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Pentile Matrix Screen what am I not understanding

I keep hearing everyone go on about Pentile is crap, etc. Then I hear that all AMOLED screens use Pentile Matrix rendering (Galaxy S, Nexus, etc). Also the pentile tech is also made by Samsung from my understanding. So why does everyone consider our Pentile TFT qHD Res 24-bit color screen crap on these fourms (other forums now too)? Especially when EVERY review I have seen online about our screens have gotten nothing but good ratings, and say it is almost as good as the iphone 4 IPS LCD screen (minus the pixel density 920x540 4" vs 920x640 3.5"). I think it is crap we have the highest res screen android phone ever and we are not getting atleast some credit.

Not really sure if there is a question in there. But Anandtech does a good explanation of the Pentile display including the pros and cons:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4165/the-motorola-atrix-4g-preview/4
In the end the decision is an objective one. Some people don't notice the difference and some people can't stop noticing the difference.
I am sure there will be numerous posts after mine complaining about the pentile display. But the only thing that matters is how the screen looks to you. Beyond that it is only a philosophical argument.

rex-tc said:
I think it is crap we have the highest res screen android phone ever and we are not getting atleast some credit.
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Meizu M9 is the android phone with highest res.
Besides, the SGS2 screen dominates the Atrix screen.

Gr1peN said:
Meizu M9 is the android phone with highest res.
Besides, the SGS2 screen dominates the Atrix screen.
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OK besides CHINA we have the highest res screen. Plus I don't think the SGS2 screen is any better it is even more oversaturated than the original SGS. On top of that they went with even less pixel density than the first... No thanks.

krkeegan said:
Not really sure if there is a question in there. But Anandtech does a good explanation of the Pentile display including the pros and cons:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4165/the-motorola-atrix-4g-preview/4
In the end the decision is an objective one. Some people don't notice the difference and some people can't stop noticing the difference.
I am sure there will be numerous posts after mine complaining about the pentile display. But the only thing that matters is how the screen looks to you. Beyond that it is only a philosophical argument.
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I guess my question is why is the Pentile LCD getting knocked but PENTILE AMOLED is not? Both have the same flaws and advantages.

rex-tc said:
I guess my question is why is the Pentile LCD getting knocked but PENTILE AMOLED is not? Both have the same flaws and advantages.
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Because people (Especially with phones for some reason) like to hop on bandwagons and have no idea what they're talking about.

Personally love the diplay on the Atrix but human nature requires some to nitpick. Prospective buyers should inform themselves of the display tech, but also that it is an excellent display that will only get a small but vocal minority bent.

krkeegan said:
Not really sure if there is a question in there. But Anandtech does a good explanation of the Pentile display including the pros and cons:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4165/the-motorola-atrix-4g-preview/4
In the end the decision is an objective one. Some people don't notice the difference and some people can't stop noticing the difference.
I am sure there will be numerous posts after mine complaining about the pentile display. But the only thing that matters is how the screen looks to you. Beyond that it is only a philosophical argument.
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I agree with you completely.

The Atrix 4G, with the Pentile screen, is still considerably higher in perceivable resolution than 800x480. And that's just my opinion.
I won't deny the Galaxy S have really nice colors, but they are oversaturdated.
The extra resolution in a practical sense has been more useful to me in web browsing and other activities than the LSD colors of my Captivate.
As someone poinedt out, it's a personal preference. I have a friend that would rather wait for Super AMOLED Plus but I find the Atrix to be an excellent phone and an improvement in all categories despite some legitimate complaints about upload speed that is the fault of AT&T.
-James

SAMOLED is pentile RGBG
Atrix is pentile RGBW
so the subpixels in the atrix are white...
I don't know the entire technicalities but I know that is the DIFFERENCE...
I love The screen. doesn't bother me a bit. I like CRISP over SATURATED, although I'm not knocking the SAMOLED screens either, as they are nice in their own right.

shea-bird said:
SAMOLED is pentile RGBG
Atrix is pentile RGBW
so the subpixels in the atrix are white...
I don't know the entire technicalities but I know that is the DIFFERENCE...
I love The screen. doesn't bother me a bit. I like CRISP over SATURATED, although I'm not knocking the SAMOLED screens either, as they are nice in their own right.
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Ya I found a little bit more about that....
"PenTile RGBW technology adds a white subpixel to the traditional red, blue, and green subpixels in a color display allowing a brighter display using less power. ... When the image is mostly desaturated colors, those near white or grey, the backlight brightness is significantly reduced, often to less than 50% peak, while the Liquid Crystal Display levels are increased to compensate. When the image has very bright saturated colors, the backlight brightness is maintained at higher levels. Since most natural images and black on white text have few simultaneously bright and saturated colors, the average power of the PenTile RGBW panel is 50% less than a conventional RGB LCD. Since the LCD backlight is the major power using component on many portable devices ... products that use the PenTile RGBW panel have appreciably longer battery life. The PenTile RGBW also has an optional high brightness mode that doubles the brightness of the desaturated color image areas, such as black&white text, for improved outdoor view-ability. "
To me it sounds instead of just RGB of tradition LCD screens we have a white subpixel also. Which increases brightness at half the power.
Man I swear these fanboys acting like we were getting some inferior screen when all along it was an UPRGADE
Plus Moto should of put some marketing scheme on it's name like. SUPER TFT LCD SCREEN QHD 24-BIT EXTREME. Then all of the fanboys would of went NUTS for it.

the simple solution is to try the phone out and see whether it meets your needs or not. at least that's how I see the 30 day love it or leave it trial period. let your own eyes be the judge, and then decide which pros and cons you can happily live with. The Atrix is a wonderful device,and I believe it will only get better with time. it was simply overkill for me, and at the ripe old age of 43 the bigger screen on the Inpire is easier to read lol.
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App

I don't know or care about the technical aspects of pentile displays, but I do know what my eyes see. If I zoom in on a 5 or 6 megapixel photo with my Samsung Captivate, the photo pixelates badly. If I do the same thing with my Atrix the photo stays sharp and clear. The Iphone 4 I returned TWICE, kept the same sharpness and clarity.
The auto settings on the Atrix and the HTC Inspire are terrible, take your camera off of automatic and it will take better pics.

