Database Users

Gyroscope?

Do you think we can get Gyroscope on software firmware or its hardware limitations again?
Its cool and helpful

no way... it's hardware matter

The most amusing bit really is that accelerometers do the same thing as a gyroscope. Unless you happen to be in space or pull heavy G's as part of your daily life. For the purposes of figuring out a device's orientation accelerometers do the job just fine.
Apple have a nasty habit of adding old features and hailing them as revolution just because they make them sexy. "Look here, you can do videochat...it's a revolution!" Problem is that it's not over the phone like people have been doing for years but only over Wifi, and you can forget chatting to people with devices other than the iPhone. So they've taken a feature people have been using for years, cripple it and then sell it as the second coming. Brilliant marketing.

Or I'm wrong? I saw something on a phone can't remember. that the phone can see Shops/Restaurant using its camera somewhat like a scanner or and the display shown looks like Matrix something really cool and help.

gr3yh0und said:
Or I'm wrong? I saw something on a phone can't remember. that the phone can see Shops/Restaurant using its camera somewhat like a scanner or and the display shown looks like Matrix something really cool and help.
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Perhaps you're thinking of Layar? Does what you ask for, doesn't need a gyroscope and works surprisingly well.

Can we get that?

gr3yh0und said:
Can we get that?
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Sure, it's been in the Android market for a long time. Just do a search.

The OP simply asked a question, which I believe the posts that I left standing pretty much answer it. There was no need for flaming.
@iead1
Consider yourself warned.

may be we could use g sensor with the compass to make thing like gyroscope

I think there are aspects of the Apple Gyroscope that will be revolutionary. For starters it will now be used to assist in pin pointing your current location with much greater accuracy. In addition, because it is Apple there will be some functionalities of new games that will only be possible using pitch and yawl. I am not saying that it wasn't possible before, but because it is Apple and their market machine has plastered this feature all over everything, I believe there will now be games and apps created by third parties to take advantage of it. Where as before it was too low key for anyone to take seriously. In the end it is the consumer who will still benefit.
As for facetime. I live in France and first used video chat about two years ago. It's a great feature, but cost way too much to use day to day.
The Iphone 4G might actually be on to something. Take the telephone company out of the equation. Ok, I understand this limitation was created more out of necessity than anything else. But there are several great products that came about out of some limitation or another. And, wouldn't it be great to move towards eliminating phone companies once and for all? This might prove to be a reason service providers switch to a flat fee for world wide service. Who knows what benefits could come out of this beyond the free video chat.
There are boat loads of people that will benefit from the fact that this is free to use. Ok, you won't use it in it's current state for every phone call. But if you are a family that is separated by circumstances you will certainly find time to use it when ever possible; maybe even every day. And, with the number of hot spots exploding, it will be easier than the detractors would have us believe. Oh, and did I mention it will be free to use! In addition, there will be plenty of third party apps created to offer services for this feature that we haven't even considered yet.
And, let's not ignore the absolute fact that once this product is out, it will be the best built device in the market.
Plus, the image is suppose to be mind blowing. And, the pictures and HD video at 5.0 are suppose to be much superior to the 8 mega we currently have in our X10's. Hey that sounds good to me.
I will surely be following the device. I will give it a month or two just to see what the feedback is. And, if it is half as good as it looks right now I will buy one for me and my lady.
Don't get my feedback wrong. I am no fanboy. In fact I have never owned an apple anything! But, it sure does look like I will be buying this device,,, times 2!

Steve Jobs' comments about Android

Just saw this on 9to5mac...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=hUQVIqjkzD4
And while I don't agree with everything he has to say, I agree with some of his points - it's close to the same argument of windows vs. os x. I love my Evo, Android and Sense, but $58 bucks a month for tons more services with Sprint is a big factor in that love.

He had valid points, lol, yeah android still needs to get all thee phones pushing the same software, but its still ever changing , but when it happens, they will trump iphone
Sent from my netarchy_toast, froyo beast of a machine evo!

I could care less what Steve B-jobs has to say.

So what he's saying is people are sheep. Everybody wants to have the exact same tool and nobody wants something different or the ability to create something different. It's not a good business move to let users have a brain.
Got it.

I'm very happy with my fragmented OS, besides i use roms from DEV's on this site, mainly due to they actually listen to what's going on with the rom's they develop and they figure out a fix for it asap, try seeing how long it takes for a Corp. DEV such as HTC or Google to listen to you and fix your issue. I'd much rather have my custom rom that Just Works versus having the exact same OS as "x" numbers who all have the same OS and still can't change their own battery without mailing their device in or without having to go to a corporate store.
Steve your still a Joke.

