Hey guys,
The rules are rules and indeed, they have been getting heavily enforced in here of late, in regards to the whole 'pay for a pre-release full feature Rom' of Monx and iHackers.
Alright, so you need to donate to get the latest version of the ROM? I'll hold my hand up and say I've never done that, nor do I care, once xposed is on top of a stock rom with a few preinstalled performance mods, I'm happy. I find most 'contributor' versions to have trivial features I am personally happy to live without until they are fully tested anyway.
As it stands at the moment, at least with my 2 LB roms of choice, one has stopped developing his ROM and the other has the thread locked.
This post will possibly get locked, deleted, I'll be warned or banned, but frankly. Heavy handed tactics from some of the mods are KILLING the development of the Z1.
Sent from my C6903 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
If you need to donate to get a rom it's never good. Devs shouldn't ask for money here.
Sent from my C6903 using xda app-developers app
krabappel2548 said:
If you need to donate to get a rom it's never good. Devs shouldn't ask for money here.
Sent from my C6903 using xda app-developers app
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I'm just saying it could be handled with a little more grace, rather than literally exiling experienced mods, I mean, you might be the only mod left in here at this rate krabappel
Sent from my C6903 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
I thought XDA mods did pretty well. Why would you donate to receive a beta version of the rom? Put it this way, you PAID to TEST beta work from the developer. Be it whatever amount of the donation is. Infact, frankly speaking, at this point the meaning "donate" and "purchasing" does not make any difference at all. That goes without saying that the rom isn't own by them, they just tweaked and add little features over the roms, however the source is ultimately belongs to sony.
When you donate to get a rom/features (or whatsoever you called it) is like defeating the purpose of open-source. As we all know, Android is open-source, if you have tweak or something better than the original source, its a given that you should share to benefit everyone. Again, donate should come from the will of the donator, if you get what I mean.
Trust me, if you donate to "some" developer, when a new flagship comes out, with your money they will purchase the product and as a result, you will still lose a developer. Of course, I'm not discouraging donation, some developer truly deserve a drink or more. Ultimately, the money is yours, decide whatever you decide to do with it.
Handle with grace? As far as I remember, the mod did hit a warning note to the developer. Isn't that sufficient?
No offense, had to let it out.
Summon @eagleeyetom for your concern.
Exactly guys...
I'm very sorry to hear they are stopping developing and if I started that avalanche - I'm fine with that.
I'm here for a quite long time, I'm working for community but there's many guys who worked and are working ten times better, faster and more than me and they never asked for a cent.
Whole purpose of open source is to share.
It's ridiculous to charge money for something that's free or just tweaked.
I mean we built PAC for XS and never asked for a money and that was compiled from a CM source, it wasn't stock ROM with a MODs...
Don't get me wrong, I found ihackers to be very good ROM but this is XDA, not playstore or any store...
If they don't want to develop and work without money, then we don't need them.
We have plenty developer who are willing to work without price tag on their ROMs or MODs...
NUT is here, krab is here, niaboc will soon be here...
We have great THEMErs and MODers here and we will survive
I just don't give a damm for that one who only came here to get our money...
Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk
Written said:
I'm just saying it could be handled with a little more grace, rather than literally exiling experienced mods, I mean, you might be the only mod left in here at this rate krabappel
Sent from my C6903 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
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Lets say it was allowed to happen all over XDA.
It won't be long before the best features are reserved for those that pay.
Plus you'd get less quality and more crap because you'll get these little twats dishing out crap so that they can collect.
Now pretend that you had to pay $20 for xposed and $10 for every module that you use for it.
Would you be more or less happy than you are now?
And I don't know what you've been smoking, but the real development is only just beginning now that:
1. the broken camera is fixed after unlocking the bootloader and
2. full rw access to system works on 4.3 - thanks to @[NUT] , somebody who did alot of the epic development which paved the way for those roms you like so much.
It's not like that. Our purpose is not exiling or banning or whatever you call it the developers. Our decision wasn't taken lightly as without developers XDA would become yet another forum to talk about cats and ponies and we don't like it. Developers are the heart and soul of this site, but they have been given rules to follow and code of conduct, so it's more like bending them to get money. XDA gives a lot of options to show the appreciation (PayPal, BitCoin etc.) but paying to get early access is a no go and that was a main reason of closing these threads as you could all read in the closing message.
My Opinion is Dev's should not ask Money for ROMs.. donation is not a problem, but I saw some devs releasing a firmware for Money. If somebody pay him, he will give the link to user to download. So i say a forum like xda-developers must ban those f****** devs. i agree with Mods, they doing is rite.
Don't want to spam dev thread so I'll answer here...
jamespmi said:
Well you can thank specially funky0308 for this. We had two brilliant Rom's he just screwed up. Monx even helped a lot with the fullroot and xposed issues... All this is heavily on my nerves as he don't even uses one of this Rom's
So I think we won't see any updates nor fresh and good Rom's for a long time. Double hard for all of us having the BL locked...
Criskelo is the only option. Bet someone will shut it down too...
Sent from my C6903 using xda app-developers app
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Mate, when you talking about someone or mentioning someone, tag him so he could reply to you.
I won't repeat same things over and over again - ask moderators who reported ihackers for not playing by the rules.
Ask those guys how many XDA users reported monx for same thing.
