I'm lucky enough to have multiple Inc's I can compare side-by-side. This week, I took the time to test-drive a few Kernels.
My goal is to find the (1) most stable, (2) best performing w/good battery life. Basically undervolt kernel testing.
Unfortunately, I really can't find much difference between these popular variants.
The battery life seems to be roughly equal on all of them, as does the stability (barring IcrediKernel, which had some issues in my testing with SkyRaider).
I tested (all current versions as of 1/10/2011):
* Redemptive with Lou's included kernel
* SkyRaider Sense with Ziggy's kernel
* SkyRaider Sense with KingX kernel
* SkyRaider Sense with Incredi kernel
KingX #6 scores almost 100 better than the next best in Quadrant. However, outside of that, I cannot really discern a major difference.
KingX seems to have the most significant changes in his changelog. Ziggy also seems to be brilliant, and yet, I really don't see any real differences between the kernels once implemented on my phone.
Can anyone help me isolate the differences -- perhaps I'm looking in the wrong place? I've basically tried to use everything I can think of, on the phone -- using each kernel, and tested all of them in power-save mode, tethered, etc.
Thanks in advance for any additional points to review..
quadrant is useless.
lou's kernels are great for me.
each phone is different so you'll have to test whichever one works best for you
Sure, of course. I'm familiar with the stock answer to the "which kernel is better" post.
That being said, I was asking something a bit different. I've *been* testing the kernels. The point of my post was to suggest that I cannot discern the difference after spending several hours with them.
With that in mind, I was asking if there is something specific I should be looking for, since I haven't found it (not with battery life, performance, or stability -- not with what I'm testing presently anyway).
Although, in addition to my original question -- of where to look to seek differences ... you do bring up another good point -- why is it that different phones (assuming they are the *same* model/android/radio version -- eg OLED 2.2's), would perform differently with identical kernels?
A few hours is not enough testing time for kernels. You need atleast a full charge down to 0 with a kernel to see how good the battery life is. Also, to judge the performance, you'll need a little more time for that too. Each phone is different. Some processors can take lesser voltages, high clocks than others. I'm not sure why this is, but it is. Honestly, I'm sure all the kernels are very good because the devs are excellent. But, some just work well for others while the same one doesn't for someone else. As I said before, just test out a kernel for a day or two, see how you like each one, and stay with it. If you battery life is being affected greatly, or your phone runs too hot or something, then switch to a different one.
At this point, I have more than 3 days or more on the following kernels:
* Redemptive with Lou's included kernel (3 days)
* SkyRaider Sense with KingX kernel (3 days)
* SkyRaider Sense with Ziggy's kernel (14 days)
* SkyRaider Sense with Stock kernel (22 days)
(Incredi -- I only had about 4 hours over two tests/loads and re-flashed, due to problems)
I've never run my batteries down to zero as you've mentioned. I've run them down to 10-20% on rare occasion.
In essence, what you are saying is that there really is nothing specific to keep an eye out for? If I don't see an obvious difference somewhere, there is no significant difference between the 4 kernels I have listed above? And Quadrant is of no help ... so in short, if they all get the same battery life, I just just pick one randomly?
I just want to believe there must be a more scientific/objective way of evaluating these kernels relative of each other.
if they are all pretty much the same to you, pick the one that makes you happy and that feels like it has the best performance and battery life. Maybe ask one of the devs about some scientific way of how each kernel is different from each other.
The problem is that I've built an app that our company uses over 18 phones that get run 9 hours a day, and the DInc's were overheating.
I went to Skyraider w/stock kernel, and that seemed to address the problem, at least it appears to reboot much less than the stock DInc's.
However, since I've made the commitment/risk of rooting/flashing these phones, I'd like to find some systematic method to determine which is the most efficient kernel to use, considering I have 18 phones in-the-field.
As a software engineer/empiricist, I'm not good at accepting the logic of "if it works, it's good enough". And so my objective is to find someone that may have some additional perspectives beyond that.
If there is a developer who sees this, I'd very much appreciate any information you can provide on how your kernel differs from others. Or someone who has some additional information.
Thank you in advance,
RKM
rkmFL said:
I'm lucky enough to have multiple Inc's I can compare side-by-side. This week, I took the time to test-drive a few Kernels. My goal is to find the (1) most stable, (2) best performing w/good battery life. Basically undervolt kernel testing.
Unfortunately, I really can't find much difference between these popular variants. The battery life seems to be roughly equal on all of them, as does the stability (barring IcrediKernel, which had some issues in my testing with SkyRaider) KingX #6 scores almost 100 better than the next best in Quadrant.
However, outside of that, I cannot really discern a major difference Can anyone help me isolate the differences -- perhaps I'm looking in the wrong place? Thanks in advance for any additional points to review..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi! One thing that affects performance is SD Card Read Speeds. Ziggy and Incredi have an improved read speed, I just tested both and got 12mb/sec read with a class 4 card. Since HTC released FroYo Android 2.2 for our phone, they implemented a read speed limit of four MB/sec for the SD card. I just tested Lou and King and got read speeds of 4mb/sec from the SD card. All Fourkernels I got a write speed of 4 mb/sec.
Other major differences I think worth mentioning are that Ziggy includes a hosts file to block connections to advertising servers. But of course installing a different kernel leaves the new host file in place. Multi touch, I love the piano and playing games so this matters to me. Ziggy has had a 5 point multi touch enabled for some time. Lou & incredi have implemented in a different way. I am not the one to explain the differences. Lou turned it on for up to five multi touch points(but disabled it in his last build). Incredi had enabled all ten multi touch points but is now also at 5. Debugging. Lou disabled debugging so apps that rely on it will not work. Ex.... PDAnet. Lou did have wireless N disabled, he said he felt due to the minor network speed increase it was not worth the extra battery usage. But reading his change log I see it has since been re enabled.
