Database Users

Very Dim Camera Flash LED after VJCandela?

Okay, I was using the camera flash from time to time as a torch and then the VJCandela app came along so I used that too. Usage maybe 2 or 3 times a week for 2-3 mins.
Now I have a very dim camera flash light, it actually looks like there is a black or brown spot in the center of the LED. I am pretty sure it is damaged, now and again it takes on a blue tinge if I test it again.
So I guess its back to O2 for warranty
regards

Vijay555 said:
This program is used to permit control of the flash light on various HTC Phones, to allow it to be used as a torch etc.
Note: this app may will cause permanent damage to your flash led over prolonged periods.
The app will disable itself after prolonged use, but still, use it at your own risk.
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I know this is of little use after the fact, but there is a warning on the site.
This is the sort of thing that HTC should have thought about when including a flash LED on the device. Do they not do QA testing? Do they care that they are getting a lot of gear back for warranty repair?
I blame their close ties with Microsoft for this, after all, MS are the masters of rushing something to market and fixing the problems with it later, are they not?
I actually use VJCandela too, so I'll be back in this thread when my flash breaks to say "ME TOO!!!1!11one!" =)

PReDiToR said:
Do they not do QA testing? Do they care that they are getting a lot of gear back for warranty repair?
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I highly agree. I guess having Billions of dollars at their disposal made them forget how hard it is to earn money. It would be nice for them to be poor before they die and experience life at the other end of the spectrum.

Guys, what kind of periods are you using it for? The latest release has a built in timer to switch itself off after 15 seconds, but even then, are you using it for long blasts or just the odd flash?
V

cktlcmd said:
PReDiToR said:
Do they not do QA testing? Do they care that they are getting a lot of gear back for warranty repair?
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I highly agree. I guess having Billions of dollars at their disposal made them forget how hard it is to earn money. It would be nice for them to be poor before they die and experience life at the other end of the spectrum.
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Hi Guys,
No disrespect meant here and really not at all knocking Vijay555, but if the flash is used in a way it was not designed to be used then yes, it'll probably fail! Vijay555 warned of this and you took the risk. And to amazingly come back to knock Microsoft about it..?!
The flash will have rating for continuous use and for pulsed use - if it's used continuously at it's pulsed rating, it will fail.
Again, not knocking anyone, but keep it in perspective guys!

bloney said:
And to amazingly come back to knock Microsoft about it..?!
!
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I don't have a problem with vijay's app nor my flash as I don't use it that much. But my comment was directed not on the flash of the Universal, but to Microsoft as an entity, seems to me they just want to do what they want rather than consider also what the consumers want.
Same here... I didn't intend to hurt anyone's feelings.

you broke your own toy
My thoughts are with bloney on this one.
You broke your own toy, and now you want to blame someone else for it. The LED wasn't built for continuous illumination, but you ventured forth anyways. if it was actually meant for that, they probably would've included a free app for it anyways. not defending M$ or HTC, but try to use some common sense before you get over-enthusiastic about your expensive toys. It already does alot more than other expensive phones, without the gimmicky hacks, at a relatively good price (for me anyways). and because opportunities for good things to come cheaply for me is valuable, I try to treat it as such. You probably should too, instead of complaining here.

daryl425 - I don't think anyone's blaming anyone else here (I hope ), but IMHO there are two competing ways of looking at VJCandela and similar hacks:
1. They're all unsupported by the Manufacturer and OS designer. There may be a good reason for that, so play it safe, and don't risk your system with unsupported/unofficial products; or
2. Live on the edge, unlock, reflash, use and abuse your hardware to get the most out of it. There will be casualties of war - expect it.
I think most of us are wise enough to use our own common sense and live somewhere between the two extremes. If the Universal had cost me $1000, I wouldn't be using it as a $0.50 flash light, risking my hardware.
I wrote the app, for the fun of writing the app. I don't use my Universal as my main phone, so I can "afford" some minor damage to it in the pursuit of art. But, I strongly advise everyone else to use their own sense, and not sit on the flash for 30 minutes, or do anything else that might risk their precious hardware. Frankly, I hardly use the app at all. However, on the odd occassion that I do, it's come in handy. And it warms my geek heart every time :wink:
So, use caution. But remember, every single piece of software you use that isn't official (and a hell of a lot of those that are) could damage your system. Be careful!
But - don't forget to have fun as well. Think how much innovation has come out of this board and guys prepared to push their systems beyond the limit (ie Buzz et al. I don't consider myself within that heady band. I'm just a tinkling tinkerer).
V

hey guys,
its not such a big deal if you burn your flash! I just went to the local camera store (not the digital ones, the age old film based cams store) and found a flash led with almost the same size and rating. I opened up my device (just once again!), took the "dimmed out" led and replaced it. Of course, i got the connector pin from my previous flash led and used the same one. Now it works fine, and i guess the quality of this led is much better.
cheers,
San

To clear up:
I haven't blown my flash (yet). I rarely use it.
I mentioned MS in a disparaging manner because they have a history of releasing products without actually making sure they are ready to go to market (hence all the ServicePacks and patches), and this seems to be what HTC did with this LED. MS works very closely with HTC and I made a joke about the behaviour pattern being contagious.
Whilst I agree that this unofficial hack is intended to utilise the LED in a way that it was not designed for, which idiot sat in his/her lab at HTC and decided that nobody would ever send their PDA in for a warranty repair because of it? Surely this is the kind of thing that bean counters go nuts over? To put an LED that is a little more reliable would have added a penny to the manufacture, as opposed to spending pounds on postage, labour, parts, time, customer support and so forth.
If it can be done, it will be done. Surely this burning out will happen with normal usage too? How many people use the flash on their mobile to read with in bed, find something in the car, blind their friends as a joke? This is nothing to do with Vijay's app, it is a bad choice of materials, costing HTC money and reputation.
I hope this clears up my thoughts when I posted earlier in the thread, and if not, just put it down to too much Slashdot reading =)

