg/sony-xperia-z3/camera/gsmarena_015.jpg
Z3+:
http://cdn.gsmarena.com/vv/reviewsimg/sony-xperia-z3plus/camera/gsmarena_102.jpg
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay, yeah, the concrete does look warmer with the plus, but these are very obvious. Though, I question why it appears that so much time passed between shots. The sky is clear in one photo but is cloudy in the next. Overcast conditions will affect the white balance as well. Still a bit too soon for me to judge.
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact
Cronis said:
I will be very interested to see how that 16mp cam performs, if its anything like the S5 or S6 I may very well convert. Especially if they get the nicer build of the S6 in too, Just please no glass back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is no much info yet so I can't tell about S6 Compact but we can make some safe guess here and probably quite close to the true specification.
1. Probably used the new ISOCell 16MP to save cost. We all know that S6 got two sensors which is Sony IMX240 and Samsung ISOCell. This time the ISOCell is improved and better than the one on S5, so it is a 2nd gen. It got better color during at low light while IMX240 got more details. On day time, both sensors are almost identical. Mine S6 got IMX240.
2. OIS is removed for cost.
3. Aperture down to f/2.2 or f/2.4 depending the price strategic
If Samsung willing to give it a f/2.2 then it is safe to say it is a killer for Z3c though Z3c will still own some advantages like waterproof and best battery life. Not sure about microSD card thing. Consider it got a powerful s808 so as a small flagship, very possible to own a f/2.2 aperture.
https://shopmeenova.appspot.com/st/p/mrg2.html
I use this otg to solve my storage problem on S6.
Aperture eans nothing without sensor's size. Z3 can have higher aperture because IMX220 one of the biggest sensors on the (mobile) market right now.
We know nothing about the S6 mini, SM-G9198 sounds like SM-G9098's replacement:
http://gadgets.ndtv.com/samsung-sm-g9098-1608
majaczos said:
Aperture eans nothing without sensor's size. Z3 can have higher aperture because IMX220 one of the biggest sensors on the (mobile) market right now.
We know nothing about the S6 mini, SM-G9198 sounds like SM-G9098's replacement:
http://gadgets.ndtv.com/samsung-sm-g9098-1608
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Click to collapse
I think it is impossible to be the next G9098 bcoz it got only 3.7" size while G9198 is 4.6" with such powerful s808 cpu, they are in total different market segment.
Aperture is real meaningful in any size bcoz my One S(8MP 1/3.2") got f/2.0 so I know about it and Iphone 5s/6/6+ got only 8MP 1/3" f/2.2 but they are doing very well at low light too.
TheEndHK said:
I think it is impossible to be the next G9098 bcoz it got only 3.7" size while G9198 is 4.6" with such powerful s808 cpu, they are in total different market segment.
Aperture is real meaningful in any size bcoz my One S(8MP 1/3.2") got f/2.0 so I know about it and Iphone 5s/6/6+ got only 8MP 1/3" f/2.2 but they are doing very well at low light too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe they want to reduce bezels? Or make it bigger? SM-G9098 has very powerful CPU as well, actually it was the most powerful back in 2014..
They're ok in low light situations (partially thanks to decent image processing) but you can't trick physics.
majaczos said:
Maybe they want to reduce bezels? Or make it bigger? SM-G9098 has very powerful CPU as well, actually it was the most powerful back in 2014..
They're ok in low light situations (partially thanks to decent image processing) but you can't trick physics.
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Click to collapse
G9098 is 3.7" size while G9198 is 4.6", the different is big enough because there is no 4.6" size flip phone becoz when you put a 4.6" screen together with a physical keyboard, the phone will be very fat and large and customer will end up prefer to get a Note4/5 instead with similar size. But I like the good old day flip phone style, actually I want to see more coming out.
Thanks for all the help guys. Just thought I'd give an update if anyone is interested.
I still really dislike the z3c camera and was considering selling the phone and picking up a galaxy s6. I do however like the other aspects of the z3c, so I ended up buying a proper camera instead. I can use my wife's note4 for a quick snap if I don't have my camera nearby. It's a compromise, but I think it made more sense.
