Database Users

porting!!!!!

Theoretically if i knew specific specs of an iphone could i somehow port win mo to an iphone? One of the main reasons i would even bring this up is the ability of the multi-touch and the larger processor (i wanna say 720mHz)
YES I DO HATE APPLE

joel2009 said:
Theoretically if i knew specific specs of an iphone could i somehow port win mo to an iphone? One of the main reasons i would even bring this up is the ability of the multi-touch and the larger processor (i wanna say 720mHz)
YES I DO HATE APPLE
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LOL never heard it the other way around like that before
oh, and t answer your question: no
did u fall into the iphone trap?

joel2009 said:
Theoretically if i knew specific specs of an iphone could i somehow port win mo to an iphone? One of the main reasons i would even bring this up is the ability of the multi-touch and the larger processor (i wanna say 720mHz)
YES I DO HATE APPLE
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Click to collapse
Well, theoretically you could build your own phone that's 50 times faster than an iPhone, with 10 times the resolution and 100 times the storage. And ran WinMacOSXubuntuDos, all with neural interfacing - no touch required.
Anything's possible theoretically.

snachez said:
Well, theoretically you could build your own phone that's 50 times faster than an iPhone, with 10 times the resolution and 100 times the storage. And ran WinMacOSXubuntuDos, all with neural interfacing - no touch required.
Anything's possible theoretically.
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LOL, didn't we have a whole thread about this? People started getting wild and started imagining all sorts of different things..like a nuclear powered phone that can double as a microwave..etc etc

Yes, but can it mow the lawn?

outphase said:
Yes, but can it mow the lawn?
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You can use it to call someone to cut your grass for you though

hmm.. that makes me think if we might built our own customs... maybe sort of a pimp my phone customs?
kewl..

Seriously now, guys are having a hard ass time writing drivers for the video issues on the MSM7200 chipset devices. How do you realistically think porting the entire WM OS to a foreign device that you will have no device reference info to is possible. Theoretically yeah I guess, but realistically, well you know the rest of the sentence....

glad everyone is on the same page hahaha....... i must say though when i heard phones would be coming out with gHz chipsets now..... does anyone know exactly how the multi touch works, is it software or hardware that makes the difference. because the whole "finger only sensitive screen" isn't really that..... it responds to anything that is thicker as an input, so it probably has something to do with a lock on a certain range of size..... since all programs are input output and touch flow is now modifyable is there a way to write software or a driver for the multitouch?????
sorry to seem iintreged by the iphone, really i hate it and personally think the only real "new" thing it produced with the multi touch on a handheld devise. I mostly just don't like apple because they Ruin everything they create by being overprotective of there stuff..... thats my two cents for the day though......
Food for thought, is there an exchange rate on your thoughts or something cause people say a penny for your thoughts but i've always given my 2 cents

Joel
I have been told that multitouch requires a whole different type of screen.
I have aslo been told that there is a possibility that WM7 once released will be able to support multitouch; however, you will not be able to just put WM7 on any phone and have multitouch because our current screens cannot support it. There will have to be completely new devices.
I wonder if the HTC Touch HD will be able to support it though.

i imagine one day our ppc will replace a p4 desktop able to output xvid video quality to tv
able to dl large gb files over the air at t1 speed and watch local tv anywhere around the world.

iPhone has a capacitive screen as opposed to the resistive screens on HTC devices. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Touchscreen

hambola said:
iPhone has a capacitive screen as opposed to the resistive screens on HTC devices. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Touchscreen
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good refrence hambola

i understands how the touch screens differ now, but if there is a way to program "actions" such as swiping a finger is there not also a way the write a piece of software that could then some how measure the size of the objet pressing on it? can we better control the "smartness" of our screens?
i no the type of screen our htc phone can only register one point because of the way it litterallly registers though the contact of two plates and just gets confused by a large object, but is there a way to assign an object to that confusion?

