HTC One M9 Camera discussion (not for photo samples)

HTC One M9 Camera discussion (not for photo samples) - One (M9) General

Albert Poon said:
May I ask you guys with M9 to take pics using manual mode? A tripod, phone holder, low ISO, long explosure to take some night views?
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This was missing in the flickr album. Long exposure 1/4, 1/2 or 1s shots. And please use flickr so we can see exifs easily. board attachments and imgur strip exifs out. I notice the phonearena samples have no exifs in them at all.
Though i have to say i like this one. Just enough silhouette to set the mood.
ISO 80 and 1/40 WHAT!!! for late afternoon Seattle in winter. I can't tell if its HDR or not.
---------- Post added at 09:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:43 PM ----------
xxquicksh0txx said:
https://plus.google.com/10388377056...6126393456474303042&oid=103883770561517758752 Link to the beetle picture on his Google+ with a resolution of 1108 x 625. Definitely cropped/compressed
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Taken with VSCO cam, ISO 50, 1/268. So ample light.
Also used flash. Sharpness is set to soft.
A nice photo.
---------- Post added at 09:22 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:17 PM ----------
vegetaleb said:
Here a comparison of crop between M9 and Note 4 in not very low light conditions taken by the Tweakers review, you can clearly see the superiority of the Note 4 in the details like the logos of Goodyear and the wheel:
I know it's not final software but this M9 camera is giving the same results the SE C905 could give 6 years ago
M9
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Note 4
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Note 4 is ISO 400, 1/10
M9 is ISO 640, 1/14
About half a f-stop difference.
What if the M9 tried to get that with ISO 300 ie ISO 200 +0.3 at 1/7 ? or go slower still ISO100+0.3 at 1/3 ? can't do these tricks with the note, slowest it will get is 1/8 and then its auto night mode kicks in which did not happen in this picture. S5 & note 4 have improved their low light capability over their predecessors in auto but i bet you can come close to matching it if not exceeding it with manual on m9.
Light in this shot is quite low btw.

th3 said:
This obsession is what makes every product better in every field, than its predecessor.
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That pair is not as important as you think it is and that applies for all with good light.
Where this 'trounces' occurs is in low light. I've already said what needs to be done.
Without this obsession, there can be no better or worse product, and you'll still be saying "good enough" to the HTC Desire camera
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with macros yeah i would because there is no difference there. I've seen three year old devices do excellent macros. Hint: macros are not a good demonstration of what the latest camera can do.
The only real innovation we've had in sensors is BSI over the last two years. More sensitive in low light. You couldn't do that with 2013 devices, m7 was the sole exception. The rest is processing, how much of it or lack thereof.
On a more general level the trick with these devices is to know when to compromise and when to be maximalist. There is no perfect device so what you end up with is what you can tolerate over what you cannot do without. Every device has this trade off. Unfortunately you are alone with making this decision. Unless you are lucky to find others whose requirements match yours closely. Now do you see why i said minor. its minor in a larger context.
What you're saying... 'Moving the goalpost' it's called. Common trick.
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no tricks. calling it straight.
i don't trust auto.That on some devices its always flawless is a myth. auto goes wrong even on dslrs. what will you do then ? blame the device or your own ignorance. better to understand why and what went wrong and then fix it. and you can.
What i'm sensing here is an unwillingness to do so. That is something else.
Your opinion is not supported by the data we all have.
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That does not make what i said wrong. Its up to people here to provide that data. particularly low light with manual.
Its right because i've seen the same done with numerous devices already. This is how cameras work. They need light.
Give them that and you get a good shot. simple.
---------- Post added at 10:19 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:14 AM ----------
tryfound said:
No, your whole post is invalid. I'm testing AUTO, feel free to grace us all with your superior photography skills when you get your M9.
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actually i should have said your tests were pointless and it was a waste of my time to go through them. test the note 4 in low light with manual in m9 that's what you should have done.
I wanted to see manual being used in the low light. You've got no excuses when the camera provides it. If you can't do that then its your problem not the m9.
bad auto does not mean bad camera. bad auto will be fixed. The Z1 took 3 months to get it right. What did people do, the lamers whined whereas the rest got busy with manual and got good shots from day 1.
make up your mind or sell.
---------- Post added at 10:45 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:19 AM ----------
vegetaleb said:
At last a camera comparison between M9 and Note4 http://www.phonearena.com/reviews/HTC-One-M9-vs-Samsung-Galaxy-Note-4_id3963/page/3
In daylight the Note 4 is significantly better, the M9 will smudge
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Show me smudge in daylight, i want to see how much. actually link the shots.
In low light even resized to 640x480 the M9 is very blurry and smudgy, the Note 4 is millions years ahead.
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All the low light shots have the m9 using high iso in guess what auto. The reviewer did not even try manual and blurred one of the shots because he could not hold a 1/7.
Conclusion: unless you want to use your photos only from daylight situations and only resized to Facebook and other social medias (of course no crop at all) . you should consider the Note 4 as a very good choice of camera phone in every situations.
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Do you realise that to display on a HD device you only need 1MP or on a full HD it only takes 2MP. Anything more than that gets resampled.
You don't let facebook or anybody else resize it you do it yourself then upload wherever.

tryfound said:
You're so full of yourself. How dare I waste your precious time.
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Look, you're not helping me, i'm helping you to help yourself as well as others in this thread.
Make up my mind or sell? Sell what? Some people here asked to see comparisons with the Note 4 and I gave them.
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And i'm pointing out why there were inadequate. They do not add anything above what reviews are saying.
I did not bother going through the imgur stuff since there are no exifs to see there. Assessing image quality let alone commenting without exifs is pointless.
To suggest that I should be tweaking manual settings on an M9 to achieve the quality of the Note 4's auto shots is beyond comprehension.
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auto shots are average x average, is this what people base their opinions on ?
manual means you take a test auto shot then see whether you can improve it in manual. That is how you will exceed what the reviews have shown and we get to see the best this camera can do. This is what any owner that wants to improve and exploit manual is going to do over time.
Why someone would not want to improve his shots is beyond my comprehension.

tryfound said:
Some more shots with the M9, large res then small res second. Had to use imgur because of filesize so these are compressed images, don't bother zooming for details, some of the higher res images I took have been reduced to a size smaller than the 'small' res images due to their original filesize, I guess that's imgur's way of compressing.
http://imgur.com/PeWfBMx
http://imgur.com/CNrpmW7
http://imgur.com/fOi00v3
http://imgur.com/dMQ1yXV
http://imgur.com/JmvdebB
http://imgur.com/MnF3Fue
http://imgur.com/2AtDjvr (HDR)
http://imgur.com/mP0g0aP (HDR)
http://imgur.com/NApwPvt
http://imgur.com/U8yHyuV
http://imgur.com/i04j8vr
http://imgur.com/1FPUAw7
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I just looked at images and they look really good. I am surprised M9 managed to capture that pristine detail I never seen before. White balance too looks so great not like previously green tint that was all over images.
One thing I am not able to find is camera data in adobe bridge and also colour space is untagged. That usually happens when photo being stripped of exif data. Have you by any chance gave some editing to them?
Thanks

I agree with a pack that camera should perform to the best on auto. If it doesn't , software has to be optimised if it's not then it's engineers faults Or hardware limitations.
it applies to the majority of the smartphone photographers . People want point and shoot.Even being enthusiast photographer and love digging my camera and phone camera I hate when auto underperforms when I simply want to take my phone out of the pocket and shoot.Every enthusiast can tweak but that defeats AUTO purpose .
There are average performers good and very good. Unfortunately M9 is not very good.Good ? Maybe....if light is favourable...at the moment it is consistently weak in certain situations. The usual wash out reminded me of the spill that when lets say camera lens gets in the studio shot or outside and for this purpose hood is used . This is one of the speculations I come up with. Somehow HTC phones consistently suffer from that. Could be they have same team of engineers that can't find the key to successful Software optimization or not so decent hardware just guessing here. Being visualphile that particular trade off with HTC devices just kills me.

nebulaoperator said:
I agree with a pack that camera should perform to the best on auto. If it doesn't , software has to be optimised if it's not then it's engineers faults Or hardware limitations.
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.
I've seen this issue with other devices. xperias camera software was never quite ready at launch. Lots of bashing. Took them a few months to get it right. Mostly auto. Then shots come out with lower ISO which you could have got yourself if you tried. Image quality is better now. why ? iso is lower. So if auto is taking high iso then low iso will get you a better shot.
So when people say camera is not working its auto. No other issues i can see so far. They will fix it but in the mean time if manual settings are tweaked you will get the results you want today. Most do not know how to do that or worse do not want to.
it applies to the majority of the smartphone photographers . People want point and shoot.Even being enthusiast photographer and love digging my camera and phone camera I hate when auto underperforms when I simply want to take my phone out of the pocket and shoot.Every enthusiast can tweak but that defeats AUTO purpose .
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General advice i give to people who cant take photos is go with the koreans or apple. if you want more then look at others.
First time i came across an iphone camera after seeing the usual controls in nokias and android was wtf do i do with this. Some shots can't be got with auto. when there is no access to manual then you are stuck. take it or leave it. its only a phone camera, you're not supposed to do anything more. Who said so ?
Many people take shots and figuring out who is at fault is a tricky business. Of course the tendency is to blame the device but the person taking the shot is the most responsible, always.
There are average performers good and very good. Unfortunately M9 is not very good.Good ? Maybe....if light is favourable...at the moment it is consistently weak in certain situations.
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Low light with auto. From what i've seen consistently boosts auto up. There are even night modes which to date i've not seen anybody even try. HELLO!
So auto is not picking these modes for some reason. Its a bug. But if you set it yourself then what is the result. Much better i bet.
The usual wash out reminded me of the spill that when lets say camera lens gets in the studio shot or outside and for this purpose hood is used .
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A lens hood decreases lens flare and saturates colours. Take a shot in shade of a sunny area. If you're getting lens flare then its clearly user error. Not just with this device but with any. I would just use my hand out of camera to block some of the light or avoid unwanted reflections. Here is a good example
https://www.flickr.com/photos/palmsolo/sets/72157651089646798/with/16274675233/
cloudy day, massive light box in the sky. Colours are all rich. Which is best. i cannot tell
interestingly enough the low end devices suffer less from this problem because the sensors are not as sensitive. They can take good shots in awful bright light which would be washed out with more capable sensors. Not much use indoors though.
This is one of the speculations I come up with. Somehow HTC phones consistently suffer from that. Could be they have same team of engineers that can't find the key to successful Software optimization or not so decent hardware just guessing here. Being visualphile that particular trade off with HTC devices just kills me.
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The ones typically from what i've seen blow out the sky. They are a little more quirky in getting those blue skies. Overexposed. HDR is one way to do it but it can be tricked also. i remember this work around from the m8 forum where this guy pointed close to the sun to lock exposure and then recomposed back on the scene. The picture was remarkably better. You don't have to do this all the time only in certain situations.

Review on bunch of cameras.
Gizmodo: The Best Smartphone Camera: Samsung Galaxy S6 Edition. http://google.com/newsstand/s/CBIw4ZO08yA

