Or does it seem like Honeycomb was rushed out. I get a lot of force closes on my browser and other apps that were installed when I get my Xoom. Does anyone else get that?
Nope, it's just you, nobody has never made a thread like this ever in this forum.
Next time put something real in the title.
Google is going to f***ing dissenchant me with all their little f***ing two sided antics. OK I get it, blah blah open f***ing source etc. But you can't have it both ways. You want to make a liberal system that can be taken advantage of freely by developers and promote creativity and freedom, great. But you do half the work and allow the cyanogenmod team to smooth out the rest of the quarks and make your OS closer to an expected consumer user experience, voiding peoples warranty in the process. Even at this point, OK. BUT YOU CAN'T F***ING HAVE THE HARDWARE MANUFACTURERS AND CARRIERS PARADING AROUND LIKE ITS OK TO MILK A HALF BAKED OS BY SUCKING PEOPLE DRY WITH INSANE UNJUSTIFIABLE PRICES, ESPECIALLY WHEN NOT EVEN ONE CENT OF ANY OF THE SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT COMES OUT OF THEIR POCKET.
Google needs to put the f***ing squeeze on these a*****es or realize that they are full of s***.
IndivisibleP said:
Language in quote cleaned.
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Click to collapse
Lolololol its a breath of fresh air seeing someone comment with this much emotion
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App
IndivisibleP said:
Google is going to f***ing dissenchant me with all their little f***ing two sided antics. OK I get it, blah blah open f***ing source etc. But you can't have it both ways. You want to make a liberal system that can be taken advantage of freely by developers and promote creativity and freedom, great. But you do half the work and allow the cyanogenmod team to smooth out the rest of the quarks and make your OS closer to an expected consumer user experience, voiding peoples warranty in the process. Even at this point, OK. BUT YOU CAN'T F***ING HAVE THE HARDWARE MANUFACTURERS AND CARRIERS PARADING AROUND LIKE ITS OK TO MILK A HALF BAKED OS BY SUCKING PEOPLE DRY WITH INSANE UNJUSTIFIABLE PRICES, ESPECIALLY WHEN NOT EVEN ONE CENT OF ANY OF THE SOFTWARE DEVELOPMENT COMES OUT OF THEIR POCKET.
Google needs to put the f***ing squeeze on these a*****es or realize that they are full of s***.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and THE OP
Nobody forced you to buy anything. Is honeycomb perfect? no we already know this. 2.2 or 2.3 is not perfect so not sure what you expected. We got earthquakes, tsunamis, and civil wars going on and you are worried about some force closes. You dont like it dont buy it. You should feel lucky you even have the choice to buy a Xoom. Quit your *****in.
IndivisibleP said:
INSANE UNJUSTIFIABLE PRICES
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Click to collapse
Sounds like you can't really afford the Xoom. Maybe you should just take it back and get a refund. Yes, I think that's the best course for everyone involved.
DroidzFX said:
and THE OP
Nobody forced you to buy anything. Is honeycomb perfect? no we already know this. 2.2 or 2.3 is not perfect so not sure what you expected. We got earthquakes, tsunamis, and civil wars going on and you are worried about some force closes. You dont like it dont buy it. You should feel lucky you even have the choice to buy a Xoom. Quit your *****in.
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Click to collapse
I wasn't "*****in" as you like to put it I was merely asking a question as to whether this was a common thing or if mine was just having problems and maybe I should reload it or something to fix it. If you can't say anything constructive maybe you should avoid using that 1st amendment right of yours.
matdev said:
I wasn't "*****in" as you like to put it I was merely asking a question as to whether this was a common thing or if mine was just having problems and maybe I should reload it or something to fix it. If you can't say anything constructive maybe you should avoid using that 1st amendment right of yours.
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Click to collapse
Maybe you should do some research because this question has been asked several times. If the same question or statement is mentioned over and over then it becomes classified as *****in. Unfortunately you fell into this category.
I think the price is fair...and Moto does have software dev time in it - Kernel time at a minimum. I'm fully aware Google was involved in the design process of the device, but I doubt other than a ton of OEM support to Moto that they actually have a ton of resources invested in the device it self.
I guess no one has looked in to purchasing a 32Gb SSD - those alone are $100.
10" screen ~$100 for just a screen without any touch digitizer
So 200 bucks in cost in 2 pieces of hardware.
One of the problems with the Android community as a whole is everyone whining about price. The price of hardware, the price of apps. The Apple drones could care less about price, they'll pay what they are asked to pay regardless of any other thought than "It's white, it has fruit on it" . I however am a fairly informed consumer and am WILLING to pay for latest and greatest as long as it serves my needs.
However, the lack of HC Source has made me reconsider the purchase....
Kcarpenter said:
I think the price is fair...and Moto does have software dev time in it - Kernel time at a minimum. I'm fully aware Google was involved in the design process of the device, but I doubt other than a ton of OEM support to Moto that they actually have a ton of resources invested in the device it self.
I guess no one has looked in to purchasing a 32Gb SSD - those alone are $100.
10" screen ~$100 for just a screen without any touch digitizer
So 200 bucks in cost in 2 pieces of hardware.
One of the problems with the Android community as a whole is everyone whining about price. The price of hardware, the price of apps. The Apple drones could care less about price, they'll pay what they are asked to pay regardless of any other thought than "It's white, it has fruit on it" . I however am a fairly informed consumer and am WILLING to pay for latest and greatest as long as it serves my needs.
However, the lack of HC Source has made me reconsider the purchase....