I think this should be off-topic....

yeah probably but i really have no idea how to move it... and itskinda development and hacking or atleast about it
mods are welcome to move it

Update to windows mobile 6.5 and 7

Hello Xda
i am wondering are we can able to upgrade to windows mobile 6.5 in the future and windows mobile 7 too.
also can we will be able to use multi touch function on hd device?

Well on past models HTC have released new ROMs with newer version of WM, so you would think they would release new updated ROMs for the HD.
Unless they have another new phone on the horizon! You would think they would wanna sell 1 or 2 HD's first though before they release another 'high end' handset.

Philio25 said:
Well on past models HTC have released new ROMs with newer version of WM, so you would think they would release new updated ROMs for the HD.
Unless they have another new phone on the horizon! You would think they would wanna sell 1 or 2 HD's first though before they release another 'high end' handset.
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You would think so wouldn't you but then there was not much time between the diamond/Pro & the HD!

tingsagwaan said:
You would think so wouldn't you but then there was not much time between the diamond/Pro & the HD!
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Yer was very close, I heard mixed reviews of the Diamond/Pro so held of upgrading, then the HD popped up on the HTC website so waited for the HD instead!

winmo 7 is said to have hardware requirement of 256MB ROM for the OS. so should be fine.
WinMo 6.5 will probably be less than 256MB ROM too so all go there too.
TOUCH HD should be well future-proofed for WinMo updates (official or otherwise), and then there's the possibility of Android too......

I think and hope that they will release at least an update to winmo 6.5 But I also think you shouldn't hope for Multitouch! If i'm not totally wrong the HD use a resisitiv Touchscreen and they are all not cabable of Multitouch, doesn't matter which Firmware is running

There is supposed to be a pre-WM7 release, not sure what else is included but supposedly it will have a better version of the IE browser.

I imagine this may depends on how much WM7 will be a change and needs adjustment from HTC. Like... what will be the touch 3D layer then ?
My bet is, the more we are expecting from WM7 as a breaktthrough in the series the less me may use it on this version of the Touch HD.

Eitum said:
I think and hope that they will release at least an update to winmo 6.5 But I also think you shouldn't hope for Multitouch! If i'm not totally wrong the HD use a resisitiv Touchscreen and they are all not cabable of Multitouch, doesn't matter which Firmware is running
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Click to collapse
Actually, correct me if I'm wrong here, but resistive technology is able to detect multiple touches - and even laptop trackpads can too, it's just that there's never been any software developed for it, and the operating system has just been hard coded to ignore multiple touch points and averaged them out to somewhere in the middle of where touched.It's pretty much a case of trackpad and touchscreen designers going "hmm what about if someone touches with two points at the same time? Ah well, there's no reason for doing that, let's just average it out"
Now, more realistically speaking, what exactly is the benefit of multi-touch on a mobile operating system? Pinch zooming? The zoom bar on Opera seems pretty simple and actually easier to use to me! Anything else? New Macbooks use gestures for Expose (no use for that on a mobile), two finger scrolling (about the only day-to-day useful feature, but again useless on a mobile device with finger scrolling anyway!) Two finger rotating maybe (um, accelerometer does that for you!) so anybody got any more suggestions for making this gimmick actually useable on a portable device that can't do it better already?

How can you play an instrument like a keyboard without multi touch!
While such a functionality might be an intesting one, it also seems like a step backwards in certain aspects.
Single handed operation is one of the essential aspects of mobile phones.

chaosdefinesorder said:
Actually, correct me if I'm wrong here, but resistive technology is able to detect multiple touches
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would be fine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3Owgcos_KY
multi-touch on windows mobile on HTC diamond.....just not in the way you may expect.

