Database Users

Multitouch

Hi,
Just a second ago I was playing with my phone and noticed that when I was switching from photo's I can 'push' it back with my other finger. In Notes it doesn't work but that is strange, if I put at the top and the bottom, it should recognize two touches and it goes to the middle. This should mean that it CAN recognize multitouch but it isn't programmed for it. I might be wrong (tell me) but it was just my 'theory'.
Regars,
NLCJ

i think its possible but requires much work . take look at this from htc hd witch is same device with bigger screen
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=486268

That's not multitouch Lol!
When you put two fingers (or more) in the the screen, it just recognizes the middle point, just like when you put just one finger, because dispite only being one finger, it has hundreds of touching points in the screen, so the operating system only recognize the middle one.
It's only just one point touchscreen.

madman_cro said:
i think its possible but requires much work . take look at this from htc hd witch is same device with bigger screen
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=486268
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not possible at all! forget it.
That software, as the author says, it's not multitouch. It only uses the middle point as if we were touching another button. Thats why when you want to use another button, you should first lift all finger and then press again.

didnt say that it was multitouch but the good starting point. well just have to wait for vm7 and see

Does anybody really care? Multi touch seems way overrated to me.

jabok said:
Does anybody really care? Multi touch seems way overrated to me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It certainly seems overrated on a 3.2 inch screen. On full desktop screens maybe, but even then I'm not sure as I want to keep taking my hands off my mouse and keyboard and reach out to put fingerprints all over my monitor!

As was already stated on many threads, multitouch is not just a software problem. It requires special hardware.
This piece of hardware must be, for the time being, a "capacitive screen", such as the iphone one. Many manufacturers work at this time on implementing multi-touch on resistive screens (such as the one of the diamond or diamond 2), but it requires an additional hardware chip.

madman_cro said:
didnt say that it was multitouch but the good starting point. well just have to wait for vm7 and see
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is TD2 devices WM7 compatible?

opensea said:
Is TD2 devices WM7 compatible?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ehh... WM6.5 isn't even released yet...
But i don't think it will be compatible, like hardware and stuff.

The REAL truth about N1 touch screen

Well - hate to break it to ya all... the touch sensor is not true multi-touch. It's not iPhone-like full matrix capacitive touch screen. Yes- it can pinch to zoom and might do some limited rotate (very limited) but it's based on the same technology of common touch pads - it can do only single finger tracking. The pinch gesture can be recognized but if you are thinking you can have apps like the iPhone piano or guitar - or for that matter - a multi touch keyboard - well - it will not happen with the N1 touch screen.
Not to say that it is a problem - multi touch is over hyped as-is. The pinch-to is just good enough and the zoom bar on previous HTC phones was just as useful.
But don't expect the N1 to detect the position of more than one finger.
Given that - I wish they stayed with resistive touch screen where you could use a stylus to type - 15 days with the N1 and still I find it harder to type with my finger that using a stylus with my now sold HTC HD.
But there is no comparing old WinMo with Android. N1 is a keeper.

Hum, so how come you can find a multi-touch keyboard in the market ?
http://www.androlib.com/android.application.net-cdeguet-smartkeyboardpro-wnzt.aspx
And, not that I don't believe you, but do you have any real proof of what you are saying ?

I've downloaded that app. Couldn't see any multi-touch - it would just press the key I put my last finger on.. just like it should if it was what we call a 2-way touchpad.
I work in developing touch solutions so I know a little bit about them.. The N1 screen, to the best of my experience is not true multi-touch.

dnts:
You could download "MultiTouch Visualizer" and see how N1 handles multitouch, it should be in the market.
If that app is correct, the N1 can distuingish between 2 points at a time which as far as I know is exactly the same as on iphone.
edit:
Just a comment about pinch to zoom, wouldn't this be impossible without multi-touch? The center point between your fingers do not change and as such it has to be multi-touch to allow this gesture. Correct me if I'm wrong.

dnts said:
I've downloaded that app. Couldn't see any multi-touch - it would just press the key I put my last finger on.. just like it should if it was what we call a 2-way touchpad.
I work in developing touch solutions so I know a little bit about them.. The N1 screen, to the best of my experience is not true multi-touch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In your OP you say the screen is a specific type that doesn't support it... general user experience of an app in BETA stage isn't a good way to determine that...
Do you have any other reason to claim the hardware of the N1 does not support multi-touch?