rex-tc said:
Ya I found a little bit more about that....
"PenTile RGBW technology adds a white subpixel to the traditional red, blue, and green subpixels in a color display allowing a brighter display using less power. ... When the image is mostly desaturated colors, those near white or grey, the backlight brightness is significantly reduced, often to less than 50% peak, while the Liquid Crystal Display levels are increased to compensate. When the image has very bright saturated colors, the backlight brightness is maintained at higher levels. Since most natural images and black on white text have few simultaneously bright and saturated colors, the average power of the PenTile RGBW panel is 50% less than a conventional RGB LCD. Since the LCD backlight is the major power using component on many portable devices ... products that use the PenTile RGBW panel have appreciably longer battery life. The PenTile RGBW also has an optional high brightness mode that doubles the brightness of the desaturated color image areas, such as black&white text, for improved outdoor view-ability. "
To me it sounds instead of just RGB of tradition LCD screens we have a white subpixel also. Which increases brightness at half the power.
Man I swear these fanboys acting like we were getting some inferior screen when all along it was an UPRGADE
Plus Moto should of put some marketing scheme on it's name like. SUPER TFT LCD SCREEN QHD 24-BIT EXTREME. Then all of the fanboys would of went NUTS for it.
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thanks cause of this i changed my wallpaper to completely white background ill see if it improves battery life

When the galaxy s came out, the deal breaker for me was the screen.
Before I knew what a pentile matrix was I noticed it without trying, and it bugs me a lot.

I have been using mine for a few days now and love the clarity of the screen. The only problem for me is that when reading on it for extended times, such as using xda, I start to develop headaches? Really odd and I thought it would just be a short adjustment but after three straight evenings I am beginning to wonder.

I wondered the exact same thing OP. I'm in the market for an atrix and I've been trolling the forums for a while to get a feel of user feedback.
It really seems like people are complaining about the pentile display on the atrix but all current SAMOLEDS have the exact same problem.
The pentile matrix is only fixed on the new SAMOLED plus on the SG2 , so until then I'm not sure why people keep knocking the pentile display on the atrix when comparing it to other current gen phones like the Nexus S and captivate.
Just my 2 cents

I find the screen on the Atrix to be very crisp and clear. Can I see a pixel or two? Honestly I dunno because I don't search for pixels on a phone screen. Gaming and text are both excellent.
I find that people complain too much. They also will read somewhere that "pentile sucks" so they start saying "fail, Pentile sucks". There would be much less drama on forums and blogs if people would just try a product and form their own opinions instead just blindly following a reviewer or commenter.

Gr1peN said:
Besides, the SGS2 screen dominates the Atrix screen.
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With a 4.3" SAMOLED Plus display.... expect battery life close to 1-hr of 3G web browsing.

TareX said:
With a 4.3" SAMOLED Plus display.... expect battery life close to 1-hr of 3G web browsing.
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To say nothing of the fact that the GPS won't work and you'll never see updates

Pentile Matrix reloaded

Most reasonable people viewing the GNote pentile screen say it is bright, has high contrast, deep blacks and a sharp image.
It is a 24bit Millions of colours screen.
So why the hatred of pentile?
It's got me f#^ked.
Maybe it is due to old arguments that date back years.
There is an old controversy going around between pentile and LCD proponents, which is apples vs oranges because there are pentile lcd's and rgb oled's.
The controversy is, that pentiles use less sub-pixels and therefore should be rated as such in lower pixel density.
This ignores how vision works, which essentially is an illusion.
To disagree is to dismiss basic Buddhism and modern psychology as well as film theory on visual perception.
At the level of pixels, the illusion of vision breaks down for lcd as well as pentile screens.
So while looking at a pentile screen with a magnifying glass can be scary, it is the same for rgb's.
So why did Samsung go back to using the pentile matrix instead of RGB for the Note?
Only guessing, but some of the advantages of pentile are;
Cuts power consumption in half for equivalent brightness, or
Doubles screen brightness for equivalent power
Achieves higher resolution
Provides flexible settings for color control and power savings
Increases cost savings potential and yield for manufacturers
Accelerates adoption of next-generation devices
Makes text easier to read
nuvoyance.com
Contrary to the hype, pentiles allow higher resolution, all the while using much less power. Talk about a no-brainer.
One of the limitations of the pentile is a cross hatched pattern seen on the edge of some images, like a border between red and white, when seen up close(with a magnifying glass). This is so at lower pixel densities but "for higher pixel densities you stand to gain from PenTile" ; is the PenTile matrix bad for you?
More technical info:
PenTile blog
OLED-A

Achieve higher resolution - yes, but already given a 1280 x800 resolution, would you prefer it to be pentile or RGB?
No one is complaining about pentile can give higher resolution, its not like we want 800x480 RGB over 1280x800 pentile. But already given the phone is 1280x800, people would rather it be super amoled plus instead of pentile super amoled.
While pentile consumes less power, super amoled screens sucks power like crazy. It is a fact. But that said, i still think the screen is gorgreous. however if you let me choose - RGB over pentile any day.

GALAXYNOTE said:
Achieve higher resolution - yes, but already given a 1280 x800 resolution, would you prefer it to be pentile or RGB?
No one is complaining about pentile can give higher resolution, its not like we want 800x480 RGB over 1280x800 pentile. But already given the phone is 1280x800, people would rather it be super amoled plus instead of pentile super amoled.
While pentile consumes less power, super amoled screens sucks power like crazy. It is a fact. But that said, i still think the screen is gorgreous. however if you let me choose - RGB over pentile any day.
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Given a 1280 x800 resolution, I would prefer it to be pentile as it will look better.
Perceived resolution.
Pentile consumes 50% less power than RGB.

Xaddict said:
Pentile consumes 50% less power than RGB.
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Well if you are not talking about super amoled, then yes a pentile layout consumes theoretically 33% less power.
If you are strictly comparing pentile RGBG/RGBW to RGB, pentile looks like sh*t i gotta say. At least my atrix did.

Pentile also ages better than sRGB amoled, because the lifespan of the organic amoled subpixels are different from color to color. The pentile ages better because there are simply more subpixels of the color which has the lowest lifespan.

epicfailguy2 said:
Pentile also ages better than sRGB amoled, because the lifespan of the organic amoled subpixels are different from color to color. The pentile ages better because there are simply more subpixels of the color which has the lowest lifespan.
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The color which has the lowest lifespan is blue, from what i can recall)
How does RGBG or RGBW have more blue subpixels than RGB? (I am only asking just wanted to know.)

GALAXYNOTE said:
Well if you are not talking about super amoled, then yes a pentile layout consumes theoretically 33% less power.
If you are strictly comparing pentile RGBG/RGBW to RGB, pentile looks like sh*t i gotta say. At least my atrix did.
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Well, comparing the Note screen(pentile) to the SGII screen(rgb), opinions vary, but the Note screen looks better to me.

GALAXYNOTE said:
The color which has the lowest lifespan is blue, from what i can recall)
How does RGBG or RGBW have more blue subpixels than RGB? (I am only asking just wanted to know.)
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More green than blue.