PReDiToR - I entirely agree. Although, should a hypothetical guy on the Clapham Omnibus feel the need to trade in his Universal for a newer one, it might be a convenient way to make a warranty claim...
I've never known LEDs to blow unless wired incorrectly. Of course, as stated, it was only designed for bursts, but even so, as you say, LEDs costs pennies, the Universal doesn't. Hopefully, that won't be our loss, and get them to think about the economics of such components in future.
V

vijay555 said:
PReDiToR - I entirely agree. Although, should a hypothetical guy on the Clapham Omnibus feel the need to trade in his Universal for a newer one, it might be a convenient way to make a warranty claim...
I've never known LEDs to blow unless wired incorrectly. Of course, as stated, it was only designed for bursts, but even so, as you say, LEDs costs pennies, the Universal doesn't. Hopefully, that won't be our loss, and get them to think about the economics of such components in future.
V
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Hello again Guys,
Not wanting to drag this on or to disagree with you Guys, but I've been looking at some LEDs at work (eg http://www.luxeon.com/pdfs/DS49.pdf) for use in a LED strobe and there's a whole load of LEDs out specifically designed for use as a flash.
So, assuming a purpose built flash LED is used in our HTC devices, it's not a matter of an inferior components being selected, but rather an entirely appropriate component that is designed for a very specific task.
From the data sheet, it states that for flash applications the maximum current (up to 1A) should be used. But for continuous operation 350mA max.
All LEDs have a finite lifetime and trebling the max rated current will obviously cause the component to fail pretty quickly!
Obviously the LED I've looked at probably isn't the one in the HTC units (could be though!), but hopefully shows that HTC might not have just been skimping on the flash!
Having said all that, I most commonly use my flash as a torch, so it's good to know it's replacable!
Hope this is of interest - it isn't meant to be not picking!
Bloney

I certainly wasn't complaining about Vijay's app
I was just pointing out my led is now knackered, lol
Keep up the good work Vijay.
Regards, Simon

No flaming of freeware and shareware
Hi Vijay.
I certainly don't remember a flashlight feature on any adverts for my MDA Pro. Once again, it's good to innovate, but users really can't blame you/HTC/MS/etc. only themselves for this. This is just like the classic CPU overclock situation, you can rev it up, but most people advise to watch out for any burning smoke if you push the pedal too hard
No one here is blaming you or your app, me certainly least of all. My point, just like bloney, is that before someone screams and shouts and cursing out other people, they should really take a look at themselves first. Although most shareware developers usually leave the standard "Use at your own risk" sign on their apps. Something else users should remember.
But then again, if they're screaming and shouting and cursing other people out, they might not be all that good to look at in the first place

Out of interest though??? I know you can leave the flash on whilst using the camera app, I used to use mine this way before. But does the flash timeout on it's own? Also is the flash actually brighter when using Vjcandela as opposed to the camera app? I never noticed it being any different?
Just wondering if I could have done exactly the same thing with just using the camera app over time? After all it does not work like a flash in a traditional sense.
As I said before, keep up the good work Vijay
Regards, Simon

Guys, I think I've said everything that needs to be said on this thread in terms of why we write and use "cutting edge" apps, and risk "bleeding"
Simon: the current version (on my website and XDA forums) has a 15 second timeout I think. This can be overridden, but the override also has a timeout, so it shouldn't be possible to sit on it for toooo long now :idea:
The flash is enabled at normal brightness as used in the Camera app. It can go even brighter, but in the circumstances, it's probably not advisable, eh?!
As bloney says, I think the LED is probably rated differently for burst vs sustained current, so hopefully the camera app wouldn't normally burn out the led. But I suppose we'll find out over time with those using the camera app a lot?
V

My advise don't go for it - you'll regret it.

Greetings,
I am from germany and new on this forum, though I keep peeking in here for quite some time now and today is the time, where I believe I should post my very own impressions about the HTC Prophet.
I was using my old S25 (Siemens) cell for nearly 6 years now and since today I was quite happy about it. It was functional, worked, never let me hung and still works fine (I only changed the service provider to go for the HTC Prophet and let the contract for it run out).
At my new job I met a bunch of people who had that HTC Magician. They primarily bought it for the same reasons as most of us. It was a small device, had PocketPC capabilities, you could listen to sound files, watch movies, navigation, phoning and keeping contacts.
Sadly my reality looks quite differently than I initially had in mind. After some real life scenarios I realized that going for this smartphone was a big and really expensive mistake and I start to regret it now.
I also have a good history of PDA's and PocketPC's (Palm, Casio E125 etc.).
Problems that I have with the HTC Prophet (That I initially never thought about).
Speaker on the back side is the most supid thing that I ever have seen. Sure once you see these little machines you don't think about any problems that it might have.
You get it demonstrated by your colleagues and you see that it's an awesome device (on the first looks). But that thing is simply too silent. Sure loudness is quite a subjective thing and everyone of us hear differently.
But the HTC Prophet with its speaker on the back side is silent. In real life scenarios that thing is either laying on the table (where the speaker will be hidden by the table plate) or laying on a book or on a surface that keeps hiding the speaker. Or you keep carrying it around in that belt case that you receive with that thing. It's too silent.
I was on a trade show not long ago and I kept carrying that thing in that black belt case around my belt. With a smoking jacket around it. The trade show was well visited and therefore quite noisy (not loud but similar as if you go into the mensa at university). The thing is I kept missing one call after another, needless to say that I missed all SMS or schedules that my kalendar kept. I started to look at it at random times only to notices whether I missed something or if new SMS arrived.
A coleague of mine had another smartphone WM5 device carrying around with him, that thing otoh was quite loud. It yelled around that even I could realize it even meters ahead. Also the speaker, microphone and earspeaker was quite boosted.
Then at night during that few days trade show I slept in a motel where I used that device as a alarm clock. It was silent. Luckely I had a quite nervous sleep so I was able to wake up correctly in the morning but the alarm was quite silent. You've been able to hear it but not if you had a well sleep.
Earphone and Microphone. I have big issues listening to the person on the other end and the person has issues listening to my voice and the normal conversation goes on in multiple "pardon can you repeat" sentences. Specailly if you leave the office to go outside on the street for talk (so your colleagues don't need to follow your private conversation) it's even worse. I need to stick a finger in my other ear only to hear the person on the other end.
I think this is quite inacceptable for a device that is sold primary as "phone". I must say that I have the original rom on it, it's as I received it from this german company with the one letter and one number. With all the junk and stuff on it. Nothing touched, it's maximum loud, nothing flashed - as is.
Now a few days ago I went to another colleague of mine and compared his HTC Magician with my HTC Prophet. We set the devices to maximum loudness and played this "alouette.mid" file at the same time. His HTC Magician was drowning my HTC Prophet in all aspects. It was noticable louder than my HTC Prophet. It had better speakers and microphone. Sure it has the speaker on the backside as well but both devices were on the table head at head and his one nearly lifted off of the table while mine was silently sitting there playing "alouette.mid".
I mean, my old Siemens S25 was loud, I was able to hear it even outside of the office room on the floor, or in the kitchen (to jump back to it to pick it up) but this thing (the HTC Prophet) can't be left out of sight. If you move away more than a few meters in a silent office building then you keep missing everything.
I really don't know how this thing can be sold as phone. It misses any quality assurance during manufacturing. From that stupid backside speaker till any real life scenarios. It's more or less a play toy for geeks but rarely something for people doing business or need to keep schedules.
Otherwise that device is quite ok. Sure it has a slow CPU (yes it is slow. There was a few articles I read where people keep saying that it's not slow and that everyone who tells that it's slow are ignorants or something) but take my word. It's slow but it's ok for a phone. It's not the biggest problem since it works smoothly enough as PocketPC for adresses etc.
I started to dig around on many forums after I realized some of the problems on my own and realized that a lot of people complained about silent speakers and microphones and I must confirm this. There are many other problems with that device as well like speaker breaking quickly or the pluging jack for the headphones. I can not confirm this but I bet my pants that these issues are there for real.
I also realized (like on most forums) that people seem to be doing nothing else with it than flashing random XYZ kind of roms onto it in hope something changes (what, most people don't know either - so my impressions - and a few seem to have bricked their devices as well). But can this be ? Can this be the purpose of this device ? To flash it because it sucks in all other aspects ? People who hope to get a new rom version with news inside it, other people who hope that it boots faster (works faster) or whatever their aim is.
But for business people who only want to use the device to keep their contacts, get in touch with people, receive notices and keep schedules it's just a waste.
I started complaining to the new service provider and hope that they're going to replace that device with something that works. No play toy or something. I changed from my old service provider to the new one only for this smartphone and now I regret it. They already informed me that they are going to take it back and fine me what I have paid for it but this is not solving the problem. The problem is that I am stuck with a new contract and no phone to use or no suitable alternative to go. But taking it back without any complaints is just a sign that they might have received plenty of complaints from others.
Anyways that's so far all I have to say. I was new here before I bought the HTC Prophet and I really hope that my little review could help the one or other in making his decisions. Before you blindly jump in buying this HTC Prophet be sure that you go and inform yourself on all kind of forums and news sites. The HTC Prophet is a nice machine - no doubt - but it's useless in a couple of areas and one of them is phoning and getting notices (speaker). This is a big no go for me.
greetings,
Spatzm