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Click to collapse
You have to think though, that by not releasing the source.. they are doing their best to avoid some of the issues spoken about previously. Too often manufacturers would like to prey on the uneducated or the early adopters by throwing a half developed piece of hardware out the door, slapping the google android sticker on it.. and then while they profit, they take the good name of Google/Android and drag it through the mud.
Look at the reaction to the original Samsung Galaxy Tab. It was thrown out, with an OS that was not made for a tablet, on hardware not optimized for the design... only to capitalize on the fact that they would be the first out the gate (or at least one of the first). Apple did the same thing, and took their phone OS and blew it up to a larger format. The only reason they succeeded was that they had their system locked down and could ensure that they had a good hardware/software mix. The throngs of iFags everywhere gobble it up because they knew it would be solid enough to satisfy them for a year till the next one comes out and improves on it.
Google is finally learning from Apple in that respect.
By not releasing the sc for HC, they are making sure that they can correct the early issues found with HC in the Xoom, as well as ensure the hardware its installed on meets specific requirements as to not damage their name or their products name. Its not that it wont let it out eventually, but they want to make it as solid as possible before they do. I respect them for that, even if it makes the modding community's job a bit harder in the interim.
Lastly... you can blame the marketing techniques for shady products. Simple people are too excited by shiny products with big words in their advertising, that they get burned by not researching... and those that get burned, cry the most. Those that do their due diligence and research, only blame themselves when they get burned because they overlooked a mistake or failed to prioritize features.
matdev said:
Or does it seem like Honeycomb was rushed out. I get a lot of force closes on my browser and other apps that were installed when I get my Xoom. Does anyone else get that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Can you give us some more details? Like, did you root your xoom or are you experiencing all of these force closes on a clean xoom that you just got 2 days ago? Did you throw an image on there, sideload a bunch of apps, etc....
Off Topic...
Many people do not understand when they try to compare the Xoom to a polished product like the iPad that the iPad OS has been around for a while before the iPad even came to market (iTouch, iPhone) and developers had already enough time to work with iOS so when the iPad was released there was not that much difference besides the new screen real estate that they had to adjust their apps for. When the iPad first came out there were some bugs, apps had that BS 2x until they were optimized for the iPad, etc...The Xoom is a brand new product that is sporting new hardware and a brand new OS that developers have not had the opportunity to work on until just recently so if "you" are not an early adopter then please buy an iPad. And if you are going to complain about the price of the Xoom compared to an iPad 2 then please explain how many 16GB WiFi only models are selling for the same price right now as a Xoom.
The entire android os and their very diverse array of devices is the reason it will fail. Kind of the same reason linux have not been able to penetrate the masses. I been a linux user since 92 and even I get overwhelmed sometimes with the amounts of distros out there. Got it that is what open source is about however. that same premises is what hinders its progress. Andoid is too fragmented with companies rushing out devices to the market without been ready, unfortunately the so call "early adopters" do everyone else a deservice by rushing to buy such devices, to compund this, companies are quick to abandon support for devices after a couple of months leaving us at the mercy of freelance developers (which by the way are great)
Yes the xoom and hc were rushed out to the market on an effort to get a headstart on other devices, by now it has been proven that it did now work as expected for them
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
neonflx said:
The entire android os and their very diverse array of devices is the reason it will fail. Kind of the same reason linux have not been able to penetrate the masses.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
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Click to collapse
What? You realize android is the most used smartphone platform worldwide right (ignoring sybian)? If that isn't market penetration I don't know what is.
The API differences from 1.6-2.3 are so minor that application compatibility is really a non issue between operating systems. The only issue is hardware differences really.
Ask the average Joe user what version of android or IOS they are using and they'll ask you "what?". Only the power users ***** and moan about these relatively minor OS updates because they always want the latest thing.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA Premium App
neonflx said:
The entire android os and their very diverse array of devices is the reason it will fail. Kind of the same reason linux have not been able to penetrate the masses. I been a linux user since 92 and even I get overwhelmed sometimes with the amounts of distros out there. Got it that is what open source is about however. that same premises is what hinders its progress. Andoid is too fragmented with companies rushing out devices to the market without been ready, unfortunately the so call "early adopters" do everyone else a deservice by rushing to buy such devices, to compund this, companies are quick to abandon support for devices after a couple of months leaving us at the mercy of freelance developers (which by the way are great)
Yes the xoom and hc were rushed out to the market on an effort to get a headstart on other devices, by now it has been proven that it did now work as expected for them
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you rooting for Android to fail? You know they do have Windows based phones if you don't like android ones. No one is forcing you to buy anything android. This is not a hate forum so unless you actually own a xoom and have a general question/statement regarding the xoom/honeycomb then why not just go find a "I hate android/linux/capitalism" forum.
neonflx said:
The entire android os and their very diverse array of devices is the reason it will fail. Kind of the same reason linux have not been able to penetrate the masses. I been a linux user since 92 and even I get overwhelmed sometimes with the amounts of distros out there. Got it that is what open source is about however. that same premises is what hinders its progress. Andoid is too fragmented with companies rushing out devices to the market without been ready, unfortunately the so call "early adopters" do everyone else a deservice by rushing to buy such devices, to compund this, companies are quick to abandon support for devices after a couple of months leaving us at the mercy of freelance developers (which by the way are great)
Yes the xoom and hc were rushed out to the market on an effort to get a headstart on other devices, by now it has been proven that it did now work as expected for them
Sent from my SPH-D700 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really? You must have been on a deserted island for the last couple years. My Xoom running Honeycomb works just fine. Someone needs to start a thread titled ***** here so you guys can get together share what type of tampons you prefer.
