Database Users

Wireless Frequencies - pros and cons

Hey everyone
I've been looking into wireless frequencies recently for a little project of mine and I have a couple of questions which I haven't been able to find the answers to in simple form.
Basically I am looking for the pros and cons of different mobile phone frequencies (ie 850mhz, 2100mhz etc). About the only thing I have managed to pick up is that the lower the frequency the better it can penetrate solid objects and also travel further.
I'm sure there must be more to it than this or otherwise we would all be using low frequencies for networks. Any help or further info would be appreciated and also if you could help explain why that is the case so I can understand it better.
Thanks!
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

as for everyone not using lower frequencies, maybe it has to do with Spectrum availability... for instance in US everyone's eyeing the recently freed white spaces in the 700MHz range, but the highest bidder gets them.
generally longer wavelengths are used in rural areas, and shorter in urban areas because they have more towers in place anyway can afford shorter frequencies.
But AT&T seems to actively convert to 850MHz anywhere possible.
for GSM, Mostly only 2G networks are now on higher frequencies, and for 3G with higher spectral power requirements, they try to use 850 to try to save power somewhere...

ap1618 said:
as for everyone not using lower frequencies, maybe it has to do with Spectrum availability... for instance in US everyone's eyeing the recently freed white spaces in the 700MHz range, but the highest bidder gets them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think it is a similar situation here in Australia. Telstra announced an LTE network for us but running on 1800mhz (old 2g spectrum for them) however by 2013 all analogue TV will be switched off so everyone is eyeing the 700mhz spectrum. I read somewhere however that if Telstra decided to use it the cost would be about an extra half a billion or so (presumably for licensing) .
I came across another bit of info (for wifi in this case but fit could be the same?) that higher frequencies can have a higher bandwidth (case in point here was 5ghz wifi). Could this also be true here and why some higher frequencies are used in cities and for LTE deployment in the UK (2600mhz I think).
Thanks anyway!
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

Bump! Anyone else have extra info to add?
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

Higher frequencies have the potential for higher bandwidth.
And Higher frequencies attenuate quicker, so in a RF dense area high frequencies are nice, as they fade away and you can hear closer broadcasters better.
Also one of them is higher energy to make, but I forget how that goes. So there is a power component to it as well.

Cheers LargePrime! That's something I didn't know so thanks for sharing. Would you happen to know why it has the potential for higher bandwidth?
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

This is rather High level, and a metaphor, so inaccurate.
Imagine Frequency as a metronome. A click is one cycle. Now lets pretend it's Jazz or something and we can screw with the timing on the metronome. When we do, that counts as a small piece of data. i.e. Short timing is a "0" and Long a "1".
With more cycles one has more potential to flow data.
Also Higher MHz has less wait time until a clock tick is going to happen, so less latency.
And Cheers to you!

Thanks for the explanation! I think I get how it would work. Yay for metaphors
Thanks again! I think I have all I need now!
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

side question for you... hows GPS on Nexus S?

Its been perfect! Never had a single issue with it in the month I've had it. Accuracy is <5m outside and about 10m inside. The lock seems quick too however I don't have another GPS device to compare it with.
No problems at all though, despite the Galaxy S GPS issues
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

oh wow! I dream of that day!
can u do me a favor? can u please post a pic of the GPS antenna?

ap1618 said:
oh wow! I dream of that day!
can u do me a favor? can u please post a pic of the GPS antenna?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry what do you mean by the GPS antenna? Like the physical antenna? I actually don't know where it would be...

yes, for by now I worry worry for a physical antenna placement issue...
on the back of your phone, there should be a tiny gold connector... what you can do is to post a pic of the back with the battery cover off.
thanks in advance.

