Database Users

So i'm leaving... *sigh*

This isn't a OMFGTTHTMI (Oh my XXXXXXX god the transformer has too many issues) thread. I actually love my device only problem is the lack of support/accessories/software for what I need/purchased it for has me going a different route.
After buying and selling a xoom,an iPad 2, and now the TF - I've just come to realize that what I need a "Tablet" (general terminology) for (photography) currently nothing can supplement a macbook. It truly pains me to see this go however I cannot afford to buy a new macbook and keep this.
I've got my TF + dock up for sale: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1137013 however just doesn't seem to be getting as many hits as I thought... Hopefully I can dump this soon enough as I need to buy another MBP soon ! On that note, does my price seem fair ?
I'll keep a close eye on this forum, but to all a farewell =/

You probably need to lower the price a bit, now that the keyboard dock is everywhere. I know you spent more than that with the skin/case, but those items have piss poor resale values when bundled with the tablet.

Gary13579 said:
You probably need to lower the price a bit, now that the keyboard dock is everywhere. I know you spent more than that with the skin/case, but those items have piss poor resale values when bundled with the tablet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I figured that.. Gonna end up returning the dock to Amazon for a full refund since im still within return policy on that and just discount the tab accordingly.

I wanted to buy a TF and was confused between an ipad2 and TF.
I would be buying it for my dad and he is not a tech person at all.
It would be mainly for browsing and emails. What do u suggest , I thought TF is value for money.
Your inputs are valuable since u used both devices

jaypeezee said:
After buying and selling a xoom,an iPad 2, and now the TF - I've just come to realize that what I need a "Tablet" (general terminology) for (photography) currently nothing can supplement a macbook. It truly pains me to see this go however I cannot afford to buy a new macbook and keep this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why buy a heavily overpriced apple laptop when you can get one for 1/2 of the price with similar or better specs ? Maybe that's where your problem is.

aligatro2010 said:
Why buy a heavily overpriced apple laptop when you can get one for 1/2 of the price with similar or better specs ? Maybe that's where your problem is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you ever owned a MacBook, you will know that it is *still* vastly superior to those at ½ price with similar or better specs!
Regards,
Dave

anticipation said:
I would be buying it for my dad and he is not a tech person at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Due to this statement, you have but one choice and that is the iPad.
My mum recently got an iPad and loves it, and she's never used a PC full stop.
Regards,
Dave

foxmeister said:
If you ever owned a MacBook, you will know that it is *still* vastly superior to those at ½ price with similar or better specs!
Regards,
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I never owned one, but I used Mac OS X a lot at campus + my friends own mac books. And I didn't see the "vast superiority" you are talking about. Could it be the aluminum case ? Or maybe EFI ? Software-wise, Mac Os X is more powerful comparing to Windows, but still sucks comparing to Linux. So, what's so special about it ?

aligatro2010 said:
I never owned one, but I used Mac OS X a lot at campus + my friends own mac books. And I didn't see the "vast superiority" you are talking about. Could it be the aluminum case ? Or maybe EFI ? Software-wise, Mac Os X is more powerful comparing to Windows, but still sucks comparing to Linux. So, what's so special about it ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The fact that it's easy to use. The fact that it has great support. Applications Just Work. No worrying about drivers or dependencies. Super long battery life. Gorgeous screens.
I am a HARDCORE Linux fanboy, I have been for over half of my life, I can't stand the iPhone and absolutely hate Apple, yet I would still consider buying a Macbook Pro. MBP is top of the line as far as hardware goes, the only thing I'd put above it are ThinkPads, but you don't get the super nice easy to use supports everything OS that is OS X.

Don't advertise your crap over here dude. If you're leaving, that's fine. good riddance to ya, but don't come over here trying to sell your TF because you couldn't research before making a purchase.
And you're selling for more than it would cost to buy the TF and Dock on amazon for brand new...
jeez.
If I see one more freaking thread like this....

