Database Users

Bad pictures from camera

Hi.
I just received my Arc and I'm shocked by something : the camera does bad pictures, cause the codec is lame. A 8Mp photo take less than 1Mo.
Can someone fix that in a rom or a kernel or is this to hard to do ?
Thanks.

the photos from almost every other Arc are incredible.. I suspect you have a problem... maybe you're settings are wrong .. or there's a fault.
Look here for examples of how good it is.. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1035589

Look at one of mine (all are the sames).
http://sberfini.developpez.com/DSC_0005.jpg
http://sberfini.developpez.com/DSC_0010.jpg
By the way I'm using an LT15i (3.0.2.A.181) not rooted nor unlocked.

I've just rooted by arc. Is there a way to fix the jpeg compression ratio? It's way too high by default and images are losing details as a result.
Sent from my LT15i using XDA App

you can try vignette that barely compresses at all - but everyone is pretty much saying that the photo's from stock cam are still better!

im_iceman said:
you can try vignette that barely compresses at all - but everyone is pretty much saying that the photo's from stock cam are still better!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks mate. Yeah I noticed almost everyone's saying that...but if one was to put the facts together, picture size alone for a 8MP resolution image can't be less than 1MB...
Will try Vignette and see if it's better. I just hope there's some kind of tweak (like in the HTC HD2) where you could set the compression ratio to further improve the quality.
Sent from my LT15i using XDA App

You should try checking your camera setting OP.
Vignette is good, except it takes longer to preview the image in real size, and the unnecessarily 5~6x larger files with slightly worse quality than stock camera app.

ArcOnFire said:
You should try checking your camera setting OP
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What's settings are you talking about ?
What's the difference between the one's who have a good quality photos and the others ? The firmware ? They have a LT15a instead of a LT15i ?
Please help me to understand.

Did you use auto scene recognition? The picture has some heavy noise in it, so I suspect you play with exposure value or select night scene mode.
2nd picture is blurry; Did you hold your arc firmly when taking the picture ?

Yes I'm using the auto scene detection. Should I disable it ?
For the fisrt picture, the flash was activated.
And yes, I was holding it firmly.

I use auto scene detection for most of my photos and they seem much better quality than yours there. Try some outdoor shots and post them, indoor ones can have a lot of noise if the light is low anyway.
I once had similar problems with a nokia n95. Everyone was posting great shots and mine were horrible. Turns out the handset was faulty.

old

old

Click for full size picture:
EXIF

Could you upload more pictures please? Macro photos looks almost always great.

Can U upload the full size images to http://imageshack.us/ ?
because the images u posted are processed and downsized in quality and size (~500KB).

the compression or noise reduction is visible in panorama not macro. the macros are food Also with 2.3.4

These are some recent photos iv taken with the arc s.
I uploaded them from the the xda app so the orientation and image size is compressed. The photo of the waterfall is on its side. Turn your screen
https://dl-web.dropbox.com/get/Camera Uploads/2012-04-02 12.19.42.jpg?w=378894cd
http://db.tt/Avv3SFqS
http://db.tt/JcyggvES
http://db.tt/k63EiMLH
Links to my Dropbox photos at full quality.
Sent from my LT18i using XDA

Less macro shots, more distant shots; let's see if detail can be resolved at a distance because macro makes it too easy. I am waiting for the official ICS to be out to show some side by side comparison against my other GB arc

zed011 said:
Less macro shots, more distant shots; let's see if detail can be resolved at a distance because macro makes it too easy. I am waiting for the official ICS to be out to show some side by side comparison against my other GB arc
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Check my 1st link in post above. It seems at 100% zoom this images still seem compressed with smeared detail. The Sky has visible noise and smearing even in broad daylight. I'm getting the HTC One X when my cap is finished with the arc, I hope the photo quality is better than arc

I honestly don't expect the lack of detail or smearing to go away, I just think it's probably just a limitation of the camera; a minor improvement from ICS at best is optimistic. I tried lg camera pro, some minor arguable differences at 100% JPEG quality. It seems like the exmor R sensor has a flaw in daylight being unable to cope with brightness. I'd still like to see the oversaturation corrected at least, it's still present on the Xperia S picture samples I've seen.
Foliage looks terrible on the arc in bright lighting
http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/features/item/12866_Camera_champions_head_to_head.php
arc is good for macro shots and night shots, anything else shows its weaknesses

We have to wait for the new ICS kernel and drivers, I think the beta was built on the GB kernel so the camera output is unchanged.
As for image quality in the above posts, it's quite simple.
Small pixels = easy saturation = low dynamic range. In order to live up to the marketing bull of low light performance, all highlights are blown.
Small pixels = more noise. In order to live up to the marketing bull of backside illumination, extremelly aggressive noise reduction is applied.
So what could be a decent (though not exceptional) camera, it is now crippled by marketing decissions that the average consumer will never notice.
Since the average consumer will probably not upgrade to ICS, I hope that Sony will re-work the camera firmware in ICS and make proper use of the sensor.

