Related
Okay I have been on this forum for a few months now and I still consider my self a noob it seems as though that magical search feature that everyone demands us noobs use is not too noob friendly and to prove this I documented my frustration when trying to get this nandroid thingy to work.
Supposed noob thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=3816278&postcount=3
EDIT: I am 99.9% sure this will work with a PVT board. I am not sure about DVT BUT if you are willing to risk bricking your G1 to find out, that would be great Reboot in fastboot and make sure it says "DREA100 PVT"
First of all what the hell is a PVT board? And what the hell is fastboot??? UHh wait I have to do another search on this stupid PVT board and this stupid fastboot. Searching…..
Searched for fastboot here is what came up:
http://www.google.com/cse?cx=000825...boot+&sa=Search&cof=FORID:0&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
After clicking several search results there is not one single post that defines exactly what fastboot is or specifically what it does.
Searching for PVT Board……
And the results were: http://www.google.com/custom?hl=en&...G=Search&cx=000825531964825142534:cqr2sjirilw
Not one single related post that clearly states what a PVT Board really is. Okay that’s out the window, maybe I can figure it out by reading how people are talking about it. Fun stuff. Unable to decypther what the hell people are talking about, NEXT search!
Okay now I want to find out what the hell a nandroid backup is.
Searching Nandroid…
Wow First success!! First result takes me to this post: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=459830
Oh no not again more words to search!!
Okay I see two strange words I do not know Busybox (wtf?) and adbd.
Searching Busybox….
http://www.google.com/cse?cx=000825...sybox&sa=Search&cof=FORID:0&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8
Results are not clear, just links me to some posts that have some RC30 release (is the RC30 busybox? That is still not clear. Other results refer to it as some kind of back up tool, I thought the nandroid was a backup tool? SO that goes out the door Next search adbd….
Searching adbd..... Nothing that directly defines what exactly adbd is, all I got was people talking about it but never directly referencing exactly what it is ( ex: “need some questions answered about adbd and debuggerd Dream android development.” Or “restarting adbd as root”) Maybe it stands for a dumb big day? God knows.
Okay back to the original Nandroid post because its really important that a noob does a back up just incase right?………
I decided to go ahead and proceed without knowing what those two words were (of course I’ll get yelled at by everyone for not searching if I make a post asking what they meant so no point in posting).
Oh this is probably my favorite part of the post!!!
LOL the easy part!!!-* How to use this (the easy part)
And below it is this sentence:
“Just boot your phone in recovery mode with the correct recovery.img (one that has adb shell as root + busybox installed with symlinks to tar, md5sum etc) and connect it to your pc/laptop/server. Then run the nandroid.sh script. If something is wrong or missing, it will tell you. “
So lets break down this sentince (as a noob) line by line.
1st line: Just boot your phone in recovery mode with the correct recovery.img
Recovery mode? I think that is the pressing of the HOME+END key or is it the END+CAM keys? Which do you mean????? My guess is the HOME+END.
2nd line: (one that has adb shell as root + busybox installed with symlinks to tar, md5sum etc) WOA dude what planet you on?!! This entire line makes no freakin sense to me. And I do not think searching will help us there. “one that has adb shell as root” WTF is the one that has adb shell???? And wtf is adb??? And symlinks to tar? Is that encrypted language for his secret lover to find him? Geez how is anyone supposed to learn by searching stuff like this?? Okay at this point im just about to give up on this whole damn back up and just live without it, next line….
3rd line: Then run the nandroid.sh script. If something is wrong or missing, it will tell you.
Umm HOW? How do I run the nandroid.sh script and on WHAT operating system? Mac, Windows, Linux??? The only thing wrong or missing is proper Instructions and good English course!!!
If you are going to post a tutorial please don’t assume that everyone knows what your talking about and skip over steps that you think are elementary when in-fact you will discover that sometimes not everyone knows what you are talking about.
BTW I found this tutorial here (where supposedly 95% of my questions are answered….. umm sure): http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=519523
Isnt this article supposedly posted to be in the pre-reading material before a noob posts questions?
This is not the only article that I found not to be noob friendly, in-fact I found very little articles that were noob friendly, here is yet another thread that I found to be rediculy confusing: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=512453
When I first went to this thread (before knowing what WIPE meant) I was like WTF is this guy crazy. Then he goes on to talk about some crazy loop (which he does not state how or where you get this mysterious loop) then he goes and pasts some code that god knows where the hell your supposed to paste it, on the phone in the command prompt or is it only in the mac????
There are soo many more threads like the ones above. It is no wonder why noobs post the same questions over and over again, its because people assume that everyone else knows what their talking about and skip what they think are useless 2 or 3 steps, well I got news for you buddy, those silly 2 or 3 steps are probably the most important steps to beginner. I am still fairly new to this forum and still am having trouble figuring out what people are talking about. I just wish that there were some kind of rules or guidelines when writing instructions or how-to guides. The ONLY guide on this entire forum that I found to be clearly written and total noob proof is this thread here:http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=502010 Everyone should take a few pointers from this person that wrote that thread, although he never stated the purpose of it at the start but that’s minor.
Sorry if I offended anyone but this is the ugly truth for us noobs, it really is hard when your first starting out and some one bashes you for asking a question that’s been asked before or the noob didn’t search. Well the search feature is not exactly that great and you almost always do not find the answer to that one noob question. And yes I am very grateful for all these great hacks and I am just posting this just out of frustration from having to constantly search and after having spent hours searching and searching. I am almost certain that I am not the only noob with this problem.
My next journey is Themes my G1 phone (God help me).
Thanks,
Abe
well the essential problem is that there will always be more noobs than not...no matter how many tutorials and guides that are posted it still will not be enough for some noobs...i did not know what i was doing myself but you first you have to understand what you are reading. so after a while after reading and searching the internet i understand what i am doing and am continuing to learn...this place was not meant to be a place for exacting directions and tutorials (ala development for Dummies)...