Isn't this what facebook is for?
Sent from my PG06100 using Tapatalk

aligatro2010 said:
I never owned one, but I used Mac OS X a lot at campus + my friends own mac books. And I didn't see the "vast superiority" you are talking about. Could it be the aluminum case ? Or maybe EFI ? Software-wise, Mac Os X is more powerful comparing to Windows, but still sucks comparing to Linux. So, what's so special about it ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Desktop Linux is still an incoherent mess in my opinion, as is installing and removing software. Not trying to start a flame war here, but Linux simply isn't ready for the average man on the street, so I discount it completely from this comparison. I love Linux, but it makes for a far better server OS than desktop OS.
OS/X on the other hand is, and is very usable for even non technical users. Couple this with epic battery life, wake from sleep and reconnecting to wifi in a couple of seconds, and *never* having to reinstall/rebuild the OS, and you have your vast superiority - again, in my opinion!
Regards,
Dave

Gary13579 said:
The fact that it's easy to use. The fact that it has great support. Applications Just Work. No worrying about drivers or dependencies. Super long battery life. Gorgeous screens.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Gnome, Windows vista/7 are also easy to use . Windows has many more productivity applications. Also, Windows is more secure than Mac and Linux, but a lot less safer, because it's being targeted all the time. From my experience, if you get good and popular hardware it will be supported out of the box on Linux and fully/partially on Windows. I don't see a point of buying the fastest laptop on the market, because it's not upgradable like a desktop and it's twice as expensive than a desktop. Also, the price usually drops like crazy after 2-6 months.
7 hours of battery (it's probably much less if you enable turn on everything on the laptop) is nice, but 3 hours on my laptop is more than enough for me. I usually plug-in my laptop right away, so it's never a problem.

aligatro2010 said:
Gnome, Windows vista/7 are also easy to use . Windows has many more productivity applications. Also, Windows is more secure than Mac and Linux, but a lot less safer, because it's being targeted all the time. From my experience, if you get good and popular hardware it will be supported out of the box on Linux and fully/partially on Windows. I don't see a point of buying the fastest laptop on the market, because it's not upgradable like a desktop and it's twice as expensive than a desktop. Also, the price usually drops like crazy after 2-6 months.
7 hours of battery (it's probably much less if you enable turn on everything on the laptop) is nice, but 3 hours on my laptop is more than enough for me. I usually plug-in my laptop right away, so it's never a problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Windows Vista and 7 are the most absurdly insane Windows I've ever used. XP is waaaaay better, less complex at least. Sure, maybe now you can do things in a simpler way, then when the need for something barely under the hood arises... where the hell did they hide the settings? Windows is becoming what osx has always been compared to Linux a (debatable) good interface hiding the innards of the os, with the difference that in this case they just went "our users are retards, let's hide as many settings as possible".
More productivity applications. Do you really need more than a good one? Choice is good, don't misunderstand me, but OpenOffice, iWork and MS Office are pretty much the thing to look for. And MS has Office for Mac.
You don't see the need to buy a fast laptop. Seriously, what are you doing in this section? With the same money spent on the TF you could get a desktop computer with better specs... but you lose portability. Go cheap, and you will need a new one sooner. Yeah, expensive laptops make perfect sense. Plus Apple hardware never drops in price, even used ones are not cheap.
Anyway, as mentioned earlier, Apple has high quality standards, so you get a good reliable machine, with a good os and the whole package will still be productive in a few years, and averagely less issues than a Windows machine will give you.
Clearly you need the right setup depending on your needs: a server will be "more UNIX" the more important it gets, a gaming machine will be more Windows the more serious the gaming and so on. A Mac is a good compromise between a server and a toy, leading to a great choice for a desktop OS. Plus it's targeted towards multimedia use/creation making that a good market for Apple.
The perfect OS doesn't exist, but they all have a field that makes them better than the competition. You know, pick the right tools for the job
Sent from my GT-P1000 using Tapatalk

aligatro2010 said:
Why buy a heavily overpriced apple laptop when you can get one for 1/2 of the price with similar or better specs ? Maybe that's where your problem is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
GTFO.
foxmeister said:
If you ever owned a MacBook, you will know that it is *still* vastly superior to those at ½ price with similar or better specs!
Regards,
Dave
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly. Only a closed minded moron would not see that.
starplaya93 said:
Don't advertise your crap over here dude. If you're leaving, that's fine. good riddance to ya, but don't come over here trying to sell your TF because you couldn't research before making a purchase.
And you're selling for more than it would cost to buy the TF and Dock on amazon for brand new...
jeez.
If I see one more freaking thread like this....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Here is an example.....

