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The title of the thread is just to get all you fine people steaming in here to tell me off. But now your here by your own free will...
I've been a long time browser of these forums and recently a more active member. I used to be a very amateur coder when I was yonger and know to a small extent the hard work you guys put into these roms, so seriously to everyone congratulations on some amazing efforts.
I did want to address the reason topic titles such as the one I chose here crop up however. When I had a diamond before my HD2 there were just a few good roms to choose from and I soon settled down and chose one after trying them out. A few months back I started this same process with my HD2 but found every ROM I flashed to have a few bugs which annoyed me in day to day use, and I eventually went back to stock. Since then I havn't really tried again.
Today I have again been looking at perhaps flashing to a cooked ROM and in the beginning of these efforts I tried out the search term "best HD2 ROM". The threads that resulted were obviously very short and the authors told off for being lazy and discrediting the great works of all the chefs here. But the very good point is made that there are ALOT of ROM's for the HD2, and whilst it may only take 5 mnins to flash a ROM it takes hours, if not days, to find out if it suited to you. With the risk of losing personal info on each flash and having to reconfigure your apps each time this can be a very tedious process.
I'm basically wondering if there is any way to have a thread that can provide a way of rating the advantages and disadvantages of each ROM without having to wade through topics with hundreds of pages of mostly useless posts. It just so daunting with all these ROM's that many people may never even start.
I am just now thinking of flexing my (somewhat out of date) webmastering ability to create a "ROM Review" website - good idea?
What are people's thoughts?
p.s. This is probably also in the wrong section of the forum... just clicked "new topic" where I was browsing without thinking where it should go, please move if appropriate, thanks.
I completely agree with your idea to open this thread.
Finally we have someone who wants to put it to rights. Because every day we have new ROM or several ROM's, and every time flashing and soft re-installation takes a lot of time... and after all that you understand that "this ROM is not really what you wanted to be"...
Go on with your idea.. and I think - this section is the right place for your thread.
you got my vote
Good to see I'm not alone here, any feedback is much appriciated, even if its just a +1
Agreed, Sir.
This was taken from another thread about a similar question
"I also see no point to a list of pro's or cons of any particular ROM as most are built for the same thing, speed and stability. The only real differences you are going to see are what programs the person has loaded."
If this is indeed the case. then a list of the roms with the space taken up by the rom on the phone. the apps installed and how quick, stable each one would be must surely be a good idea?
I truly hope you can follow through with your idea.
I think there is no such thing as "the" best ROM.
Each user has different preferences, especially WinMo smartphones are
rarely one the same like another: Included software, tweaks, mods, themes, designs.
The possibilities are endless.
Also, an earlier thread here at the HD2 forum about speed (with benchmarks
as neutral as possible) ended up in unfriendly discussions (which is a mild
term to describe what happened).
An HD2 is so extremely fast that I seriously doubt that the "average" user
can tell a big difference between different ROMs. Sometimes, a buggy ROM
may be obviously slower, but in the average case, the difference will just
not really be felt, but only perceived, sometimes only imagined.
I think that it is part of this forum that there is no rating of the available
ROMs. If you watch the forum, you can easily find out which ROMs seem to
have more acceptance and therefore more fans - and if you check the ROM
description and screenshots of the chef, you can easily find out if the ROM
is something you might like.
Just to finish: How exactly does a ROM qualify as "the best"? Speed? Come
on... Software which comes with it? Come on, again...
Imho, it all ends up in optical mods and tweaks plus some extremely basic
software which is really a must for everybody. If you would ask me what
this could be, I cannot give you any name because WinMo and Manila are
on most ROMs anyway...
I couldn't agree more Mega. Very brave of you to start this thread ; )
I was a bit of a flashaholic with both my Elf and my Raphael, but I still haven't flashed anything to my Leo because it's so hard to figure out exactly what I'm going to get. Apart from the features of each ROM, it's hard to get an idea of the things that might be missing from each. Like, have the original bugs been fixed? Stuff like the audio booster turning off, AAC files being mis-sorted in the audio player, volume keys still active when the screen is off and incremental volume control or even the relative volume between headphones and phone speaker. I just can't be bothered to start flashing a million ROMs to find out. That's not laziness by the way, honest! I'm sure I'll get over it and start flashing soon ; )
tictac0566 said:
I think there is no such thing as "the" best ROM.
Each user has different preferences, especially WinMo smartphones are
rarely one the same like another: Included software, tweaks, mods, themes, designs.
The possibilities are endless.
Also, an earlier thread here at the HD2 forum about speed (with benchmarks
as neutral as possible) ended up in unfriendly discussions (which is a mild
term to describe what happened).
An HD2 is so extremely fast that I seriously doubt that the "average" user
can tell a big difference between different ROMs. Sometimes, a buggy ROM
may be obviously slower, but in the average case, the difference will just
not really be felt, but only perceived, sometimes only imagined.
