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I don't want this to become a discussion of which OS is better, but does anyone think there will be a windows 8 install available for the A500? I read that windows 8 will support arm. Just curious.
Sent from my A501 using Tapatalk
No, the drivers aren't there for it, but they may release an upgrade for the w500 which was acers windows version of out tablet. It had different hardware specs than the a500.
Tegra 3 tablets will supposedly run Windows 8 (ARM Edition).
youtube.com/watch?v=HWOOefm_rwo
Tegra 3 tablets designed for windows will run windows 8, tegra 3 tablets designed for android won't. That is the same as the tegra 2 tablets, if you bought a Acer W500 it came with windows and you can't upgrade it to android because the driver support isn't there. The tablets came with different parts inside. Without the drivers your out of luck.
cruise350 said:
Tegra 3 tablets designed for windows will run windows 8, tegra 3 tablets designed for android won't. That is the same as the tegra 2 tablets, if you bought a Acer W500 it came with windows and you can't upgrade it to android because the driver support isn't there. The tablets came with different parts inside. Without the drivers your out of luck.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You cannot compare to W500: W500 isn't a Tegra 2 tablet.
Windows 8 ARM (WHERE ARE YOU)
This question has been asked and talked about over and over again...
I do think it all depends on the windows 8 arm version.. myself because of the way linux is partitioned. The way our device is partitioned Size of boot / system partitions and OF course the protected boot loader.. IT will take some very extreme hacks to just get it installed .then there is the whole drive thing people are talking about.Thou many tegra devices shares alot of hardware. and there is a huge chance that this device could have the same hardware as in camera bluetooth gps and so on as the w500. im almost Positive its the same with the camera and bluetooth . as i have a acer and a gateway notebook that share these same common hardware chip type devices the chinon (i think is proper spelling) for cam . the iconia has this cam chip as well .
if you factor all of this together.. Someone would really have to want it VERY BAD.. or microsoft will have to do alot of testing with ACER .
the short answer is .. FLIP A COIN WILL Bring just as good answeres until its out in beta..
An answer from Acer technical support
I ask gently to the technical support if Windows 8 Will be ported to the Iconia Tab A501 and the answer was really short ...
NO
So, if some people work on it to build one for us, we will have it. Other else, too bad
ArtSooby said:
I ask gently to the technical support if Windows 8 Will be ported to the Iconia Tab A501 and the answer was really short ...
NO
So, if some people work on it to build one for us, we will have it. Other else, too bad
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, isn't that what we said already? Why is it that hard to believe?
Win8ARM will not be sold separately, it can only come preinstalled. Secondly, Microsoft is only allowing it on fully locked-down devices; no open bootloaders for you. Thirdly it'll be very hard to even get admin access because Win8ARM doesn't allow sideloading; all and every single application must come from the Windows Store. No, you cannot run or install stuff from USB or Flash or network shares. All these things considering it'll be a wonder if someone can even copy the ROM successfully, let alone make it run on a device which doesn't have Secure Boot.
Short answer: NO, A500 WILL NOT GET WIN8.
A slight taste of the Near future .
WereCatf said:
Yes, isn't that what we said already? Why is it that hard to believe?
Win8ARM will not be sold separately, it can only come preinstalled. Secondly, Microsoft is only allowing it on fully locked-down devices; no open bootloaders for you. Thirdly it'll be very hard to even get admin access because Win8ARM doesn't allow sideloading; all and every single application must come from the Windows Store. No, you cannot run or install stuff from USB or Flash or network shares. All these things considering it'll be a wonder if someone can even copy the ROM successfully, let alone make it run on a device which doesn't have Secure Boot.
Short answer: NO, A500 WILL NOT GET WIN8.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OVER The past 10 years i have been saying. been protesting. that eventually that if this locked device and embedded software is not stopped with laws .All electronic devices will end up with a very short end of life from manufacturers. Well folks its here. If Microsoft does the above. Well even they will push minor but much needed updates like security fixes on old devices devices and make them OBSOLETE much sooner by not supporting new much needed technology to keep devices viable..
This by the way Microsoft has been two faced from MS . there statement is ( THe manufacture has a choice rather to lock a device or not but they believe the end use should have a right to choose what os to run on there device. They say in this statement they are confident everyone will choose ms software ) This statement i disagree with . the only way to protect our right to have unlocked devices is to take it to the COURTS. But with all the recent activity about piracy this is a fight that will Be very hard and a long battle. EMBEDED SYSTEMS IS THE FUTURE AND WILL COST CUTTING EDGE CONSUMERS BILLIONS. Someone very good with web development start a TRUE WEBSITE TO PROTEST THIS.. many will join in and make this fight start now before its to late..
YES The above sounds like a conspiracy just do some research then post your opinion . Sorry op of this is off topic but its kinda related..
erica_renee said:
there statement is ( THe manufacture has a choice rather to lock a device or not but they believe the end use should have a right to choose what os to run on there device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, you're slightly incorrect there; Microsoft says that only about PCs, ie. PCs must have Secure Boot enabled, but the manufacturer can decide whether or not to allow end-users to disable that. But on ARM devices Secure Boot MUST be enabled and there must be absolutely no way for end-users to disable that or the manufacturer won't be allowed to sell Windows 8.
WereCatf said:
Actually, you're slightly incorrect there; Microsoft says that only about PCs, ie. PCs must have Secure Boot enabled, but the manufacturer can decide whether or not to allow end-users to disable that. But on ARM devices Secure Boot MUST be enabled and there must be absolutely no way for end-users to disable that or the manufacturer won't be allowed to sell Windows 8.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
YES you are Totally correct. Sorry .. . either way Its bad news for the consumer.Giving manufactures this ability
Microsoft had Windows 7 working on ARM tablets 2 years ago. They are obviously looking at this potential market.
WereCatf said:
Yes, isn't that what we said already? Why is it that hard to believe?
