Database Users

WallpaperGate may be a conspiracy against Android reputation...

A few blog and newspaper are reporting the discovery disclosed by 2 Apple hacker at blackhat conference. (if they are not apple fanboy then they sure look like they are)
http://mobile.venturebeat.com/2010/...-steals-your-data-was-downloaded-by-millions/
As much as I do care about data security and think that some people may not be careful enough about what they carry on their phone, I dislike reading such story without much proof, I truly hope Google will put an end to this by posting something about it.
The funny part is that the application made by their company (lookout) is asking for MUCH MORE right than the wallpaper they are pinpointing, I am also wondering about their genome project and I am wondering if they used that "virus scanner" to gather application info from the people who used it (that being said without any proof, just my gut feeling exactly like their theory on those wallpaper)
On a more positive side I hope this will raise some people awareness about what they install on their phone even rom's could one day get compromised but I do not think we are there yet...
So the whole point of this post is to ask all the blogger around to get back to those 2 security researcher and ask them to provide proof (source code) of the malware they found so that we can put an end to this story either way...

The more people will switch from the Apple to Android, the more hate and dirt there will be about Android.
It's just getting started.
Personally, it's fun to watch, they gonna lose anyway.

DarkDvr said:
The more people will switch from the Apple to Android, the more hate and dirt there will be about Android.
It's just getting started.
Personally, it's fun to watch, they gonna lose anyway.
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I do respect apple for bringing some great innovation but I am concerned about the lack of quality coverage I see in some blog and online news paper, I mean nobody seem to have asked proof or a second opinion on quite a few recent post (like the 80% of android user would not buy another one story...)
As for the winner or looser, as long as user win I am fine with this war...

I saw this and it seems like propaganda....they took all the time to write the article but neglected to mention the application name.

britoso said:
I saw this and it seems like propaganda....they took all the time to write the article but neglected to mention the application name.
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They did publish the name of the app, In fact a LOT of different one since this is simply a program that download wallpaper from various theme. the guy have flooded the market with all of the different theme he offer.
http://www.androidcentral.com/rogue-android app-stealing-data-according-security-firm#comments
If you look at the update they wrote to change a bit the story of what the application does, the developer seem to be a bit lost about this.
Either way if this app is really a malware then they should have contacted google, and they should have published the EXACT description of what they do, instead they talk about their market analysis ...

Some fact, about time!
http://blog.mylookout.com/2010/07/mobile-application-analysis-blackhat/#more-1380
Here's the developer answer so android central http://www.scribd.com/mobile/documents/35072457
Now let's see if Google has something to say about this WallPaperGate... in the mean time it look like they SUSPENDED all the developer app
Personally I have no problem with those wallpaper app, I do not use lookout tho since I believe it's asking for too much right and I am not convinced it does something at all

How about "flickey wallpaper" ? I use that one, and it rhymes with the listed application.

adambenjamin said:
How about "flickey wallpaper" ? I use that one, and it rhymes with the listed application.
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Hey thanks for pointing this program (flikie) it's great!
The right requested by flikie are quite normal so I installed it, I do not use picture as wallpaper usually but I do like to watch them!
Back to the topics, I think the developpers in general should review their apps and make sure they do not ask for undue right!

Application to protect yourself
I personally use aSpotCat to screen what the application are using as right on my nexus one, it is free and allow you to revise the right of installed app
If you know of other app that can prevent malware from spreading please post them

thats how it is in an open system. some people will exploit it.
thats a trade off of the android market.... we will get spyware eventually.

I agree with antikryst... this happens on any platform. Don't look like iPhans and deny the truth and deflect the blame. These guys may or may not have an agenda, but they didn't "seem" to make this stuff up.