OP has zero clue what hes talking about.
He contradicts himself several times.
Theres MT visualizer as mentioned and theres numerous fingerpaint drawing apps that let you do 2 fingers at the same time.
Why not start a post with N1 doesnt have a true trackball.

xManMythLegend said:
Why not start a post with N1 doesnt have a true trackball.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The trackball is a lie!

There could be some merit to this statement. The form of multitouch the touchscreen on the G1 and Magic (perhaps more, but I'm not sure) used was capable of "2x1d" positioning. That is, if you touched the screen in two places, it knew the two x coordinates being touched and the two y coordinates being touched, but had to way of correlating which x was paired to which y... this was handled in software.
This was fine for pinch gestures, but recall in Luke Hutchison's videos where he showed that the software could become confused and pair the x and y incorrectly, which would lead to the system registering the opposite corners of the touch "box" between your fingers.
You can still see the effect today on some multitouch applications in the Market on the Nexus One. Like multitouch pong or the multitouch plugin for ethereal dialpad. In each case, the software can directly determine the initial touch points usually, but when points cross in the x or y axis they will "snap" together in that axis, and when moving from that position may become confused. This makes games like Multitouch Pong unusable on the Nexus One because it is just not reliable. However I have no way of knowing if this is a hardware limitation or a limitation in the touch software, and nobody has really talked about it.
This is contrasted to the iphone, whose touch screen allows it to keep track of touch points as two (x,y) coordinates without any sort of axis snapping.

Uejji said:
There could be some merit to this statement. The form of multitouch the touchscreen on the G1 and Magic (perhaps more, but I'm not sure) used was capable of "2x1d" positioning. That is, if you touched the screen in two places, it knew the two x coordinates being touched and the two y coordinates being touched, but had to way of correlating which x was paired to which y... this was handled in software.
This was fine for pinch gestures, but recall in Luke Hutchison's videos where he showed that the software could become confused and pair the x and y incorrectly, which would lead to the system registering the opposite corners of the touch "box" between your fingers.
You can still see the effect today on some multitouch applications in the Market on the Nexus One. Like multitouch pong or the multitouch plugin for ethereal dialpad. In each case, the software can directly determine the initial touch points usually, but when points cross in the x or y axis they will "snap" together in that axis, and when moving from that position may become confused. This makes games like Multitouch Pong unusable on the Nexus One because it is just not reliable. However I have no way of knowing if this is a hardware limitation or a limitation in the touch software, and nobody has really talked about it.
This is contrasted to the iphone, whose touch screen allows it to keep track of touch points as two (x,y) coordinates without any sort of axis snapping.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is software... even the iPhone has issues with tracking the X,Y pairs when they run into one another, but they have 3 generations of of software developement to help sort it all out. Even with that, you can still confuse the iPhone's multi-touch... make an "X" shape on the scren by running your fingers togther than apart in two "V" shapes, and 99% of the the time it will register it is two seperate lines crossing, and not two actual V's... as well, if you try to cross your fingers it can get even crazier!
The N1 does have a ways to go in terms of multi-touch software and app support to catch up to the iPhone, but I don't see anywhere that supports the claim it is a hardware limitation.

Stylus...
Im sorry but resistant touch screens are the worse screen to be on. Typing on a resistance touch screen is the worst experience ever. Go try a Samsung Omnia I or HTC Touch Diamond.
If your on a all screen device with no keyboard, capacitive is the way to go. Its obvious that the OP doesnt know what he is talking about or doesnt have past experience with resistant touch screens.
If your fingers too big and you need a stylus thats your problem, not a problem of the device.