ap1618 said:
yes, for by now I worry worry for a physical antenna placement issue...
on the back of your phone, there should be a tiny gold connector... what you can do is to post a pic of the back with the battery cover off.
thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can do, give me a few minutes I think I know what you are talking about, I always seemed to think it was for a mobile antenna extension or something
EDIT: Ok here it is sorry for the blurryness, I didn't realise it until it was uploaded but you can still see the connector.
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hmm this is super interesting... the two connectors, i believe they are are the GPS antenna. on captivate we only have one of them! While they look similar to what we have, you have two!
i wonder whether this last minute addition was sum and boost the signal with two antennas... damn

ap1618 said:
hmm this is super interesting... the two connectors, i believe they are are the GPS antenna. on captivate we only have one of them! While they look similar to what we have, you have two!
i wonder whether this last minute addition was sum and boost the signal with two antennas... damn
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The two connectors within about 1cm of each other are actually the connectors for the NFC antenna on the backplate. Sorry to disappoint I think the GPS one is the single connector on the right hand side near the middle.

oh forgot about NFC. I have the exact same connector, except its only one. so one must be GPS and one for NFC...

ap1618 said:
oh forgot about NFC. I have the exact same connector, except its only one. so one must be GPS and one for NFC...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If they both appear to be the same, maybe it's just because of software differences or even location. Considering I'm in Australia and it looks like you're in America.

An Update.
Higher Freq take less power.

Okay thanks for that update. I presume it would require less power because it attenuates quicker and therefore doesn't travel as far?
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

Quadrant, Linkpack and Neocore Scores

I got an average of:
Quadrant : 2,400
Linpack: 36
Neocore: 54.2 (although I saw it going as high as 62)
Enjoy

that's a bit of a downer on the computing side!
my n1 consistently gets 38-40 linpack. figured the dual core would do much better...

do these programs recognize the dualcore processor yet?

I really don't think they actually recognize the dual core models.
Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

The amount of time it takes the os to perform calculations has nothing to do with the benchmark app...

If its not multi thread then it totally does matter what the app does.
Sent from my DROIDX using XDA App

That sucks im pullen 2534 on my nexus s reason you can always spot all the non developers from the real tech heads who know DC means nothing we will see single core out perform it
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

Squeak22 said:
If its not multi thread then it totally does matter what the app does.
Sent from my DROIDX using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You are absolutely correct - must've had a brain cramp!
At what point does the android kernel begin to support multi-threading? I'm guessing we'll be seeing huge performance gains with 2.3/2.4 and as app devs begin building mt support in to their apps...
nucentury08 said:
That sucks im pullen 2534 on my nexus s reason you can always spot all the non developers from the real tech heads who know DC means nothing we will see single core out perform it
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Open mouth, insert foot! DC means everything to the "tech heads" that know how to use it and build mt support in to their apps - and that includes the google devs.

nucentury08 said:
That sucks im pullen 2534 on my nexus s reason you can always spot all the non developers from the real tech heads who know DC means nothing we will see single core out perform it
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's fantastic. Let's try that again, though. What did you Nexus S pull when it was completely stock? 1500 or so?
Otherwise, as has been said already, the benchmarks are likely only taxing one core at the moment, as I doubt the kernel on the phone is setup for auto-aggregation, etc. Even if it is, apps written specifically for multi-threading will be significantly faster.
I love the Nexus S as much as the next guy, but let's revisit this conversation once the Atrix launches and has had a chance for some real dev support, shall we?

Squeak22 said:
If its not multi thread then it totally does matter what the app does.
Sent from my DROIDX using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It doesn't necessarily have to be the app that supports multi-threading. If the kernel supports it then it would assign a core for the apps to work on based on the workload. This would speed up the system regardless of what the apps for designed for because the apps wouldn't know any better. Regardless though, it wouldn't help the benchmark if it is only one process. But then again, if it does everything you want better the last phone, does it matter? (I know I know... we all want our big numbers)
With any luck we'll find out today.

slhawkins said:
It doesn't necessarily have to be the app that supports multi-threading. If the kernel supports it then it would assign a core for the apps to work on based on the workload. This would speed up the system regardless of what the apps for designed for because the apps wouldn't know any better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But in the case of benchmarking apps it would, because they are specifically designed to use all available resources. If they are single thread, they aren't using multiple cores.
These are some of the highest benchmarking scores I have seen out of the box, but I don't think they are optimized to use DC's yet.

nucentury08 said:
That sucks im pullen 2534 on my nexus s reason you can always spot all the non developers from the real tech heads who know DC means nothing we will see single core out perform it
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can tell how wrong people are just by scanning over their post. I knew that whatever he had to say was ignorant from reading the first three words of his.

