Database Users

Buy or not to buy!?

Hello people
IMO Blackstone is the best device ever and right now the best device on market I have held it and played a bit with friend's device and it rulez. Far better than iPhone (I have iPod Touch and I know what it is all about OMG - although as a MP3 Player it is the best around). And I really want to buy one.
But it is little expensive in my country so here is the question.
Remember what apple did? Lot of people bought iPhone and right after that new iPhone was released.
I am really afraid that if I will buy Blackstone (I want to buy it in february) and there will be something better right after that or maybe there will be newer WM systems on these devices or etc.
Are there chances that this can happen? That eg I will buy Blackstone with WM 6.1 and really shortly there will be new blackstone with WM 6.5 or something else making it even better?
What do you think??
Thank you.

I don't think WM 6.5 is coming anytime soon. Perhaps at the end of the year.
http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/21/first-windows-mobile-6-5-devices-due-in-third-quarter-of-09/
If you can wait, I'd say wait a month. Microsoft will give more details at the Mobile World Congress next month.

Sopis said:
Hello people
Remember what apple did? Lot of people bought iPhone and right after that new iPhone was released.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's Apple for you though, the only company to not given a flying **** about the customer.
They limit you in every single way possible to use a dumb downed device that is only for dumb people.
Go for the HD, you will love it.

I think three to four months from now there might be other devices that you might want to test drive then, like the Palm Pre, the next iPhone, Touch HD-variants with better graphics processing. Some will be presented indeed at the next Mobile World Congress, but then again, it will take time for these new devices to reach your market.
Upgrading your HD operating system to 6.5 should be no problem, I would not worry about that. At some point you will have to make your hardware decision, and always face the risk that three months later there will be a device even more desireable. I think none of us need a HD to survive, but its nice to have.

In my view for the next three months there will be no device better than the HD commercially available.
I guess in the next three months we may have announcements (official) from HTC on new devices for 2009. But, these will not be in the shops until June/July.
I would say "go for it" now. There is always a possibility that another killer device will be appearing so if you wait for new ones now why not wait again in summer for the Windows 6.7 (!!) devices ...

We're in a post-Christmas, credit-crunched lull at the moment. Much better "next gen" devices based around better processors etc are just around the corner - I'd steer very clear of the HD, it's a dead end.

Thanks guys
I guess I will buy it. If you say there will be no problems updating to newer OS and other stuff.
Yep, I don't dislike iPhone, but Iphone is not what I want.
Blackstone, w8 for me, I am coming

Sopis said:
Thanks guys
I guess I will buy it. If you say there will be no problems updating to newer OS and other stuff.
Yep, I don't dislike iPhone, but Iphone is not what I want.
Blackstone, w8 for me, I am coming
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just a warning: there is no guarantee that a ROM upgrade will be made available. HTC have not promised this.
All you can say now is that the HD may be flashed with a new ROM. The supply of that ROM depends on HTC and the excellent enthusiasts here in XDA (there are lots of alternate ROMs available already for the HD).
I personally use a standard ROM and I'm happy with it.

3GSM
Maybe, we could just wait the 3GSM in Barcelona in mid February to know more about next WinMo releases. Even if MS release it on Feb, the first devices will not appear before this summer, (if it's the same way as for WM6.1).
HTC will maybe provide us with a new ROM as for some of WM6.0 devices (the elf update was only available for a short period). And if they don't, I'm sure the ROM cookers from the Blackstone ROM forum will do

My main concern about the HD is battery life,I had the Diamond and it was so bad I bought a Nokia for the first time in my life,nice machines that last 4 hours on a single charge are not mobiles.

zaki67 said:
My main concern about the HD is battery life,I had the Diamond and it was so bad I bought a Nokia for the first time in my life,nice machines that last 4 hours on a single charge are not mobiles.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am happy with the HD battery. It easily lasts a day of FULL use (BT for calls, GPS infrequent use and 1 hour of podcast listening).
But, I have no need for long-play videos. I suspect this is a weak spot for the battery.

wm6.5 from htc on our hd

when i asked the premium reseller in my country about a free upgrade to wm6.5 expexted for htc hd he told me that it is not final that hd will not get it he told me that htc told him that they haven't decided yet and he will know in november if there will be an upgrade or not

hoss_n2 said:
when i asked the premium reseller in my country about a free upgrade to wm6.5 expexted for htc hd he told me that it is not final that hd will not get it he told me that htc told him that they haven't decided yet and he will know in november if there will be an upgrade or not
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd be extremely surprised if they were to offer this after they said they wouldn't. It would be a welcomed change from their part, but I have my reservations about this............

