Database Users

Adobe Air on Android sample application - here!

Found this apk while scouring the Adobe Blogs:
http://coenraets.org/blog/2010/05/sample-application-using-flex-and-air-for-android/
Looks very cool. Can't wait to see what comes out of this after the announcement of public prerelease of the air for developers.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, air allows devs to write software in air's code and its then capable of use on various platforms...Is this the main use of adobe air? So devs don't have to write programs separately for each platform....

Yes I think so.

DMaverick50 said:
Please correct me if I'm wrong, air allows devs to write software in air's code and its then capable of use on various platforms...Is this the main use of adobe air? So devs don't have to write programs separately for each platform....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pretty much it in a nutshell. If you look at the AIR applications available for desktops then potentially these may be able to be ported to Android without much effort.
The applications for Android should rocket and the diversity of what can be run on the system increased too.
Flash based games are probably going to be high up the list for most devs I suspect. Did you try the sample?
It's pretty interesting. The videos of the possibilities are inspiring too.

+1 for all the possibilities that AIR now brings to the Android dev scene
<off topic>
+100 to Christophe for using The Office as his test database.
Good to see Kelly Kapoor, Michael Scott and Angela on there
</off topic>

karthikjr said:
+1 for all the possibilities that AIR now brings to the Android dev scene
<off topic>
+100 to Christophe for using The Office as his test database.
Good to see Kelly Kapoor, Michael Scott and Angela on there
</off topic>
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah , really cool little app. Pretty funny seeing The Office characters in it.

I got a game I made called Spate running using AIR, the performance is better than I expected from a phone but the game is unplayable as the boxes become like 4mm wide when shrunk down to a mobile screen size

eedok said:
I got a game I made called Spate running using AIR, the performance is better than I expected from a phone but the game is unplayable as the boxes become like 4mm wide when shrunk down to a mobile screen size
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Post the apk so we can have a play. How much work do you need to do to modify it to work on the smaller screen?

Here's the web version:
hxxp://geekswhoshower.com/webgame/8
and here's the apk (requires the AIR runtime from the link in the OP):
hxxp://dl.dropbox.com/u/168938/Spate.apk
The biggest issue with resizing the game is I contracted out the artwork for the game, and it was a one time contract so I'd have to contract out the art again, and the high scores were a third party library that doesn't work with AIR, so I'd have to code one of those too. Plus I have a bunch of other projects going so this was more of a see if I can do it more than anything, and it's exciting how easily the game ported over, and how well it runs.
EDIT: not mod approved so I can't post links, change the xx's to tt's

Quite a good little game. It runs fairly well until the pot fills up and there are a lot of objects on screen.
It would be nice if it could run in portrait too.
I suppose it depends how much effort and cost is involved from your consultants to see what you could launch on Android Market.
Stick it out there for 59p and see what happens.

markouk said:
Pretty much it in a nutshell. If you look at the AIR applications available for desktops then potentially these may be able to be ported to Android without much effort.
The applications for Android should rocket and the diversity of what can be run on the system increased too.
Flash based games are probably going to be high up the list for most devs I suspect. Did you try the sample?
It's pretty interesting. The videos of the possibilities are inspiring too.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just to be explicit, so people can create Android applications without writing even a single line of Android code?
I've tried dabbling with Android coding, but the framework-specific stuff frustrates me.

Paul22000 said:
Just to be explicit, so people can create Android applications without writing even a single line of Android code?
I've tried dabbling with Android coding, but the framework-specific stuff frustrates me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is true, that version of Spate was made without adding any new code, so if you know how to make flash applications it's pretty easy to turn them into android apps with this

Since Multitasking is the thing android boasts, why does it suck so badly?

Why couldn't it be more like the Palm Pre? I mean even my jailbroken iphone could pull off some multitasking that looked damn close to the pre.
I think the biggest thing I hear about android is it's got real multitasking (which works and I love), but I don't see why they couldn't make it better, or at least better looking. It's based on linux and there are some pretty snazzy graphics out there for that.