Win8ARM will not be sold separately, it can only come preinstalled. Secondly, Microsoft is only allowing it on fully locked-down devices; no open bootloaders for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
while I don't doubt the A50x will not see Win8, I do have to say... What Microsoft WANTS and what we the users DO seldom go hand in hand
Nope
I can't understand why people even think that this could be possible? the ONLY chance you'd see WinRT running on A500 is that m$ used it as a development platform...like HTC HD2 got wp7. Also, you need someone inside to leak the test OS....
Porting an ARM OS it's all about proper drivers, considering the ARM version and SOC design are somehow on the same gen. Nobody is insane enough to try and port a CLOSED OS. Even if it wasn't closed tight, porting and tweaking drivers is a hell of a job...just look at Android ( a Linux based, open source OS), how hard is to get rid of bugs because manufacturers like to keep the drivers closed source.
Also, it is imperative for MS,in order to get a chance in tablet market, to have a close-to- flawless OS,just like IoS, where the bugs are scarce. getting this job done requires at least two big choices to be made. You can only do that by completely opening the whole OS and hardware, therefore rely on a full pool of devs< nobody's choice> or you can do it by having clearly drawn/ restricted hardware devices, like WP7 phones and IOS devices.
I don't believe in locked down BLs, but I see no way that an Android native device will ever run WinRT.
It will of course happen, but it will take tremendous work to do. This always happens to an allegedly locked down OS... case in point- Hackintoshs where people install OSX onto a PC. People were even putting Android onto old WinMo handsets.
But you inevitably end up with a device that doesn't work as well as the original. Drivers were mentioned, plus there's being off the update/patch path, and plain & simple bugs that always crop up.
tl;dr: Yes, expect it. No, it won't work well.
OK, couldn't find a similar thread, so I will make a new one. I am a Noob when it comes to tablets and their OS restrictions (I've heard of boot-loaders and stuff but don't know exactly what they are).
So to the question - say I get something like this: Lenovo Ideatab K2110, which runs on an Intel X86 architecture.
Then when Windows 8 come out, can I get a license and run it on the device? Will that be possible? I know it is sort of early, but I am thinking about tablets and evaluating the options. Not really a fan of Android and iOS as I've always used windows, so I was just wondering if I get an Intel-based ICS 4.0 device, whether I can upgrade to Win eventually if I am not happy with it.
Also, I haven't found anything on the net, for convertable Android Intel-based tablets (like the Transformer) - anyone read anything on the topic? As if I upgrade to Win 8, I'd prefer a keyboard-dockable device.
Any help will be much appreciated!
To clarify - I am asking because of affordability - currently Win 7 tablets are very expensive. But if I get Android and decide that Win 8 is worth the money eventually then I will probably invest in it. I know the switch from Win 7 to Win 8 will be easy but Win 7 is crap until Win 8 comes out AND it is more expensive than Android so I see no reason to buy such a device.
And while on topic - how much would an Android shave off the price of a similar system with Win 8? Are Win 7 tablets so expensive because of the hardware or because of the software?
Edit: Just saw a similar thread in the Dev forum! I guess someone else has the same idea as me and it sounds plausible! Just waiting for an appropriate dockable device then Still, anyone heard about any convertible tablets with Intel chips?
You may be the first one in XDA say that Windows 7 sucks.
yeah, it can be suck for Tablet because it is a platform which Windows 7 wasn't aimed for.
And i don;t have a clear answer for the question because they can have the same hardware but install an OS on it is a different story.
For an example, in order to install Windows on a iMac is a stupid progress, even other PCs can use the same specs.
On a tablet it isn't good as far as I am aware. On my laptop - I love it. Anyway, are we going to know for sure when the Win 8 beta and some Intel Android device is out? I mean, would guys around here work out whether it will be possible at that stage?
CacOBG said:
On a tablet it isn't good as far as I am aware. On my laptop - I love it. Anyway, are we going to know for sure when the Win 8 beta and some Intel Android device is out? I mean, would guys around here work out whether it will be possible at that stage?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I bet most people here would buy off a tablet which run Windows 8 on a Second Gen Core i series.
ASUS seem to be a great deal over this.
does it use the regular BIOS when turned on? if so then yea it'll work. Im not so sure about that touchscreen though, there might not be drivers available for it. It really depends if the controller has been used regularly in windows, or if its some obscure chip that is only now being used in that device.
Based on little knowledge,Win 8 needs 'bios' , be it tablet or mobile.
OEM have to customise the hardware architechture.
I guess win 8 should run all the apps of win 7, based on the excellent backward compatibility of win o/s in general. again certain apps depend on the hardware architechture and the customisations the OEM offer. I may be wrong
As of now, the chaces for such porting seem low, unless some developers here in the community come up with another solution.
as long as it can have BIOS loaded, and drivers can be created, then the answer is yes, it will be possible
mtmerrick said:
as long as it can have BIOS loaded, and drivers can be created, then the answer is yes, it will be possible
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats exactly it,and with the cheap intel based android tablets coming on the market now,2 years later,this takes on more importance. I do wonder what boot loader they are using for the android tablets. I see that AMD is going to start getting into the mix,and that could be interesting because I understand that AMD has been supporting coreboot. If coreboot is ported to the chipsets in use,it might make an easy path to putting windows or linux on those tablets. Basicly,core boot handles low level hardware initialization,then loads an EFI or OpenBIOS payload,then your off and running In fact,if coreboot is ported,we might even see some RUN coreboot as the bootloader. With android,I can see simply using coreboot to directly boot into the linux kernel,and into android. But if they use it,its open source,so they need to release the code,and your good to go.
>Intel Android tablet to Windows 8?
OP should keep up with tech news.
http://www.theverge.com/2014/1/3/5267360/intel-dual-os-pc-plus-android-windows-microsoft-objection
TL;DR: Per the piece's header. But MS & Google aren't onboard for turf reasons.