I agree. The over saturation is its biggest problem, that and purple lens flare. Even stopping down the ev doesn't fix the saturation problem in sunlight.
Sent from my LT18i using XDA

I am even more troubled by the loss of detail due to noise reduction.
It is really frustrating to know that the detail was there but washed away. If only they could put a setting for noise reduction strength.

ICS official
i flashed my ard yesterday and one i know for sure, on GB pics weight 1-1.6MB and now 2-2.8MB
So jpeg compression level has changed for better, but still very strong denoising...

Xperia ray pics post ICS update
Can anybody post pics taken with xperia ray after ics update?
i have 2.3.4 and the pics are highly compressed. just want to see if that is removed in the update.

[HTC One vs Z1] Camera comparison test the shoutout

Z1 vs HTC one camera test / comparison - Vote please.​
@ Mods please move this thread in general if it doesn't belong here , ty !
ok so my cousins came at my place with 2 Z1's , we've taken them to test them out , it was cloudy day , as for flash light photos / indoor no flash photos z1 trully sux big time and they didn't want to let me have those photos , so all i have is daylight photos and 1 flash light and 1 indoor , don't ask how i got those 2 lol it was PAIN.
While taking pics z1 really has major issues with superior auto / white balance , while with manual it's slightly better but still not good enough imo due timing , they've took both pics with me average 3/4 pics each and average 2-3 mins took them for each pic with various settings at the end choosing the best outta 7/8 they took while i was snapping either 1 normal or some HDR pics that's about it. They've also deleted so many daylight photos where they were worse then me ... so not really an *FAIR* comparison due them being big time Sony fanboys and they're very stubborn and not accepting their camera isn't the best in the world lol.
Keep in mind i have no skills with camera tho my cousins know how camera works so they're more experienced then i am.
Anyway i'll let you judge the photos and i'll open a vote poll so vote for which you think it won overall.
Xperia Z1
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HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1 - Flash macro
HTC One - Flash macro
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1 - indoor no flash.
HTC One - indoor no flash.
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One

great
except for the cloud one Which z1 has more natural
i cant believe htc beats z1 camera lol
thats epic hahaha
btw some of the colors are saturated for z1
for me htc one picture are pretty awesome
bith cameras are like same 4mp vs 21 lol

@Khixar27
I'm still uploading Photos i got 50 more to go please wait before i finish
Here some more photos that couldn't fit in the 1st post.
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One
Xperia Z1
HTC One

Koje selo i država brate? ?
Htc One the One ?

Slovakia?
But sticking to topic, Z1 doesn't looks to good with 21mpx sensor. I would say that One has slight edge here

adam_pl said:
Slovakia?
But sticking to topic, Z1 doesn't looks to good with 21mpx sensor. I would say that One has slight edge here
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its Serbia actually
Sent from my HTC One using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

I like the saturation in the Z1, but the HTC definitely capture more detail in low light with less noise. My conclusion is to use the HTC with a +.5 step in saturation.

In my opinin, and yes, I am a Z1 owner... seeing as you were using the Z1 in manual mode, you either had the ISO too low (50??) or you didn't adjust the EV accordingly as the Z1 pictures just look too dark really?
When in manual mode, you really need to take advantage of the settings

raysurrx7 said:
I like the saturation in the Z1, but the HTC definitely capture more detail in low light with less noise. My conclusion is to use the HTC with a +.5 step in saturation.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We've took photos @ around 10/11am lol , the saturation you like on z1 is cuz they had to use cloudy / daylight white balance due impossibility to come close to my pics , here few examples for you just so you see what I mean , anyway it wouldn't look realistic since there were no sun at all pretty much whole time. Only 2 pics had sun and that's it.
1st pic normal 2nd with daylight effect same as they used the whole time
I assume this is what you wanted ?
Keep in mind it was cloudy no sun at all , that why pics are less saturated on my phone but as you can see in the examples I could've done that but wouldn't represent realistic colors
Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2

I guess there is something to that mega pixel after all. Both cameras took good pictures and mostly comes down to settings. At least the Xperia don't suffer from the purple haze that many of us one owners has.
Sent from my HTC6500LVW using Tapatalk