Guess we need gingerbread asap Support for dual core is a necessary thing when you SELL A DUAL CORE PHONE!

psufan5 said:
Guess we need gingerbread asap Support for dual core is a necessary thing when you SELL A DUAL CORE PHONE!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Froyo supports dual core fine. It just doesn't support breaking up apps threads to schedule across both cores unless the app is multi-threaded.

Im sure it will be fast when the os is ready for DC witch will be with the atrix 2 and 2.4 witch moto atrix wont see the lite of called marketing unless its a nexus no go.But that's half the atrix beef I want to add one to my Droid collection but no custom roms no go and fail
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

nucentury08 said:
Im sure it will be fast when the os is ready for DC witch will be with the atrix 2 and 2.4 witch moto atrix wont see the lite of called marketing unless its a nexus no go.But that's half the atrix beef I want to add one to my Droid collection but no custom roms no go and fail
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
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I'm not even going to start...

FM radio almost worked!

I found this app called connected music, it has an option for FM radio. So of course I click on it and it says to plug in headphones. I do that then it says starting FM and then theres a tuner wheel along the bottom where you can set it to your radio stations. But the best part is that when pressing the volume buttons while the fm app is going, the volume being adjusted is FM volume . Not media volume, ringer volume but FM volume. Of course I couldnt ever actually hear anything but it was acting like the FM radio in the phone was alive and well. What do u all think about that?
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Sent from my SPH-D700 using Tapatalk

I don't think our phones have an FM antenna.
Your app didn't almost work at all.

Just use TuneIn Radio
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

The problem I ran into was no way to turn on the FM Radio chip
I found a widget for the galaxy phones from europe that would launch, but ran into a wall as it wanted the FM Radio turned on.
edit: ran into same issue I did with the galaxy S radio widget, it seems the FM Radio chip is not being turned on

alfiej said:
Just use TuneIn Radio
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Works awesome.

dchawk81 said:
I don't think our phones have an FM antenna.
Your app didn't almost work at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh they do, it's built into the Broadcom chipset, but in the US, I think Nokia holds an essential patent on the functionality, so for the most part, it is disabled at the hardware or firmware level unless the carrier/manufacturer licenses the use of it and has it FCC approved.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

dchawk81 said:
I don't think our phones have an FM antenna.
Your app didn't almost work at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most phones/devices use headphones as the FM antenna (exactly why it said plug in your headphones to listen to FM radio for the OP).

Yeah I remember somebody posting the moto music player awhile back. It worked with fm.. but again only with headphones.. I would LOVE to see a reverse fm thing. Like use my phone to stream audio via the radio to my car.. anyone know if our phones are capable of this?
cd's or tapes?

I was looking at some phones today that had the FM functionality. They appear to require the headset as an FM antenna. We know the chip has FM capability, and this topic appears to signal a chance. Can someone who knows something look into this?

mynewepic10 said:
Works awesome.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tune-In is great and IHeartRadio is finally fixed too...after 6 months of not working
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App

Who listens to FM radio anyways?
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

I installed an ATM App and it said dispensing cash! I almost got free money.....so close!

if someone could figure how to get the FM working - might be able to use the car charger as the antenna and then try the old fm tuner function to listen to tunes from the phone on the car radio - damn I miss that feature.
The car dock Samsung thing is just junk.
I wish Monster would make a mini-usb charger/tuner plug-in.
I hate using CD's again and can't justify getting an Ipod and becoming a slave to Apple when I have 1200 songs on my phone.

NoSoMo said:
I installed an ATM App and it said dispensing cash! I almost got free money.....so close!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hahaha, that app only work on the nexus I heard.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App

I have seen several apps that all start, but wont initialize the FM Radio Chip.
Back when the Epic was first released, there was a setting.apk file that had the FM radio in it, with an option to turn it on, but the settings/apk file caused massive FCs, but I cant seem to find it again after many searches
It seems the issue that causes the block, is the inability to turn on the internal FM Radio.