Edit: Oops, just noticed this thread is 2-yrs old, being necro'ed by last posting dude. Disregard response.
many tablets with dual os are available now
e.mote said:
>Intel Android tablet to Windows 8?
OP should keep up with tech news.
http://www.theverge.com/2014/1/3/5267360/intel-dual-os-pc-plus-android-windows-microsoft-objection
TL;DR: Per the piece's header. But MS & Google aren't onboard for turf reasons.
Edit: Oops, just noticed this thread is 2-yrs old, being necro'ed by last posting dude. Disregard response.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
onda v919, teclast air ii, air 3g , etc and many others have dual os.
Hello guys! I have an iPad 2 (I dont know if apple talk is even allowed here) but what I want to do is to install Windows 8 on non-jailbroken iPad 2 with iOS 5.0.1 for free. Spashtops paid offer is unfair since Windows slate users can get it for free. So where do I get win8 for free?
install win8 on ipad2? you're kidding, right?
OptimusLove said:
Hello guys! I have an iPad 2 (I dont know if apple talk is even allowed here) but what I want to do is to install Windows 8 on non-jailbroken iPad 2 with iOS 5.0.1 for free. Spashtops paid offer is unfair since Windows slate users can get it for free. So where do I get win8 for free?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just a quick question, what is it you are wanting to do?
im not sure if you quite understand what is going on with Splashtop , your not installing Windows 8, your using a remote VM that's streamed to your ipad.
besides that, Win 8 ARM isn't available to us, its not a retail product, we have no idea how hard it is going to be to rip out the OS and install it on other devices, or indeed if its possible at all
What you could try, and I don't have an ipad so I cant be sure it would work, is use a web service such as logmein,
setup a win 8 desktop somewhere, then install logmein, if your ipad will allow it log on to the logmein service and connect to your Win 8 desktop, technically you now have a crude version of Splashtops product
OptimusLove said:
Hello guys! I have an iPad 2 (I dont know if apple talk is even allowed here) but what I want to do is to install Windows 8 on non-jailbroken iPad 2 with iOS 5.0.1 for free. Spashtops paid offer is unfair since Windows slate users can get it for free. So where do I get win8 for free?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First of all, Apple doesn't even let you transfer any sort of files except media on their devices. Secondly, if you could manage to get something on there using SSH or something, you can't execute it at bootup. This proves yet a impossible thing to install Windows 8 on iPad but who knows? Someone can prove me wrong and put Win 8 on iPad. That would be awesome as I also own a iPad (1st-Gen).
??? how will that work ???
How will that work? I mean Apple and Windows on a machine?
This will never be possible =[
Taimur Akmal said:
First of all, Apple doesn't even let you transfer any sort of files except media on their devices. Secondly, if you could manage to get something on there using SSH or something, you can't execute it at bootup. This proves yet a impossible thing to install Windows 8 on iPad but who knows? Someone can prove me wrong and put Win 8 on iPad. That would be awesome as I also own a iPad (1st-Gen).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not to mention that iBoot is very particular about what it downloads during recovery.
Cogixo: it's possible with both Mac and Windows PCs, Bootcamp and Hackintoshing (respectively). But on Apple's ARM based tablet? Probably not (in fact, definitely not going to be too possible)
Sent from my LS-LS670 using XDA
Kabayan, it is possible but the hardware is not compatible, you have been seeing windows 8 running on iPad but it was a remote session, using ipad to control another PC running windows 8. AFAIK, there was no single project being produced installing windows 8 in iPad. Splashtop's tool is being used to connect an iPad to a Windows 8 PC, making an illusion of running windows 8 on ipad.
there are windows 8-based tablets in the market now(samsung, ehem) amd windows 7-based tablets can also accommodate windows 8.
if you have enough funds, you can commission few programmers to make a hacked wiindows 8 pc(arm version is better) to make the sources of it compatible to iPad.
junpeikawada said:
Kabayan, it is possible but the hardware is not compatible, you have been seeing windows 8 running on iPad but it was a remote session, using ipad to control another PC running windows 8. AFAIK, there was no single project being produced installing windows 8 in iPad. Splashtop's tool is being used to connect an iPad to a Windows 8 PC, making an illusion of running windows 8 on ipad.
there are windows 8-based tablets in the market now(samsung, ehem) amd windows 7-based tablets can also accommodate windows 8.
if you have enough funds, you can commission few programmers to make a hacked wiindows 8 pc(arm version is better) to make the sources of it compatible to iPad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had to explain the same thing to my friend who switched from iOS to Android and asked me why he couldn't use Java when "cloud browse for iOS could". Had to explain to him that all he was seeing was a Linux system shunting the images from the java site to his iPod.
Sent from my LS-LS670 using XDA
:laugh: this is kind of joke.... :laugh:
hA....... Jobs is rolling over in his grave. Do some people think first? I'm gonna have to use this one at work.....
Sent from my Lumia 900 using Board Express
bzmotoninja83 said:
hA....... Jobs is rolling over in his grave. Do some people think first? I'm gonna have to use this one at work.....
Sent from my Lumia 900 using Board Express
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I like the idea of Steve jobs perpetually rolling around and around and around in his grave
Sent from my HTC One S using xda premium
androidcues said:
I like the idea of Steve jobs perpetually rolling around and around and around in his grave
Sent from my HTC One S using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
LOOOOOOOL!!!!!!!
If this is possable, I will go to the store and buy a iPad just for this use....
As I am not interested in it for iOS (sorry fanboys)
Put DOS on your macbook. U can really do it for free)
cogixo said:
How will that work? I mean Apple and Windows on a machine?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The thing is,questions like this show why the Surface is going to be a trainwreck. Windows on Apple hardware was done. First by some guy with quite a bit of talent and skill,then by apple themselves. The thing is,most endusers are so clueless they dont realize why this was possible OR why it was difficult.
