Database Users

Epic dev fallout

Here's my two cents on the issue.
I'm not privvy to all the "behind-the-scenes" info, but I have seen some crap in my time here on XDA, which has solely been in the EPIC community.
Not relevant in all cases, but for instance when BThomas was still kickin' around with Viper, he almost threw in the towel on numerous occasions after anonymous dev\mods with influence or power got butt-hurt and tried to get his work banned. That kind of crap is no doubt one reason why some devs have disappeared, not to mention whatever happened with some of the ACS devs.
No doubt people get all crazed with their interwebz power, get jealous, and try to throw some weight around. Maybe that works in the workforce when people get a paycheck, but the last thing someone wants is for morons to start complaining about how your volunteered time is hurting their ego.
...maybe we need to front the $$$ for a whaaambulance, might clean few things up around here.

I'm leaving here soon! .. But not all is devs crying over a thanks .. Some of us members are part of the reason too!
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App

dcowboys2184 said:
I'm leaving here soon! .. But not all is devs crying over a thanks .. Some of us members are part of the reason too!
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
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Its not for a thanks, its for credit.
And a "thanks" is the least you can do to give back.
Sent from my SPH-D700

dcowboys2184 said:
I'm leaving here soon! .. But not all is devs crying over a thanks .. Some of us members are part of the reason too!
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
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To be sure, for every one of us that supports by money or time, there are those that choose to piss and moan.
But as was said above, being butt-hurt has little to do with receiving a thanks but the opposite when a thanks is deserved...and also going to silly measures to satisfy your jealousy/ego.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

thanks to the name of the phone all news regarding it is instantly over-sensationalized..
EPIC dev fallout sounds pretty.. uh.. epic

Yeah, it is rather punny =D

Nothing against you MeetFace.. But don't you think we have enough threads about devs. It seems like every week after one falls off the frontpage a new one is started. Adding another one in the General section isn't going to do anything but make more people coming to this forum just move else where. If the Devs get into it with each other we should let them sort it out and not get involved. Besides the Evo section has always been worse than ours..

If had noticed/felt that I was being redundant or "preaching to the choir", I would withheld my remarks.
I don't check the forums as often as I used to, and I check the general section even less, so forgive my lack of noticing what apparently may be a problem. I was merely responding to an issue that was raised in a closed thread, felt like there were some words that needed to be said.
If you think my comments are wrong or misplaced...then you are naive, because I speak of real situations. I won't go into any more detail, but I will say this:
If you can't man up an be civilized, then you should keep your mouth shut, and regardless of your contributions, whether they be developing or support, you are doing a major disservice to a "community" when you try to tear people down in public, instead of trying to build them up.

It's really simple. Adhere to the GPL and the XDA rules against advertising other sites that require registration to download custom ROMS.
A "donation" to obtain access to GPL or similarly licensed code violates the GPL (or the respective license) and will get your ass sued by the FSF. Thusly, linking to a site that violates the law will land XDA in trouble.
RMS would **** bricks over what some of the devs here have done.

I get that, and for those situations, it overrides anything I said here in this thread.
But that's not the whole story in all situations...thus the thread I created.

MeetFace said:
I get that, and for those situations, it overrides anything I said here in this thread.
But that's not the whole story in all situations...thus the thread I created.
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Sorry, I wasn't replying to you. I just want to make it clear the reason why the mods/XDA has reacted to some devs the way they have. It's to cover their own asses from legal repercussions.

No hard feelings, just wanted to clarify that I wasn't implying the above was the case with those types of issues. Didn't mean to sound abrasive, gotta love voice-less text =]
But again, I do agree with, people should follow the rules, people should not take things so personally, and in and open source environment, people should get so selfish.

I fully agree with you. And the loss of emotion and everything else by using text-only is something that completely enrages me when I want to actually talk to my friends who live half-way around the world but they refuse to use webcams or even voice. I've just resorted to telling them to screw off unless they call or video-call me. Far too much meaning is lost otherwise and only causes trouble.

dcowboys2184 said:
I'm leaving here soon! .. But not all is devs crying over a thanks .. Some of us members are part of the reason too!
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
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You're right. It is some of the members too. The members that bash people because they ask a noob question and feel that they are so far above the person that they have to put them down. There's bullying in this forum and to the point where I've almost stepped in and said something in defense of the person. That kind of **** has no place here, just like the other crap doesnt either.

You'll like this:
http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2006/02/70179
I've read the actual study years back in one of my business classes back at the old University.
This is why you can't take things personally all the time...will save you some butt-hurt =D

I don't really have anything to add to this conversation, but I just wanted to say that "butt-hurt" is my new favorite internet phrase. That is all.

