Database Users

[Discussion] Sense Builds vs. Non-Sense Builds

I'm actively experimenting with newer builds everytime they come out. But I can't help to experience some sort of slow-/sluggyness with Sense builds?
It also seems that the Sense builds aren't that highly customizable as non-sense builds are? I might be just not that much of a sense-fan (however I really liked it under WinMo), but since I see lots of phones, in the screenshot topic, running sense builds, I was wondering if I might do something wrong ()?
Sense over non-Sense:
[+] Nice HTC Widgets
[+] Nice Clock/looks
non-Sense over Sense:
[+] Highly Customizable (especially with ADW.Launcher)
[+] Seems faster (to me that is, subjective of course!)

SENSE FTW!
i've tried non-sense (not nonsense though, just personal preference) builds b4, but i couldn't get pass the plain contacts which can't really link from here to there.
the HTC People seamlessly links your contacts to emails and facebook and twitter and whatsapp accounts, and the ability to view the facebook albums using HTC gallery as though the pictures were in the phone.
Plus the decently nice weather widgets, friends stream widget, and the multilanguage supported keyboard with handwriting tools for Chinese input, etc etc.
I vote for Sense because it makes Sense!

I'm pro sense, because of its contact manager and dialer.

I don't like sense builds. But non-sense builds freezes will kill me..

I've came across some weird crashes with Sense builds. Sometimes SetCPU would crash, or even Sense would crash and reboot.
I also like the fact that in non-Sense builds it is possible to change the DPI, probably also possible in Sense builds but I haven't found out how yet..

I cant use sense builds. Id prefer them but every single one I have tried has a screwed up contacts directory. Every contact is duplicated about 6 times.
Saying that I do love the non sense and the amount I can customize it. There are things I like and dislike about both

Below are my conclusions regarding sense vs non sense
Disadvantages of Sense are
[+] Have a nice looking of "Sense"
[-] Camera only 3M,if there's 5M,it usually have camera premature
[-] Unreliable connection and most of all PPP based
Disadvateges of Non Sense (CM Based) are
[+] Stable connection of data,usually use RMNET
[+] Good camera (dont have premature flash)
[-] G-Sensor dont working very well,sometime freeze
[-] Cant use automatic backlight because light Sensor not working well

non-sense builds!
i started using android with sense-builds. after some times i got tired of switching from one screen to another, so i reduced ist to only 4, 3 and so on.
now i'm on a non sense build with adw-launcher. i can use more shortcuts, use other apps and have all i want in 3 screens.
adw-launcher is awesome, very stable and gives you so much possibilities!!

Well I'm for sense i guess, used both and come to the conclusion that I bought the HTC HD2 for the look of the GUI, and i can't draw myself away from it, its pretty customisable and the build I'm currently using it brilliant, no lag, no sod, superb!

I love the sense widgits and UI and such, but I absolutely hate the Sense dialer and contacts setup. I much prefer AOPS or Wysie's contacts and dialer setup, and if I could figure out how to get them working in Sense, I would totally have the best of both worlds.

Does it matter which is better? We as HD2 users have the liberty of choosing between many different builds and that is what makes it the best phone ever.
For the record, I use both.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

sense with no sense
I´m also experiencing overall slowdown when using sense, particularly in desktop swipeing. But on the other hand sense brings good keyboard, dialer, sync and widgets.
So I decided to go the "Darkstone"-way - using sense ROM with LauncherPro as desktop UI. SenseUI does not even load which saves up good memory.
My experience with that combination is very good.....

psykick5 said:
Does it matter which is better? We as HD2 users have the liberty of choosing between many different builds and that is what makes it the best phone ever.
For the record, I use both.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope, it doesn't matter at all. I just wanted to discuss the pros and cons of both UIs. It's nice to have a discussion about it, so people can read up and have a decent overview of the differences between the two type of builds.

WoutH said:
Nope, it doesn't matter at all. I just wanted to discuss the pros and cons of both UIs. It's nice to have a discussion about it, so people can read up and have a decent overview of the differences between the two type of builds.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I enjoy having both hand generally use the one that gives better battery life.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

I started out with non-sense builds, but I find the sense ones to be a little more stable (They're the ones where the compass works well and freezes are minimal). I don't really like the Sense UI though so I run ADW on top of it.