The Nexus One uses a Synaptics ClearPad 2000 touch screen.
ClearPad 2000 Series benefits
ClearPad 2000 is the original ClearPad solution, offering DualTouch capabilities and easy gesture integration in firmware. In addition to the core ClearPad benefits, ClearPad 2000 Series offers:
* Proven Success—Since its introduction in 2007, ClearPad continues to set the standard for touchscreen performance.
* Exceptional User Experience—Two-finger interaction and gestures (i.e., Pinch, Pivot Rotate) provide an intuitive user experience.
* Best-in-Class Performance and Accuracy—Synaptics’ track record in design and testing ensures successful products that integrate ClearPad 2000 touchscreens.
ClearPad benefits
All ClearPad solutions bring you the wide-ranging benefits that come from choosing an industry-leading solution:
* Solution Stack—Synaptics’ comprehensive solution offering covers all critical capabilities, from design to testing to supply/support.
* Seamless Integration—Mount ClearPad touch panels beneath a product’s casing for a sleek, smooth appearance.
* Superior Optics—ClearPad touch panels minimize internal reflections.
* Accuracy—ClearPad delivers best-in-class accuracy, including resolutions of 500+ dpi, without requiring calibration.
* Durability—ClearPad touch sensors, mounted beneath a device’s top plastic, can be designed with a glass or PET substrate.
* Lower Consumption—Doze, sleep, and deep sleep modes maximize battery life and use less energy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

So, the nexus one is only dualtouch and the iphone is multitouch

Thank you guys for flaming me... but that will not change the fact the our N1s have a simple surface capacitance touch screen that has the ability to distinguish up to 2 fingers provided that they don't cross axis with each other (i.e. each finger stays in it's perimeter so either X or Y axis don't align).
I've designed several touch pads and other touch solutions in the past few years and have pending patents on that technology. You can say what you'd like about my lack of experience - ha - it will not change anything and I couldn't care less.
You can check out this patent application (soon to be granted, I hope):
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2009/0046827.html
So believe me guys and gals - it ain't no multi-touch and don't expect to have multi tocuh capabilities. Pinch to zoom.. maybe rotate... or some 2-finger flicking... that's all. No good and working multi touch keyboard.. no piano or guitar app... simply cannot be done with this hardware...
That said, this hardware provides better accuracy, lower power consumption and is free of patent issues (Apple's multi touch is heavily patent protected).

dnts said:
Thank you guys for flaming me... but that will not change the fact the our N1s have a simple surface capacitance touch screen that has the ability to distinguish up to 2 fingers provided that they don't cross axis with each other (i.e. each finger stays in it's perimeter so either X or Y axis don't align).
I've designed several touch pads and other touch solutions in the past few years and have pending patents on that technology. You can say what you'd like about my lack of experience - ha - it will not change anything and I couldn't care less.
You can check out this patent application (soon to be granted, I hope):
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2009/0046827.html
So believe me guys and gals - it ain't no multi-touch and don't expect to have multi tocuh capabilities. Pinch to zoom.. maybe rotate... or some 2-finger flicking... that's all. No good and working multi touch keyboard.. no piano or guitar app... simply cannot be done with this hardware...
That said, this hardware provides better accuracy, lower power consumption and is free of patent issues (Apple's multi touch is heavily patent protected).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
it is multitouch for me, and you can say what you want. Maybe you should write an article in iphone fanboy sites like engadget and gizmodo, because they would love to hear your scientific findings.
Maybe you could sell your technology to apple or microsoft.
Everyday, since the launch of Nexus, and especially after the OTA there is a scientist picking up no Nexus, because people cannot comprehend that it is better than their iphone. They got stack with steve jobs talking crap about icrap technologies and now cannot bear the shock.
Keep walking, Johnnie Walker.