MeetFace said:
You'll like this:
http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2006/02/70179
I've read the actual study years back in one of my business classes back at the old University.
This is why you can't take things personally all the time...will save you some butt-hurt =D
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Or add in a " " and make someones day! Lol
Sent from my SPH-D700

djbacon06 said:
I don't really have anything to add to this conversation, but I just wanted to say that "butt-hurt" is my new favorite internet phrase. That is all.
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I'll have to admit, your appreciation of my usage of the phrase afforded me not a few audibly deep belly chuckles.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

I started a thread about this a while ago. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1002595
I have a slightly different take on all of this. While I'm glad that most of today's issues are resolved these problems will arise again. This whole thing went down today because someone complained about pieces and parts of a developers ROM. Then I got dragged into this because I use the Bonsai kernel that I made NO changes to. Apparently all I had to do was post a link to the Bonsai source code and the problem went away. There are not a lot of us left here in the Epic forums for various and often times preventable reasons.
There is to much inconsistency with how these forums are moderated. Is impaler gone now? I mean it's like one day everything is ok and then the next day it's a problem. In all fairness to the mods they are over worked and simply not paid. Perhaps, xda should think about paying these guys a little something for their efforts. Perhaps XDA is growing to fast for it's own good. I mean in my opinion is quality over quantity.
My other issue is the in-fighting. We have people here that live to make drama and start flame wars. I'm not singling anyone out on this but it happens and a lot more often in the past few weeks. I don't know why we don't focus more on purging the forums of problem people rather then productive developers that choose to venture away from xda. We also need to be very careful about publicly accusing people of being in violation of a GPL. Falsely accusing someone of something should not be taken lightly. All it serves to do is misinform the community and cause confusion for the users as to what really happened. Not to mention the damage done to someones reputation.
XDA would be nothing without the developers and users that make it up. I realize that XDA makes the rules and are well within their rights to do so. But sometimes some of these rules need to be revisited from time to time to make sure they are applicable especially when a site is growing as rapidly as XDA is.
This place used to be an escape for me. Something I enjoyed participating in but anymore it serves to cause more stress then it helps to manage. If we want this community to survive we ALL need to think about how we carry ourselves here and what kind of behavior and attitude we deem acceptable. I'm very frustrated with the direction this is all going in and I have really tried to keep us going in the right direction. We all play a part in the negativity and we ALL NEED to play a part in making things better.
For the record, I thought today was handled pretty well as far as transparency goes. So Thank You.

Threads like this need to go away. Drama explaining the drama. Wish the mods would just delete any drama threads here.

ATRIX forum turning me off

I check all over this forum for all known kinds of phones and used to be very active over in the captivate forums. And theres one difference here a lot of you guys are just rude. Its kind of making me not even want to be a part of xda anymore. Its like most of you are just here to be douchebags.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App

I have to agree with you...it does appear that some people here a lot less cordial than over at the Captivate forum...if it wasn't for my 1006 with the terrible GPS I probably would have kept it and waited for the Attain.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App

We are so roods! Let's come to a forum and troll a bunch of people trying to recover from bricks
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App

Hydro360 said:
I check all over this forum for all known kinds of phones and used to be very active over in the captivate forums. And theres one difference here a lot of you guys are just rude. Its kind of making me not even want to be a part of xda anymore. Its like most of you are just here to be douchebags.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App
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I agree... people are attacking devs and making false accusations saying that they are full of **** just because they haven't released anything yet or that it dosent work right out of the gate. Maybe once everyone calms down and decides to be a bit patient then maybe people will be able to get some work done instead if dealing with all the whiners. I feel bad for all the devs for having to put up with it all.

[troll]
...which.. forum turns you on? ;D
[/troll]
i agree, the atrix forum is filled with a bunch of kids. the captivate forum was way better =/

coming from a background of development and being involved with computers from young age and doing actual work I can easily assume that most people that have atrix are people that have decided to pay $$ for a good phone. Most of these people do not have background of normal programmers so it is understandable that they cannot comprehend how much effort goes into writing each line of code and making sure each line of code works flawlessly with the rest of the code.
I would simply suggest that if people were more patient and let people with more experience to TEST all new releases for bugs before doing it themselves we would have a much better atrix forum

xredjokerx said:
[troll]
...which.. forum turns you on? ;D
[/troll]
i agree, the atrix forum is filled with a bunch of kids. the captivate forum was way better =/
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I'd say most came from that area. Unfortunately, it spoiled some people due to the success devs had with that phone. Now that we're unlocked, hopefully we can get away from those dark days

Nothing of this happen if devs say something "i will release xxx on next xxx weeks", even if its a lie, or maybe "i'll not release this, period". Simple.
Forum is a community like a city, do you imagine live on a city where the govern doesn't say nothing and make what they want? Revolution like is happening on some afrika countries.
Bad compare, but true. No one is obliged to do something, but when you say in public that you are developing, you have commited to do, so people wait some ETA, status of developing etc...
I was developing some app for students around the world, but when my atrix got bricked i loose the will to do, but i had not promised to anyone or advertise to anyone.