Ok I'm Kinda mad here... There are things I don't understand and I will probably never....
How on earth, would every review on the internet including youtube videos give the upper hand to the S7 camera which has SONY IMX260 R EXMOR that has 7.18 mm sensor size and a 1.4 μm x 1.4 μm unit cell size while the Z5/Premium has the "exclusive cutting edge" RS EXMOR IMX300 with 7.87 mm sensor size and 1.1 μm x 1.1 μm pixel size ?
And please don't tell me about image processing ? Why on earth a giant Japanese corporation such as SONY specialized and leader in photography, videography, pictures and music Entertainment without forgetting their BIONZ image processor that compete or even wins over Nikon EXPEED and
Canon DIGIC can't do image processing right on a freaking CMOS sensor ?
Now yeah the Z5/P pictures are decent and although very good on a very sunny day.... I'll remain quiet for the low light part....
So to sum it up... a Samsung with an IMX260 12MP sensor is on par or outperforms a Sony IMX300 23MP ( 25MP ) sensor...
Funny isn't it ?
It's not funny at all.
Still,I find that Z5 camera is best on market atm.
Xperia Z5 via Tapatalk
Very easy good hardware and bad software.
Sony can't compete software wise with who had nexus phones.
Samsung LG know better about android and how to create a better software cause they took lot of info from Google while they have Nexus phones.
Well money talks. S7 just cant match Z1+ line. Take a look at original S7 full resolution photos. Photo IQ is awfull on the S7. Over-sharpening that creates awfull halos and contrast, to much texture detail, texture extraction that gives a gritty look and to much noise reduction that makes for a blurry image with lost detail and plastic look. S7 has borderline the bad CRT chromatic aberration look and reminds me of old cheap digital cameras.
I'll quote one of my other posts wher one can see that even in an unfair comparision that favors the S7 my Z1 just performs much better. Much better and if making things more even by choosing 2048x1536 for my Z1 photos and same or similar for S7 my Z1 just walks all over the S7. Z5 does no worse unless in SA or the NR goes wonky.
When I look at S7 photos in good and low light it just reminds me of the bad CRT "chromatic aberration" look. Great artistic value but the persons S7 destroys IQ beyond reparation. https://www.flickr.com/photos/gavinfabl100/
I mean even the Z1 blows it out and Z5 even more. Look at this comparision which favors the S7 as the images are shown at 100% size which means my Z1 is showing a far bigger image aswell as in worse lighting conditions with far less photons in the ambient to capture (see shutter speed difference) yet it performs better. Would I scale it down to same size as the S7 it would be a brutal comparision leaving the S7 in the dust. One can choose 2048 pixel width to see this in the links.
Stock original photos, default camera apps.
S7 buildings.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/gavinfabl100/25743187832/sizes/o/
Z1 buildings.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/csls/25516883060/sizes/o/
S7 forest.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/gavinfabl100/25837956126/sizes/o/
Z1 forest.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/csls/25019022984/sizes/o/
Might take some time some day with the Z5c and capture photos in same locations once the sun is about same (wild weather over here).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And here are more S7 samples.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/gavinfabl100/25837956126/sizes/o/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/gavinfabl100/25208922064/sizes/o/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/gavinfabl100/25404249180/sizes/o/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/gavinfabl100/25021532094/sizes/o/
And here is low light.
Will check files once released here and compare CRC to see if they changed algorithms. As for the S7 I agree, it does moderately good but far worse than Sonys Xperia Z1+ line. The biggest issue on the S7 besides tending to go overboard with sharpening and noise reduction which smoothes out to much and gives a bad fake plastic look (often easily visible around fine-grain detail like branches and leaves) is that it also when post-processing brightens up the image by tweaking curves. Most software does this but should be catiously used to extract detail from low contrast areas. Samsung goes overboard often giving it the 'fake ISO' look where black turns grey. Xperia Z1+ phones give quite a bit better low light photos same ISO for ISO and shutter speed while not even having to resort to major curve tweaking just minor or barely any and it does it selectively in a often excellent way. I assume the BIONZ is really a power beast for such dedicated tasks but sensors in Sonys phones are just better even though older and they are coupled with great optics.