DirtyShroomz said:
So what he's saying is people are sheep.
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People sheeps..look at trends. Wait, trends are sheep people.
Everybody wants to have the exact same tool and nobody wants something different or the ability to create something different. It's not a good business move to let users have a brain.
Got it.
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This is what business is about. You want users to be able to repeat your advertisements, or chants. Why do you think they create slogans? Off the top of your head i bet you can say the McDonalds slogan. Now Walmart. What the point is, is that you want the people to be able to follow your products. It is about business.

tomh1979 said:
I'm very happy with my fragmented OS, besides i use roms from DEV's on this site, mainly due to they actually listen to what's going on with the rom's they develop and they figure out a fix for it asap, try seeing how long it takes for a Corp. DEV such as HTC or Google to listen to you and fix your issue. I'd much rather have my custom rom that Just Works versus having the exact same OS as "x" numbers who all have the same OS and still can't change their own battery without mailing their device in or without having to go to a corporate store.
Steve your still a Joke.
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It's funny because I love Macs. I have an iMac, iPad, iPod nano and my wife has an iPod Touch. I've had every iPhone except for the iPhone 4. I love most Apple products. But switched to android when the Nexus One came back and haven't considered switching back to the iPhone since.
Android is a much more robust OS. You can do pretty much anything you want to do. And the average consumer doesn't know or care about fragmentation. They see it as, 'hey, I want a smaller phone (Incredible) or I want a larger screen (EVO, X).' And even then, all those devices have 2.2 on it so there is no fragmentation. Steve Jobs needs to get more informed. He's likely never even used Android and is just spewing irrelevant and incorrect statements.

TwitterDeck.
http://goo.gl/ze3O

Id rather not have all Android Devices pushing the same exact thing (ex: interface). I like how it is, because dev wise, it brings a lot more excitement. Every time I go from cyanogenmod to Sense, it feels as if I just got a new phone, I like having that feeling.

dwd3885 said:
He's likely never even used Android and is just spewing irrelevant and incorrect statements.
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He probably uses one every day.

DirtyShroomz said:
So what he's saying is people are sheep.
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Click to collapse
Kind of like the people who buy Android tee shirts pissing on a Apple logo? Brand loyalty (sheep as you call them) exists everywhere and it's not limited to Apple. We/I can point out a bunch of in denial Android/EVO fanboys on just this forum to prove it.
Fragmentation is a problem. It's not about having a wide variety of phones (because that's a good thing); it's about the variety causing troubles for developers, even Google them selves. If I get a new current iPhone, it's pretty much guaranteed that it'll run iOS smoothly and as intended for about two years. It's the same deal with third party apps. On Android though, you can buy a new current phone that 1) doesn't run the latest version of Android and may never will, 2) doesn't run Android smoothly because it can't possibly be optimized for all hardware, 3) third party developers have a hard to make their apps compatible with the vast variety of hardware and versions of Android that are still in use.
You can go on the Android Market right now, click on almost any app, look at it's reviews and see hundreds of comments screaming about the app not working on their phone. The everyday consumer is stupid, they have one bad experience with Android and it'll be less likely that their next phone will be Android. And that's bad for business and the point Steve Jobs was trying to make.

ms79723 said:
Id rather not have all Android Devices pushing the same exact thing (ex: interface). I like how it is, because dev wise, it brings a lot more excitement. Every time I go from cyanogenmod to Sense, it feels as if I just got a new phone, I like having that feeling.
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THIS!
stupid10char

I used to own iphone 3G, and 4. iPhone 4 is indeed a very solid phone with very solid build quality. The downside of owning it was you have to deal with ATT. Apps like orb, and slingmobile got even worst because of retina display and the crap data limitation.
I think both Evo and iPhone 4 have great ups and owns.
I love iphone 4 for it's solid build, and does what's it's supposed to do with no need for tweaking. Down side of it is ATT, and no wifi tether (I didn't jailbreak it yet since there was no need for it for my wife), and data cap on certain apps. Oh and I have not experience the death grip issue, and let's not forget loads of free games that are actually good.
My monthly fee for 450 min, unlimited data, no text(google voice=profit!), no mms = about 70/month after all fees and taxes (EDIT** This is ATER 15% corp discount-I think I used to pay close to 90 w/o the discount).
Upside of Evo is great screen size, Sprint with Asurion insurance, easy to root and enable wifi tethering, great slingmobile quality, and the monthly price. The downside of Evo is crappy build quality (on my second Evo due to glass coming off, and even brand new one's glass can be pushed down)
Monthly fee for SERO prem = I'm assuming it's going to be around 65-70 bucks after insurance/taxes which includes unlimited texts/MMS.

