Database Users

An Audiophiles Thread

Hello,
I am trying out this phone due to it's built-in DAC. I have had other phones that I connected to an external DAC via an OTG USB cable. I have used USB Audio Pro and the Onkyo HF players successful to with good results. It would be nice to have a phone and a quality DAC/Amp/Player all-in-one device.
I noticed that with the Sprint variant of the V20, it only comes with the Google Music Player application. I don't really like the program very much as it is very limited in functionality. It seems to play all of my PCM and DSD files. I did notice, however, that my DSD files don't sound quite right. I believe that the Google Music Player application is doing a conversion to PCM first. Can anybody authenticate or rule this out?
I tried using USB Audio Pro and they claim that they are unable to play DSD files via the Android operating system. As a result, their application does a pcm conversion when an external DAC is NOT attached to the phone, but plays native DSD to a USB attached DAC.
The Onkyo HF player app seems to do the same thing.
Am I missing some settings?
Is Google play converting to PCM prior to output?
Is there a setting in the Onkyo HF Player app that needs to be toggled/adjusted?
Where can I get DETAILED specifications and instructions for use of the DAC in the V20?

mlknez said:
Hello,
I am trying out this phone due to it's built-in DAC. I have had other phones that I connected to an external DAC via an OTG USB cable. I have used USB Audio Pro and the Onkyo HF players successful to with good results. It would be nice to have a phone and a quality DAC/Amp/Player all-in-one device.
I noticed that with the Sprint variant of the V20, it only comes with the Google Music Player application. I don't really like the program very much as it is very limited in functionality. It seems to play all of my PCM and DSD files. I did notice, however, that my DSD files don't sound quite right. I believe that the Google Music Player application is doing a conversion to PCM first. Can anybody authenticate or rule this out?
I tried using USB Audio Pro and they claim that they are unable to play DSD files via the Android operating system. As a result, their application does a pcm conversion when an external DAC is NOT attached to the phone, but plays native DSD to a USB attached DAC.
The Onkyo HF player app seems to do the same thing.
Am I missing some settings?
Is Google play converting to PCM prior to output?
Is there a setting in the Onkyo HF Player app that needs to be toggled/adjusted?
Where can I get DETAILED specifications and instructions for use of the DAC in the V20?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Whoa. Sounds like you are a connoisseur of good music, high fidelity audio files, and equipment that gives great sound quality. You've opened a new door for me to venture through. Curious to hear what others will reply to this thread...

mlknez said:
Hello,
I am trying out this phone due to it's built-in DAC. I have had other phones that I connected to an external DAC via an OTG USB cable. I have used USB Audio Pro and the Onkyo HF players successful to with good results. It would be nice to have a phone and a quality DAC/Amp/Player all-in-one device.
I noticed that with the Sprint variant of the V20, it only comes with the Google Music Player application. I don't really like the program very much as it is very limited in functionality. It seems to play all of my PCM and DSD files. I did notice, however, that my DSD files don't sound quite right. I believe that the Google Music Player application is doing a conversion to PCM first. Can anybody authenticate or rule this out?
I tried using USB Audio Pro and they claim that they are unable to play DSD files via the Android operating system. As a result, their application does a pcm conversion when an external DAC is NOT attached to the phone, but plays native DSD to a USB attached DAC.
The Onkyo HF player app seems to do the same thing.
Am I missing some settings?
Is Google play converting to PCM prior to output?
Is there a setting in the Onkyo HF Player app that needs to be toggled/adjusted?
Where can I get DETAILED specifications and instructions for use of the DAC in the V20?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you tried the stock music app?
Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk

Have you tried Poweramp? I'm pretty sure it will play hi res music files as is..

mrwinkle13 said:
Have you tried the stock music app?
Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The stock music app for the Sprint variant is Google Play Music

douger1957 said:
Have you tried Poweramp? I'm pretty sure it will play hi res music files as is..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the suggestion but you are incorrect. It will only play PCM files and not beyond 48khz.