Nobody force them to stop developing, they decided they don't want to do that if they can't charge money for beta or what they called that - contributors version.
It's not mine rules, it's XDA rules.
@Nut never did such a stupid thing and he get enough donations to buy Z1 and be able to continue his work.
So please, don't blame me because someone else behaves like a little child...
As I said million times before - I found ihackers ROM great piece of software, same like monx ROM but when bunch of users report rules violation - something, obviously, isn't right
Some of us are a bit longer here and we are trying to help, not to force devs to quit.
But rules are rules and we must play by them.
If Doomlord, Niaboc, NUT, Vertigo, Krab and all other great developers can follow thise rules - then we should too.
Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk
funky0308 said:
Don't want to spam dev thread so I'll answer here...
Mate, when you talking about someone or mentioning someone, tag him so he could reply to you.
I won't repeat same things over and over again - ask moderators who reported ihackers for not playing by the rules.
Ask those guys how many XDA users reported monx for same thing.
Nobody force them to stop developing, they decided they don't want to do that if they can't charge money for beta or what they called that - contributors version.
It's not mine rules, it's XDA rules.
@Nut never did such a stupid thing and he get enough donations to buy Z1 and be able to continue his work.
So please, don't blame me because someone else behaves like a little child...
As I said million times before - I found ihackers ROM great piece of software, same like monx ROM but when bunch of users report rules violation - something, obviously, isn't right
Some of us are a bit longer here and we are trying to help, not to force devs to quit.
But rules are rules and we must play by them.
If Doomlord, Niaboc, NUT, Vertigo, Krab and all other great developers can follow thise rules - then we should too.
Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk
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Yes sir! That is so. Also to name other devs like Kali- from fxp RaymanFX (ok, he's on xperia S, but he did a very good job and he says many times, that he don't want donations). And when a dev do a good job, he will get donations from users who really appreciate their work.
Okay I think that what had to be said has been said. If you have any further questions, PM me.
Thread closed.
Related
Looking for 1.2.0... I see activity in the thread at 2:40am but the sticky post goes to a shut down notice... anybody?
Mods locked it because he released 1.2.0 early to donators
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Maybe I should have donated... are we all mad about this or is this something that will go away soon?
Mods got mad that he was releasing to donators and they think he was asking for money for the ROM.
Flipz/Fresh does this for the Hero and the Evo which makes no sense..
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
So sad
threedfreek said:
Maybe I should have donated... are we all mad about this or is this something that will go away soon?
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Well, this is sad for a couple reasons.
1) This is an established developer, who never required anything for use of his roms, and had over 10 revisions located here. He *rewarded* his donators for supporting him. This is not to be confused with a *few* other rom chefs with no proven track record, not released anything to the board and asking for money for a rom. This dev is in a diffrent league and should be treated diffrently IMO.
2) He had alot of users using his roms, he had alot of support and Q&A that is all gone now, the thread is gone but people still use his roms and may want support or something to continue. I dont think making the thread *dissapear* is the correct action. It also insinuates Guilty before proven innocent as the dev is punished before things are worked out.
My 2 cents
I think the mods should explain themselves and see if the community sees any problems with schiz... I for one do not begrudge the guy for early release to donators... fact is this is the american way which I am proud to be a part of.
This is especially lame, because now I have no idea where the hell to get the thing. What if I WANT to donate? He's not charging for the ROM. He's just releasing early to donations.
brian_hoffman said:
Well, this is sad for a couple reasons.
1) This is an established developer, who never required anything for use of his roms, and had over 10 revisions located here. He *rewarded* his donators for supporting him. This is not to be confused with a *few* other rom chefs with no proven track record, not released anything to the board and asking for money for a rom. This dev is in a diffrent league and should be treated diffrently IMO.
2) He had alot of users using his roms, he had alot of support and Q&A that is all gone now, the thread is gone but people still use his roms and may want support or something to continue. I dont think making the thread *dissapear* is the correct action. It also insinuates Guilty before proven innocent as the dev is punished before things are worked out.
My 2 cents
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I agree. I have been using Schizo's rom (1.1.6 w/Mixup kernel) for a couple weeks now and was greatly looking forward to version 1.2. He has done the best on incorporating compatibility with different kernels as well as prompt support.
I think the community is owed an explanation and a way to contact Schizo to see his side of the story.
i agree... he has supported the rom, stayed up late to get out the newest version early and always said he was releasing it regually as well.....
His ROMs actually work and you all freaking delete his thread? What the heck is wrong with you all. Stomping on a DEV, this is like the crap Apple does. Totally Lame. You all need to to reinstate this guy. Folks in this community "donate" money to DEVs and to keeping this site up and running. If word gets out that MODs are deleting threads for pointless reasons then people are going to pull their money out of this site and will start to hurt then help XDA.
Put him back-online and get the MOD to explain his actions!
I agree.
The Epic needs Devs and he seemed like a good one.
I understand the mods hesitance for his methods, but they should lay down GROUND RULES if they think he did something wrong.
I'm fine with it being released early. Call it "beta testing" for those who donated. In fact, with many new ROMs I usually wait a few days in case there are bugs.
The mods should allow the donate early-beta test model, stating it must be released publicly within X days.
Those of us who had donated have received an email from schiz. He says hes trying to work it out with the mods. Hopefully theyll get it worked out, if not, he'll pop up on his own site.