achllles said:
I used to own iphone 3G, and 4. iPhone 4 is indeed a very solid phone with very solid build quality. The downside of owning it was you have to deal with ATT. Apps like orb, and slingmobile got even worst because of retina display and the crap data limitation.
I think both Evo and iPhone 4 have great ups and owns.
I love iphone 4 for it's solid build, and does what's it's supposed to do with no need for tweaking. Down side of it is ATT, and no wifi tether (I didn't jailbreak it yet since there was no need for it for my wife), and data cap on certain apps. Oh and I have not experience the death grip issue, and let's not forget loads of free games that are actually good.
My monthly fee for 450 min, unlimited data, no text(google voice=profit!), no mms = about 70/month after all fees and taxes.
Upside of Evo is great screen size, Sprint with Asurion insurance, easy to root and enable wifi tethering, great slingmobile quality, and the monthly price. The downside of Evo is crappy build quality (on my second Evo due to glass coming off, and even brand new one's glass can be pushed down)
Monthly fee for SERO prem = I'm assuming it's going to be around 65-70 bucks after insurance/taxes which includes unlimited texts/MMS.
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It will be interesting to see what happens when the iPhone finally launches on Verizon. And who knows, with the iPhone on Verizon, we might see it on Sprint sooner or later.

Oh I forgot to mention pretty important experience.
I sold iphone 3G (I'd say 8/10 condition) for 200 bucks on craigslist with in 2 hours of posting it.
Had tough time selling HTC Touch Pro 2 (about same condition) for 150 on craigslist. Finally got rid of it for 180 with bunch of extra stuff (extra bat, charger, bodyglove etc).

DirtyShroomz said:
So what he's saying is people are sheep. Everybody wants to have the exact same tool and nobody wants something different or the ability to create something different. It's not a good business move to let users have a brain.
Got it.
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Click to collapse
Problem is, it's correct.
The majority of phone, mp3, toaster buyers are sheep.
Folks like us who read forums such as this one; Those who understand the inner workings of their device and would like to have the ability to change it if desired; Those who enjoy digging into and learning about what they have....
We're the minority. The very, very small minority.
Apple got it right with devices that just work when you turn them on and they do exactly what people expect. Your average 16 year old girl could care less about rooting or jailbreaking. Can she send text messages, listen to music and read Facebook? Bam, the iPhone is good enough. Oh, there was an update to the iPhone software? A few minutes of data transfer and a reboot later and she can get back to what she wants to do with it.
For Android users, it's a question of which phone? Which UI does it come with? Which OS version does it have? You start throwing information like that to a general, everyday, I-just-want-it-to-work user and their eyes glaze over.
I still believe that Android will eventually overtake the iPhone, just by sheer number of devices and carriers, but Google really needs to rein back a bit and let the device manufacturers catch up. We just barely got Froyo rolled out and there's already talk of IceCream.
Fragmentation is a real problem. Not just to users, but developers. The Market is full of comments that say things like "not working on X device".
You don't see that in the iPhone app store.
It's issues like that that will continue to turn sheep users away.

All that proves is Steve Jobs is not above trolling, google is not fragmenting the market. Manufacturers are, google by no means in forced Samsung to use touchwiz, or HTC to use Sense.
I really have never run into a problem where apps wont run my phone due the "fragmentation"

Jobs summed up the point of Android vs Apple in his own words and didn't even realize it.
"We see tremendous value in having Apple rather than our users be the systems integrator."

I agree with jobs. People do want products that "just work" - period. Unless you're a developer, why would you want something that you have to put labor into to actually have it running correctly? However, besides having my products just work I like variety and apple does not provide that - but then again, like someone else said, that's only a few of us.

i partially agree with jobs and just saying that makes me about throw up not because i hate apple products etc. I just really dont like steve jobs.
I think a lot of people give the general public to much credit. honestly even if android had no fragmentation and was better in every aspect then iOS ... almost everyone knows about the iphone. It is already instilled into the average persons minds that the iphone is the best phone. It will take years and years for that to change under optimal conditions.
Most people dont know what fragmentation of an os is or why it can cause problems. Even though the Evo Vs Iphone video was a joke it was pretty accurate, though exaggerated slightly, the average consumer (i am sure some of you will take offense as did many who saw the video but its true). they dont care what else is out what anything else can do they just want an iphone because they have been fed that it is the best phone for a while now.
the iphone is not a bad piece of hard ware. just dont agree with job's practices or "vision" of what the users and developers should be allowed to do. If they allowed widgets and added a bit more customization options to iOS i think they could pull a good amount of the "casual" android users back to there side.

Issue 13116: Change refund time in Market. 15min is way to little.

Issue 13116: Change refund time in Market. 15min is way to little.
Seriously? Are you effing nuts?
If your app has real value (apart from impulse marketing geared to fleece the sheep) why would you want to put customers in an all or nothing situation where they are likely to be less prone to purchase due to bad user experience (from both poorly developed apps as well as user error)?
This policy will ultimately cheapen the market & undermine user confidence.
Real developers will suffer from the fast fix sugar daddies that seek to take the money & run leaving the users with no recourse other than disgust at being taken advantage of.
This is no way to run a business & I'm appalled that Google would get behind this in any form or fashion.
At the very least, let the developer decide how long the refund time should be & allow the buyer to pick between those who stand behind their work & the fast fix dope pushers.