Which one is best for you? It really does depend on too many factors to say outright. Depending on the apps you have installed, and apps you use the most. I listen to music a lot. Using one that lowers clock speed a bunchwhen the screen is off makes themusic skip. In theory you will get better battery life, but imo, its not worth sacrificing that usability.
Please correct me if I am wrong, mis informed, or steering peoples wrong. I hope this helps to understand some differences.
Overheating. It seems that the consensus is that the 9.01 radio works best for most people. Not me. The 9.01 version makes my phone get very hot. I use the 7.28 radio and it makes a big difference in my phone not getting hot.
What issues did you have with the incredi that made you have to abandon it so quickly?
~TheHoovie
Sent from my HTC Droid Incrediblel.
P.s. did you forget to include Chad/incredi in this threadstitle?
I've been wondering pretty much the same thing, and I have been reading the different changelogs from the respective kernels to find the differences between them. Thanks to you thehoovie for a good explaination, you put to light some things I have been wondering. Very good explaination!
With that said, what has worked best for me, is RR 2.1.3 with Ziggy's new kernel (BFS Jan 2 2011). I get great battery, I can control the freqs the proccessor is at all the way down to 128mhz, the system is very stable, and have had no problems what so ever. I get roughly 2 days out of a full charge with moderate use on a 1350 battery!
@TheHoovie -
Excellent, excellent information, thank you!
I did not include Incredi in the title, because I had problems with it (mentioned in first post). To answer your question, there were two things. One more subtle, that I don't remember off-hand -- and the other, was with downloading from the Internet. I had installed twice, on a SkyRaider ROM, and in both events, Incredi would hang when downloading.
I distribute all of our private, in-house software releases through our website. So not being able to download from the web in my testing .. was a deal killer!
Our users take roughly 900 photos a day, on average. Therefore, SD speed is extremely important, and I never would have tested the differences between kernels. This is exactly the type of feedback I was hoping to find -- in other words, I was not asking "which is best for me", but instead "can someone help me know where to look for differences in performance". Your comment on SD, is a perfect example of such a factor, thank you!
...Does anyone else have any suggestions, beyond SD performance and battery life, as to other factors for comparison/testing?
@m411b -
I cannot imagine getting two days on a 1350mah, this would be amazing! I'm running off to test your suggestion (RR + Ziggy's) now. Just one question: where do you set the CPU frequencies using that RR+Ziggy configuration?
EDIT: I just tested SkyRaider + Ziggy's #15, and it seems to be running very good. Ziggy's #15 also uses a low-power Bluetooth driver, which will be a huge help for us (we use BT to communicate between DInc's and gTablets in our app).
Thank you again for the great info!
One more related question...
Have people been moving away from these Sense ROM's to CM7/Gingerbread, and if so, any feedback on stability?
I keep reading about CM7 adoptions and it's starting to make me wonder if I should give the new Gingerbread version a try.
I have not tested CM since v6 about 45 days ago, but at that point, there were some issues on the DInc.
Suggestion:
1. turn off wifi.
2. turn on gps
Launch Last.fm or pandora - stream your favorite music station.
Launch navigation, Navigate somewhere.. (I actually do this.. I just use gps when I am out running errands for an hour or so)
See how long the following lasts:
1. Battery
2. Time without crashing
That's been my simple testing of kernels. This is not scientific.. its just real world testing IMO
I am currently playing with Lou's #4 vs #8 on the same rom.. I think testing on multiple roms would bring in more factors you cant control.
#4 crashes way too often when running navigation (its fine for day to day use though)
been using Lous #8 on SR3.5 and it blew me away with battery life as well as performance. I flashed #9 yesterday and am gonna give it a day or two before i judge it. I had previously used Chad's and Hydra. Chad's wasnt the best and hyrda was great for OC performance but not for battery life.
Related
im a big fan of nief's rom comparison, and i think the same concept could be applied to Kernels. I know performance and Battery Life will vary by ROM, but if we get enough responses the different ROMS wont make too big of a difference. THis is just a draft, feel free to message me with suggestions or info.
This is a group effort, i need testers for CM Snap and net's kernel, message me with your results!
https://spreadsheets0.google.com/ccc?key=tzhby6p54vqXnyxbE_e2APw&hl=en#gid=0
seems like a good idea, i really only care about performance and battery life. any point to putting kings kernel on there, he updates it daily lol
yeah, thats why i dont have a ton of things listed.
This is a good idea
Now that I bought an extended battery the only thing I care about is performance
I still need testers!
Sent from my HTC EVO 4G
testing bakedsnack #5 and kingxkernel today!
I think these comparison charts are a waste of time to be honest. The only way it would be effective would be if it was the same person doing all the testing, under the same conditions (ROM used, tries done per benchmark, specific time after reboot, etc.)
With kernels especially, the ROM you're using it with will play a major role in benchmark and stability yields. Not to mention the what apps you have running in the background.
While I was on CM7 I kept asking myself whether the time was right to switch to "stock" gingerbread in order to get rid of the few CM7 nasties (such as battery life, FM radio, lack of BLN support,...) without giving up too many of the goodies (performance, performance, performance). I hoped there was some insight into objective comparisons, i.e. people who had tested both and could give some "neutral" feedback. Well, I couldn't find it.
So I now find myself on samsung's gingerbread for the first time and these are my findings*:
Performance**:
CM7
The best I've tried so far. No doubt.
Number of installed apps does not affect performance.
JVR
Acceptable, but after getting used to CM7 there is noticeable lag (lapse between gesture and screen reaction) and hiccups when scrolling down menus. Tested with rfs and ext4 ("lagfix"). All in all, performance is noticeably worse than CM7.
Battery***:
CM7
Improves greatly with GB bootloaders [BL] (custom kernel has to support it) but it only affects standby drain (lowers to about 1~3 %/hr).
Usage drain is ridiculous (20~50 %/hr depending on type of use and connectivity).
Typical average battery life has been about 10~24hrs.
JVR
Standby drain is about the same as with CM7 & GB BL (about 1~3 %/hr).