It was possible of course becuase the newer apple hardware really IS PC hardware with a slightly different EFI firmware. Therefore running windows on it is possible.
The thing is,there are TWO versions of the Surface,and TWO version of windows 8,which are both completely different. One version of the surface is an ARM based tablet,and it runs a special ARM windows. It needs to run special ARM windows software and cant run normal apps. They call it Windows 8 RT. (presumably for RISC Tablet or RISC Technology)
Then there is the Pro version. It runs "real" windows 8,and can run normal windows programs. Its like a PC in a tablet form factor and will use an Intel Atom CPU. It also costs almost twice as much.
This will confuse people. They will go buy the RT tablet,thinking they can run all the WIndows software and be very angry and dissapointed when they find out the expensive tablet they bought is "useless". Microsofts promises of vast amounts of Metro enabled vaporware wont cut it.
Many of those people will probably STILL not understand. They will think that "Windows 8 wont run your old WIndows programs" and not only wont buy Windows 8 for their PC,they wont even buy a new PC becuase they will think that Windows 8 does not run their software. They saw it with their own eyes,and the guy at windows tech support told them that,or at least thats what they THINK they were told,the guy was hard to understand. Those people will be very angry at Microsoft. Macs will get a nice shot in the arm from this,after all,if you have to buy all new software,then Microsofts lost its barrier to people switching. Perception IS reality in this case.
In the end,this wont kill MS or anything,but they will have to spend a fortune to undo the damage. They will have to run commericals to explain the difference. The RT tablets will dissapear not long after they are released. MS will try to salvage the Windows 8 Pro tablet line. That will anger the people that shelled out 600 dollars for a new tablet and te OEMs that are dumb enough to jump on the bandwagon. (Apperantly HP is one such company thats dumb enough)
Thats not getting into the UI. Windows 8 probably works as well as anything else on a tablet,but it sucks on a desktop.
I expect to see the Metro UI dialed back or eliminated in the Windows 9,which should basically be a rebadged version of 8 with Metro turned off and a normal windows desktop. It will probably drop around early to mid 2014. Service pack one will probably make Metro default to off as well,at least for newly installed machines.
The worst thing will be the confusion. There are too many things they are coming out with called "windows 8". My mother cant even figure out how to create a new document and has to call me every time she does it. How is she going to keep "Windows 8 RT on a Surface","Windows 8 on a Surface pro","Windows 8 Home","windows 8 professional","Windows 8 Ultimate" and "Windows 8 Phone" strait. Which one runs what software again? thats the thing,it used to be,if it ran windows,it ran windows software. People understood that. They also came to understand that really old versions of software that ran on older versions of windows might not run on newer computers with their newer versions of windows. (Although they didnt understand why). This is going to be too much for end users to keep track of.
Now for the real question. Is it theoretically possible to put Windows 8 RT,the ARM version on a I-Pad. The answer is,yes,but it wont happen. Apple does not use standard chips like ,say the HP Touchpad. The chipset is different. The drivers wont exist for a i-Pad and its not a trivial thing to write them. Now,tablets like the Touchpad might someday have a custom Windows 8 RT rom for them. Thats becuase they use a qualcom chipset used in dozens of other devices. As such,its quite likely that drivers for the hardware will exist for Windows 8 RT for those tablets. This is how they were able to port Android to the Touchpad. Even that is a huge undertaking. Its almost a year later and its working quite well but its still not finished and many things (like the camera) do not work right.
---------- Post added at 04:56 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:41 AM ----------
DavidinCT said:
If this is possable, I will go to the store and buy a iPad just for this use....
As I am not interested in it for iOS (sorry fanboys)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Im not a fanboi but I question why you would want Windows 8 RT. Its going to be a disaster. You might as well run webOS. There are two tablets operating systems right now that are successful and then there are the also-rans. The ones no one in their right mind will pay 500 dollars for.
Theres Android,and theres iOS. Thats it. In fact,many android users would rather have a iPad but its too expensive. Thats both good and bad for android. If you look at it one way,maybe 1/3 of Android users are people who would rather have the competitions product but could not afford it. On the other hand,perhaps 1/3 of Android users were potential Apple customers who were swayed by the lower price and better value of Android tablets. Windows RT however is just like WebOS. Its something thats not an iPad,costs as MUCH as an iPad and is not as GOOD as an iPad.
You can beat apple by being as good as an iPad and being far cheaper. You can beat apple by costing as much as an iPad and being far better. However,you cant beat apple by being as good as an iPad and costing as much as one,becuase at the end of the day,Apple has one thing going for it,its product IS an iPad. Thats the one most people want. Microsoft is trying to beat Apple by selling a product that costs as much or more than an iPad,and is not as good as one. (HP tried it too) Now before the fanbois start flaming me,let me say,I dont think Windows 8 RT or WebOS worked nearly as well as Android or iOS,but lets just say they are actually a little better. Thats the thing,they are a little better,but not a lot better,on their own. But then there are apps. The tablet is worthless without apps. WebOS has hardly any. Windows 8 hardly has any. Therefore the iPad and Android are better.
A little better with the promise of some vaporware in the future wont do it. You need apps,and you need them NOW,or you at least have to convince people that you have a winner. You can do it if your just WAY better. But if your just a little better,or the same,or even worse,then no one will make apps,so no one will buy it,so no one will make apps (becuase theres no one to buy them)
Android can compete with iOS becuase for some people,Android is better. Its more open. For others,the closed nature of the iPad is "better". Windows 8RT however has all the disadvantages of iOS with none of the benefits.
pflatlyne said:
The thing is,questions like this show why the Surface is going to be a trainwreck. Windows on Apple hardware was done. First by some guy with quite a bit of talent and skill,then by apple themselves. The thing is,most endusers are so clueless they dont realize why this was possible OR why it was difficult.