Personally, having used the jailbroken multitasking solutions on previous iPhones I didn't find them that great or graceful. The Palm Pre is still the king of multitasking hands down.
Android is working on it. Gingerbread will bring an improved UI with more flashy animations/graphics. For now, holding down the Home button is an acceptable method.

sfox8 said:
Personally, having used the jailbroken multitasking solutions on previous iPhones I didn't find them that great or graceful. The Palm Pre is still the king of multitasking hands down.
Android is working on it. Gingerbread will bring an improved UI with more flashy animations/graphics. For now, holding down the Home button is an acceptable method.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I found one or two apps for my old iphone that looked damn close to the pre, and worked pretty damn good on my 3g.
I know 3.0 is going to be a UI revamp, but who knows if the evo will ever get it. ;(

Hrshycro said:
I found one or two apps for my old iphone that looked damn close to the pre, and worked pretty damn good on my 3g.
I know 3.0 is going to be a UI revamp, but who knows if the evo will ever get it. ;(
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you haven't already, purchase Powerstrip. It's one of the most useful Android apps ever.

Mecha2142 said:
If you haven't already, purchase Powerstrip. It's one of the most useful Android apps ever.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sidenote, i dunno if i'm just retarded or what, but i installed power strip and i am unable to get the shortcut to work. i have it set to a double tap of the home screen. nothing happens when i do this. what am i missing??

I think you're supposed to double click the home button

Hrshycro said:
Why couldn't it be more like the Palm Pre? I mean even my jailbroken iphone could pull off some multitasking that looked damn close to the pre.
I think the biggest thing I hear about android is it's got real multitasking (which works and I love), but I don't see why they couldn't make it better, or at least better looking. It's based on linux and there are some pretty snazzy graphics out there for that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What's wrong with Android multitasking?

acrh2 said:
What's wrong with Android multitasking?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
^ this
I don't get it, OP

PLESTIUC said:
^ this
I don't get it, OP
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
neither do i. i would like a explanation what the evo is not doing.
you compare the pre to be the king of multitasking? windows mobile (touch pro2 which is with me daily in addition to my evo) multitasks beautifully and so does android in my experience with android (hero from launch day and win mo since 2002). just the other day i was on a call , was updating some apps and using tapatalk on a forum. i even had lookout scanning the apps as they were installing.... (4G area). phone did not hiccup... stock non rooted. thats multitasking to me...

I use MultiTask Manager, and it's totally configurable and display the following:
- Running Apps
- Recently closed apps
- Fav Apps
Also you can hide apps that you don't want to see, max number of apps, background and much more.
I have the icon on my main screen
Is free.

PLESTIUC said:
^ this
I don't get it, OP
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It sounds to me like the op is only concerned with how asthetically pleasing multitasking is. The fact that android doesn't have the pretty cards animation that the webos and jailbroken iPhones have means it sucks. That seams silly to me. Wanting nicer animations is fine, but saying that multitasking sucks because of the lack of these animations is silly.

k2snowboards88 said:
It sounds to me like the op is only concerned with how asthetically pleasing multitasking is. The fact that android doesn't have the pretty cards animation that the webos and jailbroken iPhones have means it sucks. That seams silly to me. Wanting nicer animations is fine, but saying that multitasking sucks because of the lack of these animations is silly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If that is the case, then the OP doesn't understand the design philosophy behind Android multitasking.
1) All apps are loaded into memory from the get go.
2) Task managers are unnecessary, just pick whatever app you want to switch to, and start it to switch to it. Hence the last 6 used apps menu when holding down the home key.
In a sense, Android multitasking is intended to be superior to any other implementation - there's no need to be even thinking about it. It just does its thing.

I like multitasking on Android way better than the Pre. First off it works without me having to worry about what's open, second I never get an error telling me to close apps even though no cards are open. Third it just works on Android. palms system is nowhere near stable yet, and backgrounder on iPad has closed apps so often that multitasking was bad.
Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk

I as well fail to see a problem with Android's multitasking abilities.

same....OP please elaborate.

I understand what the OP means... I have BOTH and the Pre DOES BEAT Android in multitasking capabilities.... I'll give u an example
On my Evo, I use Tweetcaster a lot...let's say I need to open up ZumoDrive and share something... I hit home, then open programs then open up ZumoDrive... If I wanna go back to where I was prior (Tweetcaster, looking at a persons profile), I hold the home button...and select Tweetcaster from the recently used apps, and it reopens the app from scratch, forgetting about where I was previously. That's just 1 example (that I happened to think of right now, but there's others) Another would be, try downloading a mp3 from the web browser and playing it...then switch apps... The song stops (unless u play it from the music player)
And the problem with the jab at WebOS saying well, you don't get too many cards errors in Android; well wouldn't exist b/c well for 1, the Evo has a 1GHZ processor and 512MB Ram... Compared to my original Pre (non plus) with much slower CPU; that's a no brainer that the Evo would be able to handle the tasks more effectively, (yet the GPU performance on the Pre is better, go figure)
But, it does sound like the OP was referring more to the way it looks... while, I don't care what it looks like... I just want it to work better.