chaosdefinesorder said:
Actually, correct me if I'm wrong here, but resistive technology is able to detect multiple touches - and even laptop trackpads can too, it's just that there's never been any software developed for it, and the operating system has just been hard coded to ignore multiple touch points and averaged them out to somewhere in the middle of where touched.It's pretty much a case of trackpad and touchscreen designers going "hmm what about if someone touches with two points at the same time? Ah well, there's no reason for doing that, let's just average it out"
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Click to collapse
No correction needed, this is 100% true. Touchscreens do not register clicks, or anything similar, the screen itself is nothing but a sensor. The screen sensor layer on the HD screen registers any surface part of the screen on which the pressure exceeds a given threshold and the output is translated by a driver into anything the OS uses for manipulation. Thus, theoretically, ANY touchscreen device can be multitouch.
chaosdefinesorder said:
Now, more realistically speaking, what exactly is the benefit of multi-touch on a mobile operating system? Pinch zooming? The zoom bar on Opera seems pretty simple and actually easier to use to me! Anything else? New Macbooks use gestures for Expose (no use for that on a mobile), two finger scrolling (about the only day-to-day useful feature, but again useless on a mobile device with finger scrolling anyway!) Two finger rotating maybe (um, accelerometer does that for you!) so anybody got any more suggestions for making this gimmick actually useable on a portable device that can't do it better already?
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Many of the more objective iPhone users have indicated that multitouch should not be overrated. It is nice for picture viewing, but in practical terms such as with a browser, it can be frustrating to see people zooming in to 100% with a swift doubletap while the iPhone users themselves are having to place two fingers on the screen, prevent accidentally using your nails, and having to squeeze/pinch until the page looks right.
BUT... I for one believe that more natural forms of input, i.e. a Keyboard, REQUIRES multitouch to function 100% intuitively. You simply do not need to release your finger from one key in order to press another, and a singletouch screen does require this. This causes lots of mistakes when typing too fast, you have to be over-articulate while typing.
Then again, I see most iPhone users typing with one thumb even when sitting down and holding the phone with both hands, because it's their first smartphone Not fair... WinMo pro's should have received this years ago
Oops I am straying from objectivity here...

Windows mobile 7 prebeta video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-i2jHEFdD4

Muhamed said:
Windows mobile 7 prebeta video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-i2jHEFdD4
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No it's not.

^ The interface looks new and cool...If its not WM 7...then what is it?

Nara-e-Mastana said:
^ The interface looks new and cool...If its not WM 7...then what is it?
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Click to collapse
from the youtube video info:
Device: HTC Touch (elf)
Skin name: Windows Mobile 7 i3
(i3 = 3 interface)
Skin version: QVGA
was it really that hard to read? the info was RIGHT THERE.

where to find
Out of curiosity where do we find this skin? all I can find is that youtube video. At the moment I'm getting a little bored with my current ROM and right now am looking for a new replacement look on my vogue.

chaosdefinesorder said:
Actually, correct me if I'm wrong here, but resistive technology is able to detect multiple touches - and even laptop trackpads can too, it's just that there's never been any software developed for it, and the operating system has just been hard coded to ignore multiple touch points and averaged them out to somewhere in the middle of where touched.It's pretty much a case of trackpad and touchscreen designers going "hmm what about if someone touches with two points at the same time? Ah well, there's no reason for doing that, let's just average it out"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just another confirmation of this. Synaptics, the maker of most touchpads for laptops, released driver updates for laptops to include multi-touch pinching, gestures, zooming, and Chiral(circular) scrolling - These were for touchpads that could previous only do what WinMo does with multiple touches.
So, as everyone said, you're right. If the manufacturers wanted to, they *could* give us multi-touch, but WinMo doesn't have an implementation of that anyway so it's useless.
http://blogs.msdn.com/windowsmobile/archive/2007/05/04/dogfood-doesn-t-always-taste-good.aspx

chaosdefinesorder said:
(...)
so anybody got any more suggestions for making this gimmick actually useable on a portable device that can't do it better already?
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specially for hd which has almost no hardware buttons multitouch would be a nice feature videogame-wise... like shooting while running or steering while accelerating...
btw check out the blackstone rom development forum a custom rom with winmo6.5 beta has been released already. Just for testing purposes only though.

