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There was an article recently on XDA portal about HTC losing its touch (http://www.xda-developers.com/feature/has-htc-taken-a-back-seat-on-the-innovation-car/#comments); after reviewing the latest products from HTC I must agree that there is some credence to this article.
Save for the Flyer tablet there is nothing new under the HTC sky; same old phones have just got a minor makeover especially the Desire series. I understand that the phone was particularly popular and a big seller, but must they beat this concept to death? Can there be something new on the horizon?
It has been over a year since the release of HD2 and its 1Ghz processor.
Nothing exciting since then. Meanwhile, the company has jumped on the Android platform with a gusto (and so have many others) but still producing subpar cameras, same issues since the old HD, same tech specifications, same old bugs, etc. Not to mention the battery! Even the tablet is entering the race a bit late. Not to mention 3gp video recording and resistive (?!)touch screen
I think there may be a good reason why MS has moved to Nokia instead, their announced partnership does promise something new.
I am a big HTC fan and have been a loyal costumer and would love to see something exciting coming from them but there is nothing yet.
What are your thoughts about this?
I too am a little dissappointed by their upcoming phones. The Desire HD2 is the only one to join the ranks of the dual core processors. Who knows, maybe they're working with Qualcomm and we'll see some devices by the end of the year running their new 2.5GHz single core, dual core and quad core processors.
Heres hoping anyway
I´m not really buying tech specs, I buy a device, a package. Yes, I´m not interested in average products, either.
HTC, among all other fishes in the smartphone pond, has become one of the smallest. They compete with multi-billion dollar companies which are far more powerful, some of them even developers and owners of core and key technology.
HTC has always been a company putting parts made by others together - in other words, they depend strongly on others. They indeed had some momentum with their approach to the total package. Thanks to their solution, the complicated and not-so-easy to handle WinMo became useful, some other good ideas (even if inspired by others) gave them a big group of fans. And finally, they "dared" to start sell and market products under their own brand. This step, by the way, was done not so much time ago.
I do hope they complete and/or correct the lacks and deficits they never got rid of in the past, and that they dare to take new approaches maybe, too.
The small size of the company has been an advantage in the past, now that the rules of the game have changed dramatically (especially in the past 4 years), it might have become a disadvantage. After all, if things go wrong, maybe they´ll go back to their roots: Producing OEM and ODM mass products for others.
The future will show.
The Last original phone to be released was the Desire HD... all the phones since then have been a complete knock of it or just slightly altered specs, design but in the end they all look like the Desire HD
They need a new design team because the current ones are out of ideas
tlerner said:
Even the tablet is entering the race a bit late. Not to mention 3gp video recording and resistive (?!)touch screen
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It's not resistive touch screen
It is capacitative one, it supports capacitive stylus
If this keep's happening i might even go back to the iphone =/
ehh ive moved on from HTC :/
i 'll give htc one more chance , after that i'll go for nokia when it releases wp7
hakuchi18v said:
The Last original phone to be released was the Desire HD... all the phones since then have been a complete knock of it or just slightly altered specs, design but in the end they all look like the Desire HD
They need a new design team because the current ones are out of ideas
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Desire HD was a clone of the HD2 and evo series last origional phone i would was was the Desire & the HD2
What do you expect from HTC? - Snapdragon processor - one of the top-end processors used in mobile devices, 576 of RAM - enough for mobile applications, designed to suit every taste, you can choose from several operating systems (WinMo, WP7, android) / * and to be able to change it on your phone.
The quantity of HTC users is comparable to iPhone users (they are more or less equal in my region).
And I'm almost sure, that less than in a year, HTC will present us a new monster. And I'm glad, that I have HD2, Android breathed a new life into it.
As for me, being one of the top devices for more than 1 Year means something
(from 11/2009)
Iphone 4g, in my opinion is the best,
- but HTC is not bad, it's cheaper (You can buy a good HTC device twice and even more cheaper);
- Different design and ROM solutions;
- Great community
iwanrakic said:
It's not resistive touch screen
It is capacitative one, it supports capacitive stylus
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I think this may just be wishful thinking on your part. HTC says it is ''touch-sensitive screen'' - they would say it was capacitative if it were so. Gosh, does that mean applying those annoying screen protectors and the resulting air bubbles - on a 7'' screen?! If you take a closer look as to why would one need to use the stylus one could not find a good reason for it. Scribbling doodles on a notepad? No, thanks!
Besides that there is a score of other issues which are going to prove troublesome for the Flyer (other phone models are not even worth mentioning):
- entering the Android tablet market late and with sub-features in comparison to competition + video recording is limited to 3gp (can't even remember what that looks like). Take a look at Galaxy Tab video quality http://www.engadget.com/2010/11/01/samsung-galaxy-tab-review/
- inferior screen quality and video playback
- at least the new Android version and not the old one (they say it may get upgraded but that is B.S., it should already be on it.)
- proposed high price
The only features which is better is a 1.5 Ghz processor.
When you enter a certain market late you try to have something different and better than your competition, such as, let's say 8'' or 9'' screen, better camera, nicer and larger screen resolution, etc.
PHOENIXROSE said:
Desire HD was a clone of the HD2 and evo series last origional phone i would was was the Desire & the HD2
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Absolutely agree. They came up with a Snapdragon processor and the largest mobile screen over a year ago and that was it. If it weren't for the phone's ability to carry several different OS' I think most of us would have already moved on. Don't get me wrong, I love my HD2 for all the things I mentioned above but it is time to upgrade and save for another revamped HD2 clone (HD7) there is nothing out there on the HTC's market.
I started another thread after MS and Nokia announced their new partnership 'threat to HTC' because I felt that MS was ditching HTC and it seems that this feeling was right on the mark. Somebody said that HTC eschewed dual core for now because they have something better up their sleeve , that they are going to release something revolutionary later this year, blah blah blah, but I disagree. The mobile market is a fast and merciless one; if you don't move fast and be on the top or at least close enough you lose/bomb with the consumers. One does not show up at MWC just for the sake of showing up, you put your best on the line. I am afraid with its 'new' lineup HTC has lost it which makes me really sad because I loved their products.