It was possible of course becuase the newer apple hardware really IS PC hardware with a slightly different EFI firmware. Therefore running windows on it is possible.
The thing is,there are TWO versions of the Surface,and TWO version of windows 8,which are both completely different. One version of the surface is an ARM based tablet,and it runs a special ARM windows. It needs to run special ARM windows software and cant run normal apps. They call it Windows 8 RT. (presumably for RISC Tablet or RISC Technology)
Then there is the Pro version. It runs "real" windows 8,and can run normal windows programs. Its like a PC in a tablet form factor and will use an Intel Atom CPU. It also costs almost twice as much.
This will confuse people. They will go buy the RT tablet,thinking they can run all the WIndows software and be very angry and dissapointed when they find out the expensive tablet they bought is "useless". Microsofts promises of vast amounts of Metro enabled vaporware wont cut it.
Many of those people will probably STILL not understand. They will think that "Windows 8 wont run your old WIndows programs" and not only wont buy Windows 8 for their PC,they wont even buy a new PC becuase they will think that Windows 8 does not run their software. They saw it with their own eyes,and the guy at windows tech support told them that,or at least thats what they THINK they were told,the guy was hard to understand. Those people will be very angry at Microsoft. Macs will get a nice shot in the arm from this,after all,if you have to buy all new software,then Microsofts lost its barrier to people switching. Perception IS reality in this case.
In the end,this wont kill MS or anything,but they will have to spend a fortune to undo the damage. They will have to run commericals to explain the difference. The RT tablets will dissapear not long after they are released. MS will try to salvage the Windows 8 Pro tablet line. That will anger the people that shelled out 600 dollars for a new tablet and te OEMs that are dumb enough to jump on the bandwagon. (Apperantly HP is one such company thats dumb enough)
Thats not getting into the UI. Windows 8 probably works as well as anything else on a tablet,but it sucks on a desktop.
I expect to see the Metro UI dialed back or eliminated in the Windows 9,which should basically be a rebadged version of 8 with Metro turned off and a normal windows desktop. It will probably drop around early to mid 2014. Service pack one will probably make Metro default to off as well,at least for newly installed machines.
The worst thing will be the confusion. There are too many things they are coming out with called "windows 8". My mother cant even figure out how to create a new document and has to call me every time she does it. How is she going to keep "Windows 8 RT on a Surface","Windows 8 on a Surface pro","Windows 8 Home","windows 8 professional","Windows 8 Ultimate" and "Windows 8 Phone" strait. Which one runs what software again? thats the thing,it used to be,if it ran windows,it ran windows software. People understood that. They also came to understand that really old versions of software that ran on older versions of windows might not run on newer computers with their newer versions of windows. (Although they didnt understand why). This is going to be too much for end users to keep track of.
Now for the real question. Is it theoretically possible to put Windows 8 RT,the ARM version on a I-Pad. The answer is,yes,but it wont happen. Apple does not use standard chips like ,say the HP Touchpad. The chipset is different. The drivers wont exist for a i-Pad and its not a trivial thing to write them. Now,tablets like the Touchpad might someday have a custom Windows 8 RT rom for them. Thats becuase they use a qualcom chipset used in dozens of other devices. As such,its quite likely that drivers for the hardware will exist for Windows 8 RT for those tablets. This is how they were able to port Android to the Touchpad. Even that is a huge undertaking. Its almost a year later and its working quite well but its still not finished and many things (like the camera) do not work right.
---------- Post added at 04:56 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:41 AM ----------
Im not a fanboi but I question why you would want Windows 8 RT. Its going to be a disaster. You might as well run webOS. There are two tablets operating systems right now that are successful and then there are the also-rans. The ones no one in their right mind will pay 500 dollars for.
Theres Android,and theres iOS. Thats it. In fact,many android users would rather have a iPad but its too expensive. Thats both good and bad for android. If you look at it one way,maybe 1/3 of Android users are people who would rather have the competitions product but could not afford it. On the other hand,perhaps 1/3 of Android users were potential Apple customers who were swayed by the lower price and better value of Android tablets. Windows RT however is just like WebOS. Its something thats not an iPad,costs as MUCH as an iPad and is not as GOOD as an iPad.
You can beat apple by being as good as an iPad and being far cheaper. You can beat apple by costing as much as an iPad and being far better. However,you cant beat apple by being as good as an iPad and costing as much as one,becuase at the end of the day,Apple has one thing going for it,its product IS an iPad. Thats the one most people want. Microsoft is trying to beat Apple by selling a product that costs as much or more than an iPad,and is not as good as one. (HP tried it too) Now before the fanbois start flaming me,let me say,I dont think Windows 8 RT or WebOS worked nearly as well as Android or iOS,but lets just say they are actually a little better. Thats the thing,they are a little better,but not a lot better,on their own. But then there are apps. The tablet is worthless without apps. WebOS has hardly any. Windows 8 hardly has any. Therefore the iPad and Android are better.
A little better with the promise of some vaporware in the future wont do it. You need apps,and you need them NOW,or you at least have to convince people that you have a winner. You can do it if your just WAY better. But if your just a little better,or the same,or even worse,then no one will make apps,so no one will buy it,so no one will make apps (becuase theres no one to buy them)
Android can compete with iOS becuase for some people,Android is better. Its more open. For others,the closed nature of the iPad is "better". Windows 8RT however has all the disadvantages of iOS with none of the benefits.
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Click to collapse
While there is quite a lot of misinformation in your post, as I don't have a laptop at the minute, I'll only point out a few.
One, your using "vaporware" to describe metro apps on a system currently in active development. This is like you releasing a program currently in development and people calling it vaporware during it's beta release because there's no plugins "yet". Metro applications do exist and are growing in number.
Two, Microsoft has stated many times that RT would not run standard windows applications and I'm sure that will be in the advertising for the surface RT as well. Metro has enough apps for your causal tablet user. If casual joe wants standard windows applications, he'll buy a Surface Pro.