Usage drain is about 10~30% (general feeling about half as draining).
Typical average battery life is being about 15~36hrs.
Android system process shoots CPU usage up to 99.9% while charging (reboot fixes this). Not sure if this is actually a bug.
Miscellaneous:
CM7
No BLN support (as of custom kernels on Aug 15th). No blinking led notification support.
No FM radio (as of #80)
Voodoo sound/color support is kernel dependent
Minor BT car system (A2DP) bugs. Not reproducible with BT dongle.
Horrible Wifi reception and timeouts with WPA2 + hidden SSID (might be custom kernels).
No TV-out support.
No 720p recording (?)
JVR
BLN support is kernel dependent
Voodoo sound/color support is kernel dependent
I might have overseen a bug or been inaccurate at some point. Please feel free to fill the voids or correct any imprecisions.
*I was on CM7 #80 with Zach's Neo kernel v16 r2 (GB BL!). Have also tried Glitch's.
I am now on JVR Simplicity v0.31 (Semaphore kernel 1.5).
**No OC/UV for the sake of fairness of this test (improves performance about 30~50%).
***Battery findings are merely subjective appreciations I have made on a daily usage basis. No scientific mA/h tests or benchmarks have been made. I apologize for that...
This thread should serve for everyone who has tried both ROMs to give their feedback and for those weighing to make the switch to ask questions and have more info.
Cheers!
Nice job on writing this up.
For me CM7 on the SGS is out of the question, because battery and BLN are two of my most importing things that I need daily.
I even went as far as getting the Samsung Armani Battery 1650Mah battery (same physical size as the stock battery) to give me the extra battery life I need.
As for CM7, I may throw that on my Atrix down the road. Some people that have used the beta of it say they think battery life is better than stock. Time will tell, but battery life is an absolute must on my phones which sadly rules CM7 out for me at least on the SGS...
Problems I have with CM7:
* Battery drain (obviously), but since #86 I usually get through the day without recharging.
* Random reboots
* sometimes suddenly loses reception (comes back after some time)
* broken 2g/3g-toggle (don't know if it's fixed yet, didn't dare to try)
Problems I have with stock-ROMs:
* often Launcher-redraws
* no USB-tethering on Linux
Problems I have with all GB ROMs:
* GPS-performance is bad. It's usable after applying hardware fix, but when comparing with Froyo ROMs (e.g. Darky 9.5), they always win.
You can get led notifications with Neo's kernel, v17r5 currently. No need for BLN app. :]
Otherwise, CM7 is just smoking the stock ROM, specially if many apps are installed. I can compare the phone to AOSP Desire experience, before I exchanged it for SGS a month ago.
Btw, Green battery saver app helps alot, it turns off wifi/mobile for specified intervals, so less drain when idle and you don't need to manually toggle it. Same **** as iPhone does.
I have messed both with CM7 #80 and JVR. Now I am back to stock JVR because CM7:
- does not support 720p recording
- I had a lot of issues with calling, the other person couldn't hear me. This seems to happen randomly to many users and makes it for me unusable.
There's HD recording @ 30fps on 2 recent nightlies I tried.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using Tapatalk
I was wondering, in CM7 does flash performance is still as low as in stock roms ? Most of the video websites I visit work awfull on JVR.
alinescoo said:
I was wondering, in CM7 does flash performance is still as low as in stock roms ? Most of the video websites I visit work awfull on JVR.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In my experience there is a great improvement in flash performance in cm7 (and decline in samsung's gb). Especially in flash video playback. Beware though not to expect anything similar to computer-like performance in this field.
You want a fast, smooth UI and not expect a drawback in battery use? There has got to be a sacrificial lamb in there. The fact that idle drain is already comparable with stock roms means there is no more "battery drain" issue in CM7.
I left CM7 with fugumod kernel overnight, I lost 2% battery in 9 hours.
I left Simplicity overnight. I lost 10% in 9 hours.
Just my findings off of one test
Nice Job
Thank you for your interesting info
filiptc said:
In my experience there is a great improvement in flash performance in cm7 (and decline in samsung's gb). Especially in flash video playback. Beware though not to expect anything similar to computer-like performance in this field.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
alinescoo said:
I was wondering, in CM7 does flash performance is still as low as in stock roms ? Most of the video websites I visit work awfull on JVR.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
for me, flash is crazy good since jvq and flash update. 720p fluid in the browser. silky smooth scrolling, gpu helps a lot.
Quite accurate but:
-wifi for me is horrible on stock and cm7...compared the galaxy s my old iphone 3gs was much better.
-battery when phone is on use is same on cm7 and stock... 'till you use data connection. When using 2g/3g on cm7, battery goes down like a hell.
This because samsung driver are closed source i suppose.
Imho Gingebread is not a great update respect froyo.
Just switched back to stock rom from cm7 nightly. I really liked cm's features but after a while the battery drain was too much.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
I was just about to post a thread like this! The last samsung rom i tried, jvq, was for lack of a better word, **** compared to CM7. I wondered if JVR was better but its probably not much better than jvq. For me, i think i can live with the 'drawbacks' of CM7 as it just makes the phone as good as it should be - fast as hell.
Interestingly enough, as you can see from my sig im posting from a galaxy tab. The stock sammy firmware on this is much better on this than most stock sgs roms.
Sent from my GT-P1000 using XDA App
Necrolust said:
I was just about to post a thread like this! The last samsung rom i tried, jvq, was for lack of a better word, **** compared to CM7. I wondered if JVR was better but its probably not much better than jvq. For me, i think i can live with the 'drawbacks' of CM7 as it just makes the phone as good as it should be - fast as hell.
Interestingly enough, as you can see from my sig im posting from a galaxy tab. The stock sammy firmware on this is much better on this than most stock sgs roms.
Sent from my GT-P1000 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have to say that I was the same (and I still like to switch roms) but JVR is like from a different dev team at Samsung. I am talking about stock JVR. Give it a try and you will see that it is the perfect stock rom.