Xaddict said:
Well, comparing the Note screen(pentile) to the SGII screen(rgb), opinions vary, but the Note screen looks better to me.
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Actually I gotta agree with you on that. My gf had a SGS II and that blue tint bugged the hell outta me. I dont know what they done to it, but i dont think it was a problem with it being RGB.

Pentile suffers from strange color tints on whites.
Hard time rendering shades of gray.
Strange artifacts in low-light conditions.
Ofc all noise is camouflaged by the high resolution.
I would trade for the S-LCD screen of the Rezound any-day,
the only problem with that screen is that it could use abit deeper blacks.

MartijnMM said:
Pentile suffers from strange color tints on whites.
Hard time rendering shades of gray.
Strange artifacts in low-light conditions.
Ofc all noise is camouflaged by the high resolution.
I would trade for the SRGB screen of the Rezound any-day,
the only problem with that screen is that it could use abit deeper blacks.
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I think this is related to OLED and not Pentile.
The Note screen does seem bluish to me when seen from an angle.
I don't see problems with grey on the Note.
I have view gradients to test the 24bit resolution and if viewed in a 24bit app, 24bit images look fine, otherwise not, but this is not an intrinsic fault of the Note's screen, only of the low res images or apps.

I'm not going to go back through and quote people, but some people said some things that are downright incorrect. Pentile does NOT "increase the resolution." It does exactly the opposite, decreasing it. Pentile has half the red subpixels and half the blue subpixels that RGB does; that means overall, pentile only has 2/3 the pixel elements that an RGB screen has. You can't display more information with fewer pixel elements.
The unpleasant artifacts I notice on pentile screens are small text, lines, graphics, appear fuzzy and sometimes colored on the edges, and when I look at solid colors that use red and blue (i.e.just about everything but solid green) especially white, I get this screen door effect. It's almost like there's a bit of checkerboard pattern to the solid color rather than being uniform. Hold your phone closer to your face and look at a solid white area, especially try to find a solid white area that is next to a solid green area with the brightness turned up all the way and you'll really see what I'm talking about.
Pentile doesn't necessarily use less energy than RGB. There are fewer subpixels, but they're twice as large and put out twice as much light. Energy in = light out. So in theory, the energy should be exactly the same. Perhaps they've found some way to do pentile a little more efficiently on some phones, but it's not an overall rule at all.
Pentile is used because it allows them to make the blues twice as big. Since they had a problem with short life span on those, making them twice as big made them hardier, longer lived, and higher yields in the manufacturing process. That's the ONLY reason for pentile. You could say this allows manufacturers to build higher resolution displays than they otherwise would be capable of (since they're cheating and using larger blues than an RGB would have) but a 1280x800 pentile is NOT "higher resolution" than a 1280x800 RGB! According to definition, they're the exact same resolution, but in reality, the pentile is lower in resolution.
RGB is ALWAYS better than pentile as far as image quality. The reason the Note's screen looks better than the SGSII, even though the SGSII had RGB, is simply because it has a much higher resolution. The benefits from that outweigh the negatives of pentile.
Here's a pic I put together showing the differences, even though you can find the same thing elsewhere on the net:

Thanks for summing that up =) Can we go on now and accept Sammy's gone cheap on us?

I really am not too bothered about what screen the phone uses as long as it looks good, i do think to me it looks fantastic. Lovely and bright and it displays a fantastic picture. If people dont like a particular screen a phone uses then they have the choice not to buy it. Some posts in here are very informative so in that respect thanks. However people that ***** about the phones screen (not necessarily in this thread) have the choice to return it and wait for the screen of their choice to come out.
Sent from my GT-N7000 using xda premium

maxh said:
The unpleasant artifacts I notice .......
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The general public isn't noticing these artifacts, which makes me think they made the right decision on this one. After all, the General public would definitely notice a higher battery drain. I won't pretend to know the technical details about why Pentile battery usage < RGB.
maxh said:
Hold your phone closer to your face and look at a solid white area .... with the brightness turned up all the way and you'll really see what I'm talking about.
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Probably - but it's not interesting if that's not how you generally use your phone.
I wish I could find the interview, but they interviewed a samsung executive who was quite candid about the whole thing. He said quite clearly that Amoled + is sharper than Pentile. But he said that they went Pentile because in terms of sharpness, Amoled is good enough (i.e. still fantastic) - production is better (i.e. it's cheaper to make) and uses less battery power.
And they are correct. I've watched/read many many reviews of the GNote. For the most part, they all rave about the Screen, complain about the price, and are happy with the battery.
It would have been a mistake to put AMOLED+ in, and have the reviews (still) rave about the Screen, be even more turned off by the price, and only be 'okay' with the battery. (perhaps even complaining about it, saying 'Luckily it has a huge battery, because otherwise you'd be toast)
The GNote is already a niche device - you want to widen its appeal as much as possible.
- Frank

Don't get me wrong, I'm very happy with my Note, including the screen. Search my posts and you'll see me say that several times. I'm a long time pentile hater from the day I first powered on my nexus one and started wondering what was wrong with the screen. Yet I've said several times that the Note's so awesome and the screen otherwise so beautiful that I'm able to overlook the pentile layout.
However I'm not going to read people claiming that pentile is better than RGB without speaking up, because it's not.

maxh said:
Pentile does NOT "increase the resolution." It does exactly the opposite, decreasing it
...
Pentile is used because it allows them to make the blues twice as big. Since they had a problem with short life span on those, making them twice as big made them hardier, longer lived, and higher yields in the manufacturing process. That's the ONLY reason for pentile. You could say this allows manufacturers to build higher resolution displays than they otherwise would be capable of (since they're cheating and using larger blues than an RGB would have) but a 1280x800 pentile is NOT "higher resolution" than a 1280x800 RGB! According to definition, they're the exact same resolution, but in reality, the pentile is lower in resolution.
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(This isn't meant to be a hostile response, I apologise if it comes across that way - it's absolutely not intended)
It doesn't directly, no. But you then go on to point out exactly how it enables much higher pixel densities - in an RGB layout each sub-pixel is the same size, so they need to make the blue sub-pixel at a viable size (as you said,) then make green and red sub-pixels that are the same size again.
On a PenTile screen, they can print the blue sub-pixel at it's required size, but the green component can be much smaller - and as a result, you can fit more pixels into the same space. If you compare the Galaxy Nexus's 316ppi PenTile screen to the S2's 216ppi RGB screen, you'll find that the blue and red sub-pixels are actually of a comparable width.
Sure RGBRGB is technically superior to RGBG in terms of image quality, but after a certain pixel-density:distance ratio, it just doesn't matter anymore, and allows for a greater pixel density regardless of display technology.
As a point of curiosity (I know you gave this first point, I'm just elaborating,) resolution is a measure of the number of horizontal or vertical alternating black and white lines a display can produce while maintaining a certain level of contrast. PenTile screens actually are their advertised resolution. However low-density RGBG will lose some detail in reds, but greens are still fine, and the human eye can't see enough detail in blue to tell a difference there. That's in general though - obviously there are biological differences in people, and that is where the legitimate complaints come from - not from holding a phone 3 inches from your face.
As for whether RGB or PenTile is better - consider that the Galaxy Nexus's 4.65" screen could fit either 1280x720 RG/BG pixels, or 960x540 RGB pixels, and it's too dense to be able to tell the difference in sub-pixel arrangement. I think PenTile actually is better in that case.