Three, Microsoft stated that Windows 8 was not going to have so many editions in this release. Not to mention that Windows 8 on a Surface Pro and RT (and probably WP8) will run the same Metro applications. Windows 8 on a surface pro will run the same applications as the normal computer.
Four, Microsoft is probably not going to scrap Metro. They've got enough of a user base on Windows 8 (since Developers Preview) to have enough information about metro. IMHO, if there was to be any inclination to scrap metro, we would've seen it in Release Preview with an on/off switch. Besides, they've put so much work into the interface and making that interface unified across their services and software.
As I said, I would write more if it weren't for the fact that I'm currently in the process of a move and my laptop's charger died on me.
No offense is meant by my post here, just thought I'd clear up some confusion that you seem to have.
Sent from my LG-LS670 using XDA
pflatlyne said:
The thing is,questions like this show why the Surface is going to be a trainwreck. Windows on Apple hardware was done. First by some guy with quite a bit of talent and skill,then by apple themselves. The thing is,most endusers are so clueless they dont realize why this was possible OR why it was difficult.
It was possible of course becuase the newer apple hardware really IS PC hardware with a slightly different EFI firmware. Therefore running windows on it is possible.
The thing is,there are TWO versions of the Surface,and TWO version of windows 8,which are both completely different. One version of the surface is an ARM based tablet,and it runs a special ARM windows. It needs to run special ARM windows software and cant run normal apps. They call it Windows 8 RT. (presumably for RISC Tablet or RISC Technology)
Then there is the Pro version. It runs "real" windows 8,and can run normal windows programs. Its like a PC in a tablet form factor and will use an Intel Atom CPU. It also costs almost twice as much.
This will confuse people. They will go buy the RT tablet,thinking they can run all the WIndows software and be very angry and dissapointed when they find out the expensive tablet they bought is "useless". Microsofts promises of vast amounts of Metro enabled vaporware wont cut it.
Many of those people will probably STILL not understand. They will think that "Windows 8 wont run your old WIndows programs" and not only wont buy Windows 8 for their PC,they wont even buy a new PC becuase they will think that Windows 8 does not run their software. They saw it with their own eyes,and the guy at windows tech support told them that,or at least thats what they THINK they were told,the guy was hard to understand. Those people will be very angry at Microsoft. Macs will get a nice shot in the arm from this,after all,if you have to buy all new software,then Microsofts lost its barrier to people switching. Perception IS reality in this case.
In the end,this wont kill MS or anything,but they will have to spend a fortune to undo the damage. They will have to run commericals to explain the difference. The RT tablets will dissapear not long after they are released. MS will try to salvage the Windows 8 Pro tablet line. That will anger the people that shelled out 600 dollars for a new tablet and te OEMs that are dumb enough to jump on the bandwagon. (Apperantly HP is one such company thats dumb enough)
Thats not getting into the UI. Windows 8 probably works as well as anything else on a tablet,but it sucks on a desktop.
I expect to see the Metro UI dialed back or eliminated in the Windows 9,which should basically be a rebadged version of 8 with Metro turned off and a normal windows desktop. It will probably drop around early to mid 2014. Service pack one will probably make Metro default to off as well,at least for newly installed machines.
The worst thing will be the confusion. There are too many things they are coming out with called "windows 8". My mother cant even figure out how to create a new document and has to call me every time she does it. How is she going to keep "Windows 8 RT on a Surface","Windows 8 on a Surface pro","Windows 8 Home","windows 8 professional","Windows 8 Ultimate" and "Windows 8 Phone" strait. Which one runs what software again? thats the thing,it used to be,if it ran windows,it ran windows software. People understood that. They also came to understand that really old versions of software that ran on older versions of windows might not run on newer computers with their newer versions of windows. (Although they didnt understand why). This is going to be too much for end users to keep track of.
Now for the real question. Is it theoretically possible to put Windows 8 RT,the ARM version on a I-Pad. The answer is,yes,but it wont happen. Apple does not use standard chips like ,say the HP Touchpad. The chipset is different. The drivers wont exist for a i-Pad and its not a trivial thing to write them. Now,tablets like the Touchpad might someday have a custom Windows 8 RT rom for them. Thats becuase they use a qualcom chipset used in dozens of other devices. As such,its quite likely that drivers for the hardware will exist for Windows 8 RT for those tablets. This is how they were able to port Android to the Touchpad. Even that is a huge undertaking. Its almost a year later and its working quite well but its still not finished and many things (like the camera) do not work right.
---------- Post added at 04:56 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:41 AM ----------
Im not a fanboi but I question why you would want Windows 8 RT. Its going to be a disaster. You might as well run webOS. There are two tablets operating systems right now that are successful and then there are the also-rans. The ones no one in their right mind will pay 500 dollars for.
Theres Android,and theres iOS. Thats it. In fact,many android users would rather have a iPad but its too expensive. Thats both good and bad for android. If you look at it one way,maybe 1/3 of Android users are people who would rather have the competitions product but could not afford it. On the other hand,perhaps 1/3 of Android users were potential Apple customers who were swayed by the lower price and better value of Android tablets. Windows RT however is just like WebOS. Its something thats not an iPad,costs as MUCH as an iPad and is not as GOOD as an iPad.
You can beat apple by being as good as an iPad and being far cheaper. You can beat apple by costing as much as an iPad and being far better. However,you cant beat apple by being as good as an iPad and costing as much as one,becuase at the end of the day,Apple has one thing going for it,its product IS an iPad. Thats the one most people want. Microsoft is trying to beat Apple by selling a product that costs as much or more than an iPad,and is not as good as one. (HP tried it too) Now before the fanbois start flaming me,let me say,I dont think Windows 8 RT or WebOS worked nearly as well as Android or iOS,but lets just say they are actually a little better. Thats the thing,they are a little better,but not a lot better,on their own. But then there are apps. The tablet is worthless without apps. WebOS has hardly any. Windows 8 hardly has any. Therefore the iPad and Android are better.