I ran fresh for months on my hero, but i think his donators-get-it-first was based off his website, not xda. I guess because schiz stated that donators would get it early, he got in trouble. If the mods really want to stop this kind of thing, then ban any developer who links to a donation account. But they wont do that, and shouldnt, because devs do deserve donations. But i guess you better not point to the donate link, otherwised youre banned.
Sent from my Epic using XDA app.
I have the latest update and am unsure on installing it. I don't want to install something that I won't have any support for, this is ridiculous. He puts his time, energy and money into making a rom and releases it to some people who have given him donations because they liked his rom so much, nothing wrong with it in my opinion.
Schizo and I are going to be working on a site tonight, since he has the domain and the web space now, we are going to work something up.
Stay tuned. Epic Experience will be right back .
jirafabo said:
I guess because schiz stated that donators would get it early, he got in trouble.
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Like I said, he should offer exclusive "beta test" to people via their paypal e-mail addresses.
Then he can keep it off the forums, but still give reason to donate.
I've been on all sides of the equation (developer, donator, and leecher). I think it's fair. Just as long as he releases it, in full, to the leechers within X time. He seems like a quality developer.
Wtf schizo was an awesome dev. He was really dedicated. So what if he released them early to donators. Like someone else saidd, that's the american way. I expect to wait a little longer for something that's free. I understand completely.
I don't get why he was given the banhammer. Unless he said "you can't get 1.2 unless you donate." Then I don't see how it violates tos
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Bring him back, now please
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
phantomevo77 said:
Schizo and I are going to be working on a site tonight, since we has the domain and the web space now, we are going to work something up.
Stay tuned. Epic Experience will be right back .
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Whew, the start of this thread almost ruined my Friday. You guys rock!
viper134 said:
I have the latest update and am unsure on installing it. I don't want to install something that I won't have any support for, this is ridiculous. He puts his time, energy and money into making a rom and releases it to some people who have given him donations because they liked his rom so much, nothing wrong with it in my opinion.
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If you donated, you will continue to get support, don't worry, he isn't giving up just like that.
Epic Experience will continue to get support, so don't worry about that.
guess I don't like the phrase leecher... but I guess if I don't pay I get called names... while this thing is in hot dev I wait to find what I want to keep and what I will call quits on... when I find the "end" I donate... until then I would rather be called a tester... when things go wrong I explain what's going on that might be fixed... in that case I'm a tester... not a leecher... just sayin'
bring back the "greatest epic experience"
This thread is most likley going to be closed in true china style.
But i still gonna try explaining my opinion on the way xda has developed lately.
The attitude from some of the devs is soo out of line,that on anyother site they would be getting atleast warnings.And the mods keeps licking the "emperors" butts.Im asking for some mods with some balls to step in and put down the foot.i have seen one of our most famous dev turning from a gentle and really tolerant person to a diva with some seriously bad attitude against members.even though i can understand that it can be quite annoying answering same stupid questions over and over again,theres no need in turning into an "as$hole".
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
Go spend 100+ hours developing, hacking, and reverse engineering FOR NO MONEY and then post it here and have people that don't even bother to read a few pages complain about your attitude.
Get real dude, they get annoyed with stupid questions by lazy/new users in their development threads. Remember, XDA is a forum dedicated to DEVELOPMENT of open source projects. Users shouldent expect support from developers and devs should never be obliged to provide it unless users are paying money for the product.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
ive been a member for some time
after signing up
i saw the XDA "video" which tough me stuff on proper "etiquette"
then i read the forum rules
after following these rules i have never had a problem with the people or the devs
if u don't follow the rules you should only blame your self
its free your not paying for it you should at least have some common courtesy
good day sir
If you're talking about codeworkx, in my opinion he isn't a bad guy at all. Despite the fact that he spends hours and hours developing and people pay no attention to big bold letters, ask the same ****ing questions, don't read, have no initiative, and constantly whine, he STILL RESPONDS to people regularly. Go ahead, say I'm ass kissing I don't care. Doesn't deserve the **** he gets.
I kinda agree with OP a little bit on some dev's attitude, but it's not that bad, and I also understand them. Yes, they may have a bit more "freedom" on the forum, but considering the amount of their contribution, I think it's totally justified.
There's a simple solution to this. Read. Then read some more. Then read a bit more still. If you still can't find what you're looking for, ask questions. But make sure you provide a bit of background to the question you're asking. Show you've made some sort of effort (most important) to learn/find the answer to your question on your own.
I have never seen a dev or an experienced member bag out/abuse a n00b when these simple steps have been followed. I have seen other newer members do so tho.
If anyone on this site isn't prepared to follow the steps in my first paragraph, they deserve whatever happens as a result of any posts made not following these steps IMHO. And frankly, they don't belong on a site like this & should stick to stock.
As several people have already pointed out in this thread (and others), devs owe XDA members absolutely nothing we should be eternally grateful that they do what they do and they provide fantastic roms/kernels/apps & themes either completely free of charge or for completely insignificant amounts of money (in the case of apps, or if you choose to donate to a dev).
Devs are also humans, if people piss them off repeatedly with dumb and already answered questions without reading, they have the right to react!!
My 2 cents...
