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The title of the thread is just to get all you fine people steaming in here to tell me off. But now your here by your own free will...
I've been a long time browser of these forums and recently a more active member. I used to be a very amateur coder when I was yonger and know to a small extent the hard work you guys put into these roms, so seriously to everyone congratulations on some amazing efforts.
I did want to address the reason topic titles such as the one I chose here crop up however. When I had a diamond before my HD2 there were just a few good roms to choose from and I soon settled down and chose one after trying them out. A few months back I started this same process with my HD2 but found every ROM I flashed to have a few bugs which annoyed me in day to day use, and I eventually went back to stock. Since then I havn't really tried again.
Today I have again been looking at perhaps flashing to a cooked ROM and in the beginning of these efforts I tried out the search term "best HD2 ROM". The threads that resulted were obviously very short and the authors told off for being lazy and discrediting the great works of all the chefs here. But the very good point is made that there are ALOT of ROM's for the HD2, and whilst it may only take 5 mnins to flash a ROM it takes hours, if not days, to find out if it suited to you. With the risk of losing personal info on each flash and having to reconfigure your apps each time this can be a very tedious process.
I'm basically wondering if there is any way to have a thread that can provide a way of rating the advantages and disadvantages of each ROM without having to wade through topics with hundreds of pages of mostly useless posts. It just so daunting with all these ROM's that many people may never even start.
I am just now thinking of flexing my (somewhat out of date) webmastering ability to create a "ROM Review" website - good idea?
What are people's thoughts?
p.s. This is probably also in the wrong section of the forum... just clicked "new topic" where I was browsing without thinking where it should go, please move if appropriate, thanks.
I completely agree with your idea to open this thread.
Finally we have someone who wants to put it to rights. Because every day we have new ROM or several ROM's, and every time flashing and soft re-installation takes a lot of time... and after all that you understand that "this ROM is not really what you wanted to be"...
Go on with your idea.. and I think - this section is the right place for your thread.
you got my vote
Good to see I'm not alone here, any feedback is much appriciated, even if its just a +1
Agreed, Sir.
This was taken from another thread about a similar question
"I also see no point to a list of pro's or cons of any particular ROM as most are built for the same thing, speed and stability. The only real differences you are going to see are what programs the person has loaded."
If this is indeed the case. then a list of the roms with the space taken up by the rom on the phone. the apps installed and how quick, stable each one would be must surely be a good idea?
I truly hope you can follow through with your idea.
I think there is no such thing as "the" best ROM.
Each user has different preferences, especially WinMo smartphones are
rarely one the same like another: Included software, tweaks, mods, themes, designs.
The possibilities are endless.
Also, an earlier thread here at the HD2 forum about speed (with benchmarks
as neutral as possible) ended up in unfriendly discussions (which is a mild
term to describe what happened).
An HD2 is so extremely fast that I seriously doubt that the "average" user
can tell a big difference between different ROMs. Sometimes, a buggy ROM
may be obviously slower, but in the average case, the difference will just
not really be felt, but only perceived, sometimes only imagined.
I think that it is part of this forum that there is no rating of the available
ROMs. If you watch the forum, you can easily find out which ROMs seem to
have more acceptance and therefore more fans - and if you check the ROM
description and screenshots of the chef, you can easily find out if the ROM
is something you might like.
Just to finish: How exactly does a ROM qualify as "the best"? Speed? Come
on... Software which comes with it? Come on, again...
Imho, it all ends up in optical mods and tweaks plus some extremely basic
software which is really a must for everybody. If you would ask me what
this could be, I cannot give you any name because WinMo and Manila are
on most ROMs anyway...
I couldn't agree more Mega. Very brave of you to start this thread ; )
I was a bit of a flashaholic with both my Elf and my Raphael, but I still haven't flashed anything to my Leo because it's so hard to figure out exactly what I'm going to get. Apart from the features of each ROM, it's hard to get an idea of the things that might be missing from each. Like, have the original bugs been fixed? Stuff like the audio booster turning off, AAC files being mis-sorted in the audio player, volume keys still active when the screen is off and incremental volume control or even the relative volume between headphones and phone speaker. I just can't be bothered to start flashing a million ROMs to find out. That's not laziness by the way, honest! I'm sure I'll get over it and start flashing soon ; )
tictac0566 said:
I think there is no such thing as "the" best ROM.
Each user has different preferences, especially WinMo smartphones are
rarely one the same like another: Included software, tweaks, mods, themes, designs.
The possibilities are endless.