tryfound said:
Some more shots with the M9, large res then small res second. Had to use imgur because of filesize so these are compressed images, don't bother zooming for details, some of the higher res images I took have been reduced to a size smaller than the 'small' res images due to their original filesize, I guess that's imgur's way of compressing.
http://imgur.com/PeWfBMx
http://imgur.com/CNrpmW7
http://imgur.com/fOi00v3
http://imgur.com/dMQ1yXV
http://imgur.com/JmvdebB
http://imgur.com/MnF3Fue
http://imgur.com/2AtDjvr (HDR)
http://imgur.com/mP0g0aP (HDR)
http://imgur.com/NApwPvt
http://imgur.com/U8yHyuV
http://imgur.com/i04j8vr
http://imgur.com/1FPUAw7
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jauhien said:
Some yesterday snaps here:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/we88grvt72bldy8/4PDA_REQUEST.zip?dl=0
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One Twelve said:
.
Disclaimer: I should learn how to use quotes.
I've seen this issue with other devices. xperias camera software was never quite ready at launch. Lots of bashing. Took them a few months to get it right. Mostly auto. Then shots come out with lower ISO which you could have got yourself if you tried. Image quality is better now. why ? iso is lower. So if auto is taking high iso then low iso will get you a better shot.
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Whether it's ISO OIS or else it does not stop camera to perform well. Take A look at Iphone 6 it works wonders. Low light is not on the par with M7 m8. The thing you have to understand , strongly camera orientated phone should not come with a sticker on the box " want a better image use manual"
[/QUOTE]So when people say camera is not working its auto. No other issues i can see so far. They will fix it but in the mean time if manual settings are tweaked you will get the results you want today. Most do not know how to do that or worse do not want to.[/QUOTE]
A lot people say because AUTO doesn't work. Why would I have buy "they will fix it" if I pay 500-600 GBP for a phone. It doesn't work like that. And in most cases software improved performance but only to a point .I own M7 and know it's weaknesses.And I don't want to use manual though I know my phone from inside to outside.
[/QUOTE]General advice i give to people who cant take photos is go with the koreans or apple. if you want more then look at others.
First time i came across an iphone camera after seeing the usual controls in nokias and android was wtf do i do with this. Some shots can't be got with auto. when there is no access to manual then you are stuck. take it or leave it. its only a phone camera, you're not supposed to do anything more. Who said so ?
Many people take shots and figuring out who is at fault is a tricky business. Of course the tendency is to blame the device but the person taking the shot is the most responsible, always.[/QUOTE]
I saw ifone users don't even know AE/AF lock exist till I showed. Iphone 6 has the simplest UI that can be invented I also call it Dummy proof. I think you can get an app to have access to tweaks option otherwise it's a bit limited to my taste. I can blame phone camera without long hesitation for two reasons: if hardware sucks or software or both. Then no amount of tweaks can help you. M7 is notorious for washouts, poor dynamic range. I found HDR was never a strong suite of M7 neither M8 or M9. However if you can tweak settings you might get away bringing images to photoshop. That's what I do. On the other hand only minority people are enthusiast like we are and the majority should be at least faulted for what smartphone manufacturer didn't do in the first place. If iphone , nokia, samsung(from 2014) proved there is a lot more that can be done with camera.
[/QUOTE]Low light with auto. From what i've seen consistently boosts auto up. There are even night modes which to date i've not seen anybody even try. HELLO!
So auto is not picking these modes for some reason. Its a bug. But if you set it yourself then what is the result. Much better i bet.[/QUOTE]
Low light was nevera weak spot for HTC One line(until now M9) it was cloudy weather condition with little contrast, also situation when I have half frame window in and the other half room. It would go into extremes overexpose the light in the window or underexposedarks barely visible. Sensor and software is not coping with dynamic range. I kind of like night mode but found it to slow in some situation due to the shutter speed so I just used normal mode it did great though. I wish I could try RAW mode but unfortunately I am selling my phone today ( Not sure if RAW will be brought to lollipop for M7)
[/QUOTE]A lens hood decreases lens flare and saturates colours. Take a shot in shade of a sunny area. If you're getting lens flare then its clearly user error. Not just with this device but with any. I would just use my hand out of camera to block some of the light or avoid unwanted reflections. Here is a good example
https://www.flickr.com/photos/palmsolo/sets/72157651089646798/with/16274675233/
cloudy day, massive light box in the sky. Colours are all rich. Which is best. i cannot tell
interestingly enough the low end devices suffer less from this problem because the sensors are not as sensitive. They can take good shots in awful bright light which would be washed out with more capable sensors. Not much use indoors though.[/QUOTE]
I worked with photographer who used hood for the headshots and it was game changer.
For instance Iphone6 is least prone to that error but most Android camera phones I came across are. I was surprised by Note 4 results and S6 I would never think they can do so well. So it must be bug or hardware or both as I mentioned earlier. Nice photos from M9 but WB is somehow a bit off sometimes on the blue side( couple of weeks before it was to yellow green Funny enough you are the first I came across that used hand to block the light I do that too. I guess we both come from the same/similar trade.
[/QUOTE]
The ones typically from what i've seen blow out the sky. They are a little more quirky in getting those blue skies. Overexposed. HDR is one way to do it but it can be tricked also. i remember this work around from the m8 forum where this guy pointed close to the sun to lock exposure and then recomposed back on the scene. The picture was remarkably better. You don't have to do this all the time only in certain situations.[/QUOTE]
AE/AF is a very handy tool. I am glad smartphones have this simple yet very effective feature.

Quadrider10 said:
Review on bunch of cameras.
Gizmodo: The Best Smartphone Camera: Samsung Galaxy S6 Edition. http://google.com/newsstand/s/CBIw4ZO08yA
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I didn't think the M9 looked bad. Need to use a computer instead of my note 4
Sent from a mobile gadget...
---------- Post added at 05:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:52 PM ----------
And guys, chill out. I don't think M9 will have the best camera, but it will hopefully be enough. What I'm worried about is the speed of the camera and SOT. I will probably buy it anyway because I love HTCs mix.
Sent from a mobile gadget...

You're not helping anyone mate. Pig with lipstick is still a pig. No matter how much spin you are putting on it.
Everything you are saying is your subjective opinion not backed by any reviewer or already debunked. No data at all.
I don't see any fruit in continuing this back and forth "I think" or "you can do this in software" discussion with you. I, and 99% of users, only care about how the product performs out of the box. A few may go further, with manual. That's it.
Lame apologist excuses don't hide that. If you can do x with M9, you can also do better with S6/iP6/N4 etc starting from a better base.
I'll have the M9 31st March. Then, we'll see.
One Twelve said:
Look, you're not helping me, i'm helping you to help yourself as well as others in this thread.
And i'm pointing out why there were inadequate. They do not add anything above what reviews are saying.
I did not bother going through the imgur stuff since there are no exifs to see there. Assessing image quality let alone commenting without exifs is pointless.
auto shots are average x average, is this what people base their opinions on ?
manual means you take a test auto shot then see whether you can improve it in manual. That is how you will exceed what the reviews have shown and we get to see the best this camera can do. This is what any owner that wants to improve and exploit manual is going to do over time.
Why someone would not want to improve his shots is beyond my comprehension.
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One Twelve said:
That pair is not as important as you think it is and that applies for all with good light.
Where this 'trounces' occurs is in low light. I've already said what needs to be done.
with macros yeah i would because there is no difference there. I've seen three year old devices do excellent macros. Hint: macros are not a good demonstration of what the latest camera can do.
The only real innovation we've had in sensors is BSI over the last two years. More sensitive in low light. You couldn't do that with 2013 devices, m7 was the sole exception. The rest is processing, how much of it or lack thereof.
On a more general level the trick with these devices is to know when to compromise and when to be maximalist. There is no perfect device so what you end up with is what you can tolerate over what you cannot do without. Every device has this trade off. Unfortunately you are alone with making this decision. Unless you are lucky to find others whose requirements match yours closely. Now do you see why i said minor. its minor in a larger context.
no tricks. calling it straight.
i don't trust auto.That on some devices its always flawless is a myth. auto goes wrong even on dslrs. what will you do then ? blame the device or your own ignorance. better to understand why and what went wrong and then fix it. and you can.
What i'm sensing here is an unwillingness to do so. That is something else.
That does not make what i said wrong. Its up to people here to provide that data. particularly low light with manual.
Its right because i've seen the same done with numerous devices already. This is how cameras work. They need light.
Give them that and you get a good shot. simple.
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actually i should have said your tests were pointless and it was a waste of my time to go through them. test the note 4 in low light with manual in m9 that's what you should have done.
I wanted to see manual being used in the low light. You've got no excuses when the camera provides it. If you can't do that then its your problem not the m9.
bad auto does not mean bad camera. bad auto will be fixed. The Z1 took 3 months to get it right. What did people do, the lamers whined whereas the rest got busy with manual and got good shots from day 1.
make up your mind or sell.
---------- Post added at 10:45 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:19 AM ----------
Show me smudge in daylight, i want to see how much. actually link the shots.
All the low light shots have the m9 using high iso in guess what auto. The reviewer did not even try manual and blurred one of the shots because he could not hold a 1/7.
Do you realise that to display on a HD device you only need 1MP or on a full HD it only takes 2MP. Anything more than that gets resampled.
You don't let facebook or anybody else resize it you do it yourself then upload wherever.
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Sent using Tapatalk

th3 said:
You're not helping anyone mate. Pig with lipstick is still a pig. No matter how much spin you are putting on it.
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Went right to the end for the punchline
I'll have the M9 31st March. Then, we'll see.
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Hah so despite the s6 camera 'trouncing' the m9, you actually went in for what ? .....<drum roll>....the M9 <applause>
Confirms what i said earlier, the image quality differences weren't enough to deter you.
Lame apologist excuses don't hide that. If you can do x with M9, you can also do better with S6/iP6/N4 etc starting from a better base.
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yeah so why didn't you get one of them then ? riiiiightt. Why the narrow obsessions with image quality somehow don't pan out in the end. Bigger forces at play.
With ip6+ and 3rd party camera with manual controls. you can improve over stock auto. With the same on the iP6 or even iP5x and a steady hand you can come close if not match the plus.
S6 & N4 or even the G3 don't offer shutter speed control so there is no way to tell how effective their OIS is, its just stated and i believe its there but no way to tell like say with the iP6+ that can do a 1/4 handheld. Night mode on the recent samsungs is good. Much improved over earlier versions. They boosting sensor gain and fiddling around. To get a similar shot would require an exposure two times longer with other devices including the m9. So you will have to work at it.
No idea when raw support will come for the above. But i bet you get it on the m9 before them. Your details issues will disappear at that point but you have to process each image yourself.
Everything you are saying is your subjective opinion not backed by any reviewer or already debunked. No data at all.
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So you do not understand that delaying shutter and lowering iso will improve image quality in low light ? This applies only with stationary subjects btw, forget doing it with people or anything that won't sit still.
Sop with any camera that allows manual control, i can show you manual lumia 930 vs note 4 where it gets pretty close and auto did not. When more people post later you'll see what i mean.
I'm most interested in the low light shots and rarely bother with daylight comparisons because they are pretty similar. In fact my problem with smartphone cameras is too much detail strange as that may sound. because it makes isolating subjects harder. Everything is so damn clear. Because its the equivalent of an f11 lens in 35mm speak. Depth of field is deeper. Great for macros but not others.
I don't see any fruit in continuing this back and forth "I think" or "you can do this in software" discussion with you. I, and 99% of users, only care about how the product performs out of the box. A few may go further, with manual. That's it.
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If you want better photos what i said works. 99% or not is meaningless. This is xda, do 99 % care about rooting, custom firmwares, or any number of hacks people share here ? So what 99% are you referring to and why do they matter. If anything i'm more interested in the 1%.
what i've said wrt to manual is no different. In fact its common knowledge to anyone who has a clue.
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*Emix* said:
https://curved.de/news/galaxy-s6-one-m9-iphone-6-im-grossen-kameravergleich-236192
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Why they didn't use iP6+ ?
1. night shots all soft because iso got boosted on m9. 2nd shot wrong wb for m9. 4th shot all have blown lights, cannot do this without blending.
2. again iso got boosted on m9. second selfie, because background is brighter so iso drops and looks normal.
3. is about where you set exposure.
4. macros are similar. contrast can be improved in post.
5. panoramas, heh all not to my liking because of cylindrical projection. no straight horizontals with such a wide fov.
6. food, can be improved in post or use manual. That ISO is maybe close to 600 try to get it at half.

curiousgeorge1893 said:
Not quite on topic but I've got an M8 coming, I'm ditching my Xperia Z2 for it, is that a good idea do you think?
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What is it about the Z2 that you don't like ? You'd be trading fantastic video stabilisation for none.
The scene modes should help in low light if you use them right. However the lack of shutter control can be frustrating. A quick tweak can't be done. More trial & error.
I was put off by the 4MP camera as i admit I like to zoom and crop, however I like a phone that is good in lowlight.
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What does 4MP do ? sharpens the mind. You have to think more carefully about what you want to get it right. If you want to zoom & crop then you need to be closer to your subject. if you can't do that then 4MP is out.
Also, I like a phone that offers manual controls and shutter speed, HTC phones are the only ones that do this plus a like a phone that has a good flash and takes photos quickly.
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m8 is a fast shooter in auto. But this gap has been closed with the S6 and the S5 is fast too. Have you considered them ? No shutter control though. Given what they've done may or may not be that critical. These samsungs are primarily auto shooters. If they get what you want great, if not don't complain because you can't do much.
As for similar manual controls the hybrid zooms had them first and optical zoom is a plus. crop in camera not afterwards. K zoom or wait for the successor. Slower though. And apertures are smaller. 3.1 all the way to 6.3. Working OIS.
I was planning on getting a secondhand M9 later in the year but to be honest I am disappointed as I feel that HTC have go fowards then 2 steps backwards with the M9 camera. Whilst it's great it has a higher resolution, the f/2.0 aperature in the M7 and M8 is now f/2.2 on the M9, in my opinion it should have been f/2.0 or f/1.9, also lack of OIS is disappointing and it seems lowlight on the M9 isn't as good as the M8? Very disappointing if so.
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The difference between f2.0 and 2.2 is a quarter a f-stop. That's like getting a shot at ISO 200 instead of 250. Or 1/50 instead of 1/40. Its insignficant as one or the other parameter will compensate anyway so not really as notable as reviewers make out.
However the m9 isn't as fast a camera as its predecessors.See the camera speed benchmark. Almost twice as slow as the m8. And the Z2 is faster than the m9. Does this matter ? only if you're rushed. And if you are you're not going to get very good shots to begin with. Is the choice no shot or passable. In that case look at an advanced compact with a 1 inch sensor. Much more light, faster lens and better quality. For the same money.