"The Flyer has a capacitive touchscreen with what's been known as an active digitizer, although N-Trig's hesitant about using that term to describe its wares." from Endgadget
http://www.engadget.com/2011/02/15/a-closer-look-at-the-htc-flyers-screen-and-stylus-aka-htc-scri/
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I stand corrected! But do you think that given everything else on this device it will sell well in a highly competitive market?
Seriously, 3gp, poor video playback?
I don't think HTC have list the plot here, why keep up when they can skip a mediocre generation of duel core CPUs when they can have a quad core set in the same year which probably will have longer shelf life.
They are doing the right thing
Sent from my duel booting beast of a phone
Totally agree
Jake.VR said:
What do you expect from HTC? - Snapdragon processor - one of the top-end processors used in mobile devices, 576 of RAM - enough for mobile applications, designed to suit every taste, you can choose from several operating systems (WinMo, WP7, android) / * and to be able to change it on your phone.
The quantity of HTC users is comparable to iPhone users (they are more or less equal in my region).
And I'm almost sure, that less than in a year, HTC will present us a new monster. And I'm glad, that I have HD2, Android breathed a new life into it.
As for me, being one of the top devices for more than 1 Year means something
(from 11/2009)
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Sent from my duel booting beast of a phone
You have to give HTC credit though, as they were able to sell the same phone with a different name. Lets hope they dont run out of names before chips.
Unless they go round again and just put a dual core in the shell and call it desire HD x 2 then we could have x3 and so on.
heres hoping HTC get some imagination
I came to Android about a year ago from iOS. As an Android noob, I found it amazing the capability 3rd party launchers provided. I went from launchers to rooting, rooting to unlocking bootloaders, and lately I've been flashing roms. I'm currently using joker cm9 and I love it, but I am thinking about jumping ship and trying out the Nokia Lumia 900. I feel like my Android experience has reached it's maximum potential. What do fellow Android users think about Windows Phone and specifically the Nokia Lumia 900 when compared to the Atrix 4g?
Beautiful device, but the software leaves a lot to be desired, IMHO, it has the worst bits of Android and iOS put together into one. The only reason I still bother using a Windows machine is because every game in the market requires DirectX, but the whole direction that Microsoft is taking it's platform is pretty laughable to me.
Yeah, performance wise, wp7 is nice, but albeit a little too basic, not that much to do as far as customization is concerned and the lack of apps, put the final nail in the coffin so to speak. Customization is what makes android so great. You can make it your own, even if 5,000 others have the same device. To me, wp7 still has a ways to go, before it can trump android.
#Sent from my God given Atrix 4G
Try windows phone 7 and if you like it keep it, if you don't exchange it.
I had a Samsung Focus that I got about two weeks after its release. I absolutely hated how boring WP7 OS was. There were no apps worth installing and customization was nowhere to be found. It is over simplistic in too many ways. The media player doesn't even have an equalizer.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA
I heard there is a new metro style launcher being developed for android...
wait for that
jadwv2210 said:
The media player doesn't even have an equalizer.
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This is making me reconsider my decision to leave Android. Altough I do have a pair of $120 Bose headphones that produce a strong bass so I may not need an equalizer
I have phones on both os'. I like both os'. The main problem with wp7 is the lack of Apps. And even if there is an app on both the android app tends to be more functional. I find the media player on wp7 to be superior tho. But day to day I keep my ATRIX.
I'm just going to start with that it is always going to end up being personal preference. You can have 99 out of a 100 people here tell you Android is better but at the end of the day, you can end up being one of those 1 out of a 100 people who prefer the WP OS.
Second, at the end of your inquiry you ask about the Lumia 900 compared to the Atrix specifically. In terms of software the Lumia will offer more stability and a more simplified UI at the cost of less customization and 3rd party offerings (basically, it's personal preference). With the introduction of WP7.5 Mango, functionality is coming closer together but still dependent on preference (for example, Google Docs vs Microsoft Office, etc)
In the case of hardware, the Lumia has a superior camera, better build quality, larger screen, and LTE. The Atrix has a higher pixel density but it's Pentile, it has a dual-core processor but WP7 runs great on single-core, so probably the only thing the Atrix has over the Lumia in terms of hardware is the better battery.
It may seem that I am favoring WP7 here but I am one of the 99 out of a 100 that prefers Android. So, my advice is:
If you're going to try a WP7 device, the Lumia 900 is the device to try.
pennjersey83 said:
I came to Android about a year ago from iOS. As an Android noob, I found it amazing the capability 3rd party launchers provided. I went from launchers to rooting, rooting to unlocking bootloaders, and lately I've been flashing roms. I'm currently using joker cm9 and I love it, but I am thinking about jumping ship and trying out the Nokia Lumia 900. I feel like my Android experience has reached it's maximum potential. What do fellow Android users think about Windows Phone and specifically the Nokia Lumia 900 when compared to the Atrix 4g?
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Click to collapse
Windows phones are way overpriced for their inferior internal hardware. I wouldn't pay that much of money to any decive that equips an ancient CPU/GPU and low resolution display. As an operating system WP7.5 is very boring and looks idiotic to me.
nokia no way!!!
---------- Post added at 01:20 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:16 AM ----------
Atrix 4G ICS with android ... and wonderful ... does not lack the Nexus
Semseddin said:
Windows phones are way overpriced for their inferior internal hardware. I wouldn't pay that much of money to any decive that equips an ancient CPU/GPU and low resolution display. As an operating system WP7.5 is very boring and looks idiotic to me.
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Click to collapse
I think windows phone looks nice. Customization is overrated. Do you spend hours customizing the icons, themes, etc. on your desktop PC? Or are you like most people and just change the wallpaper and move programs around? WP7 doesn't need customization because the live tiles are constantly changing. iOS is boring because it's static, but not because it lacks customization. WP7 looks like it's made for adults and iOS looks like it's made for little kids. Android is stuck somewhere in the middle. But I agree with you that the low resolution and single core processor is garbage.