It's just now that Samsung is starting use similar tech that Sony already employed in their mobiles years ago. I think Iphone 6s also got a bit of it but it relies mostly on multi-frame photo composition to create higher ISO like the Nexus 6p HDR+ does. Xperia Z1+ also does this but only when doing ISO 6400 (atleast the Z1) else not. Problem is you need to keep scene static else you get ghosting and bluriness. Haven't checked it fully out for the Z5c though but it should do better.
I guess you could say the S6 gives more detail and less blur but it also has way to much curve tweaking as the S7 but just much worse for same low light situations. S6 just turns to a mess at ISO 1000+ and low light while S7 does better. Both S6 and S7 also automatically (atleast in auto mode) if stable does multi-frame capture in low light to create improved noise reduction. Why some S6/S7 photos at say ISO 1000 looks bad and others much cleaner. Scene has to be static though and mobile firm. Same concept you can find in ProCapture camera app and their noise reduction mode.
Photo example of the S7 post-processing and curves.
Without HDR enabled.
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With HDR enabled.
Sony avoids this in most cases and dont go overboard like that keeping blacks deep and rich aswell as colors punchy and representation of captured scene is far better.
And a Z1 sample from manual mode 8MP, 1/8 ISO 3200. Little and smart use of brightening via the changing curves despite high ISO of 3200 keeping the blacks quite well, global contrast and colors punchy despite heavy tungsten lighting!
Manual mode, 1/8 ISO 1600 of same scene two days apart around same time.
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Click to collapse
The sensor is just one part of the camera, there are so many other elements that can make it better or worse.
That's like saying one restaurant has better steak and complaining as somewhere else uses better cows - it's all about the cooking of the meat and the accompaniments that go with it.
In photography's case it's about the lens system, the image stabilisation and the post-processing. As posters above have said, the software controlling the Sony sensor in the S7 is great, no doubt.
Answer me this: if you give an amazing camera to a bad photographer will you get a better photo than giving a bad camera to a good photographer?
Answer me this: if you give an amazing camera to a bad photographer will you get a better photo than giving a bad camera to a good photographer?[/QUOTE]
Let me answer :
Are you able to drive faster in a Bentley than in a Renault even if you are a bad driver ?
Yes !!!
Same with photos quality (not photo skills)
I agree that the human factor is there but can not excuse all Sony conservative attitude plus Sony do not want to let 3rd party improve their lack of dev.
But still happy with my Z5 result... It is a phone and we do not have to expect the same quality as a Reflex
NJ72 said:
The sensor is just one part of the camera, there are so many other elements that can make it better or worse.
That's like saying one restaurant has better steak and complaining as somewhere else uses better cows - it's all about the cooking of the meat and the accompaniments that go with it.
In photography's case it's about the lens system, the image stabilisation and the post-processing. As posters above have said, the software controlling the Sony sensor in the S7 is great, no doubt.
Answer me this: if you give an amazing camera to a bad photographer will you get a better photo than giving a bad camera to a good photographer?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand what you're trying to say but is it justified ? Is it possible that SONY can't make a software that control their own sensors ? Is it acceptable that other companies using SONY sensors whether modified or not, can make better use of it ?
SONY that has been in the photography industry since decades can't deal with their own driver and post processors on a mobile phone ?
Again the pictures on the Z5P are good but try going zoom to 100%... most of the details are missing compared to rivals.... not sure if it's lack of sharpness whatsoever but certainly the post processing needs work.
Look at their Z5 camera promotion bragging about the auto-focus speed... I literally had to find one single time I could get a a clear photo of somebody moving.
Don't get me wrong I'm a huge fan of the device but it just puts me on my nerve that we have the best hardware and the " best " brand name yet we always have excuses for the camera behavior.
Xeon said:
I understand what you're trying to say but is it justified ? Is it possible that SONY can't make a software that control their own sensors ? Is it acceptable that other companies using SONY sensors whether modified or not, can make better use of it ?