I think that it is part of this forum that there is no rating of the available
ROMs. If you watch the forum, you can easily find out which ROMs seem to
have more acceptance and therefore more fans - and if you check the ROM
description and screenshots of the chef, you can easily find out if the ROM
is something you might like.
Just to finish: How exactly does a ROM qualify as "the best"? Speed? Come
on... Software which comes with it? Come on, again...
Imho, it all ends up in optical mods and tweaks plus some extremely basic
software which is really a must for everybody. If you would ask me what
this could be, I cannot give you any name because WinMo and Manila are
on most ROMs anyway...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree, how would one rate the BEST? Well to be honest you cant really as each person has there own needs and wants in a rom. What might be an Ideal rom for me might not be the best rom for you. I could rate a rom at 10 and you might give it a 2, then it turns into a bashing session and that can not be allowed. The rating system has been brought up many times before and each time it comes to the same end. There will never be an accurate way to tell the best rom. I am not trying to be harsh here but threads like this are beating a dead horse.
After speaking with the OP I have decided to reopen this thread. On the condition that this is "NOT" a best rom thread. This thread will be to help those that are new to ROM flashing. I will be keeping an eye on this thread and if it turn into a Best rom or bashing thread I will reclose it for good. I understand that sense the release of the HD 2 that alot of people are new to WM and with the available options in the rom thread it can be confusing. I am also moving this thread to the General Section as it is not Rom development. To all the new guys welcome.
Just wanna say thanks to Zelendal, the topic title originally wasn't constructive.
As we all know from doing a little reading about the ROM's, each one can be individually suited to different people, it like argument about which is the best smart phone or computer platform. So the kind of discussionj I was trying to provoke was about the best way to help out newcomers decide which ROM would indeed be best suited to them.
As I posted before I have been pondering making a seperate website that would allow some organisation of peoples opinions on the ROM's and I am interested as to how much support there would be amongst the community, I am also interested as to how the Cook's themselves would see such an project, providing it was done right.
sike222 said:
This was taken from another thread about a similar question
"I also see no point to a list of pro's or cons of any particular ROM as most are built for the same thing, speed and stability. The only real differences you are going to see are what programs the person has loaded."
If this is indeed the case. then a list of the roms with the space taken up by the rom on the phone. the apps installed and how quick, stable each one would be must surely be a good idea?
I truly hope you can follow through with your idea.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You quote me but you leave out an important part. The problem with making a list is that ROMs change. What might have been an issue in one build might be working just fine in the next. Keeping up with these changes and trying to keep on top of a list would be a nightmare. Also this mystical list you are looking for is usually on one of the first few post of every ROM thread. Most good cooks will list all these things that you are looking for. Only way to tell if a ROM will fit your needs is to try it. Every bodies idea of a good ROM is different. What one person might see as a con another sees as a pro. Personal opinion is a ***** and unfortunately everybody has a different one.
Good luck but I don't see a list being started or maintained for very long. Nor do I see this thread going anywhere productive.
Will Badger -
I don't think anyone is dis-agreeing that each ROM is suited individually to different people. Each cook makes his ROM how he wants it and if you share those wants with that cook you a likly to enjoy his ROM. That doesn't make it any easier to find what ROM is indeed suited to you, and as a newbe it can be extremely daunting, there are 30 odd cooks for the HD2, thats ALOT of time spent flashing and tring out ROM's.
Having said that I have been pointed towards
http://www.xdaroms.com/Default.aspx
Which is more or less everything I had in mind for a ROM information site, so its safe to say I wont be needing to build another. Iv'e been on this forum for a few months now and have not seen this site, somthing like this would need the direct support of Cooks asking people to visit in their ROM threads to submit reviews of their ROM.
Personally if that could happen I think it would be great and a fantastic resourse for newbes but I know there are alot of differing opinions on here, and perhaps its somthing the chefs would have second thoughts about.
Cool nice to know you found what you were looking for. I still find it easier to just read the actual thread for the info I'm looking for. Going over that page quickly I see no information stating whether the any of the HD2 ROMs are T-mobile compatible. You can flash a standard HD2 ROM onto the newer T-Mo HD2 since they use different processor.
i hadn't come across that site either, lol... but looking at this thread i think the guy's pretty keen to make the site useful. see here - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=658641
there's also another thread in the ROM section that might be helpful... i'm sure jaimeeee would appreciate any input and help you wanna give
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=683743
Hi,
Thanks for the extra info, whilst the site I posted does seem to be more or less what I was thinking of doing myself it simply doesnt have the activity require to truely make it useful to anyone. It needs the support of the Forum, especially the Cooks if its going to succeed. I keep meaning to conatct the owner of th site to discuss how to push traffic onto the site but I got all caught up making a skin recently.