small dots and big dots
okay so everyone is forgetting that not so long ago printers used to print using
only one size dot of ink. well the picture from same size dots looked grainy. so the print people came up with different size dots of ink to make the pictures look
amazing. i look at the pentile displays the same way. in comparison the
screens on rgb screens look blocky to me and those on pentile look smoother and
less grainy. iphone just shrank the dots to where the human eye can't detect
them. but i believe to acheive the same thing on a larger screen isn't very
pratical. that's where different size pixels will make images appear smooth.

Some great info that dispels some pentile myths can be found here - http://pentileblog.com/uncategorized/pentile-for-720-hd-oled-smartphones/.
Put simply, a lot of the criticisms of pentile displays are only relevant to particular implementations, and not necessarily to the technology.
Regards,
Dave
Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk

I looked at the Note screen under a loupe and I could see a serrated edge along the top of white text on a black bacground. If I looked at it normally I couldn't tell. In this case the pentile doesn't bug me.
What DOES bug me is the low color depth that the Note displays. It is odd as it is inconsistant. If I look at photos it is fine. Some apps though look like the color depth is drastically reduced. Two apps to test are Angry birds Rio, and Google Sky. In AB look at the sky and clouds on the title screen, the shades all blend smooth on other devices (checked on an Infuse). On the Note there is severe color loss and much banding evident. Same with google sky There are these sky gradients, smoother on other OLED screens like the Infuse, much more bandy on the Note. I don't know why on some things like photos the note looks fine, but in many apps color loss and banding is evident. Maybe it is some weird incompatibility of the apps? Maybe they mis-read the screen capability and drop to low color mode? I don't know but it is weird and bothers me much more than the pentile matrix.

Samsung: PenTile AMOLED displays last longer, that's why we use them

http://www.mobileburn.com/19548/new...ed-displays-last-longer-thats-why-we-use-them
Samsung announced its new Galaxy S III smartphone to great fanfare last week, though some observers weren't terribly happy with one particular feature: the 4.8-inch 720p Super AMOLED display uses a PenTile(INFO) subpixel layout instead of the generally more favorable RGB(INFO) layout. At CTIA 2012, we spoke to Samsung about its choice to use PenTile layouts in a large number of its displays, and the answer really comes down to durability and longevity.
Ever since the original Galaxy S in 2010, Samsung has used AMOLED(INFO) (usually branded as Super AMOLED or Super AMOLED Plus) displays in many of its high-end smartphones, and many consumers are big fans of them. AMOLED screens have tremendous contrast, very saturated and vibrant colors, and extremely wide viewing angles. Devices that feature AMOLED displays have a certain 'wow' factor when you first look at them, and many users appreciate that, even if the displays don't provide the most accurate color reproduction. Samsung says that it fully believes AMOLED displays are the best for its mobile devices, and that's why it uses them time and again.
However AMOLED isn't without its faults. Displays that use AMOLED technology have a tendency to deteriorate over time. One doesn't have to look back that far to remember the problems Google had with the original Nexus One smartphone, which featured an AMOLED screen. There were numerous reports of screen deterioration after only a few months of use, and in some cases the display was rendered unusable (HTC, the maker of the Nexus One, eventually switched to using Super LCD displays in later versions of the phone, though it cited supply constraints as the reason for the switch).
Samsung's Philip Berne explained to me that the blue subpixels on AMOLED displays actually degrade the fastest - quicker than the red or green subpixels. With a PenTile layout, the subpixels are arranged RGBG (red, green, blue, green), so they feature more green subpixels and fewer red or blue subpixels than an RGB stripe layout with the same resolution. Because of this, AMOLED displays that have the PenTile layout tend to have a longer lifespan than those with RGB layouts. Since Samsung is selling its phones to users that usually keep them for 18 months or longer, it has to be sure that the display will still offer peak performance at that time. According to the company, PenTile AMOLED displays have proven to be more reliable than those with RGB layouts.
Those that have issues with the PenTile arrangement usually complain that the screen does not look as crisp as an RGB display or that there is odd color fringing along the edges of images, such as app icons. While Berne did agree that the PenTile arrangement's faults are pronounced at lower resolutions, such as qHD or WVGA, high-resolution displays hide the problems due to the sheer density of pixels. The Galaxy S III and the Galaxy Note, for example, both feature high-resolution Super AMOLED displays with PenTile subpixel arrangements (the Galaxy S III has a 1280 x 720 pixel screen, while the Note has a 1280 x 800 pixel display). Under a microscope, one can see the pixel layout on these displays, but in real-world use, it is not visible to the vast majority of users. To that point, the Galaxy S II, which had a lower-resolution WVGA (800 x 480 pixel) display, featured an RGB layout for its subpixels.
Today's choice to use PenTile in its high-end Super AMOLED displays doesn't mean that Samsung isn't working on or won't develop future AMOLED displays that use the RGB pixel layout, provided it can maintain reliability across the board. In fact, the Samsung Galaxy Tab 7.7 tablet features a 7.7-inch Super AMOLED Plus display with 1280 x 800 pixels and an RGB pixel layout, though that screen is obviously larger than what we see on smartphones, thereby making any PenTile-related issues more noticeable.
Is the PenTile subpixel layout something that should be a concern for prospective buyers of the new Galaxy S III? We really don't think so, and in our hands-on time with the device, we really could not see any issues with the screen. Trust me, I tried. Berne did point out that the 4.8-inch display on the Galaxy S III is improved over the 4.65-inch 720p Super AMOLED screen used on the Google Galaxy Nexus, as it features smaller gaps in its subpixel matrix, further minimizing the fringing effects of the PenTile layout.
Some reviewers and users may disagree, and contend that "once you see the PenTile, you can't unsee it," but we really think that the average smartphone buyer (the people that Samsung is actually selling the phone to) will never be the wiser. Additionally, as smartphones get higher and higher density displays, the argument over PenTile and RGB subpixel layouts will become less and less relevant. Are we going to be discussing this matter when smartphones with 1080p displays, perhaps some with PenTile subpixel layouts, come out in the next year or so? We really doubt it.

i wont believe that unless it comes straight from a Samsung press release article

I would say this is a make over from samsung, simply the technology is not ready for mass production hence the pentile.