Someone uploaded the image of the stock music player - if you can't find it let me know and I'll try and pull it myself.
I use this app to enable the DAC for GPM (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.phascinate.lgv10.dacfix&hl=en). You can really hear a difference flipping the on/off switch. I'm considering completely dropping GPM just because the quality is so much lower for no reason. Even on my G2 the same MP3s would sound better on the default player.
TIDAL also works natively with the DAC, almost as well as the stock launcher. The built-in DAC is far better than my Audioquest Dragonfly USB DAC I've been using

Anarchaotic said:
Someone uploaded the image of the stock music player - if you can't find it let me know and I'll try and pull it myself.
I use this app to enable the DAC for GPM (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.phascinate.lgv10.dacfix&hl=en). You can really hear a difference flipping the on/off switch. I'm considering completely dropping GPM just because the quality is so much lower for no reason. Even on my G2 the same MP3s would sound better on the default player.
TIDAL also works natively with the DAC, almost as well as the stock launcher. The built-in DAC is far better than my Audioquest Dragonfly USB DAC I've been using
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am going to cancel my GPM too now that I have the 20 and just use tidal for streaming way better. Hoping they were going to have a better dac in the pixel and upgrade the music on GPM but didn't happen.

I don't have a subscription to the google play music service. I just have the app on the phone and it is the ONLY music player that comes with the phone. It is horrible for playing local music files.

Neutron. Try neutron first and see what happens. And maybe mx player pro though mx is more for video than audio but the type of audio you're using is something that might be embedded in a video file. Worth a shot.

Anyone have issues with gapless playback?
I've tried it with PowerAmp and Black Player and neither work.
Only time it seems to work is if I intentionally skip to the last few seconds of a song to test it.
My music is on my SD card but that really shouldn't be an issue.

Unfortunately, my suspicions were confirmed about the implementation of the ES9218 DAC:
The following is from the developer of the NeutronMP player:
According your logs (Thank you for making them!) OS declares only one
(!!!) frequency - 48000 kHz. You can see it in logs:
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| enum: device 0
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| enum: id = 1
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| enum: type = 1
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| enum: name = LG-LS997
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| enum: is sink = 1
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| enum: is source = 0
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| enum: channels [1]:
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| - 1
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| enum: sample rates [1]:
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| - 48000
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| enum: sample types [1]:
[13:08:16] I <SFX>| - 2
It means firmware does not expose Hi-Fi DAC via this new API. Why LG can not make it and expose DAC and solve the problem with using full potential of the device - puzzle. Neutron would use it automatically if DAC is exposed by the firmware.

Hi guys, and thanks for your information. Can someone point us toward how to use an equalizer effectively? I believe many times folks who put down simply don't understand how to maximize the benefits. In terms of real cans I have HE400s. In terms of ear buds I have the BOs and a set of HE600 ear buds. How do I understand how to maximize my sound and how do I use an equalizer (with Nuetron or other apps).
Thanks Guys

Do some research. Look at the frequency response of the source you're using and the frequency response of the cans you're using. Go from there. Unless you're a tech head st this and have proper equipment it is a little testing and tweaking. Like if you're mids are low on the source and cans you want up the frequencies in the mid range to get it back. But if you doing it blindly then it's a lot testing and tweaking.

Best Music Player for regular flac files, not high res?

What do people think is the best music player for the V20 for regular flac files, not high res? And do you use special settings?

PowerAmp

mikebz5 said:
PowerAmp
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Any particular settings you prefer on PowerAmp? Like DVC, resampler etc?

So I compared Poweramp (With SoX resampler enabled) with the LG Music App, playing Dire Straits "The man's too strong" and the music sounded clearer and fuller with the LG App (44 KHz 1469 KBPS). I ended up enabling Direct Volume Control on PowerAmp and that improved it.

I do have DVC selected for headphone and BT. Crossfade @ 3000ms and gapless. The equalizer and preamp settings work great. I also save preset equalizer settings for use depending on what vehicle I am driving. I only use wired connections as I can't stand the sound quality of ANY audio player using BT.
If your download and store your music locally from Amazon it will find it(No player can access cloud to my knowledge.). It does not work with downloaded Google Play music in my experience due to the unconventional file naming Google uses(I havent tried lately though.)
I've been using the paid version of PowerAmp since my HTC Evo. Its worth every penny. I have yet to find a better app for music.

Neutron is good it processes the music at 64 bit if you enable it.
Also if you have the v10 dac fix on Google play the dac will work with all apps not just lg
Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

mrtruckincowboy said:
Neutron is good it processes the music at 64 bit if you enable it.
Also if you have the v10 dac fix on Google play the dac will work with all apps not just lg
Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just thought I'd mention it but I personally like the layout of PlayerPro a little better than PowerAmp, I bought them both years ago and I think it's well worth having both of them but I'm not an audiophile by any stretch though either.
I have a question about the v10 dac fix if you wouldn't mind because I'm still confused about it, I was under the impression that if you have a higher end set of headphones or earphones it should kick in the dac no matter what music player you use, so I guess that's incorrect then? Also are there any visual clues that the dac is working? And what exactly is causing the volume controls to switch where it says "HI-FI"? I thought that meant dac was enabled and if so that happens whenever I plug in my headphones no matter what music player I'm using even though I've never installed the v10 dac fix?
Sent from a ridiculously modified ColecoVision

What's better to use, aptX HD, aptX or SBC for Bluetooth?