Hopefully we can make somthing of this!
Typical scenario is;
v 0.1 based on this and that.
v 0.2 changed launcher, added ringtones
v 0.3 new wallpapers, added ram script
v 0.4 added new market, added google+
Excuse me!?! This is not development. This is stealing!
I think these people should just wank instead of copy/pasting. Would be more beneficial for both public and themselves.
Rant over.
Thank you.
calyxim said:
Typical scenario is;
v 0.1 based on this and that.
v 0.2 changed launcher, added ringtones
v 0.3 new wallpapers, added ram script
v 0.4 added new market, added google+
Excuse me!?! This is not development. This is stealing!
I think these people should just wank instead of copy/pasting. Would be more beneficial for both public and themselves.
Rant over.
Thank you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed, but if credit is given to original devs you can't really call it "stealing" cause Android is OSP after all...I'm no dev myself but it does seem many ROMs available are CM tweaks achievable with a few market downloads or simply AOSP with extra's...however sometimes certain ROMs begin as "Zip developments" and get later support with real devs and change fundamental features (kernels, code-base etc.) so it's not all bad...
Totally agree..........
But it's not the actual non-development of new roms that is getting on my nerves the most, its the constant *****ing and arguing through lack of understanding different languages etc etc..........
All i have to say is read the threads carefully as i've noticed some people who don't speak english very well get the hump on as they don't understand clearly what people are saying.
I know i've had my rants in some of these threads before and i don't blame anyone else for doing it too. I've managed to restrain myself the last few weeks as our arguments are falling on deaf ears so whats the point, i'll just ignore the idiots making fools out of themselves by bringing us stuff we've already had for a long time and stick to what i know best.
What you've said is true Scratch...even if the ROM cookers do bring something new often nobody knows what that new stuff is because of the poor English. I'm not trying to insult them but I would recommend, especially with a specialized thing such as compiling/ making a ROM, the English needs to be clear and concise so everyone knows what is being released, what changes have been made and what's been modified. More often than not, as you say Scratch, people get upset because of a misunderstanding. Maybe those struggling with the language can consult friends/devs and ask exactly how to express something they've done in their ROM so everybody is clear on what's happening.
Scratch0805 said:
...I've managed to restrain myself the last few weeks...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True, I have got quite a lot to say over this entire fiasco over the Android 4.0 "ports" and "source builds" that is currently playing out in the dev zone like a long dragging soap opera, but, its just not worth it, so, just let them argue over themselves who is first and who is the true dev and what not. Besides, it's not a good feeling when these Zip Devs accuse you of various stuffs when you speak out against them. It's extremely childish and irritating to read those posts, but I guess it can't be helped. Zip developers are not a localized phenomenon, they are everywhere, and since Android and ROMs like Cyanogenmod are Open Source, we have nothing to say, and have to live with it.
There's another new phenomenon which is playing out and can be seen on pretty much every ROM. Someone gets a ROM to boot / work at a basic level, create a thread and build up major hype and hoopla on it, and EVERYONE of these "devs" proclaim "I need help to do this and do that./..... bla bla bla". Zip dev is not such a big issue per se, but, the level of intellect is terribly low among the "devs". I believe most of them are what? 12-13 year olds, and, they act their age perfectly, unlike someone like Jacob.
/End Rant
Case in point, after Arco has announced his intentions and the fact he already has a working port in progress:
I was first, it was my idea, I continue and basta.
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Click to collapse
Enough said.
Ahah, doing small things for the buzz (pun intended), acquiring a fame in trolland
Lol, I've made myself clear on this too.
" the ability to read is good,
the ability to understand what you've read is great "
http://www.androidpolice.com/2011/1...om-developers-i-think-we-need-to-have-a-talk/
3xeno said:
dragging soap opera.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't you mean aosp opera? Hehe...okay, I'll stop with the bad jokes.
And I fully agree with the topic. Anyone can open up any rom .zip paste in some apps, reflash and repackage it as your own.
Agree with this. Sadly I'm one of the offenders, that will have a moan at people developing zip-roms. I accept that this isnt the greatest way to deal with people on forums like theese. But it seems the only good way to get my point across to people that aren't that great at english.
Although, I must add one thing. I've seen roms get tossed around the development forums like mad. It seems to go like this in the dev. forums.
People create a booting rom. Or compile a new one.
People add a few fixes, someone creates a spin off.
Original dev discontinues rom, other 'developers' ask to continue it, even when they have projects in hand.
Someone picks up the pieces months later. After even the re-contiuned rom is given up with.
People spin roms off from there.
All i can say is dear god. I have been reading all that threads last few days and i was frapped how people are shalow in glorifying them selves and their so called development skills. I didnt want to coment anything cauze i have run into such argument once before with someone who was constantly refusing to understand what i am saying and i dont want to do it again, so i leave my thoughts here.