Digiguest said:
GTFO.
Exactly. Only a closed minded moron would not see that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You know what separates you from the rest of the people who defended mac here ? They provide a constructive feedback and I now agree with some of the stuff they say. But you sound like a retarded sheep that follows Uncle Steve's commands. Don't have anything to say .... then shut the hell up.

The OS X vs. the world mentality cracks me up. Speaking for myself, I bought a MacBook Pro in early 2008 because I was so frustrated with Vista on my Toshiba Tablet PC. Turns out all of the problems I was experiencing were Toshiba's fault--horrible, horrible drivers, but nevertheless I used the MacBook Pro as my primary machine for 18 months.
Let me say, I didn't like it. It was NOT more stable than other Windows machines I've owned, and when it had issues it was harder to fix. I disliked the overall look and feel of the OS, and simply abhorred its window and file management scheme. I hated how the menus all stay on one screen in a two-screen setup, and the Finder rubs me wrong.
Once I tried Windows 7 on another notebook, I stopped using the MacBook Pro and eventually sold it. I'll say that OS X might be better for the novice who's unwilling to spend a few minutes learning how to do something, which I think applies to the iPhone vs. Android debate as well. It's particularly true of the iPad 2 vs. Honeycomb tablet debate: Honeycomb is vastly superior to iOS on the iPad in terms of overall functionality, customizability, and productivity, but only if one is willing to take 15 minutes to learn its tricks.

aligatro2010 said:
Gnome, Windows vista/7 are also easy to use . Windows has many more productivity applications. Also, Windows is more secure than Mac and Linux, but a lot less safer, because it's being targeted all the time. From my experience, if you get good and popular hardware it will be supported out of the box on Linux and fully/partially on Windows. I don't see a point of buying the fastest laptop on the market, because it's not upgradable like a desktop and it's twice as expensive than a desktop. Also, the price usually drops like crazy after 2-6 months.
7 hours of battery (it's probably much less if you enable turn on everything on the laptop) is nice, but 3 hours on my laptop is more than enough for me. I usually plug-in my laptop right away, so it's never a problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haha... Windows and GNOME usable? If you're a nerd, sure. 99% of end users are not nerds.
7 hours of battery life? The newer MBP's get 12-14 hour battery life, even with wireless/comfortable brightness.

Gary13579 said:
Haha... Windows and GNOME usable? If you're a nerd, sure. 99% of end users are not nerds.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
windows for nerds? ok.. so I guess my grandma is a nerd then LOL

Yeah, tell me what she's going to do when some cryptic coredump pops up on the screen. Oh what's that? That's right, she is going to do absolutely nothing, or she is going to call someone to fix it for her. Windows is not user friendly. If you think it is, you're either ignorant or haven't tried OS X.

TF2 will be around soon.

Compatible with existing docks and will have ICS.
http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/42382/asus-eee-pad-transformer-2

Ha I just got this info myself from another source that will not mention here...
Dang glad i didn't buy one now.... cause I did find a B60 in my area..and had them put it aside..for this week...
http://tablets-planet.com/2011/10/0...t-will-be-499-no-price-cut-for-transformer-1/

well isnt that just great. Ive had mine for one day. A quad core? Damn!

this is all well and good but im still gonna keep my tf1 with a smile. im sure ICS will be on the tf1 shortly after its available. not worried

Ditto - I can't see quad core being necessary for some time to come. I'll upgrade next year.... when it's six or 8 core for the same price

I think it would make sense for Asus to ditch Android and wait for Windows 8...
Sorry, but I think Windows 8 > Android Honeycomb.

xTRICKYxx said:
I think it would make sense for Asus to ditch Android and wait for Windows 8...
Sorry, but I think Windows 8 > Android Honeycomb.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow win 8 ok... I'm def buying one or two.

would you's recommend i wait for this or go for the galaxy tab 10.1? I really like the docking keyboard but i also like the look of tab 10.1. thanks!

Windows 8 <<<< Give me a break
I would wait for the TF2.... think about it Quad Core<<<<

how was the build quality of the first gen compared to samsung products?