BoneXDA said:
I do notice the white balance shifting sometimes on the goldish side around sunlit areas, and the M9 tends to underexpose in such conditions.
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I've noticed twice that it gets confused with halogen and neon lights, turning cream and red into green. With a yellow i can see how green can happen by wb adding blue, so just need to use a fluorescent wb or more. But cream into green is inexplicable for me. If its a bug then only a firmware update can fix it.
---------- Post added at 08:36 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:25 PM ----------
curiousgeorge1893 said:
I like the Z2 but not the post processing, it smudges details, I read on here that the Z3 does the same?
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Whenever camera has to produce a jpg and do it fast it has to make a call between preserving detail (ie more noise) or smoothness (less noise). I've seen smudging happen with vegetation, it happens with all jpg outputting devices to varying degrees. To make larger features look good means smaller are going to appear less sharp. Must have the lowest ISO with a longer shutter that means anything that moves is out unless light is good or smudging gets worse.
Only way is raw but you have to process every image yourself, and its a much bigger file so it will be slower than 4mp jpg.
Compare these two from nexus 5. Jpg vs processed RAW. Pull the full resolution and pixel peep all you want.
The originals come from fv5 site.
You control what should be more in detail or not instead of some average one size fits all algorithm with an impossible task that is optimised for speed by trading off image quality. Image quality here isn't file size but a function of how much luminance and chroma noise is preserved or not.
That algorithm and its implementation is the source of lots of heated argument over which is the better camera. Silly really.

SPreston2001 said:
The whole camera comparison may be silly, but 90% of users just want to pick up the phone and snap good pics. Most users don't fiddle around with the camera settings or even know what they do for that matter lol. All they see are which photos look the best when they pick up their phone and take a pic. The M9 camera seems to be alot better than the M8s camera but it still tends to fall behind Apples and Samsungs imaging abilities.
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Then those people should stick with the brands mentioned. Those brands are for people with no interest in photography. WHAT took the shot is more important than WHO took it. That is the mindset auto everything encourages, what did the owner do, just press a button. Still I would not be surprised to find people even on those boards complaining about something or the other.
Where i'm coming from is what if you don't want those brands for whatever reasons. What then ?
You wait for firmware upgrades and you learn how to get better shots. What went wrong and how to get around it.
My attitude is you are stuck with this thing and you are going to have to make the best of it. Few months later you will find people here doing just that. A review can never match it.

One Twelve said:
Then those people should stick with the brands mentioned. Those brands are for people with no interest in photography. WHAT took the shot is more important than WHO took it. That is the mindset auto everything encourages, what did the owner do, just press a button. Still I would not be surprised to find people even on those boards complaining about something or the other.
Where i'm coming from is what if you don't want those brands for whatever reasons. What then ?
You wait for firmware upgrades and you learn how to get better shots. What went wrong and how to get around it.
My attitude is you are stuck with this thing and you are going to have to make the best of it. Few months later you will find people here doing just that. A review can never match it.
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So HTC phones are for people who have interest in photography?? Lol they usually have the worst cameras amongst flagship devices yet theyre for photography minded people?? You act as of HTC is the only manufacturer that has the ability to tweak the camera settings. Most "serious" photographers won't use a cellphone to take a pic. The whole idea of cell cams is to capture quick and beautiful everyday life pictures. The ability to tweak the settings is just a added bonus for those who want to get a little more serious with it.
But to each his own I guess. When it comes to cell cams I just wanna pull it, out take a pic, and expect it to look good. If tweaking the settings to get the perfect shot is for you then that's fine. But all I'm saying is those same things can be done with other manufacturers cams too.

gavinfabl said:
This is a photos thread. We need photos! The weather for another day is gales and heavy rain here, so ruined my planned day of shooting again. Using manual settings I have captured some good shots (but private photos of family). Lowering resolution down a fraction helps in lower light. Auto is OK but when I take control even with a single tweak the difference is noticeable. I've used the S6 and S6 Edge and compared it with my Note 4. The S6 has a good auto mode.
This is my S6 and S6 Edge camera shots , and vs Note 4 camera. http://gavinsgadgets.com/2015/03/19...sung-galaxy-s6-and-s6-edge-plus-camera-shots/
I will have more in depth analysis when it's stops raining .....
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Can't say my experience with the s6 / edge was similar. On the camera front yes the camera is fast. But I found a huge issue with white balance and somewhat heavier than normal post processing (pretty evident when you look at the photos on a camera). The problem is even in pro mode, the camera still struggles with white balance. I am a white balance whore to be honest and when I see a camera struggle, I shudder.
Touchwiz lagged for me. Immensely. I kept flicking through the homescreen, not many widgets above the stock ones, and there were multiple times the device just locked up. Even after rebooting the device quite a few times, there was lag. Off topic, I watched the verge podcast recently and they also affirmed a lot of the lag I experienced with my model.
So far, I'm semi disappointed. The devices are light (like physically, I expected something much heavier). The GS6 felt boxy and somewhat sharper for my tastes while the Edge just "fit" in my hand like a really nice glove. I was stunned that the edge was the more interesting feeling device. Both devices are fingerprint magnets though almost to the point of being disgusting. After 10 minutes of handling, I was in awe with the amount of smudges and oil the back of the device accrued from general handling.
Handling is something that the Edge excels in for the most part. It feels "natural" to swipe at an edge point and get a hamburg menu from Google. And you do in GMAIL, Google Play, and a myriad of other areas. It just feels like touchwiz didn't necessarily provide too many gesture driven tasks that would really take benefit of the edge display. II mean sure you get the call context menus and the light up gimmick, but that's about it sadly. The shame of it all is that above that, the GS6 is a beautiful iphone 5-5s ripoff and the Edge is something of a quagmire begging for a developer to put it to good use. It can be obtrusive but not so much to the point it ruins the user experience.
Overall, I'm left somewhat underwhelmed with the devices. Sure, the screen is gorgeous with marvelous viewing angle fitting for a flagship. But it feels like the GS6 / edge is a iterative step in a unique and bold direction that didn't fully deliver.
Shame actually. Most people will love the GS6 / Edge. Me, I'll be forever disappoint

SPreston2001 said:
So HTC phones are for people who have interest in photography??
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What purpose is there to provide manual controls then ? nokia started this btw.
Lol they usually have the worst cameras amongst flagship devices yet theyre for photography minded people??
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its a mindset that comes naturally to those that are into photography. They are going to try a great deal more before throwing in the towel.
Very obvious when i see Jesse's photos. You make the shot not the camera. newbies whenever they see a nice photo always want to know what camera took the shot. The person, well he just clicked. How hard could it be. They like to hide behind their cameras. Often i see shots that are horribly taken and well it was the camera's fault.
HTC is a bad camera with people who cannot take a photo. I've never bought into the 4MP was bad. A full HD screen can only display 2MP anyway. if you're not zooming or need to then you're focus is on how nice the shot looks rather than whether you can count hairs on somebody's head. I've seen people post nice photos here. if you need to crop your photos then you ain't thinking about your shots or your use case exceeds what 4MP can provide.
You act as of HTC is the only manufacturer that has the ability to tweak the camera settings.
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lets be clear on what manual settings i'm referring to here. Who else offers shutter speed control ?
apple only woke up to the fact in their latest OS. prior to which you could do squat cos um turtle neck deemed it unecessary. Nokia had them early and the cheapest lumias 635 ? do too. samsungs don't not even in their latest. neither does moto, or LG which went backwards with the G3 or Sony. The Chinese provide some more. So yeah HTC since the m8 was the only android offering on a fixed focal lens that offered shutter control. Makes it easy to fix things if you were so inclined. Samsung's galaxy camera is the only other that can claim to have had it first on android earlier and its a compact.
Most "serious" photographers won't use a cellphone to take a pic. The whole idea of cell cams is to capture quick and beautiful everyday life pictures. The ability to tweak the settings is just a added bonus for those who want to get a little more serious with it.
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A cam is a cam and you can learn photography with any cam and play more with one that allows manual settings. I don't have a DSLR because i've not got to the point where i need one. I take shots every day and i like to tweak them because auto cant get it right. Its very normal to have access if not always necessary. But i'd rather have them and not need them than the other way around.
If you drive a stick shift you won't enjoy driving a cruiser.
But to each his own I guess. When it comes to cell cams I just wanna pull it, out take a pic, and expect it to look good. If tweaking the settings to get the perfect shot is for you then that's fine. But all I'm saying is those same things can be done with other manufacturers cams too.
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I never expect it to look good, if it does then conditions were perfect and i was lucky, i will usually take a auto shot and if it fine leave it at that or try to tweak things about and take a couple more. I always try to take more than one. A phone is going to get thrown into so many varied situations that would challenge a pro. To expect to get it right in one take with a phone camera when pointing at anything you can think of isn't realistic.

nebulaoperator said:
Whether it's ISO OIS or else it does not stop camera to perform well. Take A look at Iphone 6 it works wonders. Low light is not on the par with M7 m8. The thing you have to understand , strongly camera orientated phone should not come with a sticker on the box " want a better image use manual"
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A tweak here or there will always improve a shot. How many people know that. Then there is the question of will. if its there and you don't use it then its not the camera's fault. It is there for flexibility.
iphone 6 no, but 6+ will get shots at 1/4. Apple thinks slower than 1/12 is not feasible for iP6. To go slower than 1/4 have to use 3rd party soft to tweak things. iphone camera has always been capable but until ios8 there was no way to access camera parameters so low light was never good.
I saw ifone users don't even know AE/AF lock exist till I showed. Iphone 6 has the simplest UI that can be invented I also call it Dummy proof. I think you can get an app to have access to tweaks option otherwise it's a bit limited to my taste.
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yes its useful there is also a way to do some exposure comp but it changes metering to spot from average or whatever apple equivalent is. A review was comparing 6 & 6+ and saying photos looked better with 6+ until i saw the exifs and pointed out both were using different metering. So of course shots will look different.
With the latest ios you have much more options than before. Curious apple did a u turn there. But not stock just with 3rd party software.
A lot people say because AUTO doesn't work. Why would I have buy "they will fix it" if I pay 500-600 GBP for a phone. It doesn't work like that. And in most cases software improved performance but only to a point .
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So wait for a few months then decide. As for firmware improvements. If you take a shot with firmware a at ISO 200 and compare with firmware b at ISO 200, there will be little difference.
What i mean is they can lower ISO for lower light shots so it does not boost it so high. This will improve auto some. But to go further it requires manual. Possible now, if somebody would try.
They can improve white balance with auto but it will get tricked some times so only up to a point.
I can blame phone camera without long hesitation for two reasons: if hardware sucks or software or both. Then no amount of tweaks can help you. M7 is notorious for washouts, poor dynamic range. I found HDR was never a strong suite of M7 neither M8 or M9. However if you can tweak settings you might get away bringing images to photoshop. That's what I do. On the other hand only minority people are enthusiast like we are and the majority should be at least faulted for what smartphone manufacturer didn't do in the first place. If iphone , nokia, samsung(from 2014) proved there is a lot more that can be done with camera.
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They are trying to make it easy for the average person in the hope of selling more products. The traditional way is to learn how to use the product. I know the washouts you mean, blown skies etc. But once a person is aware of that you can improve it.
Low light was nevera weak spot for HTC One line(until now M9) it was cloudy weather condition with little contrast, also situation when I have half frame window in and the other half room. It would go into extremes overexpose the light in the window or underexposedarks barely visible. Sensor and software is not coping with dynamic range. I kind of like night mode but found it to slow in some situation due to the shutter speed so I just used normal mode it did great though. I wish I could try RAW mode but unfortunately I am selling my phone today ( Not sure if RAW will be brought to lollipop for M7)
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So what are you getting ?
freedcam can already output raw on m7 & m8 and by the looks of it m9 too. htc made this easy.
I worked with photographer who used hood for the headshots and it was game changer.
For instance Iphone6 is least prone to that error but most Android camera phones I came across are. I was surprised by Note 4 results and S6 I would never think they can do so well. So it must be bug or hardware or both as I mentioned earlier. Nice photos from M9 but WB is somehow a bit off sometimes on the blue side( couple of weeks before it was to yellow green Funny enough you are the first I came across that used hand to block the light I do that too. I guess we both come from the same/similar trade.
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It was an accidental discovery. I was taking shot of somebody outside the house from inside with a tab (!) and wondered why the clothes were so saturated.
There is something up with the m9's WB i can see from numerous photos. But nobody is trying manual to fix it.
Was looking at latest world press photo contest. Many with pro dslrs and i saw one person entered an iphone photo and its in the list of winners. Out of 95k entries !!! smartphone photo..Can you believe it

Lol this thread is very entertaining to say the least

twoeleven99 said:
Lol this thread is very entertaining to say the least
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Click to collapse
So what's your take on the M9 pictures, if I may ask?
Sent using Tapatalk

Related

Low Light performance of Note 3 Camera

So I LOVE THIS PHONE, it has been everything I ever wanted in a phone except one key part; The low ligth performance.
I have taken a bunch of pics in darker settings (at work, in clubs, restaurants) and all my pics look blurry/oily (oil painting effect) and the only time I get sharp pics is on close up pics (really close up) with flash.
Is this the norm for this phone? Is samsung releasing an app update?
Do you guys have any apps that solve this issue and can you post them here/the setting you use with them. I have attached some pics below to show examples

I have the same problem.

have you tried it with the smart stabilization mode on ?