LMAO
This forum really did turn into a flamefest in the last month or two. I've never seen a sub forum full of so much hate!!

bongd said:
LMAO
This forum really did turn into a flamefest in the last month or two. I've never seen a sub forum full of so much hate!!
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And everyone will loose, community will enter in a war, and motorola and others manufactures will win the right of control our lifes.

Long time lurker
As a long time lurker i have to agree, people seem to forget that people here are donating their time and skill free of charge. Some times things don't go to plan other times real life gets in the way.
The devs here deserve our support and respect. I joined just after I got my HD2 and the number of times i have been rescued from bricking my phone is beyond count. I love this forum, at the moment the atrix forum does remind me of chat avenue, any one remember that site?

i think its much nicer coming from the x10 forum o.o

Hydro360 said:
I check all over this forum for all known kinds of phones and used to be very active over in the captivate forums. And theres one difference here a lot of you guys are just rude. Its kind of making me not even want to be a part of xda anymore. Its like most of you are just here to be douchebags.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App
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+1
OP I couldn't agree with you more.
We have a couple of known users here that think they are above the "XDA Community". This doesn't help when new users sign onto XDA, and think this type of behavior is the norm.
I understand that rookie mistakes can be frustrating, but were supposed to help and not put down others around here.
For anybody that started XDA before the Atrix, it's easy to tell how sour this place can get at times.
Hopefully more people stand up, and help clean up some of that "stuff" around here...

I need to agree =/.....
but I think with unlock bootloader more serious people come where to play with atrix, I will not leave xda, I'm here since 2007 soo xD
I've been pass good moments here .....found good and exelente solutions, have a few problemes with some crazy users.....eheh

Hi,
I see the odd snarky remark from the un-socialized, but what is dragging the forums down these days is short attention span and laziness. Resurrected threads, multiple topics on the same thing. It's endless.
Cheers!

devbro said:
coming from a background of development and being involved with computers from young age and doing actual work I can easily assume that most people that have atrix are people that have decided to pay $$ for a good phone. Most of these people do not have background of normal programmers so it is understandable that they cannot comprehend how much effort goes into writing each line of code and making sure each line of code works flawlessly with the rest of the code.
I would simply suggest that if people were more patient and let people with more experience to TEST all new releases for bugs before doing it themselves we would have a much better atrix forum
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lol this is exactly why I didn't hop on the latest roms and mods yet (except for Pudding, which I "ate" right away!)
As a rule of thumb, I am never an early adopter.

xepter said:
i think its much nicer coming from the x10 forum o.o
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This is my first android phone, and first reason to come to xda. This does seem related to restlessness of not being able to mod the phone the way other phones can be. Now that the bootloader unlock is out of the bag, I was figuring I would see less hostile members, and perhaps this will be the case when there isn't an inferiority complex about being behind other phones in development ability, i.e. CM7 with overclocked kernel combination is available and stable.
Everyone could use a j and some Bob Marley.

devbro said:
coming from a background of development and being involved with computers from young age and doing actual work I can easily assume that most people that have atrix are people that have decided to pay $$ for a good phone. Most of these people do not have background of normal programmers so it is understandable that they cannot comprehend how much effort goes into writing each line of code and making sure each line of code works flawlessly with the rest of the code.
I would simply suggest that if people were more patient and let people with more experience to TEST all new releases for bugs before doing it themselves we would have a much better atrix forum
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Click to collapse
If "anyone" doesn't have the funds for a replacement, IMHO it's best not to test the "deep end" of the swimming pool.
Let "multiple people" confirm things first, or play it safe with "Official OTAs"...
Sent from my MB860 using XDA Premium App

The Atrix forums are the worse out of the ones i've spent time in (captivate, focus, inspire and Atrix). Never have I seen so much *****ing, fighting and crying over every little thing. But im here to stay either way
Sent via the power of a unicorn's horn.

The Atrix forums was the first one I've seen on XDA, the Atrix being my first device. I didnt really think much of it, since I've seen worse forums before. But once I got a nook color and saw how peaceful that section was in comparison, I've been kinda thinking the same thing.
Many people here need to realize the value of patience, the meaning of donations, the effort of actual developers and the responsibility involved in flashing untested code. And the search button.

What's wrong with XDA?