steb0ne said:
I understand what the OP means... I have BOTH and the Pre DOES BEAT Android in multitasking capabilities.... I'll give u an example
On my Evo, I use Tweetcaster a lot...let's say I need to open up ZumoDrive and share something... I hit home, then open programs then open up ZumoDrive... If I wanna go back to where I was prior (Tweetcaster, looking at a persons profile), I hold the home button...and select Tweetcaster from the recently used apps, and it reopens the app from scratch, forgetting about where I was previously. That's just 1 example (that I happened to think of right now, but there's others) Another would be, try downloading a mp3 from the web browser and playing it...then switch apps... The song stops (unless u play it from the music player)
And the problem with the jab at WebOS saying well, you don't get too many cards errors in Android; well wouldn't exist b/c well for 1, the Evo has a 1GHZ processor and 512MB Ram... Compared to my original Pre (non plus) with much slower CPU; that's a no brainer that the Evo would be able to handle the tasks more effectively, (yet the GPU performance on the Pre is better, go figure)
But, it does sound like the OP was referring more to the way it looks... while, I don't care what it looks like... I just want it to work better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with the mp3 thing. It's annoying. I think there must be better mp3 players out there.

Try Quickdesk. You won't be disappointed.

Yeah I've experienced that problem with the mp3 player. I've noticed it varies from App to app. The standard music app will stop sometimes, as does Xiialive - but Last.fm app seems to be extremely stable - never had it stop regardless of what I was doing. I don't think there's anything wrong with holding the home button - it works nicely but I am more concerned about how programs function while in the background. As I mentioned it seems to vary from program to program, and the are said to be revamping the standard music program, so I guess we can keep our fingers crossed.
I doubt it will be much work to fix but I agree, they need to step it up a notch in this respect.

steb0ne said:
I understand what the OP means... I have BOTH and the Pre DOES BEAT Android in multitasking capabilities.... I'll give u an example
On my Evo, I use Tweetcaster a lot...let's say I need to open up ZumoDrive and share something... I hit home, then open programs then open up ZumoDrive... If I wanna go back to where I was prior (Tweetcaster, looking at a persons profile), I hold the home button...and select Tweetcaster from the recently used apps, and it reopens the app from scratch, forgetting about where I was previously.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But that isn't a good example because that isn't what should happen with the current paradigm. I've left countless programs and come back to exactly the same spot when I return. Something else is going on there. How many programs are you using in between these two? Are you waiting a bunch of time? Maybe Android closes out programs after a certain period of inactivity.
steb0ne said:
That's just 1 example (that I happened to think of right now, but there's others) Another would be, try downloading a mp3 from the web browser and playing it...then switch apps... The song stops (unless u play it from the music player)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This one confuses me. I can play music with something other than the music player and switch apps without the music stopping no problem.
If I were to offer one easy change to the current UI, it would be to put a little circle or star on the icons next to the programs that are still processing in the recent apps list. That's the only issue I can see. I can't tell which ones on that list are closed and which ones are still open.

linux patch that MASSIVELY improves smoothness

http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=linux_2637_video&num=1
This is a 200 line patch that according to linux was according to Linus the most impressive result of code that is elegant - 200 lines long - and should be wound into the phone linux as well
---- edit - and here is why it isnt going to be of any use for us...
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=822756&page=210
and the meat of it from bilboa1 :-
Originally Posted by giulio.alfano
Have you seen these? w_w_w.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=linux_2637_video&num=1
Phoronix(and Linus) say that is a miraculous 200 lines patch to increase interactivty? Can you consider the inclusion, of course if group scheduling in android 2.6.32 kernel is compatible?
the process groups are created per tty, that wont work on android
you can create process groups by hand however but it doesn't make a lot of sense for android in that case. the goal is to have some intensive tasks into their own group, but theres no intensive tasks and we don't have issues like audio or video lagging
their tweak is especially good if you run a compilation in the background and want to browse the web while waiting without having slow downs.
on android if you browse the web you dont have other cpu heavy tasks in progress usually (like encoding a video or what not)
i hope that was clear enough

I've off works urlaub would bei awesome
Where are the developers, who can say, if it works?
Sent from my GT-I9000 using my Brain

Wouldnt get too excited,phoronix is like the sun of linux news
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App

Already discussed - its useless on phone. Phone will be even slower.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App

dupel said:
Already discussed - its useless on phone. Phone will be even slower.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lets save statements like these after it has been actually tested.