Crap, is there no way to edit a poll title after initial submission? WTF?
Can a mod please edit this for me? TIA!
Poll should read: Will you be less likely to trust & buy apps w/ a 15 min. refund policy?

Yeah, it is far too low. It should be up to the developer to set the refund time (between 15mins and 24hours).
15mins is stupid, i've never used an app that could be fully evaluated in 15 minutes.

Funny how 6 voters say they have no concerns about a 15 minute return/refund policy without posting a defense for said policy.
I'm gonna guess that they have a weighted interest in screwing customers out of money with poorly developed apps.
/just sayin

I personally think a 15 minute policy is fine for certain apps but other need a much longer amount of time. I think google should just allow the developers to choose the time period for a refund on an app to app basis.

You have a 24H refund period or did they change it?
Sent from my HTC Hero using XDA App

15 minutes is better than nothing.
Apple users seem to cope with no refund at all just fine.
Besides, you talk like developers are out to screw people over.
"Funny how 6 voters say they have no concerns about a 15 minute return/refund policy without posting a defense for said policy.
I'm gonna guess that they have a weighted interest in screwing customers out of money with poorly developed apps.
/just sayin"
I can see how this might be a concern because our market isn't as regulated as the walled garden, but come on. Good people still exist in the world, believe it or not.
(I own no Apple products.. I use a dinc with CM 6.1 btw )

I spend a healthy sum on apps on a regular basis (close to $100 this month alone) & firmly believe in supporting the fruit of any honest development that enriches my user experience. With the large migration of new users to the Android platform we've all seen & experienced the issues of learning.. or not in some cases.
Take any good app on the Market and read the reviews, "Doesn't work!", "Useless!". Really? In most cases I'd guess this is more than likely someone who hasn't read the instructions, "misconfigured" the app, struggling with platform fragmentation or has a sketchy install. It often takes users more than 15 minutes to simply work their way through learning/configuring an app.
If this 15 minute policy is implemented I'm afraid we will begin to see an even more rampant piracy issue than already exists.
A potential buyer will opt to "try out" a hacked version prior to purchase & possibly get a flawed app that doesn't work or one that does & then fail to purchase it.
This isn't good for the platform, Market, developer or user.
Edit: 9 votes for this & still nothing resembling a reasonable argument on your behalf... cowards.

Agree'd on the piracy thing. I have returned only 1 app out of 50+ purchases that force closed upon install, the rest of my apps were returned well after 15 minutes, finding force closes during regular use or false advertising of a feature.
I can see how this will lead people to "try out" things as they do now with music and movies...
I agree that 24 hours is possibly too long but I think the developers should be able to set their own time frames, even if there is no time frame at all, as long as it's their choice.

As a developer, I see no reason for a 15 minute refund policy. If you've made a solid app and you're honest, you have no reason to "hide" behind a short refund policy; I think 24 hours is reasonable.
What I do and really haven't seen done in the app market, is to provide a free demo version. The demo is sclaed down (for example a 100 row database vs. 100,000 rows or the inability to save data). Granted, this may be hard to do for some apps just due to the nature of the beast.
Then if the user likes what get, they can buy a full version with the caveat that there will be no return policy.

lolnl said:
You have a 24H refund period or did they change it?
Sent from my HTC Hero using XDA App
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Yes they are changing it.
Android Market to Receive Update Soon
* New categories for Widgets and Live Wallpapers
* Filter for different screen resolutions
* Apps maximum size increased to 50MB (first 25MB)
* Refund must occur 15 minutes after installment instead of 24 hours
* A “related apps” feature
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Click to collapse

16 Yes to 12 No
And still not one good argument from the 12 no's?
Don't be scared, step up & defend your vote or I'll consider it null & void.

I agree with others that it should be left up to the developer, but I do think that 24 hours is too long in most cases, and in some case I think a refund shouldn't be offered at all.
I can't think of a specific example right now but if there was an app that does one task that the developer charges, and there are no free alternitves, then a person could by the app use it and then get a refund
I could also see 24 hours being way to long in the case of some games. You buy the game finish it in one day and then get your money back.
In these cases the developer is being cheated and it is likely worst than piracy because a pirate would probably never buy the app in the first place, where someone that bought it used it and returned it found the app useful enough to at least spend money on it.
Then again users should be able to get a refund on broken apps

They should let the developers set their own timer, so developers can set a game to 15 minutes and other useful apps to 1 or 2 hours or a whole day.
Sent from my HD2 T8585 using XDA App