SpacemanGep said:
I started out with non-sense builds, but I find the sense ones to be a little more stable (They're the ones where the compass works well and freezes are minimal). I don't really like the Sense UI though so I run ADW on top of it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you don't like the Sense, why did you buy the HD2? That was the main selling point of this phone when released, the ease of use and beauty that sense provided!
But I do agree with you that sense builds are a little more stable and freeze free when it comes to the build I'm using, I can honestly say hand on heart, for two weeks now I've had 0 freezes!!

burpingboy said:
SENSE FTW!
i've tried non-sense (not nonsense though, just personal preference) builds b4, but i couldn't get pass the plain contacts which can't really link from here to there.
the HTC People seamlessly links your contacts to emails and facebook and twitter and whatsapp accounts, and the ability to view the facebook albums using HTC gallery as though the pictures were in the phone.
Plus the decently nice weather widgets, friends stream widget, and the multilanguage supported keyboard with handwriting tools for Chinese input, etc etc.
I vote for Sense because it makes Sense!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Everything you stated is incorrect right down to the weather widget.
I know you didn't do it on purpose but I have never seen a more blatantly wrong series of statements.
I use HyperDroid (Non-sense) and my contacts are linked to Facebook/Twitter etc, etc.
I actually have and use the same weather widget as sense BUT I can change my weather icons and it does more than just show me the weather.
Freinds streaming is certainly available also... I use the facebook widget. I dont know about chinese characters but i dont need them either. However there are other languages that are supported.
To each his/her own... but at least lets have the real info.
Cheers.

I'm using cyanogen builds hyperdroid1.6 and bangsters1.5. I have tried a lot of builds and cyanogen stuck out over sence aesthetically and was more stable. I did enjoy sence dialler until I discovered dialler one in the bangsters build. I'm not giving up on sence once a good one rolls out that can please my demands as good or better than cyanogen or stock froyo it will have a home on my SD
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App

jmmmmm said:
Everything you stated is incorrect right down to the weather widget.
I know you didn't do it on purpose but I have never seen a more blatantly wrong series of statements.
I use HyperDroid (Non-sense) and my contacts are linked to Facebook/Twitter etc, etc.
I actually have and use the same weather widget as sense BUT I can change my weather icons and it does more than just show me the weather.
Freinds streaming is certainly available also... I use the facebook widget. I dont know about chinese characters but i dont need them either. However there are other languages that are supported.
To each his/her own... but at least lets have the real info.
Cheers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, after reading your post, and experiencing unresolvable errors with com.htc.bgp force close due to HTC Facebook syncing, i've decided to give non-sense another try. This time it's bangster 1.5, still downloading.
Cheers!

seems like this has been dormant for quite some time...
After using bangsters 1.5 for like 2 weeks, i've decided to switch back to M-deejay's evo sense 1.8 revolution with the latest Hastarin 7.6 kernel to try again.
Some of my findings:
Sense wins in terms of:
Facebook link to contacts:-
Sense: manual linking is alot more simple and user-friendly
Non-Sense: have to rename contacts to be exactly same as facebook, otherwise manual linking is possible but very tedious: contacts, settings, edit contacts, join, find facebook contact, confirm, back, back, back, and if any mistakes, have to separate and re-join.
Dialer:-
Sense: predictive t9 + phone no. dialer showing facebook display pictures fine
Non-Sense: default phone dialer no predictive t9, but shows facebook pics; Dialer One with predictive t9, but no predictive phone no., and facebook display pictures does not show
Default email app
While there are dedicated email apps for Gmail and Yahoo Mail, the default email app on Non-Sense builds is really restrictive, you cannot move mails between folders, you can't even retrieve your mails that you accidentally deleted but still in the trash folder. But these could be solved by 3rd party apps like K9.
but Non-Sense wins in terms of:
Customizability:-
Non-Sense: Best part of Non-Sense is its customizability. From changing LCD density, and choosing one out of so many launchers, customizing the themes and looks of your phone, no. of rows and columns, smooth transition from portrait to landscape, setting soft buttons, shortcuts, folders, drawers, etc.
Sense: somehow most of the sense widgets (weather, email, sms, friendstream, news) are oversized, takes up a full page, and cannot customize the size.
Alot of other things like camera 5mp, overclocking, battery, screen freezes, sods, etc are dependent on roms, builds and kernels, so i won't use those as a comparison between sense and non-sense.
Both are good in their own way, and i'm just glad that i'm using a HD2 which allows me to experience the best of both worlds!