While I appreciate the time and effort the devs put, the arrogance some have is uncalled for. They act like they are God's sent Prophets, the only ones gifted with the power of modifying the code of the forbidden. Asking for appreciation and credit (which is well deserved) is one thing, riding the high horse and pissing on the rest is another.
Op hasnt replied... wwll thats what u call attention seeking lol. I agree with everyones comments . On a lighter note... have a happy new year
looks like an iphone but powered by android baby!!!!
i prefer not to get involved in these type of threads
but to be frank am surprised that the devs haven't stopped developing yet........
it's not the quality of xda-dev's that have gone down over time,
for me its the non-dev community thats going downhill.
i myself fall in the non-dev category but sad to say in certain cases i have actually seen 5-10 post-old users bad-mouthing and criticizing devs who have given their time, knowledge and efforts to the community over the years and asked nothing in return except for voluntary donations.
xda isn't turning into a dictatorship its just democracy gone bad.
I can't tell if most of you are really stupid/young or English is a second language for 75% of XDA. Sometimes its so damn hard to just read and understand some users comments. Does no one use a browser with integrated English spell correction?
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
ruskprick said:
This thread is most likley going to be closed in true china style.
But i still gonna try explaining my opinion on the way xda has developed lately.
The attitude from some of the devs is soo out of line,that on anyother site they would be getting atleast warnings.And the mods keeps licking the "emperors" butts.Im asking for some mods with some balls to step in and put down the foot.i have seen one of our most famous dev turning from a gentle and really tolerant person to a diva with some seriously bad attitude against members.even though i can understand that it can be quite annoying answering same stupid questions over and over again,theres no need in turning into an "as$hole".
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
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What?! Don't be so stupid! The devs here don't work for you or xda. What makes you think that they should provide you with 24h support on their work for free?
I'm guessing your just a kid by the attitude.
Maybe developers will start being nicer when the users start behaving less like animals and more like human beings.
This has all been said before and I am sure will again, "users" have to remember this is a free service, you can make no demands of it or complain when things done quite go you way, XDA is not a democracy it is a dictatorship.
I am afraid we are doing to have to live with this, for me, the benefits far far out way those issues highlighted by the OP.
Solution: - Just rise above the crap, ignore it, none of it really matters. Take what help you need from the forums but also try to give back as much as you can, you wont go far wrong.
Sparksltd said:
What?! Don't be so stupid!
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What?! Learn to read!
What makes you think that they should provide you with 24h support on their work for free?
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Where does he say that? Please supply a quote instead of accusing him without any valid reason.
I'm guessing your just a kid by the attitude.
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Sure. And your reply is very mature I guess? He expresses his feelings, in a rather normal fashion. But no, immediately the fanboy-crowd jumps on it. Well, point proven I guess. Every forum is filled with ignorant n00bs.
The dumb questions being repeated , is way more annoying and problematic in these threads.
I'd also have to say if a talented Dev is a little bit of a prima donna , then good luck to them. It makes got a great read as well.
As for the earlier comment about bad English spelling, i'm sure a small part of that is due to Swype
I have a huge amount of experience in Android and xda dev history, I even made two roms for the hd2.
I got a new sgs2 two days ago, common sense dictates I do not flash anything of here until I have done all my research. I know about the flash counter and the usb jig. I know about the efs partition aswell, and how to backup and restore it.
Two days of light reading and some research is all it takes, and you won't be asking stupid questions or making mistakes and screaming for help like some poor noobs do.
It's that easy. RTFM and Backup Backup Backup.
sent from I9100 using Omega
attention ho is back!
Im at work,so aint following the tread all the time.But to answer some of your questions,im not demanding anything from the devs.Dont think majority of us do,but then there is people that do,and i can understand it becomes annoying for the devs at times.But why not just ignore those,instead of spreading bad attitude replyes?Is that to much to ask for?Some of you thinks that the Devs are godsendt and we should stand on our knees to not piss them of so they dont produce anymore roms for our beloved phones.Maybe im abit to harsh on the devs,but there are millions of threads and replys complaining and flaming the n00bs,no need for another is there?
Lighten up guys!Keep XDA a forum that you enjoy.
AND kudos to all devs for their hard work,i mean no harm !
have to agree with OP
jetpackjeff said:
I can't tell if most of you are really stupid/young or English is a second language for 75% of XDA. Sometimes its so damn hard to just read and understand some users comments. Does no one use a browser with integrated English spell correction?
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App
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Your main language is English i guess.Mine is Swedish,i cant write and speak,not 100% fluid but i can make my self understood in 4 diffrent languages.How many do you speak?
Please stop derailing development threads, it really is getting out of hand. Instead of letting moderators step in, how about policing ourselves? If you don't have anything good to say, then don't say anything. If you take ownership to the matter, then settle it in private channels. This is only hindering people learning the inner workings of android and roms.
If one person creates rom A, built from source (obviously referring to aosp roms). Chances are rom A is using work done by other individuals in the community to achieve a certain goal. This is called an Open Source Community. So rom B comes in and uses A as a base. This is great, because I've found that when this occurs, bugs get squashed much quicker. No matter the skills of the user/developer, they have the ability to find some of the smallest issues that cause the biggest bugs. Even if rom B only has little things like the wifi scan interval changed, or added/subtracted APK's. The only thing necessary here, is a little bit of credit and submitting/notifying the original author of bug fixes and/or enhancements. When this occurs, there is no "he did this" "he got this working first" bull. I could go on forever on proper etiquette, but that's not my point. Let's let everyone do their thing, and if there is a real issue that needs to be addressed, handle it in a classy manner.