IPS display

is it good? I'm only used to OLED.

The IPS display on the Nexus 7 looks good from what I've seen. IPS is known for decent viewing angles.

it depends on the OLED screen you're comparing it to.
the galaxy s2 has super amoled plus, which has a full rgb subpixel matrix, but only a resolution of 800x480. the full rgb subpixel matrix makes everything look clearer and sharper.
the galaxy nexus, galaxy note, and galaxy s3 use a pentile subpixel matrix. its something like rgbg, which makes the display look greenish. its not as sharp as a full rgb matrix, and the colours arent as vivid due to the lack of subpixels (ends up being around 66% less subpixels).
however, the main advantage of the oled displays is that their pixels can be turned off. this means that in movies and games, you have a 'true' black, whereas in led backlit LCD displays (unless it has full led backlight with local dimming) blacks will always seem greyish. oled displays also tend to oversaturate the colours. the other advantage is that since black means the led/pixel is turned off, it means that using a black wallpaper on oled displays will reduce power consumption and improve battery life.
the nexus 7 uses an IPS panel. the general idea is that all the pixels are aligned/parallel, which leads to the image looking sharper compared to TFT and TN panels. the nexus 7 also has a full RGB subpixel matrix which makes it much sharper, and in combination with the IPS setup, it leads to more accurate colour representation. however, as it is not an oled display and it does not have local dimming with a full led backlight (having such a setup would make the device much thicker), it is unable to render 'true' black and as a result, blacks end up looking a bit grey.
cant really say much about which one is better as it is a personal preference thing. some like the oversaturated colours of OLED as it seems more vivid, whereas others prefer the accuracy of IPS panels and sharpness.
at the moment, i own a galaxy note with a pentile amoled display, and i use a 37inch Panasonic TV for my PC display, which uses an IPS panel. i'd say both are pretty good in their own way, but i prefer the IPS panel simply because of the full set of subpixels and colour accuracy.

Waiting to see how hard I rage about the non-black backgrounds.
anandtech measured nexus 7 black at 0.37 nits, whatever that means.

as souai said, it really depends.
generally OLEDs have much better colors and look better, IPS is much better in sunlight though because it's brighter and has insanely good viewing angles up to 178 degrees.
I have a first gen asus transformer which uses and IPS screen and though it's not as impressive color/quality wise as the Galaxy S III and even my Galaxy Nexus (sometimes) it's still excellent and i've never been bothered by it.
and given the fact that the N7 has such a high pixel density it should look great, and the reviews have backed this up.

This isn't apples to apples here but comparing the gnex to the one x I say I definitely prefer the IPS display. Now this is the best version possible probably of its type but I'm happy for the n7 to get an IPS screen. Almost all reviews have talked about how nice it is, only complaint being a little warm and a little dim compared to some other IPS displays. I like my oled screen but since good IPS high res screens have come out, they seem to be superior to oled at the moment. Oled uses up lots of battery in anything other than very black biased setups. IPS has that slight gray to the black but most people are used to their computer monitors and TVs having this as well. I think we won't have to sorry as much about color uniformity as much either with IPS.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

nvm

thanks for the replies. it's helpful.

Galaxy Tab Pro 12.2

Thinking about buying one.
Why?
1) Getting blind in my old age, well not blind but I need reading glasses
2) Bigger screen should be more natural with magazines
3) Has Android 4.4 (now I know I can root install custom ROMs etc... but I also had bad luck doing this with tablets)
Two questions,
It is only 2 inches bigger does that two inches make it much harder to travel with?
It runs the latest Android, does it run better?
It is expensive and I which when I bought my Note 10.1 (2014) .... what 3 months ago I knew this was coming.

has crossed my mind as well, I do a lot of reading/surfing/viewing and I don't really take it out much
saw one in a shop ...not exactly cheap not sure worth the extra coin being asked

spacecat said:
has crossed my mind as well, I do a lot of reading/surfing/viewing and I don't really take it out much
saw one in a shop ...not exactly cheap not sure worth the extra coin being asked
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Personal preference of course. Some things to consider.
It's huge and comparatively heavy.
The N10.1-14 is getting 4.4 and M-UX; it's already listed as a feature on Samsung's commerce sites. It won't get the Pro features but you can download the most meaningful, Hancom Office, in the app sub-forum here. There was some question about a modified version of the Tab/Note|Pro s/w because we have a menu button and those devices have replaced it with a task button. N12 owners have reported that long-pressing the task button provides the menu function we have which means it's one set of s/w with different button function mapping. Other than the remainder of missing Pro features the only two other unique features to the N12 are four multiview windows (vs. our two) and an expanded keyboard with FN, ALT, CTRL keys.
The N12 has an inferior display because the same pixel count that's on the N10.1-14 is stretched out over a larger area. The N12 has a gross PPI of 247 compared to 299 on the N10.1-14. Both use a RGBW PenTile display which means the net RGB pixel count is 227 and the N10.1-14's is at 274. The iPad Air is 264. A couple of reviewers have mentioned seeing a difference between the Tab|Pro 8.4/10.1 and N10.1-14's displays when compared to the N12.
It's got a bigger battery and will outlast the N10.1-14. But the Exynos N10.1-14's take forever to charge so increase that even more for the N12.
It's got USB 3.0 but it does nothing to improve charging time and increases data transfer rates on Windows (only) PCs that are USB 3.0 equipped.
So in the end, especially after the N10.1-14 gets its updates, there's not a lot of difference between the two h/w and s/w wise with the biggest exception being a fairly low (for a 1080P display) net RGB pixel count of 227 on the N12. For reference the N2's 720P display had a net PPI of 267.
Happy deciding.

Where is the downloads of the hanscom?
Sent from my SM-P600 using Tapatalk

AstroDigital said:
Thinking about buying one.
Why?
1) Getting blind in my old age, well not blind but I need reading glasses
2) Bigger screen should be more natural with magazines
3) Has Android 4.4 (now I know I can root install custom ROMs etc... but I also had bad luck doing this with tablets)
Two questions,
It is only 2 inches bigger does that two inches make it much harder to travel with?
It runs the latest Android, does it run better?
It is expensive and I which when I bought my Note 10.1 (2014) .... what 3 months ago I knew this was coming.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's really nice. I don't think the extra size makes it harder to travel with. It is noticeably larger, and you see it the most when holding it with one hand while tapping and navigating with the other. Because it is larger and heavier, there's a lopsided weight to it to where it feels like it's trying to twist out of your hand. Nothing overly dramatic, but you do notice it every time. Unlike the Note 10.1 where your hand covers a larger part of the device and so there is less / none of that feeling. Any type of case etc would most likely mitigate the issue. Other than that the screen is beautiful, sure it may be lower density but nothing I ever noticed after using the Note 12.2. You'll really appreciate the larger nature of text and graphics however, and that is priceless.