So people should get on the ground for change and start doing something usefull instead of make dozen threads, first when you dig something, than another one when you are asking if it can be done and finaly one when you "do" something. What they have done is nothing. They are just thanks chasers. In last few days there were more new roms than it was for whole Wildfire lifetime.
I remember tje days when there was just three or four roms and they worked, you hear me, they worked. So stop posting such s**t unles u did something that is realy worth it.
Sent from my HTC Wildfire using xda premium
Yes you are right, zip development is horrible. Lately there has been a major rise in "new" roms that have been hitting the development thread. I swear I have seen at least 5 to 10 roms all based on CM7 or oxygen. And what's different? It's "fast and stable" "Is themed to look like ICS" "Has a script that I actually don't know what it does but it must do something good". And its "my" rom because I grabbed a rom.zip from a device that runs oxygen smoothly and added the boot.img and the build prop right from the CM7 rom.zip and then cooked it and I posted it under MY account so its MY rom. There is a problem though, my genius copy/paste skills on my computer that took forever to build up are limited to actually being able to fix problems with things like Bluetooth and GPS, etc. So what do I do then? Hell I request "help" to fix the problems and once a genius like acro or another real dev comes in and fixes it for me, I take the fix and say it was all MY work. AOSP stands for ANDROID OPEN SOURCE PROJECT. The source is open to anyone that can use linux terminal (that's half the problem). The other problem is that no one could be bothered taking the time to actually learn a skill. They want to do something now, and now only. They won't spend hours and days learning how to program in java or C because it takes "too long" and just wants to begin this so called "deving" now. This is a rant about zip development, but wait you say, I do .zip development though? Yes I do, but what I am talking about is .zip development that is based on a .zip that is actually OPEN SOURCE. If something is OPEN SOURCE there is no point in taking a compiled .zip and "porting it" to our device. You do this because its easy for you to hit download and copy and paste, but you don't "have the time" to setup a download of the source and compile it to a rom. Zip development that is for CLOSED SOURCE on the other hand is way different. HTC, MIUI, etc. are all roms that have no open source code so all the work has to be done based on a .zip. Since the code is not available this is the only option. This in my opinion is the only kind of good .zip development since there is no source to build from. I would love to download the source and mess around with the ICS source and try to compile something but my computer is got really bad specs and my internet is so slow. I will just leave that kind of work to acro and the real devs
I agree with this. Looking through the more recent Wildfire ROMS, I can see a pattern for most. So, I have started to come up with a fight back, for individuality and mostly, for a better mobile experience. It would mean a lot if you could help me out with THIS.
Sorry to ask in this thread, but I thought it might be a good idea
Before I get accused of zipfile developing, I only compiled an edited kernel for the ROM to allow touchscreen to work a little.
I am not a "zipfile" developer and I am not going to be, my interest is in kernels.
I happened to come to xda at the wrong time, first thing kaassaus did was ask me to follow a tutorial to get touchscreen working (which took all of 20 seconds).
I think posting an ICS zip is okay FOR NOW because there is no OPEN source for the wildfire for it, and Arco is NOT breaking the GPL because he hasn't redistributed it yet.
Sent from my HTC Wildfire
We are not accusing anyone. My point is dev section is not a learning section. Those who want to learn development can pop into chefs section instead of releasing a rom with 2 zillion bugs.
There is a reason for this forum is not called xda-tweakers. Because our devs are devs. They are not steve jobs like tweakers.
2nd rant over. Class dismissed
Okay, Zip development is not so bad, actualy is needed in some points. For flashing kernels or some other things. But look at some of that AOSP-fast and stable roms. What do they bring us? Nothing. It is just repacked CM nightly or stable. To "develop" such rom you need WinZip and in best case Android SDK if they decide to decompile and recompile few apps instead of treating them with winzip too to change few icons and voila, NEW ROM. Better yet someome will take any theme and implement it into framework.And he will be so proud because his rom has diferent look. What else we can still expect is ES file explorer instead of OI, Miui galery, themed keyborad, different font and unforgetable scripts which do god knows what. They are the main part. Is that a rom? No it isn't my dear friends. Its a disrespect to any real developer here. All that we already have. We have themes, we have scripts we have everything that flashable and we dont need another yet ****y rom to tell us what is fast and stable.
Sent from my HTC Wildfire using xda premium
I don't find anything wrong in updating an already present ROM's with new applications update ,... even though i must say there is a trend in past few weeks that lot of ROM's in buzz section were merely identical and there was no development in them
I was browsing the old threads of the Dev Zone, and came on this:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=884659
Amazing, right? It's deja vu all over again.. (PS - Don't bump that please. lol)
I am a noob, and I know I will never be as experienced as other developers.
That is why I do not develop ROMs, and develop things I am good at.