I call partly BS
The wallpaper apps in question cannot access your contact's phone numbers, SMS messages or personal information.
Check out the manifest permissions on the apps in question. It is the last item that is the problem.
!Storage
modify Delete
!Your location
coarse (network-based) location
!Network communication
full Internet access
!Phone calls
read phone state and identity
The permission only allows the app to read the IMEI number of your phone (your hardware's unique identifying number), your phone number, and your currently programmed voice-mail number. If you hard coded your voice-mail password as part of your voice-mail number, then they have that too.
They shouldn't be stealing this info, and Google should separate "read phone state" from "read identity", but the stories on this app stating that your SMS's and contacts being stolen and sent to China just plain wrong.

johnp263 said:
They shouldn't be stealing this info, and Google should separate "read phone state" from "read identity", but the stories on this app stating that your SMS's and contacts being stolen and sent to China just plain wrong.
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And, unfortunately, that stemmed from the original article written at VentureBeat being incorrect. The presenters never actually said SMS and browser history were compromised. I know that at least Engadget was contacted and informed that the article at VentureBeat was incorrect, and VentureBeat also corrected their article to indicate that SMSs and browser histories were not being compromised. But at the start, it was too late, and from there, it was a game of telephone.
Here is a blog post by one of the presenters to clarify everything.
http://blog.mylookout.com/2010/07/mobile-application-analysis-blackhat/

amnigo said:
And, unfortunately, that stemmed from the original article written at VentureBeat being incorrect. The presenters never actually said SMS and browser history were compromised. I know that at least Engadget was contacted and informed that the article at VentureBeat was incorrect, and VentureBeat also corrected their article to indicate that SMSs and browser histories were not being compromised. But at the start, it was too late, and from there, it was a game of telephone.
Here is a blog post by one of the presenters to clarify everything.
http://blog.mylookout.com/2010/07/mobile-application-analysis-blackhat/
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What a douche bag. The initial commentary about the apps was essentially "It's stealing you babies and your babie's babie's babies".
But I guess actually telling what the app actually does is a little less exciting than what they did.

Just to let everyone something to think about...

Read this link. Read it carefully. It's not just about Google being able to run whatever code they like on your devices, it's about Google DOING it, remotely, without any user intervention/confirmation.
What's next ? Let me throw some wild and far fetched guesses...
* Applanet like apps being killed off on the devices to fight piracy...
* Anything not from the market being wiped out from time to time, for the same reason...
* Users are hunted down and being prosecuted for piracy based on their devices content...
* The system is rigged/updated to block inappropriate content, such as pedophile sites...
* Users are being prosecuted for possessing and/or visiting inappropriate content/providers...
* The "inappropriate" extends to warez sites and regular porn sites, "bad" users are still prosecuted...
* The "inappropriate" extend to the "wrong" political sites, "bad" users are still prosecuted...
* .......
I bet you get the idea. And yea, i know i am taking it too far, but still
PS: Let me add something... the builds we are running on our HD2 are often partially illegal (gaps) etc... hint hint

maybe a little paranoid, ok, well maybe a lot
InfX said:
* The system is rigged/updated to block inappropriate content, such as pedophile sites...
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not sure why you mentioned this, anyone in their right mind would welcome this particular point.

kam333 said:
maybe a little paranoid, ok, well maybe a lot
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A lot, exaggerated to the max, of course. But that doesn't turn what Google does right.
kam333 said:
not sure why you mentioned this, anyone in their right mind would welcome this particular point.
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Thats EXACTLY why i mentioned it.

InfX said:
A lot, exaggerated to the max, of course. But that doesn't turn what Google does right.
Thats EXACTLY why i mentioned it.
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personally, i think google already knows tooooo much about its users, but in the case of malware, google is definitely the lesser of the 2 evils
let me ask you this, would you rather the big G have some remote access to your device or hackers collecting your personal info. Its the connected world, there's no turning back!!!
only real solution for anyone worried about companies interfering with their device... remove the sim card... for ever.
gnight & dont have nightmares

kam333 said:
would you rather the big G have some remote access to your device or hackers collecting your personal info.
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Guess what... neither of those

Also, there are terrorists under the bed,chemtrails in the sky, bromine in the water,drug dealers at the school gates, drunks on fones in cars, bondage freaks at work,human traffickers, religious zealots bent coppers paedo nursery workers racists fanatics and plain clothes Google operatives spreading FUD in forums cos its cheaper and gets more results than million pound lawsuits. Oh and bloody clowns.
Just a random outpouring,please continue.