I can say the TF3 will be out in June of 2012 too, but that doesn't mean it's going to happen. This is the beginning of media hype. The same thing happened with the original Transformer as well. How many months was it until we had a concrete date, much less hardware in hand? For god sakes, they were showing off hardware 3+ months before it hit stores! Having the CEO say they're preparing, is like me saying I'm preparing for Christmas now.
When we have a date, fine, post threads. But until we have a date, whats the point of having thread, after thread, after thread with every little stupid article about the TF2? It's all hype and nothing more.
---------- Post added at 02:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:15 AM ----------
mrloltime said:
how was the build quality of the first gen compared to samsung products?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It was sorta a crapshoot. In a way...I mean, as you probably are well aware, the people that got bad units (or are just too picky when it comes to backlight bleed) complained the loudest. When you consider the fact that they were selling 100k+ per month, having even 100 people complaining is still only 0.1%. Outside of that, I feel it's good. I have a B50 unit (not one of the even older B40 units) and it's build really solid, I can't complain unless I expect everything to be better than perfect.

mrloltime said:
would you's recommend i wait for this or go for the galaxy tab 10.1? I really like the docking keyboard but i also like the look of tab 10.1. thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you're after the looks, why not try the ipad 2? I don't even ow why people will buy the tab for $500.

mrloltime said:
would you's recommend i wait for this or go for the galaxy tab 10.1? I really like the docking keyboard but i also like the look of tab 10.1. thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you can find a B60 or below tab I'd go for it. B70 series are hit and miss when it comes to being able to root. Even if you NEVER root it, it's good to have the option IMO.
Quad-core? Not necessary for functioning apps at present. The dual-core TF1 performs beautifully. "Less is More" axiom applies here I believe.
I'd jump to the quad-core ONLY if dual boot with Win8 were an option. Never been a gamer so playing games mean diddly to me. (Win8 option would help with work interface).

Its not going to be thinner? Different Color? More aesthetically pleasing w/ a new dock to match? Only hardware is the difference?
I am dissapoint. I was really hoping that they would have created a more badass version of the TF2. They might as well just called it the TF1S and saved the TF2 monicker for the real deal.

I honestly think Asus, like Lenovo, are going to be in the Tablet races a long time. However, I think the tablets running Android will be short lived. I want a fully featured, robust, heavily developed OS. Windows 8 is just that. If anyone is not excited about Windows 8 competing with Android, then they are not excited for any innovation.
The Transformer 2 will most likely run Windows 8.

xTRICKYxx said:
I honestly think Asus, like Lenovo, are going to be in the Tablet races a long time. However, I think the tablets running Android will be short lived. I want a fully featured, robust, heavily developed OS. Windows 8 is just that. If anyone is not excited about Windows 8 competing with Android, then they are not excited for any innovation.
The Transformer 2 will most likely run Windows 8.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Windows 8 should be able to run on Tegra 2 so we should have the dual boot capability on the TF1.

xTRICKYxx said:
I honestly think Asus, like Lenovo, are going to be in the Tablet races a long time. However, I think the tablets running Android will be short lived. I want a fully featured, robust, heavily developed OS. Windows 8 is just that. If anyone is not excited about Windows 8 competing with Android, then they are not excited for any innovation.
The Transformer 2 will most likely run Windows 8.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
source?
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk

xTRICKYxx said:
I honestly think Asus, like Lenovo, are going to be in the Tablet races a long time. However, I think the tablets running Android will be short lived. I want a fully featured, robust, heavily developed OS. Windows 8 is just that. If anyone is not excited about Windows 8 competing with Android, then they are not excited for any innovation.
The Transformer 2 will most likely run Windows 8.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It won't. It will run IceCream Sandwhich. - If there is one thing I've learned it is to take all posts with a grain of salt. Usually it's peoples' personal opinions or prefrences instead of facts.
http://androidcommunity.com/asus-ee...ice-cream-sandwich-expected-in-q3q4-20110623/

If it doesn't have digitizer stylus I'll pass. I need the tablet for taking hadwritten notes at work, Transformer 1 is not good for it.

multiple places are reporting that the CEO of Asus has stated that transformer 2 will be coming out shortly (meaning by the end of the month or early next month).
http://androidandme.com/2011/10/news/asus-the-fire-isnt-hot-enough-transformer-2-going-for-499/
http://www.techradar.com/news/mobil...nd-gen-eee-pad-transformer-on-the-way-1031351
however, the price point says $499...hopefully they are referring to the 32GB model and not the 16GB model. I was really hoping to get this as soon as it came out but if 16GB is at $499..i might wait until closer towards the end of the year to hopefully get a better deal on it once samsung and others come out with their kal-el models.