I thought that this section was unique crap for Galaxy S2. Looks like we will have same **** soon.
anonymous572 said:
I thought that this section was unique crap for Galaxy S2. Looks like we will have same **** soon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
huh?
im yet to see what this section is for too
panyan said:
im yet to see what this section is for too
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea ive seen it on other sections before, But I dont fully understand it
What the hell is 'original development' ??
What is the current development ? Un original ?
whats with the need to add un-necessary sub sections ? It just fuels confusion
Maybe "original" means "real". So there will be a chance to distinguish between cloning/adding/tweaking from development
Do we need / want it ?? I think we should open up a poll and pass the results on to the mod(s)
We had a similar thing in the HTC One S forums, Where they added a subsection for Tmobile Versions, It was totally un-needed as there were no differences between the 2 devices. We made a poll and the section got removed.
Sometimes these things do more bad than good, As if the flashing procedure isnt difficult enough already, What with the brickbug and all that.
If you think its a good idea to remove it, Ill open a poll before the section gets full with stuff.
Why not wait a little bit and see what it should be used for?
One Mod will explain sooner or later...
lets just hope its something useful
Is it so hard to understand? All stuff about original roms goes in there.
What do you mean Original ROMs ? Things like Stock TW ROMs ? Or does that include Custom ROMs too ?
Only in the SGS2 threads the 'original' section is full of custom ROMs and kernels too.
I mean this device is almost 12months old, We've survived without it.
Im just old fashioned Change freaks me out
Confusing?
Hate It?
Simply Don't Open It
anonymous572 said:
I thought that this section was unique crap for Galaxy S2. Looks like we will have same **** soon.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wish you could enlighten us on how it was a unique crap and a **** for s2 then?
original = stock = cooked roms
the other thread will be for "really" developed roms i.e, aokp/aosp/cm9 variants
So if some one builds a ROM based on Cynogen Mod from scratch..will it be in original section or since its from CM it will be in Development
btw this was the rule posted there
The following are most likely “Original Development”:
Official releases of highly original and upstream custom ROMs (built from the ground up with significant original development within them
Official releases/development of such original ROMs, perhaps posted by the maintainer or their nominated person.
A significant “first” in development for a device. Significant is subjective, but it is likely something which took considerable time/effort, and is generally accepted by developers to be significant and non-trivial.
Kernels which are built with beneficial changes that are not simply pulled from other kernels already available. Some element of original work is expected.
Tools and utilities with a clear purpose, and which are well-made, and useful to users. They should have an element of originality, either in purpose or through significant improvement in the means of operation.
Significant port of a ROM from one device to another, giving enhanced features or functionality to users of the target device. The port should be beneficial (a port from two virtually identical devices isn’t original development, it’s winzipping, and nobody really benefits from this, as it’s not development)
The following are most likely not “Original Development”, and should be posted in the “Android Development” subforum:
Your own “unofficial” stock build of your favourite original, source-built (or otherwise) ROM, particularly where an official or maintainer-endorsed thread exists already.
Minor derivatives of other ROMs with little or no changes, or ROMs consisting of “placebo” features as a main constituent or claim.
Renames or rebadges of others’ work – these don’t belong on XDA at all! Refer to rule 12 for more information.
Reposts of existing ROMs with small changes (i.e. kitchen work, such as adding a couple of apps). If you could realistically distribute your changes as an “addon pack” above and beyond a ROM, you should do so. In addition, your “ROM” would not be original development as it would be substantially identical to the original ROM.
A thread created with unrealistic goals that are clearly unachievable by those starting the thread. This is not intended to discourage high aspirations, rather to prevent threads porting Windows Phone 8 to the HTC Wallaby. This is pretty much common sense.
A ROM where a main or significant claim/feature is graphical changes to the user interface (ie. Themed ROM)
i get the idea to separate the genuine development from the WinZip one, but it may not be that easy in practice to distinguish those lying somewhere in between
See Here
XDA, the moderators and the powers that be.... have been wrestling with trying to differentiate the Difference between the Code-writing Development and the Quasi-developers that use rom cooking tools.
To that end we will be going through the development threads in the next couple of weeks and moving the appropriate threads that meet the original code requirement to be placed in this new forum.
Please bear in mind that this is a "Work in Progress" and will take a bit of time to hone and perfect what goes where.
Also, please understand that this does not mean that some developers are on some special pedestal. That is not the case.
I will use an analogy to explain:
A music composer writes an original piece of music. The music composition may be awesome... but his performance of it, may not.
Such often is the case in developers..... often someone comes up with a awesome idea or new code application, but it often ends up being perfected by the use of others putting their creative spin on it.
That is the beauty of The Android Platform and ....XDA provides a fertile field for all to share ideas and collectively improve our experience
I hope this clarifys the potential questions
Thanks from the Moderators
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Click to collapse
At the end of the day everything is built from something else but what they are getting at is ROMs that are just other roms with maybe a new theme and tweaks taken from else where would just be in the normal development.