[Q] Comparing WinMO< -> NAND (And switching)

hI,
First of al sorry if quetions have been asked before, I coud not find all answers, and sometimes contradictions.
I am new to NAND. Familiar with Android and WinMo.
I really love my HD2.
Therefor I am wondering about a few things:
- Is it poible to revert to WinMo (eg for guarantee/repair), I read several times it is not posible.
- Battery consumption in Android NAND: Better or worse compared to WinMo?
- Speed on NAND: Better or worse compared to Android on SD?
- Boot time: Comparable to SD or faster (Like factory Desire?)
- Are all Desire sense functions working?
eg1: Desire HD has possibility to ring phone when set to quit via PC, i this posible with Desire HD build on HD2?
eg2: Silence ring by turning phone
- Is there sync software (like with Sony Ericson Xperia 10i) like activesync/mobile center?
Finaly:
Which is the best Desire HD including sense buid around? (Most stable, Longest battery life)

- Yes it is possible to revert back, just people rush into things and don't read so they aren't knowledgeable of their device
- Iunno, considering i have not used winmo since android came out. Well for standby in andoird, 6 hours took off 3% for me
- I'd say it depends on your build. If you're using a sense build, then I feel NAND is faster than SD builds, atleast for desire HD builds. In non sense, it's the same speed
- I wouldn't know if boot time is comparable to an android device as I have never touched one before. To sd, I wouldn't say there's a notable difference
- Yes (except 720p recording, which we all know doesn't work with android on our phones as of yet)
- HTC sync, however I don't know how efficient it is as I've never used it.
There is no best of anything.

- Is it poible to revert to WinMo (eg for guarantee/repair), I read several times it is not posible.
It is possible. I haven't done it but every where I go it says possible. However like flashing winmo rom there is always a certain level of risk.
- Battery consumption in Android NAND: Better or worse compared to WinMo?
Worse. It's close but def worse than winmo.
- Speed on NAND: Better or worse compared to Android on SD?
Didn't try SD android that much, but nand android is FAST.
- Boot time: Comparable to SD or faster (Like factory Desire?)
Don't know. But I used nexus froyo build, sometimes it boots in <20s.
- Are all Desire sense functions working?
eg1: Desire HD has possibility to ring phone when set to quit via PC, i this posible with Desire HD build on HD2?
eg2: Silence ring by turning phone
Don't use sense build.
- Is there sync software (like with Sony Ericson Xperia 10i) like activesync/mobile center?
No need, just copy/paste.

Thanks all for your replies.
I am running Android from BAND now for a couple of days, and I must say that a lot of worries were not needed.
Doing a lot by GGD, I. Missed task sync with Outlook/exchange. I got around that.
Now for the answers in my opinion:
Speed, compared to SD: Faster if one leaves phone to settle for a few minutes after boot. faster than WinMo.
Battery life: With use of advanced taller I believe better, at least comparable to WinMo.
Market offers lots of replacements for my WinMo software, most of the time even surpassing in functionality and mostly for free or very little.
I already flashed back to WinMo, because. I forgot to deactivate CoPilot. Now using my WinMo licence on Android.
Boot is faster, comparable to stock phone, but needs to settle for a few minutes for max performance.
When I chose HD2, I chose it for WinMo, loving the possibility to experiment with Android. Now I am glad I can run Android from NAND.
My wife just got SonyEricson Xperia X10i. Sexy phone (in white). Very happy with Android.
Only disadvantages found on both phones is the missing integration for Exchange. There array a lot of (quite expensive) third party apps, but Google dropped a vital issue by not implementing exchange integration, especially notes and tasks to the Android calendar.
The third party software makes push mail and sending possible, but still separate from Android calendar and contacts. Fix that Google, and Android is A++, now just A.
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App

Go to setting then account and sync, choose add new account then you'll are the possibility of adding exchange account.
I'm running nexus froyo.
Wilco said:
Thanks all for your replies.
I am running Android from BAND now for a couple of days, and I must say that a lot of worries were not needed.
Doing a lot by GGD, I. Missed task sync with Outlook/exchange. I got around that.
Now for the answers in my opinion:
Speed, compared to SD: Faster if one leaves phone to settle for a few minutes after boot. faster than WinMo.
Battery life: With use of advanced taller I believe better, at least comparable to WinMo.
Market offers lots of replacements for my WinMo software, most of the time even surpassing in functionality and mostly for free or very little.
I already flashed back to WinMo, because. I forgot to deactivate CoPilot. Now using my WinMo licence on Android.
Boot is faster, comparable to stock phone, but needs to settle for a few minutes for max performance.
When I chose HD2, I chose it for WinMo, loving the possibility to experiment with Android. Now I am glad I can run Android from NAND.
My wife just got SonyEricson Xperia X10i. Sexy phone (in white). Very happy with Android.
Only disadvantages found on both phones is the missing integration for Exchange. There array a lot of (quite expensive) third party apps, but Google dropped a vital issue by not implementing exchange integration, especially notes and tasks to the Android calendar.
The third party software makes push mail and sending possible, but still separate from Android calendar and contacts. Fix that Google, and Android is A++, now just A.
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App

Does Froyo sync tasks and notes too?
Currently I am running desire HD which is Android 2.2
Looking at the problem I encountered, the sync still is not possible.
Using Moxier or touchdown, contacts end up in different db than Android db. Setting up two applications sending the same data is imo principally wrong. (nitpickin) Also for battery life having two sync costs more mA......
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA App

Not sure to understand how you want to sync.
If exchange via Internet... I can't help.
If ou talk about software to sync with your laptop I just found a link (and again advertisement for my post )
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=951567
If you use a sense build, HTC Sense is great (much better than the WM one).
Both solutions are free.