I really like my Prophet.
Yes the rear speaker is a problem but it's the only problem. Just wait till it stops working completely. There is a workaround for this. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=281331
Also, yes it was a bit slow but a helpful chap called Ikarus produced an excellent overclock utility which has really helped. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=270751
I will upgrade when the time comes though - maybe a Hermes or an Artemis.

I wrote quite a long post to explain in detail why I seem to disagree with you on almost every point you try to make. But I'd rather keep it short. (and I don't mean this in a nasty way, my experience is just totally different than your 'review')
Speaker: no problem at all for me. I mainly use it in loud areas. Also use it as alarm clock too and it's loud enough (believe me when I say I'm not a light sleeper). I do however use PocketZenPhone for my phone profiles (volume, call volume, ringtone stuff etc etc) and SPB Time (alarm clock).
Upgrading: Have a look on what forum you are here. Most people come here because they seem interested in upgrading the thing with a rom. For possible free extra's. Who doesn't want to have free extra's? (hell, why do people upgrade their computer, their software, their bios? Because it's all crap? I don't think so at all).
There are loads of phones on this forum, from your perspective they are all crap because people are trying to upgrade them? And yes, upgrading is difficult at times and if you do it wrong, you brick your device. Can't blame HTC for those people pusing the upgrade button...
But all with all, I'm sorry to see you are so dissapointed in your Prophet phone. Perhaps the thing just isn't your thing. And it doesn't meet up to your expectations.
For me the thing lived up all too good to my expectations and even more than that.
For me it's loud enough (maybe with the help of some programs I don't care) it's fast enough and even though I have been 100% happy with it all along I even upgraded it with a newer ROM.
I use it for phoning/smsing, calendar/appointments, adresses, car-navigation, games, watching movies, wireless internet etc. etc. and that all works flawlesly for me...

TheBrit said:
I really like my Prophet.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=281331
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=270751
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Thanks for providing these links. I'm a technican myself and am used to many pocketpc's and pda's back in the years. I also did development for those devices so I am skilled enough to know what to do.
But the primary point of mine is differently. My workday looks like this. Starting morning at 7:00 and come back at home around 20:30. A lot of traveling from A to B. Basicly a fulltime job. Now you might imagine that business people don't want to play around with their PDA.
They simply don't have time to do so. They expect that the device they bought "simply works". The terminoloy "simply works" means. You turn it on and you start working with it. There is no time and also no intentions to mess around with the hardware. Like opening it and fix what HTC had failed to solve on their own.
I am also aware of the overclocking utilities that exists but this can't be the point either. But as I said it's probably the last problem that I care for now.
I think that HTC miserabely failed with their products due to bad engineering and bad QS. I only hope that some of their engineers are reading this forum so they can think about the stuff they build.