The OnePlus 5 has those 3 options but I do not know the difference between them or which is best to use. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you!

+1

Both the phone and Bluetooth device have to support AptX for it to work, so often your issue resolved by that.
AptX will provide better sound than SBC. SBC is the default codec used by the A2DP Bluetooth profile.
So, in short, if your headphones/speakers have AptX, use that. If they don't, SBC.

What happens if you choose aptX if your device doesn't support it?

yubimusubi said:
What happens if you choose aptX if your device doesn't support it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It will probably just switch to SBC so the connection will work, as that's the baseline standard in Bluetooth. I couldn't say with absolute certainty, as my OP5 hasn't arrived yet.
AptX is a proprietary thing - someone other than the Bluetooth consortium developed it and licenses it. That's why not everything has it - you have to pay to use it in the products you make. They created AptX because the default Bluetooth audio profile pretty much sucks when you start to examine how it butchers bit depth and sample rates just to cram audio data across a low power wireless signal.
On the flip side of that coin - yeah, AptX is better (and I'd use it if both devices supported it) but the audio quality differences are probably not going to readily apparent when listening to $20 to $50 Bluetooth devices. It's been my experience that it takes a somewhat trained ear and better-than-good equipment to be able to easily spot the difference. So, if you're an audiophile, you probably already know to stay away from Bluetooth for the best quality sound. If you're not an audiophile, try to use the best Bluetooth profile you can, but don't sweat it too much.

The A2DP profile is negociated at pairing and the best supported by both devices is picked (SBC < AptX < AptX HD). Problem is that the codec is just one link in the whole daisy chain. Other equally important aspects:
- music source quality (don't expect 128 kbps CBR mp3 to sound good)
- DAC and amplifier (each and every sound system that converts bits to sound has these!)
- speakers (from those in IEM's to those in BT boom boxes - they are all speakers)
So just that you're using AptX doesn't imply you are listening to high quality sound and probably implementing AptX and putting its logo on the product is the cheapest and least development intensive way to raise the price of a product.
Just my two (euro) cents...

Hi,
The question here is how the phone behaves when a higher quality codec has been selected (eg aptX) and a standard bluetooth headset (SBC - only )has been connected?
So far it seems to work (but then the question is why there is a selection available)
Best Regards
Joerg

My wild guess is that tis setting acts like a low-pass filter threshold. The phone will negotiate the highest available option without going above setting.
If the setting is AptX, the phone and speaker support AptX HD, the connection will be made at AptX quality. If the speaker only supports SBC, the connection will be made with SBC.
Honestly I don't see the point in such a setting. 99% of the people would want the best quality available anyway.

Is there a power consumption difference?
Sent from my ONEPLUS A5000 using Tapatalk

daniel_loft said:
My wild guess is that tis setting acts like a low-pass filter threshold. The phone will negotiate the highest available option without going above setting.
If the setting is AptX, the phone and speaker support AptX HD, the connection will be made at AptX quality. If the speaker only supports SBC, the connection will be made with SBC.
Honestly I don't see the point in such a setting. 99% of the people would want the best quality available anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It makes sense to have the setting *if* for some reason you want to force SBC or the non-HD aptX. I have it set to aptX HD right now and it seems to work with my car (I'm about 95% sure it doesn't support aptX).
The real question is, if it fails back appropriately, why on Earth would OnePlus set the *default* to SBC?

@aa_chow: There surely is a consumption difference. SBC was designed decades ago with low computational complexity in mind (among others). On the current smartphone hardware (which is probably on par with a medium desktop from 5-6 years ago) the difference would be so small that measurements are impossible (you might see a difference on the battery life of the speakers, but I wouldn't loose my time there) .
@yubimusubi: I cannot even find the reason why that setting is even there! It only limits the best usable codec, which makes no sense to me. Maybe you can find more answers on the oneplus forums.

lag
with the sb, i experience music lag from when i have played in 1 minute and it continues, is it low power consumption or something on sbc? I'm gonna try the apex option when i get home to check if its better.