And i do not mean anything as an insult...i am just trying to explain that this is not an organized affair with a specific hierarchy, it is a community of developers experimenting and passing that knowledge off to others in the community.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=519523
that link is from the first or second thread on the development section...reading through those will give you a lot of the answers your looking for....
and to be honest if you do not have a clue as to what the stuff your reading is then research the internet...otherwise you definitely should not attempt any of this stuff.
All I will say Is I managed to root my phone by reading multiple threads.
I actually started reading threads before I got my phone . It was confusing but thats why I kept reading . If i didnt understand something I would read over and over again. As far as finding out what busybox was I used regular old google search for that . Heres what i found based on that search.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BusyBox.
I have learned to not soley rely on the in forum search because it doesnt always seem that helpful. I think overall what the vets what is for the "noobs" to help themselves first before having someone hold their hand.
It is pretty ironic that you bought a phone featuring Google search and now want to hack it, and instead of taking time to actually learn searching techniques you write a page long rant on your incapability to do some simple research. If you cannot figure out what some of these basic terms mean, then you shouldn't be hacking your phone in the first place.
Also, what in the hell are you talking about? You say that we are asking you to search first, hello? You only have ONE post in our community, you haven't asked us ANYTHING.
Honestly, this forum is already very organized. Granted, you are a noob, but really, it isn't all that difficult. If there is something you just really can't figure out, ask it now, I would be happy to answer it for you.
SolemnWishing said:
It is pretty ironic that you bought a phone featuring Google search and now want to hack it, and instead of taking time to actually learn searching techniques you write a page long rant on your incapability to do some simple research. If you cannot figure out what some of these basic terms mean, then you shouldn't be hacking your phone in the first place.
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Take it easy, man. What's basic for one person may be quantum theory for another. Everyone isn't the same-we all perceive and learn differently. The noobs are tired of senior members telling them to search, and the senior members are tired of noobs asking redundant questions.
Also, what in the hell are you talking about? You say that we are asking you to search first, hello? You only have ONE post in our community, you haven't asked us ANYTHING.
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I think he means other noobs have been told to search when asking a question...
Anyway, OP:
the forums are huge and contain a boatload of information. If you don't understand a tutorial or certain terms, ASK. PM the OP of the tutorial or someone in the thread that sounds like they know what they are saying. Follow devs on twitter, and read extensively. Get involved.
You have to understand that there have been hundreds of noobs that only come here to ask "OMG HOW DO I ROOT??" without wanting to understand ANY underlying details. They get caught in a bootloop, get errors, or brick their phone because they don't follow directions and they want to hold devs responsible.
These people want the easy way out, so don't be surprised if senior members and devs here are hesitant in replying to a thread that has been started countless times before. Also, every one here has a life (almost everyone ), so they may not always be available 24/7 to answer unimportant (to them) questions.
I've been with this forum for little over a year now and search function may not be the best but does help a lot. I've started out with the dash, mda, tilt and now the g1. i've just been recently been posting because everything everyone does here is great. I still consider myself a noob and still learning. Ranting like this doesn't really help, spoon feeding noobs gets tiresome and i can see why the seniors gets frustrated. All you need is the patients to read thru the posts and not get blown away with all the lingo and information overload that gets yourself more confused.
This is a community built by the community no one expects to get payed for helping out, so be thankful for what this forum bring. [/rant]
I don't see whats hard about this forum.
I just followed the guides and I was set.
This is a DEVELOPER forum, so I expect it will be a little difficult to use
You don't take physics before taking elementary school math.
That's the way I look at.
But I partially share your thoughts.
I am the first to agree that a search button or Google are your best friends.
What makes a successful search, though, is your choice or keywords or phrases. And I've run into those times that had I known the proper combination of terms to use (one's that would weed-out the bizillion of results that don't relate), I would have easily found the proper answer. I've gotten buried in search results that lead to endless threads only to find out that the Google search I did for "Android Bluetooth Cupcake" might have been better had I narrowed it further with "Android Bluetooth +"File Transfer" +application". That was probably a poor example, but you know what I mean. Searching for broad and common terms usually turns up useless results, we give up in disgust, and that's when some of the redundant posts get made. I also continue to have trouble decided whether a post belongs in the "Dream" forum or the developer forum. And we won't even go into whether they belong in the developer forum, app forum or theme forum. To me, they all cross similar boundaries at times.
There are lots of other forums that are intended for end-users with technical questions. They break things down in easier to understand terms (at least for me). Most of them link to XDA for the downloads, but they offer support on their own forums. I frequent XDA the most, but I still haunt the ubber-newbie sites as well. I still learn from them.
One last thing... It's been said that the internet is akind to the wild, wild west. Forums and mailing lists are usually the worst. If there wasn't some type of moderation/control over XDA, there would be telling how deep we would have to wade to find one meaningful post. I'm as guilty as the next person of wanting immediate answers when I think I've ruined a $400 phone. Luckily, I think the rescue tutorials here are fairly good at outlining the needed steps. No, they may not explain what's happening with each step along the way... but they do give you the necessary steps to get you out a bind. If you'll remain calm, follow the steps, not expect your hand to be held during the process, and only resort to asking for help when all else fails, you'll probably get your phone working the way you want it AND learn along the way. It's the equivalent of junior high vs a college or university. Once you make a conscious choice to go beyond what's required, you're expected to do a lot of the work yourself without the teacher constantly having to offer a refresher course on the basics.
Just my opinion.
Damn double post
Hi!