For me it turned out the smart stabilization mode was the culprit, disabling it fixed it.

yamensati said:
have you tried it with the smart stabilization mode on ?
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Click to collapse
Yep and it only makes things more bright with no real advantage...it still looks blurred/oily and details are hard to make out; but hey I have a little bit more contrast/better colors

Updates wont' fix it - it's the hardware.

Take a look at the tiny little lens on the back of your Note 3. Then compare that with a point & shoot camera. Then realize N3's camera takes in a fraction of the light and has a miniscule sensor. Do you really expect similar performance?

You really need to play with settings, to squeeze maximum performance in low light and one setting for all won't work, but one thing is for sure, get as much light as possible from flash or elsewhere. If you ever watch pros making movies, half of their equipment is lights and light bouncing screens and they use them even in the daylight even with huge lenses costing thousands of dollars. I do agree Samsung could fine tune low light performance a little better, possibly having dedicated low light/night mode and explain "smart stabilization", which is not stabilization, but custom HDR, little better, but it's not that bad, considering small lens and sensor. I've seen that oil painting effect myself, but only in really low light where even DSLR would have hard time to cope.

pete4k said:
You really need to play with settings, to squeeze maximum performance in low light and one setting for all won't work, but one thing is for sure, get as much light as possible from flash or elsewhere. If you ever watch pros making movies, half of their equipment is lights and light bouncing screens and they use them even in the daylight even with huge lenses costing thousands of dollars. I do agree Samsung could fine tune low light performance a little better, possibly having dedicated low light/night mode and explain "smart stabilization", which is not stabilization, but custom HDR, little better, but it's not that bad, considering small lens and sensor. I've seen that oil painting effect myself, but only in really low light where even DSLR would have hard time to cope.
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what setting do you use in low light?

As I already said there is no one setting for all, but just to give an example, don't use smart stabilization for close distance , because then flash won't fire and here flash will give best results. On the other hand if you were shooting sunset, don't use flash because exposure will be too dark, unless you have people right in front as main subject etc. Smart stabilization won't work for moving objects, since it stocks multiple exposures on top of each other, but it may work pretty well for some static pictures. You could also try to manually set ISO and again it all depends, higher ISO will give you shorter exposure but much more noise, so for static picture you could try lower ISO and brace the phone against some hard surface to avoid shake, or even make a tripod. But nothing beats the light, so always try to position yourself with light behind you, so let's say inside the house have window behind you, not in front of you.

Ive owned every single Android device to date.. yes you read right, every one and if theres one thing Android Devs Can NOT get right out of the box .. its the freaking cameras.
Googles own Nexus 5 needed a few updates from LG to fix it. LGs own G2.. the camera is smudgey and noisey and needs a firmware update.
The LTE version of the S4 (I9005) had shutter lag out of the box, leaving pictures burred and noisey, which was fixed.. eventually... in 4.3.
Thank you so much for this post OP, I was considering a Note 3 as a back up to my Lumia 920 (WP8), soon to be a Lumia 1020.. Its getting ridiculous the way devs are treating us buyers like ****.. "Oh dont worry we can release an OTA next month".
Seriously, take it back and send an email to Samsung "Ram it Samsung", then go buy an HTC One Max.
Stop letting Devs Q&A treat us like ****, return your phones, then send Samsung a Scanned copy of the refund reciept.. explaining it didnt work out of the box.. theyd soon kick their Q&A into gear.

NightOrchid said:
Ive owned every single Android device to date.. yes you read right, every one and if theres one thing Android Devs Can NOT get right out of the box .. its the freaking cameras.
Googles own Nexus 5 needed a few updates from LG to fix it. LGs own G2.. the camera is smudgey and noisey and needs a firmware update.
The LTE version of the S4 (I9005) had shutter lag out of the box, leaving pictures burred and noisey, which was fixed.. eventually... in 4.3.
Thank you so much for this post OP, I was considering a Note 3 as a back up to my Lumia 920 (WP8), soon to be a Lumia 1020.. Its getting ridiculous the way devs are treating us buyers like ****.. "Oh dont worry we can release an OTA next month".
Seriously, take it back and send an email to Samsung "Ram it Samsung", then go buy an HTC One Max.
Stop letting Devs Q&A treat us like ****, return your phones, then send Samsung a Scanned copy of the refund reciept.. explaining it didnt work out of the box.. theyd soon kick their Q&A into gear.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would but I don't know another phone that has a pen. THe pen alone has been the one saving grace for me. I'm a very disorganized guy, ESPECIALLY PAPER and being able to have all my notes in one place has been really convenient. But I don't know, I would like to find a way to get forums to get in contact with Sammy and get them to fix cameras.
BTW does anyone know if the note 2's camera is a better camera and if it would be worth it to return the Note 3 for a Note 2
WHat makes me angry is that most reviewers swear the Note 3 camera is godly. Well not at all in low light

edo101 said:
I would but I don't know another phone that has a pen. THe pen alone has been the one saving grace for me. I'm a very disorganized guy, ESPECIALLY PAPER and being able to have all my notes in one place has been really convenient. But I don't know, I would like to find a way to get forums to get in contact with Sammy and get them to fix cameras.
BTW does anyone know if the note 2's camera is a better camera and if it would be worth it to return the Note 3 for a Note 2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, It has an 8MP camera on it and its a brilliant camera, Its actually better than the S3, especially in low light. As an amateur photographer, I understand that 13MP dont mean squat.. 8MP cams are better.. less MPs for it to process.. I used to own a Note 2 and I loved it. The photos were truely amazing and Sammy have had a few years to iron out the bugs.. so it works beautifully and smooth.. nice fast shutter speeds with reasonable low light.. oh and the speaker on the back is fantastic and loud, with a rich sound from the wolfson DAC, plus the screen on the Note 2 isnt crappy Pentile either.
Its a great phone and you wont be dissapointed.
EDIT:
Yep I know, but reviewers all do that, its amazing what a new free phone will do to grease a reviewers wheels. I tend to watch independent YouTube reviewers, theres a few honest ones around if you look for them. There seems to be an obession that bigger is better, and in the terms of Camera MPx.. No its not.. trust me,. Look at the HTC One 4 Ultra Pixel.. Its fantastic, the Note 2 is a great phone and its cheap now. Go for it
Good luck

note 2 camera is I can tell for sure at least 40% better than the note 3 camera in low light... that's my personal experience

NightOrchid said:
Yes, It has an 8MP camera on it and its a brilliant camera, Its actually better than the S3, especially in low light. As an amateur photographer, I understand that 13MP dont mean squat.. 8MP cams are better.. less MPs for it to process.. I used to own a Note 2 and I loved it. The photos were truely amazing and Sammy have had a few years to iron out the bugs.. so it works beautifully and smooth.. nice fast shutter speeds with reasonable low light.. oh and the speaker on the back is fantastic and loud, with a rich sound from the wolfson DAC, plus the screen on the Note 2 isnt crappy Pentile either.
Its a great phone and you wont be dissapointed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I suppose the question now is, is it worth going back to the Note 2 for despite the other advancements in hardware?
With Note 2, do the native updates give it some of the more useful features of the Note 3?

edo101 said:
So I suppose the question now is, is it worth going back to the Note 2 for despite the other advancements in hardware?
With Note 2, do the native updates give it some of the more useful features of the Note 3?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now that I cant say, sorry. I know the Note 2 did get some added updates from the Note 3 OS, but due to the half-baked flaky bullsh*t OS that samsung, LG and other devs keep giving us "Out of the Box" with their bug ridden, faulty, un-tested devices from a lazy QA depatment over and over again.. I gave up on latest Android new release devices and went to Nokia WP8, but thats just me
And yet we keep buying these faulty release day Android devices.
---------- Post added at 04:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:13 AM ----------
NeoDJW said:
note 2 camera is I can tell for sure at least 40% better than the note 3 camera in low light... that's my personal experience
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Click to collapse
Agreed , Its a great camera.

NightOrchid said:
Now that I cant say, sorry. I know the Note 2 did get some added updates from the Note 3 OS, but due to the half-baked flaky bullsh*t OS that samsung, LG and other devs keep giving us "Out of the Box" with their bug ridden, faulty, un-tested devices from a lazy QA depatment over and over again.. I gave up on latest Android new release devices and went to Nokia WP8, but thats just me
And yet we keep buying these faulty release day Android devices.
---------- Post added at 04:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:13 AM ----------
Agreed , Its a great camera.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmm I guess you wouldn't know which one has a wider camera view?

edo101 said:
Hmm I guess you wouldn't know which one has a wider camera view?
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Click to collapse
How do you mean by wider camera view?, are you talking about how much of the picture you take is in a single frame? or do you mean aperture?
The note 2 has an f2.6 aperture lens where as the Note 3 has a wider f2.2 aperture lens, meaning on paper, the Note 3 should let in more light, however, due to the huge number of 13Milion pixels compared to the less crowded 8Million, the aperture size may not matter here.
Also the Note 2 and Note 3 both have a digital zoom, meaning it expands the actual pixels themselves, not the image like a better Optical zoom, but they both have O.I.S and both have panorama shot for expanded images.
EDIT:
You mean as in how much you see through the viewfinder on the screen.. I think the Note 2 is the wider view, but Im not sure someone else reading this may know though
Hope that helps

edo101 said:
I would but I don't know another phone that has a pen. THe pen alone has been the one saving grace for me. I'm a very disorganized guy, ESPECIALLY PAPER and being able to have all my notes in one place has been really convenient. But I don't know, I would like to find a way to get forums to get in contact with Sammy and get them to fix cameras.
BTW does anyone know if the note 2's camera is a better camera and if it would be worth it to return the Note 3 for a Note 2
WHat makes me angry is that most reviewers swear the Note 3 camera is godly. Well not at all in low light
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AFAIK, the pen functionality in the Note 3 is better.
The camera on the note 2 sounds like a winner...
I guess you need to choose. Since it is only dark in so many situations, I would err on the better specs and forward thinking of the note 3 in terms of android trim, better specs, and future updates.
A $80 point and shoot will do even better than a note 2.

NightOrchid said:
How do you mean by wider camera view?, are you talking about how much of the picture you take is in a single frame? or do you mean aperture?
The note 2 has an f2.6 aperture lens where as the Note 3 has a wider f2.2 aperture lens, meaning on paper, the Note 3 should let in more light, however, due to the huge number of 13Milion pixels compared to the less crowded 8Million, the aperture size may not matter here.
Also the Note 2 and Note 3 both have a digital zoom, meaning it expands the actual pixels themselves, not the image like a better Optical zoom, but they both have O.I.S and both have panorama shot for expanded images.
EDIT:
You mean as in how much you see through the viewfinder on the screen.. I think the Note 2 is the wider view, but Im not sure someone else reading this may know though
Hope that helps
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you can get a wider picture from the Note 2. Note 3 seemed to have a narrow wide angle. (so lets say Note 2 was 16:9, Note 3 would be 16:11) thats what I mean. you can capture more area with the Note 2 camera

Photographer's perspective on the LG G3

These topics have been widely discussed, I just find this funny. I do professional photography, and I thought this phone would be great for me. Not only could I show off my photos on a glorious 2k screen, but it was supposed to have a great off-duty camera as well. Ironically, it's instead hitting some photographer pet peeves real bad.
1) The screen sharpening is bad. I see amateur photographers get over enthusiastic on sharpening, cause the sharper the better, right? No, you make ugly artifacts like halos. Now my entire phone does it nonstop. It hurts! This goes beyond the font issue that's widely been talked about. I love viewing photos through my Nexus 7 or HTC M7 because it's like looking through a window. Photos on the G3 just look artifical.
2) Another is the camera noise reduction. Noise is bad, so let's crank the noise reduction. No, some grain and more detail is much preferable to pics that look like watercolors.
3) I knew this one going in, but as the Andantech review pointed out, the color accuracy is bad. I can spend time editing a photo on my phone and paste it to Facebook, just to realize once I'm viewing on a pc that the pic looks nothing like my meticulous edit. Great.
I know I'm hypersensitive to these issues because of my profession. My wife didn't notice the sharpening. But it's funny that what I thought would be my ideal phone is such the opposite.

supposedmonster said:
3) I knew this one going in, but as the Andantech review pointed out, the color accuracy is bad. I can spend time editing a photo on my phone and paste it to Facebook, just to realize once I'm viewing on a pc that the pic looks nothing like my meticulously edit. Great.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
How long ago was last time you calibrated your PC monitor? Does your monitor have sRGB mode? And, BTW, maybe you even use some notebook with cheap junky TN panel in the first place? :laugh:

I use an ASUS PA246 wide gamut monitor regularly calibrated with a Colormunki Display, so yes, I have a good benchmark.
Sent from my LG-D851 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

supposedmonster said:
so yes, I have a good benchmark.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Glad for you, well then did you try to compare pix from the net to view both on monitor and on G3 and compare colors? Like I did
Check that topic also, maybe you bought G3 with blueish panel

Man this was not an easy shot to pull off. It's hard to tell from the pic, but LG is on the left and Nexus 7 is on the bottom. The LG would equate to quite a few notches of saturation boost in Lightroom.
This photo doesn't quite show it well, but the Nexus is actually slightly less saturated than the calibrated monitor.
The colors aren't that bad in either devices (I mean you can only expect so much, I get these aren't meant to be crazy calibrated panels), but I'd rather edit on the Nexus and find them slightly more vibrant on other devices than on the LG and find it decidedly dull.
Sent from my LG-D851 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

Haha, well my camera has WiFi. When in on vacation it's fun being able to post professional quality pics to social media from my phone.
Sent from my LG-D851 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

The G3 display can be somewhat manually adjusted in color contrast, did you tweak it a bit? Maybe it'll improve.