Rootstonian said:
As a developer, I see no reason for a 15 minute refund policy. If you've made a solid app and you're honest, you have no reason to "hide" behind a short refund policy; I think 24 hours is reasonable.
What I do and really haven't seen done in the app market, is to provide a free demo version. The demo is sclaed down (for example a 100 row database vs. 100,000 rows or the inability to save data). Granted, this may be hard to do for some apps just due to the nature of the beast.
Then if the user likes what get, they can buy a full version with the caveat that there will be no return policy.
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Click to collapse
I'm seeing more and more devs doing trial versions. Gentlealarm might of been the first I saw. Originally the trial wouldn't work on Wednesdays.
As for the return policy, definitely too short at 15 minutes.
Sent from my HERO200 using XDA App

we're lucky we even get refunds at all. I had an iPhone for 2 years, no refunds from the AppStore.....
I personally think a 24 hour return window just allows people to buy and return games after they're done playing and THAT hurts developers.
What should be done is make it HARDER to publish CRAP to the market making the need for returns unnecessary.

Wow are you trying to have a discussion or bully people into what you believe? "I'll consider your votes null and void" "blah blah devs only want fifteen minutes because they wanna scam people" at least you get fifteen minutes. Go buy an iPhone and complain to them about not getting the option at all. You'll realize the majority don't care.
Read reviews before you buy something, because while some of them might be people that don't know wtf they are doing, if the app is worth buying someone will buy it before you, and someone will give it a try with the correct settings, and chances are someone will do this while having your phone. Returning an app after playing with it extensively is no better for a developer than returning it within fifteen minutes because either way they make nothing off of it.
Iphones have no return policy, they seem to get along just fine. I don't see the Blackberry app world with a return policy either, devs just put up trial versions of the app. Oh the App Catalog? Hmm doesn't seem to have a return policy either. I have a Tour 9630, a Palm Pre Plus and an Droid Incredible, so you can't call me an Apple lover, a BB fanboi or a Palm hater. I personally don't care what the limit is, I'm open to letting the devs decide on a limit if anything, but I just really don't like the way you're going about this "poll".
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App

deathsled said:
...I personally think a 24 hour return window just allows people to buy and return games after they're done playing and THAT hurts developers....
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Is a game that you can beat in under 15 min or even 24 hr even worth purchasing? I'm no dev... but i believe that someone making games will undoubtedly try to develop a game that lasts for more than a few hours unless they are just out to make a quick buck... Isn't that why the refund policy is there in the first place? 15 min is a joke... might as well just take the entire refund policy away.

"done playing" does not mean "finished the game" lol
I don't think I've played all the way through a single game on a phone ever, except for Game Dev Story on my iPhone, which I played for 18 hours straight one weekend. I definitely got the full effect of that game and haven't really played it since, and if it had been for Android I could have returned it and gotten my money back.....

To the Devs who refuse to offer an ad-supported version of your apps: Google cutting the refund time to 15 minutes is why I'm not buying any more of your apps.
15 minutes is not anywhere near an adequate amount of time to evaluate a product and I refuse to be burned and stuck with a bill for a POS app that doesn't work right, doesn't do what it claims to do, or causes problems or conflicts that may not appear for several hours of usage.
If you offer an ad-supported version, I'll use that for a trial. If you don't, oh well. Your loss.
That, or you can tell Google to pull their heads out of their collective ass.

Is it just me...

Or does it seem like Honeycomb was rushed out. I get a lot of force closes on my browser and other apps that were installed when I get my Xoom. Does anyone else get that?

Nope, it's just you, nobody has never made a thread like this ever in this forum.
Next time put something real in the title.

Google is going to f***ing dissenchant me with all their little f***ing two sided antics. OK I get it, blah blah open f***ing source etc. But you can't have it both ways. You want to make a liberal system that can be taken advantage of freely by developers and promote creativity and freedom, great. But you do half the work and allow the cyanogenmod team to smooth out the rest of the quarks and make your OS closer to an expected consumer user experience, voiding peoples warranty in the process. Even at this point, OK. BUT YOU CAN'T F***ING HAVE THE HARDWARE MANUFACTURERS AND CARRIERS PARADING AROUND LIKE ITS OK TO MILK A HALF BAKED OS BY SUCKING PEOPLE DRY WITH INSANE UNJUSTIFIABLE PRICES, ESPECIALLY WHEN NOT EVEN ONE CENT OF ANY OF THE SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT COMES OUT OF THEIR POCKET.
Google needs to put the f***ing squeeze on these a*****es or realize that they are full of s***.