How much do you think window 8 tablets will cost?

Do you guys think it would be priced competively with the ipads, and various android devices? Maybe somewhere around 500-550$?

Fasty12 said:
Do you guys think it would be priced competively with the ipads, and various android devices? Maybe somewhere around 500-550$?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have no idea.
I think its critical that Windows 8 RT is competitive otherwise its a little bit pointless. As you climb above that price point you start to get in to x86 price ranges at which point (battery life aside) x86 would kick its arse.
Android stuff will be cheaper, theres no getting around that, Google makes its money from you in other ways. So I really have no idea, sorry

I would say if they price them the way Slates are priced they will wont sell anything! If they undercut Apple by $50 bucks it will sell , if they want to compete with Android they will have to cut and $100 off the list price! But the way the OS is looking it will be an easy sell since XBOX,Windows Phone, media center are all integrated into it , No body else has that kind of integration ! They need to keep the price low , it should be any big deal , lets face it it costs about 10 dollars to make an iphone , 15 for the ipad and they pay there workers about that per day to make the device , Im pretty sure GREED works well in this industry , appl has enough where they could drop the price and not lose a nickel , but why would they?
Microsoft needs to do that as well ,I mean after all Bill invented greed in the tech industry!

$300 Windows 8 tablet
Fasty12 said:
Do you guys think it would be priced competively with the ipads, and various android devices? Maybe somewhere around 500-550$?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course, the prices will go up, according to the specs of each device, so while you may be able to buy a $300 Windows 8 tablet
hamidshaikh.com

Xbox Capabilities
I think the tablets should be priced at about $300-$400 because I can buy a cheap laptop for that and it would have a keyboard unlike most tablets.
I had a thought (others may have already said this) but Microsoft should add capabilities to be able to play xbox/xbox360 games and more gamers would buy a tablet to game on the road.

Windows 8 tab price
I am guessing you will get what you pay for. Windows tablets using arm architecture will more than likely cost the least, being competitive with the current line of Android and Apple offerings. Buyers will be limited to metro apps and select 1st party Microsoft applications; however, the price in general SHOULD be lower than a Win8 tablet running on Intel architecture. Tablets running win8 on a normal x86-64 processor will be the wild card. Slap some low end components in a generic plastic case with a touch screen and it will more than likely cost less than the highest end Windows on arm tablet. I am sure Origin PC will have a $5,000 USD Windows 8 gaming tablet that has two full sized graphics cards in SLI/crossfire configuration and overclocked components available at some point (might actually become a reality if you have seen the Razer gaming tablet). So my predictions after all this ranting?
Win8 on ARM tablets: $250-$600+
Win8 on Intel tablets: $400-more money you would ever want to spend on anything.

whatever it is, it would be ofcourse out of my range.

Skully1983 said:
I am guessing you will get what you pay for. Windows tablets using arm architecture will more than likely cost the least, being competitive with the current line of Android and Apple offerings. Buyers will be limited to metro apps and select 1st party Microsoft applications; however, the price in general SHOULD be lower than a Win8 tablet running on Intel architecture. Tablets running win8 on a normal x86-64 processor will be the wild card. Slap some low end components in a generic plastic case with a touch screen and it will more than likely cost less than the highest end Windows on arm tablet. I am sure Origin PC will have a $5,000 USD Windows 8 gaming tablet that has two full sized graphics cards in SLI/crossfire configuration and overclocked components available at some point (might actually become a reality if you have seen the Razer gaming tablet). So my predictions after all this ranting?
Win8 on ARM tablets: $250-$600+
Win8 on Intel tablets: $400-more money you would ever want to spend on anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe you're spot-on. Entry level devices will *absolutely* be competitive with iPad and Android tablets, but there will be numerous SKU's that add capabilities for different consumers.
And that's a GOOD thing. Apple likes to say "**** you, take what we give you," but Microsoft and other vendors understand that the truth of the world is, there are LOTS of different kinds of consumers with MANY different kinds of needs, and the smart money puts an appropriate product within reach of every customer. That's one of the reasons Windows itself has 90% worldwide OS marketshare, and Apple has 4%.