Dark Jedi said:
I guess there is something to that mega pixel after all. Both cameras took good pictures and mostly comes down to settings. At least the Xperia don't suffer from the purple haze that many of us one owners has.
Sent from my HTC6500LVW using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It actually has indoor some yellow / blue tint , you can see on the indoor pic , btw I don't have that sensor issue that many HTC one owners do.
Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2

wezzel98765 said:
In my opinin, and yes, I am a Z1 owner... seeing as you were using the Z1 in manual mode, you either had the ISO too low (50??) or you didn't adjust the EV accordingly as the Z1 pictures just look too dark really?
When in manual mode, you really need to take advantage of the settings
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exifs are there for all the pics
The Z1 user set white balance appropriately and actually used -EV compensation for a number of shots, might have over done it in some places. it's a difficult call. Auto isn't mature yet on the Z1, whereas the HTC one has been out for ages and from what i could tell the HTC camera took all the shots in auto. No tweaks.
The close up on the tree bark actually has the Z1 produce a blurred shot, dunno how that happened. Shutter was fast enough so no chance of camera shake.
Shan89 said:
ok so my cousins came at my place with 2 Z1's , we've taken them to test them out , it was cloudy day , as for flash light photos / indoor no flash photos z1 trully sux big time and they didn't want to let me have those photos , so all i have is daylight photos and 1 flash light and 1 indoor , don't ask how i got those 2 lol it was PAIN.
While taking pics z1 really has major issues with superior auto / white balance , while with manual it's slightly better but still not good enough imo due timing , they've took both pics with me average 3/4 pics each and average 2-3 mins took them for each pic with various settings at the end choosing the best outta 7/8 they took while i was snapping either 1 normal or some HDR pics that's about it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What i'd like to understand better is this brightness value i see in the HTC exifs, it seems to change for each shot and wondered if any of the htc guys can tell me more about it. First thing you see is the HTC shots are all brighter, and in some cases more than necessary.
Questions to the OP
- how long have the Z1 owners had their phone and how long have you had yours.
- indicate which photo pairs are HDR (if any) ?
- Can you clarify whether the Z1 took the shots in 20MP or 8MP.
- Which program did you use to resize down to 1.4MP ?
- i don't understand what happened with the indoor shots. Saying they were really bad does not make sense to me. Without seeing the shots there is no way to comment.
- How about a low light shoot-out. I want to see shutter speeds of 0.3s on your htc and we'll see how that compares with the 0.8s on the Z1. Take care to stabilise the cameras so as not to have blur. If your cousins know what they're doing this should not be a problem for them
Shan89 said:
They've also deleted so many daylight photos where they were worse then me ... so not really an *FAIR* comparison due them being big time Sony fanboys and they're very stubborn and not accepting their camera isn't the best in the world lol.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually this is fair, you should have done the same as this way it really is best that the cameras can do. These are pre-planned shots, you can take as much time as you want. There is no time deadline or any other constraints. When people put up their pics many times they put up the best of many. So this is normal.
Auto isn't mature on the Z1, it will take time. This means the skill of the Z1 owner needs to be better. The difference with ISO for instance can be signficant and not slight as you put it, auto can bump ISO up very high resulting in a noisy shot whereas you can get pretty good results if you set it manually. Your cousins did this already. Most reviewers do not.
This should not come as a surprise to an HTC owner, you have plenty of tweaks you can use as well. However, things like contrast, sharpness, saturation etc would not be fair as they're not present on the Z1 and can be done in post with better software. i note you did not use any of these 3 in any photos

great comparsion
for me htc one looks better , btw the photos is great
does your htc one camera sometimes show in screen regular noise while capturing photos? i want to know if this is a regular thing or only my unit does this .. another question , does your phone suffer from blue/red noise in dark or no ? i hope no:good:

wezzel98765 said:
In my opinin, and yes, I am a Z1 owner... seeing as you were using the Z1 in manual mode, you either had the ISO too low (50??) or you didn't adjust the EV accordingly as the Z1 pictures just look too dark really?
When in manual mode, you really need to take advantage of the settings
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello there , I didn't even use z1 , I've wrote in OP that I was using my one and my 2 cousins were using 2 z1's taking each 3/4 pics each in total of 7/8 and later picking the best pic outta 7/8.
They look dark because HTC really has outstanding HDR while z1 really is no match with hdr.
From my observation with those difficult scenes z1 was useless , you could make pic but you would have to chose either sky/ clouds or ground , there's no option to take both like with HTC's hdr.
oh and believe my cousins were only using manual since superior auto was completely useless.
One Twelve confirmed this by checking Exifs.
One Twelve said:
Exifs are there for all the pics
The Z1 user set white balance appropriately and actually used -EV compensation for a number of shots, might have over done it in some places. it's a difficult call. Auto isn't mature yet on the Z1, whereas the HTC one has been out for ages and from what i could tell the HTC camera took all the shots in auto. No tweaks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah you're right. Like I said all I was using was auto or hdr , nothing else.
One Twelve said:
The close up on the tree bark actually has the Z1 produce a blurred shot, dunno how that happened. Shutter was fast enough so no chance of camera shake.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess the cousin moved lol.
One Twelve said:
What i'd like to understand better is this brightness value i see in the HTC exifs, it seems to change for each shot and wondered if any of the htc guys can tell me more about it. First thing you see is the HTC shots are all brighter, and in some cases more than necessary.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The shots are brighter cuz of hdr , with z1 if you point at the sky for example bottom gets dark and it's clearly impossible for z1 to balance that due to poor hdr capabilities where's the htc one handles this easily.
My guess about brightness change is probably meetering and our auto / hdr can use higher values then what we can in manual.
One Twelve said:
Questions to the OP
- how long have the Z1 owners had their phone and how long have you had yours.
- indicate which photo pairs are HDR (if any) ?
- Can you clarify whether the Z1 took the shots in 20MP or 8MP.
- Which program did you use to resize down to 1.4MP ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
- I've had HTC one since June , my cousins have their Z1's since it came out ( as addition they've been with Sony since SE K300I , so trust me they know what they're doing lol )
- All photos that have sky / clouds +ground = hdr , the rest were normal.
One Twelve said:
- i don't understand what happened with the indoor shots. Saying they were really bad does not make sense to me. Without seeing the shots there is no way to comment.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
- trust me it was embarrassing shots which is why they didn't let me have them , I managed to get only 1 flash photo and only 1 indoor no flash photo , I was looking forward to upload those but unluckily they didn't let me have them.
- Dunno which mp they used all I know is they used manual settings.
- I didn't use any program to resize photos , all I did is upload the photos from pc to tinypic site and post them here.
One Twelve said:
- How about a low light shoot-out. I want to see shutter speeds of 0.3s on your htc and we'll see how that compares with the 0.8s on the Z1. Take care to stabilise the cameras so as not to have blur. If your cousins know what they're doing this should not be a problem for them
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Like I said there's no low light shots Thx to them , tho in almost pitch black no flash z1 was better , everywhere else worse. Even video recording low light due fact I can record video at same brightness as the shots you saw lol. ( hdr recording ) also in pitch black z1 can't come close since my flash is about 2x more powerful.
One Twelve said:
Actually this is fair, you should have done the same as this way it really is best that the cameras can do. These are pre-planned shots, you can take as much time as you want. There is no time deadline or any other constraints. When people put up their pics many times they put up the best of many. So this is normal.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't have the nerves for that I just want point and shoot not wasting time to set all the settings , the moment will pass by the time settings are set.
One Twelve said:
Auto isn't mature on the Z1, it will take time. This means the skill of the Z1 owner needs to be better. The difference with ISO for instance can be signficant and not slight as you put it, auto can bump ISO up very high resulting in a noisy shot whereas you can get pretty good results if you set it manually. Your cousins did this already. Most reviewers do not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah I've noticed that superior auto is utter **** lol.
One Twelve said:
This should not come as a surprise to an HTC owner, you have plenty of tweaks you can use as well. However, things like contrast, sharpness, saturation etc would not be fair as they're not present on the Z1 and can be done in post with better software. i note you did not use any of these 3 in any photos
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah I'm just one of those point and shot , sometime switch to hdr and that's about it. Tho I gotta say I play with settings when I'm bored but when taking pics pretty much point and shoot.
Nightf0x_007 said:
great comparsion
for me htc one looks better , btw the photos is great
does your htc one camera sometimes show in screen regular noise while capturing photos? i want to know if this is a regular thing or only my unit does this .. another question , does your phone suffer from blue/red noise in dark or no ? i hope no:good:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess I get sometimes with flash noise untill it focuses after that all normal , no tints here pretty much perfect unit.
Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2

Great post. It is nice to see almost a year in and our camera is still up there with its so called Ultra-pixels which is just a fancy word for mega-pixel. I never doubted this phones camera always served me well and even made a 2 hour long home movie to send back home.. Great phone but i think if sony put time and effort into their software they can get the camera up and running in brilliant quality too..