SONY that has been in the photography industry since decades can't deal with their own driver and post processors on a mobile phone ?
Again the pictures on the Z5P are good but try going zoom to 100%... most of the details are missing compared to rivals.... not sure if it's lack of sharpness whatsoever but certainly the post processing needs work.
Look at their Z5 camera promotion bragging about the auto-focus speed... I literally had to find one single time I could get a a clear photo of somebody moving.
Don't get me wrong I'm a huge fan of the device but it just puts me on my nerve that we have the best hardware and the " best " brand name yet we always have excuses for the camera behavior.
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Click to collapse
In my opinion it's quite obvious with the Z5 premium that Sony spent more time focussing on the display than the camera's image processing. Sony could do a lot more with the camera than they do, but there are numerous other factors Sony consider when designing a smartphone. Evidently they either A) do not have the skills, B) don't rate it high enough or C) think they nailed it when it comes to the camera.
I agree that Sony should have done more with it, but I bought the phone knowing that they hadn't and I'd buy it again over Samsung's TouchWiz interface. I prefer my DSLR for photography, for me the rest of the phone is more important.
And, in answer to your first question, yes - what I said is justified. Whether it's what you'd have done if you were part of Sony's dev team, who knows, but what they did is make a very good phone with a camera that could be better.
NJ72 said:
In my opinion it's quite obvious with the Z5 premium that Sony spent more time focussing on the display than the camera's image processing. Sony could do a lot more with the camera than they do, but there are numerous other factors Sony consider when designing a smartphone. Evidently they either A) do not have the skills, B) don't rate it high enough or C) think they nailed it when it comes to the camera.
I agree that Sony should have done more with it, but I bought the phone knowing that they hadn't and I'd buy it again over Samsung's TouchWiz interface. I prefer my DSLR for photography, for me the rest of the phone is more important.
And, in answer to your first question, yes - what I said is justified. Whether it's what you'd have done if you were part of Sony's dev team, who knows, but what they did is make a very good phone with a camera that could be better.
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Click to collapse
Well to be honest, SONY only brags about their camera performance in their devices.... This time in September they mentioned nothing but the 4K screen and the IMX300. No major change to the device design, software is close to stock android and the IP68 has been there for ages.
http://www.sonymobile.com/global-en/products/phones/xperia-z5/
See ? They are so proud of their camera that this is the only marketing card in their hands for now. As for lack of expertise, I really doubt but I can nothing but believe that they thought they nailed it when in fact it's still horrible in low light conditions.
The big problem I have with the Z5 is its shutter lag and no burst shooting. So you're left with rapidly tapping the shutter button which only gives you about 3fps. On the S7 you get a burst mode at over 20fps.
It's ridiculous how their ads show an instantaneous shutter but it could be no further from the truth. Even with Marshmallow the shutter lag is still pretty bad. This seagull was standing on the bridge when I pressed the shutter and the camera captured when it already started to fly away.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/j5hcj2jeazzjs77/DSC_0988.JPG?dl=0
Even HTC M9+ Supreme Camera has faster shutter and better manual options than Z5. It uses IMX230 and is a pretty bi
FYLin21 said:
The big problem I have with the Z5 is its shutter lag and no burst shooting. So you're left with rapidly tapping the shutter button which only gives you about 3fps. On the S7 you get a burst mode at over 20fps.
It's ridiculous how their ads show an instantaneous shutter but it could be no further from the truth. Even with Marshmallow the shutter lag is still pretty bad. This seagull was standing on the bridge when I pressed the shutter and the camera captured when it already started to fly away.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/j5hcj2jeazzjs77/DSC_0988.JPG?dl=0
Even HTC M9+ Supreme Camera has faster shutter and better manual options than Z5. It uses IMX230 and is a pretty bi
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Click to collapse
This is what I'm talking about... you see... in your pic nothing looks OK, what was the focus doing ? i can't find any part of the pic clear....