Thanks, I have read about that. Without being able to use a preview image to calibrate I think it'd drive me crazy. Plus I doubt it'll help because it seems to only adjust color and contrast, not saturation, which is the bigger issue.
What bugs me more though is the sharpening, but I have faith that'll be fixed either by LG or the community since enough people have raised a hallaboo.
Sent from my LG-D851 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

I can live with the screen sharpening (since it's all software and don't affect the photos themselves). I can also live with so-so color reproduction. But gawd, that NR pisses me off. What's the point of having a good sensor when you're gonna mess up the photos with mediocre processing. That being said... photos still look pretty decent in good lighting ;P

supposedmonster said:
These topics have been widely discussed, I just find this funny. I do professional photography, and I thought this phone would be great for me. Not only could I show off my photos on a glorious 2k screen, but it was supposed to have a great off-duty camera as well. Ironically, it's instead hitting some photographer pet peeves real bad.
1) The screen sharpening is bad. I see amateur photographers get over enthusiastic on sharpening, cause the sharper the better, right? No, you make ugly artifacts like halos. Now my entire phone does it nonstop. It hurts! This goes beyond the font issue that's widely been talked about. I love viewing photos through my Nexus 7 or HTC M7 because it's like looking through a window. Photos on the G3 just look artifical.
2) Another is the camera noise reduction. Noise is bad, so let's crank the noise reduction. No, some grain and more detail is much preferable to pics that look like watercolors.
3) I knew this one going in, but as the Andantech review pointed out, the color accuracy is bad. I can spend time editing a photo on my phone and paste it to Facebook, just to realize once I'm viewing on a pc that the pic looks nothing like my meticulous edit. Great.
I know I'm hypersensitive to these issues because of my profession. My wife didn't notice the sharpening. But it's funny that what I thought would be my ideal phone is such the opposite.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am sorry but you have me totally confused.......
I agree the G3 does have over sharpening which depending on how and what you shoot can have detrimental effects on the scene shot.
However, why on earth are you getting so annoyed with what is in effect simply a smartphone camera sensor?
Although I do not take photos as a profession I have however owned a camera since... Hang on a second......1963. Throughout time I learned many various methods and art in photography, travelling the world shooting all manner of photos with compacts and SLR's to the more recent DSLR and smartphone.
Yet, there is no way on earth would I take a professional shot with a smartphone nor would I expect it to achieve something which could be of use in a professional manner.
I do apologies but it does annoy me when I hear from someone first stating they are a 'professional' and use this word as their basis for a debate.
If you have an issue with the G3, fine I can live with that as you are very much correct, certain aspects of the software could be improved but let us not forget.
1. It is a smartphone.
2. It is software which means if you do not like the camera app that controls the shooting then use a different camera app.
I personally use the app 'A Better Camera' which is excellent.
I am sure as a professional photographer you must have heard of this app and learned the author is not just another coder but does have an understanding of photography.
With 'A Better Camera' as your tool you will find first it gives you back the manual controls and second it then allows you to be as creative as a smartphone will allow you.
Having said all this I have never ever ever been happy letting the camera dictate the shot but the G3 is the first type of camera that I am happy shooting 'casual photography' in auto mode.

Beards said:
I am sorry but you have me totally confused.......
I agree the G3 does have over sharpening which depending on how and what you shoot can have detrimental effects on the scene shot.
However, why on earth are you getting so annoyed with what is in effect simply a smartphone camera sensor?
Although I do not take photos as a profession I have however owned a camera since... Hang on a second......1963. Throughout time I learned many various methods and art in photography, travelling the world shooting all manner of photos with compacts and SLR's to the more recent DSLR and smartphone.
Yet, there is no way on earth would I take a professional shot with a smartphone nor would I expect it to achieve something which could be of use in a professional manner.
I do apologies but it does annoy me when I hear from someone first stating they are a 'professional' and use this word as their basis for a debate.
If you have an issue with the G3, fine I can live with that as you are very much correct, certain aspects of the software could be improved but let us not forget.
1. It is a smartphone.
2. It is software which means if you do not like the camera app that controls the shooting then use a different camera app.
I personally use the app 'A Better Camera' which is excellent.
I am sure as a professional photographer you must have heard of this app and learned the author is not just another coder but does have an understanding of photography.
With 'A Better Camera' as your tool you will find first it gives you back the manual controls and second it then allows you to be as creative as a smartphone will allow you.
Having said all this I have never ever ever been happy letting the camera dictate the shot but the G3 is the first type of camera that I am happy shooting 'casual photography' in auto mode.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Speaking of which, is it possible to set long exposure (for night shots with a tripod, for example) with A Better Camera? Other than the automatic "Night Shot"...

fabripav said:
Speaking of which, is it possible to set long exposure (for night shots with a tripod, for example) with A Better Camera? Other than the automatic "Night Shot"...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not presently...... But note, this is not the problem with the G3 or A Better Camera.
It is Android or should I say Google who limited the speed to just under 1sec.
However, under Android L all will change as among the 400+ camera api's introduced camera speed is one of them. So 'hopefully' developers will raise to the challenge and add this vital missing setting.

Beards said:
Not presently...... But note, this is not the problem with the G3 or A Better Camera.
It is Android or should I say Google who limited the speed to just under 1sec.
However, under Android L all will change as among the 400+ camera api's introduced camera speed is one of them. So 'hopefully' developers will raise to the challenge and add this vital missing setting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, can't wait for that update for many reasons, camera included.
It's weird though that the Oppo Find 7 camera (for example) has a shutter speed that goes up to 32 seconds. How did they manage to make it avalaible? The sensor is a simple Sony IMX214.
I wonder if all the features of Camera FV-5 work on the G3, anyone tried it yet? (my G3 has yet to arrive)

fabripav said:
Yeah, can't wait for that update for many reasons, camera included.
It's weird though that the Oppo Find 7 camera (for example) has a shutter speed that goes up to 32 seconds. How did they manage to make it avalaible? The sensor is a simple Sony IMX214.
I wonder if all the features of Camera FV-5 work on the G3, anyone tried it yet? (my G3 has yet to arrive)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Oppo Find 7's camera doesn't actually keep the lens open for 32 seconds, it does a trick similar to what Camera FV-5 does in that it takes a series of shots from a thumbnail (hence why it's small and lacks any detail).
Re your query on Camera FV-5 ~ everything with the exception of ISO works. With ISO the dials say it has altered ISO but when you take the shot you find it has altered nothing.
A Better Camera on the other hand does alter the settings and does apply them to the shot.
It's the only app out there which utilises all the manual controls that are open to write permission, this also includes AE and WB Lock which again no other camera app uses.

[/COLOR]
fabripav said:
Yeah, can't wait for that update for many reasons, camera included.
It's weird though that the Oppo Find 7 camera (for example) has a shutter speed that goes up to 32 seconds. How did they manage to make it avalaible? The sensor is a simple Sony IMX214.
I wonder if all the features of Camera FV-5 work on the G3, anyone tried it yet? (my G3 has yet to arrive)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes it does. I haven't tried the long exposure in FV-5 though.
Beards said:
Re your query on Camera FV-5 ~ everything with the exception of ISO works. With ISO the dials say it has altered ISO but when you take the shot you find it has altered nothing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Camera FV-5's ISO setting works fine for me.
ISO 100 1/60 F/2.4
http://i1.minus.com/iMbhMmPuhI3Es.JPG
ISO 1600 1/680 F/2.4
http://i7.minus.com/iNJO0u9CN5xvf.JPG
I'm a photographer (;P). I know what I'm talking about.

You have the D851 which is Tmob.. which doesnt have the sharpening effect.. at least anecdotally. same model i have and theres zero sharpening going on. the colors mind you are off, but its no galaxy S4 or G2.. but as was stated dont plan to edit on your phone and you wont be frustrated by using the wrong tool for the job.
dont bring a 400mm telephoto zoom to a job that requires a 35mm prime or vice versa.

Itaintrite said:
[/COLOR]
Yes it does. I haven't tried the long exposure in FV-5 though.
Camera FV-5's ISO setting works fine for me.
ISO 100 1/60 F/2.4
http://i1.minus.com/iMbhMmPuhI3Es.JPG
ISO 1600 1/680 F/2.4
http://i7.minus.com/iNJO0u9CN5xvf.JPG
I'm a photographer (;P). I know what I'm talking about.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really...... Thank you.
When was the App last updated?

Beards said:
Really...... Thank you.
When was the App last updated?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm using v1.7.3. Updated June 27th.

Itaintrite said:
I'm using v1.7.3. Updated June 27th.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great... I'll give it another go against A Better Camera; although ABC does have many more controls.

Sony's Camera isn't great, but it could be worse...

We all give Sony a hard time for releasing flagship devices with mediocre camera performance. I personally can verify that my previous HTC phones (One mini, One S, and even the Ville aka MyTouch 4G) dating back nearly 4 years all had better color reproduction, white balance, indoor performance, and faster focus and shutter response. None of those were even considered flagship devices at the time of release. We assumed Sony's problem was the software, so many of us searched for 3rd party camera apps such as Google Camera, A Better Camera, Camera FV-5, etc... and some even claimed to get better results using these apps. I've tried just about all of them (free versions only) and never saw any dramatic improvement to make me replace the default camera app. I finally decided to compare shots side by side on a couple of my personal favorite camera apps and here's what I noticed:
The 3rd party apps over-exposed the scene with far too much flash, giving it that cold LED light look, and washing out some of the natural colors. But worst of all, they weren't as clear when zooming in as the default app was. Pay close attention to the can of WD40 in the back. Only the stock app makes the word "Directions" visibly clear. All photos were taken using Auto Mode at 8MP - the setting the average person will use daily.
Sample Photos In Order (from left to right):
- Sony Stock Camera App
- Google Camera App
- OpenCamera App
https://goo.gl/photos/ihkstAg95Ag8rybX7
I took a few comparison shots in scenes that I thought would cause the stock app to falter, but it kept coming through and beating the competition. For example, when taking a picture of a poster that was covered by a slight shadow, the stock app was the only app smart enough to use flash; thereby making the words of the poster much clearer. In another indoor scenario, the competition once again over exposed the scene with too much flash, washing out the colors again. I may post these photos later if you request them.
Moral of the story:
Compared to other smartphones (especially flagships), Sony's camera is simply one of the worst performers. <-----(This is a click-able link to the results of a test article) There is no argument here and someone from Sony needs to do something about it. But as for the stock Sony camera app, it appears to utilize the camera better than 3rd party apps can. So if you want to make the best of out our bad situation, stick with the stock camera app.

I agree that the camera on the Z3C is somewhat lacking.
Outdoors in good light it can produce some really nice photos (some of the time) although even in good conditions it still seems to make a mess of things on occasions. Indoors and low light it's just plain terrible. I've done a back to back comparison with my rather elderly SGS3 and in most circumstances the SGS3 knocks the spots off the Z3C.
The problem is marketing.
In order to produce compelling marketing material, Sony developed the 20MP sensor and put this in all their flagship phones. This is way too many MP for such a small sensor and as such the quality suffers badly in anything other than bright sunlight. Even when interpolating the image down to 8MP you still see way more noise than the equivalent true 8MP sensor and the details are mushed to buggery. I'd be happy for the resolution on smartphones to top out at 10MP, which should be enough for 4K video and multiple aspect ratios (not that I think 4K video from a smartphone has much use).

sensor not bad, driver sometimes is...
Exmor IMX220 Shoot Out – Meizu MX4 Pro vs Sony Xperia Z3
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Wajk said:
sensor not bad, driver sometimes is...
Exmor IMX220 Shoot Out – Meizu MX4 Pro vs Sony Xperia Z3
indeed sony's pic are washed out but the looking at the "lay's" and "muji" comparision, meizu's pics are blurred.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

We all know auto mode sucks isn't that right? Well Sony hasn't designed this phone for you, i have taken some absolutely stunning photos that my friends think were taken with a proper camera. The truth is that I'm a photographer that tries to push the hardware and software to the limit and if your having a good day you can produce stunning works of art. Sure there's a bit of noise but you can't expect fullframe image quality on this sensor. Taking a backwards step from my Nex7 to the Z3 compact was a great learning experience. If you're a photographer that likes to push the limits of a camera this one is for you, if your the average joe your wasting your time. Think about it, when you buy a camera what is the point of using auto mode when it limits the amount of control you have over a photo. Its like driving an automatic transmission car at a drag race.