KhaaL said:
Lets save statements like these after it has been actually tested.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not everything needs to be tested. If you make a program to draw a circle, it wont make a square, let alone cook eggs. (it's the case for this patch at the technical level, beyond the "wow" words from 1st post)
Note: there's other patches in 2.6.37 for responsiveness which are different from the one spoken about here which are actually likely to improve things. But probably not as drastic.

dupel said:
Already discussed - its useless on phone. Phone will be even slower.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Got any links to where I can find out what you know?
I was *hoping* that if it made desktops much more responsive under heavy loadings that it would help with the phone - its not like we have slow cpu's in these things Or is it cpu architecture that allows the improvments and the phones just are not compatible? or something else?
just wanting to know more and to hopefully get a dev who thinks its worth taking a look to see - 200 lines of code - *cof* (ducks behind armour) "how hard could it be?" *runs for cover*
i get this sinking feeling from the subtle - and not so subtle comments from you guys tho - that its just not really suited for how android works on a phone....

cbdrift said:
Got any links to where I can find out what you know?
I was *hoping* that if it made desktops much more responsive under heavy loadings that it would help with the phone - its not like we have slow cpu's in these things Or is it cpu architecture that allows the improvments and the phones just are not compatible? or something else?
just wanting to know more and to hopefully get a dev who thinks its worth taking a look to see - 200 lines of code - *cof* (ducks behind armour) "how hard could it be?" *runs for cover*
i get this sinking feeling from the subtle - and not so subtle comments from you guys tho - that its just not really suited for how android works on a phone....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Read last 5 pages in hardcore kernel topic.

knowing one and the other about linux, I have to disagree with those who say: it's gonna make your phone slower..
why? in linux, things constantly run in the background. and what this patch does, is give priority to foreground processes. True, there isn't MUCH in the background, so results may not be super, but the compile with 64 threads is just AN EXAMPLE of what it can do. That's the PERFECT situation to demonstrate. This doesn't mean that it sucks for everything else! It just means that it works
So stop *****ing and just test it before you start yapping that it's bad, doesn't work on phones etc... There is no right and wrong here, there is just: test it and see if it works!
i'd like to have a REAL technical discussion with these people here that are so-called experts... Because their arguments (excusez-le-mot) SUCK.
so please adapt your first post, because what they are saying is just guessing and not based on experiments nor experience, which renders it completely useless
Just my 2 cents

dupel said:
Already discussed - its useless on phone. Phone will be even slower.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
discussion is worthless, you can't convince me with some "maybe this, possibly that", if you say it's useless: give hard numbers or (sorry, but...) stfu!

UPDATE:
i've been reading up on the lkml and i think there are some very interesting possibilities here...
What this program does, is put the tty-bound processes in a special cgroup. While this is done automatically, there is also a possibility to just do the same in userspace. (check Lennart from redhat's solution).
It basicly creates a different cgroup for foreground processes, he does it in the bash profile. But i think that with this in mind, we can create cgroup handler for our "most important" apps to make them more responsive!
I've been looking into hardcore's kernel and it already has cgroup support built in, so it's actually just a matter of using it properly
how? check lennart's comments further in the lkml thread because you have to look out to clean up cgroups when no more processes use it.
Anyway, when properly tuned, it should be even better than the kernel patch people talked about!

These type of changes would suit more underpowered devices like the Hero or G1 but imho I dont know why the galaxy S needs it, my IO after applying OCLF is 2300+ apps, any lag issues are not due to the current modded kernels available as they are really good..

Idk why people don't understand simple things
cgroups does not magically makes your apps more responsive. It makes groups of processes which are scheduled together at the same level instead of doing it per process.
So, the group of "make" processes during a make -j64 get all globally a lower share of resources (than if they weren't grouped), allowing the group "browser" process to get enough resources to be smooth.
Without, each make process (64 of them) would get an equal resource time, which would also be equal to the browser, which ends up not being very nice for the desktop.
Now on the phone.. do you have a make -j64 running [IN THE BACKGROUND]? nope. do you have an heavy process or group of processes running [IN THE BACKGROUND]? nope.
Your front task is always the one taking most resources. If you put it in a group you might even decrease it's performance and responsiveness.
It's a double edged sword. You see, when they schedule the make -j64 process group, your browser is smooth but the make -j 64 process group is *slower*.
So unless a group of processes on the phone are taking too much cpu (i know of none doing that unless they're on the foreground), it's useless