One thing I noticed is that even Whatsapp camera looks awful. I understand that the pic is compressed and the post processing is non existent but on my Xperia Z the difference wasn't noticeable that much.
gm007 said:
Very easy good hardware and bad software.
Sony can't compete software wise with who had nexus phones.
Samsung LG know better about android and how to create a better software cause they took lot of info from Google while they have Nexus phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry but I tend to disagree. I dont think OEM release need google assistance. In fact SONY is very conservative when it comes to camera software. I bet they know how to unlock raw mode and compatibility yet they don't want to.
It's obvious that the post processing has been inconsistent across the Xperia line. A bit of trial and error if you want my opinion....
What you say about bad software is correct however unjustified. I can't accept it from an industry leader such as SONY.
OK the camera is almost perfect in manual mode if you want to go hardcore and adjust every possible value and mode for a snapshot but I don't want to spend 2 minutes for that :
Look at the difference between iPhone 6S and Z5 camera.... this lack of details is what makes me go nuts.
Xeon said:
This is what I'm talking about... you see... in your pic nothing looks OK, what was the focus doing ? i can't find any part of the pic clear....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This has been zoomed a bit using "clear image zoom" which just oversharpens things. It could be fine if they just use something that rounds off the edges for up sampling, but you see a lot of jagged circular blobs throughout the edges. I had taken a few pictures of this bird standing there but the camera kept overexposing the scene. Then I brought the exposure down and tried taking a photo - the bird a still standing there the moment I pressed the shutter.
The only thing to get around no burst mode is using 4K video. You can capture 8MP stills while you film but sometimes it causes the video to stutter and it takes a long time to save them. The stills also look worse than the video itself - the contrast is lower with washed out colours. It's better to grab frames after filming but you'l need another app to do this and I'm not sure which one as I do it on my computer using Media Player Classic. You can also crop to 1080p which is better than using the digital zoom in the app - unfortunately the bitrate of 4K video is a bit low so you can see some artifacts when cropped to 1080p ...
Is the shutter lag due to software or hardware? it's hard to say. Low resolution photos from Facebook messenger can be taken instantaneously, but all the third party apps I've tried exhibit shutter lag - I think even worse than the stock camera app... and don't forget only 8MP works with third party apps.
If the images were downscaled to 8MP or something, they would be good compared to some other cameras but that defeats the purpose of having 20/23MP.
Imagine seeing the loch ness monster and you took a photo but the shutter lag means your photo doesn't show it because it dove into the water
I will give you a small example why sony is bad software wise,
In lollipop we had fingerprint scanner test in the diagnostic menu and the test was not working.
So instead to fix it in marshmallow they removed the test completely lol.
Xeon said:
Ok I'm Kinda mad here... There are things I don't understand and I will probably never....
How on earth, would every review on the internet including youtube videos give the upper hand to the S7 camera which has SONY IMX260 R EXMOR that has 7.18 mm sensor size and a 1.4 μm x 1.4 μm unit cell size while the Z5/Premium has the "exclusive cutting edge" RS EXMOR IMX300 with 7.87 mm sensor size and 1.1 μm x 1.1 μm pixel size ?
And please don't tell me about image processing ? Why on earth a giant Japanese corporation such as SONY specialized and leader in photography, videography, pictures and music Entertainment without forgetting their BIONZ image processor that compete or even wins over Nikon EXPEED and
Canon DIGIC can't do image processing right on a freaking CMOS sensor ?
Now yeah the Z5/P pictures are decent and although very good on a very sunny day.... I'll remain quiet for the low light part....
So to sum it up... a Samsung with an IMX260 12MP sensor is on par or outperforms a Sony IMX300 23MP ( 25MP ) sensor...
Funny isn't it ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, and it's no surprise, it has been the case forever.
There was never any need for Sony to stupidly try to play the MP race again, seems they didn't learn from the point and shoot and DSLR MP race/nonsense. It's all marketing BS to say hey we've got something that no one else has.