Thanks for your time, and i apologize in advance to moderators if this thread gets out of hand, feel free to remove it.
Well said, now if people will only start holding back their words.
Sounds good. Credit where credit is due. No one develops completely on their own (for the most part). Even the CM branch is a "team". When knowledgeable people work together (and acknowledge the source of their work) we all win, and the builds get better.
This model benefits all.
I know, as the user of a now ancient device, I would love to see development NOT come to a halt, or be pushed off to the unfindable fringes.
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
I'm very grateful for all the people out there who put their time and effort into making my device better and enjoyable....essentially saving me money....and ask for very little in return. I believe Google has set and shown the example that when people share ideas and work....a product can improve and evolve much faster. Thanks to everybody out there who participates and believes in these principles, and I look forward to your future endeavours.
Sent from my OG SuperEvo using Tapatalk
Well said, Drew! Awesome
Yup Yup. Btw I agree with what you said in the other thread about not completely agreeing with the xda rule in regards to having to gain permission to use peoples work. Only thing that should be req is proper notation in the OP that its being used and that's it. Imho.
It gets real sad around here when people fight over work and even more so when they do so in public channels. Happened in the 3D section awhile ago and was redic.
If you did something and you don't see credit in an OP for it It's simple, PM the user to discuss it and if that doesn't work PM a mod to help mediate the dispute. NEVER should it be discussed in public threads!
Sent from my PG86100 using XDA App
Well written Mr Drew. I wouldn't worry about those who mess things for everyone else, they surely have nothing better to do.
Keep up the solid work.
Thanks.
That was perfect. Not only are you a tremendous developer, but a very wise person as well. Thank you for taking the time out to write this up. And thank you and everyone else for sharing your/their knowledge.
It would be really nice if there was a list where everything that's gotten done/fixed giving credit to that particular person. Or perhaps when you work off of someone else's work, you bring all of the credits with you. That way as it moves along the credits will stay with that particular version of rom.
By the way, preview7 is running great.
Thanks again,
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
Let's not forget about donating to the devs of which you use their hard work. Yes this stuff is free, but hours and hours go into the smallest things sometimes. Even if everyone donated 1 dollar to the dev(s)of the Rom or whatever you use, you're still making a difference. Let's show each other some respect here. Not just to other devs, but to other users also
I wrote this in the other thread but it applies here too. A huge thanks to all who are truly interested in moving forward and improving the Evo experience. And +1 on donating to the devs, all of the devs.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=22234151&postcount=45
Good post drewizzle
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
tommytomatoe said:
Good post drewizzle
Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk
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+1 well stated
Well, everyone should just place nice in the sand box, end of story. Development will get back on it's steady crawl.
Moving on to greener pastures
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA
See ya' on the flip side ...
Yeah, I think I may move as well but I'll keep in touch with xda. seriously, mods. This forum is for Developers, not for you to be a little ***** and think you're the king of everything.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using xda premium
The f*k happened anyway?!?? I heard rumors and I'm not stateside so I don't log in as much so I really don't know what happened
Oo oo I know
This happens in every phone forum on this site. I have been on xda (as a user only) since the g1. I think it is good that the devs leave this site. Xda is only the first step for a new dev. Since the mods do not understand the term "development". Your everyday user should not be able to post in a dev thread. That is why we have a general forum. The Dev thread is for developers to talk to other developers to make a better product. It is not a place for users to complain and bad mouth developers, all that does out make them leave. Maybe one day xda will realize that.....cyanogen started on xda....he had his own site now....I wonder why.....lol
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And without developers say goodbye to your advertising sponsorship. Slippery slope guys.
Remember, this is just a Web forum, nothing more and nothing less.
Maybe a revaluation of your perceived value of importance is known order.
It's just a real shame that the best devs keep leaving, and always for similar reasons. Biting the hand that feeds is never smart.
lostwhat83 said:
This happens in every phone forum on this site. I have been on xda (as a user only) since the g1. I think it is good that the devs leave this site. Xda is only the first step for a new dev. Since the mods do not understand the term "development". Your everyday user should not be able to post in a dev thread. That is why we have a general forum. The Dev thread is for developers to talk to other developers to make a better product. It is not a place for users to complain and bad mouth developers, all that does out make them leave. Maybe one day xda will realize that.....cyanogen started on xda....he had his own site now....I wonder why.....lol
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No its good for everyday people to post what they get when they flash new roms. Now bad mouthing that's a different story..
Hmmm that's ridiculous..
But i like this site..
Did people get butthurt over some ROMs not working or something? I'm confused, I would expect the devs to encourage bug testing and criticism...
clofan said:
Did people get butthurt over some ROMs not working or something? I'm confused, I would expect the devs to encourage bug testing and criticism...
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I don't know exactly what happened, but it wasn't something that an average user did. Brick'd was a fun guy. One of the mods decided to close the thread for a reason that I do not know, and brick'd wanted to say goodbye.
oka1 should be the only mod for our forum, he actually gets us + hes pretty damn cool. even though i have like 70 infractions from him from a year ago haha
Judging from Br1ckd's post in Zen I think something happened to another on the DD team. My guess is it was Dan but not sure. The mod in our tablet forum can go on power trips. Because Br1ckd is a Recognized Developer he has the power to lock/unlock his own thread.