bilboa1 said:
Idk why people don't understand simple things
cgroups does not magically makes your apps more responsive. It makes groups of processes which are scheduled together at the same level instead of doing it per process.
So, the group of "make" processes during a make -j64 get all globally a lower share of resources (than if they weren't grouped), allowing the group "browser" process to get enough resources to be smooth.
Without, each make process (64 of them) would get an equal resource time, which would also be equal to the browser, which ends up not being very nice for the desktop.
Now on the phone.. do you have a make -j64 running [IN THE BACKGROUND]? nope. do you have an heavy process or group of processes running [IN THE BACKGROUND]? nope.
Your front task is always the one taking most resources. If you put it in a group you might even decrease it's performance and responsiveness.
It's a double edged sword. You see, when they schedule the make -j64 process group, your browser is smooth but the make -j 64 process group is *slower*.
So unless a group of processes on the phone are taking too much cpu (i know of none doing that unless they're on the foreground), it's useless
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
very true... that's why it still might be possible to group "your current task" and "all the rest". That (might) give you an advantage still...
and as said: i'm not saying it IS better, i'm saying it might be worth testing
hence the suggestion i put in post 11: make something that puts the application you start in foreground in a dedicated group and EVERYTHING else in another. When you background that process, move it to the "pool" group
it might just help!! (so... don't shoot the idea too soon )

Android accelerator - A Magic runs same speed than a Nexus

Hi all,
Very impressed after watching this video on the Cyanogen Mod :
Demo video : http://forum.cyanogenmod.com/topic/...aster-flexycore-thanks-cyanogenmod-community/
I m pleased to share it with you and would like to know what you're thinking about this "droidBooster" which make an old HTC running at the same speed than a Nexus One! :

Whats the point of this?
What does a video of a video player proove? Wouldn't some real time benchmarks like linpack or quadrant be more proof.
Still why didnt they have 2 Nexus One's and show how much faster the one with droidbooster got.
All these booster softwares sound abit like all the BS booster softwares for windows.
sceptical...

Hmm I suspect that they are overclocking because they didnt mention anything about clock speed but lets hope that its legit
Edit: they have an apk in the market
Sent from my Nexus One using Tapatalk

Imperial.mack said:
Hmm I suspect that they are overclocking because they didnt mention anything about clock speed but lets hope that its legit
Sent from my Nexus One using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I hardly think they are overclocking becose that would make the software only runnable on rooted devices. Which would remove a huge part of their possible market share.
And overclocking with that much improvement in performance? Youd have to double the clock rates. Which on nearly all devices is damn close to impossible. Except for Desire-Z for example.
Unless they somehow are without Root overclocking it or changing the kernel to their own super optimized i dont really see how this is done.

nd the nexus one can fly beyond their limits?

They posted this video showing how it works basically:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEAz9fRoDmA

Their software modifies the Dalvik code, which means that you do not only need to be root, but you also can't install this software without modifying your ROM.

From the web page http://www.flexycore.com/droidbooster-overview.html
"DroidBooster technology enables to compile any Android Java code in optimized native binary when generating the ROM, taking full power of the underlying CPU for high performance and low power execution."
This is not overclocking, but maybe be a paid app (and very expensive app)
Sorry 4 my poor english

It's actually more like Jit.
See this video for further explications : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEAz9fRoDmA
Lol ok took me so much time to answer that already 4 ppl posted !!

After looking at the company website who developed DroidBooster, I discover an other Video with a principle presentation of droidbooster.
"DroidBooster relies on compiling and executing any embedded Java Code of an Android system as binary." according to the video available here:
ww.youtube.com/watch?v=tEAz9fRoDmA[/url]

this thing is kinda bs imo. And the guy's voice is just gay

LoL
I hope to come out soon

If this thing really does what the company claims, then Google will probably buy the code from them. Also limiting this software to rooted phones means it wouldn't make a ton of cash, and then expecting them to cook and sign their own ROMs is a weird business model. In other words, it's meant for developers only, so we kinda have to wait for official incorporation.

exciting! hope they support the nexus ..

DDM123 said:
If this thing really does what the company claims, then Google will probably buy the code from them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, I doubt this code is worth anything to google. All they say they are doing it converting the dalvic code into native code. If google wanted to do that they could very easily, the JIT they included with Froyo already does do it to some extent.