Not trying to be disrespectful to the WP7/Nokia owners here but comparing an Atrix 4G to a Nokia Lumia is like comparing gold to charcoal. Although both have their own uses, they are totally different.
Android= feature rich, dual core capability, unlimited tweaking and improvement, open source and we are getting official ICS + linux.
Windows Phone 7= Amazingly fast due to its simple and minimilastic user interface, apps may load faster compared to Gingerbread but ICS will change this fact soon and that is all that Windows Phone 7 has. (The truth is i don't like tiles....it makes no sense to me and i also don't like the fact that you have to scroll down for ages in order to access an app in the menu).
Atrix 4g= Dual core, Tegra 2 processor, 1 gig of ram, lapdock, webtop, etc...
Nokia Lumia 900= Deadma5 doing the music of a of 2d holograms that Nokia advertises as 4d, single core, 512 mb Ram?, no webtop, lapdock, no innovation at all...... plus you don't have all the facilities that android will give you due to WP7 not being open source.
In the end, if you like the nokia phone better and if you enjoy using it more, you should definitely get it but personally, i would always go for the Atrix 4G.
Jibraldor said:
Not trying to be disrespectful to the WP7/Nokia owners here but comparing an Atrix 4G to a Nokia Lumia is like comparing gold to charcoal. Although both have their own uses, they are totally different.
Android= feature rich, dual core capability, unlimited tweaking and improvement, open source and we are getting official ICS + linux.
Windows Phone 7= Amazingly fast due to its simple and minimilastic user interface, apps may load faster compared to Gingerbread but ICS will change this fact soon and that is all that Windows Phone 7 has. (The truth is i don't like tiles....it makes no sense to me and i also don't like the fact that you have to scroll down for ages in order to access an app in the menu).
Atrix 4g= Dual core, Tegra 2 processor, 1 gig of ram, lapdock, webtop, etc...
Nokia Lumia 900= Deadma5 doing the music of a of 2d holograms that Nokia advertises as 4d, single core, 512 mb Ram?, no webtop, lapdock, no innovation at all...... plus you don't have all the facilities that android will give you due to WP7 not being open source.
In the end, if you like the nokia phone better and if you enjoy using it more, you should definitely get it but personally, i would always go for the Atrix 4G.
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Disagree with you in a couple of points:
1) dual core really doesn't matter (well not in this case), since the Atrix dual core isn't that good and WP7 runs perfectly smooth on a single core.
2) The Lapdock is a big pile of ____! Stock of course. The Linux ones are much better, but still don't expect anything amazing. After all you are using a phone to run it. However it is a nice addition that other phones can't do. So something is better nothing
3) the Gig of RAM really doesn't matter in WP7 due to the way it multi task (Androids way is superior if you're a power user, in my opinion).
4) Open source is not a valid point here, we have to wait till developers make it work on our device and this takes a while (if it ever does come). We got to remember developers don't owe us anything and they don't have to work on it if they don't wish to.
If you're worried about updates you are better off with WP7, Microsoft has committed to bringing timely updates to the devices and they haven't fail. And not to knock on our developers, I honestly am grateful and know they have been working hard but to date we don't have a stable ICS ROM and if I'm not mistaking the Source Code was release in early December. So sorry but Open Source shouldn't be given as a point to the Atrix.
5) Innovation, true Nokia's 900 doesn't have much innovation to it seeing as its just a reuse N9 body. But its still a very sexy device. Plus it has LTE
Not to mention that the Atrix isn't so innovative either, the only thing it has going for it was the Lapdock and that it was the first Dual Core phone to hit the US. Which does feel a bit rush to be honest.
Conclusion: I love my Atrix (even though it might not sound like it) and I wouldn't trade it for a WP7 (I actually have two) but that's because of my specific uses for it. WP7 is also lacking as a mobile OS (to my needs) and the app selection just isn't there. However the WP7 isn't a bad OS just takes a bit of getting use to. And who knows you might just enjoy it, honestly you just have to try it yourself. Don't make judgements off of what others think about it. Just dive into the water
Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk
Well I made my decision. I just ordered the Galaxy Nexus from Amazon wireless for 100$ It should be here in 2 days. I love my Atrix but I have a cracked screen so it was time for an upgrade. The Galaxy Nexus might be the last Android phone I ever own. In a year or two I will most likely switch to Windows Phone. By that time, they should have high def, dual core devices that actually have EQUALIZERS! Still think Metro UI is beautiful.
pennjersey83 said:
I think windows phone looks nice. Customization is overrated. Do you spend hours customizing the icons, themes, etc. on your desktop PC? Or are you like most people and just change the wallpaper and move programs around? WP7 doesn't need customization because the live tiles are constantly changing. iOS is boring because it's static, but not because it lacks customization. WP7 looks like it's made for adults and iOS looks like it's made for little kids. Android is stuck somewhere in the middle. But I agree with you that the low resolution and single core processor is garbage.
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To each their own. Android is by far the most customizable OS of the 3. This is what sets it apart from the other two. As you said, WP7 lacks apps/functionality, and iOS is simply crap. Wonder what Apple will try and sue over next.... They sure as hell can't be that 'innovative' company they were once known for.... now all they do is sue anyone who threatens to take #1 spot in the market.
As per the title suggests, whats the next WP8 flagship phone to be released?
I was really looking at getting the Lumia 920, however its going to be even more old when I upgrade in the next 2 months or so.
Thanks
None announced. I don't think the platform has gained enough traction for there to be any new handsets yet. 6 months old isn't that old. It will at least be stable.
There is rumoured to be a new pureview WP8 phone from Nokia, but it will be an odd shape like the Nokia 808 was.