My issue with CM7 are the colours. Both on stock and Voodoo. There is something about it that I can't get right even after following a few guides here.
Having said that, CM7 is a very good, features rich, fast rom. I don't think any stock rom would get to that speed due to the filesystem difference.
K.
It's interesting that nobody mentions the problem during calls. Is this an isolated problem, happening to only a few of us ?
I am very very impatient when it comes to responsiveness so I'm on CM7 for a while. Hoever, most likely, I will go back to stock because of:
-problems during calls (other person can't hear me - hold-unhold call sometimes fixes this, sometimes not)
- headset controlls not working (can't answer calls, can't control music); very annoying, this was introduced when a fix for FM radio was tried. FM radio still does not work but it managed to screw up the headset controls
- no 720p recording - well, you CAN record but the frames skip a lot and audio is not synced
- when using 3g/h battery goes down REALLY fast and phone heats up a LOT
- last but not least devs are concentrating on SGS2, so any fixes will probably take a long while to be implemented (if there's gonna be any fixes); the development has slowed a lot (still, my thank to the devs for their hard work)
The grass is always greener on the other side, is it? I love CM for its pure android experience, its speed and the control. But yes, there are bugs and that's to be expected if you have to work with closed source blob's and pretty weird hardware (search for atinm's post in the CM7 thread). I'm willing to live with the remaining bugs because the advantages of CM7 are just to big. But my next phone is going to be a Nexus one for sure. That's the only way I'm guaranteed a real android phone without any of the OEM crap.
Jvr odexed with a few fixes is best for me. Camera, colours, no radio and battery drain just not good enough on cm7 for my needs.
Stock Samsung jvr is better than my cm7 2.2.4 nexus one.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
Hey guys,
First off, I don't post much on here, but have been doing alot of reading to stay "up-to-date". Yesterday, I just got the Nexus S 4G through Sprint cuz my Epic 4G took a crap and they were backordered so I said sure to the Nexus S.
I spent most the day yesterday looking for ROMs for it and found out about ICS and got all excited for that. So, after looking around I decided on Crossbones 0.1.3 ICS. Overall, I'm liking it but after using it for about a day now, I am noticing the battery life (in comparison to my Epic, which ran the current Legendary ROM with the Samurai Kernel) is HORRIBLE. I don't want to be quick to say it's the phone, ROM, or ICS though. Maybe there's a different way of closing out unused apps that I don't know about? I did just find that you can swipe away unused recent apps. Will that help?
Basically, for a ROM, I look for stability, battery life, speed, and looks. In that order. In GB, I always used Launcher Pro, btw.
So, my question is for those that use or used Crossbones, what are your experiences so far? Also, if it's recommended that I go back to GB for awhile until things get a lil better on ICS (I heard its coming OTA soon), which ROM are people liking? With ICS out now, searching for a good GB ROM has become a lil difficult. So far I read about MUIU (or whatever it is) and CM7, which my gf has on her Dinc2 and her Nook Color. I'm kinda "eh" about CM7. It "just works" imo and I think that's what they are going for. Def not a fan of the looks though. I also miss my power options in my notification pull down too.
PS-
That and I can't get Facebook to add to my account sync. When I go to add it, it does it, goes back to the accounts screen, but its not there. Very strange. Ok, gonna shut up now. this is long enough. lol Thanks in advance.
I've had my Nexus S for a couple of weeks now, I put the stock ICS ROM on the first day and during this time my battery has significantly improved. There are probably three reasons for this, but perhaps not all will apply to you?
1) I've stopped turning everything on, all of the time and constantly tweaking / fiddling / admiring the AMOLED.
2) I've refined how the device uses battery (logged out of Google+).
3) The battery has matured a little.
There's another side effect...
4) I've stopped worrying about the battery so much as I get a day of use from it.
Ice Cream Sandwich and ROMs using it are gonna improve in time. Gingerbread has been out for a year or so and has all this development. So from this there's a lot of potential from ICS...
I'm going to keep my device running the standard ROM for the time being as it's my daily driver, but wanting a device to potentially brick and hack. Thinking about the Galaxy S.
davidsteele1975 said:
I've had my Nexus S for a couple of weeks now, I put the stock ICS ROM on the first day and during this time my battery has significantly improved. There are probably three reasons for this, but perhaps not all will apply to you?
1) I've stopped turning everything on, all of the time and constantly tweaking / fiddling / admiring the AMOLED.
2) I've refined how the device uses battery (logged out of Google+).
3) The battery has matured a little.
There's another side effect...
4) I've stopped worrying about the battery so much as I get a day of use from it.
Ice Cream Sandwich and ROMs using it are gonna improve in time. Gingerbread has been out for a year or so and has all this development. So from this there's a lot of potential from ICS...
I'm going to keep my device running the standard ROM for the time being as it's my daily driver, but wanting a device to potentially brick and hack. Thinking about the Galaxy S.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the reply. So far in terms of battery saving tricks, I've disabled animations, the screen is set to about 1/4 brightness, only thing that constantly does anything is k9
mail to check my inbox every 15 mins (that I'm aware of lol). So it could be that my battery needs to "mature"? Btw, are there any good themes out yet? I miss my transparent text msg threads and I really miss my power controls on the notification pull down. I'm def not digging the white on the contacts and SMS screens. Lol
::BUMP:: Seriously? No one else?
Well is was getting bad battery and weird force closes on cross bones, i'm on vhgomex(thinks that's right), it's been a lot better for me and it has the notification power widget in it
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk
BrianDigital said:
Well is was getting bad battery and weird force closes on cross bones, i'm on vhgomex(thinks that's right), it's been a lot better for me and it has the notification power widget in it
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I havent had any issues with the rom running or any FCs... Took a look at gomez. Gonna do a nandroid and give it try. Looks promising, and FB sync is supposed to work. lol
infamshxr said:
::BUMP:: Seriously? No one else?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you're not getting many answers because your issues have already been addressed. A simple search will find many (most) ROMs with notification toggles and Facebook sync. I personally recommend AOKP.