If they really would release it, then only after some time selling the most recent devices which will come with WM6.5. Would be very nice from HTC side, but i think they won´t.

TMReuffurth said:
If they really would release it, then only after some time selling the most recent devices which will come with WM6.5. Would be very nice from HTC side, but i think they won´t.
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Click to collapse
htc made a thing like this before for the tytnII it upgraded it to wm6.1 after the td and touchpro are sold enough

i really hope they do. in a way, the official 6.1 upgrade gave my touch dual a new lease of life.

afhstingray said:
i really hope they do. in a way, the official 6.1 upgrade gave my touch dual a new lease of life.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Precisely what a phone manufacturer doesn't want.

which is why HTC dosent let anyone flash whatever they want. its just a minority of users that come to this site and learn how to bypass CID etc.
6.1 was released for the touch dual because it went on sale in certain markets quite a while after the original 6.0 device was released.
so, fingers crossed, there are markets where the HD is still selling decently well, and HTC isnt bringing the Leo out anytime soon. It's this kind of scenario that will result in us seeing a (official) rom upgrade
i got kind of sick of using cooked 6.5 roms since they dont approach the stability of an official upgrade, which is unfortunate, but i cant tolerate that for my main phone. maybe after i get a replacement for my HD, i'll play around with upgrading it. much like what i do with my Universal after i got my touch dual. I dont use it as my critical business phone, so had fun tinkering with it!

i think everyone with an HD, that are not part of this comunity, a simply google search of: windows mobile 6.5 on touch hd, most pages that you get will have a link to xda-devs, so i hope HTC will realize that by them not giving the upgrade wont stop people from flashing it to their HD, thus better if they save all that hassle and just give the damn upgrade already

I own a Blackstone because last year our company's IT department did not certify other OS than Windows Mobile which will change soon (as Apple and Android move closer to a better MS Exchange connection).
I clearly expect from a mobile device manufacturer to keep their devices including the OS on the latrst and most current level at least for the usual time people use such devices (i.e. 2 years after purchase, if connected to a mobile provider contract). As far as I know, in many companies thie cycle is used even if there is no such connection to a provider.
To me, a company is not trustworthy that advertises the Touch HD as its "top level" device and one month later says that they will no longer support this device. It is RIDICULOUS that HTC did not even offer a ROM upgrade including the latest Manila 2.0/2.1, and this during a time period where the Touch HD was and still is an outstanding device.
Apple, by the way, offers free or cheap upgrades for their iphones which make it possible to run the latest version on the first iphones that had bveen manufactured. This does not prevent customers from buying more iPhones than aver. And I am convinced that if HTC would offer upgrades to the latest WM version or Manila version for existing devices, this would not drop sales significantly. Not offering upgrades is a fair swindle.
I am well aware that many people here stand close behind HTC and understand and tolerate the behaviour and business model of HTC much better than I do. I am using HTC devices for 5 years now and if we had not xda-developers, I would not even think of touching a HTC device again. I would certainly not buy one.
Cheers,
Eriol

xdaassasin said:
All is about money why put latest sw a better firmware if you need to sell more new product.etc touch HD2.Apple has got only few rubbish phones for stupid people.HTC is selling to completly diferrent customers levels.
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Click to collapse
You mean, the quality of Apple's phones is to be compared to the intelligence of HTC customers?
No, honestly: I understand that you are in favour of the business strategy of HTC. But I cannot really understand this. I think that customers should put much more pressure on HTC. I, for instance, will not buy a new device every year. I will get one every two years. And I know quite a lot of other people who act the same way. I am aware that especially amongst the cookers and Chief's here at xda-developers, there are quite some that are really technic-freaks and always try to get hands on the latest device available. It is not their obligation to create ROMs for older models. But I think that it is definitely an obligation of HTC to do so. Especially because HTC devices are in fact technically speaking astonishing (if I look at my old Wizard and see how fast it runs TF2D ...).
Eriol