Related
Out of all the the companies that have announced Honeycomb tablets, not one of them have laid a finger on Android 3.0? Is Google not allowing this? Or are they simply not familiar enough with 3.0 to make any dramatical changes? I don't think it is us consumers forcing them to do this, as it is very clear Motorola and Samsung will skin their devices as they please... but this struck me as odd that they aren't making any changes to the software to differentiate their tablets from the others.
Does Google want to make sure that their tablets get updated as soon as possible? Or do the manufactures believe that Android 3.0 doesn't need to be altered whatsoever and that stock Android is fine?
I know none of you may have a definite answer but I am very curious. I do know that this isn't a bad thing as people actually prefer stock Android... it just somewhat shocks me that these companies aren't trying to alter these tablets to their liking. All the tablets are essentially the same with a different shell. If this is the case, Google could have just released one Honeycomb tablet on all carriers with a decent price. Of course the answer to this will be "choice", but if ONE (and only one) Honeycomb tablet with a low enough price was announced.. that had USB ports, SD Cards slots, etc. -- we wouldn't have to look elsewhere.
The xoom will get an update for motoblur at a later date.
Sent from my EVO using XDA App
Sirchuk said:
The xoom will get an update for motoblur at a later date.
Sent from my EVO using XDA App
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Click to collapse
A Motorola employee said that, but then Motorola itself dismissed that as false.
It was a big race to get the first tablet out the door. It's going to take months to do a 3.0 as they need to re-do it from the group up.
Then perhaps manufacturers have finally come to the realization that google got it right and chose not to sink the money into software development and are sticking to the hardware.
Sent from my EVO using XDA App
If you watch the engadget interview with Matias Duarte, they ask him about his thoughts on manufactures laying hands on Honeycomb. He simply smiles and seems like he doesn't want no one changing up the UI. I mean he is the designer for Honeycomb and I doubt anyone would want their masterpiece being murdered by Motorblur and touchwiz! I think honeycomb looks amazing personally. I also think Google wants these tablets to succeed; therefore, leaving them in charge of updating the software, not manufactures like Samsung who never really update their devices.
Unfortunately we still have to rely on the manufacturer to do the updates I think.
Tico.ASandoval14 said:
If you watch the engadget interview with Matias Duarte, they ask him about his thoughts on manufactures laying hands on Honeycomb. He simply smiles and seems like he doesn't want no one changing up the UI. I mean he is the designer for Honeycomb and I doubt anyone would want their masterpiece being murdered by Motorblur and touchwiz! I think honeycomb looks amazing personally. I also think Google wants these tablets to succeed; therefore, leaving them in charge of updating the software, not manufactures like Samsung who never really update their devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my EVO using XDA App
Tico.ASandoval14 said:
If you watch the engadget interview with Matias Duarte, they ask him about his thoughts on manufactures laying hands on Honeycomb. He simply smiles and seems like he doesn't want no one changing up the UI. I mean he is the designer for Honeycomb and I doubt anyone would want their masterpiece being murdered by Motorblur and touchwiz! I think honeycomb looks amazing personally. I also think Google wants these tablets to succeed; therefore, leaving them in charge of updating the software, not manufactures like Samsung who never really update their devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not to mention that Goog wants fast to market adoption of apps and the potential behind a store ala Apple.
Allowing third parties to muck around with what users can do has been the whole basis of the 'fragmentation' argument.
If Google uses its power in this case they do have a good chance to steal thunder from Apple, but only if they don't allow for the software and devices to get wildly out of sync as they are now.
And that really only pisses off the consumer, not the manufacturer folk - these hardware makers should be beholden to Google, not the consumer to the manufacturer.
Google needs to put the line in the sand so to speak and take ownership of the app side of the game with regards to the platform.. and as much as it pains me to say so, they need to start enforcing some rules about things.. within reason to their current scope/intention - a few friggin standards/rules would not hurt the platform at all.
Just wanted to say - I got my Xoom, and yes, I do see some freezes and weird behavior every once in a while.
It doesn't bother me though.
We're all early adopters helping to push Honeycomb forward. Since Xoom is the only tablet atm that uses honeycomb, and it's a pure "Google Experience Device", I'm sure we'll have updates from ElGoog soon and often. Plus, this device is a heaven for developmental though and experimentation, so I'm sure we'll see great things from our local genuises at XDA.
So everyone chill and enjoy a rare opportunity to be there when it all starts =)
DarkDvr said:
Just wanted to say - I got my Xoom, and yes, I do see some freezes and weird behavior every once in a while.
It doesn't bother me though.
We're all early adopters helping to push Honeycomb forward. Since Xoom is the only tablet atm that uses honeycomb, and it's a pure "Google Experience Device", I'm sure we'll have updates from ElGoog soon and often. Plus, this device is a heaven for developmental though and experimentation, so I'm sure we'll see great things from our local genuises at XDA.
So everyone chill and enjoy a rare opportunity to be there when it all starts =)
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Click to collapse
I have had mine since the doors opened at Costco here in South Florida and I have not had one freeze or force close. I think people may be loading up apps that are not designed for Honeycomb causing issues. For the most part, I am sticking to Honeycomb apps only with a few exceptions. I am also not loading alternate launchers like ADW. I suspect loading things like this will cause problems.
Yea I couldn't agree more.just be patient.we'll have a flash update coming within two weeks also.I love my Xoom
Sent from my DROIDX using XDA App
keitht said:
I have had mine since the doors opened at Costco here in South Florida and I have not had one freeze or force close. I think people may be loading up apps that are not designed for Honeycomb causing issues. For the most part, I am sticking to Honeycomb apps only with a few exceptions. I am also not loading alternate launchers like ADW. I suspect loading things like this will cause problems.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1 mines never froze, fc'd or lagged either. Its a little slow rotating sometimes but its not an issue.