I was just wondering if anyone would like to point me and others in the direction of some other useful threads to check out that relate to our Hero. (Not Superman, he's still GSM only)
For example, I've wondered if any subforums other than Hero CDMA in the HTC Hero Forums here on XDA have any useful info or downloads that are relevant. Also, I've been wondering the same thing about the general Android forums here on XDA.
I keep a CDMA Hero bookmark button on top of Firefox, but does anyone have any good suggestions of other sites or subforums/threads that I can add along with it and check about as much as I check Facebook, Gmail and Plentyoffish? Hahaha
The thread list is up at the top.. Under search..
Have fun with it..
http://geekfor.me/
http://forum.androidcentral.com/htc-hero/
http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=519
these are my bookmarks on this install, i have a ton more on my other computer but can't remember them now, these are the ones i've used this week
There is plenty to read and learn both in the G2 section, and in the wider general Android forum. I highly recommend checking it out.
Haha, yeah, thanks. I was about to say thanks, ****, but I saw you're joking so it's cool.
Before anyone tries to use the old "google it" line on me, let me say, yeah - I've googled it before. I know several good sites to check out other than XDA, like android central and so on.
I'm just wondering what other people check religiously like I check this subforum.
I'm also mainly curious to know if there's even any point reading through stuff on in the GSM Hero subforums. It's so lame that we only get one lousy little subforum! There's bound to be a wealth of knowledge, downloads, etc. in the GSM subforums, but I just don't want to waste my time or learn harmful/useless things.
By the way, if I could soapbox for a minute (and this has nothing to do with the post above this one, lol), I've noticed a lot of rudeness in the CDMA Hero posts, and it's a shame.
Of course it gets annoying to see people begging for help with common issues that have been addressed a hundred times. No one denies that, but it's just something that will always be there. Unless there is a quiz on the basics of flashing ROMs and using a device before one can make posts on here, it's always going to happen. Getting annoyed with this is understandable.
However, I've noticed other types of threads posted, which while a bit annoying because we've seen the same thing over and over, really don't deserve the rudeness that they get. Who cares if there are 50 threads on here where people ask what other people prefer to use as a daily ROM, or what their home screen looks like? Does anyone lose any money or time over this? Is there a thread limit here? No. This is a community of people who have the same device and who all want to get the best out of their devices. If a thread is pointless, it will be buried quickly when no one posts in it, and the more popular threads will remain on the first page. A pointless thread will continue to stay on the first page though, when someone takes the time to make a rude post!
Anyway, sorry to rant on and on about it, but it would really be great to see the CDMA Hero community work together a little better and be a little less anal. This is probably the number one site that people with our phone check to learn more and update and generally get more out of the Hero experience. Instead of scaring people away from making new threads and posts to ask people what they like and why they like it, we should really try to encourage this. The more we all come together and explore things together (regardless of how repetitive and in some opinions possibly even trivial some of these things may be), the more we grow as a whole, and I am sure that this kind of atmosphere will encourage more people to make more and more interesting contributions.
The beauty of Android and of XDA Developers Forums is that they were both created with the goal of people coming together and developing, creating, tweaking, designing, and discussing. Before the Hero, I was permanently glued to a Dell Axim x51v, and between these forums and HTCGeeks, and a friendly and open community of users and developers, we've taken the device FAR beyond anything that anyone could have dreamed it could get to when it was made, what, 5 years ago?
thedudejdog said:
http://geekfor.me/
http://forum.androidcentral.com/htc-hero/
http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=519
these are my bookmarks on this install, i have a ton more on my other computer but can't remember them now, these are the ones i've used this week
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Thanks a lot, I'm going to add these into a "Hero" bookmarks folder!
tejasrichard said:
There is plenty to read and learn both in the G2 section, and in the wider general Android forum. I highly recommend checking it out.
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Thanks for the info!
GSM Hero Themes/Apps Thread
Curious - is this thread useful at all to us, or will any themes and apps be useless since we're CDMA?
I already know (I think) that GSM themes won't work because they're probably designed for GSM ROMs, so all kinds of things won't be compatible. (Like trying to use a 1.5 theme on a 2.1 ROM)
Are things like widgets and clocks ROM and/or device specific? I'm on a widget hunt.
I'm new to using Helix and I'd love to find some widgets that compare to the awesome Sense widgets, particularly Sense's beautiful Messaging, Mail, Music, and Friendstream widgets.
raynda said:
However, I've noticed other types of threads posted, which while a bit annoying because we've seen the same thing over and over, really don't deserve the rudeness that they get. Who cares if there are 50 threads on here where people ask what other people prefer to use as a daily ROM, or what their home screen looks like? Does anyone lose any money or time over this? Is there a thread limit here? No. This is a community of people who have the same device and who all want to get the best out of their devices. If a thread is pointless, it will be buried quickly when no one posts in it, and the more popular threads will remain on the first page. A pointless thread will continue to stay on the first page though, when someone takes the time to make a rude post!
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It's not that we care that there is a hundred threads that say the same thing, its that if there are 100 threads of the same topic, it in effect, makes our forum usage a terror, because navigation is almost doomed from the beginning in that situation..
And it is not going to be something that is always there, because with mods actually modding these threads on other forums that I frequent daily, *they are virtually non-existant...
For the "noob" users, they cannot find these answers efficiently because the forum is blasted with the same thing over and over... With different answers in each thread..
The only way to make the "noob's" life easier, is to format the forum in a efficient and knowledge ready way...
Which by letting noob's overrun your forum, is not possible... We are hateful because you are feeding an endless chain of questions, when it could be handled in a much more effective way, if it wasn't for people flaming people who are actually looking out for the forum....
raynda said:
By the way, if I could soapbox for a minute (and this has nothing to do with the post above this one, lol), I've noticed a lot of rudeness in the CDMA Hero posts, and it's a shame.
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Yeah, it's kinda bad here... It's like that on pretty much any technical forum, but things are really over the top on this one.