Infx may sound paranoid, and no person of any kind of moral decency would condone anbody using pedophelia porn or any other form of content that causes any kind of harm to anyone. But those are matters for the authorities to deal with, not google. If the internet's morality policies were enforced by a huge internet based company, wouldn't that be considered some kind of a conflict of interests somehow? I mean imagine if Disney were the biggest internet company, we'd never see so much as a single cuss-word or titty. Big companies shouldn't be able to impose their own commercialized morals upon users, the internet will inevitably grow more and more watered down. I don't consider myself a paranoid person, but this type of issue stinks of denial of 1st amendment rights, one step closer to completely government/corporate filtered news-tainment, and corporate control of the masses.

Huggs, i totally agree, thata why i posted this, not because i am actualluly that paranoid (would i still use Internet if i was ?). What i tried to do in my post is to demonstrate a worst case scenario, how would google start with somethimg that should be totally accepted by everyone (fighting pedophily) yet slowly move to fighting things we no longer want it to fight (political opinions).
PS: This little remote control thing is the first step for a corporate giant to become a corporate government, a corporate dictator. And the onlu things corporations care for is money, not their users.
PPS: Just my personal opinion, feel free to disagree.

I like that idea: http://code.google.com/p/open-android-alliance/

InfX said:
Guess what... neither of those
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you really dont have a great deal of options
android, rim, ios & wp7 all have the ability to "spy" on their users to some degree,
mostly its just basic info such as: gps location, installed apps & how often they're used, crash logs, etc
some apps on ios have been caught out sending even more personal data. The point is, whilst i dont disagree fully with your concerns, i do see your post as somewhat hysterical.
There was no suggestion in the article you linked (or any other that ive read) that google is planning any of things you mentioned, so why mention them, as doing so only makes you a part of the current media trend of FUD as samsamuel put it.
this isnt about deny that all companies are in it 1st for the £$€, then customer welfare further down the list, im talking about being realistic. at this moment in time i cannot see google taking the path that you suggested, i also have far more immediate and real life things to focus on.
im all for a good conspiracy theory, fema detention camps springing up all over the usa (REX 84), the western so called "powers" planting the seeds of unrest in africa & the middle east so they can insert more puppets to secure natural resources (be it oil, gold, diamonds...), i could go on, but this isnt the place.
so let bring it back to google, you are in denial if you think cyber crime isnt going on, and with the rise of the smartphones we will see a rise of cyber crims trying to gain access. so i ask again who would you rather have access to your device?
if you still think or say neither, il know for sure you have lost the plot or you have taken my advice & binned your sim card cause thats the only other option you have.
@huggs, normally your post are quite informative & rational, that last post wasnt imho
no one was talking about censorship, the 1 point about google blocking access to child porn is something i would vote for, this has nothing to do with internet policing, you say thats down to the authorities, but they are not all seeing (no yet anyway) hence the use of informants by law enforcement the world wide, n thats all i would support. yes its possible that you give them a small mandate they will take it further but il worry about that IF the signs arise.
ppl who get there kick this way should have no rights, & should be actively hunted by whatever methods are available & taken out of the general population.
P.S.
Man i would love to have such a care free life that i need to start imagining then stressing about what may or may not happen, but i dont, my concerns are here & now, What you are talking about ISNT.
sorry for the lengthy post but your suggestions/posts are a subtle form of propaganda and a 1 line response really wouldn't cut it.
all the best
Kam

I say if we are doing something wrong and get caught that's our own fault.

How is it illegal? Isn't android open license ie freeware?
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App

@kam333, i may be way less paranoid than you may think, mind the fact i've posted this as a VERY far-fetched and unrealistic speculation that only got slim to nil chance of actually happening, but it does demonstrate a possibility of undoubtedly good things becoming a base to slowly advance into nasty control-it-all direction. And, yea, your suggestion about binning the SIM card won't work. I still got WiFi
@dung8604, search the net about why Cyanogen mod no longer includes Google apps.