Sent from my HTC Vision using Tapatalk
I read a post yesterday, I can't remember by who, saying that this "Early Adopter" argument is invalid. I believe it was because it would be easy for all tech-companies to take advantage of this and release crappy products that they know consumers will eat up and look past the issues because they know they are "early adopters". As much as I don't like to repeatedly mention Apple, it doesn't seem that they release products riddled with bugs and expect their consumers to shrug it off and say "Oh yea, we're just early adopters, these bugs don't matter!".
Nothing can be perfect obviously, but things can be more perfect than others. Why release something so unfinished when you can release it later in a more complete state? I don't have a Xoom yet, but it seems that Honeycomb was rushed out the door much too quickly. Did Google do this to beat the iPad 2 in the market race? We all know it will still easily sale millions.. they could've waited.
Apple doesn't release products before they are ready? Really? Have you used an iPhone 4 and tried to make a phone call? Did you used an Ipad when it first came out? It had no software for it. Once competition comes and millions of people buy android tablets, the developers will come.
While I agree I would of prefered and more polished Honeycomb, there are ALWAYS growing pains with new technology...especially with brand a new OS. My xoom, like wine, will only get better with age.
Just give it time. It isn't a half assed product....it just needs some software updates. Lets all be happy that soon the mod community is going to do things with it that won't be possible with other devices.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
Yeah. It's not halfassed. Only about 5% assed.
I think the update will work wonders.
Eclair~ said:
I read a post yesterday, I can't remember by who, saying that this "Early Adopter" argument is invalid. I believe it was because it would be easy for all tech-companies to take advantage of this and release crappy products that they know consumers will eat up and look past the issues because they know they are "early adopters". As much as I don't like to repeatedly mention Apple, it doesn't seem that they release products riddled with bugs and expect their consumers to shrug it off and say "Oh yea, we're just early adopters, these bugs don't matter!".
Nothing can be perfect obviously, but things can be more perfect than others. Why release something so unfinished when you can release it later in a more complete state? I don't have a Xoom yet, but it seems that Honeycomb was rushed out the door much too quickly. Did Google do this to beat the iPad 2 in the market race? We all know it will still easily sale millions.. they could've waited.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just wonder how you can give a valid opinion about something you don't own. It would be like me giving an opinion on a ferrari italia.
Eclair~ said:
I read a post yesterday, I can't remember by who, saying that this "Early Adopter" argument is invalid. I believe it was because it would be easy for all tech-companies to take advantage of this and release crappy products that they know consumers will eat up and look past the issues because they know they are "early adopters". As much as I don't like to repeatedly mention Apple, it doesn't seem that they release products riddled with bugs and expect their consumers to shrug it off and say "Oh yea, we're just early adopters, these bugs don't matter!".
Nothing can be perfect obviously, but things can be more perfect than others. Why release something so unfinished when you can release it later in a more complete state? I don't have a Xoom yet, but it seems that Honeycomb was rushed out the door much too quickly. Did Google do this to beat the iPad 2 in the market race? We all know it will still easily sale millions.. they could've waited.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i am using my bt keyboard on the xoom. honeycomb is quite e finished product in terms of its normal use. ive not had one freeze or rrreboot. i had one force close becasue i tried to run a rdp/vnc app. it force closed and i move to next app which did work for controlling my pc. you have people on here either talking without owning the product or loading things not designed or updated for this hardware OR software. such as flashlight apps, launchers, etc. ive used all the apps designed for tablets in the market and ive had no issues. ive played the couple of free games (which performed quite well) and used things as simple as the weather app. smooth sailing. i WOULD like to see more apps (like dish networks sling app) but thats not moto or googles fault.
the bugs ive read about in most topics dont happen to me. im gonna be testing the 720 rip playback later as i havent moved much media to mine yet.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
keitht said:
I have had mine since the doors opened at Costco here in South Florida and I have not had one freeze or force close. I think people may be loading up apps that are not designed for Honeycomb causing issues. For the most part, I am sticking to Honeycomb apps only with a few exceptions. I am also not loading alternate launchers like ADW. I suspect loading things like this will cause problems.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey, I was first in line at my South Fla Costco...lol. You must have gone to Flagler.
I've had a few FC's but I'll admit they were mainly on the first day. Since then I've been good.
colbyb25 said:
Apple doesn't release products before they are ready? Really? Have you used an iPhone 4 and tried to make a phone call? Did you used an Ipad when it first came out? It had no software for it. Once competition comes and millions of people buy android tablets, the developers will come.
While I agree I would of prefered and more polished Honeycomb, there are ALWAYS growing pains with new technology...especially with brand a new OS. My xoom, like wine, will only get better with age.
Just give it time. It isn't a half assed product....it just needs some software updates. Lets all be happy that soon the mod community is going to do things with it that won't be possible with other devices.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The iPhone4 was a design decision. Had they waited 3 more months it still would have had that same problem.
The iPad had over a thousand third party apps at launch, what are you talking about?
And Android isn't going to compete in the tablet world by releasing beta tablets with buggy software. A normal user would have returned the Xoom after seeing 7 apps at launch, no flash at launch, non functional SD card slot, buggy OS and apps force closing. If normal users see this as their first impression of a Google tablet, that will stick with them for a while. The "early adopter" nonsense is absolutely the worst argument that anyone could make.
atoy74 said:
Hey, I was first in line at my South Fla Costco...lol. You must have gone to Flagler.