BarryH_GEG said:
[*]The N12 has an inferior display because the same pixel count that's on the N10.1-14 is stretched out over a larger area. The N12 has a gross PPI of 247 compared to 299 on the N10.1-14. Both use a RGBW PenTile display which means the net RGB pixel count is 227 and the N10.1-14's is at 274. The iPad Air is 264. A couple of reviewers have mentioned seeing a difference between the Tab|Pro 8.4/10.1 and N10.1-14's displays when compared to the N12.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
May I ask how did you get the net PPI figure?
Note 10.1 has an RGBW matrix made of ~4 Mpixels (2560x1600).
This equals to the same subpixel count as a ~2.7 Mpixel RGB panel (PenTile only have 2 subpixels per pixel compared to RGB's full 3 subpixels)
Which means that our Note's effective resolution is 1306x2090.
So the hypotenuse of the panel (via the pythahorean theorem) equals to the equivalent of 2464 RGB pixels
Which finally means that we have an effective 244 PPI (2464.5/10.1)
Which is lower than Ipad's but higher than other 10.1 inch android's. iPad's screen also consumes far less battery has (arguably) better colours and most importantly does not suffer from the grayish blacks we suffer. In short if you want the best "large" panel in the market you have to go to Apple, for everything else our note is the best deal.

Stevethegreat said:
So the hypotenuse of the panel (via the pythahorean theorem).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Seriously?
The effective PPI of the N10.1-14's display is 299 PPI. It's achieved somewhat by slight of hand by using combinations of sub-pixels to create the illusion of more. That's the very definition of PenTile whose impact varies greatly based on implementation. My simple formula is essentially just factoring in the loss of 25% of the RGB sub-pixels to the added white ones and distributing the lost pixels across each of red, green, and blue. .
From WiKi...
PenTile RGBW technology, used in LCD, adds an extra subpixel to the traditional red, green and blue subpixels that is a clear area without color filtering material and with the only purpose of letting backlight come through, hence W for white. This makes it possible to produce a brighter image compared to an RGB-matrix while using the same amount of power, or produce an equally bright image while using less power.
The PenTile RGBW layout uses each red, green, blue and white subpixel to present high-resolution luminance information to the human eyes' red-sensing and green-sensing cone cells, while using the combined effect of all the color subpixels to present lower-resolution chroma (color) information to all three cone cell types. Combined, this optimizes the match of display technology to the biological mechanisms of human vision.[13] The layout uses one third fewer subpixels for the same resolution as the RGB stripe (RGB-RGB) layout, in spite of having four color primaries instead of the conventional three, using subpixel rendering combined with metamer rendering. Metamer rendering optimizes the energy distribution between the white subpixel and the combined red, green, and blue subpixels: W <> RGB, to improve image sharpness.
The display driver chip has an RGB to RGBW color vector space converter and gamut mapping algorithm, followed by metamer and subpixel rendering algorithms. In order to maintain saturated color quality, to avoid simultaneous contrast error between saturated colors and peak white brightness, while simultaneously reducing backlight power requirements, the display backlight brightness is under control of the PenTile driver engine. When the image is mostly desaturated colors, those near white or grey, the backlight brightness is significantly reduced, often to less than 50% peak, while the LCD levels are increased to compensate. When the image has very bright saturated colors, the backlight brightness is maintained at higher levels. The PenTile RGBW also has an optional high brightness mode that doubles the brightness of the desaturated color image areas, such as black&white text, for improved outdoor view-ability.​RGBW is funky in that when displaying certain fully saturated colors (yellow and green have been given as examples) on a white background there's some granularity issues on hard graphics edges.
Also from WiKi...
However, for the same resolution and size the PenTile screen can appear grainy, pixelated, speckled, with blurred text on some saturated colors and backgrounds when compared to RGB stripe color. This effect is understood to be caused by the restriction of the number of subpixels that may participate in the image reconstruction when the color is fully saturated. In the RGBW case, this is caused as the W subpixel will not be available in order to maintain the saturated color. For all other cases, text and especially full color images are fully reconstructed.​The impact of PenTile depends on PPI and even more so on visual acuity - the point at which the viewer's vision intersects one arcminute. For people with 20/20 vision holding a device the typical 10-12" away you can't see that the N10.1-14's display is PenTile; at least from a clarity perspective. Some people here with 20/10 vision have seen the RGBW saturation issue. I, with 20/20 vision, haven't.
Here's an interesting article talking about PPI and its impact on various content...
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/10/1080p-on-a-smartphone-screencan-it-possibly-matter/
Here's an interesting article talking about visual acuity in the context of Apple naming their display "retina"...
http://www.anandtech.com/show/3794/the-iphone-4-review/4
The pixel race explored...
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7743/the-pixel-density-race-and-its-technical-merits

BarryH_GEG said:
Seriously?
The effective PPI of the N10.1-14's display is 299 PPI. It's achieved somewhat by slight of hand by using combinations of sub-pixels to create the illusion of more. That's the very definition of PenTile whose impact varies greatly based on implementation. My simple formula is essentially just factoring in the loss of 25% of the RGB sub-pixels to the added white ones and distributing the lost pixels across each of red, green, and blue. .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I honestly don't get your point, a rectangle is made of two triangles whose hypotenuse is the diagonal of said rectangle, which is why one can use the pythagorean theorem to find the diagonal's pixel count.
As for the rest I calculated what's the effective PPI of our device is in RGB terms, again I don't see where I'm wrong. I called it effective because most screens use an RGB panel. A 1306x2090 panel produces exactly the same sub-pixel count as our note. Now due to subpixels' placing one may see a different picture altogether, but holding our note side by side with an Ipad it is more pixilated, which shows to me that the 299 number is literally meaningless since we are talking about a different screen tech...

Stevethegreat said:
I honestly don't get your point, a rectangle is made of two triangles whose hypotenuse is the diagonal of said rectangle, which is why one can use the pythagorean theorem to find the diagonal's pixel count.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah I would have done it the same way Stevethegreat did. But I'm not familiar with how they create the illusion of more subpixels.