Well, I'm running a cooked rom without a Google account set up. So I can cross that off of the paranoid list.

I can't say I'm surprised by anything written in the article.

Did a quick search and from what i can tell, only Google apps are proprietary. Nothing about the OS itself though
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App

{Everyone} Help Fight For Unlocked Bootloaders

Finally today i had enough... I filed a formal complaint with the FTC against motorola and all other mobile device manufacturers out lining the cause and effect of these companies selling us devices that we are made to be only users of rather than owners and administrators the devices we purchased. Nothing will change until we make some one step in and set the rules, i am encouraging everyone here on xda to do the same ... here is a link to the example complaint i filed and the link to the appropriate form to be filed
http://t0dbld.blogspot.com/2011/03/my-complaint-to-ftc-on-lock-bootloaders.html
https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/FTC_Wizard.aspx?Lang=en

Can I still do this as a Canadian Citizen or is it only for Americans?

mafiaboy01 said:
Can I still do this as a Canadian Citizen or is it only for Americans?
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could not hurt...

even though I don't own this device anymore I still filed a complaint. Rooting this device is much easier than the HTC Inspire. I hope they listen.

Good luck with this. You'll need it. No sarcasm intended.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App

t0dbld, I read your complaint and don't take my comment as negative but your complaint is full of grammatical errors. The case in point about Samsung keylogging has been debunked. But your example is always a possible scenario. AT&T data capping speeds for all phones but the iPhone is something we could mention as crippling.
I'm 100% in favor of unlocking our phones boot loader.
http://www.networkworld.com/newsletters/sec/2011/032811sec2.html <-- Samsung false alarm article.
Again, I don't mean any disrespect. I appreciate the developers who help the Android community, especially the Atrix.

Here was my submission:
Motorola makes and sells a device called the Motorola Atrix. They have, in the boot-loader, added a cryptographic signing check that prevents any software not created, and signed by Motorola from executing on the device. I believe this business practice to be monopolistic, and anti-consumer. While modifying the operating system voids any warranty on the device, as a consumer purchasing this device I should have the option to modify, or improve the device in any way I see fit.
In short: Motorola is exhibiting monopolistic business practices by locking the device down and disallowing third party operating system software to be installed.
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t0dbld said:
Finally today i had enough... I filed a formal complaint with the FTC against motorola and all other mobile device manufacturers out lining the cause and effect of these companies selling us devices that we are made to be only users of rather than owners and administrators the devices we purchased. Nothing will change until we make some one step in and set the rules, i am encouraging everyone here on xda to do the same ... here is a link to the example complaint i filed and the link to the appropriate form to be filed
http://t0dbld.blogspot.com/2011/03/my-complaint-to-ftc-on-lock-bootloaders.html
https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/FTC_Wizard.aspx?Lang=en
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I smell an april fools setup post.... if not.. everyone remember what day tomorrow is.

mafiaboy01 said:
Can I still do this as a Canadian Citizen or is it only for Americans?
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kdoodle said:
t0dbld, I read your complaint and don't take my comment as negative but your complaint is full of grammatical errors. The case in point about Samsung keylogging has been debunked. But your example is always a possible scenario. AT&T data capping speeds for all phones but the iPhone is something we could mention as crippling.
I'm 100% in favor of unlocking our phones boot loader.
http://www.networkworld.com/newsletters/sec/2011/032811sec2.html <-- Samsung false alarm article.
Again, I don't mean any disrespect. I appreciate the developers who help the Android community, especially the Atrix.
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I replied on the blog but i will reply here as will in case you did not read , that is a blog, i am not concenred with errors or anything there, also that was not my EXACT complaint as i did not want it to just get copy and pasted hence taking away from my formal complaint, while i appreciate your support and interest , i do think your time would have better used to file an actual complaint as per my request , rather than writing me a 2 page comment about mine either way good to have you on board, and make sure yours is well written