I won't believe this for a second. I have both the N1 and Magic, and I can safely say the N1 is MUCH faster. It should be a no-brainer, just look at the specs. The Magic was what -- the second Android ever!? They were bound to improve, and the N1 set the bar high a year ago. Now look at the plethora of fast devices we have, and the N1 can be thanked for that. I once read that one of the reasons Google launched the Nexus was to jump-start the "super" smart phone market, because manufacturers weren't pushing the bar far enough in their devices. N1 set a standard for the rest of them. The way I see it, the Magic was nothing more than an early experiment.
And I never had an issue playing videos on my Magic anyway. What proof is that? The N1 is definitely more responsive, boots 10x faster, never runs out of memory. The Magic pretty much requires an app killer; never needed one on the Nexus. I can go on and on, but I think I made my point.

Bloodflame said:
I won't believe this for a second. I have both the N1 and Magic, and I can safely say the N1 is MUCH faster. It should be a no-brainer, just look at the specs. The Magic was what -- the second Android ever!? They were bound to improve, and the N1 set the bar high a year ago. Now look at the plethora of fast devices we have, and the N1 can be thanked for that. I once read that one of the reasons Google launched the Nexus was to jump-start the "super" smart phone market, because manufacturers weren't pushing the bar far enough in their devices. N1 set a standard for the rest of them. The way I see it, the Magic was nothing more than an early experiment.
And I never had an issue playing videos on my Magic anyway. What proof is that? The N1 is definitely more responsive, boots 10x faster, never runs out of memory. The Magic pretty much requires an app killer; never needed one on the Nexus. I can go on and on, but I think I made my point.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not really. The point is that this guy is claiming to make java code run in native binary, thus ensuring that the CPU isn't doing unnecessary work to interpret and run java code. If possible (who's to say) then it would make a Magic run much faster than it does. It might even be feasible to suggest that it would run as fast as a stock Nexus.
Think about it this way, why is it that the original iPhone UI is so smooth? The code is optimized and run as a native binary, not some VM that has to be compiled and run by the CPU every time it wants it. Native code would make the Magic much faster.
The whole point is moot though, because this isn't something that you will see bundled into an .apk anytime soon. It might be novel code that Google picks up on and uses in later OS revisions though. Who knows.
sassafras

As i understand it will cost a high memory consumption, where 512mb of ram will be not enought for it (Actually its already not enough on miui rom with Dalvik VM, on nexus1 i have only 130mb free). And high power drain.
Welcome back to Windows Mobile
Btw i dont believe it, they just want to make some money with air bubbles

Tim4 said:
As i understand it will cost a high memory consumption, where 512mb of ram will be not enought for it (Actually its already not enough on miui rom with Dalvik VM, on nexus1 i have only 130mb free). And high power drain.
Welcome back to Windows Mobile
Btw i dont believe it, they just want to make some money with air bubbles
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
"Only" 130MB free? It's 130MB that isn't ever used by the system, making it wasted 130MB, and you're referring to it as "only"?
This point was discussed zillions of times in Autokiller Minfree and "Don't need task killers" threads. Android has efficient memory management, Nexus having it VERY efficient since Froyo, much more efficient than really needed. It never uses its 400MB of user memory or even close to it.
Funny, how marketing affects people. They want more of the things they don't need.

Jack_R1 said:
"Only" 130MB free? It's 130MB that isn't ever used by the system, making it wasted 130MB, and you're referring to it as "only"?
This point was discussed zillions of times in Autokiller Minfree and "Don't need task killers" threads. Android has efficient memory management, Nexus having it VERY efficient since Froyo, much more efficient than really needed. It never uses its 400MB of user memory or even close to it.
Funny, how marketing affects people. They want more of the things they don't need.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, i call it "the only free memory."
Take a look:
You have 130mb left.
1)browser eats 65mb of ram. 65mb left
2)+some other apps that running at background/service.
So what i have in result?
My apps often be killed by android because out of memory.
The most anoying thing is when im surfing, writing some stuff on forums i get my browser killed with data lost. Its rare but still hapens.
Another real example: Dungeon Defenders. When i play it, i got almost all my apps be kicked from memory.
P.s. I know about wipe. Just moved to latest 1.1.14miui, have wiped everything 3 times.
P.s.2 ofcource it depends on how many apps you have and which rom you use. No problems with ram on stock android but i just dont like it, so...