As a photographer, you of all people should understand that a camera phone is not likely to be used when taking serious photos. This is designed to be a point and shoot replacement for selfies, pictures of food, group photos of friends in a restaurant, etc... This phone's camera isn't a complete failure by any means, but it simply doesn't perform as well as phones from 2-3 years ago under the most basic condition (indoors). I'm just finding it difficult to explain why my $500 flagship phone takes overexposed, blurry photos when my old phones (none of which were even flagship models) did not.

Starlith said:
We all know auto mode sucks isn't that right? Well Sony hasn't designed this phone for you, i have taken some absolutely stunning photos that my friends think were taken with a proper camera. The truth is that I'm a photographer that tries to push the hardware and software to the limit and if your having a good day you can produce stunning works of art. Sure there's a bit of noise but you can't expect fullframe image quality on this sensor. Taking a backwards step from my Nex7 to the Z3 compact was a great learning experience. If you're a photographer that likes to push the limits of a camera this one is for you, if your the average joe your wasting your time. Think about it, when you buy a camera what is the point of using auto mode when it limits the amount of control you have over a photo. Its like driving an automatic transmission car at a drag race.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am also a photographer (enthusiastic amateur and no expert for sure) who has worked for a software company in the digital imaging industry for 7 years. I get to sample a lot of cameras; including pre-production test mules, some of which never make it due to unrecoverable issues. I have tried the Z3C in every conceivable mode and it's still a disappointment in low light and unpredictable when it's good light. A brief summary of the biggest issues I've seen would include:
1) Poor light performance - It's not even low light, the performance is poor in moderate lighting conditions (20MP is too much for such a small sensor and lens)
2) Unpredictable auto focus - It misses what should be an easy AF fix more often than it should do
3) Too much NR - TBH this is a personal criticism of almost every camera currently made, but the NR on the Z3C is a bit nasty
4) Even the best shots seem to lack "definition"
I'm not saying that the camera is a complete dead-loss, but for a flagship smartphone it's not as good as I would expect. I don't think that I've taken a single picture with it where I've got home, uploaded it to my PC and thought it was really good. I've checked back through my SGS3 pictures and at a glance the best images look like they've come from a "proper" camera, I can't say that for many of the Z3C images. I'd really like to be able to get RAW images out of the camera to see what is possible with decent post processing, but it doesn't seem like that is going to happen any time soon.
If you could give some hints about how to get the most out of the camera, then I for one would very much appreciate it.

mad-marco said:
I am also a photographer (enthusiastic amateur and no expert for sure) who has worked for a software company in the digital imaging industry for 7 years. I get to sample a lot of cameras; including pre-production test mules, some of which never make it due to unrecoverable issues. I have tried the Z3C in every conceivable mode and it's still a disappointment in low light and unpredictable when it's good light. A brief summary of the biggest issues I've seen would include:
1) Poor light performance - It's not even low light, the performance is poor in moderate lighting conditions (20MP is too much for such a small sensor and lens)
2) Unpredictable auto focus - It misses what should be an easy AF fix more often than it should do
3) Too much NR - TBH this is a personal criticism of almost every camera currently made, but the NR on the Z3C is a bit nasty
4) Even the best shots seem to lack "definition"
I'm not saying that the camera is a complete dead-loss, but for a flagship smartphone it's not as good as I would expect. I don't think that I've taken a single picture with it where I've got home, uploaded it to my PC and thought it was really good. I've checked back through my SGS3 pictures and at a glance the best images look like they've come from a "proper" camera, I can't say that for many of the Z3C images. I'd really like to be able to get RAW images out of the camera to see what is possible with decent post processing, but it doesn't seem like that is going to happen any time soon.
If you could give some hints about how to get the most out of the camera, then I for one would very much appreciate it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with you, it does have its limits and they are really weird limits. For example when in manual mode anything that is set to auto including white balance and focus is either hit or miss, there is no touch metering, i have taken some stunners but they required me to work hard for it such as adjusting wb, iso, focus mode. Even the background defocus app which produced amazing photos btw i had to work really hard for. All that work on a phone is exhausting. Too many apps complicate the camera app and the post processing algorithm is inconsistent. Im interested what the results would be with a lens similar to the iPhone 6. The best thing about the camera is the wide angle lens but no one really cares for that.

Starlith said:
I agree with you, it does have its limits and they are really weird limits. For example when in manual mode anything that is set to auto including white balance and focus is either hit or miss, there is no touch metering, i have taken some stunners but they required me to work hard for it such as adjusting wb, iso, focus mode. Even the background defocus app which produced amazing photos btw i had to work really hard for. All that work on a phone is exhausting. Too many apps complicate the camera app and the post processing algorithm is inconsistent. Im interested what the results would be with a lens similar to the iPhone 6. The best thing about the camera is the wide angle lens but no one really cares for that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I personally don't even like the wide angle lens. It just forces me to stand that much closer to my subject to properly frame the shot. Then, if using flash, you blind them because you're standing 1 foot in front of their face. Anyway, I thought a sony branded lens/sensor was being used on most high end phones these days... even the iPhone? We just got stuck with poor image processing.

PuffDaddy_d said:
I personally don't even like the wide angle lens. It just forces me to stand that much closer to my subject to properly frame the shot. Then, if using flash, you blind them because you're standing 1 foot in front of their face. Anyway, I thought a sony branded lens/sensor was being used on most high end phones these days... even the iPhone? We just got stuck with poor image processing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When you buy a phone you don't expect it to take pictures like an SLR Camera would, that being said though I still think 20 mp is more than enough for taking snapshots. If you complain about the camera quality then you shouldn't have bought a phone in the first place and buy a DSLR instead.

and if you came from a Nokia flagship this difference is even bigger ....

Revontheus said:
When you buy a phone you don't expect it to take pictures like an SLR Camera would, that being said though I still think 20 mp is more than enough for taking snapshots. If you complain about the camera quality then you shouldn't have bought a phone in the first place and buy a DSLR instead.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've already got several DSLR's thanks very much. I don't think that anyone is expecting DSLR like quality, in fact you seem to be the only person who has brought this up.
I think that what people would like is the the camera on Sony's flagship smartphones to be comparable with other smartphones, especially the ones that have the same sensor hardware!!! It's a disappointment that the 2/3 year old SGS3 produces superior photos than the current Sony flagships, the current Samsung 16MP cameras are vastly superior.

Revontheus said:
When you buy a phone you don't expect it to take pictures like an SLR Camera would, that being said though I still think 20 mp is more than enough for taking snapshots. If you complain about the camera quality then you shouldn't have bought a phone in the first place and buy a DSLR instead.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have completely missed the point of this thread. It has nothing to do with expecting DSLR quality from a camera phone. We just don't want pictures to look like they were taken from a flip phone from 2006 - which is what this camera looks like when taking photos indoors. A flagship phone needs a flagship camera, and Sony's image processing has left us without, while all other major manufacturers are using some form of Sony image sensor and getting much better results.
But as my original post indicates, the best photos I've been able to get from this camera are with the stock camera app. All others seem to fall short when viewed on a larger screen.

ray_J13 said:
Wajk said:
sensor not bad, driver sometimes is...
Exmor IMX220 Shoot Out – Meizu MX4 Pro vs Sony Xperia Z3
indeed sony's pic are washed out but the looking at the "lay's" and "muji" comparision, meizu's pics are blurred.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seems to me the camera glass on her Z3C was a bit smudged... That would explain the haze.
And the small details on the Z3C look much better and cleaner at 100% zoom than on the Meizu, even if the Z3C was a bit out of focus.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

I'm so disappointed in this camera. I took my Z3C and my old HTC Droid Incredible 2 to a concert last night. Inc2's pics were much crisper and cleaner. The videos were better as well (at 720p), though the sound on the Z3C's vids were better. Inc2 is what, 4 years old?
Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk

Crewville96 said:
I'm so disappointed in this camera. I took my Z3C and my old HTC Droid Incredible 2 to a concert last night. Inc2's pics were much crisper and cleaner. The videos were better as well (at 720p), though the sound on the Z3C's vids were better. Inc2 is what, 4 years old?
Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, this is our point exactly! The Z3C camera has far more advanced technology in it, yet the results are sub par to midrange and outdated phones. Care to share any of your pics for reference?
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact

PuffDaddy_d said:
Yes, this is our point exactly! The Z3C camera has far more advanced technology in it, yet the results are sub par to midrange and outdated phones. Care to share any of your pics for reference?
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can upload the vids and couple pics. None of the pics are really the same for comparison since i was in the crowd at the concert though. But you can get a general idea.

PuffDaddy_d said:
Yes, this is our point exactly! The Z3C camera has far more advanced technology in it, yet the results are sub par to midrange and outdated phones. Care to share any of your pics for reference?
Sent from my Xperia Z3 Compact
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here's my vids. One is from my old Droid Incredible 2 (2011, running GB) the other is from my Z3C (2014, running LP). I'll let you guys judge which vid is better.

That concert looks like it was a lot of fun! I watched both videos on full screen and i personally think the top video looks better - less grainy and handled the bright lighting much better.

PuffDaddy_d said:
That concert looks like it was a lot of fun! I watched both videos on full screen and i personally think the top video looks better - less grainy and handled the bright lighting much better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep, just cleaner and sharper overall. Thats the Droid Incredible 2 video (720 only as well, Z3C is at 1080 lol).

I give up on this camera...

No matter what I do I can't seem to get a clear picture. Everything is blurry. I can't figure out if my expectations are just too high.....I came from an LG G4 but still. How are you guys getting good pictures? I'm talking 5% of the pictures I take are passable. Maybe I have a faulty camera? Anyone else find the camera to be garbage? I've looked through the camera threads and people seem happy overall. It can't just be me.
Sent from my XT1575 using XDA Free mobile app

Moto camera app sucks...did you try a different app?
Sent from my XT1572 using XDA Free mobile app

I tried Open Camera and am using Google camera currently. And I'm no Ansel Adams but I takes lot of pictures and have always been able to figure out how to take a decent shot on every device I've owned until this one.
Sent from my XT1575 using XDA Free mobile app

Are the pictures blurry or noisy?

They're blurry. That the thing, that's new to me. Good lighting with as steady a hand as I can muster still results in a blurry shot. I'll take one now and post if I can.
Sent from my XT1575 using XDA Free mobile app

This is probably a stupid suggestion, but have you tried just wiping the lens and making sure it's clean and clear? Honestly I've had that problem before where it's been smudged without my noticing and it obviously makes every picture screwed up. I know it's not likely, but something that's worth a shot I've found! Other than that I know nothing about cameras and coming from an HTC One I know nothing of a quality photo...

No, I agree with @jiggyb21, I just bought the Moxo X and came from the Galaxy S6. The camera on the Moto seems like pure garbage to me, and I think it's because we are coming from phones with superior cameras. People who came from phones with worse cameras will obviously think the Moto X camera is great right?

I don't have the steadiest of hands, but I haven't run into a problem like what you are describing. Have you given some thought that you might have a faulty device? It uses phase detection for focus, so if every picture is blurry you may have an issue with the actual camera module.

I've tried a few camera apps, and though pics come out good, man do I really have to keep a steady hand. Move it a hair and any text blurs. Why not lean it up against something to take your handling out of equation and voice command take pic and see what comes up.
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk 2

It would be nice if you could post some samples. I'm not in love with the camera but I have consistently been able to snap photos that are good enough quickly

I don't even know if I uploaded the pics correctly and if not I'll fix it later while I'm watching the Giants beat on the Eagles. Something interesting happened while taking these pictures. I am in 100% optimal lighting conditions and these are basically the best 4 shots I could possibly get out of this camera. I asked around to the people here on the jobsite with me and everyone thought the pictures were just fine. Yes, they aren't blurry to the point of being unreadable by any means but they are quite blurry. I guess it could just be me but I would still argue it's not. Before anyone says anything about how this is just a smartphone and it's only a $400 smartphone at that and it's good enough, I know that and maybe people who haven't used a good smartphone camera don't know what they're missing. If that's the case, fine, and that's why I started this thread was to find out. My last 4 phones were Xperia ZL, Z2, Z3 and LG G4. We all know the G4 and S6, to name two, have incredible cameras and have OIS. The first 3 I named weren't and don't. They were all rated as average cameras and they don't have OIS. I have hundreds of pictures taken in similar conditions with the Sonys and they didn't suffer from blur. Like I said these 4 pictures were surprisingly good IMO. Most I take are MUCH more blurred and most of the pictures I take aren't in this perfect a light. So I'll have to post more pictures from my collection at home to really show off the bad ones.
If you zoom in a little on the pics its almost a 3D art poster kind of eye strain. Again, I'm not talking about level of detail, just the blurriness.