You should have let me proof that prior to submission. Other than it being way to long, over technical, and demonstrating piss poor English it did actually make some points! No hard feelings bro
The problem is that corporate America will not read our complaints, they simply don't care about anything but their bottom dollar. The bottom dollar is protected by the boot loader. New features? Go buy our new device!
The way I see it, we have two options.
A.) Petition our government to impose regulations and implement new laws to control these corporations and protect our consumer rights. But wait, doesn't our government make a lot of money off this industry in every aspect? How much tax did you pay when you bought your device? Ever look at the taxes on your phone bill? It's rape any way you cut it. It's not the 'sleeping with your girlfriend while she's passed out drunk' rape. It's more like the 'in the alley, behind a dumpster, while it's raining and dark getting raped by an HIV infected ex-con bum' rape. So my point is, the FTC is a government subsidiary and our taxes pay their salerys. We have established that they enjoy to rape us and we pay them to do it. Keep up the complaints, they just might change their outlook on life. For now, I would say option A can be scratched off the list.
B.) Start a revolution. Unite, gather our firearms, cordinate our forces, and take our country back!
Or someone smarter than I could just crack the damn boot loader... That's all i have for now, time to burn one

Submitted complaint

Moved to general as not android development

tical2k said:
I smell an april fools setup post.... if not.. everyone remember what day tomorrow is.
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ummm are you that dense this is not a joke
thedude420 said:
You should have let me proof that prior to submission. Other than it being way to long, over technical, and demonstrating piss poor English it did actually make some points! No hard feelings bro
The problem is that corporate America will not read our complaints, they simply don't care about anything but their bottom dollar. The bottom dollar is protected by the boot loader. New features? Go buy our new device!
The way I see it, we have two options.
A.) Petition our government to impose regulations and implement new laws to control these corporations and protect our consumer rights. But wait, doesn't our government make a lot of money off this industry in every aspect? How much tax did you pay when you bought your device? Ever look at the taxes on your phone bill? It's rape any way you cut it. It's not the 'sleeping with your girlfriend while she's passed out drunk' rape. It's more like the 'in the alley, behind a dumpster, while it's raining and dark getting raped by an HIV infected ex-con bum' rape. So my point is, the FTC is a government subsidiary and our taxes pay their salerys. We have established that they enjoy to rape us and we pay them to do it. Keep up the complaints, they just might change their outlook on life. For now, I would say option A can be scratched off the list.
B.) Start a revolution. Unite, gather our firearms, cordinate our forces, and take our country back!
Or someone smarter than I could just crack the damn boot loader... That's all i have for now, time to burn one
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OK nice ridiculous rant , for the last time that was not the EXACT complaint, secondly the FTC is the closest government agency that would have anything to do with this so what do you think we are doing, third please mr 420 hippy do something on your own than, to many times i have been given suggestions by pot smoking liberals with all the answers... yet never once seen them step up to the plate, while my self on the other hand has a long documented court history for the things i believed in and stood up for, i am not against any method of trying to draw attention and get results as this is not about the phone in my hand today but the future of the industry, so please try any method you wish but than do it and than give us your lesson about rape and pot smoke and alleys as the rest of us act with actions.... not long drawn out imaginative story's after "burning one" than dont make any real sense or have any relevance

No not dense, just real. Why would THIS make a difference, the community has been *****ing about bootloaders being locked for ages. Just throw another *****ing complaint in the pile, they don't care. Get a lawyer pack that can combat ATT and/or moto. Are you THAT dense to think you can make a difference. Dont get me wrong I like your spirit and you have an ethos, but not enough money to fix it. sorry face reality.

tical2k said:
No not dense, just real. Why would THIS make a difference, the community has been *****ing about bootloaders being locked for ages. Just throw another *****ing complaint in the pile, they don't care. Get a lawyer pack that can combat ATT and/or moto. Are you THAT dense to think you can make a difference. Dont get me wrong I like your spirit and you have an ethos, but not enough money to fix it. sorry face reality.
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your right.... give up and win, why vote either your vote doesnt count so who cares

t0dbld said:
your right.... give up and win, why vote either your vote doesnt count so who cares
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Nice rebuttle. And for the record I vote... right down the middle to maintain chaos, because politics are only good when they don't do anything unless they both parties agree on it. If you dont like the bootloader being locked why buy it? Also why not return it.