Push the boundaries of the ideal MP for a certain sensor size, then you will always have problems with different types of noise entering your photo, due to sensor heat and the sensors small size and not being able to dissipate that amount of heat effectively, as a result to clean all this up they end up having to have pretty aggressive noise reduction algorithms, this also keeps the jpg photo size down a fair bit, handy for a phone unless you want to run your storage out in no time flat. Approx 25-35MB per photo @ 23MP low light high ISO these could have been even bigger.
Realistically would have just been better off running at 12MP and requiring much less noise reduction because due to less heat build up in the photo sites of the sensor.
danw_oz said:
No, and it's no surprise, it has been the case forever.
There was never any need for Sony to stupidly try to play the MP race again, seems they didn't learn from the point and shoot and DSLR MP race/nonsense. It's all marketing BS to say hey we've got something that no one else has.
Push the boundaries of the ideal MP for a certain sensor size, then you will always have problems with different types of noise entering your photo, due to sensor heat and the sensors small size and not being able to dissipate that amount of heat effectively, as a result to clean all this up they end up having to have pretty aggressive noise reduction algorithms, this also keeps the jpg photo size down a fair bit, handy for a phone unless you want to run your storage out in no time flat. Approx 25-35MB per photo @ 23MP low light high ISO these could have been even bigger.
Realistically would have just been better off running at 12MP and requiring much less noise reduction because due to less heat build up in the photo sites of the sensor.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ironically their sales and marketing strategy is flawed to death and it's chaotic but they wanna do marketing they do it the wrong way.
Seriously they should start recruiting...
hawker_gb said:
It's not funny at all.
Still,I find that Z5 camera is best on market atm.
Xperia Z5 via Tapatalk
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Click to collapse
post like this really make me wonder about my specific device.... because i am totally with op here: the camera may be very good (the best?) in sunny/ bright conditions, but is just useless in darker situations (not just pitch black.. darker..). a camera like that can NEVER be called the best on market.. i would say
Barthlon said:
post like this really make me wonder about my specific device.... because i am totally with op here: the camera may be very good (the best?) in sunny/ bright conditions, but is just useless in darker situations (not just pitch black.. darker..). a camera like that can NEVER be called the best on market.. i would say
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They should have less NR in low contrast areas for photos as right now it is quite aggressive. Seems the area noise reduction aint so 'clever'. Previous Z phones perform much better in low contrast areas with no smudged out detail. My Z1 for example outdoes my Z5c easily in detail clarity across all contrast variables while keeping noise as low or even lower and resorts to less post-processing. I assume some can be attributed to not as wide sensor (26mm vs 23mm) and 1,2um vs 1,1um pixel size and perhaps the focus system (less electronical noise). They might heat up differently to. Will be interesting to see how the Xperia X performs since AFAIK it uses same or similar sensor as the Z5. Also seems Z5c uses more NR in superior auto vs manual mode despite same ISO.
But despite that it stands really good against competition and overall it just beats them.
Here is an example of the area noise rduction system it uses akin to BIONZ X algorithms just that it is to aggressive. Look at tree trunk and streetlight pole. High contrast area is sharp but low contrast area is smudged by the NR. The problem is it failed to detect that there are bushes infront smudging them out. This is the area NR not working as intended.
EQ2000 said:
They should have less NR in low contrast areas for photos as right now it is quite aggressive. Seems the area noise reduction aint so 'clever'. Previous Z phones perform much better in low contrast areas with no smudged out detail. My Z1 for example outdoes my Z5c easily in detail clarity across all contrast variables while keeping noise as low or even lower and resorts to less post-processing. I assume some can be attributed to not as wide sensor (26mm vs 23mm) and 1,2um vs 1,1um pixel size and perhaps the focus system (less electronical noise). They might heat up differently to. Will be interesting to see how the Xperia X performs since AFAIK it uses same or similar sensor as the Z5. Also seems Z5c uses more NR in superior auto vs manual mode despite same ISO.
But despite that it stands really good against competition and overall it just beats them.
Here is an example of the area noise rduction system it uses akin to BIONZ X algorithms just that it is to aggressive. Look at tree trunk and streetlight pole. High contrast area is sharp but low contrast area is smudged by the NR. The problem is it failed to detect that there are bushes infront smudging them out. This is the area NR not working as intended.