Shan89 said:
They look dark because HTC really has outstanding HDR while z1 really is no match with hdr.
From my observation with those difficult scenes z1 was useless , you could make pic but you would have to chose either sky/ clouds or ground , there's no option to take both like with HTC's hdr.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HDR takes multiple exposures and combines them. You have no control over this process. Given that auto isn't mature with Z1, it follows that neither will HDR be mature on Z1.
If you want good quality photos, then try not to use HDR. why ? jpg is lossy. jpg + jpg + jpg = even more lossy. Also takes longer as you have to wait for 'processing images' before taking next shot.
About sky/ground, what you do is use spot metering. If you spot on the clouds, the ground becomes dark, on the ground you blow out the sky, you have to spot somewhere in the middle. Now if the subjects are in the same focal plane then you can get away with this otherwise HDR is the only option as focus will not be at infinity. HDR is a compromise in this particular case to get you better exposed shot.
Its not required for every shot, only where there is big difference in lighting between foreground and background and subjects are in many planes that you want to keep more or less in focus. Personally, unless its landscape type photo this can be distracting, better to keep the subject in sharp focus and forget if the rest is blurred, it will make for a better shot.
In camera HDR is a recent 'innovation'. If you want the best HDR, then take 5 exposures from -2 to +2 with camera on a tripod, use a HDR speicialised program to combine them on a PC and then see the results compared to the 'poor man's HDR' the camera provides.
Shan89 said:
Yeah you're right. Like I said all I was using was auto or hdr , nothing else.
The shots are brighter cuz of hdr , with z1 if you point at the sky for example bottom gets dark and it's clearly impossible for z1 to balance that due to poor hdr capabilities where's the htc one handles this easily.
My guess about brightness change is probably meetering and our auto / hdr can use higher values then what we can in manual.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Then i would look only at the pics where HDR was not used in this comparison. HTC one has had many months to improve HDR, it did not come perfect out of the box. Same with Z1.
Shan89 said:
- I've had HTC one since June , my cousins have their Z1's since it came out ( as addition they've been with Sony since SE K300I , so trust me they know what they're doing lol )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Z1 has been out now just under two months, takes time to get to know its quirks. Each phone camera is different. Since they set WB & EV i can tell they are not complete n00bs. But more hands on time is always better than less. Photographer is more important than camera.
Shan89 said:
- Dunno which mp they used all I know is they used manual settings.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you have the originals, then look at the resolution. the 20MP will be (5248 x 3936) and the 8MP will be (3840 x 2160) or (3,264 x 2,448) . File sizes will also be bigger. I think they have used 20MP for all, can you confirm ?
This matters because currently you will get better shots with Z1 in 8MP 4:3 than with 20MP. Noise control is much better due to oversampling. Also 8MP means you can use different SCN modes which is not possible with 20MP. For low light shots or indoors this will make a difference.
For now we can say 20MP means 2x zoom is better than lower resolution sensors. Photos at 20MP are not necessarily better than 8MP. I wish these cameras put out RAW because then we will really see what the camera can do instead of what the compression program is doing to create those jpgs
When people make comments about camera they are primarily commenting about
1) auto and how well it works
2) image compression algorithm. good compression + good quality means more time + more CPU, a phone is not the best place to do this. So you can take the next shot quick, compromises are made here which affect image quality.
3) stock camera app. 3rd party apps in playstore may do a better job in certain situations.
So we still do not get to see what the camera can do without these other factors interfering in the process with ANY phone camera.
Shan89 said:
- I didn't use any program to resize photos , all I did is upload the photos from pc to tinypic site and post them here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was a good choice for image host because inspite of resizing it still preserved the exif data. Many others strip it out. I was surprised to see them. So you passed the minimum test here
Better still would be to resize them yourself with a good quality program and then upload. How well these image sites do resize is not transparent. They have to handle lots of load.
Shan89 said:
- trust me it was embarrassing shots which is why they didn't let me have them , I managed to get only 1 flash photo and only 1 indoor no flash photo , I was looking forward to upload those but unluckily they didn't let me have them.
Like I said there's no low light shots Thx to them , tho in almost pitch black no flash z1 was better , everywhere else worse. Even video recording low light due fact I can record video at same brightness as the shots you saw lol. ( hdr recording ) also in pitch black z1 can't come close since my flash is about 2x more powerful.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm trying to figure what you mean here. The only clue is flash is 2x more powerful. So in cases where a more powerful flash helps the Z1 could not compete but there are cases where your flash will be over powering and the Z1 will be just right. This isn't a problem because you can always diffuse the light by putting some paper on the flash. Where the more powerful flash has an edge is in freezing motion if subject is moving with low light, so long as it happens less than 6 feet away. But then flash makes for lousy photos since its direct at the subject and not reflected. Big problem with phone cameras currently. They always locate the flash below the lens instead of above it. I don't why this is. There is no off camera flash option available as yet. eg. you cannot bounce the flash of the ceiling and get better photos.
But why to use the flash in the first place, when both cameras can do good low light photos. None of the subjects in the photos were moving so there should not be a problem here.
We don't know what your cousins were thinking. Embarrassing does not say much, why was it embarrassing and what could be done to make it better. There are many indoors shots with Z1 in the photo thread, nothing embarrassing there.
Shan89 said:
I don't have the nerves for that I just want point and shoot not wasting time to set all the settings , the moment will pass by the time settings are set.
Yeah I'm just one of those point and shot , sometime switch to hdr and that's about it. Tho I gotta say I play with settings when I'm bored but when taking pics pretty much point and shoot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This applies for impromptu shots. How often does this happen for you ? Not a single one of your sample shots comes in this category. My feeling is these impromptu shots are maybe 5% of the time. These are the hardest to get, subject may be moving and you will not get a good shot, you will get an ok to bad shot.
The rest of the time you can plan, take many shots, play with angles for better composition etc. But the thing about camera in your pocket is at least you have a camera in the first place and if the time is there you will get the shot whereas before you had nothing.
People say you are not supposed to get good photos because this is only a phone camera. But with more capable cameras they take lots of effort to get a good photo because its a good camera. Makes no sense. To get a good shot with phone camera you have to work harder because there are more limitations. This means more possibilities as well.
Shan89 said:
Yeah I've noticed that superior auto is utter **** lol.
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Click to collapse
And what about 3 months from now ? will your statement still be valid.
if you follow the evolution of the Z, it took anywhere from 3-5 months after launch to get it right. So there is no reason it will change with Z1, maybe it might come sooner. This unfortunately is a sony thing. others will put out cameras that are mature but have bugs elsewhere. Nobody puts out a perfect phone at launch. Look hard enough and you will see the bugs, what matters is whether the vendor is prepared to fix them or not. How good is their past record in doing this.
But the reviewers always get the latest & greatest and then move on, they do not bother to review after 3 months. People also want latest & greatest and then find its not mature and think its bad. But after 3 months they change their mind. Just see the photo threads for any flagship here and you see the same comments. My <old phone> takes better photos than this <new phone>. very predictable :laugh:
if you look at HTC photo thread, around march-may, reviewers were complaining that htc is oversharpening images because they can see halos around the edges. What is the solution ? set sharpness to -2 or -1 gives a softer image and no halos. So htc got bashed quite a bit too. In fact i think htc is most bashed camera out there because everybody thinks 4MP is not enough. But what can they use to display 4MP ? there are no 4k displays out there or they are very expensive. Full HD is only 2MP. you can still print 10x14 inch prints with 4MP. But no... 4MP on HTC is not enough or bad. pfft.
Shan89 said:
I guess I get sometimes with flash noise untill it focuses after that all normal , no tints here pretty much perfect unit.
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Click to collapse
This is one thing that still i'm not able to understand. 300 pg thread on this omg!. There are theories around but nothing conclusive as yet. Some people are saying the heat does it over time. With Z1 if it gets too hot you will not be able to use the camera. So too much heating over a long time is supposed to cause this problem with tinting. Its such a pity to replace the phone after only 6 months :crying:
This tinting is the problem as i see it with htc one. Not 4MP.