I've had a few FC's but I'll admit they were mainly on the first day. Since then I've been good.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I went to Pompano Beach Costco. The Verizon guy there gave me trouble with the activation thing. I had to keep pushing him to call more people. Each person he called at Verizon didn't know about the change that activation is not required. Hopefully I helped anyone that came after me
I had two freezes while playing cordy. There was an update for it yesterday that seems to have fixed it. Other than that I have not had any stability issues, just some minor graphical issues.
As far as Apple stability goes am I the only one old enough to remember the axiom "never buy a first Gen apple product."? Apple is somewhat notorious for problems with first Gen products.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
muyoso said:
The iPhone4 was a design decision. Had they waited 3 more months it still would have had that same problem.
The iPad had over a thousand third party apps at launch, what are you talking about?
And Android isn't going to compete in the tablet world by releasing beta tablets with buggy software. A normal user would have returned the Xoom after seeing 7 apps at launch, no flash at launch, non functional SD card slot, buggy OS and apps force closing. If normal users see this as their first impression of a Google tablet, that will stick with them for a while. The "early adopter" nonsense is absolutely the worst argument that anyone could make.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm glad you knew this, I was starting to think I had no argument.
JanetPanic said:
I had two freezes while playing cordy. There was an update for it yesterday that seems to have fixed it. Other than that I have not had any stability issues, just some minor graphical issues.
As far as Apple stability goes am I the only one old enough to remember the axiom "never buy a first Gen apple product."? Apple is somewhat notorious for problems with first Gen products.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think you can say the same with most companies that release version 1 products.
Eclair~ said:
I read a post yesterday, I can't remember by who, saying that this "Early Adopter" argument is invalid. I believe it was because it would be easy for all tech-companies to take advantage of this and release crappy products that they know consumers will eat up and look past the issues because they know they are "early adopters". As much as I don't like to repeatedly mention Apple, it doesn't seem that they release products riddled with bugs and expect their consumers to shrug it off and say "Oh yea, we're just early adopters, these bugs don't matter!".
Nothing can be perfect obviously, but things can be more perfect than others. Why release something so unfinished when you can release it later in a more complete state? I don't have a Xoom yet, but it seems that Honeycomb was rushed out the door much too quickly. Did Google do this to beat the iPad 2 in the market race? We all know it will still easily sale millions.. they could've waited.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Obviously they could have waited, its about supply and demand. The demand was there, so they got it out as fast as they could in working order. It has its problems, software problems, I love it it and didnt want to wait a day longer. They know what they're doing, google isn't Microsoft lol. It works, we want it, were willing to sacrifice a little functionality to be able to have it now, we love it , if you don't like the problems then thats your problem dont cry about i, either don't get one or wait to get one, everyone who bought it knew for the most part what types of problems we might come across, nobody is making you buy it nor keep it! You have no right to speculate on why they should or should not have released it like this, only the right to not buy or use it
parrotheadmjb said:
Obviously they could have waited, its about supply and demand. The demand was there, so they got it out as fast as they could in working order. It has its problems, software problems, I love it it and didnt want to wait a day longer. They know what they're doing, google isn't Microsoft lol. It works, we want it, were willing to sacrifice a little functionality to be able to have it now, we love it , if you don't like the problems then thats your problem dont cry about i, either don't get one or wait to get one, everyone who bought it knew for the most part what types of problems we might come across, nobody is making you buy it nor keep it! You have no right to speculate on why they should or should not have released it like this, only the right to not buy or use it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
sorry but a user has every right to gripe about the limitations of the product they purchased.
Google has a history of releasing buggy products, and improving them over time. its just how they do it. (a la google tv, nexus one launch, etc) does that make them a bad company? no. but to a mainstream (non techie) user who uses the product as is, the xoom out of the box is somewhat of a disappointment because of some basic feature limitations at launch. (no software sd support, no flash support, lack of proper video encoding support, which is a surprise as Google is normally great with cross compatibility). I personally feel that the Xoom launch was rushed in order to get as many early adopter sales before the iPad2 hits. I'm verrry sure that had the xoom been released the same time as iPad2 launch date, xoom sales numbers would be much lower.
i was an avid iPad user (gave it away), and currently awaiting for the xoom to arrive in the mail. i'm looking forward to using it.
What you are totally missing is the fact that the majority of apps look and work just fine. None of this "2x" bull crap that apple did with there tablet launch. I ask, did you purchase an Ipad when it first came out? Do you own a Xoom? If no to one or both counts, you lose some credibility with your argument.
No one is giving Motorola or Google a pass, but there is some kind of understanding with new gear. That is not an excuse, but something to take into account. I personally love xoom, both for what is and what it can and will be. You want a completely bug free and flawless piece of equipment, make it yourself. If you have ever ran your own company, you would know that every prouduct and system goes through some level of growing pains.
Too many people think the xoom is supposed to magically outsell the I pad...which will never happen. Apple, if nothing else has done an AMAZING job at marketing and creating demand for their sometimes sub par, at least technologcally, products. That being said, android is picking up steam and offering a solid competition to the ios system. Does it still have a ways to go...sure. But it is heading that way and things are only going to get better from here.
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
aohus said:
sorry but a user has every right to gripe about the limitations of the product they purchased.
Google has a history of releasing buggy products, and improving them over time. its just how they do it. (a la google tv, nexus one launch, etc) does that make them a bad company? no. but to a mainstream (non techie) user who uses the product as is, the xoom out of the box is somewhat of a disappointment because of some basic feature limitations at launch. (no software sd support, no flash support, lack of proper video encoding support, which is a surprise as Google is normally great with cross compatibility). I personally feel that the Xoom launch was rushed in order to get as many early adopter sales before the iPad2 hits. I'm verrry sure that had the xoom been released the same time as iPad2 launch date, xoom sales numbers would be much lower.
i was an avid iPad user (gave it away), and currently awaiting for the xoom to arrive in the mail. i'm looking forward to using it.