Re My advise don't go for it - you'll regret it.
RaptorRVL said:
I wrote quite a long post to explain in detail why I seem to disagree with you on almost every point you try to make. But I'd rather keep it short. (and I don't mean this in a nasty way, my experience is just totally different than your 'review')
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Hello RaptorRVL, thanks for your reply. I really appreciate your feedback and I would like to raise a few further points to explain the situation.
First of all, not everyone is a technican. Most people don't know about Registry, they don't know about OmapClock, they also don't know howto flash ROM, they also don't know what AKU is.
They simply want to use the thing they paid money for. I have the feeling that you see everything as the expert kind of person that fully controls his device in all areas like knowing every DLL, knowing every Registry entry, knowing the hardware and much more. But you shouldn't forget those who bought a small device and who wants to use it. We are simply too busy with work rather than having all the time digging in all places to seek for answers where HTC has failed.
Speaker: no problem at all for me. I mainly use it in loud areas.
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But the speaker seems to be a problem by many other people. You only need to fire up Google and search for "HTC Prophet loud" or similar keywords. You can hear a lot of complaints about silent speakers, broken speakers, silent microphone or earphone, broken headphone jacks etc. You can even use search on the whole forum here and find similar complaints by others. I must admit that this is something I initially wasn't aware about but I wished someone would have told me before I was going for it.
And that's why I am here writing my second message on this forum to inform those new readers here who use this forum as a starting point to read about the pros and cons about the HTC Prophet.
Upgrading: Have a look on what forum you are here. Most people come here because they seem interested in upgrading the thing with a rom. For possible free extra's. Who doesn't want to have free extra's? (hell, why do people upgrade their computer, their software, their bios? Because it's all crap? I don't think so at all).
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Yes I am in the forum for general Prophet discussions. The one for Prophet upgrading is one further. This was also one of the first places that I came to before I bought my Prophet to inform myself about it from those who are already using it.
There are loads of phones on this forum, from your perspective they are all crap because people are trying to upgrade them? And yes, upgrading is difficult at times and if you do it wrong, you brick your device. Can't blame HTC for those people pusing the upgrade button...
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No! I was only refering to my HTC Prophet here which I had the chance to compare in real life scenarios on that trade show (noisy area), within the motel (as alarm clock), with the colleagues HTC Magician and with another colleagues HTC (dunno what it was called, it has a knob in the middle and looks more like a real phone).
I don't know whether other devices have similar issues but I think that HTC needs to get in here and do something. You only need to google for all the problems it have. There are plenty of forums existing outside and the more people buy one of these devices the more "similar" problem reports you receive.
If one person complains then this is probably a one time issue but if plenty of people start complaining about the same issues then there's something where HTC needs to fix.
You are right that you can not blame HTC for a bricked Prophet, but you can't blame the users either since they expect that a new updated ROM might solve the one or other problem they noticed.
But all with all, I'm sorry to see you are so dissapointed in your Prophet phone. Perhaps the thing just isn't your thing. And it doesn't meet up to your expectations.
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And here lays the problem. I can not know whether this device dissapoints me or not without having tried it out first. I didn't knew about all the hardware related issues. I also didn't put any weight into other peoples complaints for silent speakers and realize now that I better did pay attentions to it since it really is a huge problem.
Look I and probably others didn't buy it for playing or toying around with it (Random today screen tweaking, overclocking and rom flashing) we bought it for our serious daily needs. As sort of companion that helps doing our daily tasks, keeping schedules and do the thing it has to do. Inform us where our brain leaves us alone since we can not remember everything. Of course the OS side of it does the job but the hardware side is failing here due to weak components used.

I didn't read every word of every post, but I don't think you state which version of the Prophet you have. That said I have the Jamin with their latest ROM. I have no reason to play with other ROMs. Reliability is important for my usage.
To be honest I DON'T have the majority of the issues you seem to have. Specifically the front speaker is so loud that I have to set the volume to 50% to prevent hurting my hearing on normal phone calls. With respect to the rear speaker the volume is more that sufficient to use as an alarm clock.
The major issue that I have is the CPU performance in stock form is only just adequate. But remember static high clock rates translate into low battery endurance. I'm using Battery Status to perform automatic clock rate scaling and battery life is good or better than stock, while CPU performance is very good.
From reading I'm of the opinion that not all Prophets are created equal, but might be made so by flashing an alternative ROM.
Spatzm said:
Greetings,
I am from germany and new on this forum, though I keep peeking in here for quite some time now and today is the time, where I believe I should post my very own impressions about the HTC Prophet.
[snip]
greetings,
Spatzm
Click to expand...
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but I don't think you state which version of the Prophet you have. That said I have the Jamin with their latest ROM. I have no reason to play with other ROMs. Reliability is important for my usage.
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Normally I would write something like "The user don't know anything about Prophet versions - he/she only uses it". But I have an XDA NEO - G4 and this one doesn't have a front speaker (only a really silent ear speaker).
To be honest I DON'T have the majority of the issues you seem to have.
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I have only one issue with it and not "majority" (which implies dozens of issues). The only issue I have is the weak components used for speaker, ear speaker and microphone.
From reading I'm of the opinion that not all Prophets are created equal, but might be made so by flashing an alternative ROM.
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Yes I have the impression myself now. But that shouldn't be the problem of the end users or customers. That's the big problem of HTC for implementing some sort of quality assurance.
I also doubt that flashing an alternative ROM (there is no official alternative ROM that guarantee fully functionality (but more on this later on) that will solve a hardware issue. Flashing a new ROM don't change the position of the speaker from the back side to the front side.
I also think you should start reading my replies more carefully to understand that not everyone has the time or the geek factor to flash "or want to flash" his Prophet to use it.

By front speaker I mean the speaker that used when the phone is on your ear.
I would comment that the Prophet is a platform and Jamin, XDA Neo, etc are products. In fact the user shouldn't even know or be concerned with the underlying platform. He should buy based upon the end user product's features and performance. Note that HTC doesn't necessary have to manufacture each product to identical specifications. And I say this from a OEM's perspective.
With regard to flashing various firmware and debugging a product one purchased, I only can agree with your position. My only point is that what issues you have doesn't necessary apply to all versions of the Prophet.
Dopod released a patch to increase volume. If your product doesn't have this fix (e.g. running the most current firmware) then I would be thinking about getting my money back or Ebay it if that is not possible.
Spatzm said:
Normally I would write something like "The user don't know anything about Prophet versions - he/she only uses it". But I have an XDA NEO - G4 and this one doesn't have a front speaker (only a really silent ear speaker).
I also think you should start reading my replies more carefully to understand that not everyone has the time or the geek factor to flash "or want to flash" his Prophet to use it.
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Silent but loud, slow but fast ?!
I share all comments claiming weakness of Prophet speakers and slowness of its processor and i'd read too much about these before buying one.
Anyways, many claims about the OMAP come from users who did not overclock. At 286mhz the baby is fast enough for me and no serious standby time shortening.
Coming to the speakers, using the oldphone ring, i find it loud enough. Of course there's always individual tastes and feelings. Mines are not so negative.
Finally, don't forget to set sound level to maximum for alarms and disable program sounds. This prevents boring sounds when you use menus.

slow or fast its in your hands only
well in my eyes , i had took the S200 (qtek) or whtever name he have, as base for smartphone app. for security usage. like you i had to choose between the stability , quality and speed. the hardware base had all i need, battery and SD, wifi and BT, and all very steady. yes speed stunt me slow at begining, but with the help of jesterz and one of his coocked Roms, i got it fatser, and for the final battery status gave me real overclock of 247-260 which is more than i need. when i load it with streamin video (mpg-2) no it dose not gag nor crash nor hang. thats more than i had with HP/ASUS/ etc pda on the same level. have more trust in your littel device. remember rule 1.
garbadge in-garbadge out. set it correctly and you'll have only fun.