Read up on the broadcom chip in the phone, it says that a few of the device onboard (FM Radio, 802.11, Bluetooth) actually share the same antennas.

keith5039756827 said:
Who listens to FM radio anyways?
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If it was HD Radio, might not be that bad.....

In_da_buff said:
if someone could figure how to get the FM working - might be able to use the car charger as the antenna and then try the old fm tuner function to listen to tunes from the phone on the car radio - damn I miss that feature.
The car dock Samsung thing is just junk.
I wish Monster would make a mini-usb charger/tuner plug-in.
I hate using CD's again and can't justify getting an Ipod and becoming a slave to Apple when I have 1200 songs on my phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is a FM transmitter. That is not what is in the Epic.

[APP] Android L Calculator

Hey guys,
I managed to convert the demo calculator on the Polymer Project website into an .apk so we can use the material design calculator on our phone.
Let me know what you guys think.
Here are some screenshots:
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virjog said:
Hey guys,
I managed to convert the demo calculator on the Polymer Project website into an .apk so we can use the material design calculator on our phone.
Let me know what you guys think.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually looks like it works running carbon rom. bout to put up on purity

marcusva79 said:
Actually looks like it works running carbon rom. bout to put up on purity
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Let me know if it works properly. Thanks!

Works on my moto x!

Is it just a webview to open polymer project page or a native app.
Also if its native app how did you ported it ?

Works on LG G2 with CM11. Looks great! Thanks.

Results seems incorrect.
50+10%+10 shows 50
Correct answer is 65
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Free mobile app

ATZ-007 said:
Results seems incorrect.
50+10%+10 shows 50
Correct answer is 65
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What the hell is 50+10%? 10% of what? That doesn't make any sense.

The graphic is very nice but I've noticed lag in addition to wrong results, a good place to work..

ATZ-007 said:
Results seems incorrect.
50+10%+10 shows 50
Correct answer is 65
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Garbage in Garbage out
go back to school sonny

SD Card permission? Really?

roygbiv856 said:
What the hell is 50+10%? 10% of what? That doesn't make any sense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was just testing the calculator.
This is the first thing came to my head. Calculation makes perfect sense,
10% of 50 is 5
So it’s 50 + 5 + 10
Don’t think this calculator can handle percentage.
flex360 said:
Garbage in Garbage out
go back to school sonny
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your comment has no value what so ever. Waste of digital space. Don’t think it’s me who needs to go back to school.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Free mobile app

ATZ-007 said:
I was just testing the calculator.
This is the first thing came to my head. Calculation makes perfect sense,
10% of 50 is 5
So it’s 50 + 5 + 10
Don’t think this calculator can handle percentage.
Your comment has no value what so ever. Waste of digital space. Don’t think it’s me who needs to go back to school.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually they're right. Regardless of some calculators spitting back a result, that expression is mathematically meaningless.
Swiftkey'd from my Nexus 5

ATZ is right. His math is a bit strange. However, a calculator should correct this and change 10% to 5. Try the math with most calculator and it will give you 65. More advanced ones will change 10% to 0.10 which would give you 60.1.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

projectvomit said:
ATZ is right. His math is a bit strange. However, a calculator should correct this and change 10% to 5. Try the math with most calculator and it will give you 65. More advanced ones will change 10% to 0.10 which would give you 60.1.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have a point, the correct answer to that should be 60.1, but in any case is a bad mathematical expression and shouldn't be used.
Hell I never use the % symbol when doing math in the first place, but that's another matter.
Swiftkey'd from my Nexus 5

Molitro said:
You have a point, the correct answer to that should be 60.1, but in any case is a bad mathematical expression and shouldn't be used.
Hell I never use the % symbol when doing math in the first place, but that's another matter.
Swiftkey'd from my Nexus 5
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree 100% . I just don't understand the attacks on someone trying point out a potential problem and try trying to help in a forum. Thank you ATZ!
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

Sorry guys, my math may seem strange but I do use % at work and sometimes I use my phone to do it. This calculator can't calculate % so that I'd point it out.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Free mobile app