Windows 8 Flaws - Short Review

Hey guys, I believe everyone has known the BUILD conference by Microsoft pretty well and know quite a bit about Windows 8 for now. I have written a short review on the short-comings of Windows 8 and decided to share with you guys. Please leave me a comment and tell me what you think, and I'll gladly thank you in return.
http://www.seednonym.com/2011/09/major-flaws-in-windows-8-known-so-far.html
This article is written as of now and is subject to change as development continues. I'd like to know what you have in mind regarding the issues.
Thank you.

Regarding "Major Flaw no 2":
Not supporting Flash (or any other plug-ins) in IE10 when running the Metro UI is not an issue in my opinion, that is a great feature. Flash really is a disaster in general especially on smartphones and tablets. Flash has had it's time, now its time to leave Flash for HTML5 or dedicated apps.
And since the breakthrough of ipad, Flash is slowly dying, and this move by MS will speed up this process. So this is not a big issue when W8 arrives. And we'll probably see third party browsers for metro UI with Flash support (e g google chrome/firefox?) if you really need Flash.
And plug-ins is a huge security issue as well.
Regarding the other issues - they seem a bit irritating, but if these are the major flaws you have found in a alpha-OS then this looks really promising.

tjtj4444 said:
Regarding "Major Flaw no 2":
Not supporting Flash (or any other plug-ins) in IE10 when running the Metro UI is not an issue in my opinion, that is a great feature. Flash really is a disaster in general especially on smartphones and tablets. Flash has had it's time, now its time to leave Flash for HTML5 or dedicated apps.
And since the breakthrough of ipad, Flash is slowly dying, and this move by MS will speed up this process. So this is not a big issue when W8 arrives. And we'll probably see third party browsers for metro UI with Flash support (e g google chrome/firefox?) if you really need Flash.
And plug-ins is a huge security issue as well.
Regarding the other issues - they seem a bit irritating, but if these are the major flaws you have found in a alpha-OS then this looks really promising.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for your feedback.
Yes I do agree with point #1. However most web-based applications still run on Flash and it takes time to transition over to HTML5. Flash imo hogs too much system resources hence it actually would slow down performance - a key note why Steve Jobs insisted not to incorporate in iOS.

ToonXW said:
Flash imo hogs too much system resources hence it actually would slow down performance - a key note why Steve Jobs insisted not to incorporate in iOS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, if you make the same banners/advertisements with the same animations in HTML5, it will use even more resources. And believe me, those banners will still be made. HTML5 and supported video codecs(patented) for the video element is also questionable.
Flash is not that bad in regard to performance(especially with the latest version of flash utilizing the GPU for acceleration).
However HTML5 is an open standard and flash is not, so that's a good reason why flash had it's time.

YoMarK said:
Actually, if you make the same banners/advertisements with the same animations in HTML5, it will use even more resources. And believe me, those banners will still be made. HTML5 and supported video codecs(patented) for the video element is also questionable.
Flash is not that bad in regard to performance(especially with the latest version of flash utilizing the GPU for acceleration).
However HTML5 is an open standard and flash is not, so that's a good reason why flash had it's time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for your input.
I think designing on the same base, flash could actually produce better animations as compared to HTML5 as the variety is much more made for animated transitions. Correct me if I'm wrong.

How can you judge an OS when its in beta... I remember downloading the W7 beta and it was as bad as vista

TwoSquared said:
How can you judge an OS when its in beta... I remember downloading the W7 beta and it was as bad as vista
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So you can't judge a school child when he is in primary school.
It's the same theory. Everything has to improve, and people has to point it its flaws from time to time. When it's finalized, there will be even more little flaws found. It's how disadvantages are cut down to the minimum.
Give it time to improve now. 8 months from now we'll see to the official release.

Regarding closing apps, you're not really supposed to close Metro-apps, just as Android. Look for example here:
http://www.winsupersite.com/article.../wininfo-short-takes-september-16-2011-140606
"
Top Windows 8 Question: How Do You "Close" a Metro App in Windows 8?
Answer: You don't. Windows automatically suspends apps that aren't on the screen and, over time, will shut them down as needed, so you don't have anything to worry about, or anything to micro-manage. In some ways, it works a lot like it does on Windows Phone, which makes sense, though it's a much more sophisticated system. And if a Metro app does hang, you can always kill it with Task Manager, just like you do with today's applications. I'm guessing that won't be a pressing need, based on the quality of the underlying platform, called WinRT (Windows Run Time).
"
If this works well or not in practice is something we'll need to find out of course...