I'm suffering micro breaks on HD audio (320 bitrate MP3) from aptX HD, aptX or SBC.
Is there a way to correct it?
All my files are stored at 320 and I doesn't have time to convert to a bitrate of 128
Edit: No issues with iPhone 7+ and Huawei P10 using the same BT headset and MP3 files

bartito said:
I'm suffering micro breaks on HD audio (320 bitrate MP3) from aptX HD, aptX or SBC.
Is there a way to correct it?
All my files are stored at 320 and I doesn't have time to convert to a bitrate of 128
Edit: No issues with iPhone 7+ and Huawei P10 using the same BT headset and MP3 files
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have an issue on my International LG G6 where it sounds like the 24 bit lossless tracks are essentially dropping frames to borrow a gaming term. Then it will correct itself. It happened on my VW and the problem persists in my wife's new Subaru.
The LG G6 sports Aptx HD. Any ideas?

i prefer aptX but then again ive been using it quite a while now

APTX-HD do not work on One Plus 5. The music hacks constant.

Android 8.1, LDAC, AptxHD , V4A, ARISE and other findings

Hello,
So based on my request for help in the following thread, I was initially trying to setup ultimate audio experience with ARISE (not only V4A) to run on stock 8.1 (Mar 18 updates). However after numerous tricks and ways to make it work , i reliazed its not possible for now. I also came to know that V4A and Atmos dont live together well and Atmos overrides the sound processing by V4A, which has to be manually reactivated time and again.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/pixel-xl/how-to/guide-ultimate-audio-battery-guide-t3727124
I reverted to Android 8..0.0 (Oct 17) and then following the guide in this thread
https://forum.xda-developers.com/pixel-xl/how-to/guide-how-to-install-arise-sound-8-0-t3692415
I was able to install V4A , Dolby Surround to work together (Arkamys , A3MD crash repeatedly and ICESound breaks the sound at all from speaker or headsets, didnt find a solution for it so far).
One of reasons for me to try Google Pixel with 8.+.+ was to try the new (supposedly) hi resolution bluetooth codecs namely AptxHD and LDAC (a Sony version of Hi-res audio protocol).
Being an amateur audiophile, I bought Sony Wh1000MX2 which supports both LDAC and AptXHD.
A finding which I made was when I paired the XL with Sony Headphones using LDAC, the audio quality was good, however I wanted to make it better by activating V4A and Dolby Surround audio mods. After fiddiling for a couple of hours, I realize V4A and Dolby does not work or recognized the sound output when the headphones were connected using LDAC. It was seen as the V4A driver status showed "Abnormal" and no "Processing" was done. However with the same setup as soon as I changed my bluetooth audio connection to use AptxHD , the V4A and Dolby started working and sound was equally superb with the added value of tuning it more to my taste using the audio mod.
I am not sure why the audio mods are not bluetooth connection protocol agnostic, or why not working with LDAC.
Shared it for information, maybe the gurus would be able to reproduce the setup and post a working solution.
Thanks.

Hi, same problem here. I have a pair of Sony MDR 1000x Bluetooth cans with ldac support. Flashed my Xiaomi Redmi Note 4x to LOS unofficial Oreo to get the ldac codec going (it works indeed), but v4a does not work with this codec. If I choose the SBC codec, it apears to at least realize that it can do something (although changeing effects dosent work). With ldac enabled v4a driver status says abnormal and obviously nothing works. All in all I guess that we cant do anything other than wait, so that some devs will adopt to the new features of Android Oreo.
Hope for the best
PS: sorry for possible spelling mistakes
edit: if someone needs logs, im happy to provide them.