I'd say it's just the rom. I'm on an ICS rom, everything works great and I have significantly better battery life than before.
I'm on AndroidME with Eugene's speedy-3 kernel. I don't have Facebook sync and power toggles in notification though, but I don't really care for those two features anyway.
Well I'm on Gomez now. Things already seem to be better. Absolutely no issues so far. I'll know for sure in a day or so.
Well I uninstall bloat.sys apps I don't use with root uninstaller
As for Bette battery life. Honestly think. What could someone do to the phone to put out better battery life. Almost nothing but SBC kernels and the CPU speed and goveners. That's it.
Most of you guys don't have battery issues you just play with your phone all day instead of doing your work.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA App. Developer of brickROM, and OP of XDA Thread of The Year 2011.
Shark_On_Land said:
Well I uninstall bloat.sys apps I don't use with root uninstaller
As for Bette battery life. Honestly think. What could someone do to the phone to put out better battery life. Almost nothing but SBC kernels and the CPU speed and goveners. That's it.
Most of you guys don't have battery issues you just play with your phone all day instead of doing your work.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA App. Developer of brickROM, and OP of XDA Thread of The Year 2011.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A: that was fairly rude. I'm legitimately asking for help and advice. I didn't make the thread to be judged or ridiculed on my phone usage. I don't judge others on how they use they're phone, so why should I be?
B: I'm comparing this all with my epic. I don't over clock or mess with the CPU settings cuz that's beyond my knowledge atm. Like I said, battery seems MUCH better now with this rom . Now my only gripe is volume. Way quieter on this phone which seems to be a known issue. Trying out volume+ soon. Also, at the end of my day, I'll post my battery stats and see what you guys think. But like I said, I think its OK now.
Im on bigxie's rom and icup kernel im getting great battery life with this but thats just me.i dont know whats great for you.try this rom its somewhat minimalist or pure stock with just statusbar widgets and other features.no 'omg' tweaks that cause more harm than good.and it has trebuchet which is perfectly put into the mix.im satisfied with this .been with this rom since build 1 and ive been happy with its consistency.no bugs encountered
Sent from a Nexus S
dark06 said:
Im on bigxie's rom and icup kernel im getting great battery life with this but thats just me.i dont know whats great for you.try this rom its somewhat minimalist or pure stock with just statusbar widgets and other features.no 'omg' tweaks that cause more harm than good.and it has trebuchet which is perfectly put into the mix.im satisfied with this .been with this rom since build 1 and ive been happy with its consistency.no bugs encountered
Sent from a Nexus S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the opinion. I'll keep that one in mind if this doesn't work out. Sounds a lot like Gomez. Gomez has basically just what you listed. I'd def take stability over extra crap. Lol
Sry for the double post,but to report back, totally forgot to post my battery stats, but they were definitely better. By far. Still not much luck on the sound tho. Got an app the boosts my media volume but my ringer wasn't affected, which sucks. Anything on this that I haven't possibly found?
I'm going back to CM7. 7.2 is out and honesty its just more optimized for this device. CM optimizes their ROMs to very fast high standards and do stuff a lot of you newbies can't even think of. (Yes, these will be implemented in BESTROM.)
So I'm going back. To smoothness.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA App. Developer of brickROM, and OP of XDA Thread of The Year 2011.
Shark_On_Land said:
I'm going back to CM7. 7.2 is out and honesty its just more optimized for this device. CM optimizes their ROMs to very fast high standards and do stuff a lot of you newbies can't even think of. (Yes, these will be implemented in BESTROM.)
So I'm going back. To smoothness.
Sent from my Nexus S 4G using XDA App. Developer of brickROM, and OP of XDA Thread of The Year 2011.
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You really shouldn't be so rude and demean other members of this forum like that. Frankly, no one cares if you're going back to CM7 or not. But thank you for your belittling feedback.
To the original poster, I'm running Pete Alfonso's nightlies along with Mathkid's Matrix CFS kernel. With a bit of overclock and tweaking of the kernel settings, I get great smoothness, stability, and decent battery life. To me, any battery life that gets me from "up in the morning" to "home at night" is fine, because I have my charger at my desk. But typically, I can survive a full 24 hours on one charge.
Who knows, though. Maybe I'm just too much of a newbie to realize the full potential of what my device can do and therefore it's my fault that the battery life is as good as it is.
Hey! I've just recently switched to my Galaxy Nexus, but was a Crespo owner since it came out. Been reading your post but I would agree that you should try out the AOKP rom along with a custom undervolted kernel for longer battery life.
I haven't really tinkered with my Nexus S in awhile (I gave it to my gf when I got the Galaxy Nexus) but the last thing I remembered was either installing aokp or cm9. In due time the custom ics roms will improve and the power widgets in the notification bar will be brought back, but they usually want to focus on stability then add new features little by little. Hope you are having fun your Crespo!
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium
So far I'm still rocking gomez's. Really loving the battery life. Only issue I've had is 3g doesn't always come back after using wifi. Not a big deal tho I guess. Really stable too. I was thinking of using mathkidskernel but don't wanna possibly screw up what I got now. I'm backed up so maybe one of these days. Heard alotof good things about mathkids kernel. Heard good things about aopk too, so that's my other go to. Lol
kto_matchu said:
You really shouldn't be so rude and demean other members of this forum like that. Frankly, no one cares if you're going back to CM7 or not. But thank you for your belittling feedback.
To the original poster, I'm running Pete Alfonso's nightlies along with Mathkid's Matrix CFS kernel. With a bit of overclock and tweaking of the kernel settings, I get great smoothness, stability, and decent battery life. To me, any battery life that gets me from "up in the morning" to "home at night" is fine, because I have my charger at my desk. But typically, I can survive a full 24 hours on one charge.