I heard for Mobile version of win8/ARM if any. Should be half the cost of the full fledge win8 versions on the tablets. So currently win7 tablets are $1000+, I would say $500 or so..

I am hoping the price range will be 400$-600$, because i really want one of those Windows 8 tablets.

Ann information week article says 32 different versions ranging from $300 to $1000...can't really see an arm tablet going for a grand...
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2

seulment said:
Ann information week article says 32 different versions ranging from $300 to $1000...can't really see an arm tablet going for a grand...
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
there is some pretty good S4 kit and not to mention NVidia's offerings out there, its possible it could go that high, but at that price id sooner get myself an x86

I think ARM tablets are going to go anywhere between 400 to 700 and x86 are going to be 700 to 1500.

You have to remember that W8 tablets not are hardware like neetbooks, those will be around 700 dollars no less at least prom the most famous manufacturers
---------- Post added at 03:11 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:10 AM ----------
Another detail are the W8 ARM devices, these will be around the 400 dollars im pretty sure

How about just running it in a virtual machine on an ipad ? Or natively ?
The price point will have to be considerably less than an ipad to even be considered by folks.
As it is now, a tablet means an ipad to the population. For that matter, "tablet" may confuse people more, as ipad is what is recognized more widely and immediately.

Get you a Iconia W7 tablet for $300, and install W8 on it.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

Really don't see why they would be any more expensive than they are now. Its just a different operating system.....

vetvito said:
Get you a Iconia W7 tablet for $300, and install W8 on it.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
apparently MS has made some big gains in touch screen tech to go along with W8, whilst older tech will likely work if there are drivers, this new tech should make some of the issue disappear
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2012/03/28/touch-hardware-and-windows-8.aspx
not quite related to Win 8 but also worth a look
http://www.geek.com/articles/gadgets/microsoft-demos-a-high-performance-1ms-touchscreen-2012039/

I wouldn't buy WinRT, give me full Windows or give me nothing.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

probably between 200-1000$ depending on hardware performance

(Q) Am i tight or has win 8 rt priced itself out of the game

I realize all the greatness about windows 8 etc, look at all my other post and you will see I am full blooded fanboi. However I am a poor fan and so price is something I have to consider. I thought when I saw the Surface price that it was really miles to steep but then it was really top end hardware and so was to be expected. However what I didn't realize is that it wasn't an expensive windows rt tab at all infact it was very competitive. For example here in the UK the Ativ tab with less fancy hardware is more expensive (32gb ativ = £457 32gb, surface = £399). Am I being funny here or can you not get same spec Android for about £100 less? I know RT smashes Android BUT its still got its problems - lag, app unreliability, lack of native apps though bluestacks has this covered but then as I was pointing out if you want droid go for an actual android tab. Is it wrong to want decent hardware RT for around the £350 mark? Or am I just a tight old man?

lumpaywk said:
I realize all the greatness about windows 8 etc, look at all my other post and you will see I am full blooded fanboi. However I am a poor fan and so price is something I have to consider. I thought when I saw the Surface price that it was really miles to steep but then it was really top end hardware and so was to be expected. However what I didn't realize is that it wasn't an expensive windows rt tab at all infact it was very competitive. For example here in the UK the Ativ tab with less fancy hardware is more expensive (32gb ativ = £457 32gb, surface = £399). Am I being funny here or can you not get same spec Android for about £100 less? I know RT smashes Android BUT its still got its problems - lag, app unreliability, lack of native apps though bluestacks has this covered but then as I was pointing out if you want droid go for an actual android tab. Is it wrong to want decent hardware RT for around the £350 mark? Or am I just a tight old man?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not wrong at all to want decent hardware RT cheap especially when the Google Nexus 7 32gb when released will be £249.99. Ms seem to be going down the Apple route and overpricing there tabs instead of competing with Android. Windows 8 RT is after all the full Windows 8 optimized for Arm CPUs, I'm curious to what the Price of the Surface Pro will be as It's a better spec than RT with a propper Intel Processor and full Windows 8 with the ability to load regular PC apps so you'll have the choice of Office apps that you want to use other than Microsoft Office.
I want a Tab but cant decide wether I should save for a Google Nexus 7, Microsoft Surface RT or Microsoft Surface Pro?
Roland