When I first came to this forum, I was admittedly lost and confused.
I had my Samsung Vibrant for a very short time, and it was giving me non-stop problems; It was nothing; but a headache. I bought the phone believing some of the hyperbole that surrounded it. My previous Samsung (Dumbphone) had worked beautifully for a year until it's touchscreen died. Considering the fact that it featured a "resistive" touchscreen, and factoring in normal wear from daily use. I just couldn't be mad about it. It served it's purpose. This was my reason for purchasing the Samsung Vibrant. I was ready to buy a much better device with a better touchscreen; I had done my homework on Android, and was waiting for the right time to purchase an Android device.
I didn't want the Behold 2; I checked it out, and after handling a live model at the store, it felt cheap and I was a little surprised by that; because the Behold 1 was literally made with REAL Metal etc.
I visited this site, and realized that I could ACTUALLY replace the inoperable ROM
that was leaving my Samsung Vibrant non-functional
I posted my issues looking for answers and was instead attacked vigilantly by developers and other members here
This was the exact opposite of what I was expecting.
I've noticed that Developers here frequently bully other users here, and they have friends who use rogue tactics which cause the developers to close ANY thread which openly criticizes Samsung or T-Mobile in a negative way.
Recently we found out that the creator of the Cyanogen mod was just hired by Samsung!
Based on the response even to the most subtle of my issues
I have had nothing but suspicion since the beginning.
I have been wondering who your company holds in the best interest
Is it the people?
Yourselves?
Or the corporations you seek jobs (and/or) sponsorships from or look to gain sponsorship from?
All I can say is that when your site claims it is for the developers you leave some important things out of the equation.
This site is frequented by regular people who do not have the money or time to go and buy ten different phones to play with.
Some of us don;t have the time to sit there for hours and work on code
There are REGULAR people who are members of this site
they have issues like me, and we do not act like we know everything
we are not selfish and narcissistic.
You have never considered as as a factor
were sick of the bullying and favoritism
and I was the first to fight back
I am asking
What's wrong with XDA?

It's not you, It's me.

The best advice to any new user that I can give is to sit, watch, and read. If you come in your first day and post a question that gets asked on a weekly basis you will be flamed. If you have a reasonable level of tech savy, and watch and read the forums for two weeks or so 90% of your questions will be answered and almost all of those that aren't can be found easily by searching (the xda search function sucks imo but a Google search returns xda pages easily).
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

Lol Your post really touched me because that's how life and the real world is. Not so much on XDA. If you at least read the first full post and the last page of the thread you will know about any bugs/fixes and won't be flamed for asking the same question. I know it's kind of intimidating when people who build the ROMS tell you your wrong about something and openly express displeasure about having to answer the same question over and over. But you also have to keep in mind that this is an open community and anywhere you go in life or the internet there will be assholes and trolls but 99 percent of the members of this forum are cool people who can relate to not being able to afford 3 phones. Lighten up bud. If you have at least the slightest knowledge about technology and problem solving. You should be just fine. BTW most trolls have 0-25 posts and 0-3 thanks and are juniour members. Just something I thought I'd share.

It be like dat
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App

oh, and to answer your question, it sounds like you are the problem with xda. i've never had a problem. i've never blamed samsung or tmob for me purchasing the vibrant (and i love my vibrant), i don't demand or expect anything from the devs, i just appreciate what they do for us and try and help others when i can.

It's about respect bro.
I've only been flashing for a couple months but i was lurking for a month before I posted.
I read, learned, and then asked. I got flamed sure, but now I try to help other users with their repeat questions so the devs don't have to.
Anyway... your post is probably going to fall on deaf ears.
You do not complain ON the site you're complaining ABOUT.
You're wasting your time and venting to the community you're venting about.
Pretty much making people mad at you is all you did
Sorry man.
Vibrant+MIUI

I've been here a while. I just lurk so I don't have to deal with assholes. I also read and use the search to avoid asking questions. 98% of the time my questions have already been asked and I find the answer myself.

Hey MicBeast, how did that class action law suit go for you? Make any more songs about it?
Its funny how you sound self righteous here, when I remember a much different person starting a lot of drama when I first saw your name popping up around here, a simple search and anyone can read that whole soap opera.
But hey, this is just one man's opinion.
Sent from my ZenDroid, meditating on the XDA App

Dude....
Something uncomfy crawl up your pants leg ?
I've asked plenty of questions on this site....always got the answer (granted a few asswipes always show).
I've *****ed about both Slambung and Tblowbile, no one bad mouthed me for it.
Hell, I have a Motorola Photon on Sprint now (yes, it WAS that bad).
I don't see the problem.
If you don't like it.....walk the hell away.
Not one soul forced you to be here.

MicBeast, I just skimmed your 125 posts.
I will not say much, but maybe you should really think about what's wrong with xda... Keeping in mind that xda is a place for developing predominantly.

I've never had this kind of experience personally, and I actively discourage it in my thread. My thread its full of helpful nice posts and great individuals. I don't do this for any reason but the love of doing so, and never plan on doing it any other way. Its rude, insulting, and wrong to generalize anyone, you have only interacted with a fraction of the people on here. Once you have spoken with EVERY person, then you can make a statement, for now, please refrain from these gross generalizations.....
Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk

I thought you have an Iphone now? So why are you lurking on these forums still?
You have nothing better to do than to waste your time harassing people you don't know on the internet?
If I remember correctly, I've seen YOU bullying quite a few different members. Causing much more drama than any developer I've ever seen.
XDA is for developers to share and "develop" their work, share ideas, etc... They don't necessarily have to be every newbie's personal tech support agent. They can help who they want on their own free will... And if they don't feel like being nice, or get fed up with the same questions asked over and over again, then by all means let them. No one is paying them, and they certainly aren't bound by any contracts.
This isn't a service, there's no 1800 number to call and complain to. It's a public forum, so deal with it. Take some time and appreciate the information that this forum is bulging at the seams with, for free, for anyone to learn.