Pretty sure it was an all for 1, 1 for all type thing. He's in a better place now. So lets not mourn his loss but rejoice in his new beginning. Hey, it's almost Easter and Padre Wood is done with his sermon.
Woodrube is on point. I pulled my stuff, closed my threads, and stopped hosting on xda due to something that happened in the sgs2 forums between a trusted friend and DD member, and an overzealous, aggro moderator. As well, the same DD member has also been receiving harassing pm's that the mods didn't seem to want to help with.
I've spoken with Oka1 about my decision and the facts surrounding it, and thanked him heavily for his part in cleaning up the Vibrant forum in recent months. He really has had a big hand in bringing this particular subforum to where it is now.
I harbor no ill will towards anyone over here and I still check in from time to time. However, I also stand by those who stand by me. When my boy had enough of the BS, it was obviously time for a change, and as a new team, we showed great unity in unanimously voting to move.
Hope this sets the record a bit more straight. Feel free y'all, to pop by and say hi sometime, sit a spell, and visit some old friends, and some new ones.
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From this Moderator of the Vibrant
I Like all the guys in this forum, and this forum's Devs have been Stellar and worked together to keep things even and fair, properly giving credit to those who deserve. AS to the other forums I really do not know what happened, but I do know the SGS2 forums is a pretty tough bunch. So, it is understandable that some devs would get tired of the rowdiness..... That's unfortunate. I will strive to talk to the superiors about this incident so XDA can learn from it and make this forum a more conducive environment for all......
Thanks to all in this forum for being the good participants you are ........ ~~~ oka1
lostwhat83 said:
This happens in every phone forum on this site. I have been on xda (as a user only) since the g1. I think it is good that the devs leave this site. Xda is only the first step for a new dev. Since the mods do not understand the term "development". Your everyday user should not be able to post in a dev thread. That is why we have a general forum. The Dev thread is for developers to talk to other developers to make a better product. It is not a place for users to complain and bad mouth developers, all that does out make them leave. Maybe one day xda will realize that.....cyanogen started on xda....he had his own site now....I wonder why.....lol
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They just need to have a better "recognized developer" system. that way ONLY developers can post in dev section, and they have an available option to enable/disable posting in their thread - leave discussion threads for the general section. as long as the moderators cleaned up the general section once a day, making sure there is only one discussion thread per rom - it would be a flawless system
I think the more annoying thing is how people can theme a ROM, add a couple apks, along with some build.prop/ram tweaks, and then post it in the dev section as a new ROM. that drives me mad, and then the noobs encourage this behavior (because they dont know any better) by saying "why complain about having more options??", and by calling these members "developers" - release it under themes/apps, not development
^^the end result of this is a cluttered development section with multiple versions of the same ROM - all of them having poor explanations - so you dont know which ROMS are legit enough to monitor because they all have the same damn features listed
Why are we losing developer's. .is it xda policy, or are they just sick of to many questions of why dont it work? ?
Easily can be summed up in one word , entitlement! Saw this on the lg g3 forum, people think they are entitled to roms and the Dev are there to serve. Forget the fact these guys do it for free and share their work with and take the time write directions in there op .. That people don't bother to read! Start being respectful and grateful or learn to do the work yourself. I am not a Dev but I can def see their site of it.
I was questioned about his earlier.. So here is my opinion on it. A few pm's I have sent out confirmed a few things and even brought some other things to light I didn't even notice. Could additionally be some xda policy.
here
I hate people, this is why we cant have nice things.
What gives with this place. This place is amazing you can learn how to root android phones. Install custom recoveries. You can learn alot of stuff which can help you. You can ask seniors or others for help and they might cooperate. I am happy this site exists.
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I too was inspired but recieved pms asking when my roms comming out n asking for etas its not coming out least not to xda
I can tell you it is not XDA policy.
What it most likely is from what I have read is the influx of the entitled members. Moderators are reactive. We need to see reports on posts, then we can see what is going on. The problem with that is sometimes no one reports a post or issue, and the flaming goes on for days before someone reports it. This is a site of over 6 million users...thousands joining each week. So many posts of "Give me root NAO!" "Can we haz update Nao" Or the ever popular "Your ROM looks like a child made it" It would be a great help if no one responded and someone reported it...eazy peezy clean up and PM sent to that member. Instead the developer stressed from all the constant updates and support, blows up at the member...he gets a PM saying please report and try not to respond...he feels moderators are not quick enough...they go to G+...then guess what...within a few weeks they are yelling at users on G+...telling them to be nice, patient...blah blah blah. So you have developers upset because they cannot curse out these entitled members and/or the entitled members drive them crazy. They would rather work with 150 users on G+ than thousands of users here.