four point multi touch on hd2 screen

can the hd2 screen do four point multi touch (uses more than 2 fingers) or it needs another hardware

hoss_n2 said:
can the hd2 screen do four point multi touch (uses more than 2 fingers) or it needs another hardware
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I do remember an app that someone wrote that showed the HD2 could recognize at least 3 different fingers on the screen at once.

hoss_n2 said:
can the hd2 screen do four point multi touch (uses more than 2 fingers) or it needs another hardware
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The hardware is there. There's just no software capable of it yet. I'd be suprised if we don't get full multi-touch recognition apps at some point. (For people that don't understand what that last sentance actually means, please note that when I say full multi-touch I do not mean more than 1. I mean as many as you want.)

johncmolyneux said:
The hardware is there. There's just no software capable of it yet. I'd be suprised if we don't get full multi-touch recognition apps at some point. (For people that don't understand what that last sentance actually means, please note that when I say full multi-touch I do not mean more than 1. I mean as many as you want.)
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aren't there any games that supports full multitouch for windows mobile or we should wait for for the wp7
series

johnk1973 said:
I do remember an app that someone wrote that showed the HD2 could recognize at least 3 different fingers on the screen at once.
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Click to collapse
and if you remembered this application please post it here

johncmolyneux said:
The hardware is there. There's just no software capable of it yet. I'd be suprised if we don't get full multi-touch recognition apps at some point. (For people that don't understand what that last sentance actually means, please note that when I say full multi-touch I do not mean more than 1. I mean as many as you want.)
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why then there are posts saying that hd2 did HD2 uses the clearpad 2000 capactive touch screen which only supports 2 point multitouch

Humm im sure playing super mario on morph gear i can run and jump right+2 round keys

colinp said:
Humm im sure playing super mario on morph gear i can run and jump right+2 round keys
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tis true, all my snes games support at least 2 points......

colinp said:
Humm im sure playing super mario on morph gear i can run and jump right+2 round keys
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Click to collapse
then you used more than 2 fingers on hd2

hoss_n2 said:
why then there are posts saying that hd2 did HD2 uses the clearpad 2000 capactive touch screen which only supports 2 point multitouch
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Clearpad 2000 are used on Nexus One and Android HTCs. Maybe HD2 uses another brand of touchscreen. I'm not sure though.

mdmhd2 said:
clearpad 2000 are used on nexus one and android htcs. Maybe hd2 uses another brand of touchscreen. I'm not sure though.
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if only we can make a track fingure application to use it and see

any new progress (sorry for bumping but i want answers)

scilor.com/hd2-leo-real-multitouch.html
found this, but i can't get it to actually respond to multiple fingers

You might have to soft reset to get it to work. It won't recognize more than two fingers as documented elsewhere on here or on his site, guess he never got around to doing a lower-level hook.

Or is there a way to upgrade hd2 clearpad 2000 to 3000?

According to the Visual Multitouch Test App from the Android market, I can only use up to two points. I don't know if this is a restriction caused by the Android port, or if the HD2's digitizer/screen can only support two points at once.

hd2 can't really handle multi-touch well? (compared to samsung or iphone)

sorry if this was mentioned before, but i cant seem to find any related threads on hd2 forum, anyways here it goes
does anyone else find the hd2 handles multi touch really poorly compared to some other smartphones out there? like the iphone and samsung galaxy s. this is especially obvious when the two point are close to each other in either axis, which is demonstrated by the video attached below (not by me!), although htc desire is used in the video, i can replicate the same response on my hd2 easily
so my question is, is the htc hd2 hardware 'imperfect' or is it the driver for the touch screen the one that is causing the problem, cheers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVlsRCMltDg
edit: forgot to mention, what i mean by hd2 handles multi touch really poorly is when the 2 touches are close to each other in either axis, the hd2 sort of just merge the two axis, although they are not exactly in the same line!