Also, an earlier thread here at the HD2 forum about speed (with benchmarks
as neutral as possible) ended up in unfriendly discussions (which is a mild
term to describe what happened).
An HD2 is so extremely fast that I seriously doubt that the "average" user
can tell a big difference between different ROMs. Sometimes, a buggy ROM
may be obviously slower, but in the average case, the difference will just
not really be felt, but only perceived, sometimes only imagined.
I think that it is part of this forum that there is no rating of the available
ROMs. If you watch the forum, you can easily find out which ROMs seem to
have more acceptance and therefore more fans - and if you check the ROM
description and screenshots of the chef, you can easily find out if the ROM
is something you might like.
Just to finish: How exactly does a ROM qualify as "the best"? Speed? Come
on... Software which comes with it? Come on, again...
Imho, it all ends up in optical mods and tweaks plus some extremely basic
software which is really a must for everybody. If you would ask me what
this could be, I cannot give you any name because WinMo and Manila are
on most ROMs anyway...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree, how would one rate the BEST? Well to be honest you cant really as each person has there own needs and wants in a rom. What might be an Ideal rom for me might not be the best rom for you. I could rate a rom at 10 and you might give it a 2, then it turns into a bashing session and that can not be allowed. The rating system has been brought up many times before and each time it comes to the same end. There will never be an accurate way to tell the best rom. I am not trying to be harsh here but threads like this are beating a dead horse.
After speaking with the OP I have decided to reopen this thread. On the condition that this is "NOT" a best rom thread. This thread will be to help those that are new to ROM flashing. I will be keeping an eye on this thread and if it turn into a Best rom or bashing thread I will reclose it for good. I understand that sense the release of the HD 2 that alot of people are new to WM and with the available options in the rom thread it can be confusing. I am also moving this thread to the General Section as it is not Rom development. To all the new guys welcome.
Just wanna say thanks to Zelendal, the topic title originally wasn't constructive.
As we all know from doing a little reading about the ROM's, each one can be individually suited to different people, it like argument about which is the best smart phone or computer platform. So the kind of discussionj I was trying to provoke was about the best way to help out newcomers decide which ROM would indeed be best suited to them.
As I posted before I have been pondering making a seperate website that would allow some organisation of peoples opinions on the ROM's and I am interested as to how much support there would be amongst the community, I am also interested as to how the Cook's themselves would see such an project, providing it was done right.
sike222 said:
This was taken from another thread about a similar question
"I also see no point to a list of pro's or cons of any particular ROM as most are built for the same thing, speed and stability. The only real differences you are going to see are what programs the person has loaded."
If this is indeed the case. then a list of the roms with the space taken up by the rom on the phone. the apps installed and how quick, stable each one would be must surely be a good idea?
I truly hope you can follow through with your idea.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You quote me but you leave out an important part. The problem with making a list is that ROMs change. What might have been an issue in one build might be working just fine in the next. Keeping up with these changes and trying to keep on top of a list would be a nightmare. Also this mystical list you are looking for is usually on one of the first few post of every ROM thread. Most good cooks will list all these things that you are looking for. Only way to tell if a ROM will fit your needs is to try it. Every bodies idea of a good ROM is different. What one person might see as a con another sees as a pro. Personal opinion is a ***** and unfortunately everybody has a different one.
Good luck but I don't see a list being started or maintained for very long. Nor do I see this thread going anywhere productive.
Will Badger -
I don't think anyone is dis-agreeing that each ROM is suited individually to different people. Each cook makes his ROM how he wants it and if you share those wants with that cook you a likly to enjoy his ROM. That doesn't make it any easier to find what ROM is indeed suited to you, and as a newbe it can be extremely daunting, there are 30 odd cooks for the HD2, thats ALOT of time spent flashing and tring out ROM's.
Having said that I have been pointed towards
http://www.xdaroms.com/Default.aspx
Which is more or less everything I had in mind for a ROM information site, so its safe to say I wont be needing to build another. Iv'e been on this forum for a few months now and have not seen this site, somthing like this would need the direct support of Cooks asking people to visit in their ROM threads to submit reviews of their ROM.
Personally if that could happen I think it would be great and a fantastic resourse for newbes but I know there are alot of differing opinions on here, and perhaps its somthing the chefs would have second thoughts about.