There r some rumours about Lumia 1001, u can search on youtube for some renders and so on... It will have a PV camera like the 808 does, and thats the only certain thing... Nothing else is known.
miodrage said:
There r some rumours about Lumia 1001, u can search on youtube for some renders and so on... It will have a PV camera like the 808 does, and thats the only certain thing... Nothing else is known.
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Lumia 928 is the newest flagship coming to WP8. Due in April. If you wanna stay up to date on WP news, I recommend www.wpcentral.com
Dadstar said:
Lumia 928 is the newest flagship coming to WP8. Due in April. If you wanna stay up to date on WP news, I recommend www.wpcentral.com
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The 928 is simply a different version of the 920 with added support for Verizon's CDMA network along with VoLTE capabilities, although it will have an Aluminum shell and be lighter than the 920. But most of the phone internals is pretty much the same.
FeatherM said:
As per the title suggests, whats the next WP8 flagship phone to be released?
I was really looking at getting the Lumia 920, however its going to be even more old when I upgrade in the next 2 months or so.
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Computers don't improve gradually. They improve in regular jumps.
Lumia 920 has a MSM8960 processor at its core. This is a 28nm processor. Phones with this 28nm processors have been out only a few months. It will take 2-4 years before ARM processors get produced at sub-28nm.
Intel is currently behind at 32nm, but is planning to shrink faster (2013 for 22nm, 2014 for 14nm). But that is a different architecture and also has some issues (unsupported by iOS and WP8, most Android apps do not run natively).
This will help speed, power consumption, and cost.
At the moment to "improve" (e.g. Samsung Galaxy S4) phones are just getting spurious features (screens with more pixels than the eye can see, cameras with more megapixels than the lens can resolve, additional processor cores that will just sit idle).
Well, I would say that a thinner, lighter, all-aluminum version of the 920 qualifies as improvement. It would certainly make my friends with a 920 jealous. Also the Lumia 720 seems to be 99% of the 920 features at little more than half the price in a slightly smaller, lighter package (with an even better IPS ClearBlack screen).
Sprint is also promising a new high-end Samsung phone this summer, and the rumors of a high-end Lumia camera phone along the lines of the record-breaking Nokia 808 are persistent.
None of this makes the 920 anywhere near obsolete - there will just be more choices. (Trust me - I bought a Lumia 900 last year. I know from obsolete.)
Although my eye is on the 1020, its July and other than the 925 and 1020 Lumias there isn't any other new wp8 hardware being announced, HTC has been particularly quiet, I am satisfied (and I use that term loosely) with my ativ s but am bored and have no other new coming hardware to research over or dream about SIGHS
Sent from my SGH-T899M using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
There was an unofficial announcement / leaked certification documents and photos / whatever about a new ATIV phone from Samsung... frankly though, I'm not sure that I can trust them to support these phones properly. My ATIV S definitely has firmware issues, and they've gone unpatched for over seven months now...
I would like to see more hardware from HTC, and ideally see LG get back into the game and possibly even Sony/Ericsson (not that I'd buy anything SOny, mind you, but competition is good). Motorola is basically a zero-chance, but there could still be a pretty good ecosystem without them.
Sigh as good as the ATIV S is, the lack of support really bites, but I am getting a lot of use with the removable battery and expandable storage, I am eyeing the 1020 but an international version so that I can continue with my unlimited data plan with at&t, I briefly had an unlocked HTC radar and they detected that as a smart phone after several months I was shocked! I do want a Nokia but are they ever going to release a premium phone with a larger than 4.5" screen removable battery and expandable storage? Come on already Nokia!
Sent from my SGH-T899M using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
here you go: http://www.zdnet.com/sprint-announc...tiv-s-neo-windows-phone-8-devices-7000017332/
trytogetme said:
here you go: http://www.zdnet.com/sprint-announc...tiv-s-neo-windows-phone-8-devices-7000017332/
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Those two phones are really lackluster compared to what nokia brings to the table...
Lumia 820 blows them both out of the water...
@mcosmin222: Yeah, a 4.3" 800x480 screen totally "blows them both out of the water"... WHAT?!? Not even close. Don't get me wrong, aside from that (relatively) POS of a screen, the 820 is a good phone, but that display is damn-near minimum spec for WP7, never mind WP8. Its battery is also substantially smaller than that of the ATIV S and non-removable (wireless charging is a nice perk even if you have to pay extra for it, but when I'm home I plug my phone in all the time anyhow; it's faster anyhow).
I'm not quite sure where the ZDNet author gets "mid-range" and not a "flagship" out of those models... the 8X was the flagship WP8 device at its reveal, and the 8XT looks to be mostly an upgrade on that, while on many specs the ATIV S (including "Neo") is *still* the best-specced model: largest display, most storage (16GB + uSDXC vs. 8GB + uSDXC for the 820), largest battery (2300mAh, and yet it's both replaceable and in one of the thinnest WP8 models), 1.9MPx front-facing camera (Nokia does better rear cameras, but their front ones are an afterthought). I'll grant that these phones seem to have their clock speed slightly stepped down, and the 1020 pushed the bar for RAM (not that WP8 has a huge use for excess RAM...), but these are still decidedly high-end phones and if they don't count as "flagship" tier then nothing except the 1020 does.
GoodDayToDie said:
@mcosmin222: Yeah, a 4.3" 800x480 screen totally "blows them both out of the water"... WHAT?!? Not even close. Don't get me wrong, aside from that (relatively) POS of a screen, the 820 is a good phone, but that display is damn-near minimum spec for WP7, never mind WP8. Its battery is also substantially smaller than that of the ATIV S and non-removable (wireless charging is a nice perk even if you have to pay extra for it, but when I'm home I plug my phone in all the time anyhow; it's faster anyhow).