Ill take the hd2 off your hands.

the touch panel is capable of it.... just bad drivers.... htc is known for f*cking good hardware with ****ty drivers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOD3cWrTuEY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4IkVp3uWtE&feature=related

polo735 said:
Ill take the hd2 off your hands.
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haha you wish
JJbdoggg said:
the touch panel is capable of it.... just bad drivers.... htc is known for f*cking good hardware with ****ty drivers
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOD3cWrTuEY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4IkVp3uWtE&feature=related
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i see, hope there will be a fix in the future, because HD2 is one of the most capable smartphone ever... kind of unfortunate when the software cant utilize its full potential!

It.s a known old problem on the HD2. It was a long hard debate that HD2 can only ,,pinch-to-zoom,,. HTC implemented the drivers to use the device just for pinching. There are some workarounds on WM 6.5 to use the MT (look at fpsece) but if you refer to android (games i assume) you will experience weird behavior on the HD2.

snowblindd said:
It.s a known old problem on the HD2. It was a long hard debate that HD2 can only ,,pinch-to-zoom,,. HTC implemented the drivers to use the device just for pinching. There are some workarounds on WM 6.5 to use the MT (look at fpsece) but if you refer to android (games i assume) you will experience weird behavior on the HD2.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dont see the problem personally, unless you are expecting three point touch. Trying one of the multi touch test apps in Android, it works fine... are you referring to the snapping when the points approach orthogonal? or maybe mixing it up with this: http://www.knowyourmobile.com/blog/326530/htc_hd2_leo_lacks_universal_multitouch.html
...which clearly is untrue.

Real multitouch?
HTC HD2 have Synaptics Clearpad 2000 - work only with two fingers.
So there is no chance to see real multitouch on HD2 :/
Producent page : http://www.synaptics.com/sites/default/files/Product_Brief_CP2000_01_0.pdf
HTC Evo 4G have new touch panel - Atmel MaxTouch mxt224 - UNLIMITED FINGERS!
@UP :
This videos don't show new drivers . It's practically impossible to write new drivers by normal person.

Even with 2 fingers MT does not work as it should, actually HD2 is capable only to ,,pinch-and-zoom,, (as i said there are some work-arounds but you can.t compare evo or iphone MT with HD2)

adamvanner said:
Trying one of the multi touch test apps in Android, it works fine...
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it works, thats about it. the biggest problem i've had so far is when the two touches are quite close on the y axis, e.g. using a multi-touch keyboard, when i type o immediately after a, sometimes the o is registered as k or l, because the os somehow merges the two touches vertically, so they seem to be on the same horizontal line (sorry if i didnt explain this properly, but i think the video i've attached above should make this clear)

One thing that I noticed when using MultiTouch Visualizer 2 (free on Market) was that touch point 1 and touch point 2 would flip when using any Nexus builds. It is most apparent when touching between diagonal corners. Desire builds will show the two touch points recognized correctly. If anyone is having problems with Nexus builds, try this out. It may be part of the reason for your multitouch problems.

frostmourne said:
it works, thats about it. the biggest problem i've had so far is when the two touches are quite close on the y axis, e.g. using a multi-touch keyboard, when i type o immediately after a, sometimes the o is registered as k or l, because the os somehow merges the two touches vertically, so they seem to be on the same horizontal line (sorry if i didnt explain this properly, but i think the video i've attached above should make this clear)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i get this too if i type very fast only it happenes to me everywhere on the keyboard

the hd2 doesn't have the clearpad 2000 , i asked htc themselves , it is used in nexus and desire not hd2 , that is why we don't have the axe problems that they face , and the 2 point multitouch is a driver limitation as htc said to me

Multi-Touch problem in Nexus S?