I just looked at ur post an yea u are what is wrong with xda u go around an complain about how things aren't working troubleshoot it ur self an what about that iPhone which is "better" than android go to whatever fourm they have an just go away :-/
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA Premium App

Ok..here we go:
The name of the site should be a clear shot of what this site is all about, XDADEVELOPERS.COM.
Secondly...what's "wrong" with this site is the same as any other site...some members, either old or new, that think that they opinion is more valuable than other and for that they tend to bully themselves around
Third...why even start a thread about this topic when you clearly know the reaction it's going to cause...in my book that is considered a type of trolling and even though I'm up for trolling the OT fora every now and then, do not agree with threads that will stir up the pot (if you know what I'm mean )
Hence, thread closed.
Best regards with your future endeavors mate...come back and visit

Br1ckd is gone to root, goodbye xda.

Moving on to greener pastures
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA

See ya' on the flip side ...

Yeah, I think I may move as well but I'll keep in touch with xda. seriously, mods. This forum is for Developers, not for you to be a little ***** and think you're the king of everything.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using xda premium

The f*k happened anyway?!?? I heard rumors and I'm not stateside so I don't log in as much so I really don't know what happened

Oo oo I know

This happens in every phone forum on this site. I have been on xda (as a user only) since the g1. I think it is good that the devs leave this site. Xda is only the first step for a new dev. Since the mods do not understand the term "development". Your everyday user should not be able to post in a dev thread. That is why we have a general forum. The Dev thread is for developers to talk to other developers to make a better product. It is not a place for users to complain and bad mouth developers, all that does out make them leave. Maybe one day xda will realize that.....cyanogen started on xda....he had his own site now....I wonder why.....lol
Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk

And without developers say goodbye to your advertising sponsorship. Slippery slope guys.
Remember, this is just a Web forum, nothing more and nothing less.
Maybe a revaluation of your perceived value of importance is known order.
It's just a real shame that the best devs keep leaving, and always for similar reasons. Biting the hand that feeds is never smart.

lostwhat83 said:
This happens in every phone forum on this site. I have been on xda (as a user only) since the g1. I think it is good that the devs leave this site. Xda is only the first step for a new dev. Since the mods do not understand the term "development". Your everyday user should not be able to post in a dev thread. That is why we have a general forum. The Dev thread is for developers to talk to other developers to make a better product. It is not a place for users to complain and bad mouth developers, all that does out make them leave. Maybe one day xda will realize that.....cyanogen started on xda....he had his own site now....I wonder why.....lol
Sent from my SGH-T959 using Tapatalk
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No its good for everyday people to post what they get when they flash new roms. Now bad mouthing that's a different story..

Hmmm that's ridiculous..
But i like this site..

Did people get butthurt over some ROMs not working or something? I'm confused, I would expect the devs to encourage bug testing and criticism...

clofan said:
Did people get butthurt over some ROMs not working or something? I'm confused, I would expect the devs to encourage bug testing and criticism...
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I don't know exactly what happened, but it wasn't something that an average user did. Brick'd was a fun guy. One of the mods decided to close the thread for a reason that I do not know, and brick'd wanted to say goodbye.
oka1 should be the only mod for our forum, he actually gets us + hes pretty damn cool. even though i have like 70 infractions from him from a year ago haha

Judging from Br1ckd's post in Zen I think something happened to another on the DD team. My guess is it was Dan but not sure. The mod in our tablet forum can go on power trips. Because Br1ckd is a Recognized Developer he has the power to lock/unlock his own thread.
Pretty sure it was an all for 1, 1 for all type thing. He's in a better place now. So lets not mourn his loss but rejoice in his new beginning. Hey, it's almost Easter and Padre Wood is done with his sermon.

Woodrube is on point. I pulled my stuff, closed my threads, and stopped hosting on xda due to something that happened in the sgs2 forums between a trusted friend and DD member, and an overzealous, aggro moderator. As well, the same DD member has also been receiving harassing pm's that the mods didn't seem to want to help with.
I've spoken with Oka1 about my decision and the facts surrounding it, and thanked him heavily for his part in cleaning up the Vibrant forum in recent months. He really has had a big hand in bringing this particular subforum to where it is now.
I harbor no ill will towards anyone over here and I still check in from time to time. However, I also stand by those who stand by me. When my boy had enough of the BS, it was obviously time for a change, and as a new team, we showed great unity in unanimously voting to move.
Hope this sets the record a bit more straight. Feel free y'all, to pop by and say hi sometime, sit a spell, and visit some old friends, and some new ones.
Sent from my ICZen experience, via Tapatalk