I'm not quite sure where the ZDNet author gets "mid-range" and not a "flagship" out of those models... the 8X was the flagship WP8 device at its reveal, and the 8XT looks to be mostly an upgrade on that, while on many specs the ATIV S (including "Neo") is *still* the best-specced model: largest display, most storage (16GB + uSDXC vs. 8GB + uSDXC for the 820), largest battery (2300mAh, and yet it's both replaceable and in one of the thinnest WP8 models), 1.9MPx front-facing camera (Nokia does better rear cameras, but their front ones are an afterthought). I'll grant that these phones seem to have their clock speed slightly stepped down, and the 1020 pushed the bar for RAM (not that WP8 has a huge use for excess RAM...), but these are still decidedly high-end phones and if they don't count as "flagship" tier then nothing except the 1020 does.
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Well, I wouldn't consider the Lumia 928 to be flagship either. The phone's screen is quite nice, but the storage is only 32GBs with only 20GBs usable, the battery is 2000 mAh with wireless charging (who is going to pay ~$80 USD for a wireless charging pad or $140? for the JBL speaker with wireless charging?) that isn't interchangeable, the cameras are quite exceptional (without looking at the 1020 being AT&T exclusive) and what exactly needs the extra ram? I haven't used any apps that have seemingly taken a long time to process or seem to stutter onscreen.
GoodDayToDie said:
@mcosmin222: Yeah, a 4.3" 800x480 screen totally "blows them both out of the water"... WHAT?!? Not even close. Don't get me wrong, aside from that (relatively) POS of a screen, the 820 is a good phone, but that display is damn-near minimum spec for WP7, never mind WP8. Its battery is also substantially smaller than that of the ATIV S and non-removable (wireless charging is a nice perk even if you have to pay extra for it, but when I'm home I plug my phone in all the time anyhow; it's faster anyhow).
I'm not quite sure where the ZDNet author gets "mid-range" and not a "flagship" out of those models... the 8X was the flagship WP8 device at its reveal, and the 8XT looks to be mostly an upgrade on that, while on many specs the ATIV S (including "Neo") is *still* the best-specced model: largest display, most storage (16GB + uSDXC vs. 8GB + uSDXC for the 820), largest battery (2300mAh, and yet it's both replaceable and in one of the thinnest WP8 models), 1.9MPx front-facing camera (Nokia does better rear cameras, but their front ones are an afterthought). I'll grant that these phones seem to have their clock speed slightly stepped down, and the 1020 pushed the bar for RAM (not that WP8 has a huge use for excess RAM...), but these are still decidedly high-end phones and if they don't count as "flagship" tier then nothing except the 1020 does.
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HTC 8XT has a dual core 1.4Ghz (compared to 1.5 from HTC 8x), has the same 480x800 resolution as lumia 820. The only upgrade it brings over htc 8x is the SD card slot.
HTX 8xT is made to compete directly with lumia 820.
Ativ S neo: same stuff, only it has a higher resolution screen, a bigger screen and ofc a bigger battery(to compensate for bigger screen with bigger resolution)
Lumia 820 will probably still look better because of infinite contrast thing and have better battery life because of lower screen size+res.
So yes, for the first time ever, I agree with Zdnet, they are mid range.
Ah - I didn't see that they'd stepped down the resolution on the 8XT; my bad. The 8x has 1280x720. On the other hand, the 8XT still has the better front-facing camera and speakers than the Lumia 820; I'll grant that they're both mid-range (because of that screen, mostly).
I'm really curious what you think qualifies the ATIV S (Neo or otherwise) as mid-range, though. It's not the display; larger viewable area and higher DPI than the mid-range phones is a definite upgrade, and "the infinite contrast thing" is just an attempt to make LCD do what AMOLED does naturally, so no, the 820 doesn't win there either (also, for those of us with actually good vision, the higher DPI really does matter). It is trivially lower resolution than the 920 or 1020, but I really do mean trivially. It's not the processor, unles shaving 0.1GHz off the CPU speed of the fastest phone for this OS drops it to "mid-range". It's not the RAM; the only reason the 1020 has that huge amount of RAM is so it can work with 41MPx images; most of the time it won't even be possible to use that much due to OS limitations, It's not the front-facing camera. It might be the rear camera, which is good but nothing special, I guess? (On the Neo), it just might be the battery; they put a slightly smaller battery in it than is in the ATIV S. Except, oh wait, it's still one of the highest-capacity batteries for WP8, tied with the Lumia 1020.
GoodDayToDie said:
Ah - I didn't see that they'd stepped down the resolution on the 8XT; my bad. The 8x has 1280x720. On the other hand, the 8XT still has the better front-facing camera and speakers than the Lumia 820; I'll grant that they're both mid-range (because of that screen, mostly).
I'm really curious what you think qualifies the ATIV S (Neo or otherwise) as mid-range, though. It's not the display; larger viewable area and higher DPI than the mid-range phones is a definite upgrade, and "the infinite contrast thing" is just an attempt to make LCD do what AMOLED does naturally, so no, the 820 doesn't win there either (also, for those of us with actually good vision, the higher DPI really does matter). It is trivially lower resolution than the 920 or 1020, but I really do mean trivially. It's not the processor, unles shaving 0.1GHz off the CPU speed of the fastest phone for this OS drops it to "mid-range". It's not the RAM; the only reason the 1020 has that huge amount of RAM is so it can work with 41MPx images; most of the time it won't even be possible to use that much due to OS limitations, It's not the front-facing camera. It might be the rear camera, which is good but nothing special, I guess? (On the Neo), it just might be the battery; they put a slightly smaller battery in it than is in the ATIV S. Except, oh wait, it's still one of the highest-capacity batteries for WP8, tied with the Lumia 1020.
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Oh well, we will call it even.
Ativ S neo is high end, the other mid end (it will probably still not have an equalizer)
and btw, the 820 has removable battery+ super-sensitive touchscreen (which comes in handier than higher res display imo)
Although im a windows phone fanboy I have been very bored by the lack of updates and hacks and new devices other than nokia
Sent from my SGH-T899M using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Do the other Beatz Audio (or whatever it's called) phones not have equalizers? It was an option all the way back on the HD7 (Sound Enhancer app).