But if you came up with something new and different (not just a rehash of other peoples work) then it should go in original development
Now its starting to make sense, well ive always reverted to one particular rom (cleanote) so i guess i wont be affected.
maybe its for the best, there are a lot of similar roms out there so it might make life easier.
Im still adapting to the new xda theme, any more change after this and i might self destruct.
Want me to start a poll?
Sent from my GT-N7000 using XDA Premium App
azzledazzle said:
Now its starting to make sense, well ive always reverted to one particular rom (cleanote) so i guess i wont be affected.
maybe its for the best, there are a lot of similar roms out there so it might make life easier.
Im still adapting to the new xda theme, any more change after this and i might self destruct.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sahilarora2003 said:
Want me to start a poll?
Sent from my GT-N7000 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It makes alot of sense, will make it easy to find new and 'bigger' development work against the small tweaked roms which while important are starting to fill up the forum
It was tested in the S2 forums and has been rolling out XDA wide so theres not alot a poll will do, in honour of the hitch hikers guide of the galaxy, the plans have been on show for quite some time, if you can’t be bothered to take an interest in local affairs, that’s your own lookout.
I understand, after 2+ years, that ROM development and the forums for the EVO are gonna slow down. Devs are going to move on to other devices, but there is a really disturbing trend here that is irritating the hell out of me.
ROMs used to be released as Aplha's Beta's RC's, final, etc. You could look at the OP and see everything about the ROM. Devs took their time crafting something unique.
Now, I'm seeing these ROMS come out at a rapid pace and I'm not liking it for several reasons.
1) Poorly written OP's that don't even list the Android base version or the kernel, etc.
2) The same ROM with different names and the only real differences are a few 3rd party apps, or a slight theme change.
3) ROMs released as finals, with a ton of bugs. I'm not talking about FFC, Netflix, 4G bugs on ICS/JB ROMS; I'm talking about ROMS with no Wifi, for example. The majority use WiFi. Why the HELL would you release something where one of the most important aspects doesn't even work?? It's like not paying attention to details is suddenly OK
Settings that don't stick. Sounds that don't stick. Constant System Process Errors. These are pre-release errors, and I don't see them getting fixed, because it's become like a race to port every other ROM from every other device and tweak to boot up on the Evo, then letting it go.
I REALLY wish I could take the time and learn how to properly cook up my own ROM. My OCD of paying attention to details would probably make it great.
Hipkat thats the best thing ive heard in weeks,someone finally speaking out about the BS thats being posted now days and its like everyones in a race to see who can come out with the most borked roms,lol,like you said,they are all the same,except the apps and some themeing and half of them cant do that either,i'm sure this isnt meant to be a bashing session,its just getting rediculous with the drama some are causing and all the crappy ass roms being released,some guys do know what their doing,theres been 1 or 2 that i've put out that i shouldnt have,but come on guys at least take your time and try to do it right,only takes a little common sense and effort.If you havent noticed,over half the members and devs have left because of the BS,when i started doing roms,it was fun,nows its just a big joke,lol.
I dont care if anyone gets pissed about this and i'm sure they will,but oh well life goes on,you will eventually get over it.
It's definitely not a bashing, but a call for Devs to take a little more time and do it right
HipKat said:
It's definitely not a bashing, but a call for Devs to take a little more time and do it right
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I don't Dev, Cook, Build, Port or whatever term is used so I have alot of respect for those that do. With that being said I would also state that I am in complete agreement with you and Diablo.
I look at damned near every topic started in the Dev forum just to see what is being made. I take weeks to look at a new ROM and follow the threads to see what comes of it (with the only exception being Mazda's new CAJB ROM. On that one I went with name recognition and am pleased that I did)
In regards to the mass influx of ROMs I'll say this: If you guys don't take the time to keep up with each item you produce, work on bugs, add new options, answer questions from the users then you'll soon find yourself out of favor. Your reputation here, just like in RL, is something of value. It takes very little to earn trust, respect and loyalty. Most people will always give you the benefit of the doubt. Do something to devalue that trust and it can be nearly impossible to regain.
I think some wisdom can be gleaned by the following quote:
jamieg71 said:
I've seen devs, chefs, hackers, w/e, that make statements like "I do this for myself and just choose to share" or things to that effect. I call BS. I won't speak for anyone else but myself when I say, I do this for the thrill of it, for the challenge, to learn, and to share. I'd be lying if I said I didn't care about d/l numbers or that seeing my thanks meter grow did not give me some juvenalalistic (is that a word?) thrill. The fact is, guys like me doing this stuff get off on it...
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We know why you do it, and if you want to keep your junkies and not lose your rep, then make sure you take the time to Develop your craft and thereby make a better product for the masses...