Well please accept my very subjective opinion... from first look the pic is catchy, nice, really nice colors but then the disaster...... it's certainly not a focus issue.
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Xeon said:
Well please accept my very subjective opinion... from first look the pic is catchy, nice, really nice colors but then the disaster...... it's certainly not a focus issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Kinda hard to make out what you are reffering to but "disaster"? Z5 series applies to aggressive area based NR in low contrast areas, as for the rest the photo is quite good and natural looking. Certainly better than most S7 photos you can find of similar ISO, shutter speed and scenery type. Atleast the NR can be countered partially with texture detail and clarity filters to bring out contrast in smudged areas. S7 you cant do nothing to repair photos as they are beyond reparation.
Click on images to view them in Flickr default display size. Atrocious and beyond reparation. The Z5 IQ despite smudgy NR in low contrast areas is head and shoulders above the S7 IQ. Z5 looks to the DSLR side while S7 looks to the cheap old digital camera side.
S7. Atrocious, the borderline bad CRT chromatic aberration look. Like relief filter applied shifting pixels due to horrible post-processing and subpar sensor.
Z5. The area based NR problem is clearly visible yet it looks much more natural and better despite being taken in much worse lighting conditions as evident by shutter speed and postition of sun and shadows.
As for the highlights you made that is pretty much what I already noted though the left side is from lens problem, that unit has decentered lenses thus blurred sides, right and/or left. You can see that in S7 to depeding on unit. Such a unit should be replaced. And all cameras have to do some detail extraction in low contrast areas (shadowed/non directly lit areas) and thus wont be as detailed as lit areas.
Take a look at S7 photo with shadowed areas, see? Noisy, smudgy with blotches and horrible even though ISO is low. Atleast the Z5 smoothes it out mostly OK. (left and right side)
One more time! You see? (right side trees and bushes)
You still cant see it!? Well some more then!
To the right!
To the left!
To the left!
And all around! :laugh:
https://m.heise.de/ct/artikel/OnePlus-5T-Keine-Zoom-Kamera-mehr-3887487.html
Heise.de is one very serious german tech site and they say that since other sites already broke the NDA they dont feel obliged to hold information back.
To make it short: camera does not get better, low light performance gets even worse.
Long version: The camera setup (still WITHOUT OIS!) will be 16+20 mp again BUT the 20 mp sensor this time won't work as telephoto lens. Also aperture changes from f/2.6 to also f/1.7 like the 16 mp main snapper. Pixel size of the 20 mp sensor stays at 1.0 um. This sensor will, despite its crazily small pixel size, automatically work as low light shooter when light levels drop below 3.5 lux, making pictures look even worse than with the 16 mp sensor.
The Software does NOT use both sensors to combine the picture information like it is the case for other phones. Thus, picture quality does not seem to improve compared to the OP 5.
My comment: This really doesnt seem to make any sense. Why not put in a sensor with bigger pixels if you want a lowlight specific unit? Why take one with even smaller pixels? Wtf!? Did they have too many of those crappy 20mp sensor left over? Or why not at least use both sensors to combine the two die pics? Or why not just use the fabulous sensor that the s8/pixel2 uses and put an OIS in it? This is so stupid oneplus, i just dont get it..
Furthermore: Usb will again be 2.0.
2015 all over again..
Also, unlike the introductionary text of this forum suggests, battery will be the same as the OP5, 3300 mah. Thus, endurance will be lower compared to the 5.
And the device will also feature face recognition to unlock.
What do you think?
This is kinda disappointing. I was kinda missing my OnePlus 5 going to the pixel 2xl because I really loved the feel and everything on the o5. I was also thinking I should have waited on the 5t and hope they made some small improvements to the camera. This seems like a bit if a downgrade. Battery life will still be really good but slightly worse. I don't see why they couldn't have fitted in a slightly larger battery
Finally get to review it
Finally got my new glasses and can check all of the new great features With these phones. It has been a while since I bought a smart phoneBut the one plus is something that I there are just way too expensive.