From this Moderator of the Vibrant
I Like all the guys in this forum, and this forum's Devs have been Stellar and worked together to keep things even and fair, properly giving credit to those who deserve. AS to the other forums I really do not know what happened, but I do know the SGS2 forums is a pretty tough bunch. So, it is understandable that some devs would get tired of the rowdiness..... That's unfortunate. I will strive to talk to the superiors about this incident so XDA can learn from it and make this forum a more conducive environment for all......
Thanks to all in this forum for being the good participants you are ........ ~~~ oka1

lostwhat83 said:
This happens in every phone forum on this site. I have been on xda (as a user only) since the g1. I think it is good that the devs leave this site. Xda is only the first step for a new dev. Since the mods do not understand the term "development". Your everyday user should not be able to post in a dev thread. That is why we have a general forum. The Dev thread is for developers to talk to other developers to make a better product. It is not a place for users to complain and bad mouth developers, all that does out make them leave. Maybe one day xda will realize that.....cyanogen started on xda....he had his own site now....I wonder why.....lol
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They just need to have a better "recognized developer" system. that way ONLY developers can post in dev section, and they have an available option to enable/disable posting in their thread - leave discussion threads for the general section. as long as the moderators cleaned up the general section once a day, making sure there is only one discussion thread per rom - it would be a flawless system
I think the more annoying thing is how people can theme a ROM, add a couple apks, along with some build.prop/ram tweaks, and then post it in the dev section as a new ROM. that drives me mad, and then the noobs encourage this behavior (because they dont know any better) by saying "why complain about having more options??", and by calling these members "developers" - release it under themes/apps, not development
^^the end result of this is a cluttered development section with multiple versions of the same ROM - all of them having poor explanations - so you dont know which ROMS are legit enough to monitor because they all have the same damn features listed

What gives with this place??

Why are we losing developer's. .is it xda policy, or are they just sick of to many questions of why dont it work? ?

Easily can be summed up in one word , entitlement! Saw this on the lg g3 forum, people think they are entitled to roms and the Dev are there to serve. Forget the fact these guys do it for free and share their work with and take the time write directions in there op .. That people don't bother to read! Start being respectful and grateful or learn to do the work yourself. I am not a Dev but I can def see their site of it.

I was questioned about his earlier.. So here is my opinion on it. A few pm's I have sent out confirmed a few things and even brought some other things to light I didn't even notice. Could additionally be some xda policy.
here

I hate people, this is why we cant have nice things.

What gives with this place. This place is amazing you can learn how to root android phones. Install custom recoveries. You can learn alot of stuff which can help you. You can ask seniors or others for help and they might cooperate. I am happy this site exists.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using XDA Free mobile app

I too was inspired but recieved pms asking when my roms comming out n asking for etas its not coming out least not to xda

I can tell you it is not XDA policy.
What it most likely is from what I have read is the influx of the entitled members. Moderators are reactive. We need to see reports on posts, then we can see what is going on. The problem with that is sometimes no one reports a post or issue, and the flaming goes on for days before someone reports it. This is a site of over 6 million users...thousands joining each week. So many posts of "Give me root NAO!" "Can we haz update Nao" Or the ever popular "Your ROM looks like a child made it" It would be a great help if no one responded and someone reported it...eazy peezy clean up and PM sent to that member. Instead the developer stressed from all the constant updates and support, blows up at the member...he gets a PM saying please report and try not to respond...he feels moderators are not quick enough...they go to G+...then guess what...within a few weeks they are yelling at users on G+...telling them to be nice, patient...blah blah blah. So you have developers upset because they cannot curse out these entitled members and/or the entitled members drive them crazy. They would rather work with 150 users on G+ than thousands of users here.
We do what we can but cannot stop a post before it happens..and then the damage is done...no matter what the moderator does. How do you become a welcome site for new members if you ban them on the first mistake? We try to explain what they are doing wrong. You have no idea how much time the volunteer moderators here spend in PMs with members...and how often it ends up with the moderators being cursed out. We also spend a lot of time talking to these teams..doing what we can to convince them to stay....there is a lot the average user does not see. It is not simply a developer taking his ball and going home. Many plan this for months..building their own sites. So help us help you. Report, don't add to the drama and cleanup...Thanks!