I think part of the pictures of blurry because of shallow depth of field due to lower aperture setting in the software algorithm. It seems the software is trying to compress too much noise. Although I have not personally used it, try the following link for the alternative camera and report back the results. Hope this works out for you:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/moto-g/themes-apps/app-camera-galery-t3216944

trace1er said:
No, I agree with @jiggyb21, I just bought the Moxo X and came from the Galaxy S6. The camera on the Moto seems like pure garbage to me, and I think it's because we are coming from phones with superior cameras. People who came from phones with worse cameras will obviously think the Moto X camera is great right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not really. I have a DSLR so that's my standard on PQ. In daylight, nothing should be blurry at 100% zoom on even a $200 phone. You don't need flagship to take a good photo at 1/125 second shutter speed. It's either defective camera unit or something is wrong with the setting. Just look at all the photos people have posted on this forum.
---------- Post added at 10:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:25 PM ----------
jiggyb21 said:
I don't even know if I uploaded the pics correctly and if not I'll fix it later while I'm watching the Giants beat on the Eagles. Something interesting happened while taking these pictures. I am in 100% optimal lighting conditions and these are basically the best 4 shots I could possibly get out of this camera. I asked around to the people here on the jobsite with me and everyone thought the pictures were just fine. Yes, they aren't blurry to the point of being unreadable by any means but they are quite blurry. I guess it could just be me but I would still argue it's not. Before anyone says anything about how this is just a smartphone and it's only a $400 smartphone at that and it's good enough, I know that and maybe people who haven't used a good smartphone camera don't know what they're missing. If that's the case, fine, and that's why I started this thread was to find out. My last 4 phones were Xperia ZL, Z2, Z3 and LG G4. We all know the G4 and S6, to name two, have incredible cameras and have OIS. The first 3 I named weren't and don't. They were all rated as average cameras and they don't have OIS. I have hundreds of pictures taken in similar conditions with the Sonys and they didn't suffer from blur. Like I said these 4 pictures were surprisingly good IMO. Most I take are MUCH more blurred and most of the pictures I take aren't in this perfect a light. So I'll have to post more pictures from my collection at home to really show off the bad ones.
If you zoom in a little on the pics its almost a 3D art poster kind of eye strain. Again, I'm not talking about level of detail, just the blurriness.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a f 2.0 lens. You gonna have blurriness around the edge of photo if you are taking it that close. It has nothing to do with OIS.
In any case, you can read the professional review of the XPE here.
http://www.dxomark.com/Mobiles/Moto-X-Style-Mobile-review-Style-and-Substance

If you're in good light, this is arguably one of the best phone cameras out there. Your pictures should be nice and crisp. Try this: take your camera outside during the day and take a few shots of the horizon or something. Then post the pictures here and we'll tell you (hopefully) if you've got a faulty unit. It sounds like your phone is not performing as mine is. I'm even satisfied with some indoor shots with this camera. I have done professional photography, so I am well-versed in cameras (color, WB, ISO, exposure, f-stop, etc.).
Even from reading reviews and comparisons from the web and tech reviewers, this camera performs with, and sometimes beats the other current flagship models out there. I happen to agree with them. From reading this thread though, maybe your camera isn't the only one with this problem.
Anyway, try to post a couple of pictures up. A link to an external host like photobucket or something like that would probably be better than uploading straight to XDA, due to compression and size limits.
---------- Post added at 04:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:42 PM ----------
Edit: looks like I missed a page
Those photos don't look that bad. What sort of blurriness are you talking about? The bokeh from taking close up pictures? Bokeh is a natural blurring effect you get from a larger aperature lens not being able to capture the entire depth of field. That's normal. The focused part of those pictures don't look blurry to me.
As an aside, any indoor shot will not be optimal lighting, unless you have a lighting kit or something to really brighten up the scene. Optimal lighting would be outside, and when the sun is not directly overhead. This is a very quick summation of optimal light, but you get the point.

Gr8man001 said:
I think part of the pictures of blurry because of shallow depth of field due to lower aperture setting in the software algorithm. It seems the software is trying to compress too much noise. Although I have not personally used it, try the following link for the alternative camera and report back the results. Hope this works out for you:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/moto-g/themes-apps/app-camera-galery-t3216944
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow, thanks, that camera works great, I always enjoy having the face detection feature it makes focusing on faces much faster.

Gr8man001 said:
I think part of the pictures of blurry because of shallow depth of field due to lower aperture setting in the software algorithm. It seems the software is trying to compress too much noise. Although I have not personally used it, try the following link for the alternative camera and report back the results. Hope this works out for you:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/moto-g/themes-apps/app-camera-galery-t3216944
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for your tip. After turning off NR in advanced setting, I tried a couple of indoor shots of some writings on my note book. Please excuse the terrible lighting and my bad handwriting, but it's very easy to tell which shot had the NR off. Yes the one with NR off has a dirtier background, but the pen strokes has much better contrast from the paper. That's probably one of the reasons why the default setting produces blurry photos.

Yea when taking photos of dogs in low light I only managed to have 1 or 2 come out bad and that was from me moving the phone. But then again I am used to shooting 50asa film freehand.

lack of optical image stabilization rearing it's ugly head.. who knows why the hell they couldn't use a sensor with it, but it's quite disappointing. but turning off nr helps a lot.. we need a dev to come in and work on a true camera mod for this phone only. I tried to get my bud xdabbeb to make a mod (as anyone who had the g2 knows his xcam mod was killer!) but he isn't planning on buying this phone. ugh.
Sent from my Moto X Pure Edition

jonathanbailie said:
If you're in good light, this is arguably one of the best phone cameras out there. Your pictures should be nice and crisp. Try this: take your camera outside during the day and take a few shots of the horizon or something. Then post the pictures here and we'll tell you (hopefully) if you've got a faulty unit. It sounds like your phone is not performing as mine is. I'm even satisfied with some indoor shots with this camera. I have done professional photography, so I am well-versed in cameras (color, WB, ISO, exposure, f-stop, etc.).
Even from reading reviews and comparisons from the web and tech reviewers, this camera performs with, and sometimes beats the other current flagship models out there. I happen to agree with them. From reading this thread though, maybe your camera isn't the only one with this problem.
Anyway, try to post a couple of pictures up. A link to an external host like photobucket or something like that would probably be better than uploading straight to XDA, due to compression and size limits.
---------- Post added at 04:46 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:42 PM ----------
Edit: looks like I missed a page
Those photos don't look that bad. What sort of blurriness are you talking about? The bokeh from taking close up pictures? Bokeh is a natural blurring effect you get from a larger aperature lens not being able to capture the entire depth of field. That's normal. The focused part of those pictures don't look blurry to me.
As an aside, any indoor shot will not be optimal lighting, unless you have a lighting kit or something to really brighten up the scene. Optimal lighting would be outside, and when the sun is not directly overhead. This is a very quick summation of optimal light, but you get the point.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you and this is why I wanted feedback. I posted the pictures I did (close-up), because, to me, they were the most objectifiable shots I could take while at work. The text just isn't as clear as other shots I've taken with other phones. I called it optimal lighting because I was in a 6x6 room with three windows and a skylight on a sunny day with no direct sunlight. The lighting felt like the kind any decent camera would take advantage of. To me, that's optimal..but I understand that's a strong word and not scientific. The fact that it scores so highly in professional reviews is what has me frustrated. The only thing I can deduce is that a professional, lab environment is more controlled and repeatable than my layman's point and shoot approach. They must be using a tripod, right? This phone has everything else I want and I just want to like the camera. So believe me, I want to figure out how to enjoy the camera. I will take more shots tomorrow and post them and I hope you and others with knowledge will chime in. I just know that with the other smartphone cameras I mentioned earlier, 8 out of 10 shots were keepers and with this one it's more like 1 out of 10 and that's not jiving with everyone else. Thanks again.
Sent from my XT1575 using XDA Free mobile app

looking at the pictures, they seem just fine to me. the blurred part (glue) at the bottom of the bottle is just from it using a wide aperture. the images are not tack sharp but this is a cellphone camera and small dof. I dont see motion blur.
problem with auto cameras is that you dont know what priority it has. to use a wide aperture to get a decent shutter speed and not have to use high iso or the opposite.
for proper exposure you have to adjust and juggle the 3 parameters (iso/aperture/shutter) to get a proper image.
wish the phone had controls like the LG G4 which has aperture iso shutter WB and EC.

Photo quality

Say "cheese", then rate this thread to express how photos taken with the Sony Xperia 5 come out. A higher rating indicates that photos offer rich color (without over-saturating), sharp detail (with all subjects in-focus), and appropriate exposure (with even lighting).
Then, drop a comment if you have anything to add!

Having this phone along with Pixel 4, I can say that X5 photo quality is mixed bag. The most frustrating thing is "ghost imaging" of moving objects, not even a fast ones. Color accuracy is pretty good. Camera app itself still needs some work. It's not convenient to use and it's considerably slower that Pixel 4 one. Focusing system could be better too.

WarVic said:
Having this phone along with Pixel 4, I can say that X5 photo quality is mixed bag. The most frustrating thing is "ghost imaging" of moving objects, not even a fast ones. Color accuracy is pretty good. Camera app itself still needs some work. It's not convenient to use and it's considerably slower that Pixel 4 one. Focusing system could be better too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On Manual Mode the phone is unbeatable.

doministry said:
On Manual Mode the phone is unbeatable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unfortunately it's not true. I wish it was true but it's definitely not. I played a lot with manual mode on Xperia 5. I does produce very good, with plenty of details, true to life colours, "Pixel grade" photos in good light condition. Any other conditions different from ideal and Xperia photos start to fall apart. Making pictures of the moving objects in light conditions just a bit different from ideal is a failure as well. I'm getting "ghost", "double" images of my kids nearly all the time. That's not acceptable for flagship camera-phone. The same thing happen when you make photos in the late evening or night. It's pretty much impossible to use Xperia 5 in this conditions without tripod. Sony just unable to compensate even a very minimal hand shake where as it's not a problem for Pixel or flagship Huawei devices. So I took a lot of photos from Pixel 4 and Xperia 5 in the same conditions for comparison to choose the best one to keep. I took a month for me to make the final decision. So I decided to keep Pixel 4 just for much better camera system. I'll give a chance to Xperia 5 Plus this year though.

WarVic said:
Unfortunately it's not true. I wish it was true but it's definitely not. I played a lot with manual mode on Xperia 5. I does produce very good, with plenty of details, true to life colours, "Pixel grade" photos in good light condition. Any other conditions different from ideal and Xperia photos start to fall apart. Making pictures of the moving objects in light conditions just a bit different from ideal is a failure as well. I'm getting "ghost", "double" images of my kids nearly all the time. That's not acceptable for flagship camera-phone. The same thing happen when you make photos in the late evening or night. It's pretty much impossible to use Xperia 5 in this conditions without tripod. Sony just unable to compensate even a very minimal hand shake where as it's not a problem for Pixel or flagship Huawei devices. So I took a lot of photos from Pixel 4 and Xperia 5 in the same conditions for comparison to choose the best one to keep. I took a month for me to make the final decision. So I decided to keep Pixel 4 just for much better camera system. I'll give a chance to Xperia 5 Plus this year though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That means you have no clue about manual mode. I get all I want. You just have to use ISO and shutter speed and all that stuff correctly. That's it. It's obvious for any person knowing anything about photogtaphy....
I don't have any ghosting. Any. Sorry. And the Android 10 update makes things even better. Just yesterday had a chance to make some pics in difficult conditions and it worked great.
https://flic.kr/p/2io5e3E
https://flic.kr/p/2io2KfM

I don't need to have a clue about manual mode. Xperia 5 is not DSLR camera, you know. The main purpose of any flagship smartphone, camera-phone in particular, is ability to make perfect shots at any time as fast as possible without playing with manual mode. Manual mode is just a good addition (for geeks), nothing more. Mediocre auto mode isn't forgivable thing for such expensive device. Kids don't allow to tinker with manual mode - they simply won't wait. And I don't like to miss a moment. I can give you samples with "ghost" images if you like. Certainly Xperia 5 isn't up for competition right now and I have doubts that Sony Alpha team took any part in Xperia 1 / 5 development. They have a beer together, I guess . That's a main contribution.
---------- Post added at 12:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:54 PM ----------
In addition, Xperia 5 app launch speed is ridiculously slow compared to all phones I had for the last 2 years. Focusing system is disappointing as well. Quite often it just misses and too many times I came across the problem of inability to focus on places / objects which was not a problem Pixel 4. That's not good either.