A little better with the promise of some vaporware in the future wont do it. You need apps,and you need them NOW,or you at least have to convince people that you have a winner. You can do it if your just WAY better. But if your just a little better,or the same,or even worse,then no one will make apps,so no one will buy it,so no one will make apps (becuase theres no one to buy them)
Android can compete with iOS becuase for some people,Android is better. Its more open. For others,the closed nature of the iPad is "better". Windows 8RT however has all the disadvantages of iOS with none of the benefits.
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Click to collapse
i disagree with you completely, just cause something has changed doesnt mean it is bad, metro is an amazing UI for both touch and keyboard and mouse, sure it takes some getting use to but it will always be like that and i dont think you have even tried windows 8, the windows store already has a bunch of metro apps and the os isnt even released as a final product yet. as for windows rt, i feel that will succeed because it is enough for average joe blow to browse the web and play some small games, and even if you need to run pc programs, im 100% sure there will be emulation for x86/x64 programs whether its native or its from a third party company like vmware.
tbh you are being a fanboy so please dont lie to yourself by saying you're not, you're comparing an unreleased os to a failed os because webos doesnt have any apps and windows 8 doesnt have many in its current state and on top of that, you're defending current tablet os's at every chance you get just because they have more apps
heck the reason you NEED an app to do something on ios and android is because you cant do much with the built in apps, have you tried using facebook's desktop site on your android tablet, the experience is terrible, nothing clicks right, you cant hover over drop menus, ect. while on IE10 everything works the way it should, it doesnt freezee or try to click something behind a drop menu, everything just works
and yes i am being a fanboy, windows 8 is the future for mobile computing, especially when there are going to be so many hybrid laptop tablets coming out in the near future, windows 8 would have done what the ipad and android tabs have failed to do, kill the laptop
I agree with you completely pflatlyne, though as previously stated there are many inaccuracies in your post.
One thing I want to point out that hasn't been already corrected: the SurfacePro will run an x64 inter i-Core series CPU, not an Atom
mtmerrick said:
I agree with you completely pflatlyne, though as previously stated there are many inaccuracies in your post.
One thing I want to point out that hasn't been already corrected: the SurfacePro will run an x64 inter i-Core series CPU, not an Atom
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Click to collapse
but it could do, future Atoms will be developed and improved uppon, there is no technically reason Win8 Pro wont run on an Atom or an i7!
infact id put money it there being mid level devices released some time after the initial release to fill the void between ARM and i5 although in saying that there is apparently only 10w difference between the two so perhaps new i3s will become the new Atom ultra low watt SKUs
Can someone point or steer me in the right direction?
I am a IT/hackit type person, and I am searching for the best "do it all" system. I don't mind glitchy/buggy systems so long as I can always boot or flash the system stable if I need/want to.
(Read below, if you want to know why/how I got here)
I am largely clueless about windows 7, 2008r2, 8, 8rt, and all post wince phone varients, but I want to expose myself to it if at all possible. I really want to re.perk my interest in linux/android/windows and anything else I am not up on (Facebook/twitter/cloudXYZ intigration).
I haven't used an iphone/ipad much (I had an early ipod, one of the USB sticks with no screen). Other than almost always smooth interface, and high res display, it hasn't perked my interest much. That may just be all the guppies, itunes, closed mindedness, and general leash to many of them wear. If I ever got one, it would either need to run android (or heck, windows, bsd, anything), or there would need some other compelling reason ( runs android/google play apps, has a 3rd part app store, or I dunno, something).
Anyways, back on topic...
I am seeking hardware that can do all, or most all, of the following:
Run android ICS/JB
Has a somewhat active community
Can operate as a tablet and phone (preferably gsm/3g with native phone support)
Can run whatever flavors of windows are interesting (Windows 8, windows 8 rt, etc)
If needed, I can jump ship to x86, but I don't know how unusable android might be.
I'm willing to virtualize or split hardware if I must. (I.e. voip, vmware, terminal, etc.)
A nice plus would be incredible hardware specs (4 core or >1gb ram), even if price is high.
Right now I have a 2 month old galaxy tab 7.7 (p6800). It died, and is in the process of being fixed/replaced/refunded. It's demise prompted my search for a replacement, which in turn, brought me across some windows 8 articles. All I know about windows 8 is what I read in the past hour or so. I came across some stuff about an ARM capable windows (though limited by secure boot), some dual booting of windows x86 tablets, and I think some ICS/win7phone?, etc. I couldn't figure out where to start reading and/or if I should skip it or split it.
BELOW:
Welcome to my personal short story. In short, I have been very ill, and offline for the past 4 years. Prior to that I haven't gone more than a day or two since 1986 without in some way using a computer. I have always hovered at the bleeding edge, and started my career pushing customized solutions, documentation, and "proof of concept" designs.
Fast forward to 2007, using my IT skills I switched to a more top end systems/workflow design, decision matrix, and proof of concept (often centered around server consolidation, virtualization, and terminal emulation (everything from bsd/linux to dos/windows). I also touched countless applications from legacy to high end multimedia/desktops. Most all of my off time was spent pushing hardware, network(+internet), operating system, and virtulalization/duel booting/cross platform interoperability.
Shortly before 2004, I had a life saving surgery, and was good to go (at my best). Then, in 2007/2008 I suffered several major relapses in health. From then until early this year (2012), I was so sick, I couldn't do much at all. Being an early adopter of the original motorola droid, I did manage to stay in touch. I did some very simplistic modding, but didn't have the brain power to do much. My family got me a droid x and a xoom tablet later on, and I had a couple good spells where I rooted and did lite modding.
Why all this detail? It's my best effort to show my perspective and maybe where I am trying to come at or re-enter the IT/hackery world. I really want to catch up, start having fun again, and get cleared to work again!