IndivisibleP said:
Language in quote cleaned.
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Lolololol its a breath of fresh air seeing someone comment with this much emotion
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App

IndivisibleP said:
Google is going to f***ing dissenchant me with all their little f***ing two sided antics. OK I get it, blah blah open f***ing source etc. But you can't have it both ways. You want to make a liberal system that can be taken advantage of freely by developers and promote creativity and freedom, great. But you do half the work and allow the cyanogenmod team to smooth out the rest of the quarks and make your OS closer to an expected consumer user experience, voiding peoples warranty in the process. Even at this point, OK. BUT YOU CAN'T F***ING HAVE THE HARDWARE MANUFACTURERS AND CARRIERS PARADING AROUND LIKE ITS OK TO MILK A HALF BAKED OS BY SUCKING PEOPLE DRY WITH INSANE UNJUSTIFIABLE PRICES, ESPECIALLY WHEN NOT EVEN ONE CENT OF ANY OF THE SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT COMES OUT OF THEIR POCKET.
Google needs to put the f***ing squeeze on these a*****es or realize that they are full of s***.
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and THE OP
Nobody forced you to buy anything. Is honeycomb perfect? no we already know this. 2.2 or 2.3 is not perfect so not sure what you expected. We got earthquakes, tsunamis, and civil wars going on and you are worried about some force closes. You dont like it dont buy it. You should feel lucky you even have the choice to buy a Xoom. Quit your *****in.

IndivisibleP said:
INSANE UNJUSTIFIABLE PRICES
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Sounds like you can't really afford the Xoom. Maybe you should just take it back and get a refund. Yes, I think that's the best course for everyone involved.

DroidzFX said:
and THE OP
Nobody forced you to buy anything. Is honeycomb perfect? no we already know this. 2.2 or 2.3 is not perfect so not sure what you expected. We got earthquakes, tsunamis, and civil wars going on and you are worried about some force closes. You dont like it dont buy it. You should feel lucky you even have the choice to buy a Xoom. Quit your *****in.
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Click to collapse
I wasn't "*****in" as you like to put it I was merely asking a question as to whether this was a common thing or if mine was just having problems and maybe I should reload it or something to fix it. If you can't say anything constructive maybe you should avoid using that 1st amendment right of yours.

matdev said:
I wasn't "*****in" as you like to put it I was merely asking a question as to whether this was a common thing or if mine was just having problems and maybe I should reload it or something to fix it. If you can't say anything constructive maybe you should avoid using that 1st amendment right of yours.
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Maybe you should do some research because this question has been asked several times. If the same question or statement is mentioned over and over then it becomes classified as *****in. Unfortunately you fell into this category.

I think the price is fair...and Moto does have software dev time in it - Kernel time at a minimum. I'm fully aware Google was involved in the design process of the device, but I doubt other than a ton of OEM support to Moto that they actually have a ton of resources invested in the device it self.
I guess no one has looked in to purchasing a 32Gb SSD - those alone are $100.
10" screen ~$100 for just a screen without any touch digitizer
So 200 bucks in cost in 2 pieces of hardware.
One of the problems with the Android community as a whole is everyone whining about price. The price of hardware, the price of apps. The Apple drones could care less about price, they'll pay what they are asked to pay regardless of any other thought than "It's white, it has fruit on it" . I however am a fairly informed consumer and am WILLING to pay for latest and greatest as long as it serves my needs.
However, the lack of HC Source has made me reconsider the purchase....

Kcarpenter said:
I think the price is fair...and Moto does have software dev time in it - Kernel time at a minimum. I'm fully aware Google was involved in the design process of the device, but I doubt other than a ton of OEM support to Moto that they actually have a ton of resources invested in the device it self.
I guess no one has looked in to purchasing a 32Gb SSD - those alone are $100.
10" screen ~$100 for just a screen without any touch digitizer
So 200 bucks in cost in 2 pieces of hardware.
One of the problems with the Android community as a whole is everyone whining about price. The price of hardware, the price of apps. The Apple drones could care less about price, they'll pay what they are asked to pay regardless of any other thought than "It's white, it has fruit on it" . I however am a fairly informed consumer and am WILLING to pay for latest and greatest as long as it serves my needs.
However, the lack of HC Source has made me reconsider the purchase....
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You have to think though, that by not releasing the source.. they are doing their best to avoid some of the issues spoken about previously. Too often manufacturers would like to prey on the uneducated or the early adopters by throwing a half developed piece of hardware out the door, slapping the google android sticker on it.. and then while they profit, they take the good name of Google/Android and drag it through the mud.
Look at the reaction to the original Samsung Galaxy Tab. It was thrown out, with an OS that was not made for a tablet, on hardware not optimized for the design... only to capitalize on the fact that they would be the first out the gate (or at least one of the first). Apple did the same thing, and took their phone OS and blew it up to a larger format. The only reason they succeeded was that they had their system locked down and could ensure that they had a good hardware/software mix. The throngs of iFags everywhere gobble it up because they knew it would be solid enough to satisfy them for a year till the next one comes out and improves on it.
Google is finally learning from Apple in that respect.
By not releasing the sc for HC, they are making sure that they can correct the early issues found with HC in the Xoom, as well as ensure the hardware its installed on meets specific requirements as to not damage their name or their products name. Its not that it wont let it out eventually, but they want to make it as solid as possible before they do. I respect them for that, even if it makes the modding community's job a bit harder in the interim.