Cool nice to know you found what you were looking for. I still find it easier to just read the actual thread for the info I'm looking for. Going over that page quickly I see no information stating whether the any of the HD2 ROMs are T-mobile compatible. You can flash a standard HD2 ROM onto the newer T-Mo HD2 since they use different processor.
i hadn't come across that site either, lol... but looking at this thread i think the guy's pretty keen to make the site useful. see here - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=658641
there's also another thread in the ROM section that might be helpful... i'm sure jaimeeee would appreciate any input and help you wanna give
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=683743
Hi,
Thanks for the extra info, whilst the site I posted does seem to be more or less what I was thinking of doing myself it simply doesnt have the activity require to truely make it useful to anyone. It needs the support of the Forum, especially the Cooks if its going to succeed. I keep meaning to conatct the owner of th site to discuss how to push traffic onto the site but I got all caught up making a skin recently.
Hopefully we can make somthing of this!
Just saw this and curious if this will work with our hd2 and hopefully devs aren't too busy trying it....
"What this hack basically does is changing some partition settings (loopback) to increase write performance and to saver power."
[DATA2EXT] [11/Dec] FULL BENCHMARK, V4, Improve the efficiency of IO
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=859419
cedesmith's initrd give a twice iops then normal ramdisk
wondering how much DATA2EXT will give
i saw someone with 9k IOps and the cpu 6k
so drilling
Why nobodyy gives info on whether its going to be released ?
eeeeeee said:
Why nobodyy gives info on whether its going to be released ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think the devs are looking into it for sure.
You must appreciate that the devs are also working for free and share their builds with us.
Nothing stops you from developing your own build and sharing it with us.
I wonder if you would also appreciate it if people would 'demand' something from you.
So sit back, relax and appreciate all this fine work from people that do this in their own free time.
lukesan said:
I think the devs are looking into it for sure.
You must appreciate that the devs are also working for free and share their builds with us.
Nothing stops you from developing your own build and sharing it with us.
I wonder if you would also appreciate it if people would 'demand' something from you.
So sit back, relax and appreciate all this fine work from people that do this in their own free time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wow what a fool..
im asking a question whether its going to be released,
i wasnt demanding anything -_-
besides, when i have something to offer to the community, i share it, unlike most of the guys here.
and when i do share, its a huge post just for those who are still noobs
So I was just browsing the news on the portal, and saw the 3K+ quadrant scores that this idea brings...
I remember seeing one of the Desire builds hit 3k+ as well, and i believe it is due to this mod when building the ROM.
Can any developer, or ROM cook give ideas on how to update current roms with this DATA2SD mod, i hear it has great benefits for speed as well as some neat quadrant scores that makes people smile when seeing it!
anyway, here is the link to the thread for the mod, let me know what you think?
Thanks,
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=859419
I'd love to get this... Actually trying to work on this myself, but my skills ain't that good yet xD
To answer the question that everyone is thinking as they click on this thread... Yes, I am a noob.
Anyway, I downloaded the Android Kitchen and installed it on a Linux Ubuntu Virtual Machine on my Macbook using VMWare Fusion and i watched a video from theunlockr, but all it really let me do was add in apps, change the rom name and give it a few features but no visual customizations... If i posted a link of the "My ROM" no one would be able to tell a difference in the rom i planned on starting from.
Let me know if there is a different way to create that is actually making ROMs or customizing the ROM in it's entirety instead of small unnoticeable features, let me know if I'm just doing something wrong in my Android Kitchen and let me know if theres an easy way to develop ROMs on Mac without Virtual Machines. (The last one isn't a big worry because linux is very lightweight and runs fine on my computer but please help me on the other two questions)
Thanks in advance,
Adam Ferguson
Welcome Adam.
There's a lot going on in this little phones. It takes time to learn, and you'll probably never learn it all. (But don't let that stop you from trying. It is interesting and geeky fun.) So, I would start reading if you really want to learn. Here's a few links to get you started.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=886641
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=815265
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=723319
(I guess it's easier for me to find my posts, but others have posted some good stuff too.)
Also, I'd read some similar posts in this forum --> http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=613
This same question has been asked a lot in there.
Thanks for the info, I would really like to get into developing.
I also noticed you live in raleigh and thought it was quite a coincidence because in like about an hour from you in Winston Salem, just saying.
AdamFerg said:
Thanks for the info, I would really like to get into developing.