Who knows, though. Maybe I'm just too much of a newbie to realize the full potential of what my device can do and therefore it's my fault that the battery life is as good as it is.
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sorry if that was rude but you have to take in count that
I myself is using modified CM7.1RC0AOSP2.3.7GB as base. But far as CM9AOSP4.0.3ICS goes its still not ready for folks like me for DD yet.
As I described below how extensively its optimized and most of it is outside the scope of current XDA.
What you have to understand is performance is not measured via synthetic benchmarks (ex: Quadrant). The biggest issue with people is that they don't know enough to know that they don't know, so they compare it with silly numbers (ex: score) they can't comprehend what they see, much less put numbers behind real life activities that's not applicable in controlled environment.
OS development which eliminates most of it but on software level custom base rom (ex: CyanogenMod) is highly optimized and tweaked to run on optimal performance. Mostly, but not all. But does it mean it can't be tweaked any further? (Rhetorical) No. How do I know? We (scope outside of XDA) tweaked it to the next level. How you ask?
1) Optimized ext4fs: reduced r/w rate (healthy NAND lifespan), improved journaling (corrupted data writeback integrity) = Which improves the IOPs and performance access rate.
2) HC3.x fugu binaries, patched sqlite libraries, mSD read ahead buffer fix.
3) Modified VM: OOM (Out Of Memory), LMK (Low Memory Killer), VM heap (Virtual Machine), DRA (Dirty Ratio), DBR (Dirty Background Ratio), DWC (Dirty Writeback Centisecs), DEC (Dirty Expired Centisecs), SWP (Swap), VCP (VFS Cache Pressure).
4) Increased minfree value: Background, Foreground, Empty, Hidden, Visible, Secondary, Content.
5) Optimized cache: File and Drop cache, Forced cache (resident loop).
6) Custom kernel: OC/UC, UV/SVS/VDD, BFS/CFS, RSU/NP/VR/SP supported.
7) Custom ROM: Optimized Rom script and props (ex: CyanogenMod).
this as its tweaked to THE next level. I'll stick with AOSP2.3.7GB until ICS4.X is more stable and we understand more as most memory grouping and adjustments might be changed.
I bet most of you only do 2 of those thing (6&7)
i suggest you try androiduser aosp rom with icup kernel. you dont have to do anything else and with normal usage you'll get 24+ hours
I have yet to find any decent threads anywhere regarding the best settings for the Nexus 7 so I thought I would start and hopefully learn some info from other users and provide a good resource thread for others.
I have not overclocked and haven't added any cutom tweaks to governors and schedulers yet so my experience so far has been with the default kernel options. Since hardware is different and kernel/rom experiences will vary I will just start with Scheduler, Governor, and other general tweaks.
Scheduler:
i have so far had the best experiences with SIO, and NOOP
Governor:
So far the best balance between performance and battery life has been with Pegasusq and Interactive
ADJ and LMK:
I don't use any scripts like Supercharger I like to do everything manually, here are the values I have found that offer the smoothest user experience:
ADJ:
0,1,3,6,9,15
1536,9216,25600,51200,76800,102400 - (Wife's for general use and multi-tasking)
ADJ:
0,1,4,7,10,15
5120,15360,61440,81920,102400,122880 - (Mine for gaming and high performance)
I have boat-loads of tweaks that I have used for roms I have built for other devices, but hesitant to use them with the Nexus 7 due to the fact that I don't want to cause any negative effects. I have added generic linux tweaks (ext4, database defrag, kernel tweaks) but the Adreno and Powervr tweaks obviously are null and void for this. As I discover more I will definitely share.
I have had issues getting custom LMK values loaded on some kernels, but franco and anything based off Motley has worked just fine. I know there is a bug with LMK on some source versions and assume it is related to that, but if anyone has found a workaround i would be very interested as I would love to give the other kernels a shot.
I am intrigued about lulzactive but the parameters need to be tweaked as the default settings provide horrible battery life. I am interested to know what other people have been using and any info you want to provide is welcome and greatly appreciated!
The problem with such threads and people sharing all this info is everyone uses something different, meaning what tweaks and settings you use for your given device are dependent also on the ROM and the kernel you're using so...
You can see how that basically ends up being a thread full of info where people just end up saying "oh yeah, well my <whatever device> can get <however many hours> of battery life..." and so on.
It's a good idea I suppose but it only ends up providing benefits to those people that a) end up using the same hardware and b) end up using the same ROMs and c) end up using the same kernels too. And yes I know this is the Nexus 7 so that covers the device aspect right there...
Suffice to say this: none of the tweaks or info you provided in your post are relevant to me at all with my Nexus 7 as the kernel I use (M-Kernel a37) doesn't support the kinds of governors that are considered the more esoteric ones (it has interactive, ondemand, touchdemand, and performance) nor the same class of schedulers (it has noop, deadline, row, and bfq). Would be nice but, I look at it this way:
Both the Paranoid Android developers (any and all of them) as well as Metallice who's responsible for M-Kernel, have done a metric frak-ton of work before I even got a Nexus 7 with testing, builds, more testing, more builds, testing, more testing, even more testing, and they continue to develop and test even to this moment and my Nexus 7 runs fabulously, I honestly can't ask for more considering the performance (even with the default of 2 cores enabled with my choice of kernel) and battery life (which is damned amazing as well).
But who knows, maybe something useful will show up... I've just gotten to a point where "It just works" and that's good enough for me. Tweaking is just boring nowadays, but that's just my opinion.
<all this is coming from a guy that's been tweaking computers and consumer electronics of all kinds, shapes, and sizes for several decades now, and yes I can honestly say "I've pretty much seen it all...">
br0adband said:
You can see how that basically ends up being a thread full of info where people just end up saying "oh yeah, well my <whatever device> can get <however many hours> of battery life..." and so on.