Lastly... you can blame the marketing techniques for shady products. Simple people are too excited by shiny products with big words in their advertising, that they get burned by not researching... and those that get burned, cry the most. Those that do their due diligence and research, only blame themselves when they get burned because they overlooked a mistake or failed to prioritize features.

matdev said:
Or does it seem like Honeycomb was rushed out. I get a lot of force closes on my browser and other apps that were installed when I get my Xoom. Does anyone else get that?
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Can you give us some more details? Like, did you root your xoom or are you experiencing all of these force closes on a clean xoom that you just got 2 days ago? Did you throw an image on there, sideload a bunch of apps, etc....
Off Topic...
Many people do not understand when they try to compare the Xoom to a polished product like the iPad that the iPad OS has been around for a while before the iPad even came to market (iTouch, iPhone) and developers had already enough time to work with iOS so when the iPad was released there was not that much difference besides the new screen real estate that they had to adjust their apps for. When the iPad first came out there were some bugs, apps had that BS 2x until they were optimized for the iPad, etc...The Xoom is a brand new product that is sporting new hardware and a brand new OS that developers have not had the opportunity to work on until just recently so if "you" are not an early adopter then please buy an iPad. And if you are going to complain about the price of the Xoom compared to an iPad 2 then please explain how many 16GB WiFi only models are selling for the same price right now as a Xoom.

The entire android os and their very diverse array of devices is the reason it will fail. Kind of the same reason linux have not been able to penetrate the masses. I been a linux user since 92 and even I get overwhelmed sometimes with the amounts of distros out there. Got it that is what open source is about however. that same premises is what hinders its progress. Andoid is too fragmented with companies rushing out devices to the market without been ready, unfortunately the so call "early adopters" do everyone else a deservice by rushing to buy such devices, to compund this, companies are quick to abandon support for devices after a couple of months leaving us at the mercy of freelance developers (which by the way are great)
Yes the xoom and hc were rushed out to the market on an effort to get a headstart on other devices, by now it has been proven that it did now work as expected for them
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App

neonflx said:
The entire android os and their very diverse array of devices is the reason it will fail. Kind of the same reason linux have not been able to penetrate the masses.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
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What? You realize android is the most used smartphone platform worldwide right (ignoring sybian)? If that isn't market penetration I don't know what is.
The API differences from 1.6-2.3 are so minor that application compatibility is really a non issue between operating systems. The only issue is hardware differences really.
Ask the average Joe user what version of android or IOS they are using and they'll ask you "what?". Only the power users ***** and moan about these relatively minor OS updates because they always want the latest thing.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA Premium App

neonflx said:
The entire android os and their very diverse array of devices is the reason it will fail. Kind of the same reason linux have not been able to penetrate the masses. I been a linux user since 92 and even I get overwhelmed sometimes with the amounts of distros out there. Got it that is what open source is about however. that same premises is what hinders its progress. Andoid is too fragmented with companies rushing out devices to the market without been ready, unfortunately the so call "early adopters" do everyone else a deservice by rushing to buy such devices, to compund this, companies are quick to abandon support for devices after a couple of months leaving us at the mercy of freelance developers (which by the way are great)
Yes the xoom and hc were rushed out to the market on an effort to get a headstart on other devices, by now it has been proven that it did now work as expected for them
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you rooting for Android to fail? You know they do have Windows based phones if you don't like android ones. No one is forcing you to buy anything android. This is not a hate forum so unless you actually own a xoom and have a general question/statement regarding the xoom/honeycomb then why not just go find a "I hate android/linux/capitalism" forum.

neonflx said:
The entire android os and their very diverse array of devices is the reason it will fail. Kind of the same reason linux have not been able to penetrate the masses. I been a linux user since 92 and even I get overwhelmed sometimes with the amounts of distros out there. Got it that is what open source is about however. that same premises is what hinders its progress. Andoid is too fragmented with companies rushing out devices to the market without been ready, unfortunately the so call "early adopters" do everyone else a deservice by rushing to buy such devices, to compund this, companies are quick to abandon support for devices after a couple of months leaving us at the mercy of freelance developers (which by the way are great)
Yes the xoom and hc were rushed out to the market on an effort to get a headstart on other devices, by now it has been proven that it did now work as expected for them
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really? You must have been on a deserted island for the last couple years. My Xoom running Honeycomb works just fine. Someone needs to start a thread titled ***** here so you guys can get together share what type of tampons you prefer.

Would you pay for Android OS updates?