I am debating which one to get- the note 10.1 2014 or the tab pro 12.2. Does the screen size make it a must have?
Sent from my LG-VS980 using xda app-developers app

I wanted to get the Note Pro 12.2 until I saw the price (am in Bangkok):
29,900 baht (~$930). I love my Note 10.1 2014.

Stevethegreat said:
May I ask how did you get the net PPI figure?
Note 10.1 has an RGBW matrix made of ~4 Mpixels (2560x1600).
This equals to the same subpixel count as a ~2.7 Mpixel RGB panel (PenTile only have 2 subpixels per pixel compared to RGB's full 3 subpixels)
Which means that our Note's effective resolution is 1306x2090.
So the hypotenuse of the panel (via the pythahorean theorem) equals to the equivalent of 2464 RGB pixels
Which finally means that we have an effective 244 PPI (2464.5/10.1)
Which is lower than Ipad's but higher than other 10.1 inch android's. iPad's screen also consumes far less battery has (arguably) better colours and most importantly does not suffer from the grayish blacks we suffer. In short if you want the best "large" panel in the market you have to go to Apple, for everything else our note is the best deal.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Stevethegreat said:
I honestly don't get your point, a rectangle is made of two triangles whose hypotenuse is the diagonal of said rectangle, which is why one can use the pythagorean theorem to find the diagonal's pixel count.
As for the rest I calculated what's the effective PPI of our device is in RGB terms, again I don't see where I'm wrong. I called it effective because most screens use an RGB panel. A 1306x2090 panel produces exactly the same sub-pixel count as our note. Now due to subpixels' placing one may see a different picture altogether, but holding our note side by side with an Ipad it is more pixilated, which shows to me that the 299 number is literally meaningless since we are talking about a different screen tech...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You guys do know that a rgbw pentile display doesnt render images in full pixels like a rgb panel right? Thus making a comparison of the two technologies a pissing contest at best. A rgbw panel renders images at the subpixel level using any arrangement of the subpixels to achieve the desired image (in a way more natural and easier on the human eye) whereas a rgb renders images using the entire pixel (all 3 subpixels as a solid unit) it takes a rgbw display 1/3 less subpixels to display the same resolution image with no loss of image quality. Yes if you jam your face into the thing you will notice the pixels slightly sooner than a rgb. All that means is you look less like an idiot while pixel peeping with the rgbw. On text you will never notice a difference. One of the biggest electronics companies of all time keeps using pentile panels and keeps getting great screen reviews in its products. Shut the stupid pentile assault down. I cant even recall a reviewer knocking any of these screens. At normal viewing distance they are marvelous. If you dont use it at a normal distance congratulations your the minority that uses his tablet pressed to his face. Oh the and the "slight" loss of sharpness on the display in comparison to the note 2014 is made up for by a larger screen used FARTHER AWAY meaning that with normal vision no discernable difference. And lastly in what universe have you compared the note 10.1 to the ipad air and found the note more pixelated? Even factoring the lost pixel count (BarryH_GEG is right) the note is superior to the ipad. The rgbw panel doesnt need the extra pixels because it looks just as good without them. And if it looks just as good whats your problem?
Op the 12.2 offers alot more screen real estate. It is a bit heavier but unless you have lost tge ability to wipe yourself you will easily be able to carry it around. My 90 year old grandmother still carries an ipad 3 (same weight). The screen is very efficient and this tablet is consistently beating the ipad air in battery tests. It will take awhile to charge if you allow it to drain all the way. Which you shouldn't do. Charge it when not in use and you will be fine. 4.4 is smoother and the pro features are nice. I would also point out that the charging port is on the side making use while charging much easier. If you are intrigued by its size try it out. Worst case you return it.
Sorry guys for ranting but I keep seeing the same false information over and over again. Your splitting hairs between ridiculously good and slightly more ridiculously good and smaller.......just like that stupid 4:3 is better for reading thing. (IT IS NOT IN ANY WAY BETTER)
Sent from my SCH-I605 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
---------- Post added at 02:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:14 AM ----------
Oh please notice the only time you can tell the difference is text against a fully saturated background.
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---------- Post added at 02:24 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:18 AM ----------
Also from Nouvoyance (a company owned by samsung doing their r&d for rgbw pentile displays) the are pursuing pentile because it relies on technology that tskes advantage of the human eyes natural mechanisms. Samsung obviously believes that pentile is the way of the future. they seem to be selling the idea very well.
Sent from my SCH-I605 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

@ Duly.noted: OK I get you dislike of ipad and it is not without merit but I was comparing the sub pixel count of our device with that of ipad's and unlike what BarryH_GEG said my calculations are not wrong, you said it yourself we have 1/3rd less subpixels. Now I often keep my tablet at a distance of 8-10 inches close to my eyes. Granted I keep it closer than most people, and also -granted- text looks better but everything else *doesn't* and *that's* my point, technically we have a worse screen but to most people it is just fine. It is not splitting hairs though, I would much prefer ipad's panel but then I would lose android's flexibility and the spen
As an experiment put a red text in a yellow background and *tell* me that it looks the same to you (same clarity) as in an ipad, because it sure as hell doesn't to me.
Anyway, this thread is about Note 12.2, so imagine it as a thought experiment in an even larger more spread out fashion. Again to many people this is splitting hairs but I think it is more important to let more people learn of the impact of pentile technology than simply call the panel a 2560 x1600 panel and be done with it. I'm surely not as happy to learn about it *after* I bought the tablet, but you're right it may not be that big of a deal, the biggest deal by far (for me) was/is the "milky" blacks and the atrocious gamma raise when looked at from different angles, both not expected from a panel of this calibre. I sure hope that note 12.2 have/had this issue fixed, because especially in such a large panel it would make quite an impact to its picture quality. Much more than the pentile arrangement would (even in principle) be able to make.