supergodie said:
So, the nexus one is only dualtouch and the iphone is multitouch
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Dual touch (two finger) IS multitouch. The common definition of mutitouch is more that one finger. The Iphone is rumored to use the same screen. Apple doesn't reveal it's suppliers.
* ClearPad 3000 Series—Our premium ClearPad solution provides the ultimate in touchscreen innovation and excitement with MultiTouch capabilities (up to 10 fingers simultaneously). A powerful new chip delivers 48 sensing channels and excellent power management for a differentiated user experience. Click here to see the 3000 Series demo demo with gestures like Crumple and Scratch.
* ClearPad 2000 Series—ClearPad 2000 Series—the original ClearPad solution—brings exceptional DualTouch (2-finger) touch capabilities to a wide range of handheld devices. High performance and accuracy combined with seamless gesture integration make ClearPad 2000 Series the proven touchscreen leader seen in the market.
* ClearPad 1000 Series—ClearPad 1000 makes touch capabilities available to mass-market handheld devices. This SingleTouch solution provides exceptional gesture integration and a flexible zero-border sensor design. For cost-effective touchscreen capabilities, ClearPad 1000 is the right choice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Guys I was looking the synaptic webpage and I found this :
ww.synaptics.com/about/press/press-releases/synaptics-clearpad-on-nexus-one-smartphone
Nexus one has a CLEARpad 2000 capacitive touch screen sensor, so it's dual touch , the clearpad 3000 it has support for multitouch .
So the nexus one doesn't have multitouch only has dual touch ...
I was testing the piano application from Iphone and It's recognize a lot of points on the screen , anybody know which hardware display have the iphone? .
PD: I sold my iphone 3GS and now I have a nexus one .
Sorry, my english is bad .

htcmagic said:
it is multitouch for me, and you can say what you want. Maybe you should write an article in iphone fanboy sites like engadget and gizmodo, because they would love to hear your scientific findings.
Maybe you could sell your technology to apple or microsoft.
Everyday, since the launch of Nexus, and especially after the OTA there is a scientist picking up no Nexus, because people cannot comprehend that it is better than their iphone. They got stack with steve jobs talking crap about icrap technologies and now cannot bear the shock.
Keep walking, Johnnie Walker.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well.. you obviosly don't want to understand what I am saying and if you are a happy camper with your N1 - so be it.. I will not ruin the fun for you...
But the Clearpad 2000 technology is lacking. We all know the palm wrapping problem offsetting our finger touch if we don't hold the device careful enough... root cause of this is HW and software may ease things up slightly but cannot rid of that problem (which is #1 problem with N1 screen for me).
I never owned an iPhone. I don't like anything Apple.. don't like being a fanboy either. Not for WinMo and not for Android.
I like my N1. A leap from the HD. A keeper for me. But that doesn't stop me from pointing out stuff when I see it.
All the best...

dnts said:
Well.. you obviosly don't want to understand what I am saying and if you are a happy camper with your N1 - so be it.. I will not ruin the fun for you...
But the Clearpad 2000 technology is lacking. We all know the palm wrapping problem offsetting our finger touch if we don't hold the device careful enough... root cause of this is HW and software may ease things up slightly but cannot rid of that problem (which is #1 problem with N1 screen for me).
I never owned an iPhone. I don't like anything Apple.. don't like being a fanboy either. Not for WinMo and not for Android.
I like my N1. A leap from the HD. A keeper for me. But that doesn't stop me from pointing out stuff when I see it.
All the best...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I
I for one, find this all very interesting, and from the sounds of it, this guy knows his stuff and it seems pretty factual.
People, its not exactly a bad thing the N1 doesn't have true-multitouch, it is not as if the average consumer will realize this. They will look at whatever involves two fingers as exactly what the iPhone has.
Exactly why though would we need multiple fingers on the screen, other than two? I guess for things such as piano and guitar, but I do not believe this would contribute to many other things..

balabok said:
Dual touch (two finger) IS multitouch. The common definition of mutitouch is more that one finger. The Iphone is rumored to use the same screen. Apple doesn't reveal it's suppliers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
" today announced that the Nexus One™ phone uses its ClearPad™ 2000 capacitive touchscreen sensor."
So sad to see that ... I would rather pay an extra 50 bucks for a ClearPad 3000 if 50 is enough, though so far 2 fingers response is enough for me Hope the 2000 is not the source of the touch screen problem.
Looking forward to see info about the chip that N1 uses: "T1007A, 2 0927, AMP08P"