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You just contradicted yourself, you said
1. They have the right to complain about the product being released too early
2. Google has a history of releasing buggy products
---
They have no right to complain, they knew in advance or they don't possess the ability to think
Also, you can just return it.... but no *****ing about the obvious is a better idea
Well, the no software argument is pointless, you'll have to wait here. Phone Android didn't start with that much apps either, same for iPhone, Windows, any OS.
http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/mar2011/tc20110324_269784.htm
Google says it will delay the distribution of its newest Android source code, dubbed Honeycomb, at least for the foreseeable future. The search giant says the software, which is tailored specifically for tablet computers that compete against Apple's iPad, is not yet ready to be altered by outside programmers and customized for other devices, such as phones.
almostinsane said:
http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/mar2011/tc20110324_269784.htm
Google says it will delay the distribution of its newest Android source code, dubbed Honeycomb, at least for the foreseeable future. The search giant says the software, which is tailored specifically for tablet computers that compete against Apple's iPad, is not yet ready to be altered by outside programmers and customized for other devices, such as phones.
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More beta BS. I'll sell you a car but we only completed the frame.
Yup - Its why I just sent my Xoom back to Moto.
Perhaps it's time to change your ID to "completelyInsane".
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
_RTFM_ said:
Perhaps it's time to change your ID to "completelyInsane".
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA App
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LMAO!
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA Premium App
i dont understand what will make it "ready" if they are planning on eventually releasing it what will keep it from being ported to phones then. If its a matter of incompleteness then what's changed since Cupcake which everyone agrees was more .8 than 1.0. Releasing it to dev's will allow for bugfixes and tweaks to get merged upstream.
It will leak eventually. It always does...
Sent from my Xoom using XDA App
Yea I dont understand google some times. I understand the the OS isnt ready, but if it really is that bad and that unstable then why even put it on a tablet. And really what harm does it do the put out the code, so people will port it to other devices, you can keep doing what you will but make lots of devs happy.
They say they're worried about a poor user experience. Who do they think these users are? "I he4rd on the int3webz I can haz h0neycombz on my G1?" I mean we already know that the percentage of people running custom Roms, while large for what it is, is not the bulk of people using Android. And we know that what we're doing may not be the smoothest experience. The SDK has already been ported to pretty much everything, and they're worried about the actual 3.0 being a poor experience? Come on Google, what's this really about?
This wasn't the best source to quote from. Google said they don't want developers trying to port it to phones yet since they can't guarantee a good user experience on phones. They're afraid XDA is going to port it, people try to run it on their phones and then say how crappy it runs on a phone even though that's not what it was designed for. You know it would happen, and word would spread that it sucks on phones and yada yada it doesn't get a fair chance.
Sent via EVO
As much of a ROM guy as I am, I admit this makes sense from a business stand point. Google makes $ from licensing and distribution (with regards to Android). The hacker communities do not make up said market for the most part.
The worst thing companies combat these days is negative publicity.
I owned an iPhone, two iterations, the 3G and the original. Why did my mother never purchase one, nor my sister? Simply because of how locked down they are due to MY advice. Were they ever going to buy said device due to their hackability? Hell no. But because I said it was sh**** that Apple locks their stuff down so much, they declined to buy said hardware.
Releasing the software for Google could have a lot of negative effects on a BRAND NEW operating system for a BRAND NEW market for Google. If people are throwing this on phones, you search it out on the internet, and everything is Honeycomb this sucks, and honeycomb that sucks, due to people using it on phones, most people who try to do basic research, like my mother, or sister,
will only see "THIS SUCKS".
Just my 2c, but I can see their stand point. Until they can find a way to keep it off the phones, I see this as an issue for google.
~m
familiarstranger said:
They say they're worried about a poor user experience. Who do they think these users are? "I he4rd on the int3webz I can haz h0neycombz on my G1?" I mean we already know that the percentage of people running custom Roms, while large for what it is, is not the bulk of people using Android. And we know that what we're doing may not be the smoothest experience. The SDK has already been ported to pretty much everything, and they're worried about the actual 3.0 being a poor experience? Come on Google, what's this really about?
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Uhmm, are we reading the same forum? Where people knowingly purchased a device that didn't have flash or lte or an ad card working at launch but are still *****ing and whining and returning their xoom regardless? What I mean is, those same people will install Honeycomb and complain that google released a lousy product.
Sent via EVO
thegeektern said:
I understand the the OS isnt ready, but if it really is that bad and that unstable then why even put it on a tablet. And really what harm does it do the put out the code, so people will port it to other devices, you can keep doing what you will but make lots of devs happy.
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My understanding of that article is that Google doesn't feel its ready for phones. It's not that its not ready for tablets. They understand that they won't be able to stop people from using HC on phones, but trying to stave off the inevitable...
this HC thing looks like crap.... oh.. on my phone. In the end.. we are talking about a company here.. a company that needs to keep it's image.. and products.. (or software as you may call it).. as good as possible.
I don't think it's the best move Google could have made, but I think Google should do things in it's best interest to keep itself as a company in good standing. Long and short of it.. if things go south for google.. we'll all be unhappy. Just getting things out for the sake of allowing devs to play doesn't mean its the most sound decision for the company making it.
Yes, I know.. it's 'open source', but it is still a work-product. I think it's also entirely likely this is just a marketing ploy to say 'we told you so'.. and then it will get leaked and everything will go back to normal. But I still think people often forget that this is still a company that has to keep itself together to survive.