I wonder if it possible cross-device ROMs between OnePlus 5 & 5T.
ps000000 said:
I wonder if it possible cross-device ROMs between OnePlus 5 & 5T.
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Click to collapse
I think it will be possible. Since the changes are similar like 3 and 3t. Lets see
yeah, for me the missing ois is a deal breaker. I planned to upgrade from my op3t but now i will keep it. Hopefully they will learn from it and add a camera with ois for the 6
GSMArena have some shots in their hands-on here.
If you zoom in and look at what it's done to the foliage in the first 2 shots you might wish you hadn't. This would be considered poor in a low-light shot, never mind outdoor daylight. I just hope that this is pre-pre-production software that they stupidly gave to a reviewer and not what they are planning on selling.
Maybe anybody has a acutal review of the camera of the Oppo R11s?
It should have the same camera configuration and software "magic".
Results should be an indication for the possible camera performance of the OP5T.
---------- Post added at 05:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:35 PM ----------
Large Hadron said:
GSMArena have some shots in their hands-on here.
If you zoom in and look at what it's done to the foliage in the first 2 shots you might wish you hadn't. This would be considered poor in a low-light shot, never mind outdoor daylight. I just hope that this is pre-pre-production software that they stupidly gave to a reviewer and not what they are planning on selling.
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Interesting. GSMarena comments on the lowlight pictures:
"We also went out for some night shots around the usual locations. We won't be passing any verdicts just yet, but the results look promising."
When they said the second camera would have f1.7 aperture (without probably mentioning the pixel size) I thought they would do something special to combine the result of both cameras and create nice pictures. I didn't expect that they only would use one of them....
OnePlus clearly doesn't know much about software photography, but they know a lot about marketing...
Furthermore: Usb will again be 2.0.
2015 all over again..
Seriously brah?
Also, unlike the introductionary text of this forum suggests, battery will be the same as the OP5, 3300 mah. Thus, endurance will be lower compared to the 5.
And the device will also feature face recognition to unlock.
What do you think?
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Well, the screen says 6.0 VS 5.5 But it's taller but thinner side to side. The total screen area should be the same or very close. I doubt enough to affect battery in any significant way. It's also a newer panel, so possibly more efficient than the old 5.5 which was a carryover from the previous OP.
The screen is not narrower but a lot longer so the real estate is quite bigger.
Its 136x68mm vs 122x68mm.
A few sites have mentioned the camera is a bit lackluster, but until we can get a good comparison between the 5 and 5T I'm not sure how to take these comments.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A5000 using Tapatalk
Camera will be more powerfull if you install Google camera.
Martin.077 said:
Camera will be more powerfull if you install Google camera.
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i feel so too, on the op5 the difference is huge in low light conditions with the hdr+
Unfortunately there isnt a port that works properly. Either no touch to focus or other drawbacks
Lasersdude said:
Unfortunately there isnt a port that works properly. Either no touch to focus or other drawbacks
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And the microdots. It was too much of a hack for something I need to be reliable at least IMO.
Sent from my ONEPLUS A5000 using Tapatalk
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/201...ding-combination-of-specs-design-and-price/2/
https://m.gsmarena.com/oneplus_5t-review-1687p8.php
mario toys on arstech and low light comparison on gsm
5t looks better than 5 there
FridrufHau said:
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/201...ding-combination-of-specs-design-and-price/2/
https://m.gsmarena.com/oneplus_5t-review-1687p8.php
mario toys on arstech and low light comparison on gsm
5t looks better than 5 there
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It is still producing oil paintings in daylight though.
Mind boggling that this is still not fixed! The sensor is capable to produce better photos but the processing...
https://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/op5T-2.jpg
This issue is soo old by now:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbn9Lj6F6EM
Someone needs to tell OnePlus that a little noise doesn't hurt as long as the photos come out sharp!
AcmE85 said:
This issue is soo old by now:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbn9Lj6F6EM
Someone needs to tell OnePlus that a little noise doesn't hurt as long as the photos come out sharp!
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Ok so moving is never sharp, although with other camera apps?