It's to the point now that when I do have a question I feel like I need to devote one short paragraph to asking the question, then tack on 5 more long paragraphs explaining that I already DID search, came up empty handed, searched again, explain which keywords I searched on, etc....
Surely there's a happy medium that can be found...
azyouthinkeyeiz said:
We are hateful because you are feeding an endless chain of questions, when it could be handled in a much more effective way, if it wasn't for people flaming people who are actually looking out for the forum....
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Hey, I'm not trying to come off defensive to you in this reply because I appreciate your posts on here, but are you saying that I personally am feeding an endless chain of questions?
Also, maybe I'm wrong, but I think that the problem may be in people looking out for the forum too much, when the point of this whole XDA Developers Forum thing should be to look out for the fellow user. Like I said though, I may be wrong.
And I don't mean that it's perfectly cool to have hundreds of the same thread in here, I agree that is useless clutter. I just think that some threads that get posted do have potential for the good of the community, but they get squashed quickly by posters with bad attitudes, and then the OP in that thread and others who have the same thoughts and questions become too embarrassed or insulted/offended to post again. When that happens, someone who may have eventually provided something amazing to the community will either never get to that point, or will get there and just won't post it here because of the bad experience.
I'm sure that there are all kinds of amazing things that people have tweaked, developed, designed, and created, but they're never going to be publicly released for one reason or another. Let's not let the reason be that they were treated like they were stupid when they were finding their way on these forums.
subliminalurge said:
Yeah, it's kinda bad here... It's like that on pretty much any technical forum, but things are really over the top on this one.
It's to the point now that when I do have a question I feel like I need to devote one short paragraph to asking the question, then tack on 5 more long paragraphs explaining that I already DID search, came up empty handed, searched again, explain which keywords I searched on, etc....
Surely there's a happy medium that can be found...
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That's exactly what I'm talking about. People will get to the point that they just won't post anything when they have an idea or a question because there's no happy medium. And the worse it gets, the less progress we make as a whole.
raynda said:
Hey, I'm not trying to come off defensive to you in this reply because I appreciate your posts on here, but are you saying that I personally am feeding an endless chain of questions?
Also, maybe I'm wrong, but I think that the problem may be in people looking out for the forum too much, when the point of this whole XDA Developers Forum thing should be to look out for the fellow user. Like I said though, I may be wrong.
And I don't mean that it's perfectly cool to have hundreds of the same thread in here, I agree that is useless clutter. I just think that some threads that get posted do have potential for the good of the community, but they get squashed quickly by posters with bad attitudes, and then the OP in that thread and others who have the same thoughts and questions become too embarrassed or insulted/offended to post again. When that happens, someone who may have eventually provided something amazing to the community will either never get to that point, or will get there and just won't post it here because of the bad experience.
I'm sure that there are all kinds of amazing things that people have tweaked, developed, designed, and created, but they're never going to be publicly released for one reason or another. Let's not let the reason be that they were treated like they were stupid when they were finding their way on these forums.
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No not you specifically. Sorry that was an analogous "you".. And I totally agree.. But 95% of the ones get shot down immediately, deserve it, even though you might not think so, from the people with answers, you will know almost immediately if it merits further investigation. Wishful-thinking and impossible sometimes walk a very narrow line. Developers and end-users have entirely different mindsets.. That's never going to change.. But the end-users should have a more thorough understanding of what it is we do for you and *developers should be more compassionate "for the most part (there are alot of caring devs)..
Where this sub-forum was destroyed, was giving it sub-forum status and not its own separate forum, like every other HTC device.. Then, we would get a development sub-forum, themes forum, etc. The development is different than the GSM Hero, so why doesn't it deserve its own?
You will see, that with honest concerns and problems, I will go to the end of the world for you...
But, if you want something from me, (effort to help you) you must at least show some sort of effort to solve the issue, besides "NEW TOPIC< IS MY PHONE BRICKED?"
azyouthinkeyeiz said:
You will see, that with honest concerns and problems, I will go to the end of the world for you...
But, if you want something from me, (effort to help you) you must at least show some sort of effort to solve the issue, besides "NEW TOPIC< IS MY PHONE BRICKED?"
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I can definitely see your point.
But this is where the happy medium needs to be found. I know I'm the exception rather than the rule on this point, but by the time I post asking for help, it's safe to say I've spent at least one day each both trying to figure out an answer on my own (and I'm fairly capable), and searching this forum, other forums, and google to see if anyone else has had and solved the same problem.
That's effort that isn't seen, but it's extremely frustrating to feel obligated to explain it all in detail in exchange for the privilege of asking a question.
Now, don't take this post the wrong way. There's absolutely nothing wrong with expecting people to do a little digging on their own before they come crying for help.
I just think this forum (as a whole, not you specifically) has gone a bit over the top with how much "proof" of that digging is required before someone can feel comfortable asking their question.
(And I'm not really even complaining, just offering my observations on a topic that was already brought up for discussion....)
I get very sarcastic... But only because I think sarcasm is funny...
And you really don't have to explain it yourself *in every post.. Because most of us with a thorough background, can tell how much effort you put in, just by your question... (edit* Yourself is again analogous, not you)
For Example, the 2.1 thread this morning...
I opened it up, thinking to myself "Not again"...
But when I read and see that it was actually about A2DP, mindset about the thread changes, and I go into help mode... That invoked thought and development just from that post..
Now if I had opened it up, and it was a brand new "Can I change back to a rooted rom after the OTA update" question... I would have went into sarcasm mode... And I don't want to help that guy be lazy.. Why should we give him the benefit of spouting off verbatim what has been answered 1000 times before, just because he can't take the 20 mins to peruse over a couple threads??