wojo797 said:
Easily can be summed up in one word , entitlement! Saw this on the lg g3 forum, people think they are entitled to roms and the Dev are there to serve. Forget the fact these guys do it for free and share their work with and take the time write directions in there op .. That people don't bother to read! Start being respectful and grateful or learn to do the work yourself. I am not a Dev but I can def see their site of it.
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Right. I miss being able to sit back and wait for cool roms & updates. But here in the Sprint Note 4 forums there's not much as far as developers goes. So what do you do? Either sit and cry or step up and do something yourself. I chose the latter. i'm a "take action" kind of person.
shawnsingh said:
What gives with this place. This place is amazing you can learn how to root android phones. Install custom recoveries. You can learn alot of stuff which can help you. You can ask seniors or others for help and they might cooperate. I am happy this site exists.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using XDA Free mobile app
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I agree . But you can't control the thoughts and opinons of others and people shouldn't be followers but responsible and respectful leaders instead. If somebody has a problem with XDA and/or members they want to pout, cry and throw fits. Then all of a sudden they want to take there "buddies" to their dream world "safe haven" where the grass is greener and things are so perfect and business is booming... uum ok, whatever. I refuse to play into that game. I'm a grown man and I accept and take responsibility for my actions and don't need to lay blame on XDA and/or it's not-so perfect members for my childish actions.
KennyG123 said:
I can tell you it is not XDA policy.
What it most likely is from what I have read is the influx of the entitled members. Moderators are reactive. We need to see reports on posts, then we can see what is going on. The problem with that is sometimes no one reports a post or issue, and the flaming goes on for days before someone reports it. This is a site of over 6 million users...thousands joining each week. So many posts of "Give me root NAO!" "Can we haz update Nao" Or the ever popular "Your ROM looks like a child made it" It would be a great help if no one responded and someone reported it...eazy peezy clean up and PM sent to that member. Instead the developer stressed from all the constant updates and support, blows up at the member...he gets a PM saying please report and try not to respond...he feels moderators are not quick enough...they go to G+...then guess what...within a few weeks they are yelling at users on G+...telling them to be nice, patient...blah blah blah. So you have developers upset because they cannot curse out these entitled members and/or the entitled members drive them crazy. They would rather work with 150 users on G+ than thousands of users here.
We do what we can but cannot stop a post before it happens..and then the damage is done...no matter what the moderator does. How do you become a welcome site for new members if you ban them on the first mistake? We try to explain what they are doing wrong. You have no idea how much time the volunteer moderators here spend in PMs with members...and how often it ends up with the moderators being cursed out. We also spend a lot of time talking to these teams..doing what we can to convince them to stay....there is a lot the average user does not see. It is not simply a developer taking his ball and going home. Many plan this for months..building their own sites. So help us help you. Report, don't add to the drama and cleanup...Thanks!
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I agree with you but I also see a lot of immaturity on behalf of these disgruntled individuals. They can't handle a few whiney disrespectful members and think thinks should be perfect and handled immediately by the mod team. Yea, ok. They can go elsewhere and see how grenn that grass really is. I won't miss a thing because without XDA these brats wouldn't have a clue or the slightest inspiration to do what they do to begin with. Bite the hand that feeds you? That's never worked out well for anyone. This isn't a business it's a hobby for developers. I don't think the majority of these private dev "teams" are raking in enough cash to pay one months mortgage. I point and laugh every time i read those hate comments by the you know who's.

ibcenu said:
Why are we losing developer's. .is it xda policy, or are they just sick of to many questions of why dont it work? ?
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I will tell you why I am stopping for awhile, no one appreciates anything, no dev respect what so ever, so why do people continuously stay on the devs a$$ about a time a rom is going to be updated, and much much more. It gets old, serious.
I can see if the OP does not clarify what the rom is about or when it is updated, THEY DON'T READ! I had one guy call me every name in the book because he didn't do a backup and flashed my rom and it continuously bootlooped, he proceed to tell me if I was around him, he would kick my........you get the picture, I told him simply, build your rom. problem solved...I suppose.
---------- Post added at 09:41 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:24 AM ----------
shawnsingh said:
What gives with this place. This place is amazing you can learn how to root android phones. Install custom recoveries. You can learn alot of stuff which can help you. You can ask seniors or others for help and they might cooperate. I am happy this site exists.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using XDA Free mobile app
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I will help people who read, and you can tell if they have been reading...

I can honestly say that I have not seen it this bad since I joined back in 2007 - A lot of unappreciative people - Everything I know how to do on an android phone, I learned from this site - I'm guilty of not reading through a thread all the way before asking a question but I also understand what this is all about - I enjoy coming here and catching up on the latest - I've had many different android phones and this is where I always come to learn - All I can say is, Thank You to ALL of the people here - I really don't understand why some people are so ungrateful for something that is given to them for FREE. Sorry for the rant, just my thought on the matter...