Too many peoples and companies think megapixels means quality, while using very poor sensors. They keep trying to push this rumor/agenda
A better sensor>>>>>megapixel count

crixley said:
Too many peoples and companies think megapixels means quality, while using very poor sensors. They keep trying to push this rumor/agenda
A better sensor>>>>>megapixel count
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Click to collapse
Exactly +1
@One Twelve
I'm sorry I can't bother answering to all questions etc , simply just take a look at photos and you got answer.
As for hdr stuff you wrote HTC one takes less then 0.5 Sec to make hdr photo and ready for next , I'm sure it takes over 20 sec to set z1 to make similar photo which is still no match.
As for fllash HTC one has smart flash = we.have 5 modes = it can fire up very low light or super strong light , this is why z1 will never match htc one in flash light photos , especially if photos are 1/2+ meters away , z1 is useless in this distance.
As for ceiling HTC one gets better flash photos when there are walls then when there aren't.
I can take photo outdoor pitch black about 5/7 meters away , indoor I can go up to 10 , if I increase exposure and lower contrast I can go even further.
HTC one also in long distance low light photos can take hdr + flash light = it gathers light from flash as well and makes overall picture more light.
With 4:3 HTC one also makes better photos then in 16:9 also sharper.
By the time z1 gets / if it gets fixed we will have updates as well + one 2 will be out by that time and more fair comparison would be one 2 due being newer 4/5 month's instead comparison vs HTC one which is 7 months older
As for Xperia Z I've took test with my cousins as well since they had XZ before z1 , I've literally raped Xz , I'll ask them to send me that test and upload it as well.
As for movement + picturing z1 will never match HTC ZOE.
here few samples for you so you see why :sly:
Btw all this pics were quiet tricky movement and impossible with burst shot or regular , but ZOE handles movement quiet easy.
Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 2

If I am to judge, I'd say for the most part, the z1 does seem more pleasing. You seem to be abusing the hdr alot on the Htc one. The colors are washed out as hell. I can tell because I use the htc one as well.
I'll say this, neither the z1 nor the HTC One's hdr are good. Only the HTC One has a minor advantage.
If you are going to use HDR, set your ISO to 100, AF/AE lock on a bright light source AND THEN switch to HDR. This way your HDR will look much better than just using HDR right off the bat.
The first pic, I used HDR right off the bat. Looks washed out, basically it looks terrible
The second pic, I set ISO100, AE/AF lock on my ceiling light, switched to HDR. Much better colors.