I am all about the education of every single member of this forum, into all of the ways of Android... But its like what my papaw used to tell me, "You get what you put in."
And to ray...
Download GMOB chat, from the market...
Go to the rooted users chat, and there is usually alot of good info there, you just have to sort of wade through some of it, since you only get to see like the 50 most recent posts.. So it takes a little more effort to find anything... Also the apps room is pretty cool...
I have found technorati.com is getting alot better...
androidfreeware.com is good for apps.
OK, now to take the completely opposite side....
I was just reading another topic and in 5 minutes I saw 3 different questions posted that had been answered ON THAT SAME PAGE!!!
The proper profanity has not yet been invented to describe people like that.
See subliminal...
It's not that I don't wanna see those questions asked, I just want people to understand the nature of a forum, and alot* here do not...
If people read, before they start looking for answers, we would be alot better..
The issue is, that all of these people look to have a very limited understanding of Android, and just want a phone to use.. And this is not the forum for those.. Android-central, sprintusers.com, etc are more appropriate..
This forum is for development, not for chatting about the evo, or why your 1.5 is better than 2.1.. or how android is the iphone killer..
This forum is to bring ideas to our platform, and to build upon them... And to release mods and hacks..
Not for people to rant about how sprint sucks, and I want a nexus one..
Or to rant about how developers are stealing our donations....
It is to make our phone better, and with people feeding this nonsense, we are hindering the forum from where it should be...
azyouthinkeyeiz said:
Not for people to rant about how sprint sucks, and I want a nexus one..
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But what if Sprint sucks, the Nexus One is a POS...
AND....
Why can't I get a Nexus One on Sprint?
(I really do understand both sides of the issue. I just kinda agree that some on this forum are a bit quick on the draw with the "Use the search you ****in' noob!" gun....)
azyouthinkeyeiz said:
And to ray...
Download GMOB chat, from the market...
Go to the rooted users chat, and there is usually alot of good info there, you just have to sort of wade through some of it, since you only get to see like the 50 most recent posts.. So it takes a little more effort to find anything... Also the apps room is pretty cool...
I have found technorati.com is getting alot better...
androidfreeware.com is good for apps.
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Hey thanks, I'll check that out! By the way, after thinking about it today and catching up on this thread's replies, I think we're thinking on the same page.
It would be handy, I think, if we could get some extremely well written and dummy-proof How-To's stickied for the main page. I know there is already a sticky wicky for guides, but I remember still being a bit lost even having read them when I was new to the Hero. I wrote some extremely detailed step by step how-to's for the x51v over at htcgeeks, and though it might be my own vanity speaking, I think that it slowed down the constant repetitive questions. I'd volunteer to help out with this if we could get some Mod help to reorganize the stickies. I think we should have individual ones for...
- How To Setup an SD Card for A2SD
- How To Install Recovery and How To Use It (Nandroids, what they are, wipes, which ones to use for what, Fix UID's explanation, etc.)
- How To Flash a Custom ROM
- How To Flash a Custom Theme
- Troubleshooting PC Sync Issues
- How To Setup and Use ADB Shell with a list of ADB functions
I know we have this stuff now, but I remember it took a while to find all the info I needed to learn all these things when I was new to the Hero, and the current Guides sticky wasn't as helpful as it could have been. And I'm a pretty resourceful and intelligent guy who can search, read, and follow instructions! (Or at least I like to think so, lol)
Oh, and to make a preventative strike against hundreds of future bug reports on new ROMs, giant bold text on every page of every thread that says "WIPE DATA, DALVIK CACHE, AND SD EXT BEFORE FLASHING A DIFFERENT ROM!!!
Now I'm fully aware of my n00b status, and will not deny it at all, however last night when I was in the midst of my ROM installation fiasco (worked out well in the end!) I thought of something that might be pretty useful when doing all this flashing back to stock in order to load a custom rom...(and then messing up the custom rom, then loading backup, then messing that up, then almost bricking, then freaking out over possible brick, then figuring out how to really use ODIN3, then starting stock, lol....the past 12 hours has been a serious learning experience, but fun now that it's done)
The process I followed to install the Cognition ROM involved taking my bone stock captivate and rooting it, then installing ROM Manager, then backup, etc....Here's my suggestion, take it for what it's worth, and if I'm overstepping my boundaries, try to be nice about letting me know
I've noticed that there are many root "packages" where it installs root, and lagfixes, and a ton of other stuff, but (and maybe I haven't looked hard enough, but I've looked...) I noticed there isn't just a root "package" that ONLY roots the phone and installs ROM Manager only...this is my suggestion- make one! Maybe include Titanium backup, but since I was a bone stock Captivate, I didn't really have too much invested in apps, since I knew I was going to be going back and forth, and I intend on keeping it that way for a while, since I am still learning. But yeah- Root, ROM Manager, and Titanium Backup package would pretty much be the sh*t!
Now, I know I haven't contributed a damn thing to this forum, but this seems like it would be a handy tool to have, and while it's benefits are marginal (you save the whole 3 or 4 minutes to go to the market and install these apps) it makes life a little easier in a world where life isn't always easy (as I found out last night/this morning
If something like this exists already, forgive me for my ignorance and please point me in the right direction. I'm not trying to step on any toes or offend anyone, I just think this would be handy to have, and judging from the knowledge floating around this forum, it *seems* like it would be something fairly elementary for some of you extremely knowledgeable folks to do..
My apologies for such a long-winded post, but I tend to be that way, and again...thanks to all on this forum for a treasure trove of information to read through and slowly acquaint myself with the Android OS...It's hella better than the 3gs Iphone I previously had.......
Welcome aboard. I will say this first, post in the proper area of the forum, this belongs in the general discussion area, for future reference, this is the developement forum.