Duly.noted said:
Sorry guys for ranting but I keep seeing the same false information over and over again. Your splitting hairs between ridiculously good and slightly more ridiculously good and smaller.......just like that stupid 4:3 is better for reading thing. (IT IS NOT IN ANY WAY BETTER)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes you are ranting, fine if you want to do that, but your rant has almost nothing to do with the post you quoted. It it not about false information, whether the screen was good enough, nor 4:3 ratio. It is about methodology for calculating PPI. That may be interesting for someone comparing a Tab Pro 12.2, Note 10.1 2014, or an ipad.

ddzado said:
I am debating which one to get- the note 10.1 2014 or the tab pro 12.2. Does the screen size make it a must have?
Sent from my LG-VS980 using xda app-developers app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here's my input. I had the Note 12.2 for about a week. I returned it without hesitation for the Note 10.1 (14). Why?
1. It's heavier. I came from an original Tab 10.1 and one would think that 4 ounces more isn't a big deal. That's what I kept telling myself. Yet it is. My hand got tired holding it very quickly where it never got tired holding the 10.1.
2. It's larger. Well, you say, that's the point isn't it? Yeah, but there's an odd thing about it being larger, it's harder to hold it. If you remember your physics class then you'll understand that the center of gravity for the 12.2 moves further from the hand than the 10.1. Throw in 4 ounces more weight and the torque applied to the hand makes it uncomfortable to hold in one hand.
3. The screen is just bigger, not better. The apps don't use the real estate better. They're just larger. It's like putting larger buttons on a pushbutton phone. You don't get more buttons, you just get larger ones. It's the same with your TV. A 50" screen has the exact same number of pixels and resolution as a 40" screen, just larger. Now, for us folks getting older one would think that this would be a good thing. It wasn't. It just didn't feel right.
4. Magazine UX. It was fun. For about 30 minutes. Because it was so limited I found it to be boring after a short period of time. I installed Apex.
5. When I combined it with a Zagg hard keyboard case it did a fine job as a desktop device. The keyboard was full sized and easy to use. Felt great. But, then I found myself pulling out my 15.6" laptop for those times instead. After all, if 12.2 is good on the desktop 15.6 is better.
6. One thing that I really liked on the larger screen was the ability to have up to 4 apps running at once. Mult-apps feels cramped on the 10.1" screen and it felt much better on the 12.2" screen.
My comments here are very personal and may only apply to me. They're intended to be a "heads up." Here's what I'd recommend to anyone thinking about getting a 12.2" tablet. Buy it at Best Buy or any other brick and mortar store that permits easy returns. Try it out, you'll know in a few days if it's for you. If you don't like it just return it. No harm done. (Don't do this at Fry's, they charge a 15% restocking fee.)
---------- Post added at 07:33 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:27 AM ----------
Side note on PPI:
PPI doesn't matter. Look at the screen. Run the apps you normally use. Do you like what you see? Yes? That's all that matters. Period.

TabGuy said:
Here's my input. I had the Note 12.2 for about a week. I returned it without hesitation for the Note 10.1 (14). Why?
1. It's heavier. I came from an original Tab 10.1 and one would think that 4 ounces more isn't a big deal. That's what I kept telling myself. Yet it is. My hand got tired holding it very quickly where it never got tired holding the 10.1.
2. It's larger. Well, you say, that's the point isn't it? Yeah, but there's an odd thing about it being larger, it's harder to hold it. If you remember your physics class then you'll understand that the center of gravity for the 12.2 moves further from the hand than the 10.1. Throw in 4 ounces more weight and the torque applied to the hand makes it uncomfortable to hold in one hand.
3. The screen is just bigger, not better. The apps don't use the real estate better. They're just larger. It's like putting larger buttons on a pushbutton phone. You don't get more buttons, you just get larger ones. It's the same with your TV. A 50" screen has the exact same number of pixels and resolution as a 40" screen, just larger. Now, for us folks getting older one would think that this would be a good thing. It wasn't. It just didn't feel right.
4. Magazine UX. It was fun. For about 30 minutes. Because it was so limited I found it to be boring after a short period of time. I installed Apex.
5. When I combined it with a Zagg hard keyboard case it did a fine job as a desktop device. The keyboard was full sized and easy to use. Felt great. But, then I found myself pulling out my 15.6" laptop for those times instead. After all, if 12.2 is good on the desktop 15.6 is better.
6. One thing that I really liked on the larger screen was the ability to have up to 4 apps running at once. Mult-apps feels cramped on the 10.1" screen and it felt much better on the 12.2" screen.
My comments here are very personal and may only apply to me. They're intended to be a "heads up." Here's what I'd recommend to anyone thinking about getting a 12.2" tablet. Buy it at Best Buy or any other brick and mortar store that permits easy returns. Try it out, you'll know in a few days if it's for you. If you don't like it just return it. No harm done. (Don't do this at Fry's, they charge a 15% restocking fee.)
---------- Post added at 07:33 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:27 AM ----------
Side note on PPI:
PPI doesn't matter. Look at the screen. Run the apps you normally use. Do you like what you see? Yes? That's all that matters. Period.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I'm hoping to try all this out and see if it bothers me. I've never had a tablet before, but I've used the tablets of others.
I am hoping that I can root the thing and change a couple of the things you were mentioning. For example, I'm on a G2 right now, having the same issues with a bigger screen/apps are just bigger. I changed my LCD density (effectively the screen resolution) and now have a much better use of the real estate on the screen.
Another big test would be if the S-Pen works well on the Tab Pro (yes that's right Tab Pro). You would instantly save $100 minus the difference for buying a stylus. I don't care for the S-Pen software, just the handwriting capability.
I am also nervous about all the bloatware/UX that comes with it... I'm a guy that buys a phone and has it rooted/ROM'd before I go to bed. We'll see how long I last....

TabGuy said:
[/COLOR]Side note on PPI:
PPI doesn't matter. Look at the screen. Run the apps you normally use. Do you like what you see? Yes? That's all that matters. Period.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are many of us who like to read , for many hours. Be it literature, articles, long emails. While a screen may look beautiful at first glance after long hours it can and will become tiresome if the PPI is below some threshold. As a reader PPI is the first I look for when buying a new tablet. Fortunately note's pentile handles text beautifully so I suspect it would not be a problem for note 12.2 either

ddzado said:
Another big test would be if the S-Pen works well on the Tab Pro (yes that's right Tab Pro). You would instantly save $100 minus the difference for buying a stylus. I don't care for the S-Pen software, just the handwriting capability.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It won't work. The tab pro doesn't have an active digitizer. It wouldn't even work as a capacitive stylus. You'd just get nothing.

mustbepbs said:
It won't work. The tab pro doesn't have an active digitizer. It wouldn't even work as a capacitive stylus. You'd just get nothing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well that blows. I mean.. you can draw with your finger... so why wouldn't any stylus work?

ddzado said:
Well that blows. I mean.. you can draw with your finger... so why wouldn't any stylus work?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A capacitive stylus is made with a material that effects the electrical current of the touchscreen causing it to register as a touch in the same way a finger does. Pieces of metal will register as well. The spen is a active stylus. The tip is a nonconductive rubber or plastic tip and it affects the touchscreen using a magnetic field detected by the digitizer layer. This allows much greater accuracy and by increasing the magnetic force with a button sensitive to pressure allows pressure sensing. However, it would not function on any device that did not have either a resistive touchscreen or digitizer layer.
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