Oh no! Can I only use two fingers with my Nexus One?
Now I must sell it and buy something better... I must use at least three fingers when using the facebook app! An playing the piano on my phone is something i wish to do every day.
Seriously guys... Even if the Nexus has single touch it beats every phone out there today imho. Stop whining what it could have been and just be happy and have some fun with it... =)

stylus on htc incredible

i heared that the incridble screen uses the max touch technology that supports stylus and fingure nails ,so has any one tried it

i heared that the incridble screen uses the max touch technology that supports stylus and fingure nails ,so has any one tried it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Does not work for me. I don't know is various parts have to be software enabled or is the screen needs to be made of certain material for that additional support. They make capacitive stylus.
Sent from my ADR6300 using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk

deekjx said:
Does not work for me. I don't know is various parts have to be software enabled or is the screen needs to be made of certain material for that additional support. They make capacitive stylus.
Sent from my ADR6300 using the XDA mobile application powered by Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
may be it does not use this new technology at all ,and the enhanced touch is only upgraded driver

It does not work with stylus. Just tried it.

hoss_n2 said:
may be it does not use this new technology at all ,and the enhanced touch is only upgraded driver
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, we definitely have the new sensor. Multi-touch is rock solid and super-responsive now, just as advertised.
EDIT: I was also wrong, after re-reading the link I posted, it does indeed indicate stylus, gloves, and fingernails -- but they don't in fact work, at least not on the Incredible. I suppose the same sensor could perhaps be used with either resistive or capacitive screens (true?), hence the fingernails/stylus being on the feature list, but not supported in our capacitive devices.

askwhy said:
No, we definitely have the new sensor. Multi-touch is rock solid and super-responsive now, just as advertised.
EDIT: I was also wrong, after re-reading the link I posted, it does indeed indicate stylus, gloves, and fingernails -- but they don't in fact work, at least not on the Incredible. I suppose the same sensor could perhaps be used with either resistive or capacitive screens (true?), hence the fingernails/stylus being on the feature list, but not supported in our capacitive devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
resistive digitizers are copmletly diffrent than capactive digitizers ,different technology ,different way of operation

Is the Incredible's touchscreen truly "revolutionary?"

One of the biggest hyped features of the Incredible is the new MaxTouch sensor. The makers boast infinite multitouch and a bunch of other advantages it has over competitors. So my question is, does the Incredible's touchscreen hold up to these claims?
Atmel claims that the MaxTouch sensor can recognize an infinite number of touches, enables the use of fingernails, gloves, and styluses. So far, people have been telling me that it can't recognize touch when you use your fingernails. What I'm more interested in finding out is the infinite multitouch.
Has anyone tried playing emulator games on the Incredible?

I read all that too. The fingernail thing is crap, although it's alot better at using the point of your finger even if you have fingernails.
that said, the DI screen is is definately a revolution over the N1 lol. I have zero missed touches and zero wierd behavior. It works exactly as advertised.
Once we have root, we can use the multitouch test to see where it's really at. It is surely a step in the right direction though, I haven't seen one bad review of the multitouch.

Yes, I haven't seen anything negative about its touch screen either. No weirdness with the screen nor the capacitive buttons... or really anything. But I'm definitely curious about the full extent of the Incredible's touchscreen's capabilities. Hmm, I also didn't realize you needed root access for emulators and stuff

I could be wrong... but isn't Android only capable of handling two points? This could be expanded upon in later releases though... if I'm even right.