We do what we can but cannot stop a post before it happens..and then the damage is done...no matter what the moderator does. How do you become a welcome site for new members if you ban them on the first mistake? We try to explain what they are doing wrong. You have no idea how much time the volunteer moderators here spend in PMs with members...and how often it ends up with the moderators being cursed out. We also spend a lot of time talking to these teams..doing what we can to convince them to stay....there is a lot the average user does not see. It is not simply a developer taking his ball and going home. Many plan this for months..building their own sites. So help us help you. Report, don't add to the drama and cleanup...Thanks!
wojo797 said:
Easily can be summed up in one word , entitlement! Saw this on the lg g3 forum, people think they are entitled to roms and the Dev are there to serve. Forget the fact these guys do it for free and share their work with and take the time write directions in there op .. That people don't bother to read! Start being respectful and grateful or learn to do the work yourself. I am not a Dev but I can def see their site of it.
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Right. I miss being able to sit back and wait for cool roms & updates. But here in the Sprint Note 4 forums there's not much as far as developers goes. So what do you do? Either sit and cry or step up and do something yourself. I chose the latter. i'm a "take action" kind of person.
shawnsingh said:
What gives with this place. This place is amazing you can learn how to root android phones. Install custom recoveries. You can learn alot of stuff which can help you. You can ask seniors or others for help and they might cooperate. I am happy this site exists.
Sent from my SCH-I545 using XDA Free mobile app
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I agree . But you can't control the thoughts and opinons of others and people shouldn't be followers but responsible and respectful leaders instead. If somebody has a problem with XDA and/or members they want to pout, cry and throw fits. Then all of a sudden they want to take there "buddies" to their dream world "safe haven" where the grass is greener and things are so perfect and business is booming... uum ok, whatever. I refuse to play into that game. I'm a grown man and I accept and take responsibility for my actions and don't need to lay blame on XDA and/or it's not-so perfect members for my childish actions.
KennyG123 said:
I can tell you it is not XDA policy.
What it most likely is from what I have read is the influx of the entitled members. Moderators are reactive. We need to see reports on posts, then we can see what is going on. The problem with that is sometimes no one reports a post or issue, and the flaming goes on for days before someone reports it. This is a site of over 6 million users...thousands joining each week. So many posts of "Give me root NAO!" "Can we haz update Nao" Or the ever popular "Your ROM looks like a child made it" It would be a great help if no one responded and someone reported it...eazy peezy clean up and PM sent to that member. Instead the developer stressed from all the constant updates and support, blows up at the member...he gets a PM saying please report and try not to respond...he feels moderators are not quick enough...they go to G+...then guess what...within a few weeks they are yelling at users on G+...telling them to be nice, patient...blah blah blah. So you have developers upset because they cannot curse out these entitled members and/or the entitled members drive them crazy. They would rather work with 150 users on G+ than thousands of users here.
We do what we can but cannot stop a post before it happens..and then the damage is done...no matter what the moderator does. How do you become a welcome site for new members if you ban them on the first mistake? We try to explain what they are doing wrong. You have no idea how much time the volunteer moderators here spend in PMs with members...and how often it ends up with the moderators being cursed out. We also spend a lot of time talking to these teams..doing what we can to convince them to stay....there is a lot the average user does not see. It is not simply a developer taking his ball and going home. Many plan this for months..building their own sites. So help us help you. Report, don't add to the drama and cleanup...Thanks!
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I agree with you but I also see a lot of immaturity on behalf of these disgruntled individuals. They can't handle a few whiney disrespectful members and think thinks should be perfect and handled immediately by the mod team. Yea, ok. They can go elsewhere and see how grenn that grass really is. I won't miss a thing because without XDA these brats wouldn't have a clue or the slightest inspiration to do what they do to begin with. Bite the hand that feeds you? That's never worked out well for anyone. This isn't a business it's a hobby for developers. I don't think the majority of these private dev "teams" are raking in enough cash to pay one months mortgage. I point and laugh every time i read those hate comments by the you know who's.
ibcenu said:
Why are we losing developer's. .is it xda policy, or are they just sick of to many questions of why dont it work? ?
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I will tell you why I am stopping for awhile, no one appreciates anything, no dev respect what so ever, so why do people continuously stay on the devs a$$ about a time a rom is going to be updated, and much much more. It gets old, serious.
I can see if the OP does not clarify what the rom is about or when it is updated, THEY DON'T READ! I had one guy call me every name in the book because he didn't do a backup and flashed my rom and it continuously bootlooped, he proceed to tell me if I was around him, he would kick my........you get the picture, I told him simply, build your rom. problem solved...I suppose.
---------- Post added at 09:41 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:24 AM ----------
shawnsingh said:
What gives with this place. This place is amazing you can learn how to root android phones. Install custom recoveries. You can learn alot of stuff which can help you. You can ask seniors or others for help and they might cooperate. I am happy this site exists.
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I will help people who read, and you can tell if they have been reading...
I can honestly say that I have not seen it this bad since I joined back in 2007 - A lot of unappreciative people - Everything I know how to do on an android phone, I learned from this site - I'm guilty of not reading through a thread all the way before asking a question but I also understand what this is all about - I enjoy coming here and catching up on the latest - I've had many different android phones and this is where I always come to learn - All I can say is, Thank You to ALL of the people here - I really don't understand why some people are so ungrateful for something that is given to them for FREE. Sorry for the rant, just my thought on the matter...
Im a developer, not an android developer, but a developer. Ive used xda for years, I answer questions when I can here. I hope the developers dont bail I love to see their input on things. Their personal insight has always been invaluable. I thank all of you guys I hope you stay.