Im a developer, not an android developer, but a developer. Ive used xda for years, I answer questions when I can here. I hope the developers dont bail I love to see their input on things. Their personal insight has always been invaluable. I thank all of you guys I hope you stay.
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I don't understand some of these complaints we have nearly every custom ROM available..... When I first got here we had 1-2 stock/stockish roms now we have damn near every one that's out there.... I don't get it.... And as tat said I've learned everything I know from xda and some good friends from xda....no school, no classes, just searching, reading, and a few good friends..... Makes no sense to see these statements saying we have no roms, we have no devs, where are all the roms, where are all the devs....... If we are really so lacking in development why do we have so much available to us.... I can really only think of maybe 3/4 roms we don't have ....IMO only thing we are lacking in is custom kernels and we even have a couple of those..... Really makes no sense to me

spleef said:
I don't understand some of these complaints we have nearly every custom ROM available..... When I first got here we had 1-2 stock/stockish roms now we have damn near every one that's out there.... I don't get it.... And as tat said I've learned everything I know from xda and some good friends from xda....no school, no classes, just searching, reading, and a few good friends..... Makes no sense to see these statements saying we have no roms, we have no devs, where are all the roms, where are all the devs....... If we are really so lacking in development why do we have so much available to us.... I can really only think of maybe 3/4 roms we don't have ....IMO only thing we are lacking in is custom kernels and we even have a couple of those..... Really makes no sense to me
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Lol right ??
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It seems like people whining about the "lack" of ROMs and developers think its still 2010-2011. Back when I had my og evo 4g, there were so many ROMs it blew my mind. I don't think these people realize there are a LOT of premium android devices, and no one can expect these devs to buy every device and build a ROM for all of them.
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m4xwellmurd3r said:
It seems like people whining about the "lack" of ROMs and developers think its still 2010-2011. Back when I had my og evo 4g, there were so many ROMs it blew my mind. I don't think these people realize there are a LOT of premium android devices, and no one can expect these devs to buy every device and build a ROM for all of them.
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This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
And more....Xposed! Many people are not using custom ROMs anymore..stock with a few add-ons is fine when they have so much control of their own customization. Back in 2010-2011 everything was brand new Eclair and Froyo...so much innovation on mods and fixes...that eventually became part of Google code and most mods only needed a few tweaks to work on the next version of OS. Also back then you had teams and sharing galore...people were happy to share what they made and also how to do it...now some teams do not want to share, they keep the code to their teams only...Devs back then did it for love, the quest for donations was rare. And last but certainly not least...AT&T and Verizon! The 2 biggest carriers locking their phone completely...of course developers will buy something else that they CAN modify...and with that goes those devs that shared things across carriers. So when you feel..."lacking" in the development sense...look at the dev sections here and T-Mobile..then stop in and see the ghost towns in AT&T and Verizon. Moral of the story...be grateful for what you have and maybe think about becoming the next dev if you are sticking around Sammy.

I was thinking the exact same thing about the advances in android as a whole. Each version recently have been massive steps ahead IMO. Back then android still had a ton of tweaks that needed to be made be it for performance, battery life, or functionality. Now, Google has gotten a lot of good upgrades into the os so it doesn't need as much tweaking.
And xposed for sure. When that came out it became a game changer. Before, if you wanted to tweak anything it required someone to make a flashable theme for your ROM, or for you to dig in on your own and tweak it. DPI scaling was system wide and caused issues with some things.
Now we have SIMPLE tweaks for every aspect of the device it seems. And per app DPI changes!!!
I would love to be a dev but lack the time and resources to do stuff, so I'll happily support any dev that's willing to put the hard work into building a ROM. Used to be an HTC fan but Samsung will always be my go to manufacture as long as they keep having an external SD slot.
And big kudos to the CyanogenMod team. I finally decided to try out cm12 and I'm blown away with the level of refinement in the ROM and theme system. Its like I have a whole new phone. And to think they have a ROM for such a huge list of devices is nothing short of impressive.
I'll stick with sprint as long as they keep my unlimited data and keep my phones unlocked. Screw tmo and Verizon.
The other big thing I noticed. Custom kernels are becoming a thing of the past. Evo 4g had like, half a dozen different kernels, some were tweaks of each others, etc, because android still needed a lot of refinement. Now, there's some kernel tweaks, but nothing massive compared to back then.
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Yeah I hate what people have done to good devs. If I like something they made I send them what I think is fair compensation for a single user. Strongsteve back in the gs3/note3 days was one of the best in my opinion.
Sent from my SM-N910P using XDA Free mobile app

Exactly people think devs are here to to be there servent we do it for free im new to deving but not on xda

pbedard said:
Exactly people think devs are here to to be there servent we do it for free im new to deving but not on xda
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Where at would love to check out your work

Definitely agree, when I had my OG EVO and EVO 3D there were so many ROMs, kernels, and mods I flashed 10 times a day lol. Now you find a ROM that you like and just tweak it with Xposed. I do miss the anthrax kernels...nothing compared. But I jumped off the HTC ship after my EVO 4G LTE, I got it replaced 6 times in 3 months and every replacement broke from the slightest thing. I loved my S5 and I love my Note 4 even more. I don't like how they integrated the battery and got rid of the SD slot on the S6 which is worrying, hopefully Sammy wakes back up and brings those 2 things back on the next line of Galaxys. I was surprised that there was even as many ROMs as there are for the Note 4 given that it's so new. My HTC phones I was always eagerly waiting for HTC to drop the source so a dev here could make a masterpiece...