I also noticed you live in raleigh and thought it was quite a coincidence because in like about an hour from you in Winston Salem, just saying.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've bounced between Asheville, Raleigh, and Gastonia... So, I've been through WS several hundred times at least. NC is the place to be. (At least that's what the imports from NY, NJ, PA, etc. tell me.
well i thought i'd get this up before source for JB (4.1) drops... I'm looking for a dev willing to let me watch them as they build a ROM and make changes to that ROM... no i don't need to come over your house to do this... I was thinking of a live video stream of your screen as you do the work... if you're willing to allow me to watch and maybe answer a few questions in between, i'm willing to learn!!
i learn really fast if i'm watching someone do it which is why i'm taking this approach rather than trying to read through a bunch of threads on this topic... that stuff basically looks like a foreign language to me... especially when they talk linux stuff lol... i can catch on quickly but i need to SEE IT BEING DONE... not reading and having my brain decode what i just read...
so please pass this thread along... the site i'm looking to use is join.me and it can be viewed by more than one person... so if someone else is willing to jump in on the fun and the dev is cool with it... we all can watch as they work their magic...
preferably someone that's gonna be building on crespo/crespo4g... but i'll take whoever is willing to teach!!
disclaimer: i'm not even looking for a real "expert" on the subject... just someone to do the basic work so i can take notes and then do the stuff myself!!
PM me if you're a dev and willing to help out!! what do you have to lose? nothing really... you're just gonna load the program and let it stream as you do the stuff you normall would do...
sn: it doesn't have to be Jelly Bean... but seeing as source is coming out soon... i figured someone will want to start fresh and build from aosp... that's really where i'd like to start from!!
I'd love to watch too
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umm. the best way to do it is to just follow the step by step guides online. doesnt get much easier than that. you watching isn't going to help when they already have all the software installed
derekwilkinson said:
umm. the best way to do it is to just follow the step by step guides online. doesnt get much easier than that. you watching isn't going to help when they already have all the software installed
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
thanks but i have everything i need to build a ROM installed and have already built one from CM9 source... i'm talking about all the other edits and things they do... ie: adding in or removing features of a ROM...
and if you re-read my OP... i said reading this stuff is like learning another language... i'm a visual learner... i need to SEE these things then do them... not read them and try to decode whatever i just read...
the1dynasty said:
thanks but i have everything i need to build a ROM installed and have already built one from CM9 source... i'm talking about all the other edits and things they do... ie: adding in or removing features of a ROM...
and if you re-read my OP... i said reading this stuff is like learning another language... i'm a visual learner... i need to SEE these things then do them... not read them and try to decode whatever i just read...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just happen to work for a company the makes tools to help visual learners.
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
Yea I'm willing too. I got a few things going here. Along with ubuntu, sdk, java6, android kitchen. I'm more of a visual learner. I've been constantly researching to point where my brain hurts to think android. I need a break. But I'm willing as well. Some devs out there no even respond to help needed. I would love to watch Fergie716 at work tho.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk 2
My video will be up tomorrow (today) in my MIUI thread. I have everything ready for it. I just had a bit too much to drink tonight (its 450am)
Tomorrow afternoon it'll be up
Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
I also like to watch.
Sent from my SPH-D710
I agree with the OP, one thing I think is missing (or at least in my experience hard to find) in the Android ROM community is a set of guides on how to properly do things (branch with repo to make a mod, apply patches from other trees, add prebuilt apks, add source provided apps, integrate su, busybox, creating your own vendor, device, adding your kernel, etc)
It's all scattered all over the net, sure you can figure some of it out but if you lower the barrier of entry people will be able to focus their energy on doing better work somewhere else.
gparent said:
I agree with the OP, one thing I think is missing (or at least in my experience hard to find) in the Android ROM community is a set of guides on how to properly do things (branch with repo to make a mod, apply patches from other trees, add prebuilt apks, add source provided apps, integrate su, busybox, creating your own vendor, device, adding your kernel, etc)
It's all scattered all over the net, sure you can figure some of it out but if you lower the barrier of entry people will be able to focus their energy on doing better work somewhere else.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i really couldn't have said it any better!!
i know Fergie usually puts out some great tutorials... i used his stuff when i was learning to theme... so hopefully he delivers on this as well... i would still like to do a live "webinar-type" of training tho if any dev is up for that!!
we can get a time going so that everyone can login at the same time and see what's being done...
I'd also like to see how its done, I would love to be able to cook up some things and then release a ROM to the public. I'm sure it's not easy but I'm willing to take a wack at it
Btw are you guys using pretty powerful computers for building ROMS? Or would you say they're average spec?
stellar said:
I'd also like to see how its done, I would love to be able to cook up some things and then release a ROM to the public. I'm sure it's not easy but I'm willing to take a wack at it
Btw are you guys using pretty powerful computers for building ROMS? Or would you say they're average spec?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
mine isn't that great tbh... but it manages to put out something... once your setup is correct and you do your first build... the second build of that ROM is usually a lot faster...
i think average would be around quad core with 8GB RAM... that's my guess based on a few devs i've heard from...
the1dynasty said:
mine isn't that great tbh... but it manages to put out something... once your setup is correct and you do your first build... the second build of that ROM is usually a lot faster...
i think average would be around quad core with 8GB RAM... that's my guess based on a few devs i've heard from...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I like to learn too. But my pc is just dual core 3.0ghz 4gig ram what do you think?