There are one click root methods, there are other packages that remove AT&T bloat and toss in a few other goodies. A word of caution, read, read, read, learn as much as you can from all of our mistakes before you go making the same ones. You should read an entire thread before jumping ahead and flashing, that way you avoid fiascos and possible brick your phone. Read all of the stickies at the top of the page, then browse all of the topics discussed, usually if you read an entire thread your questions will be answered in it. If you run into trouble and need help you will find it here. Happy hunting!
Root: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=739304
ROM Manager and Titanium: Get them from the market.
Rhiannon224 said:
Welcome aboard. I will say this first, post in the proper area of the forum, this belongs in the general discussion area, for future reference, this is the developement forum.
There are one click root methods, there are other packages that remove AT&T bloat and toss in a few other goodies. A word of caution, read, read, read, learn as much as you can from all of our mistakes before you go making the same ones. You should read an entire thread before jumping ahead and flashing, that way you avoid fiascos and possible brick your phone. Read all of the stickies at the top of the page, then browse all of the topics discussed, usually if you read an entire thread your questions will be answered in it. If you run into trouble and need help you will find it here. Happy hunting!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 to this and yes there is indeed a one-click root already (as bare as you can get). installing ROM manager and titanium can be your job after that (how hard is that? takes like 5 seconds). and yes, read! reading is your friend! read read read read and then when you feel like you've learned everything you can, read more because you still haven't figured it all out. and again, because this doesn't provide anything NEW or unique to Android running on the Samsung Captivate, please keep it to General.
Thanks and enjoy your phone
Rhiannon224 said:
Welcome aboard. I will say this first, post in the proper area of the forum, this belongs in the general discussion area, for future reference, this is the developement forum.
There are one click root methods, there are other packages that remove AT&T bloat and toss in a few other goodies. A word of caution, read, read, read, learn as much as you can from all of our mistakes before you go making the same ones. You should read an entire thread before jumping ahead and flashing, that way you avoid fiascos and possible brick your phone. Read all of the stickies at the top of the page, then browse all of the topics discussed, usually if you read an entire thread your questions will be answered in it. If you run into trouble and need help you will find it here. Happy hunting!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cool. I will be sure to post correctly next time. Maybe a mod can move this thread.
As far as reading, that's all I've been doing for the past 2 months (hence, my low post count...didn't want to post when an answer is around the corner) Coming from the Iphone, this is a whole new monster, and all the reading I've done has benefited me infinitely
pyrplhaze said:
Cool. I will be sure to post correctly next time. Maybe a mod can move this thread.
As far as reading, that's all I've been doing for the past 2 months (hence, my low post count...didn't want to post when an answer is around the corner) Coming from the Iphone, this is a whole new monster, and all the reading I've done has benefited me infinitely
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Enjoy your phone, I love mine, I'm a noob too and I spend hours everyday studying these forums. Everyone on here is very helpfull, I use Designgears stuff and love it. His new ROM is amazing it will make your phone fly. My phone has never worked like this, my battery life has improved drastically since flashing this ROM last night. Here's a link to the thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=786532
Rhiannon224 said:
Enjoy your phone, I love mine, I'm a noob too and I spend hours everyday studying these forums. Everyone on here is very helpfull, I use Designgears stuff and love it. His new ROM is amazing it will make your phone fly. My phone has never worked like this, my battery life has improved drastically since flashing this ROM last night. Here's a link to the thread http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=786532
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but she needs to show it off in her signature... =)
techmik67 said:
Yes, but she needs to show it off in her signature... =)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was enjoying it so much I forgot to update my signature. I've been hanging out here trying to help answer some questions, thanks for catching that.
Hey all, new to the android phones... have my self a desire z with bell, looking for the best over all root out there, someone suggested i check out this site as they probably have some optimized setups already...
any suggestions for the phone would be amazing
Cheers
Next time, before you post and add to the clutter in these forums, take ONE MINUTE and SEARCH or READ some threads.
There are numerous guides in Android Development that walk you through the root process step by step.
kneedraggin101 said:
Hey all, new to the android phones... have my self a desire z with bell, looking for the best over all root out there, someone suggested i check out this site as they probably have some optimized setups already...
any suggestions for the phone would be amazing
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
gbarayah said:
Next time, before you post and add to the clutter in these forums, take ONE MINUTE and SEARCH or READ some threads.
There are numerous guides in Android Development that walk you through the root process step by step.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Like gbarayah said all you need to do is use the search button next time, but since this is your first post I'll skip the flaming and point you in the right direction, there are three ways to root your HTC Vision but the safest and most reliable way is to temp root with Rage + Perm root with Gfree, the instructions to do this can be found HERE on the XDA Wiki for the Vision.
i did look, and there is 30 pages of ppl talking about this one or that one or this that this that, and on the phone its a big pita.....
so its not clutter, im asking for a no bs answer to which is the best for a phone to which i use and enjoy the sense ui it has...
also since im new, i figured it would be a nice way to have ppl explain to me what i need to know, with the ability to ask questions and have them answered in MY OWN WAY, vs reading what others have said
thnx for the snotty reply tho ( to the first post)
kneedraggin101 said:
i did look, and there is 30 pages of ppl talking about this one or that one or this that this that, and on the phone its a big pita.....
so its not clutter, im asking for a no bs answer to which is the best for a phone to which i use and enjoy the sense ui it has...
also since im new, i figured it would be a nice way to have ppl explain to me what i need to know, with the ability to ask questions and have them answered in MY OWN WAY, vs reading what others have said
thnx for the snotty reply tho
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
People are explaining what you need to know, Please refer to the XDA forum rules HERE and look at rule number one. Please don't be too sensitive here, its just there are so many redundant thread in this forum on the same thing.
so your telling me, that when someone is NEW to something, and has ZERO idea on what most of that stuff means in the link provided above, that im not permitted to ask about which ppl suggest, and how to go about making it happen??