Not loud enough to wake up?
Although the sound quality is not the best I found my old JAMin loud and strong as an alarm, especially with the LB sound file. In fact I am using the same file on my new SE P990i. I sold the JAMin as a trade-in and bought a P990i a month ago and although I am very happy with the new phone as it improves in all areas where I found the Prophet not so good (built-in support for A2DP, camera, sound quality and so on), sometimes I miss my old phone. What I don't miss though is the SCREEN ALIGNMENT PROBLEM. I am amazed how well the touch screen on the P990i works and how it even lacks an Align Screen function.

abubasim said:
Although the sound quality is not the best I found my old JAMin loud and strong as an alarm, especially with the LB sound file.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know what a LB sound file is. May you post it please ?
What I don't miss though is the SCREEN ALIGNMENT PROBLEM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I never had a Screen Alignment problem with my HTC Prophet but I keep reading about these issues on plenty of other news sites and forums.
So to sum it up these are the most known hardware related problems that come along with the HTC Prophet.
* Backside speaker useless and totally misplaced if the phone is placed on the table.
* Ear speaker quite silent, if you are in a noisy area or street then you need to plug a finger in the other ear to hear the other participant clearly.
* Microphone quite silent, the other part is permanently asking to repeat what's said.
* Headphone plug is causing problems when unpluging there's no sound sometimes (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
* Backside speaker is dying at times (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
* Backside speaker is applied at the backside.
* Misalignment of the touchscreen (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
* Battery life ends with 28% and needs recharging (I have the same problem. The device needs to be recharged).
These are the common problems, that I came along so far. Windows Mobile itself is operating normally so far, but the hardware is causing problems. Every company with name by now would have started a call back to replace the faulty systems. My next device will be from an manufacturer with name, who has skills in doing proper devices - no no-name branding.

* Backside speaker useless and totally misplaced if the phone is placed on the table.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not much of a problem for me.
* Ear speaker quite silent, if you are in a noisy area or street then you need to plug a finger in the other ear to hear the other participant clearly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not a problem for me.
* Microphone quite silent, the other part is permanently asking to repeat what's said.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not a problem for me.
* Headphone plug is causing problems when unpluging there's no sound sometimes (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
NOt a problem for me.
* Backside speaker is dying at times (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes this has happened to me twice not. First time it went for a repair - second time I used a workaround - see my first post in this thread. Has anyone had this on a G4 - maybe it's fixed in that version.
* Backside speaker is applied at the backside.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Same as first issue on this list.
* Misalignment of the touchscreen (not confirmed by me but found on various places).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not been a problem for me.
* Battery life ends with 28% and needs recharging (I have the same problem. The device needs to be recharged).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not been a problem for me.

I'm sure some people have problems with the phone, which is in fact not really surprising because it's a stuffed up little machine with lots of sensitive electronics in it (made as cheap as possible to position it in the market for a certain price obviously).
But I must say that when looking at forums and people with problems there, you might not get a good idea of what's really going on with a device.
Forums are usually filled with questions and complaints instead of people searching for the forums to say "Hey! My device is working just properly! cheerios!".
It would be much more interesting to know how many devices have been sold and what % of those had faults/problems. Mind you, the prophet is sold world-wide and is a very popular device, which would increase the number of people with complaints on a forum considerably.
I wouldn't exactly call HTC a no-name manufacturer too. It's just that they are not well known because they have always made their hardware for other companies who put on their own brand and name on the device. Yet still it is a HTC product.
I haven't had a single problem with my device and know a lot of people who don't have problems with the thing too. I know someone who works in a store selling them and he says they don't see loads of the devices coming back with the complaints/problems you write.
For example, I have none of the problems you list up there. If the phones would have been so bad, don't you think I should at least have one of the problems here? Or do you think I'm the exception of having a error free phone and faulty devices are the standard?
So perhaps a somewhat more subtle approach on the subject might not hurt. I could be reading you the wrong way, but it almost seems like because of your dissapointment of your device you are on a small crusade stating the prophet is a very bad device. A device that only works for geeks with too much time on their hands changing roms, editting the registry and repairing the device themselves.
Which is, ofcourse, not the case at all.

TheBrit said:
Not much of a problem for me.
Not a problem for me.
Not a problem for me.
NOt a problem for me.
Same as first issue on this list.
Not been a problem for me.
Not been a problem for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but it has been a problem for many others. It's as simple as that. If there are a few geeks really happy with it then be it that way. This thing simply isn't the right device for serious people who simply want to do their work. It's that simple.

LB.wav
Spatzm said:
I don't know what a LB sound file is. May you post it please ?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you the open the Clock settings and choose the Alarms tab then you can choose the sound file to be played by tapping the bell icon. LB is one of the provided sound files. In case it's missing on your phone then here it is.

Spatzm said:
Yes, but it has been a problem for many others. It's as simple as that. If there are a few geeks really happy with it then be it that way. This thing simply isn't the right device for serious people who simply want to do their work. It's that simple.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What is quite funny is the fact that you just called everyone who likes their device (or do not agree with you) a geek and apperantly not a serious person.
Like I said in my other post, it might not be a bad idea to take a somewhat more subtle approach to the whole subject, instead of just reading the forums fast and sum up the first 8 problems you come across and state them as facts.

RaptorRVL said:
What is quite funny is the fact that you just called everyone who likes their device (or do not agree with you) a geek and apperantly not a serious person.
Like I said in my other post, it might not be a bad idea to take a somewhat more subtle approach to the whole subject, instead of just reading the forums fast and sum up the first 8 problems you come across and state them as facts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hello,
This wasn't meant as insult or offense. I was just quite fed up with the device when I replied. The thing is that everyone has a right to like his / her device.
For my personal impression this thing is more a geeks toy rather than something for people like me who are deep into all kind of works and need a serious companion.
One that doesn't need tweaking, fixing or worrying. Something that simply works and does its tasks. I depend on connections with other people, it's my work, my business. I can not offend people by telling them to repeat themselves 20 times just because my cell is failing.
No problems with that but we also need to keep an eye on those people who have serious issues with it and the list is getting longer.
You said (or wrote) that people do not agree with me but I already received replies within this thread from people who confirmed parts of the issues raised.
I think it's just fair to light both sides of the medal. It's not fair to only hype this device and ignore or speak all issues it has to death.
So, just because YOUR Prophet is fine, doesn't mean that other peoples Prophet is as well. You are just the lucky one or your service provider bought working branches rather than getting the monday devices.
I don't ask for much and simply hope that some people from HTC are spending some time reading the contents of this forum and get uphold of these issues.
Thailand and probably most other asian countries are known to not supply the same quality standards that europe requires or that we are used too.
Just my opinion and I believe that I speak many people out of their heart here.