Thanks for reading this, any pointers to hardware, ariticals, forums, and/or just some search terms would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers,
-D0c5i5 (aka. Jon or JonC)
There is nothing
I believe there is an old 2.x version of Android running on x86 meaning you could buy a normal x86 device and install Win 8 and Android
using win RT devices with android isn't possible yet
installing RT on Android devices isn't possible yet
Windows phone was never "hacked" as such so if MS insisted on the same level of security its highly unlikely we will have dual boot ARM devices any time soon.
as for dual boot x86, well, youd better get on to the android folk for that one
dazza9075 said:
There is nothing
I believe there is an old 2.x version of Android running on x86 meaning you could buy a normal x86 device and install Win 8 and Android
using win RT devices with android isn't possible yet
installing RT on Android devices isn't possible yet
Windows phone was never "hacked" as such so if MS insisted on the same level of security its highly unlikely we will have dual boot ARM devices any time soon.
as for dual boot x86, well, youd better get on to the android folk for that one
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http://www.android-x86.org/
There's also BlueStacks for emulating Android apps on Windows. I don't believe they have an RT version, though.
JihadSquad said:
http://www.android-x86.org/
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Known issues
•Suspend and resume doesn't work on some targets.
•Not support Ethernet.
indeed, its been updated to ICS
Maybe it will soon be possible to run android and windows nt nativly at the same time on the SGT!
how? - ReactOS:
http://www.reactos.org/ (if you are going to test it in a virtual machine dont' use the 0.3.14 version of os, use the trunk build version its much much much better)
ReactOS is an open source windows clone and most of the windows applications work on it ! (MS office, opera, ff, ...) the good news is there is an ARM port of ReactOS - Windows RT equivalent:
http://www.reactos.org/wiki/ARM_Port
ReactOS still has problems to work on real hardware because of many different components but on some PC it works very well (it can be targeted to SGT fix the bugs)
The ARM port is able to run on the SGT but there is still a lot of work to do.
Windows will soon release a Office ARM version for winRT and in order to run any windows application on the SGT a recompile is needed.
and about android there is already a port of android that runs native on windowsne emulation no virtual machine !!)
http://mobile.slashdot.org/story/13/...tm_medium=feed
If anyone has any coding skills it would be nice to try to port reactos to the SGT or just to donate to the project with the subject "arm port for SGT"
This runs pretty well even at alpha stage, I tested it in virtualbox in my laptop, and I'll test it on emulator in my SGT soon... they've planned to bring it up to windows 8... hope that everyone interested here will help the fundraising...
I posted this just to keep this thread up, so don't blame me for not saying anything useful...
I think(theory) that it will run very smoothly on SGT, because it only uses 6mb of graphic memory, I tested it with 256mb RAM and 500mb HDD, and it was better than my expectations!
I really recommend all to try it...:good:
While I applause the developers efforts and certainly see potential benefit..I wonder still if it not more practical to remote desktop as thin client using an app like splashtop for full windows desktop usability?
Sent from my SCH-I905 using xda app-developers app
Awesome
This is awesome! Great work!
This would be great.But, what I would really like,is to have all 3 OS on one tablet.
redhk886 said:
This would be great.But, what I would really like,is to have all 3 OS on one tablet.
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Why you gotta get greedy 5 posts in?
I have 20 US Dollars for the first person that can port even an alpha of this, and an extra 15 USD to anyone who can fix up our Ubuntu port (everything needed to fix the kernel is available in Samsung's ICS kernel). There are just too many sweet things that we get close to but never actually get.
Has there even been any Android based device that has had ReactOS running on it ever?
It sounds like OP is just rambling nonsense and wishful thinking.
The ARM port is able to run on the SGT but there is still a lot of work to do.
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What is the basis for this statement? Has someone demonstrated any ReactOS code running on a Tegra 2? Is it simply because someone put up that ARM Port section of the wiki? The ARM CPUs represent a wide range of devices. Just because someone decided to put up a blurb about that doesn't mean we are anywhere close to getting a worth while port of ReactOS running on this device.
Why is there a link to some Slashdot story from 1998?
Perhaps this is the way to go to make this tablet suck less, but I would recommend switching to a windows tablet, either a Rt-based or a x86-based tablet. Back when galaxy tab 2 10.1 came to the stores, I went ahead and got one.
And that was a decision I soon came to regret deeply. Android is simply not comparable to windows, not even on a tablet.
So I went to buy a hp elitepad, running windows 8 pro. This impressed me so much that I also bought an Asus vivotab Rt.
The fact that the elitepad is running x86, means that I now will install virtualbox, and then install android for x86.
And perhaps mac os, windows nt, bsd or Ubuntu. Time will show.
My point here being, it is better to start with a superior os and then install the inferior ones, instead of doing this in reverse.
ottoen said:
Perhaps this is the way to go to make this tablet suck less, but I would recommend switching to a windows tablet, either a Rt-based or a x86-based tablet. Back when galaxy tab 2 10.1 came to the stores, I went ahead and got one.
And that was a decision I soon came to regret deeply. Android is simply not comparable to windows, not even on a tablet.
So I went to buy a hp elitepad, running windows 8 pro. This impressed me so much that I also bought an Asus vivotab Rt.
The fact that the elitepad is running x86, means that I now will install virtualbox, and then install android for x86.
And perhaps mac os, windows nt, bsd or Ubuntu. Time will show.
My point here being, it is better to start with a superior os and then install the inferior ones, instead of doing this in reverse.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You really can't compare a weak Tegra 2 processor to a much more powerful Intel processor, based on two totally different architectures, running two totally different OSes, two totally different tablets with entirely different specs... You're comparing a snail to a Toyota sports car.
Try out a Tegra 4 tablet or a Snapdragon 800 tablet... That's some good stuff. Nexus 10 too, Exynos is a beast.