wow good to know
kneedraggin101 said:
so your telling me, that when someone is NEW to something, and has ZERO idea on what most of that stuff means in the link provided above, that im not permitted to ask about which ppl suggest, and how to go about making it happen??
wow good to know
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What I am telling you is that I have read the majority of threads in this forum and what you asked has been asked at least 50+ times, thats what I mean, If your having an issue with rooting and have searched for an awnser to your problem and can't find an awnser by all means, please post a new thread but I can guarantee all the problems people have ran into with rooting have been solved and the solutions posted. Like I said don't be so sensitive and over dramatic.
kneedraggin101 said:
Hey all, new to the android phones... have my self a desire z with bell, looking for the best over all root out there, someone suggested i check out this site as they probably have some optimized setups already...
any suggestions for the phone would be amazing
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand how confusing it can be, trying to sift through a ton of threads and posts, reading lingo, terms, and abbreviations that you don't understand. It's like trying to learn something new and the instructions are written in another language.
I can also understand how frustrating it can be to KNOW all this information and have the same basic questions asked all the time when the information is easily available.
You should start by reading THIS, it is an over view of the phone, some step by steps, and links. It will get you started. Also HERE, and HERE.
Personally, I would play with your new phone for a while first. Get used to Android in general, and get to understand your phone. While you are doing that, read those links and then start reading some other threads in the forums. Get hands on first, then start to look deeper into rooting and modifying. The G2/Desire Z is already a great phone. Jumping right into rooting when you are still new to Android is like buying a brand new Mustang and wanting to start modifying it before you ever really drive it. But that's just my opinion. I started with the G1 when it first came out, moved onto the Slide, and now the G2. I didn't root my G1 until after a year when it was pretty much announced that they weren't going to upgrade it. Then the Slide when I got my G2, and I haven't even rooted my G2 yet......I'm still waiting to see the official 2.3 upgrade until I decide to root.
Just be patient, read as much as you can and it will all start to make sense. Play with the phone for a while, THEN decide if you want to take on rooting. It's not the easiest thing in the world to do, but there are plenty of step by step's out there. Good luck.
kneedraggin101 said:
so your telling me, that when someone is NEW to something, and has ZERO idea on what most of that stuff means in the link provided above, that im not permitted to ask about which ppl suggest, and how to go about making it happen??
wow good to know
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I apologize for the 'snotty' remarks above, but over the past few months there has been a significant increase in the number of redundant threads opened on these forums. It makes them cluttered and frustrates many users, myself included.
Referring to your post above, think about how many threads would be opened if every new member of the community who was new to Android started their own thread on how to root.
99.5% of the questions that people ask when they are 'new' to Android have already been answered somewhere else. Most of the time, a search and some reading will lead you in the right direction.
I would be more understanding if you had read the wiki or some of the other guides but based on the question you asked in your first post, it didn't appear that you had made the slightest effort to do so. The threads can be a bit overwhelming when you are new, but like someone said earlier, rooting isn't something you should jump straight into if you are not comfortable with your device.
This community is very helpful but make sure you follow the FORUM RULES and do some research before starting your own thread. If you have questions about a specific step in the rooting process, there are other threads that are already open where your question should go.
well ok, so let me ask you this,, i used the method mentioned here
hxxp://theunlockr.com/2010/11/15/universal-android-rooting-method-visionary-method/
and it shows i still have SU permission... but everytime my phone re starts, it opens visionary and says rooting phone...
but the thing is, my phone is snail slow now... and when i go back to the main screen, it takes forever and says loading... then my normal screen shows up... its also taking forever to do simple things, such as open text msg's
any suggestions on this problem?
That's temp rooting, and isn't the same thing as modifying the phone, giving you true root and installing a custom ROM. It's basically just allowing you root access to run SU and other apps that require root access.
I personally think it's great for those who want to use some apps that require root, like "Shoot Me". But it's not true root. I used it on my G2 and found the same things you found, that it slows the phone down. I figure it's because the reason rooted phones are normally faster than original is because of the custom ROMs that you install. It really has nothing to do with root itself, rooting just allows you to run a custom ROM. And it's the ROM that makes the phone faster, usually due to less things running in the background and overclocking the processor.
I still have VISIONary on mine, but I don't have it set to temp root on startup, I only run it if I want to use an app that requires root.
it shows on visionary that you can do a perm root via the software, and i did that, so when the phone restarts, it still shows i have su....
so are you telling me that if i unclick temp root and restart my phone it should be better??
basically i just want to keep the stock rom, or find a better one that still uses sense, as its super usefull for me.... i just wanted to root, so i can use the cpu thing to speed up the phone and scale it down when its in my pocket etc....
so i need help, i ran a stock bencmark and i got almost 1500, now im gettin 1000... which seems to be a huge diff and thats all ive changed was rooting the phone...
suggestions on a great sense rom then?
You are very luck you didn't brick your phone running visionary perm root. Don't try that again, you might not be so lucky ^_^
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 running Cyanogenmod.
kneedraggin101 said:
it shows on visionary that you can do a perm root via the software, and i did that, so when the phone restarts, it still shows i have su....
so are you telling me that if i unclick temp root and restart my phone it should be better??
basically i just want to keep the stock rom, or find a better one that still uses sense, as its super usefull for me.... i just wanted to root, so i can use the cpu thing to speed up the phone and scale it down when its in my pocket etc....
so i need help, i ran a stock bencmark and i got almost 1500, now im gettin 1000... which seems to be a huge diff and thats all ive changed was rooting the phone...
suggestions on a great sense rom then?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
PermaRoot and TempRoot via VISIONary gives you root access, but it is not the same as rooting and running a custom ROM. Like I said before, the key in making the phone faster is not having root access. Having the phone run faster is all in the ROM you are running. Rooting is just the first step in loading a custom ROM.