It's a good idea I suppose but it only ends up providing benefits to those people that a) end up using the same hardware and b) end up using the same ROMs and c) end up using the same kernels too. And yes I know this is the Nexus 7 so that covers the device aspect right there...
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Given that this is the Nexus 7 forum, <whatever device> = <Nexus 7>
richardorvince said:
Given that this is the Nexus 7 forum, <whatever device> = <Nexus 7>
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I covered that in the last sentence you just quoted.
I know I only have 9 posts here and that makes me a "noob" in the eyes of most people here, but I am by no means a noob in general, just a noob when it comes to tegra. I have boosted performance and battery life (up to 50%) on other devices and don't see any reason why it can't be done on this one.
I already touched on the fact that opinions are just that, experiences may vary, but when it comes to governors there is a discernable difference when it comes to battery life and performance and that is what I am inquiring about. There are also tunables which can change a governor from completely horrible to exceptional. THis is why I am inquiring. Don't bother yourself with this thread if it is of no use to you.
If you'd take the time - if you haven't already - to read with comprehension the threads for kernels like franco.Kernel and M-Kernel you'd see a massive if not overwhelming amount of information that you're actually looking for that's already been done. Those two kernels - and probably most of the other popular ones - have extensive levels of research and testing already done on them and in their most currently available forms they are the epitome of kernel development on the Nexus 7, and I stand by that statement even in spite of me not being a developer myself. I have read thousands upon thousands of posts and done my own little amounts of experimentation just to prove to myself that yes, those two kernels (and probably others) provide exactly what their respective developers have worked so hard to provide:
Exceptional performance overall coupled with exceptional battery life as well. Yes you can do your own tuning for your own particular needs and wants and even your own requirements as needed which is pretty much what you're apparently hoping to discover from other people and their own experiences.
I'm not saying this thread is a bad idea, I'm saying it's been done before: hundreds if not thousands of times in the very threads that exist for each of the respective kernels (and ROMs by association). The kernel threads have extreme amounts of info on basic tunables, governors, schedulers, pretty much every last thing you or anyone else could ever do to squeeze out the best they offer and the the developers implement that stuff into the defaults of their kernels based on the results of testing and reports from users implementing them.
The info is out there, you just have to go find it - and yes I note that you said you'd never found any decent threads about the Nexus 7 which is precisely what prompted my first reply: the info is already out there in the kernel and ROM threads.
There can't be a "best of" type thread like this because there's just so many different variations of kernels, ROMs, etc even if the device is the same amongst all the people.
Also, one aspect that most people don't realize: there are different revisions of the Nexus 7 hardware and they tend to perform differently. I, for example, have an original (and I mean first production run) Nexus 7 8GB model that has totally different performance characteristics than the later revisions of the same 8GB model, and then the 16GB and 32GB models are even different on another level because they use faster Flash-RAM onboard than the 8GB models ever did.
So again, it's a great idea and I figured if nobody else ever created one I'd do it myself, but in the long run every device is going to perform differently. Even if you had two Nexus 7s that came off the production line one right after the other and you tested them with the exact same ROMs, kernels, and tweaks, you'd get different results from each one. I'm not being facetious when I say that, I'm being totally absolutely dead serious.
Also, there is no really good overall benchmark for Android, probably never will be. You have to use different ones geared towards specific purposes to get any useful data, like AndroBench which tests the storage specifically and Vellamo which can test the HTML/surfing performance specifically. Antutu is probably the best actually useful overall system benchmark but unfortunately more people use Quadrant which is a shame because that one is so useless the results can vary rather dramatically even if you run it several times in a row.
Believe me, I've been tweaking for decades, so there's nothing I can say or do that'll stop anyone from doing it - I know the bug of "Upgraditis" quite well and have suffered from it forever, right alongside the companion condition known as being a Tweakaholic...
br0adband said:
If you'd take the time - if you haven't already - to read with comprehension the threads for kernels like franco.Kernel and M-Kernel you'd see a massive if not overwhelming amount of information that you're actually looking for that's already been done. Those two kernels - and probably most of the other popular ones - have extensive levels of research and testing already done on them and in their most currently available forms they are the epitome of kernel development on the Nexus 7, and I stand by that statement even in spite of me not being a developer myself. I have read thousands upon thousands of posts and done my own little amounts of experimentation just to prove to myself that yes, those two kernels (and probably others) provide exactly what their respective developers have worked so hard to provide:
Exceptional performance overall coupled with exceptional battery life as well. Yes you can do your own tuning for your own particular needs and wants and even your own requirements as needed which is pretty much what you're apparently hoping to discover from other people and their own experiences.
I'm not saying this thread is a bad idea, I'm saying it's been done before: hundreds if not thousands of times in the very threads that exist for each of the respective kernels (and ROMs by association). The kernel threads have extreme amounts of info on basic tunables, governors, schedulers, pretty much every last thing you or anyone else could ever do to squeeze out the best they offer and the the developers implement that stuff into the defaults of their kernels based on the results of testing and reports from users implementing them.
The info is out there, you just have to go find it - and yes I note that you said you'd never found any decent threads about the Nexus 7 which is precisely what prompted my first reply: the info is already out there in the kernel and ROM threads.
There can't be a "best of" type thread like this because there's just so many different variations of kernels, ROMs, etc even if the device is the same amongst all the people.
Also, one aspect that most people don't realize: there are different revisions of the Nexus 7 hardware and they tend to perform differently. I, for example, have an original (and I mean first production run) Nexus 7 8GB model that has totally different performance characteristics than the later revisions of the same 8GB model, and then the 16GB and 32GB models are even different on another level because they use faster Flash-RAM onboard than the 8GB models ever did.
So again, it's a great idea and I figured if nobody else ever created one I'd do it myself, but in the long run every device is going to perform differently. Even if you had two Nexus 7s that came off the production line one right after the other and you tested them with the exact same ROMs, kernels, and tweaks, you'd get different results from each one. I'm not being facetious when I say that, I'm being totally absolutely dead serious.