Shan89 said:
I'm sorry I can't bother answering to all questions etc , simply just take a look at photos and you got answer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Too bad, i guess it will fall upon somebody else to challenge otherwise my points stand.
Z1 isn't ready for a HDR shootout. It is ready for non-hdr manual shootout. When i have time i will select the non-hdr shots in your group and we will see the differences.
Shan89 said:
As for fllash HTC one has smart flash = we.have 5 modes = it can fire up very low light or super strong light , this is why z1 will never match htc one in flash light photos , especially if photos are 1/2+ meters away , z1 is useless in this distance.
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Click to collapse
This bit is interesting. i don't think any other android camera can vary the intensity of flash light based upon what the camera sees. This is an advantage with indoor shots. Does not mean you cannot get acceptable ones in Z1 or any other that does not have this ability, its just harder. And once you know what to do its no longer harder.
So I'm not going with ease of use, i'm interested in whether its possible to take the shot or not. This is a better indication of limitations.
Shan89 said:
HTC one also in long distance low light photos can take hdr + flash light = it gathers light from flash as well and makes overall picture more light.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok
Shan89 said:
I can take photo outdoor pitch black about 5/7 meters away , indoor I can go up to 10 , if I increase exposure and lower contrast I can go even further.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Useful but difficult to get right. People look more cold than warm. This is why the push to improve low light handling so there is little need to use flash in the first place. Flash photography on a mobile phone is difficult.
Shan89 said:
With 4:3 HTC one also makes better photos then in 16:9 also sharper.
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Click to collapse
Surprising as i thought htc one has a native 16:9 sensor. Everybody else uses 4:3. So smaller pics come out better with 4:3 than 16:9.
So i'd have thought 16:9 is best aspect ratio for htc one.
Shan89 said:
By the time z1 gets / if it gets fixed we will have updates as well + one 2 will be out by that time and more fair comparison would be one 2 due being newer 4/5 month's instead comparison vs HTC one which is 7 months older
As for Xperia Z I've took test with my cousins as well since they had XZ before z1 , I've literally raped Xz , I'll ask them to send me that test and upload it as well.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, do that lets see the difference. Ensure the exifs are visible. After looking at the photo thread for Z, i changed my mind about what most people think about the Z. I would like to understand in which way the htc one 'rapes' the Z
I note that htc one does not indicate which firmware number is being used. So can you mention which one was used to take your photos.
Shan89 said:
As for movement + picturing z1 will never match HTC ZOE.
here few samples for you so you see why :sly:
Btw all this pics were quiet tricky movement and impossible with burst shot or regular , but ZOE handles movement quiet easy.
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Click to collapse
I don't follow, with enough light you have a fast shutter speed so why is it hard to get those shots ?
What does ZOE do here that you cannot do without it.

Maybe Cyanogen 11 for LB in our Z1?

Just read this In XDA news:
http://www.xda-developers.com/android/cyanogenmod-11-and-slimkat-for-the-locked-xperia-sp/
Maybe some of the greatest developers in this forum could port it for our Z1 LB. who knows...

That would be amazing!
Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk

They did the same with CM10 on Xperia S, I was running it on my XS and it worked really well so it is possible
Sent from my C6903 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

Without kexec, it is impossible.
Tapatalk を使用して私の Xperia Z1 から送信

And, one day, we get this in CM build for Z1
Paranoid Android's Hover - Hands On: http://youtu.be/u_3Ik7m3z50
Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk

I Hope so !!! :laugh:

Somone know if a dev will take the project ? )

jordane1993 said:
Somone know if a dev will take the project ? )
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Click to collapse
Probably not.
I'm sad to say this but the z1 is the first and last sony device I bought. Why? Lack of development, locked bootloader and unable to unlock it. The fact it has a 21 mp sensor and I'm obligated to use 8 mp to take better photos than If took it with 21mp, video recording full HD only at 30 when the hardware can do 60 fps. And so on.
It's a shame. This device has a lot of potencial but it's wasted.
Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk

albertobom said:
Probably not.
I'm sad to say this but the z1 is the first and last sony device I bought. Why? Lack of development, locked bootloader and unable to unlock it. The fact it has a 21 mp sensor and I'm obligated to use 8 mp to take better photos than If took it with 21mp, video recording full HD only at 30 when the hardware can do 60 fps. And so on.
It's a shame. This device has a lot of potencial but it's wasted.
Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Totally agree with you, first and last device from Sony ...
It's like a powerfull phone, but he used only 50% of this power .... I'm really sad ...
Pictures are good in auto but only 8 Mpx, yes why put 21 mpx then ? .... :-/

You can do it with 20mp mod (xposed).
Enviado desde mi C6903 usando Tapatalk 4

jordane1993 said:
Totally agree with you, first and last device from Sony ...
It's like a powerfull phone, but he used only 50% of this power .... I'm really sad ...
Pictures are good in auto but only 8 Mpx, yes why put 21 mpx then ? .... :-/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because you get better images that way. Unlike older cameras that simply subsampled the image, the Z1 uses information from multiple pixels to reduce random noise. This is exactly what Nokia does with the 808 and some crappier Windows Phone models (1020, 1520).
With a high pixel count camera, you get very dense information. You most likely don't need such a dense information: you can print an 8MP image on A4 and still be over 300 dpi. When you look at the image on your screen, the PC/phone will blindly reduce the resolution to match your screen (which is 1920x1080, about 2 megapixels).
In other words, unless for specific corner cases, 20 megapixels is overkill. So, you're better off using that dense information to get a better, lower density image. The methods Nokia/Sony use for that are derived from seismic image processing, which is one of the cornerstones of the oil industry. Very complex, very well tested, and very accurate. For 99.99% of the pictures you take, they will be better than the raw 20MP image (and you do have the option to get the raw 20MP image when you shoot manual, although those corner cases are when a real camera would be the best choice).