I personally have not run any custom ROMs on my G2 yet, because I find that the stock 2.2 runs very fast as it is. However, I find that cm7 on the Slide runs very fast and works great, even though it is still considered an experimental rom. You could run the latest CM6 stable version.
I am personally waiting for the official 2.3 to come out for the G2 before loading a custom ROM, just because I don't see the need to run one yet. The phone runs very fast out of the box.
Let me ask, what are you trying to get out of rooting?
i was just looking to have the ability to speed up the phone a lil bit, have some scaling, since the battery life is horrible, and if there was a nice optimized sense rom out, id look into that...
Hi Developers,
You folks all do a great job of trying to sort out install issues and confusion regarding vendor images for our devices and whatnot and we less inclined to develop really do appreciate all you put into it for the rest of us.
That being said, one thing that I personally think should be included in the ROM's initial posting is a link to the **LINK---> FACTORY IMAGES<---KNIL** for our device.
I know that you all have the link memorized and every flavor imaginable already downloaded, but when a normal person flashes something and it doesnt work its a pain in the joint to try to remember where the list of imperatives is in the forum. The first place most look is to the thread where they were coming from.
It's ok if you flame me for this and I understand. Personally I'm usually all over it myself, but when I see questions in all of the ROM threads asking where someone got a vendor image and then they say they found it in the marlin thread it's just not right, if you know what I mean.
Anyway, thanks for considering it.
Regards,
Dtrud0h
If users don't know where the factory images page is they really shouldn't be unlocking their bootloader.
Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
dtrud0h said:
Hi Developers,
You folks all do a great job of trying to sort out install issues and confusion regarding vendor images for our devices and whatnot and we less inclined to develop really do appreciate all you put into it for the rest of us.
That being said, one thing that I personally think should be included in the ROM's initial posting is a link to the **LINK---> FACTORY IMAGES<---KNIL** for our device.
I know that you all have the link memorized and every flavor imaginable already downloaded, but when a normal person flashes something and it doesnt work its a pain in the joint to try to remember where the list of imperatives is in the forum. The first place most look is to the thread where they were coming from.
It's ok if you flame me for this and I understand. Personally I'm usually all over it myself, but when I see questions in all of the ROM threads asking where someone got a vendor image and then they say they found it in the marlin thread it's just not right, if you know what I mean.
Anyway, thanks for considering it.
Regards,
Dtrud0h
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I always just do a GOOGLE Search - "Factory Images Pixel Sailfish" and it comes up as the first or second link every time. Easy Peasy. I think you have to remember, it is not the Developers place to make life easy for anyone. They already did all the work by creating the rom in the first place. Everyone flashing a rom takes on a major responsibility to know what they need to do if something doesn't go right. if they can't figure this out by searching - or at the very least by TRYING to search first, they should never try in the first place. Of course if they do try on their own to figure something out and still need help - I am sure they will find it by asking.
Too many people have gotten to the point of EXPECTING the developers to hold their hand while they flash roms - why is it the developers place to do that? They didn't hold a gun to the persons head when they flashed - and frankly, I believe they expect each of us to at least try to find things out on our own first - they already put a huge amount of work into creating the rom and then chose to allow us to use it as well. I think they have done enough -
Just my two cents.
joetheshmo said:
If users don't know where the factory images page is they really shouldn't be unlocking their bootloader.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Very true, but it seems a lot of people are doing so. I dont recall a new phone that had so many noobs to flashing. Not complaining, I help them out a lot. Just an observation.
And no, not the devs responsibility to help them. And if they posted links for flashing stock they would get inundated with requests to help with that.
Some phone forums on XDA are more user-friendly than others for flashing ROMs. It used to be so easy and I was (I thought) a pro - I helped others a lot. This phone confuses me more. You learn by doing, but people also don't want to risk $800 phones for the sake of learning.
I personally think it would be nice to include all crucial links as well, but most people on this forum are more inclined to believe you should just find it yourself, haha. I got a "let me Google that for you" response to a question this month, I recall.
When I was back in the Galaxy S3 or HTC One M8 forums, things were a little more noob-friendly but this place is full of nice people who help. It's just harder to do it yourself (without research or asking) because the threads are written at a more advanced level, in my opinion, and the steps are more complex than they used to be.
I agree, some forums are much more friendly than others. It is also easy for the ones that get in on the ground floor than it is for the ones that get in later. People sometimes answer questions in a more complex manner than is needed and probably without realizing it. Throw that in with someone that maybe hasn't had an unlocked bootloader in years and you have some uneasy and nervous people. Yet these guys have a right to get in there, get their feet wet, and eventually contribute. Imagine how clean a Dev's thread would be if not only a link to the firmware was given but if only a vendor image was needed, then that was provided as well. There would fewer questions about the little things and people going back and forth with one another about how stupid or lazy people are on one hand, and how unhelpful or rude people are on the other. I'm not a Dev though.
I agree with you all. lol. It is not the devs responsibility to make sure that your grass is covered, it's usually the first thing in all the threads, **Your Own Risk** I think are the key words. I haven't built any roms but I can get around the platform tools pretty well. But for the sake of keeping the rom threads clean and informative, especially with all the new variables related to most notably the Pixel, but android flashing in general supplying the correct files would probably cut thread clutter down by 40% and with uniform installs bug tracking would be a bit easier.
Anyway, thanks for looking and thinking about it, I appreciate all the points of view expressed.
I'm not complaining about anything, but I originally posted this in the Development Forum and it got moved to Guides and News...Whatever.
Starting to get a stiff neck from shaking my head at the posts in the rom threads, one right after the other asking where to find files, among other things that the user should know.
Just sayin'