I tend to feel that the touchscreen on my phone is almost *too* sensitive, but I don't live in a part of the world where people need to wear gloves much (and ski gloves are too thick for the 920 and presumably also 820 anyhow).
GoodDayToDie said:
Do the other Beatz Audio (or whatever it's called) phones not have equalizers? It was an option all the way back on the HD7 (Sound Enhancer app).
I tend to feel that the touchscreen on my phone is almost *too* sensitive, but I don't live in a part of the world where people need to wear gloves much (and ski gloves are too thick for the 920 and presumably also 820 anyhow).
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Yeh HTC has equalizer. The ativ does not.
Where I come from, super sensitive touchscreen comes in very, very handy.
My Nokia 521 is all over both those phones! Jk
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My eye is on an international 1020 so I can keep my unlimited data plan with at&t, im also very concerned about losing my Microsoft YouTube app, I have the xap and a dev unlock account but so far no one has been able to de encrypt marketplace apps and any talk of that, people start freaking out about piracy, I just don't want to give this app up when I switch phones, I seriously use it all the time
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noelito said:
My eye is on an international 1020 so I can keep my unlimited data plan with at&t, im also very concerned about losing my Microsoft YouTube app, I have the xap and a dev unlock account but so far no one has been able to de encrypt marketplace apps and any talk of that, people start freaking out about piracy, I just don't want to give this app up when I switch phones, I seriously use it all the time
Sent from my SGH-T899M using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why would you lose your Microsoft Youtube app if you buy a windows phone?
Because the app is no longer available in the marketplace and the xap cannot be side loaded
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noelito said:
Because the app is no longer available in the marketplace and the xap cannot be side loaded
Sent from my SGH-T899M using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
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Click to collapse
You realize the official "youtube app" is just a web browser in disguise, which connects automatically to youtube?
No I am talking about the I'll fated Microsoft YouTube app that was pulled after google threw a hissy fit, it has a beautiful modern metro ui, NO ADS, and you can download videos as well as play videos not intended for mobile, its better than sliced bread
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noelito said:
No I am talking about the I'll fated Microsoft YouTube app that was pulled after google threw a hissy fit, it has a beautiful modern metro ui, NO ADS, and you can download videos as well as play videos not intended for mobile, its better than sliced bread
Sent from my SGH-T899M using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
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I'll make ya one after im done with my curent project lol xD
:laugh:
Don't get me wrong. I like Apple Devices too. I own a Mac Air, AppleTV, etc. but all this hype and a $349 phone has better stats? Yeah, it has 64-bit but really nothing else. I hope OPO remains successful because this is the way mobile needs to go in the States. We have crappy providers, with crappy costs, with no "real" competition. The only way to combat this is with non-subsidized phones. This goes also for the crappy "Edge" type programs too which are essentially up-charged subsidized phones for people who like to upgrade on a regular basis. Now I have a phone that is $349, as good as 3 newer "FLAGSHIP" phones and I am not commit to any carrier... hell, $349 will be the 2-year subsidized cost of the 64GB iPhone 6+.... I am sure tooo that ETF's will go up... mark my words... since essentially you could get a iPhone 6+ 64GB for $349 on contract... cancel for $375... That's $725 which is definitely less than the $849 non-contract sticker price... hell I might even sell some if old Big Red & Big Blue don't close that loop hole.... I am sure though they thought of it and watch if ETF's won't end up being tiered like data...
Yeah I admit it is a good looking phone. But I think it is funny that apple is finally getting 1080 res when android has "been there, done that" and is going QHD. Bottom line though..... Apple will be getting a lot of people back that went to android for the larger screen.
Sent from my One using Tapatalk
Imo 64bit on a phone without at least 4gb of RAM is just plain dumb.
I love android, and I love my one, but I'm going back to the iPhone, something about it, idk. I just like it.
Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk
nicholaschum said:
Imo 64bit on a phone without at least 4gb of RAM is just plain dumb.
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Supposedly you need at least 3gb to notice anything at all.
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jma9454 said:
Supposedly you need at least 3gb to notice anything at all.
Sent from my LGMS323 using Tapatalk
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nicholaschum said:
Imo 64bit on a phone without at least 4gb of RAM is just plain dumb.
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Click to collapse
you guys should read that
http://www.androidcentral.com/why-64-bit-processors-really-matter-android
Qoute from the Author "And for heaven's sake — stop saying the big deal about 64-bit hardware is the ability to use more than 4GB of RAM."
ilea94 said:
you guys should read that
http://www.androidcentral.com/why-64-bit-processors-really-matter-android
Qoute from the Author "And for heaven's sake — stop saying the big deal about 64-bit hardware is the ability to use more than 4GB of RAM."
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Click to collapse
I know what I'm talking about. I never said it was bad, I'm saying its just not feasible.
A 64bit architecture utilizes memory more efficiently and more extensively, hence running with more RAM would be more favourable with a 64bit architecture.
Being dumb doesn't mean that I'm saying IT must have at least 4gb RAM, I said in my opinion, I would rather have more RAM with 64bit than 1gb RAM Apple provides. Also I would rather have a computer with 4gb RAM using 64 bit and not 512mb RAM using 64bit.
There's a difference between myself and the link you sent me, I'm not saying you need 64bit to run 4gb RAM, I'm saying running 64bit on 1gb is just "what's the point?".
nicholaschum said:
I know what I'm talking about. I never said it was bad, I'm saying its just not feasible.
A 64bit architecture utilizes memory more efficiently and more extensively, hence running with more RAM would be more favourable with a 64bit architecture.
Being dumb doesn't mean that I'm saying IT must have at least 4gb RAM, I said in my opinion, I would rather have more RAM with 64bit than 1gb RAM Apple provides. Also I would rather have a computer with 4gb RAM using 64 bit and not 512mb RAM using 64bit.
There's a difference between myself and the link you sent me, I'm not saying you need 64bit to run 4gb RAM, I'm saying running 64bit on 1gb is just "what's the point?".