EDIT: So many things get written in the same time when you respond to a post! It seems as though I am joining the choir of.. this isn't so bad.
Sirchuk said:
This wasn't the best source to quote from. Google said they don't want developers trying to port it to phones yet since they can't guarantee a good user experience on phones. They're afraid XDA is going to port it, people try to run it on their phones and then say how crappy it runs on a phone even though that's not what it was designed for. You know it would happen, and word would spread that it sucks on phones and yada yada it doesn't get a fair chance.
Sent via EVO
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Well that hasn't stopped devs on xda porting it already - http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=978939
Darn you almostinsane, I was just about to post this but you beat me to it!
Its really unfortunate that Google is doing this, whatever happened to a completely open source OS? In my honest opinion I think they should release it to the public and let the various devs have at it and see what can be improved and take those improvements into consideration for the next release of Android. If the OS was only meant for tablets who is to say that x developer can port it to a handheld flawlessly? It would be a HUGE leap ahead for us and for big ol' G.
Either way, it'll happen with or without Google releasing the source as our one dev spacemoose1 has shown us with making a near perfect port to the Samsung tab of honeycomb.
Stinks money is such an issue, Google doesn't really need anymore haha.
Done with my rant now
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App
Another business reason for this decision: Google may not have programmed Honeycomb well.
An obvious(?) repercussion for grimy source code going public is more bashing of Honeycomb's alleged "beta-ness". The more app developers that use the ...poisonous open-source code, the more ...poisoned apps there will be.
Or, they want to curb full-blown Honeycomb from appearing on devices other than the Xoom for just a little longer.
you're right. I just hate that its true. Your sig shows you remember the G1 days when we were all just so happy about what our phone COULD do. It's gotten a lot whinnier around here since then.
Sirchuk said:
Uhmm, are we reading the same forum? Where people knowingly purchased a device that didn't have flash or lte or an ad card working at launch but are still *****ing and whining and returning their xoom regardless? What I mean is, those same people will install Honeycomb and complain that google released a lousy product.
Sent via EVO
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As a ROM enthusiast; yea this sucks. Business it's understandable; but as the former it doesn't make me happy.
My NC sorely needs a aosp honeycomb, HC's tablet interface is superior to even CM7 on it.
Honestly though it's a lot of speculation here on why, but it really just sounds like an excuse (Bad one) to quiet the devs while really being a straight business decision.
How is not releasing honeycomb aosp right away not being open? Would you like all your roms without SD card support right now? Honeycomb is most likely stable enough for normal use for the average consumer and Google had to make footprint in the tablet industry before ipad2 was announced. Things were obviously rushed so i rather wait for them get everything situated. I think this unfortunate news but I'm not gonna cry foul when its something that's probably for the better. Google has proven with each iteration of android they have released source so just be patient
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk
almostinsane said:
Yup - Its why I just sent my Xoom back to Moto.
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I don't understand the logic here. What alternative are you seeking? Take it back for the Galaxy 10.1? It runs the same OS. Take it back for an iPad? It runs a closed OS.
The AOSP release is delayed ... maybe. Why would you return your Xoom because of this?
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA Premium App
First off, keep in mind I'm not trying to start a fight. I really don't know the answers.
Given that Honeycomb is never going to be open source, to me that means ROM changes by the dev community are impossible. Only Acer can make and push out those changes.
I don't consider changing an app out to be "development". To me, that's theming. While that's a fine thing, what I really want are changes to the core code to fix basic problems with the OS we've been given.
At some point in the near future I'd like to participate in making those changes.
Since HC source is never going to be available to me, that tells me that I'm going to be limited to theming the OS I've already got.
What do you know that I don't which leads you to think the dev community will be able to make substantial changes to our tablets?
Ice Cream is rumored to be scheduled for Q4 and Google has stated it will be the next open-sourced version.
Honeycomb was effectively a rush-to-market to try to allow companies like Motorola and Acer to compete with the iPad before it came too late, and is an incredible hack job.
I'm okay with that. Once someone breaks the boot-loader on the Acer some enterprising dev will get Ice Cream on it, even if Honeycomb is never released as source.
News sources: http://phandroid.com/2011/05/10/goo...mb-because-they-wanted-to-wait-for-ice-cream/
http://www.engadget.com/2011/05/10/google-announces-ice-cream-sadwich-for-q4-2011-for-smartphones/
It's funny that Google is so embarassed of how bad they had to code Honeycomb to get it out that they won't let the public see it. It's got to be really stinky, and it explains the problems we have. I'd rather this than Apple winning the war though.
That being said, I don't want Apple out of the game either. I want it split 50/50 or so. Encourage price and development pressure on the corporations.
muqali said:
It's funny that Google is so embarassed of how bad they had to code Honeycomb to get it out that they won't let the public see it. It's got to be really stinky, and it explains the problems we have. I'd rather this than Apple winning the war though.
That being said, I don't want Apple out of the game either. I want it split 50/50 or so. Encourage price and development pressure on the corporations.
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Yup. I completely agree. The competition keeps them on their toes.
Sent from Desire HD or Inspire 4G or whatever this thing is called via premium XDA app.
agreed , I dont think anyone wants Apple out of the game , just as kicking Microsoft to the curb is unwise! Competition makes prices go down and technology better!
I think the comparison to apple products is not really justified. These tablets are not glorified ipods (and I mean this in a good way), but they are actual intermediates from phone to laptops. I have a more efficient way of browsing, e-mail, reading, playing movies, etc that happens to have games.