tical2k said:
Nice rebuttle. And for the record I vote... right down the middle to maintain chaos, because politics are only good when they don't do anything unless they both parties agree on it. If you dont like the bootloader being locked why buy it? Also why not return it.
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Your missing the point entirely , this is not about my motorola atrix, i could care less and mine will be unlocked sooner than later... this is about the fact that they have no right to make us users on devices that we own, we own it we deserve to have administrative rights as well as the option to load what ever software we want on it... period

Go away, troll

t0dbld said:
Your missing the point entirely , this is not about my motorola atrix, i could care less and mine will be unlocked sooner than later... this is about the fact that they have no right to make us users on devices that we own, we own it we deserve to have administrative rights as well as the option to load what ever software we want on it... period
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I end with a quote from Swimming with Sharks (a great kevin spacey movie btw):
"Look, I can appreciate this. I was young too, I felt just like you. Hated authority, hated all my bosses, thought they were full of ****. Look, it's like they say, if you're not a rebel by the age of 20, you got no heart, but if you haven't turned establishment by 30, you've got no brains. Because there are no story-book romances, no fairy-tale endings. So before you run out and change the world, ask yourself, "What do you really want?"

I submitted it.
Everyone please do this it doesn't take any time.

Carrier IQ Exposed in Video

TrevE created a video demonstrating the tracking ability of Carrier IQ. Very scary stuff - reads your SMS and copies to Carrier IQ before you even see it. Also completely bypasses https and reads supposedly secure browsing information and notes your location even if you opted not to share your location.
Video here: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/11/30/smartphone_spying_app/
View it while you can. It will probably be taken down with a C&D from Carrier IQ soon. Can't have people knowing what they're up to. We've known about CIQ for a while now and many of the Devs are automatically removing it from their ROMs.

just posted the vid on my fb to help get the word around. everyone should post it to where ever they can, tell friends, family,anybody. just get the word out about this BS!

dzee206 said:
just posted the vid on my fb to help get the word around. everyone should post it to where ever they can, tell friends, family,anybody. just get the word out about this BS!
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I'm with you. I did the same. Get it spread around to everyone. This is just disappointing.

They will always claim that its for "market research" and that in the end the "benefits" from this technology are greater that anything we can imagine and understand all together, but what I will never understand is why they have to do this in the shadow? why can't they ask for permission of the user to compile all this information?
I'm sure that if they ask for permission they will have a handful of people willing to participate. I think that a petition should be taken to the FCC to force carriers / manufactures in to disabling this once and for all, at least as long as the phone is purchased in the the US (thats where their jurisdiction is).

Rootkit is a rootkit they can call it what they want. I knew there was deception in this video by the CEO. They really need to be "sonified" and have a few rootkits thrown their way and if phone makers and carriers knew of this BS.. they do as well.
Class actions only help lawyers get rich, State legal by the Attorney Generals do nothing for the consumer either and the FCC wont have a clue as they are still in the "turn the phone dial with your finger to make a call" era.

Carrier iq is highly invasive and is not solely for "market research". No one needs to read your private txt messages for "market research" and some forms of.carrier iq on VZW have the ability to record phone calls. It is an invasion of privacy and plainly a virus, I will only run roms with iq fully stripped I don't need some "analyst" reading my txts between me and my old lady. And I don't care about any of the "benefits" they could ever imagine from it I care about my privacy.
Sent from my Classic-EViLizED-ToMAToFiED-EVo4g-

The Evo 3D has a more in-depth thread on this. It's TrevE's original post on the subject.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1247108
Because the topic spans many phones (over 160,000,000 by CIQ's own count) and different carriers, it's hard to keep track of the various forums and threads discussing this. But here's some encouraging news. The CIQ melt-down has made the major league media.
Yea!
http://www.forbes.com/sites/andygre...ve-violated-wiretap-law-in-millions-of-cases/

Put their **** on blast
Support TrevE!!