Sorry for the rant
Well said, and nice quote from Jamie, who, btw, you notice took a lot of time with Reloaded
HipKat said:
Well said, and nice quote from Jamie, who, btw, you notice took a lot of time with Reloaded
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...lol, 'nuff said!
I think everyone needs to remember the difference between Development and Port / Theme / Tweak / Mod. That simple labeling would be a start
Over in Evo LTE land, they have finally recognized this distinction by creating entirely separate forums for "HTC EVO 4G LTE Android Development" and "HTC EVO 4G LTE Original Android Development"
One is for tweaks or ports, and the other is for people who actually compile something.
I made a request for the same original dev section but got denied as our device is to old.
I agree that there are a ton of ports and not enough originality or bugs being fixed. What I would like to state us that the op is stating that a lot have some third party apps but that's like calling the kettle black. You yourself have a rerelease of a miui from where all you did was slap your team name in the thread. I believe the original thread still exists. I'm not calling you out at all but at the same time the work that goes into all these ports or mods or what not is a ton. I myself have my rom thread and some new stuff coming out but I don't call people out usually on their stuff unless its a pure kang(meaning an actual using of ur work with out permission) not a duplicate port.
Yeah some of the revs here could put a little more work in and for sure learn to organize their rom thread a whole hell of a lot better but at the same time who else do u see bringing the newest and best to a two year old device.
XDA Moderator
It's not that they have 3rd party apps, all ROMS do, it's that some ROMS are just the same ROM with a few different 3rd party apps, or a slight variation in theming, and I mean real slight, but tbh, my biggest beef was with the OP not even listing what kernel is in the ROM, or if it has A2SD or a way to get it working, or the version of Android it's based on, etc.
Add in bug reports that get ignored or the person posting the report gets demeaned for it.
Mostly, it's just the sloppiness that I see going on over the last few months. Too hasty to release something without really perfecting it first
HipKat said:
It's not that they have 3rd party apps, all ROMS do, it's that some ROMS are just the same ROM with a few different 3rd party apps, or a slight variation in theming, and I mean real slight, but tbh, my biggest beef was with the OP not even listing what kernel is in the ROM, or if it has A2SD or a way to get it working, or the version of Android it's based on, etc.
Add in bug reports that get ignored or the person posting the report gets demeaned for it.
Mostly, it's just the sloppiness that I see going on over the last few months. Too hasty to release something without really perfecting it first
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I can agree with that there. sloppy op's without all the listings of what is added or taken out and what its running with a q & a section amoung other things.
I feel like we developers and porters alike should make a check list. Every time you want to post something, run through the list and then once everything is there, read again. If it seems like a business proposition (detailed, understandable, provocative and complete) then, that is the right moment to unleash it.
Thats exactly what i do,i make a list in notepad of what i want to do to the rom,then i go through and check it off as i go,wahla,i have a channelog,so to speak,then post it on the thread.Just like in my 4 Kornerz thread..... http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1612933
Same thing I'm gonna do as I try and update this MIUI GB ROM
What's funny is that the main reason I always hated opening ROM threads is because I'm completely OCD and feel like the posts have to make perfect sense. I try for my thread to make a little bit of sense at least at this point. And I try to keep change logs, bug reports & FAQs up to date.
But then again, I only have one ROM thread in this device section.
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Current Device: HTC EVO 4G LTE | ROM: toasted-deck CM10 | Kernel: Stock
Kernel should be listed.
a2sd included/not included AND if a specific version is known to work/not work.
Gapps included/not included (you can usually tell from the size of the ROM, but still)
SuperSU vs. Superuser
Wifi and data working/not working
Boot animation audio (can lead to uncomfortable moments when flashing in restrooms, in bed, around family or in TSA security lines--- yes, all personal experiences)
Probably much more...
RootzWiki kinda sorta tried to standardize some of that in OP headers. Would be cool to see that concept expanded in a visually pleasing manner. But, I know people like sprucing up their OP to their liking. Example:
Source: https://github.com/s...mmc-ra-recovery
Mod Type: Recovery Difficulty: Moderate Mod Status: Kang Mod Base: Carrier:
Requires Root: Yes Apply In: Fastboot Optional: Themed Optional: Android Version:
I think ports are great. If the developer is planning on just bringing it over and leaving it alone I think that's fine, but they should be upfront and say "Hey, I did this. Probably won't do any more with it myself, but anyone is welcome to add to it. Otherwise, enjoy."