Spatzm said:
So, just because YOUR Prophet is fine, doesn't mean that other peoples Prophet is as well. You are just the lucky one or your service provider bought working branches rather than getting the monday devices.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, we can turn this around and talk about how your device is the bad one and how that doesn't mean all the others suck too. I just don't think this is very productive. You don't like it, but others like it.
I for one am very happy with my Prophet, and guess what: I am from Germany too and I also got my phone from o2. I never had to change ROMs or overclock the processor. The only "geek" thing I've done is to abort the installation of the extended ROM.
My device is working just fine and I've never had any problems. No broken speaker, battery working fine, no screen alignment problems. It's fast, it's smooth, it's loud.
And oh yeah (and I really don't mean this in a smartass way), if I'm in a loud environment and can't hear the phone, the vibration massaging my leg lets me know someone is calling. Not a solution for the earpiece problem but at least for the incoming SMS and organizer alarms.
Well, to sum it up: you're not happy, others are. Simple as that. I don't know if it's very smart to keep discussing this.

RaptorRVL said:
What is quite funny is the fact that you just called everyone who likes their device (or do not agree with you) a geek and apperantly not a serious person.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So...I'm a Geek!
I'm also a serious user. I use the Diary, Contacts, phone, TomTom etc etc. Bubble-Breaker when on the t.....never mind. Syncing the Diary and Contacts with both my home PC and my work PC a great bonus - so simple and so very useful.

[DISCUSSION] Risks of Android on HD2!

Just a normal man thinking in a high voice!
Ok so i had a touch screen failure of my HD2 during usage of Android build; maybe it's a coincidence maybe not! But what annoys me is that i was preserving it nearly intact: never fell, no water, no heat, no cold, no underclocking or overclocking (except that smartass governor dims cpu to minimum by default when screen is off)
Fixed it in the end and cost me nearly 1/4 the price of the phone (120$)!
So let's face it! HD2 was DESIGNED for Winmo 6.5 and not for android! And please nobody try to convince me that it doesn't have any side effects!
Well, it's like using diesel oil for a regular gasoline car! There has to be some disorders! Or using a BMW engine on a Peugeot! Maybe the chassis will handle it but not the cooling system or the clutch or the wheels or etc....
So let's begin with some of the concerns that i think of and excuse me if some questions look silly, i'm neither a technician nor a developer! (i know many of them have some basic answers, but here i'm questioning even these answers):
1-About touch screen:
Well HD2 screen is capable of 128k colors if i remember good while android GENERATES or produce 16M colors; couldn't that have affected the pixels of the screen itself?! Couldn't that be warming these pixels to higher rates than normal rates that this screen can withstand?! Maybe the system is obliging in a way or another the pixels to display those colors while they can't physically so the are failing at the end?!
(I simulate it to overclocking of the CPU: making the CPU run at higher speeds than the original ones that it was designed to work under will make it fail in the end after some time)
(and please don't tell me this has nothing to do with the OS, bcz let's not forget that the screen was limited to 65k colors in winmo while it is capable of 128k colors, so OS does matter)
2-About CPU/battery/cell temperature:
I couldn't separate those 3 characteristics coz they are highly related! (and even related to the screen )
If we overclock ==> cell temp increase
If we underclock ==> cell temp decrease
And both are bad logically for the phone, because simply those smart engineers at HTC that designed the phone knew what were they doing; that's why they kept CPU out of reach of children p us) because it will regulates the temp of the cell phone automatically to optimal values!
Anyway, who said that optimal values for normal HD2 (winmo) with it's 64or128k colors screen are the same optimal values for an android phone with it's 16M colors screen!?
So my touchscreen failed suddenly while in android, couldn't the smartass governor was the reason behind it bcz it dropped the cell phone temp to less than 26deg in idle and something in the screen failed/broke?!?
What about the cooling system/ventilation in the phone?!?!
Maybe because of its high power consumption (thus temperature) an android phone is designed to ventilate/cool the system in a manner that a winmo can't do like our beloved HD2!?! Maybe that's why our phones gets so hot during heavy use!?
Many other questions come to my mind...Just wanted to discuss some points, and evidently many other points that you will share to see if using android on our beloved HD2 is safe after all or not...
Cheers

I've read about your touchscreen failure in another thread, and while I'm very sorry for you, how can you be sure it's because of Android? I'm not saying it's not possible, but just running an OS during a failure doesn't mean the OS caused it, I can imagine some people have had touchscreen failures on WinMo too.
Just trying to keep things a little in perspective here.
1. The screen is capable of 16M colors (not 128k). WinMo only supports 65k, and I believe Android does at this point too. Pixels are unrelated to the touch sensitive part anyway.
2. Overclocking can indeed have serious consequences for your CPU (and possible surrounding parts too), and should *always* be done with caution (better to refrain from it at all actually, the small performance gain isn't worth it). I believe all kernel devs indicate the possible and imminent danger of overclocking.
Underclocking can't be a problem though, that's obvious. Extreme cooling can destroy parts, but heating it up less than usual is still not at all the same as cooling something down.
Again, I'm sorry for what happened to your phone, but I think you're somewhat overreacting.
Edit: a more likely explanation for an Android-related failure would be that your CPU somehow went insane and produced too high temperatures, breaking stuff down. This isn't typical behaviour though, and can almost always be prevented.