lumpaywk said:
I realize all the greatness about windows 8 etc, look at all my other post and you will see I am full blooded fanboi. However I am a poor fan and so price is something I have to consider. I thought when I saw the Surface price that it was really miles to steep but then it was really top end hardware and so was to be expected. However what I didn't realize is that it wasn't an expensive windows rt tab at all infact it was very competitive. For example here in the UK the Ativ tab with less fancy hardware is more expensive (32gb ativ = £457 32gb, surface = £399). Am I being funny here or can you not get same spec Android for about £100 less? I know RT smashes Android BUT its still got its problems - lag, app unreliability, lack of native apps though bluestacks has this covered but then as I was pointing out if you want droid go for an actual android tab. Is it wrong to want decent hardware RT for around the £350 mark? Or am I just a tight old man?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no i think they missed the mark, i suspect it was OEM presure, they would perhaps have promised to release low priced parts in x months, we do see that with other hardware, top end gets released first, then back ported to lower end gear.
but yes i agree,it is stupid,MS would have done well to use some of that $40 billion surplus it has to support a low price and gain some traction in the market rather than start from 0 with relitively high prices...
but who am i to argue

It's $100 cheaper than the iPad for the same storage, and when you look at it the Surface really does scream quality. Everything about the hardware just seems so precisely designed.
I think Microsoft are planning to go after Apple rather than Google. Apple is more of a competitor, as it offers the same services as Microsoft with that distinct Apple twist I despise.
They also don't want to undercut OEMs.

aegixnova said:
It's $100 cheaper than the iPad for the same storage, and when you look at it the Surface really does scream quality. Everything about the hardware just seems so precisely designed.
I think Microsoft are planning to go after Apple rather than Google. Apple is more of a competitor, as it offers the same services as Microsoft with that distinct Apple twist I despise.
They also don't want to undercut OEMs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
absolutely as a long term plan, but the more pressing problem is short term market traction,Android holds the cards there and shouldnt be dismissed, dispite it being a crap product compared to Apple and MS

dazza9075 said:
absolutely as a long term plan, but the more pressing problem is short term market traction,Android holds the cards there and shouldnt be dismissed, dispite it being a crap product compared to Apple and MS
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
MS should price Surface RT & Surface Pro mid range so its:
Android, budget Phone/Tablet for people on a tight budget/Linux users.
Windows Mid Range All Rounder, Desktop/Phone & Tablet for people that want a complete affordable package of Desktop, Phone & Tablet with everything working as one semlessly.
Apple premium All Rounder high end Desktop/Phone & Tablet for people that can afford to pay for style and want everything seamlessly synced between all there devices.
Android tablets may be cheaper than Apple Tablets but Android is scales properly on an Android Tablet compared to iOS where the icons are spread appart as if Apple has taken iSO from an iPhone and just flashed it to the iPad.
Hopefully Surface Pro with Windows 8 Pro will be more successfull than Windows XP Tablet Edition, I can't recall ever seeing any resonably priced Windows XP Tablet Edition Tablets advertised.
Roland

Yeah its not like I am saying that there shouldn't be top end hardware at a top end price but where is the middle ground.
And now I also want to know where are any of these tablets. Its launch day the big bang of there tablet push and I cant find ANY for sale anywhere bar the surface and that's on a 3 week wait. I have been to PC world, Commet, Currys and nothing but old Laptops with the os put on it and not a single tablet. Its a joke! How do they expect to make big profits if people that actually want to buy cant find anything anywhere. Then to top it off we have the most preview locations in Europe but they are all in London! So once again some Americans thing England is well London.

If you buy what you really need, the price might be right

lumpaywk said:
Yeah its not like I am saying that there shouldn't be top end hardware at a top end price but where is the middle ground.
And now I also want to know where are any of these tablets. Its launch day the big bang of there tablet push and I cant find ANY for sale anywhere bar the surface and that's on a 3 week wait. I have been to PC world, Commet, Currys and nothing but old Laptops with the os put on it and not a single tablet. Its a joke! How do they expect to make big profits if people that actually want to buy cant find anything anywhere. Then to top it off we have the most preview locations in Europe but they are all in London! So once again some Americans thing England is well London.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
your closer to London than i am!! Marketing has always been MSs downfall, hardware is something they often do very well,but alas you may be right on this one