[Q] Stock-like HD2 Android Builds

I have a few questions about the current state of android builds for the HD2.
I've been running the Cotulla DFT Stock Desire rom for a while with a few tweaks (prj 0.3 kernel, removed some system apps, repartitioned for more /data on NAND). It's been relatively stable but I thought i'd try a Desire HD build as I like some of the newer apps and smaller menu text (it works better on the 4.3" screen).
I tried the imilka RAM Desire HD build. The build has the same WiFi sleep issue (wifi disconnects after phone left in extended sleep) that the DFT Stock build has. It also has a very obscure partition format (with RAM, but system framework on SD), odd slowdowns, and a few other things including the camera FC.
Basically I am looking for a build for the HD2, with the following:
- Suit EU HD2
- Desire HD base
- As stock as possible. No crazy RAM or framework-on-sd stuff. Fine with removed apps (like maps, youtube, etc) and /data on A2SD+
- Odexed. I want performance not fancy graphics
- Good battery life
- Fixed wifi & camera (I dont care what resolution, I just dont want FC on using the share app)
- Prefer Desire keyboard (hate the arrows, take up too much screen space).
Is this wish list too much? I might try skink clean desire but it's not a HD build.
I'm really disappointed that there are so many different android builds for the HD2 yet they all seem to have the same basic problems. I liked the DFT rom as it was well tested and had no extra crud.
HELP!

Well maybe you should ask yourself this first. What major difference is there between a desire hd and desire build in terms of looks/functions? A new music app? A different widget look for messaging and e mail? A different camera interface (Note barely any of the features in the desire hd camera work, which I assume you know)? A camcorder that doesn't sync audio and visual correctly? HTC hub, which isn't even populated with anything of relevance yet. And to top it all off, the desire hd builds are considerably slower than desire builds. I'm just saying here, there's no advantage other than eye candy I guess.

galapogos01 said:
I have a few questions about the current state of android builds for the HD2.
I've been running the Cotulla DFT Stock Desire rom for a while with a few tweaks (prj 0.3 kernel, removed some system apps, repartitioned for more /data on NAND). It's been relatively stable but I thought i'd try a Desire HD build as I like some of the newer apps and smaller menu text (it works better on the 4.3" screen).
I tried the imilka RAM Desire HD build. The build has the same WiFi sleep issue (wifi disconnects after phone left in extended sleep) that the DFT Stock build has. It also has a very obscure partition format (with RAM, but system framework on SD), odd slowdowns, and a few other things including the camera FC.
Basically I am looking for a build for the HD2, with the following:
- Suit EU HD2
- Desire HD base
- As stock as possible. No crazy RAM or framework-on-sd stuff. Fine with removed apps (like maps, youtube, etc) and /data on A2SD+
- Odexed. I want performance not fancy graphics
- Good battery life
- Fixed wifi & camera (I dont care what resolution, I just dont want FC on using the share app)
- Prefer Desire keyboard (hate the arrows, take up too much screen space).
Is this wish list too much? I might try skink clean desire but it's not a HD build.
I'm really disappointed that there are so many different android builds for the HD2 yet they all seem to have the same basic problems. I liked the DFT rom as it was well tested and had no extra crud.
HELP!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try the Typhoon NAND rom, it runs very smooth on my EU HD2, very stock, and almost all other points you mentioned.

Well the rom development for hd2 has come a long way from dft/cotulla build. I'd suggest you try some newer nn sense roms which I find way faster than any sense rom, that's the only way to find out for sure.
After countless trail and error I have found my rom(HyperDroid GBX) which does what I want it to do, it fast smooth, everything seems to work for me, battery its good, GPS,Bluetooth,wifi all work as intended and that's why its my daily driver( I still try other roms but this is where I go back to), keep in mind that just because it works for me doest mean it'll work for you.
Td;lr: try other roms and find one that meets your needs (do your home work! )

[Q] Good Sense is not bad. Can we make it better?