Life Engineer said:
Just a normal man thinking in a high voice!
Ok so i had a touch screen failure of my HD2 during usage of Android build; maybe it's a coincidence maybe not! But what annoys me is that i was preserving it nearly intact: never fell, no water, no heat, no cold, no underclocking or overclocking (except that smartass governor dims cpu to minimum by default when screen is off)
So let's face it! HD2 was DESIGNED for Winmo 6.5 and not for android! And please nobody try to convince me that it doesn't have any side effects!
Well, it's like using diesel oil for a regular gasoline car! There has to be some disorders! Or using a BMW engine on a Peugeot! Maybe the chassis will handle it but not the cooling system or the clutch or the wheels or etc....
So let's begin with some of the concerns that i think of and excuse me if some questions look silly, i'm neither a technician nor a developer! (i know many of them have some basic answers, but here i'm questioning even these answers):
1-About touch screen:
Well HD2 screen is capable of 128k colors if i remember good while android GENERATES or produce 16M colors; couldn't that have affected the pixels of the screen itself?! Couldn't that be warming these pixels to higher rates than normal rates that this screen can withstand?! Maybe the system is obliging in a way or another the pixels to display those colors while they can't physically so the are failing at the end?!
(I simulate it to overclocking of the CPU: making the CPU run at higher speeds than the original ones that it was designed to work under will make it fail in the end after some time)
(and please don't tell me this has nothing to do with the OS, bcz let's not forget that the screen was limited to 65k colors in winmo while it is capable of 128k colors, so OS does matter)
2-About CPU/battery/cell temperature:
I couldn't separate those 3 characteristics coz they are highly related! (and even related to the screen )
If we overclock ==> cell temp increase
If we underclock ==> cell temp decrease
And both are bad logically for the phone, because simply those smart engineers at HTC that designed the phone knew what were they doing; that's why they kept CPU out of reach of children p us) because it will regulates the temp of the cell phone automatically to optimal values!
Anyway, who said that optimal values for normal HD2 (winmo) with it's 64or128k colors screen are the same optimal values for an android phone with it's 16M colors screen!?
So my touchscreen failed suddenly while in android, couldn't the smartass governor was the reason behind it bcz it dropped the cell phone temp to less than 26deg in idle and something in the screen failed/broke?!?
What about the cooling system/ventilation in the phone?!?!
Maybe because of its high power consumption (thus temperature) an android phone is designed to ventilate/cool the system in a manner that a winmo can't do like our beloved HD2!?! Maybe that's why our phones gets so hot during heavy use!?
Many other questions come to my mind...Just wanted to discuss some points, and evidently many other points that you will share to see if using android on our beloved HD2 is safe after all or not...
Cheers
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The "TOUCH SCREEN" has nothing to do with the CPU, therefore no amount of overclocking will damage your "touch screen".
Has your pc monitor ever got damaged by overclocking your pc's cpu? NO
Just because your screen stopped working in Android doesn't mean that it was caused by Android.
The GPU driver would limit Android or any other OS from forcing 16m colours on a 128k screen therefore no damage would be caused to the screen itself because it is limited by the driver. The driver tells Android (or any other OS) which resolution and colour depth is supported and will only support that. Just because Android is capable of 16m doesn't mean it will force that colour depth.
This was simply a manufacturing defect in your screen and could have happened at any time, it could have happened in WinMo but just happened to happen while your phone was booted into Android.
Also be aware that the screen is TFT, and there is a separate layer called the digitizer above the actual TFT screen which senses the touch. They are separate components, therefore the screen itself isn't a touch screen.

if devs or experience users can post wats the maximum temp and ma a hd2 device could take that would realy help us alot to see if a built is working normaly or pushing our hardware excessively..mayb juz a gauge like say over 36 degress is a risk or sumting like that..info like this will realy help us users

Stop overreacting, its just a hardware failure, just get it fixed and youre good to go.

derycklong said:
Stop overreacting, its just a hardware failure, just get it fixed and youre good to go.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Man no one is overreacting! I fixed it (maybe you didn't read the thread after all) and i am willing to use android again!!! However, if we shacked our brains a bit to see if android has any down effects on our cells, it wouldn't be such a bad thing!!! Nothing to loose, and maybe many things to win after all!

I wanted to put down a whole story on how stupid your comparison's are and how you should leave the thinking about this stuff to ppl who actually know what they are talking about.
Android wont destroy your hardware its a bare bone operating system with custom drivers to run on our HD2. Software imput cant realy damage your hardware unless your overclocking.
Take it from ppl who know what they are talking about seeing you seem to be clueless

shuntje said:
I wanted to put down a whole story on how stupid your comparison's are and how you should leave the thinking about this stuff to ppl who actually know what they are talking about.
Android wont destroy your hardware its a bare bone operating system with custom drivers to run on our HD2. Software imput cant realy damage your hardware unless your overclocking.
Take it from ppl who know what they are talking about seeing you seem to be clueless
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No need to be rude! That's what i said in my post, i'm not a technician or a developer, i just have some concerns/questions and i need to be insured!
Besides, i am pretty sure that many others have many other concerns/questions!
That's why i titled it a "discussion"!
So if you are ready for a good discussion welcome; if you are not or think yourself much highly educated to discuss such silly ideas you can keep you mouth shut like many people did!
Regards

Software just doesn't work like that.
If any, the only side-effects that I can see is that we are using the Hardware Buttons more often, therefore they might fail earlier using Android instead of WinMobile.

The car comparison isnt really good.. Its more like when you buy a computer from the market with preinstalled windows os and put a linux on it. It wont kill your pc. It may not work as intended because of driver issues, but if set properly, there should be no problem. And as far as i know, its not that easy to overheat a cpu, because there is a hardware security built in, so your mobo knows what to do. It will just shut down. Sure,you can have bad luck and your cpu can die. I dont overclock my HD2 (only for benchmarking maybe), but i concider myself as a hardcore pc overclocker (like 15 years now), so i am aware of the potential risks and know what i am talking about

I agree with Greg on this one
Hardware is hardware on a computer..
If the correct software is written for it it will run.
I.e i run emulators on android and thats emulating the 68000 chip set no problems there.
But most damge you will cause to your phone is over clocking the CPU until it dies..
Reminds me when used to run windows 3.1 on my old AMiga

If this puts your mind at rest and stops people flaming.
No your touch screen failure was unrelated to Android. The cpu temps and screen res would not have been related. Had you had cpu or screen res/pixel related issues your symptoms would have different.
There are some risks to android, the worst of them being imho your battery going flat when your desperately trying to phone for a lift because the trains and buses have stopped and it's bloody cold outside (as I found out last week). However what I'd suggest is rather then non-devs making uneducated guesses we leave threads like this to the devs who can state specifically what the risks are.

Well, the worst that can happen, is killing the phone. happend to me. I started android, went outside the room for a minute and when I came back, the phone was dead and awfully hot. Fortunately htc repaired it ...

greg17477 said:
The car comparison isnt really good.. Its more like when you buy a computer from the market with preinstalled windows os and put a linux on it. It wont kill your pc. It may not work as intended because of driver issues, but if set properly, there should be no problem. And as far as i know, its not that easy to overheat a cpu, because there is a hardware security built in, so your mobo knows what to do. It will just shut down. Sure,you can have bad luck and your cpu can die. I dont overclock my HD2 (only for benchmarking maybe), but i concider myself as a hardcore pc overclocker (like 15 years now), so i am aware of the potential risks and know what i am talking about
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now that´s a nice comparison... but still, the operating system as a whole, means including hard- and software, is a highly complex entity.
Concerning LC displays, you can actually kill them if the power on sequence (eg. the voltage), which drives the display, is wrong. Depending on the display, there is a certain range of voltage which is fine, but below or higher still can produce problems or even permanent damage. Please don´t forget the complex structure of the LCD´s in our HD2´s.

To concur with some of the above posts, I have a computer that I have running Windows 7 on. I have also run XP and Vista on it.
Additionally I run Linux on it.
And if that were not enough, I am brave enough to admit I run OSX on it.
None of these affect any aspect of my hardware.
Now I do believe I do not have a large enough power supply to run my two hard drives, two optical, dual video cards and pro audio card. But that is a hardware issue, as the OP's issue clearly was hardware failure.
And yes, usage does affect computer/mobile life, no matter the OS it is running.