We all know the reason updates are slow to roll out is because of money. Why update older phones when you can sell new ones with the latest OS? So would you pay for updates to get them sooner? If so how much would you be willing to shell out?
Trigger 3.3

I'll only pay it if it's pure Google and no more than 20$. Lol
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

No reason to pay for it. Androids kernel is based off Linux. Open source!
Google should force the hardware manufacturers to give them the drivers. Ya, I would say at this point in the game, with the dominance of Android, why not start playing hard ball with manufacturers and carriers? You don't even need the phone manufacturers support, since most of the components (chips, memory, screen, etc) are from various manufacturers, and not really the phone manufacturer. Just get the drivers from component makers directly.
Anyway, if one really had to pay. I think minor updates should be free, and major OS overhauls should have a minor fee, if at all. Personally, I would pay a small fee for major OS upgrades versus free for small updates.

Id be willing to pay a small amount over waiting months.
Trigger 3.3

I think there should be one ultimate phone. You know in the android which gets the fastest updates, oh wait isn't that a nexus? :O
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App

You start paying for this sort of thing and then they send out the dogs. Bad idea. I can't think of any companies that have done this but I'm sure there are major ones.
And. If the main os was optimized for users by the dev team and people that haven't bought the update them can be in trouble for stealing. Yeah they might try it but the push against would be stronger. And pirating phone stuff would be HUGE. Almost as big as movie or game s are.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App

helllllllll no.

Only if its straitup aosp. And if we can get the God d*mn update the day Google released it. You know like 2.3 was realeased in December and some company's *cough*HTC*cough* didn't release it till today. And without new sense... smh -_-
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA Premium App

GreggoryD502 said:
We all know the reason updates are slow to roll out is because of money. Why update older phones when you can sell new ones with the latest OS? So would you pay for updates to get them sooner? If so how much would you be willing to shell out?
Trigger 3.3
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Click to collapse
To answer. I wouldn't pay a dime. A device should work satisfactorily as advertised. If it does not then I choose to take matters into my own hands, either by getting another device or indulging in a community like this one. I just don't think it's as simple as your implying.
Money is a motivator for manufacturers and carriers, but only in the sense of how it impacts meeting deadlines and release schedules. No amount of theoretical payola from end users is going to change this. End users and their perceptions do matter, even to manufacturers. But we're kidding ourselves if we think that our goals here in a place like XDA represent anything remotely close to the majority. They do not.
Android brings an entirely different sort of OS ecosystem to the table than consumers have been accustomed to, and more importantly entirely different than what carriers and manufacturers are accustomed to.
Much of what we have seen in the past few years with regards slow or nonexistent updates has been due to how manufacturers initially approached Android as simply a way to stave off significant R&D. Manufacturers are doing better in this regard as of late, because the ecosystem as a whole is maturing. The market is now lucrative and extensive, but competition is rife.
It is these competitive forces AND ONLY THESE that will improve the situation. Indeed it can be readily argued that this above all else is what has made such update issues ameliorate themselves. The most jaded among us can certainly realize things are much better now for Android as a whole than they were a year ago. Orders of magnitude so!!
Even so, realize that manufacturers will only do what they deem is in their interests when developing for their products. No matter how capable the hardware, or how "open" the infrastructure, manufacturers are in this for profit (as well they should be). Many will realize that supporting existing hardware is in their best interest, but as we've seen in similar scenarios in the PC universe, they will do this to varying degrees and for their own reasons. Some will do better than others and perhaps some of that will play out well with end users and gain them loyal customers. It's as likely that customers will simply go elsewhere because they're enticed to do so. This simply isn't as simple a problem as it was when this whole Android sleighride started anymore.
Communities like XDA have a role to play, and the developers and their efforts made here recontribute to everyone involved. But lets not kid ourselves. The performance of most devices as they ship is, to varying degrees, satisfactory. Most users are not zealots (and lets be frank, most XDA people *ARE*), and many of the concerns expressed here are not only unrealistic they are pointless. It is difficult enough to come up with a concrete list of precisely why 2.3 is better than 2.2, or 2.1 amongst ourselves as it is. To most end users perception (and thus most manufacturers) these distinctions are trivial and meaningless.
XDA is a hacker's maven. An important one, and a valuable one to those of us who participate here. But Android itself is no longer *just* a hacker's wet dream. It's a commercial juggernaut of a platform that is living and thriving quite nicely with or without us as this stage.

I would make a donation to the person who cracks it so people can use it for free.

doug2060 said:
I would make a donation to the person who cracks it so people can use it for free.
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... Piracy?
I LIKE IT.

I will pay for it. Not to Samsung or t-mobile. I have $20 saved for the first developer who gets gingerbread working stable on our phone.

It's like asking "Would you spend money to buy linux?" Noooo!

HyprGeek said:
It's like asking "Would you spend money to buy linux?" Noooo!
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You do realize not all Linux distros are free right?

I wouldn't.

pvspencer22 said:
You do realize not all Linux distros are free right?
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yeah but how many go for the paid instead of free?