I have WF with Alpha Rev X S-OFF and Jokerdroid 4.2
It is now the fastest ROM with Sense, and there's no doubt about that.
I've read that there is not enough system memory to run Gingerbread-Sense ROM, but maybe it is possible to create some free space.
What is really great about Sense:
- clock with timer, stopwatch
- Facebook integration (espacially calendar)
- dialer and phonebook
- camera app
some people will also like Flickr integration, News Weather and so on...
But I thing we really don't need:
- HTC launcher, which is rubbish and You can't personalize it like Launcher Pro or (imho best - Go Launcher)
- all HTC Widgets as a result
- stupid services, that make nothing more than slowing down the phone (like HTC Checkin)
I got rid of a few apps, like Checkin service, DCS Service, Weather Service, and the phone runs very smooth, I got over 1000 on AntutuBenchmark which is rather a lot.
I'm wondering if there's a chance to get rid of some more Sense crap, that consumes RAM and ROM and only keep it with really good features, that no one has replaced yet, like Facebook integration, dialer.
I'm no developer and all I can do in my phone is deleting some apps / files or editing text files, but is it possible to make it any better at this point? Have anybody tried to cook a ROM with only selected Sense Apps deleting useless services and libraries as well?
This is my first post, so don't get mad

Actually that is not a bad idea at all. I believe there were already some attempts to do that by means of hybrid-sense roms. But I guess there was not enough demand for those roms. I for one would love to have that kind of a rom.
Right now, I am on Jokersdroid 4.2 as well. I installed AntTek App Manager and try to remove/uninstall some of the HTC programs but since I dont really understand what some of those apps do, I can't delete them. I am experimenting with FREEZE function for a while, and if I get no errors/misfunctions then I uninstall them.
All I need from a sense ROM is it's simply beautiful dialer. Rest I can live without.

I don't believe that there is no demand for fast ROM with the best of SENSE. I know barely anything about linux and Android as an OS, but deleting some unused libraries and other stuff cannot ruin the OS, can it? Maybe it will be possible to enable JIT then...
Devs, please look at this thread!!!

tomekpap said:
I don't believe that there is no demand for fast ROM with the best of SENSE. I know barely anything about linux and Android as an OS, but deleting some unused libraries and other stuff cannot ruin the OS, can it? Maybe it will be possible to enable JIT then...
Devs, please look at this thread!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sense rom is rather propritary not AOSP rom - get few apps where this functionality is allready implemented as in sense rom - weather with clock - and many additions not available in stock sense is fancy widgets, contacts manager much better than htc contacts - youlu has more power, camera ? ....
m32

[Q] Fast ics is a real possibility?

The HD i bought had already installed a 2.2 sense in magdlr. It is fast and stable.
Im willing to change and i tried miui 2.3 in sd. Worked ok but suffered sometimes apps made it slow, showing me the chinese guy with the turtle a lot.
After this i tried tostidroid with ics v9.0. Loved ics. Apex launcher, everything. Hated the performance.
Changed to tostidroid 10.0. Usable but not for everyday use.
Now, all the questions:
1. Is having ics on this phone, with nice performance, a real possibility? Or should i just stay at 2.2, 2.3 roms?
2. When changing version of tosti from 9 to 10, i deleted the entire folder and did all the setup. Is that the right way to do it or there is a way to just "upgrade a build?
3. When looking to improve performance in tosti, tried to overclock the phone with rom control. Phone reset itself or freezes. So i should rule it out? Should i try overclocking to lower values?
4. Could my sd be the one to blame for poor rom performance?
5. During all this time i left my sense 2.2 in magdlr as a fallback. Should i just backup this rom and flash a new one directly to the internal memory?
Your thoughts?

We`re not going to have a fast ics without lags,unless if someone can port full hardware accelleration for ics in our device

im running the latest tostidroid on the NAND with dorimanx 5.6 kernel
I dont really notice any lags, only in the browser when using multiple tabs but using dolphin solves this
full HWA would be sweet but it is not really a dealbreaker

Ιn some point you are right.Ιcs is fast or even faster from gingerbread if the app you use doesnt need hw acceleration.For example in ics launcher i have lag but i havent it if i use zeam launcher.Same for default ics dialer.If i use dialer one there is no lag.Αlso i think that it scrolls better in some programms.for example in k-9 mail

So, trying so me replacements might work? I noticed the facebook app is almost unusable, mobile versión works ok. I love apex launcher, maybe should try nova? Da, twitter, baconreader seem fine. Widgets i only use simicalendar and clock. Was cable ti overclock a bit the phone and so dar looking good.
Sent from my HTC HD2 using XDA