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Hm well the link explains "what´s the point?".
But i agree with you about the rest
I changed my iPhone 5s to OPO few months ago, and after presentation iPhone 6 I'm still thinking that it was good idea! :laugh:
since at least iphone 4s apple just runs after the android devices in specs and features.
i cannot imagine a point why to buy apple at this time.
Lugke said:
since at least iphone 4s apple just runs after the android devices in specs and features.
i cannot imagine a point why to buy apple at this time.
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Click to collapse
100% agreed! I mean if apple can sue Samsung for billions of dollars why can't Samsung/HTC/Motorola/LG strike back? I'm still waiting for that to happen! Apple is annoying and ignorantly expensive!
As I was watching the Live Blog for Apple's event yesterday every time they said something I found myself saying "Yep...already have that..." In most cases they're features I've had for for over 2 years since I jumped ship from Apple. One of my friends was shocked that I've had NFC payments for the last 2 years with Google Wallet. "But but but you can't use it anywhere like iPay!" "....Yes... I can and have... NFC is NFC. If it has it both devices will work there...". He was trying to say iPay was more secure as his phone is locked and can be unlocked with his thumb. I go "MY FACE can unlock my phone...". When I saw the new Keyboard being demonstrated I literally help up SwiftKey keyboard I had installed and it was identical.
Last years iPhone5S I expected no real new features. They added the thumb print reader. But it was a refresh year. The iPhone6 and iPhone6 Plus are supposed to be leading products with new features... and everything "new" was a direct rip that Android has been doing for in most cases up to 2 years. It's sad to see Apple loose their innovation where they used to be the leaders.
The only thing I was impressed with was the Camera and display quality. I'll start with the display. Low PPI and resolution aside it is a improvement. Full RGB support means colors will pop a lot better. However unsure of what they say vs what it really looks like. So far, even though I now hate Samsung phones, my Galaxy S4 had the best color quality with its AMOLED screen. The Camera. So far I've had Galaxy S4, Nexus 5, and OnePlus for Android devices. My Nexus 5 was on par with my iPhone 4S, shot the same quality pictures with the same ease of use. The Galaxy S4 was horrible and a step far down from my iPhone 4S. The OnePlus camera is mixed. At times I get better quality shots than the Nexus 5 I had, but half the time they're worse. Under different shooting conditions everything changes. The optics and image stablzation and such they toot in the new iPhone6 makes me think they have made a even larger step forward with their cameras. Their Camera app also is AMAZING and very fined tuned to adjust the camera focus, aperture, and such automatically for you so you get great shots consistently, something I see lacking in many Android camera apps.. they simply don't adjust as fast to lighting conditions and such as iOS Camera app.
Anyway just my .02
ilea94 said:
you guys should read that
http://www.androidcentral.com/why-64-bit-processors-really-matter-android
Qoute from the Author "And for heaven's sake — stop saying the big deal about 64-bit hardware is the ability to use more than 4GB of RAM."
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Although this article does touch on additional benefits of 64 bit architecture, It's primary focus seems to me to be more about the new features of the new ARMv8 architecture. I would argue that many of the new features of the ARMv8 are not 64bit specific and could also be included in a 32bit chip.
For Android, the story is not simply 64-bit, but really more about the new ARMv8 Architecture. In addition to enabling 64-bit applications, ARMv8 brings a host of improvements in power efficiency as well as performance that have a direct and significant impact on nearly every 32-bit Android application in the market today.
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In fact, the article mentions only two benefits that are 64 bit specific.
they afford higher performance for applications coded to use the 64-bit features, and larger memory addressing for the operating system and multiple applications.
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Click to collapse
So in summary,
Without 64 bit software, the only added benefit to 64bit is larger memory addressing. There are additional benefits that will come with a new ARMv8 spec but they could be implemented in a 32 bit chip as well.
---------- Post added at 10:00 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:49 AM ----------
WoodburyMan said:
<snip>
He was trying to say iPay was more secure as his phone is locked and can be unlocked with his thumb. I go "MY FACE can unlock my phone...". When I saw the new Keyboard being demonstrated I literally help up SwiftKey keyboard I had installed and it was identical.
Last years iPhone5S I expected no real new features. They added the thumb print reader. But it was a refresh year. The iPhone6 and iPhone6 Plus are supposed to be leading products with new features... and everything "new" was a direct rip that Android has been doing for in most cases up to 2 years. It's sad to see Apple loose their innovation where they used to be the leaders.
<snip>
Anyway just my .02
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's typical, they add new to the iPhone features and tout them as groundbreaking. My 3 1/2 yr old Motorola Atrix 4g had a fingerprint reader to unlock the phone............. Apple releases TouchID and the fingerprint scanner last year and suddenly what's old is new again.
They do make sexy devices, just wish they weren't locked down, expensive and tied to a bloated piece of [email protected] software called itunes.
Well I personally don't have any Apple products, mainly because it was always an arm's length out of my price range, I'd have to say that I disagree with everyone here.
Well, mainly the ones bashing the company and it's choices.
Even though the biggest difference in terms of hardware is the processor being 64 bit rather than our 32 bit systems, I'd have to say Apple has a pretty solid build and standard. Granted that EVERY company has their flaws, I'd have to applaud Apple this time around.
Now, for the part where someone said "Oh 64bit processor without at least 4gb ram, that's dumb!"
Not quite. Apple's optimization is off the charts. Scary good actually. The 5s had 1gb of ram, and my old Amaze 4g had 1gb of ram. The 5s had a duo core 1.3ghz processor, my Amaze had a duo core 1.5ghz (O/C'd to 1.7ghz) processor.
Needless to say the iPhone was faster and more fluent in ALL of the tasks as compared to my phone which lagged and stuttered here and there.
It's all about optimization when it comes to Apple.
If I didn't have a OnePlus One and if I were a rich man, I'd definitely get myself an iPhone 6.