Also, there is no really good overall benchmark for Android, probably never will be. You have to use different ones geared towards specific purposes to get any useful data, like AndroBench which tests the storage specifically and Vellamo which can test the HTML/surfing performance specifically. Antutu is probably the best actually useful overall system benchmark but unfortunately more people use Quadrant which is a shame because that one is so useless the results can vary rather dramatically even if you run it several times in a row.
Believe me, I've been tweaking for decades, so there's nothing I can say or do that'll stop anyone from doing it - I know the bug of "Upgraditis" quite well and have suffered from it forever, right alongside the companion condition known as being a Tweakaholic...
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Blah Blah Blah
I mean seriously dude, that is a lot of words for saying absolutely nothing.
I am a developer on other devices, and I will be releasing roms for this one as well. I was looking for personal experience, not an opinion from someone who has absolutely nothing to add. I have been a member of this site for over six months, and I am just now hitting the "10 post requirement" to post in the developer forums. Why?? Because I am not out to make a name for myself on this website, I already have a reputation - a good one - on others, places where post counts and titles mean nothing unless you have actually developed something.
I work and have a family so I don't have tons of time to test out schedulers and governors so I was looking for some info from others and gave some of my own in return. I am not a tweakaholic, but you will thank me when I release an optimized ROM with extended battery life and a fluid and smooth user experience.
This site is great in a lot of ways, but I have noticed there are a lot of egotistical holier than thou people on the forums who like nothing better than to put other people down and be (for lack of a better word) ***holes. If your hobby is to crap on other peoples threads then it is time for a life change, get out and find a girl-friend, or friends in general.
You're a ROM developer and a member at the biggest most popular site on the entire Internet for ROM development for mobile devices and it took you six months to get to 10 posts? Guess I'm missing something but whatever, you go right on going on, son, I'll keep an eye out for your progress.
As for thanking you for ROMs, no, that won't happen since you're too far behind the curve now and anything you come up with will basically be copied work that others before you have long since created and improved upon (even if you don't realize it). If you're that busy with 'real life' and whatever - which always seems to be the reason, go figure - then perhaps you don't have the time to focus on such tasks in the first place. Priorities, man, priorities.
Ad hominem sure seems to be the norm for people online these days, wonder why.
Fact - 95% of the battery tweaks are placebo at best.
The remaining come from kernel developers who have a firm grasp on undervolting and can actually get a little longer battery life out of your device.
The best blanket solution to increasing your battery.. Turn off Location Access and Google Now.
Yes my job and family are my priority. As they should be. Also my point was I am not trying to boosty my post count to show how "cool" I am, I could care less. As it should be.
And no battery tweaks are not placebo, unless you are using placebo battery tweaks of course. There are Build.prop, init.d and sysctl.conf tweaks that can boost battery life 20-30% easy, and it can be proven. No placebo. If you choose to believe that then I have no problem with it.
I thank both of you for littering this thread with crap. I will not bother with this one I have much better things going on other forums. I truly wish I knew as much as you guys, It must suck to know everything because life must be truly boring for you.
Hello, I know the choice is personal and regarding my own needs in terms of performance, battery etc. , but i'd like to know which kernel you are using, why etc.
I am not very good at seeing performance difference between 2 kernels and your feedback is often great to hear
Which one for you is the most user friendly with features like color calibration, vibration strength (things with GUI you know i don't care about scheduler or whatever)
I think imma settle down on No Limits OOS Rom, which offers a large choice of kernels...
Thank you in advance :')
You will never ever get a proper answer for this question Every kernel has its own characteristics and features, so try yourself and determine which one fits best for you
Going to have to go with the fact that this thread has been made countless times and you never get a definite answer. If you want a truthful opinion, stick with stock. It was designed for your device specifically. Especially in the case of OnePlus devices, they devise the kernel to fit with Oxygen OS. I stick with stock kernel and stock rom because the roms out there are bogus. Theres usually something the dev has done to their rom to disrupt continuity and stabilization especially with google apps and services. Always trying to "debloat" the phone is not a good idea. Letting the phone run its course is a much better way to go because it will adjust to what you actually use. Changing your kernel doesn't do very much for you. In my experience it is always worse. I havent changed the way i use a smartphone since the day i bought one and every kernel ive ever been on has never POSITIVELY affected: 1. Performance 2. Stability 3. Battery life 4. Speed of service 5. internet speed 6. Screen on time 7. Longevity
The claims that they do something for those things is typically a red flag for me. Every time i used franco kernel for example, my internet would cut out a lot and on some occasions YouTube would work for a few videos then not at all until i restarted my phone. On stock kernel, my phone never has these malfunctions but no matter which release on the 3t and the 5 now with his kernel my google stuff would constantly break down or my internet would die until i restarted or i would be permanently stuck on H+ until reboot. Just something annoying like that. And no i did not install this wrong or anything. Its not like you really can with how TWRP works. If the phone turns on then whatever goes wrong is on that rom and that kernel and theyre very unstable beasts.
TL;DR
Always stick with stock. It is built for YOUR device specifically. Don't debloat, disable. Stock kernel is always superior and in the case of OnePlus you have additional doze options in its built in settings. Don't run doze apps either btw. Let your system manage itself you'll find it does a damn fine job.
This question takes a little research to answer, some reading specifically. By seeing the features and commits present in each kernel offered, you'll be able to see where the focus of the dev is. All devs have different things in mind, some will lean towards extending battery longevity, whereas others will prefer a smooth UI and gaming performance, because after all, the processor in this phone can deliver good stuff for all these different leanings.
Anyway, go read a little, see through the devs lens and take your best pick.
My final and subjective opinion? Lightning kernel, blu spark, flash, elementalX, Franco...in no respective order.
I also have a lot of respect for the guys in RenderZenith. Building EAS from nothing is no short of a benchmark, and that kernel is really good as well.
Or as the gentleman above, stay in stock, it was built from scratch by the manufacturer for this device only and no other.