WarVic said:
I don't need to have a clue about manual mode. Xperia 5 is not DSLR camera, you know. The main purpose of any flagship smartphone, camera-phone in particular, is ability to make perfect shots at any time as fast as possible without playing with manual mode. Manual mode is just a good addition (for geeks), nothing more. Mediocre auto mode isn't forgivable thing for such expensive device. Kids don't allow to tinker with manual mode - they simply won't wait. And I don't like to miss a moment. I can give you samples with "ghost" images if you like. Certainly Xperia 5 isn't up for competition right now and I have doubts that Sony Alpha team took any part in Xperia 1 / 5 development. They have a beer together, I guess . That's a main contribution.
---------- Post added at 12:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:54 PM ----------
In addition, Xperia 5 app launch speed is ridiculously slow compared to all phones I had for the last 2 years. Focusing system is disappointing as well. Quite often it just misses and too many times I came across the problem of inability to focus on places / objects which was not a problem Pixel 4. That's not good either.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wrong. Manual mode is exactly to be used consciously. If you want effect you think before you do it. That's why it's MANUAL. And than why do you want to make photos if you don't care about basics? I think it's just plain ingnorace. Than why do you even bother writing on forums. Learn something, and than discuss - don't expect your ignorance will be seen as a good thing.
Another silly thing - yes, phone cameras are semi pro, for some years. And if they're not, again - why do you expect any good results from it?
Let's face it, you need an idiot camera, than buy Pixel. Leave the best for those who can actually use it.

doministry said:
Wrong. Manual mode is exactly to be used consciously. If you want effect you think before you do it. That's why it's MANUAL. And than why do you want to make photos if you don't care about basics? I think it's just plain ingnorace. Than why do you even bother writing on forums. Learn something, and than discuss - don't expect your ignorance will be seen as a good thing.
Another silly thing - yes, phone cameras are semi pro, for some years. And if they're not, again - why do you expect any good results from it?
Let's face it, you need an idiot camera, than buy Pixel. Leave the best for those who can actually use it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you completely forgot what are you talking about - what really is a tiny camera on a dinky phone (whatever good and powerful it is) and what's the primary purpose of it. And you're calling the best smartphone camera on the market for quite a while by now (not just my personal opinion by the way) - Google Pixel camera - an idiotic one?! That is complete ignorance and nonsense! You certainly never had a Pixel phone. That's explains everything.
Please find attached one of my Xperia 5 photo. It's an epic failure indeed, man. An it's not just a one-off shot. Can't remember that I saw anything like that coming from flagship smartphone camera.
Good luck with your "advanced, for professionals only" Xperia ). Cheers!

WarVic said:
I think you completely forgot what are you talking about - what really is a tiny camera on a dinky phone (whatever good and powerful it is) and what's the primary purpose of it. And you're calling the best smartphone camera on the market for quite a while by now (not just my personal opinion by the way) - Google Pixel camera - an idiotic one?! That is complete ignorance and nonsense! You certainly never had a Pixel phone. That's explains everything.
Please find attached one of my Xperia 5 photo. It's an epic failure indeed, man. An it's not just a one-off shot. Can't remember that I saw anything like that coming from flagship smartphone camera.
Good luck with your "advanced, for professionals only" Xperia ). Cheers!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh, I forgot to mention Xperia 5 complete inability to handle lens flares which was the issue for me not just once, very limited HDR mode and ... inability to shoot in RAW ("Idiotic" Pixel does have RAW!). Last one Sony's omission is laughable for "professional grade, Sony Alpha team tuned" flagship smartphone camera to say at least! And once again, Xperia focusing system is just horrible (maybe perfect for you though if you're not familiar with others). This is my final 2 cents. Cheers

WarVic said:
I think you completely forgot what are you talking about - what really is a tiny camera on a dinky phone (whatever good and powerful it is) and what's the primary purpose of it. And you're calling the best smartphone camera on the market for quite a while by now (not just my personal opinion by the way) - Google Pixel camera - an idiotic one?! That is complete ignorance and nonsense! You certainly never had a Pixel phone. That's explains everything.
Please find attached one of my Xperia 5 photo. It's an epic failure indeed, man. An it's not just a one-off shot. Can't remember that I saw anything like that coming from flagship smartphone camera.
Good luck with your "advanced, for professionals only" Xperia ). Cheers!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, it's good to be able to understand things you comment. I didn't say Google is an idiotic camera, I just said you need an idiots camera - camera which does anything for you, you just press the shutter.
Google is known for its Auto Mode. But as compared with any phone with manual controls, it fails. There are tons of real life comparisons on YouTube to prove that. But to know that you have to understand anything about photography, which you don't. Which you prove again with your arguments - first about the tiny camera and than about RAW. It's obvious none of these opinions are yours actually.
Now, about the photo you enclosed - maybe your phone is broken, I don't know. Never seen anything like that, and I was never able to fail like this although I've made thousands of photos.

doministry said:
Well, it's good to be able to understand things you comment. I didn't say Google is an idiotic camera, I just said you need an idiots camera - camera which does anything for you, you just press the shutter.
Google is known for its Auto Mode. But as compared with any phone with manual controls, it fails. There are tons of real life comparisons on YouTube to prove that. But to know that you have to understand anything about photography, which you don't. Which you prove again with your arguments - first about the tiny camera and than about RAW. It's obvious none of these opinions are yours actually.
Now, about the photo you enclosed - maybe your phone is broken, I don't know. Never seen anything like that, and I was never able to fail like this although I've made thousands of photos.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's clear that you're just a blind Sony fan pretending to be a really cool professional photographer using highly sophisticated, for clever people only, MANUAL mode and .... "professionally" taking photos by smartphone camera . That pretty muck explains everything. You made me laugh, man. I like you for that . I just say it again, Xperia 5 has subbar camera system suitable for Sony fanboys only. An not only Pixel 1 or 2 but also most modern Chinese phones like Huawei, Xiaomi and Realme do much better job with their camera than glorious Sony Xperia. Unfortunately that's the brutal truth. And you have to suck it up and go on with Xperia 5 - the choice of professional photographers .

WarVic said:
It's clear that you're just a blind Sony fan pretending to be a really cool professional photographer using highly sophisticated, for clever people only, MANUAL mode and .... "professionally" taking photos by smartphone camera . That pretty muck explains everything. You made me laugh, man. I like you for that . I just say it again, Xperia 5 has subbar camera system suitable for Sony fanboys only. An not only Pixel 1 or 2 but also most modern Chinese phones like Huawei, Xiaomi and Realme do much better job with their camera than glorious Sony Xperia. Unfortunately that's the brutal truth. And you have to suck it up and go on with Xperia 5 - the choice of professional photographers .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A classic - personal insults instead of any real argument. Typical forum dumb..ss. But the fact you can't even make a proper photo because you're drunk, doesn't mean the discussion with you is in any way better

No insults or rants against the brand. I gave you real arguments of subbar Xperia 5 cameras compared to Google Pixel 2 / 3 / 4, Huawei Mate 10 Pro / 20 Pro / P30. I used all these camera-phones for more than enough time to compare with Xperia 5.
So personally for you I repeat my arguments against "master of mobile photography" Sony Xperia 5:
- inferior focusing system - slower than others, unable to focus properly to damn often on places where rivals smartphones can do easily,
- painfully slow Camera app start up, Camera app itself is not really good & polished as others,
- no dedicated night mode. Automatic one isn't good enough compare to rivals,
- inability to make night shots in Manual mode without tripod (blurry mess is guaranteed),
- struggle to make any decent photos in extreme or not perfect light conditions,
- camera lenses / glass cover flares,
- not good enough dynamic range,
- inferior HDR mode (little to none difference when it's on), inability to use it in Auto mode,
- "ghost" imaging of moving objects.
I saw all above mentioned issues by my own eyes and this is not something I was expected to come across on Alpha team tweaked Sony Xperia flagship smartphone camera!

WarVic said:
...
Please find attached one of my Xperia 5 photo. It's an epic failure indeed, man. An it's not just a one-off shot. Can't remember that I saw anything like that coming from flagship smartphone camera
....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi there,
Not to argue for or against Xperia 5 camera(s), but I just want to point out that your phone was perhaps defective.
In all the pictures I've done with Xperia 5, I've never seen any ghost image such as in your example, not even at night.
I can however get blurred moving subjects (but no double image) if taken at too slow shutter speed, as is the case with any small sensor camera.
This happens for example at night in auto-mode on Xperia 5 (ex: 1/16): too slow to shoot people, in which case we must set the speed in manual mode to avoid blur (ex: 1/64).
Cheers too!

chgr said:
Hi there,
Not to argue for or against Xperia 5 camera(s), but I just want to point out that your phone was perhaps defective.
In all the pictures I've done with Xperia 5, I've never seen any ghost image such as in your example, not even at night.
I can however get blurred moving subjects (but no double image) if taken at too slow shutter speed, as is the case with any small sensor camera.
This happens for example at night in auto-mode on Xperia 5 (ex: 1/16): too slow to shoot people, in which case we must set the speed in manual mode to avoid blur (ex: 1/64).
Cheers too!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You could be right but I'm not sure. Can't remember that any of my smartphones had faulty camera in the past. I took photos both in Auto and Manual mode (HDR was enabled, nothing more changed) and that "double images" of moving objects persisted in light conditions a bit different from ideal. Just slight movement of my kids was enough to get unusable photo. Very disappointing. Luckily I sold that phone already and ordered another one. I'll check your suggestion once I get it.
Thanks

WarVic said:
You could be right but I'm not sure. Can't remember that any of my smartphones had faulty camera in the past. I took photos both in Auto and Manual mode (HDR was enabled, nothing more changed) and that "double images" of moving objects persisted in light conditions a bit different from ideal. Just slight movement of my kids was enough to get unusable photo. Very disappointing. Luckily I sold that phone already and ordered another one. I'll check your suggestion once I get it.
Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok. I tried lots of pictures exactly as you explain: HDR ON (both with auto and manual), lots of light in background and a moving subject not well lit. Basically I did a moving person against a bright window.
I did get about 1 in 20 of these back-lit photos displaying a ghost image at the limit between dark and light areas. So I agree the phone still exhibits a little bit of the same issues as was the case in older models.
The algorithm to blend the multiple images in HDR is not yet perfect.
Not sure about the Pixel 4. It's probably better at this. I personally had the pixel 2 and sold it exactly because I was getting consistently blurred pictures of people and animals in HDR mode, much worse than with Xperia XZ2 which I had at the same time. Problem is Pixel 2 could only take nice pictures with HDR enabled, otherwise was terrible quality.
So in my day to day usage, I normally don't get this issue with the X5 which I use mostly in auto mode. Tip: if you absolutely need to avoid HDR in auto mode (besides the obvious advice not to shoot people in backlit conditions), uncheck "Object tracking" in settings, and use your finger to set focus + exposure on your subject before taking the pic. This in effect prevents HDR (Backlit) mode.
So now the only time I use manual mode is for night time shots to avoid blurred faces with 1/32 or 1/64 speed. I just wish Sony would add an option in settings so the user could set a lower speed limit that would apply to Eye/ face detected subjects only.

Thanks for good advises. I'll certainly use them once I get the phone. Regarding Pixel 2, I can't remember getting any blurred / out of focus photos from it. Quite surprised to hear it. Anyway, Pixel 3 seems ironed all the issues of previous models. I still consider it one of the best camera-phones right now. Also it's very cheap now too. Overall it is one of the best phones I've ever had and that's why I decided to keep it as a backup phone. Pixel 4 appeared to be roughly the same thing with worse battery. That was the reason for getting rid of it.
I did enjoy Xperia 5 too though. Hence I gave it one more chance and re-order it. I wish that Sony fix current issues with it or will do it in future. One of them, a very noticeable one, the camera app launch speed and its overall performance. I want it to be on pair with older Pixel 3 one, not any slower. Cheers

WarVic said:
Thanks for good advises. I'll certainly use them once I get the phone. Regarding Pixel 2, I can't remember getting any blurred / out of focus photos from it. Quite surprised to hear it. Anyway, Pixel 3 seems ironed all the issues of previous models. I still consider it one of the best camera-phones right now. Also it's very cheap now too. Overall it is one of the best phones I've ever had and that's why I decided to keep it as a backup phone. Pixel 4 appeared to be roughly the same thing with worse battery. That was the reason for getting rid of it.
I did enjoy Xperia 5 too though. Hence I gave it one more chance and re-order it. I wish that Sony fix current issues with it or will do it in future. One of them, a very noticeable one, the camera app launch speed and its overall performance. I want it to be on pair with older Pixel 3 one, not any slower. Cheers
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I guess now that X5 is getting much cheaper it's still interesting, but I wouldn't expect big software improvements to come except for maybe Photo Pro app if Sony is nice to us.
Personally I think the next version X5 II should bring major improvements in photo and we will soon know if that's true with the X1 II:
Photo Pro app vs current camera app (should bring better speed, stability and features if it lives up to current Cinema Pro app)
Bigger sensors = better low light shots
Faster and better focus (with TOF and dual pixel)
Eye tracking on pets (I have a cat and a dog)
... That's of course if it does indeed come out.

It's good enough.
Overall it's an acceptable camera system. I agree it has some flaws, but I knew that going in. I purchased used on eBay (MUCH more affordable), and of course read and viewed many reviews that outline these flaws. It's good enough for snapshots or Instagram or times when you need a pic of something when your out and about. I take a digital camera with me when I know I am going somewhere that I am going to photograph stuff. One reviewer summed up nicely what the big issue is here; Sony makes camera sensors for a lot of other phone companies and makes some of the absolute best digital cameras in the world, so how did they let this slide?

WarVic said:
I think you completely forgot what are you talking about - what really is a tiny camera on a dinky phone (whatever good and powerful it is) and what's the primary purpose of it. And you're calling the best smartphone camera on the market for quite a while by now (not just my personal opinion by the way) - Google Pixel camera - an idiotic one?! That is complete ignorance and nonsense! You certainly never had a Pixel phone. That's explains everything.
Please find attached one of my Xperia 5 photo. It's an epic failure indeed, man. An it's not just a one-off shot. Can't remember that I saw anything like that coming from flagship smartphone camera.
Good luck with your "advanced, for professionals only" Xperia ). Cheers!
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Looking at your pictures, i assume you received a faulty phone

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