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I don't understand some of these complaints we have nearly every custom ROM available..... When I first got here we had 1-2 stock/stockish roms now we have damn near every one that's out there.... I don't get it.... And as tat said I've learned everything I know from xda and some good friends from xda....no school, no classes, just searching, reading, and a few good friends..... Makes no sense to see these statements saying we have no roms, we have no devs, where are all the roms, where are all the devs....... If we are really so lacking in development why do we have so much available to us.... I can really only think of maybe 3/4 roms we don't have ....IMO only thing we are lacking in is custom kernels and we even have a couple of those..... Really makes no sense to me
spleef said:
I don't understand some of these complaints we have nearly every custom ROM available..... When I first got here we had 1-2 stock/stockish roms now we have damn near every one that's out there.... I don't get it.... And as tat said I've learned everything I know from xda and some good friends from xda....no school, no classes, just searching, reading, and a few good friends..... Makes no sense to see these statements saying we have no roms, we have no devs, where are all the roms, where are all the devs....... If we are really so lacking in development why do we have so much available to us.... I can really only think of maybe 3/4 roms we don't have ....IMO only thing we are lacking in is custom kernels and we even have a couple of those..... Really makes no sense to me
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Lol right ??
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It seems like people whining about the "lack" of ROMs and developers think its still 2010-2011. Back when I had my og evo 4g, there were so many ROMs it blew my mind. I don't think these people realize there are a LOT of premium android devices, and no one can expect these devs to buy every device and build a ROM for all of them.
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m4xwellmurd3r said:
It seems like people whining about the "lack" of ROMs and developers think its still 2010-2011. Back when I had my og evo 4g, there were so many ROMs it blew my mind. I don't think these people realize there are a LOT of premium android devices, and no one can expect these devs to buy every device and build a ROM for all of them.
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This ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
And more....Xposed! Many people are not using custom ROMs anymore..stock with a few add-ons is fine when they have so much control of their own customization. Back in 2010-2011 everything was brand new Eclair and Froyo...so much innovation on mods and fixes...that eventually became part of Google code and most mods only needed a few tweaks to work on the next version of OS. Also back then you had teams and sharing galore...people were happy to share what they made and also how to do it...now some teams do not want to share, they keep the code to their teams only...Devs back then did it for love, the quest for donations was rare. And last but certainly not least...AT&T and Verizon! The 2 biggest carriers locking their phone completely...of course developers will buy something else that they CAN modify...and with that goes those devs that shared things across carriers. So when you feel..."lacking" in the development sense...look at the dev sections here and T-Mobile..then stop in and see the ghost towns in AT&T and Verizon. Moral of the story...be grateful for what you have and maybe think about becoming the next dev if you are sticking around Sammy.
I was thinking the exact same thing about the advances in android as a whole. Each version recently have been massive steps ahead IMO. Back then android still had a ton of tweaks that needed to be made be it for performance, battery life, or functionality. Now, Google has gotten a lot of good upgrades into the os so it doesn't need as much tweaking.
And xposed for sure. When that came out it became a game changer. Before, if you wanted to tweak anything it required someone to make a flashable theme for your ROM, or for you to dig in on your own and tweak it. DPI scaling was system wide and caused issues with some things.
Now we have SIMPLE tweaks for every aspect of the device it seems. And per app DPI changes!!!
I would love to be a dev but lack the time and resources to do stuff, so I'll happily support any dev that's willing to put the hard work into building a ROM. Used to be an HTC fan but Samsung will always be my go to manufacture as long as they keep having an external SD slot.
And big kudos to the CyanogenMod team. I finally decided to try out cm12 and I'm blown away with the level of refinement in the ROM and theme system. Its like I have a whole new phone. And to think they have a ROM for such a huge list of devices is nothing short of impressive.
I'll stick with sprint as long as they keep my unlimited data and keep my phones unlocked. Screw tmo and Verizon.
The other big thing I noticed. Custom kernels are becoming a thing of the past. Evo 4g had like, half a dozen different kernels, some were tweaks of each others, etc, because android still needed a lot of refinement. Now, there's some kernel tweaks, but nothing massive compared to back then.
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Yeah I hate what people have done to good devs. If I like something they made I send them what I think is fair compensation for a single user. Strongsteve back in the gs3/note3 days was one of the best in my opinion.
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Exactly people think devs are here to to be there servent we do it for free im new to deving but not on xda
pbedard said:
Exactly people think devs are here to to be there servent we do it for free im new to deving but not on xda
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Where at would love to check out your work
Definitely agree, when I had my OG EVO and EVO 3D there were so many ROMs, kernels, and mods I flashed 10 times a day lol. Now you find a ROM that you like and just tweak it with Xposed. I do miss the anthrax kernels...nothing compared. But I jumped off the HTC ship after my EVO 4G LTE, I got it replaced 6 times in 3 months and every replacement broke from the slightest thing. I loved my S5 and I love my Note 4 even more. I don't like how they integrated the battery and got rid of the SD slot on the S6 which is worrying, hopefully Sammy wakes back up and brings those 2 things back on the next line of Galaxys. I was surprised that there was even as many ROMs as there are for the Note 4 given that it's so new. My HTC phones I was always eagerly waiting for HTC to drop the source so a dev here could make a masterpiece...