Sent from my Nexus S™
mixtapes08 said:
I like to learn too. But my pc is just dual core 3.0ghz 4gig ram what do you think?
Sent from my Nexus S™
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it will take longer than some other PC's... but that will still work... i'd guess a few hrs to build a ROM... mine is around those specs and it takes a few hrs on the initial build lol
There should also be a thread for porting, kinda like "chef central" where users could get support on certain issues with their ports.. Over there in chef central the people seem to only help people that are building from source.. there's not too much support for people doing ports which is unfortunate because not everyone is skilled enough to build from source and having ports is what keeps some devices alive... In this thread there would be threads where you could post your logcat if your not getting boot and some of the more experienced porters (like fergie for example) could take a look and point you in the right direction. Also there could be guides and tutorials as how to get certain aspects of the ROM working like HWA, WiMax, MMS/SMS so on and so forth... I think that it would really bring a lot of new life to some devices that don't get the support that they should..
Anyone else agree on that or is just me?
evol4g said:
there's not too much support for people doing ports which is unfortunate because not everyone is skilled enough to build from source and having ports is what keeps some devices alive...
Anyone else agree on that or is just me?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with the whole sentiment "more people should build things", but not with "aosp is too hard so we should help people do ports". Unless a port is the only way to get a device working, we definitely should focus on making aosp easier to learn if that's part of a problem the porting people are having.
Anyway, I started my own ROM yesterday and might end up making a wiki to document a bunch of things I'm doing. It's a very stock-ish ROM though, so I won't spend much time writing about adding mods other than a few basic ones.
-IF- I do get around to making the wiki, I will post here about it.
As for the computer, I am using a i7 930 (2.8GHz) with 24GB of RAM.
gparent said:
I agree with the whole sentiment "more people should build things", but not with "aosp is too hard so we should help people do ports". Unless a port is the only way to get a device working, we definitely should focus on making aosp easier to learn if that's part of a problem the porting people are having.
Anyway, I started my own ROM yesterday and might end up making a wiki to document a bunch of things I'm doing. It's a very stock-ish ROM though, so I won't spend much time writing about adding mods other than a few basic ones.
-IF- I do get around to making the wiki, I will post here about it.
As for the computer, I am using a i7 930 (2.8GHz) with 24GB of RAM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
id like to ask.. is making a rom really difficult.. how much java language knowledge would a person need to have to build from source...?
ferozfero said:
id like to ask.. is making a rom really difficult.. how much java language knowledge would a person need to have to build from source...?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, one of the fun things about being a maintainer rather than a developer is that you really don't -need- much knowledge at all.
Everything helps, though. Yesterday I fixed a gcc compilation issue from knowledge of C++ that I acquired over a number of years. It wasn't a hard bug to fix and I could've asked a friend about it instead, but being a programmer lets me get away with fixing mistakes I see in AOSP when it's necessary (it rarely is).
Later, in my kernel compile, I turned on a compilation flag because I knew that a warning (that failed the build due to -Werror) was completely inaccurate. Good luck doing this if you don't know what's a compilation flag, and good luck doing it safely if you're not sure what the warning means and if it is really safe to override it (it often isn't).
If you want to make a ROM and be efficient about it, I think the two most important skills (in order of importance) are the ability to use git and to solve problems. Without a minimum of source control ease, it will be a pain in the ass to add features to your mods or to keep track of changes efficiently (especially when it comes the time to branch off releases and what not). Problem solving is what you do whenever stuff that should work doesn't work. And it's always hard because if it wasn't hard it would be documented already so you wouldn't have the problem.
If you want to build FEATURES for a mod (that is, not repack what others have written), then yes you will need programming knowledge. Java, C and probably C++. Mostly Java for user facing stuff.
great post gparent... that was a wonderful breakdown of how ROM making works... if it's all true (which it sounds like it), then this might be a bit more than i can chew lol... i'm still willing to see someone in action do these things so i have a better understanding of how to put things together and maybe one day i'll take a stab at building my own ROM!!
gparent said:
24GB of RAM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
:what: wow, lol
If any other devs come by I'd love to know what setups you guys use for developing too.
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