aegixnova said:
They also don't want to undercut OEMs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly this. With the pricing that they have they are trying accomplishing 3 goals
1. Placing the surface in everyones mind as a "Premium" product
2. Not annoy their OEMs
3. Give them room to drop the price if they want later.
I REALLY want a Surface pro but I know that it's going to probably be 900+ (based on RT prices) and I can't justify spending that much when I already have a perfectly working Acer w500 with windows 8 and nice i5 @ 4ghz, 16gb ram self built PC that runs pretty much anything decently. I think MS is targeting those consumers that have money to burn and the oems can fight over the 'bargain hunters'.

thundr51 said:
Exactly this. With the pricing that they have they are trying accomplishing 3 goals
1. Placing the surface in everyones mind as a "Premium" product
2. Not annoy their OEMs
3. Give them room to drop the price if they want later.
I REALLY want a Surface pro but I know that it's going to probably be 900+ (based on RT prices) and I can't justify spending that much when I already have a perfectly working Acer w500 with windows 8 and nice i5 @ 4ghz, 16gb ram self built PC that runs pretty much anything decently. I think MS is targeting those consumers that have money to burn and the oems can fight over the 'bargain hunters'.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but nobody is fighting for the bargain hunters, the acer and the Samsung tablets are more expensive then the surface (at least here on pre-order prices). All the windows pro based tablets are stupidly expensive like + £900. I know there are a few that could fill the cheap market but where are they? There is nothing available for launch! Its the worst launch I have seen in a long long time and is like launching the next xbox without any games. Whoever was in charge of making sure oems had products really dropped the ball on this one big style and by time they get anything to market the momentum of launch will have faded.

You're Fired!

Sinofsky is toast. Now you know how well the Win8 and Surface RT launches went.
http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/11/12/windows-chief-sinofsky-leaving-microsoft/
It would be nice if Ballmer joins him, but I suppose it's too much to ask the boss to fire himself. Hopefully the board will do its job.

the launch was soft and snoring. I think the real reason is what balmer stated the other day, "modest sales".

ohgood said:
the launch was soft and snoring. I think the real reason is what balmer stated the other day, "modest sales".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The guy was an idiot, he had the right ideas but like many things that happen in MS, didn't go about it in the right way, lesson to replacement, you are building an integrated OS across many platforms with the intention of keeping the experience similar across them all, yes? then you REALLY need to talk to one another to make sure it all works together
As for Balmer.... remember I was saying about negative PR momentum? well if someone would sack his sorry arse we'd see MSs shares jump up 10% im sure.
Steve Jobs was also an idiot, BUT at least he became a household name for all the right reasons, Balmer as far as I can tell hasn't done anything and I bet outside of the Geekdom no one knows or cares who he is
plus Balmer probably saw him as a threat to some extent

Sinofsky's departure is nothing to do with sales. No one judges sales in 3 weeks especially in Windows. Previous versions of Windows sold slower than Windows 8. RT is a new product as well.
Sinofsky was removed because his work with Windows 8 / Surface RT is complete. The team now works on Windows 9 / next versions of Surface and they don't want his influence any more.
This is not to say that Win 8 / Surface sales are great. We don't know but we do know one thing - judging sales of a typically slow moving product within 3 weeks and sacking a top man over this is stupid. Politics and infighting are the more likely factors by a mile. Moment Sinofsky's project is done he was shown the door / resigned.

junialum said:
Sinofsky's departure is nothing to do with sales. No one judges sales in 3 weeks especially in Windows. Previous versions of Windows sold slower than Windows 8. RT is a new product as well.
Sinofsky was removed because his work with Windows 8 / Surface RT is complete. The team now works on Windows 9 / next versions of Surface and they don't want his influence any more.
This is not to say that Win 8 / Surface sales are great. We don't know but we do know one thing - judging sales of a typically slow moving product within 3 weeks and sacking a top man over this is stupid. Politics and infighting are the more likely factors by a mile. Moment Sinofsky's project is done he was shown the door / resigned.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wicked smart, been there for decades, and one scuffle with balmer puts him on the street? maybe its decades of scuffles.
wonder me this, if the surface hadn't locked up and crashed during presentation, and was actually selling like iPads, would he be praised or canned?