What I'd really like to see is the people who respond first after an OP + OP reserved do something with that slot besides planting their flag of happening to be online at the right time (e.g. "First. Looks cool!"). They could take the lead, especially for very active developers with many ROMs and threads, to follow that thread and maintain an updated ROM Cheat Sheet/Known Fixes post. How many times have you followed the development of a ROM and things like the new boot animation didn't make it into the next update because the developer forgot. Then people post, "Hey, what happened to the boot ani" five or six times. Then a nice person posts it on Dropbox. Then a few people say other things. Then people repeat the question. Then people point them to the Dropbox link two pages back. Repeat. Repeat. Probably wouldn't matter though since a lot of people never read the OP. They sure wouldn't read that. I'll shut up.
smelkus said:
Kernel should be listed.
a2sd included/not included AND if a specific version is known to work/not work.
Gapps included/not included (you can usually tell from the size of the ROM, but still)
SuperSU vs. Superuser
Wifi and data working/not working
Boot animation audio (can lead to uncomfortable moments when flashing in restrooms, in bed, around family or in TSA security lines--- yes, all personal experiences)
Probably much more...
RootzWiki kinda sorta tried to standardize some of that in OP headers. Would be cool to see that concept expanded in a visually pleasing manner. But, I know people like sprucing up their OP to their liking. Example:
Source: https://github.com/s...mmc-ra-recovery
Mod Type: Recovery Difficulty: Moderate Mod Status: Kang Mod Base: Carrier:
Requires Root: Yes Apply In: Fastboot Optional: Themed Optional: Android Version:
I think ports are great. If the developer is planning on just bringing it over and leaving it alone I think that's fine, but they should be upfront and say "Hey, I did this. Probably won't do any more with it myself, but anyone is welcome to add to it. Otherwise, enjoy."
What I'd really like to see is the people who respond first after an OP + OP reserved do something with that slot besides planting their flag of happening to be online at the right time (e.g. "First. Looks cool!"). They could take the lead, especially for very active developers with many ROMs and threads, to follow that thread and maintain an updated ROM Cheat Sheet/Known Fixes post. How many times have you followed the development of a ROM and things like the new boot animation didn't make it into the next update because the developer forgot. Then people post, "Hey, what happened to the boot ani" five or six times. Then a nice person posts it on Dropbox. Then a few people say other things. Then people repeat the question. Then people point them to the Dropbox link two pages back. Repeat. Repeat. Probably wouldn't matter though since a lot of people never read the OP. They sure wouldn't read that. I'll shut up.
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LOL, you forgot 'Lather, Rinse...'
Who else clicked the link
While I agree with the OP 100%, I think at the end of the day there is NO rule that states that you need to do all that..... This is for FREE, and therefore we should be happy with we get on our EVO's nowadays..... I wish developers took their time to put a fully detail change log, bug list Q&A's section, but honestly if we don't like the way certain devs handle their threads, then just move on to the next Rom either way I don't develop, and I can figure out most stuff regarding a Rom by myself now, so I'm just thankful for all the roms out for the og EVO.
Edit: what I would like to know is what's going on with all the Rom teams flip flopping, what's up with that? Sorry to go off topic, lol.
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
Sorry, but while I appreciate the freeness of the work done and am grateful for it, there should still be enough info to identify exactly what you're getting into.
Perfect example. A lot of ICS/JB ROMS require the patched A2SD file. Good luck finding it. Why not add a link to the OP?? Same with GAPPS
And the date that it was released is much appreciated, although not as critical. The Android version if it's a Sense and/or GB ROM is definitely something that should be there, along with the kernel.
PHE-NOM said:
Edit: what I would like to know is what's going on with all the Rom teams flip flopping, what's up with that? Sorry to go off topic, lol.
Sent from my PC36100 using xda premium
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Two teams merged. Some people have left teams. I myself left td to not look partial towards a certain group.
XDA Moderator
There's too many ROMs to choose from here, it's kind of a pain in the ass really LOL.
What I want is the stock ROM with advanced power controls, and battery % in the status bar and the ability to change the DPI to make more use of the screen real estate. Maybe a kernel that improves battery life as well. I like things simple that work, not a lot of tweaks.
Can someone point me to a ROM like this? Would be much appreciated.
J
These threads aren't allowed as you have to try them yourself unfortunately...
Seems like as a community, we should start a spreadsheet or grid of what roms do/have what, updated by each developer, etc.
Telling someone "you have to try each one" seems kind of irresponsible, and would take days, possibly weeks to backup, install, restore, test functionality for a day or so, move on.
That's just the way it is. There's a poll in the general section about what ROMs people are using, and it doesn't take a genius to read the OP of a ROM and figure out whether it's full of features or very clean and simple. Nobody can recommend a ROM because it's a completely subjective question. It's like asking someone 'what's the best colour' or 'what's the best type of food'. If you can give me a definitive answer to either of those questions then I'll happily answer your question (in other words, your question cannot be answered).
What ^^^this^^^ RC posted. And to add there are too many variables involved from one User to another User...just take your time and Test the ROMs out, and since there are so many to chose from...Enjoy!
Thanks