So back to the app. Any number longer than 7 digits will be cut off. Font size does not change to accommodate for large numerical values. And no, this mathematical expression does not make sense. It's only to show an issue with font size adjustment.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

Oops here are the screens
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium 4 mobile app

ATZ-007 said:
Sorry guys, my math may seem strange but I do use % at work and sometimes I use my phone to do it. This calculator can't calculate % so that I'd point it out.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Free mobile app
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The point we're making is that it's not that the calculator doesn't handle %, but that your way of writing it is wrong.
50+10% doesn't mean 50+ (10% of 50). In principle, as I said, I'd call that wrong because is not clear what you want. Or in any case it would mean 50 + 10*1/100, that is, 50 + 0.1
Swiftkey'd from my Nexus 5

Car home Ultra on G2?

Anyone using Car Home Ultra on their G2?
I have come to rely on the app on my S4, but am switching to a G2 (arriving any day now) and am wondering if anyone has issues.
I like having the GPS speedometer, MP3 player (I use Mortplayer) and assorted quick dial shortcuts available.
Alternatively, what is everyone using in their car?

nunjabusiness said:
Anyone using Car Home Ultra on their G2?
I have come to rely on the app on my S4, but am switching to a G2 (arriving any day now) and am wondering if anyone has issues.
I like having the GPS speedometer, MP3 player (I use Mortplayer) and assorted quick dial shortcuts available.
Alternatively, what is everyone using in their car?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I rely on my car speedometer, jokes apart never used the apps
Sent from my LG-D802 using xda premium

vishal11in said:
I rely on my car speedometer, jokes apart never used the apps
Sent from my LG-D802 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have found many cars' built-in speedometers to be wildly inaccurate (more imports, strangely). No joke.
Unless it is part of a sophisticated nav system, it is a mechanical device. They calculate how many rotations of the wheel equal what speed and it can vary drastically according to whether you have the same exact wheels and tires that came on the car to how much air is in them and how well they are aligned. The precision of a calibrated GPS beats them hands down.

nunjabusiness said:
I have found many cars' built-in speedometers to be wildly inaccurate (more imports, strangely). No joke.
Unless it is part of a sophisticated nav system, it is a mechanical device. They calculate how many rotations of the wheel equal what speed and it can vary drastically according to whether you have the same exact wheels and tires that came on the car to how much air is in them and how well they are aligned. The precision of a calibrated GPS beats them hands down.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your point is logical but again it is not handy for me have it all the time running on phone.
Sent from my LG-D802 using xda premium

Works great here, along with usb autoconnect,
it pops up automatically as it connects to bluetooth and turns up the volume.

Yup, glad to say it works better on the G2 than it did on the S4.
Happy camper here!

Check this out. Its a car audio app that looks like a car stereo. Can put you're own presets of apps or stations
---------- Post added at 04:30 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:29 AM ----------
mattwheat said:
Check this out. Its a car audio app that looks like a car stereo. Can put you're own presets of apps or stations
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=uk.co.cdrskull.digitalcar

mattwheat said:
Check this out. Its a car audio app that looks like a car stereo. Can put you're own presets of apps or stations
---------- Post added at 04:30 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:29 AM ----------
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=uk.co.cdrskull.digitalcar
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your link is broken, what is the app called?

nunjabusiness said:
Your link is broken, what is the app called?
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Click to collapse
The link took me right to it. But here's a screen shot of the where the link takes you so you can see the info on it.
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"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
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mattwheat said:
The link took me right to it. But here's a screen shot of the where the link takes you so you can see the info on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
WTH is the deal? Here is what I get clicking on that very same link:
We're sorry, the requested URL was not found on this server.
Maybe it is the link and the fact I am in the US?
The link you posted is "https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=uk.co.cdrskull.digitalcar"
Can't see the details easily, but the US Play store has no such app. That sucks pretty hard.
I found the download of an Alpha version in XDA's downloads, is that what you have - an Alpha?
I think I will give it a shot.

Update:
Apparently, the download link is only valid after you join the group.
Have installed app on my N7 and am trying it out now.
It would be nice if the apps had their names showing. I don't recognize half of them by just their icons, especially as tiny as they are.