I could be wrong... but isn't Android only capable of handling two points? This could be expanded upon in later releases though... if I'm even right.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
See I only see that as a software issue. Well maybe a patent issue now that patents are being granted to certain companies for this such as multitouch gestures.
-------------------------------------
Sent from HTC Incredible via XDA Tapatalk App

I think the sensor is capable of using stylus and finger nails provided the screen surface isn't glass like ours. I'm curious about more than two touches as well.
Tracking infinite touches is not exactly true. There is aof coarse a limiting factor in touch area, the ability to detect 1 touch per I think 10mm, and the ability to process those touches. This sensor is not limited to portable electronics.
On at least 2 occasions, the screen would not respond to any of my touches till turned the screen of and back on with the power button. Not sure of the cause yet.
-------------------------------------
Sent via the XDA Tapatalk App

[Q] Is the touchscreen resistive or capacitative

I've been thinking all along that Nexus 7 would have a capacitative touchscreen, like all modern quality tablets. Never did it cross my mind it could be the resistive, more crappy, kind found on many low budget Chinese tablets.
However the UBM TechInsights teardown threw off alarms on my head by showing two resistive screen controllers:
ELAN Microelectronics eKTF3624BWS – Controller for Resistive Touchscreen
ELAN Microelectronics eKTH1036BWS – Controller for the Resistive Touchscreen
Can someone already with the tablet confirm which kind it is and report back? I think a simple test is just trying to use the back of a regular pen.
If it works with the pen it's resistive, if not it's capacitative.
Thanks guys!

One thing Google DEFINITELY didn't and wouldn't skimp on is this.
Don't worry, it's a standard touch screen. Trust me, if it was resistive you'd know. The internet would be up n arms, and this tablet would NOT be successful.

Thanks elcapitaine, but after the MHL saga I'm hoping to be sure of this. The reviews have told us surprisingly very little about the the hardware side of things.
I was re-reading the Verge's review to see if they picked up anything and noticed this: "To my eyes, this is definitely a software problem, but I didn’t see similar issues on the Galaxy Nexus with Jelly Bean, so this will remain a question mark. Simply put, sometimes when you’re scrolling quickly (say, on the homescreen), the scroll will not follow your finger, and instead snap back the page to the one you were trying to move away from."
So users may be assuming that any inconsistent behaviour is down to software glitches, when in reality it's the touchscreen itself.
I'm really a bit worried about this.

i can absolutely guarantee you that it's capacitive.
if it was resistive then we would know from engadget, verge, ign, or one of any thousand blogs.

Can anyone now confirm this since it's actually out now? Saw some apple fanboy going on about how the N7 had a touch resistive screen on a blog at Engadget, but couldn't find much either way on the net. Can anyone do the pen test?
Because as much as I want the N7, a resistive touch screen would be sufficient to make suffer using this POS iPad 1 until the next go-around.

It's capacitive, this isn't 2002.
Sent from my Palm Pilot.

mmmdieselfumes said:
Can anyone now confirm this since it's actually out now? Saw some apple fanboy going on about how the N7 had a touch resistive screen on a blog at Engadget, but couldn't find much either way on the net. Can anyone do the pen test?
Because as much as I want the N7, a resistive touch screen would be sufficient to make suffer using this POS iPad 1 until the next go-around.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lmfao I don't think you know how hard resistive screens are to use.. They're **** and have crap multi touch.
OF COURSE the N7 is capacative, it'd be worthy of the garbage bin if it wasn't. Even $100 Chinese tabs are capacative these days.

Mungulz said:
Lmfao I don't think you know how hard resistive screens are to use.. They're **** and have crap multi touch.
OF COURSE the N7 is capacative, it'd be worthy of the garbage bin if it wasn't. Even $100 Chinese tabs are capacative these days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lol. I know exactly how much a pain in the ass touch resistive is, thus my disinclination to purchase the N7 IF it truly did have a touch resistive screen.
Though I admit that TR screens have come a long way since we all learned to hate them on the early palm devices. Most of our high-end drafting tables for our engineers at my company use TR screens, because there are some legitimate benefits to having a resistive screen over a capacative screen when you're drafting. But I definitely don't want one on a tablet. At least until palms new TR/TC hybrid screens start gaining traction. I think then we'll start to see some neat haptic screen techniques that weren't possible before.
But thanks for assuring me the screen is TC. Think I'll purchase my N7 now (though I'd kill for a 3G variant...).