HyperEscape said:
Hello,
So based on my request for help in the following thread, I was initially trying to setup ultimate audio experience with ARISE (not only V4A) to run on stock 8.1 (Mar 18 updates). However after numerous tricks and ways to make it work , i reliazed its not possible for now. I also came to know that V4A and Atmos dont live together well and Atmos overrides the sound processing by V4A, which has to be manually reactivated time and again.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/pixel-xl/how-to/guide-ultimate-audio-battery-guide-t3727124
I reverted to Android 8..0.0 (Oct 17) and then following the guide in this thread
https://forum.xda-developers.com/pixel-xl/how-to/guide-how-to-install-arise-sound-8-0-t3692415
I was able to install V4A , Dolby Surround to work together (Arkamys , A3MD crash repeatedly and ICESound breaks the sound at all from speaker or headsets, didnt find a solution for it so far).
One of reasons for me to try Google Pixel with 8.+.+ was to try the new (supposedly) hi resolution bluetooth codecs namely AptxHD and LDAC (a Sony version of Hi-res audio protocol).
Being an amateur audiophile, I bought Sony Wh1000MX2 which supports both LDAC and AptXHD.
A finding which I made was when I paired the XL with Sony Headphones using LDAC, the audio quality was good, however I wanted to make it better by activating V4A and Dolby Surround audio mods. After fiddiling for a couple of hours, I realize V4A and Dolby does not work or recognized the sound output when the headphones were connected using LDAC. It was seen as the V4A driver status showed "Abnormal" and no "Processing" was done. However with the same setup as soon as I changed my bluetooth audio connection to use AptxHD , the V4A and Dolby started working and sound was equally superb with the added value of tuning it more to my taste using the audio mod.
I am not sure why the audio mods are not bluetooth connection protocol agnostic, or why not working with LDAC.
Shared it for information, maybe the gurus would be able to reproduce the setup and post a working solution.
Thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rakkke said:
Hi, same problem here. I have a pair of Sony MDR 1000x Bluetooth cans with ldac support. Flashed my Xiaomi Redmi Note 4x to LOS unofficial Oreo to get the ldac codec going (it works indeed), but v4a does not work with this codec. If I choose the SBC codec, it apears to at least realize that it can do something (although changeing effects dosent work). With ldac enabled v4a driver status says abnormal and obviously nothing works. All in all I guess that we cant do anything other than wait, so that some devs will adopt to the new features of Android Oreo.
edit: if someone needs logs, im happy to provide them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not the type to necro old threads, but I believe I've found the solution to your problem. I had this problem myself on my V30 and realized what was making Viper effects not processing. LDAC by default starts off with an audio sample quality of 96 kHz and 32 audio bits per sample. If you can change these settings in developer options, lower the sample rate(sample quality) to 44.1 kHz - the rate used for 90% of all music & audio and the bits per sample to 24. Viper audio effects should work now with LDAC. You will have to do this every time you turn on/pair your headphones to your phone.

Ypu can use James DSP for ldac codec with any sample rate and bits per sample. James DSP has a magisk module and can be installed from magisk.

How to enable LDAC in G6

I've been trying to find out how to enable LDAC in G6 so I can use my Sony WH1000XM3 to its full advantage. LDAC is missing from Bluetooth Settings. The only place to enable it is under Developer Options. Every time I choose LDAC it reverts back to the default the moment I exit Developer Options. Any idea?

In bluetooth settings find Your device and switch from best performance to best quality. It will switch from AAC/SBC to LDAC

Chamelleon said:
In bluetooth settings find Your device and switch from best performance to best quality. It will switch from AAC/SBC to LDAC
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, did that. Now I can see it's streaming in LDAC. Thank you. But it's streaming in 32bits/96kHz. How is that possible? As far as I know the maximum bit rate LDAC is capable of is 24bits. The source music is in 16bits/44.1kHz.

Poweramp resampler is doing that. Go to PowerAmp-Sound-Sound Info to see all active DSP, Resampler etc.

Thanks @Chamelleon. Finally fixed it. It's under Audio - Output - OpenSL ES Output. Set Bluetooth to On.

Few days ago I tested new version of PA and found that it makes something strange with sound when LDAC is enabled, but I had no time to dig what exactly. It drains twice more battery than GMMP and I can't hear any significant difference in sound quality so I went back GMMP.

Chamelleon said:
Few days ago I tested new version of PA and found that it makes something strange with sound when LDAC is enabled, but I had no time to dig what exactly. It drains twice more battery than GMMP and I can't hear any significant difference in sound quality so I went back GMMP.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've only used the Sony headphone with Poweramp occasionally since I bought it last week. Didn't really pay attention if there's a battery drain issue. BTW, is GMMP a good music player? Does it have an EQ built in? The thing I like about Poweramp is that it has a good EQ and can handle many audio formats except DSD, DFF, and DVD audio ISO files.

GMMP is probably more customizeable than PA and it drains less battery. It has it's own sound engine so sounds quality is perfect as well. It reads all embedded (covers, ratings, lyrics) from tags and only downside is that it looks like from ICS era when it has been made. I like it more than PA because it's more lightweight and now it's developer is working on V3 so it'll be up to date.