Windows Mobile 7 for HD2, it will happen

Hi,
I have recently received an enquiry about a post I made saying that I contacted HTC about a month ago asking if WinMo 7 will be made available for the HD2, and if it will be a free download. I have found their response so have decided to post it on here:-
"Dear Toby
Thank you for your enquiry about HD2
What we do it ROM Upgrades from our website, however 6.5 windows mobile has only been out 2 months and windows mobile 7 hasn't even been developed. This wont be out until next november at the earliest. But when it is available it will be a free download.
If these steps have not helped, please let me know by responding using the link provided and I will be happy to check again for you.
Best regards,
Terry Snelling
HTC customer support team
HTC Corp. Global Service Division
http://www.htc.com/europe/CA_Hotline.aspx"

When asked to comment on the sayings of a HTC developer who said that WM7 will be available for the HD2 on Twitter, HTC responded "No, disregard that". Should have said "when and if" instead of "when".
So yeah. We're not exactly too sure about what the branches are up to.
It's not like this matters anyway, you'll probably have your share of WM7 roms here in xda.

Yunabeco said:
It's not like this matters anyway, you'll probably have your share of WM7 roms here in xda.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't bet on that. Developing a ROM based on an entirely new CE kernel is a totally different proposition to going to a different version of WM6.x - where are the hardware drivers going to come from?

I doubt it will be a new rom for us. First, its seems its being pushed to q1 2011, second, new phones with dual core processors will come out and it will hurt sales if they offer an upgrade to 7. They need to sell the new phones.
Its just business guys, its not like HTC cares so much about the current hd2 owners. They are in the money making business.

To be fair, lorin.bute is on the money here - I'll probably only have this phone a year at most and there'll be bigger & better around by the time WM7 is out.
That said, if they do release wm7 for hd2, it will a nice thing for them to do

I have doubt there will be any official WM7 release for HD2, just as there is no official WM6.5 for HD.

Shasarak said:
I wouldn't bet on that. Developing a ROM based on an entirely new CE kernel is a totally different proposition to going to a different version of WM6.x - where are the hardware drivers going to come from?
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Click to collapse
Many devices originally running WM5 have 'unofficial' WM6(.5.x) Roms available.
Drivers can be created or taken from devices using the same hardware.
Also, I wouldn't be surprised if WM7 turns out to be able to use 6.x hardware drivers.
If the HD2 continues to be a well sold device, and -not unimportant- the first device that meets the WM7 HW Specs, it could be a logical choice for HTC to come up with an upgrade.
And offcourse it also depends on when WM7 will be available. If it comes out in April, the HD2 may still be HTC's 'flagship'. If it comes out in november, chances are the HD2 is not that fast, big and high tech anymore..

@tomasz
Going from WM6 to WM7 is something completely different than going from WM5 to WM6. WM5 and WM6 share the same kernel (kinda), so it's easy to update, as all the drivers still work. Drivers made for WM6 will not work on WM7.
But HD2 is testing WM7 on the HD2 and it only takes someone to leak a ROM and we'll have all the necessary software to port WM7 to the HD2. So even if HTC doesn't release an official update, I'm pretty sure that we'll get it.
But we definitely can't develop the necessary software ourselves and it's not like the updates from WM5 to WM6, that's where Shasarak is right. All we can do now is wait and see what happens.