SilverStone641 said:
I'm with you. I did the same. Get it spread around to everyone. This is just disappointing.
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+1 on it being disappointing, i hate this type of ish.
-EViL-KoNCEPTz- said:
Carrier iq is highly invasive and is not solely for "market research". No one needs to read your private txt messages for "market research" and some forms of.carrier iq on VZW have the ability to record phone calls. It is an invasion of privacy and plainly a virus, I will only run roms with iq fully stripped I don't need some "analyst" reading my txts between me and my old lady. And I don't care about any of the "benefits" they could ever imagine from it I care about my privacy.
Sent from my Classic-EViLizED-ToMAToFiED-EVo4g-
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crap i didnt even think about vzw, now i gotta go see if theres any way i can remove it from my pre+ also.

The CIA pays AT&T $10 million annually for foreign call logs

source link
For those that don't want to access the above link, here is the text:
AT&T is on the receiving end of a $10 million payout each year from the CIA in exchange for providing phone records to help with overseas counterterrorism investigations. It’s a program that the wireless provider voluntarily agrees to meaning there’s no court order involved according to a report from the New York Times.
The publication claims the CIA supplies AT&T with the phone numbers of suspected terrorists. From here, the wireless provider is able to comb their database for call records attached to a given number. These records include valuable information such as the length and date of phone calls. In the event that a call is placed to or from an American number and involved an international caller, the CIA reportedly asks AT&T to mask the identity of the US-based number for legal reasons.
In case you were wondering, the arrangement is said to be different from the tactics the NSA uses to collect phone records although they likely duplicate some of their programs. It appears to have been started sometime before 2010, was put on hold at some point then reinitiated once again.
Naturally, neither AT&T nor the CIA would confirm the existence of the partnership. An anonymous intelligence official, however, believes it makes sense for such a program to be in place. The source said the need to act without delay is often best met when the CIA has developed its own capabilities to lawfully acquire necessary foreign intelligence information.
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lmike6453 said:
source link
For those that don't want to access the above link, here is the text:
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At least they get money for it when we all know CIA has other means of getting those data logs anyways...

Not a surprising tactic. Seriously if a terrorist is still conducting activities on a cellular network... just turn yourself in now.
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OH NO!!!!!! NOW THEY KNOW ABOUT THE TIME I TOLD MY FRIEND I WAS TAKING A DUMP!!!!!!
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Anthonok said:
OH NO!!!!!! NOW THEY KNOW ABOUT THE TIME I TOLD MY FRIEND I WAS TAKING A DUMP!!!!!!
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That's not the sort of information they can glean from metadata (unless your friend specializes in counseling people on that topic).

Gary02468 said:
That's not the sort of information they can glean from metadata (unless your friend specializes in counseling people on that topic).
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I know. But my point is I don't care. Also I'm just really tired of hearing people complain about losing their privacy and it being stolen from them...meanwhile they sit there and use Facebook and other social media...haha

Anthonok said:
I know. But my point is I don't care.
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But people who want to protect their own privacy don't care that you don't care. People who take seriously the 4th Amendment of the US Constitution, and its requirement to have probable cause and a detailed warrant before conducting a search, also don't care that you don't care. People who have studied history carefully enough to know what abuses arise in the absence of these protections don't care that you don't care.
Also I'm just really tired of hearing people complain about losing their privacy and it being stolen from them...meanwhile they sit there and use Facebook and other social media...
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There's no inconsistency between willingly revealing some information--whether to your friends or to the public--while still wanting NOT to reveal OTHER information publicly.