tjtj4444 said:
Regarding closing apps, you're not really supposed to close Metro-apps, just as Android. Look for example here:
http://www.winsupersite.com/article.../wininfo-short-takes-september-16-2011-140606
"
Top Windows 8 Question: How Do You "Close" a Metro App in Windows 8?
Answer: You don't. Windows automatically suspends apps that aren't on the screen and, over time, will shut them down as needed, so you don't have anything to worry about, or anything to micro-manage. In some ways, it works a lot like it does on Windows Phone, which makes sense, though it's a much more sophisticated system. And if a Metro app does hang, you can always kill it with Task Manager, just like you do with today's applications. I'm guessing that won't be a pressing need, based on the quality of the underlying platform, called WinRT (Windows Run Time).
"
If this works well or not in practice is something we'll need to find out of course...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for the input.
Yes I have read the app managing system and yes it does work like how Gingerbread manages applications. However there are certain times which you would want to shut down the number of apps as it will affect the amount of applications you have to swipe through each time to reach your desired app.

Point 5: This is amazing for Tablet point's of view, assuming they have an airplane mode. Otherwise "go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200"
For a desktop the fast resume could be useful, but for small individuals or students like myself even small increases in power bills hurt. If we have 4 devices doing this then it will knock us over our budget (yes thats how tight our budget in NZ is)

CruciasNZ said:
Point 5: This is amazing for Tablet point's of view, assuming they have an airplane mode. Otherwise "go directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200"
For a desktop the fast resume could be useful, but for small individuals or students like myself even small increases in power bills hurt. If we have 4 devices doing this then it will knock us over our budget (yes thats how tight our budget in NZ is)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for the input.
Airplane mode would just cut off the data line, however i don't really think it really consumes that much battery. for tablet in deep sleep mode it could last for days on light usage.

I liked the new windows. Internet explorer 10 is extremely fast. The switching between apps is fluid and smooth. I know multitasking is an issue but only for a select amount of people. I don't know how many people actually run more than two applications at once but for me its not an issue. You can still snap two windows side by side so I have enough to do my work while watching movie etc. btw the flash works but you have to select the internet explorer from the desktop not from metro.
So far, I've liked it. I like that it suspend tasks, saves battery that way and nothing eats up too much memory that way.
Looking forward to more improvements.
What's a signature?

utsmaster18 said:
I liked the new windows. Internet explorer 10 is extremely fast. The switching between apps is fluid and smooth. I know multitasking is an issue but only for a select amount of people. I don't know how many people actually run more than two applications at once but for me its not an issue. You can still snap two windows side by side so I have enough to do my work while watching movie etc. btw the flash works but you have to select the internet explorer from the desktop not from metro.
So far, I've liked it. I like that it suspend tasks, saves battery that way and nothing eats up too much memory that way.
Looking forward to more improvements.
What's a signature?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see. I've read Adobe is now stepping up the game and start poking into HTML5 on top of Flash at the same time, so that problem is generally solved.

Has anyone found anything that's worth adding under the list?

I think the list is almost perfect as it is, but a small correction for #2, Windows 8 does support Flash (and other plugins) on both x86 and ARM when running in regular desktop IE10 rather than the Metro IE10. I think this makes perfect sense because you're mostly going to be using Flash with the mouse and keyboard, as the uses for Flash - games, web apps, etc - don't work too well on a touch screen anyway.

NotTarts said:
I think the list is almost perfect as it is, but a small correction for #2, Windows 8 does support Flash (and other plugins) on both x86 and ARM when running in regular desktop IE10 rather than the Metro IE10. I think this makes perfect sense because you're mostly going to be using Flash with the mouse and keyboard, as the uses for Flash - games, web apps, etc - don't work too well on a touch screen anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you, will update as it is.

TwoSquared said:
How can you judge an OS when its in beta... I remember downloading the W7 beta and it was as bad as vista
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure which beta you used but I had 7 as my main OS since beta, and it was leagues better than vista.

The decision to remove the start menu and its dedicated search along with apps not being designed to close entirely are the ones that are bugging me the most. For now.

ToonXW said:
Thank you, will update as it is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Am i right in assuming that windows 8 RTM, will have both the desktop and metro sides? If they do that's retarded. I thought the desktop side was there atm to provide compatibility with win32 applications, and in the final build would be hidden

AndroHero said:
Am i right in assuming that windows 8 RTM, will have both the desktop and metro sides? If they do that's retarded. I thought the desktop side was there atm to provide compatibility with win32 applications, and in the final build would be hidden
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On the contrary, hahah. Yes, you will have both desktop and Metro UI.