Steve_max said:
Because you get better images th......bla, bla, bla
...bla,bla, bla.. ot manual, although those corner cases are when a real camera would be the best choice).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Great story but mine pictures, no matter which pixel density, still with a lot of noise. Unacceptable for a kind of high-tech device and camera.

Steve_max said:
Because you get better images that way. Unlike older cameras that simply subsampled the image, the Z1 uses information from multiple pixels to reduce random noise. This is exactly what Nokia does with the 808 and some crappier Windows Phone models (1020, 1520).
With a high pixel count camera, you get very dense information. You most likely don't need such a dense information: you can print an 8MP image on A4 and still be over 300 dpi. When you look at the image on your screen, the PC/phone will blindly reduce the resolution to match your screen (which is 1920x1080, about 2 megapixels).
In other words, unless for specific corner cases, 20 megapixels is overkill. So, you're better off using that dense information to get a better, lower density image. The methods Nokia/Sony use for that are derived from seismic image processing, which is one of the cornerstones of the oil industry. Very complex, very well tested, and very accurate. For 99.99% of the pictures you take, they will be better than the raw 20MP image (and you do have the option to get the raw 20MP image when you shoot manual, although those corner cases are when a real camera would be the best choice).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thaks for information Then i used only 8 mpx for better quality
I don't know before how the pictures was token, now i can know how, and that good to say ! Thanks !

That hover looks good, is it a standalone mod? Or is pa a prerequisite? I'm thinking that this is my last Sony too. The fact that were tied to flash tool and using a computer is just a pain in the backside. Not to Menton the fact that my first z1 was unlockable. HTC and the one plus one for me. Maybe even the note 4.
Sent from my Xperia Z1 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

locked bootloader photos vs unlocked (comparison)

To see the comparison , download the rar file from the sendspace link , extract the rar file and compare etc: before_superior1.jpg with after_superior1.jpg or before_manual2.jpg with after_manual2.jpg and so on....also hit thanks if i helped
sendspace link: https://www.sendspace.com/file/1vqlyd

there is def more noise after unlocking.. but not that much of a deal breaker in your examples.. it would be good if you had the chance to go for a more low light situation because it would probably be more apparent there.
but tbh, i cant decide yet which of those pics i like more. There is something more natural/defined about the "unlocked" pics compared to the smoothed out "locked" ones.

nkim3 said:
there is def more noise after unlocking.. but not that much of a deal breaker in your examples.. it would be good if you had the chance to go for a more low light situation because it would probably be more apparent there.
but tbh, i cant decide yet which of those pics i like more. There is something more natural/defined about the "unlocked" pics compared to the smoothed out "locked" ones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i didnt take photos with lower light because i dont think someone would take a smartphone to take pictures at night
Sent from my E6653 using XDA Forums Pro.

arismelachrinos said:
To see the comparison , download the rar file from the sendspace link , extract the rar file and compare etc: before_superior1.jpg with after_superior1.jpg or before_manual2.jpg with after_manual2.jpg and so on....also hit thanks if i helped
sendspace link: https://www.sendspace.com/file/1vqlyd
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, that helps me a lot!
It looks like the lost "drm-keys" for the cam is only for the software and makes only the pictures in digital use better and i think with GIMP i have better results if i want better pictures.
soooo i think its not realy worth it if you keep them/ custom rom calls for me

cyrok said:
Thanks, that helps me a lot!
It looks like the lost "drm-keys" for the cam is only for the software and makes only the pictures in digital use better and i think with GIMP i have better results if i want better pictures.
soooo i think its not realy worth it if you keep them/ custom rom calls for me
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
right! glad i helped ?
Sent from my E6653 using XDA Forums Pro.

Nice thanks! I must say the difference in manual is minimal but with locked BL you have noise free image and slightly better colors and exposure. One thing to note is that in superior auto the after unlocked bootloader photos have lower ISO making for a bit bigger difference (First set 1250 vs 1600, second 640 vs 800 ISO, unlocked/locked).

EQ2000 said:
Nice thanks! I must say the difference in manual is minimal but with locked BL you have noise free image and slightly better colors and exposure. One thing to note is that in superior auto the after unlocked bootloader photos have lower ISO making for a bit bigger difference (First set 1250 vs 1600, second 640 vs 800 ISO, unlocked/locked).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i didnt change the iso , i put the phone on the exact position and on the exact lightning and took exactly the same photos before and after