Gary02468 said:
But people who want to protect their own privacy don't care that you don't care. People who take seriously the 4th Amendment of the US Constitution, and its requirement to have probable cause and a detailed warrant before conducting a search, also don't care that you don't care. People who have studied history carefully enough to know what abuses arise in the absence of these protections don't care that you don't care.
There's no inconsistency between willingly revealing some information--whether to your friends or to the public--while still wanting NOT to reveal OTHER information publicly.
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And I don't care that they don't care. People act like this kind of thing is new. Its been around forever. Anyone who thinks its something that's never happened in the past is blind. I understand the whole privacy thing. I get it. But I look at it like this, I'm not doing anything wrong so I don't care who sees what I do or say or who I call. I would rather my every move be monitored as long as it has the possibility of some terrorist being caught preemptively.
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Anthonok said:
People act like this kind of thing is new. Its been around forever.
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False. Instead of addressing what people are actually saying, you're pretending that they're saying something they never did.
Warrantless searching isn't new. It's just illegal, immoral, and more dangerous that what it supposedly protects us from.
However, the scale on which spying is being conducted now--the sheer amount of data being collected from hundreds of millions of citizens--is indeed unprecedented. We know that simply because the technology to collect and store that much data did not exist until fairly recently.
I'm not doing anything wrong so I don't care who sees what I do or say or who I call.
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Anyone who says that there's no need for privacy unless you're doing something "wrong" is woefully ignorant not only of history, but of basic human interaction.

Gary02468 said:
False. Instead of addressing what people are actually saying, you're pretending that they're saying something they never did.
Warrantless searching isn't new. It's just illegal, immoral, and more dangerous that what it supposedly protects us from.
However, the scale on which spying is being conducted now--the sheer amount of data being collected from hundreds of millions of citizens--is indeed unprecedented. We know that simply because the technology to collect and store that much data did not exist until fairly recently.
Anyone who says that there's no need for privacy unless you're doing something "wrong" is woefully ignorant not only of history, but of basic human interaction.
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Yeah. Sure. Cool.
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Why is this useless, off-topic thread still open!?

khaytsus said:
Why is this useless, off-topic thread still open!?
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(1) It pertains to the AT&T Note 3. (It also pertains to other AT&T phones, but so do many of the AT&T topics discussed here.)
(2) The thread was already dormant until you bumped it just now.

This sort of stuff surely has to have been happening for a while, it's not like they get anything useful out of civilians anyways.

The only terrorists they will catch are the ones that the CIA is training funding and helping conduct and carry out their plan. The CIA has been running alqueda since the start of it. The name it self was a US government database that bin Laden liked and used the name. Every major dictator in history the US has put in power funded and then took them out. It's Hegelian Dialectic=Problem – Reaction – Solution.
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AT&T's going to cough up whatever they're subpoenaed to. Bully for them for extracting a fee for it.

BarryH_GEG said:
AT&T's going to cough up whatever they're subpoenaed to. Bully for them for extracting a fee for it.
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You're just making that up. The people involved have acknowledged that there is no subpoena, and that acknowledgement has been widely reported.

Gary02468 said:
You're just making that up. The people involved have acknowledged that there is no subpoena, and that acknowledgement has been widely reported.
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So? With all that's come to light post-Snowden does this surprise you? The other carriers could be doing something similar and it's just not been made known yet. Post-9/11 the world's a sinister place with both the good guys and bad guys trying to outmaneuver each other with us innocents caught in the middle. If this freaks people out move to another carrier. I guess I operate under the naive assumption that my data being scoured isn't a big deal because I'm not doing anything wrong. My life in data-form would probably be considered pretty boring by those reading it.

Why does everyone think that it's Ok just because they are not doing anything wrong? The founding fathers put the constitution together to protect us from things like this. Lately people are so for giving up their rights all in the name of keeping them "safe" Ben Franklin said " those who will give up liberty for security shall have neither". There are a lot of people who need to wake up to the tyranny that is going on around them before it's to late. The only time people start to care is when it effects them by that time they are a day late and a dollar short. This is a tyrannical regimen we are dealing with and it will only get worse until we stop allowing it to continue just because "I'm not doing anything wrong so why should I care". We either all need to stand up for our rights or we will all fall together.
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boxerlover02 said:
Ben Franklin said " those who will give up liberty for security shall have neither".
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Here's a hint to tell if you're totally off topic for a tech forum - when your posts contain quotes from dead presidents. Fascinating point of view; for Reddit.

I agree I went off topic. But it burns me up that everyone always says "well I have nothing to hide so I don't care". Or there is nothing we can do about it so why should I care... Just think if the men who fought for this country to become a country had that same attitude. There would be no USA. Again sorry for the rant, but we need to hang together or fall separate.
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