I found that sometime when you touch two points at the same time, the phone doesn't response as expected. The screen only detect one point being pressed. This happens quite often and I am wondering if it is my phone's issue.
You can notice the problem easily when playing "Slice It".

hungyip84 said:
I found that sometime when you touch two points at the same time, the phone doesn't response as expected. The screen only detect one point being pressed. This happens quite often and I am wondering if it is my phone's issue.
You can notice the problem easily when playing "Slice It".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Multi touch is app dependent, some apps dont support it, open up google maps and pinch to zoom

Multi touch works fine for me. Nothing like the shennaigans of the Nexus One. Downloaded multitouch visulaizer 2 - my touch screen can detect 5 points of touch at once!
Edit - I see what you mean on sliceit. Sometimes if you put down 2 fingers simultaneously, it will lose the track on one of the fingers. All you have to do is lift that finger and put it back down again and it regains track.

hungyip84 said:
I found that sometime when you touch two points at the same time, the phone doesn't response as expected. The screen only detect one point being pressed. This happens quite often and I am wondering if it is my phone's issue.
You can notice the problem easily when playing "Slice It".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I noticed that with Slice It! too and was messing around investigating it. Also, I think it's the app's issue, since I've never had any other problems with multi-touch anywhere else.

sound like more of a bug with some specific Apps rather than a hardware issue.
as the multitouch test apps works just fine, if it were a hardware problem those test apps should be failing as well.

I don't know if you guys remember, but when the N1 got its first update to enable "multitouch", there was a lot of speculation that it wasn't true multitouch as Apple has it patented. I wonder if they're continuing on that same track or whether Google said screw Apple and dropped it in anyway.

allen099 said:
I don't know if you guys remember, but when the N1 got its first update to enable "multitouch", there was a lot of speculation that it wasn't true multitouch as Apple has it patented. I wonder if they're continuing on that same track or whether Google said screw Apple and dropped it in anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No. back then they used thinkpad2000 or something like that. forgot the same. wasnt real one " much like what Sony is doing with xperia x10" right now
the nexus s has true multi touch.

On the subject do any of you guys have problems with zoom in your photo galleries. When ever i try to pinch to zoom in for example to someones face it will start to zoom somewhere else. Don't know if its just my phone or everyones.

I tried to do the multi touch test using multi touch visualizer and multi touch tester. In multi touch tester, it only detect one touch point when i touch two points at the same time. In multi touch visualizer, it detect two touch points but the second point has a 1-2 second delay when i do the same test. I did the same test using Droid and galaxy s and they don't have the problem mentioned...any thought?
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

Slightly off topic, but in the Gallery app in the Album thumbnail section, you can two-finger press an album and spread your fingers and it'll give you a mini-slide show right there. Very impressive.

hungyip84 said:
I tried to do the multi touch test using multi touch visualizer and multi touch tester. In multi touch tester, it only detect one touch point when i touch two points at the same time. In multi touch visualizer, it detect two touch points but the second point has a 1-2 second delay when i do the same test. I did the same test using Droid and galaxy s and they don't have the problem mentioned...any thought?
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
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Click to collapse
i never heard of a screen that has a multi touch problem as in hardware issue.
but try different nexus S. if its doing the same thing then your phone is fine.

allen099 said:
I don't know if you guys remember, but when the N1 got its first update to enable "multitouch", there was a lot of speculation that it wasn't true multitouch as Apple has it patented. I wonder if they're continuing on that same track or whether Google said screw Apple and dropped it in anyway.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apple patented a specific method for implementing multi-touch... part of it is UI, which was only granted in the US, and part was technical... in either case, there are new ways of doing multi touch in technical terms, and as for UI Apple doesn't have a leg to stand on when it comes to "generic" actions like pinch to zoom, et al.

Some ppl in thus thread also experience the same problem. To me this is not a acceptable multi touch experience. I hope this can be fixed by an firmware update.
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App