You (and the author) are confusing "64 bit" with other things like "more registers". Yes, the ARM processors that deliver 64 bit generally include OTHER advances that are actually nice, but 64 bit itself is a separable aspect of the design. Without knowing many of the details of the A8 processor, we can't say if any of these advances are actually present (or used). As such, you shouldn't translate the comments about "64 bit" with any other improvements that went into the chip design Apple is using.
That said, I can't seem to find any reliable statement on memory in the iphone 6, although many sources say it is still limited to 1GB of RAM. If so, it seems that the biggest changes are the new A8 SoC, screen size and onboard storage (option). Even the 64 bit capable chip isn't stated as being run as 64 bit, and for compatibility with most apps, it likely is still running as a 32 bit chip.
If the iPhone 6 plus 64gb costs less, I would use it, but at this price, triple the price of a OnePlus no.
I used an iPhone 5 for a couple of days as my primary device, love the ecosystem, everything just works, most apps I need are there and work fine, but I was unable to support the small screen size and the fixed single keyboard option. now with the bigger screens and with iOS 8 keyboard feature I can use one.
Currently on my Android device, I have at least 10 apps related to root/backup/kernel/etc, with iOS i don't need to bother about those stuff, iCloud backs up all apps, no need for kernels, cpu managers, root, and it just works.... but this comes at a cost: MUCH MORE $$$s
The talks about the new line of iPhones with meager specs are so pointless. iOS doesnt need to run all these 4GB of ram and whatever specs you want to throw at it to run smooth. iOS is optimzed way better than android and personally I see android never running as smooth and seemless are iOS. I know some will say if you have a GPE device, yeah I been there and done that and they are smooth but its something about iOS thats the top of the food chain when it comes to optimization. I am avid Android person and I love all tech and all that was missing for me was a bigger screen and they have that now so I may find myself pre-oreding one tonight.
Yeah android has had these features for years (NFC) but out of the majority of people (im not talking about us because we are tech heads and know about all features!) honestly know about NFC and know the benefits of it? Since Apple has came out now and introduced NFC payments, it will be mainstreamed now and it will be known by everyone now. Its sad the way that will work but it is what it is.
If you are a true tech head like myself then you have to know and respect both platforms and know that iOS is a premium OS where everything works and you know you have a reliable device, sad to say I cant say that about all android phones. They are getting better but even though they have killer specs when compared to the iPhone, Android is still behind...
tee00max said:
The talks about the new line of iPhones with meager specs are so pointless. iOS doesnt need to run all these 4GB of ram and whatever specs you want to throw at it to run smooth. iOS is optimzed way better than android and personally I see android never running as smooth and seemless are iOS. I know some will say if you have a GPE device, yeah I been there and done that and they are smooth but its something about iOS thats the top of the food chain when it comes to optimization. I am avid Android person and I love all tech and all that was missing for me was a bigger screen and they have that now so I may find myself pre-oreding one tonight.
Yeah android has had these features for years (NFC) but out of the majority of people (im not talking about us because we are tech heads and know about all features!) honestly know about NFC and know the benefits of it? Since Apple has came out now and introduced NFC payments, it will be mainstreamed now and it will be known by everyone now. Its sad the way that will work but it is what it is.
If you are a true tech head like myself then you have to know and respect both platforms and know that iOS is a premium OS where everything works and you know you have a reliable device, sad to say I cant say that about all android phones. They are getting better but even though they have killer specs when compared to the iPhone, Android is still behind...
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Click to collapse
I agree with singer of what you said but android is open source and there is no "ecosystem"control. With iOS the system is designed for one device using only approved hardware. It's much easier to control the look and feel and performance of an OS when it's designed for one set of devices.
I can't stand iOS but that's because it's too simplified and childish in my opinion.
rdar_93 said:
Now, for the part where someone said "Oh 64bit processor without at least 4gb ram, that's dumb!"
Not quite. Apple's optimization is off the charts. Scary good actually. The 5s had 1gb of ram, and my old Amaze 4g had 1gb of ram. The 5s had a duo core 1.3ghz processor, my Amaze had a duo core 1.5ghz (O/C'd to 1.7ghz) processor.
Needless to say the iPhone was faster and more fluent in ALL of the tasks as compared to my phone which lagged and stuttered here and there.
It's all about optimization when it comes to Apple.
If I didn't have a OnePlus One and if I were a rich man, I'd definitely get myself an iPhone 6.
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Click to collapse
No offence but Apple's optimization really is off the charts. It's total ****. Have you tried running Mac OS X 64bit on a 1gb computer? Kernel tasks rack up the computer's processor and RAM so quickly I get stuck on 8mb RAM left. I removed Mac OS X on my computer and kept it with 100% Windows.
Now let's forget about computer software and talk mobile software. The fact that you're introducing 64 bit on a phone that you didn't change in terms of specs, especially the RAM, think about it, dismissing the 64 bit-ness of this, if you were to load higher quality thumbnails and images to render the operating system due to a larger screen....remaining on 1GB of RAM won't help, as well as the 64 bit "optimizations" built in.
The only optimizations that were good, can't compare to an Android, where multitasking actually means multitasking. Apple's optimization is to deep sleep an app when you try to multitask, and that's not optimizing back in the day, to optimize means you make a certain action more efficient. If I can multitask the real way, and be optimized, as well as on the 64bit architecture, only Android will take advantage of this, because it has both the hardware and soon the software to take care of this. Or rather launching an app in 64 bit mode instead of 32bit mode, with sufficient RAM, your performance would be much better.
"Needless to say the iPhone was faster and more fluent in ALL of the tasks as compared to my phone which lagged and stuttered here and there." it is because of the natural interactive governor on the iPhone where the CPU anticipates the touching of the screen and racks up CPU to predict it. Google tried to mimic this but haven't succeeded until 4.3-4.4. Anticipating touch input is a nice touch, but if the iPhone ran on good Android-esque specs, that would be much better - that's all I'm saying.