Life Engineer said:
No need to be rude! That's what i said in my post, i'm not a technician or a developer, i just have some concerns/questions and i need to be insured!
Besides, i am pretty sure that many others have many other concerns/questions!
That's why i titled it a "discussion"!
So if you are ready for a good discussion welcome; if you are not or think yourself much highly educated to discuss such silly ideas you can keep you mouth shut like many people did!
Regards
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Again you stated in your first post dont try and convince me that it was not android that killed my toutch screen. So thats why i was rude ppl who say stuff like that in a opening post while saying you want a discussion is just useless.

winmobile screen failure
if this were any assurance to go by, here's my story: I had a screen failure of my hd2 back in the time when I was running it with windows mobile only - it simply would not respond to touch at all.. fortunately, htc has repaired it and I've been assured that such problems might happen to some handsets from the first months of production... my screen (or was it digitizer) was apparently replaced by a newer version/model... Since then everything has been running very smoothly on my hd2, and I've been testing all sorts of android versions available on this forum.. no problems with the screen or anything whatsoever...

Your concern are not logical to begin with. First of all: Android is a piece of software, that runs on top of Windows Mobile. It won't change anything. It is self containing. So it's like any other App you downloaded from the Windows Marketplace. Secondly: The gamut of Android or WinMo has nothing to do with what the LCD is really able to produce. If you turn down Windows 7 16bit Colordepth, you'll only get 16bit. If you crank it up to 32bit and your monitor is only able to handle 16bit, than you'll see 16bit colors. No pixel will overheat. And the last point: Underclocking won't damage you CPU. It will even increase the lifespan of it, because it does not have to process as many inputs and outputs within each second. If you just run Winmo, it is much colder than using an app.
It is just a hardwarefailure, nothing more. Happened to all of us at least once.

NessD said:
Android is a piece of software, that runs on top of Windows Mobile. It won't change anything. It is self containing. So it's like any other App you downloaded from the Windows Marketplace.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wrong.

/Two cents,
My phone’s touchscreen broke while using Android. I eventually found my “Back” key is somehow interfering with the touch, and now when it happens I need to press the key many many times to stop it jamming the screen’s input. Very annoying but luckily not so serious to need replacing (yet).
As stated above, I think hardware-wise the biggest issue with Android is that you probably will use your buttons more, and as your device is likely to be over a year old, it’s possible you’ll see these give way more. But *shrug* what can you do? Every hardware has a shelf-life. And my hardware fault may well have occurred just as easily on Android.
//Edit: *On Windows Mobile

Anyone seen a real explosion?

The media, YouTube and even this forum have many referring to the problem with the Note 7 as "exploding". I wonder how many of those writing have ever actually seen an explosion. Yes, it is a relative term. Considering the same word is used to describe events like Hiroshima, Hindenburg or today's event in Chelsea it seems to me that it hardly comes close to accurately describing what happens during the charging fire on these phones. I suppose, in the most technical sense, one could also call striking a single match an explosion but realistically it is more like over sensationalizing.
I suggest those thinking this is an explosion head off to the firing range and squeeze off a round or two of an .500 Smith & Wesson Magnum. That friends is an explosion.

Samsung, the CPSC, and serious news outlets (e.g. NYT) are not calling it an explosion.
But regardless of the terminology, I think everyone understands that the Note 7's combustion is stronger than a match but weaker than a military explosive.
Discussion of other types of explosions is completely off-topic for this site.

Gary02468 said:
Samsung, the CPSC, and serious news outlets (e.g. NYT) are not calling it an explosion.
But regardless of the terminology, I think everyone understands that the Note 7's combustion is stronger than a match but weaker than a military explosive.
Discussion of other types of explosions is completely off-topic for this site.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would never be so bold as to assume what anyone else understands let alone what EVERYONE else else understands.
My point is that it is not an explosion at all in common everyday English.
If one wants to sensationalize the issue then you would need to exaggerate the reaction.

light reading

Thought I would post this to the community for a light reading..
Behind the scenes the big money is gearing up for the takeover of the car console and one way to do this is via these systems.
If you haven't read how much "Here Maps" sold for the do a google search on it.. that and we already see cross interface information from Waze showing up in Google maps..
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/volvo-google-android-infotainment-polestar-2/
Interesting enough.. the banter had with another poster on "interaction" of these units while driving brings up the point of liability.
If a driver is using these systems and crashes and
a: kills someone
b: kills themselves..
c: hurts or maim
Then it could be argued that the units are at fault..
Of course this is wear motion sensors come into play in that the acknowledgement screen is presented and agreed that the driver is not the one controlling the screen..
Thus hands free kits on steering wheels should in theory get better.. ie maybe trackpads embedded into the steering wheel.. so it's controlled by feel like a mouse so no need for eyes off road..
Please note just theories here and shouldn't be be taken as "as driver shouldn't have a licence if they use this while driving type ultimatum. As it's a bigger discussion then that..

And another one..
https://techcrunch.com/2018/12/01/t...ce-is-heating-up-and-will-be-won-in-software/
I am guessing that there are a few readers as most of us that have been early adopters are also interested in the code and tech behind the unit's we use..
As this last article states.. the space is only going to get hotter with this amount of money getting thrown at it.
Mind you that doesn't do anything for those poor bigger suffering from low quality mish mash of parts that are featured in these units we have got.
Hats off to those that tinker with the hardware and develop the roms.
Your making the world a better place for us plebs that are end users and don't have the knowledge or time and just want all our wishes in one little box to work..

dgcruzing said:
And another one..
https://techcrunch.com/2018/12/01/t...ce-is-heating-up-and-will-be-won-in-software/
Mind you that doesn't do anything for those poor bigger suffering from low quality mish mash of parts that are featured in these units we have got.
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I've honestly started to wonder what it would take to design and build a higher quality unit. Everything about these Chinese units we're all using is terrible, non-ergonomic and buggy. From the glossy, cheap screens, to the power supplies that seem to cause most of the poor quality audio issues on the newer units…
I'd pay more for something better.

Yes, I think most of us here would.
As 30+ years ago I spent 2 weeks wages on getting the best system I could for the car back then..
LOL, Apprenticeship wages and that was a 45 hour week ..
When you think about it, most of us are using $1,000+ phones thus if and when there is consistency with this equipment then I am sure that is a price point that could be achieved.
Just need one of the majors to really have a go at it much like some have with the TV setup box's.
With luck, an extension of the Google Home devices into the car is on the way soon enough.
Understand at the moment that Android Auto is being perfected at the moment for this very day.