I am impressed that Apple introduces well packaged and polished products to consumers, and for most consumers, these products will work well for their "needs." I agree with what another member said recently, just using the product is only half the fun. I think the reason we are on these forums and buy these products is that we enjoy the challenge that Android devices hold. They are basically the most raw form of the new tablet PC market, akin to the old IBMs and such that most of us remember using when we were younger. You know, the ones we used to open up and explore, disassemble and reassemble.
I love what the android tablet market offers: a collection of powerful hardware and the collective creativity of everyone in this dev community. I am looking forward to what kind of crazy things this community comes up with.
We all know the reason updates are slow to roll out is because of money. Why update older phones when you can sell new ones with the latest OS? So would you pay for updates to get them sooner? If so how much would you be willing to shell out?
Trigger 3.3
I'll only pay it if it's pure Google and no more than 20$. Lol
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
No reason to pay for it. Androids kernel is based off Linux. Open source!
Google should force the hardware manufacturers to give them the drivers. Ya, I would say at this point in the game, with the dominance of Android, why not start playing hard ball with manufacturers and carriers? You don't even need the phone manufacturers support, since most of the components (chips, memory, screen, etc) are from various manufacturers, and not really the phone manufacturer. Just get the drivers from component makers directly.
Anyway, if one really had to pay. I think minor updates should be free, and major OS overhauls should have a minor fee, if at all. Personally, I would pay a small fee for major OS upgrades versus free for small updates.
Id be willing to pay a small amount over waiting months.
Trigger 3.3
I think there should be one ultimate phone. You know in the android which gets the fastest updates, oh wait isn't that a nexus? :O
Sent from my GT-I9000 using XDA App
You start paying for this sort of thing and then they send out the dogs. Bad idea. I can't think of any companies that have done this but I'm sure there are major ones.
And. If the main os was optimized for users by the dev team and people that haven't bought the update them can be in trouble for stealing. Yeah they might try it but the push against would be stronger. And pirating phone stuff would be HUGE. Almost as big as movie or game s are.
Sent from my SGH-T959 using XDA App
helllllllll no.
Only if its straitup aosp. And if we can get the God d*mn update the day Google released it. You know like 2.3 was realeased in December and some company's *cough*HTC*cough* didn't release it till today. And without new sense... smh -_-
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GreggoryD502 said:
We all know the reason updates are slow to roll out is because of money. Why update older phones when you can sell new ones with the latest OS? So would you pay for updates to get them sooner? If so how much would you be willing to shell out?
Trigger 3.3
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To answer. I wouldn't pay a dime. A device should work satisfactorily as advertised. If it does not then I choose to take matters into my own hands, either by getting another device or indulging in a community like this one. I just don't think it's as simple as your implying.
Money is a motivator for manufacturers and carriers, but only in the sense of how it impacts meeting deadlines and release schedules. No amount of theoretical payola from end users is going to change this. End users and their perceptions do matter, even to manufacturers. But we're kidding ourselves if we think that our goals here in a place like XDA represent anything remotely close to the majority. They do not.
Android brings an entirely different sort of OS ecosystem to the table than consumers have been accustomed to, and more importantly entirely different than what carriers and manufacturers are accustomed to.
Much of what we have seen in the past few years with regards slow or nonexistent updates has been due to how manufacturers initially approached Android as simply a way to stave off significant R&D. Manufacturers are doing better in this regard as of late, because the ecosystem as a whole is maturing. The market is now lucrative and extensive, but competition is rife.
It is these competitive forces AND ONLY THESE that will improve the situation. Indeed it can be readily argued that this above all else is what has made such update issues ameliorate themselves. The most jaded among us can certainly realize things are much better now for Android as a whole than they were a year ago. Orders of magnitude so!!
Even so, realize that manufacturers will only do what they deem is in their interests when developing for their products. No matter how capable the hardware, or how "open" the infrastructure, manufacturers are in this for profit (as well they should be). Many will realize that supporting existing hardware is in their best interest, but as we've seen in similar scenarios in the PC universe, they will do this to varying degrees and for their own reasons. Some will do better than others and perhaps some of that will play out well with end users and gain them loyal customers. It's as likely that customers will simply go elsewhere because they're enticed to do so. This simply isn't as simple a problem as it was when this whole Android sleighride started anymore.
Communities like XDA have a role to play, and the developers and their efforts made here recontribute to everyone involved. But lets not kid ourselves. The performance of most devices as they ship is, to varying degrees, satisfactory. Most users are not zealots (and lets be frank, most XDA people *ARE*), and many of the concerns expressed here are not only unrealistic they are pointless. It is difficult enough to come up with a concrete list of precisely why 2.3 is better than 2.2, or 2.1 amongst ourselves as it is. To most end users perception (and thus most manufacturers) these distinctions are trivial and meaningless.
XDA is a hacker's maven. An important one, and a valuable one to those of us who participate here. But Android itself is no longer *just* a hacker's wet dream. It's a commercial juggernaut of a platform that is living and thriving quite nicely with or without us as this stage.
I would make a donation to the person who cracks it so people can use it for free.
doug2060 said:
I would make a donation to the person who cracks it so people can use it for free.
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... Piracy?
I LIKE IT.
I will pay for it. Not to Samsung or t-mobile. I have $20 saved for the first developer who gets gingerbread working stable on our phone.
It's like asking "Would you spend money to buy linux?" Noooo!
HyprGeek said:
It's like asking "Would you spend money to buy linux?" Noooo!
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You do realize not all Linux distros are free right?
I wouldn't.
pvspencer22 said:
You do realize not all Linux distros are free right?
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yeah but how many go for the paid instead of free?