tomasz said:
Many devices originally running WM5 have 'unofficial' WM6(.5.x) Roms available.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, but Windows Mobile 5.0, 6.0, 6.1 and 6.5 are all based on Windows CE version 5-point-something. (You forget how little development has been going on with Windows Mobile for the past several years - very little has actually changed between 5.0 and 6.5). Going to WM7 we go to a Windows CE version 6 kernel, which is completely different.
tomasz said:
Drivers can be created or taken from devices using the same hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What devices are there which have identical hardware to the HD2 and are running WM7? I take the point that there probably will be devices out there with similar hardware running WM7 at some point; but look at the issues people are currently having porting graphics drivers from the Toshiba TG01 to the HD2 (and they really do have virtually identical hardware) - it mostly works, but it's not perfect. And every device onboard needs a driver - not just the main chipset, but things like the camera too. What are the chances a WM7 phone will have an identical camera to the HD2? And where are we going to get a WM7-compatible radio ROM from?
tomasz said:
Also, I wouldn't be surprised if WM7 turns out to be able to use 6.x hardware drivers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's already been announced that it won't.
tomasz said:
If the HD2 continues to be a well sold device, and -not unimportant- the first device that meets the WM7 HW Specs, it could be a logical choice for HTC to come up with an upgrade.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It would be a totally illogical choice for an upgrade, because WM7 isn't due out until Q4 this year - likely late Q4 according to some rumours. That means the HD2's successor will probably launch as HTC's first (flagship) WM7 phone. At that point, if HTC issues a WM7 upgrade for the HD2 they will be seriously cannibalising HD3 sales; from HTC's perspective, they want anyone who wishes to upgrade to WM7 to buy a new phone to do it. There was no official WM6.5 upgrade for the Touch HD for the same reason.
freyberry said:
But HD2 is testing WM7 on the HD2 and it only takes someone to leak a ROM and we'll have all the necessary software to port WM7 to the HD2. So even if HTC doesn't release an official update, I'm pretty sure that we'll get it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If HTC are testing WM7 on actual HD2 hardware, then there may indeed be a helpful leak at some point. Do you have a source for that claim, or are you just being optimistic?

by 2011, i think i can upgrade my phone again since it reaching the end of my contract....

Shasarak said:
It would be a totally illogical choice for an upgrade, because WM7 isn't due out until Q4 this year - likely late Q4 according to some rumours. That means the HD2's successor will probably launch as HTC's first (flagship) WM7 phone. At that point, if HTC issues a WM7 upgrade for the HD2 they will be seriously cannibalising HD3 sales; from HTC's perspective, they want anyone who wishes to upgrade to WM7 to buy a new phone to do it. There was no official WM6.5 upgrade for the Touch HD for the same reason.
If HTC are testing WM7 on actual HD2 hardware, then there may indeed be a helpful leak at some point. Do you have a source for that claim, or are you just being optimistic?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK, some additions to your points.
I really don't think that a WM7 upgrade would hurt HD3 sales. Would Apple still sell the iPhone 3G if it did hurt 3GS sales? Probably not. If someone wants an HD3, he'll buy an HD3. If someone doesn't want to spend that much, he'll buy a cheaper device, which could then be the HD2 (because it saves HTC some costs of developing new mid-range phones if they continue to sell the last gen devices, just like Apple does). The reason for not providing a WM6.5 upgrade to the Touch HD is that they have to draw a line somewhere. Testing and adjusting new WM versions causes additional costs and they have to decide if it pays (because they give out the upgrade for free, so the "only" thing they get in return is satisfaction of their customers). Yes, I do think that they should have provided WM6.5 for the Touch HD, but apparently they decided that it would not pay. Apple only has to support two last-gen devices, it would be much too expensive for HTC to develop upgrades for all their devices, so they have to choose which ones to support.
About HTC testing WM7 on the HD2: I know that the necessary software exists, but I can't tell you any more than that (and I don't know more than that). Of course I can not guarantee that there will be a leak, I'm just being optimistic about this. Only time will tell if there will be an official upgrade or a leak that we can use, but yes, I am optimistic

snerkler said:
HTC customer support team
HTC Corp. Global Service Division
http://www.htc.com/europe/CA_Hotline.aspx"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't bet a penny on that statement.
All I've read so far about HTC customer support responses (HD2: ROM upgrades, warranty, release datesm..) were vague. One not knowing what the other one said, contradictious statements, etc.
Unless that "confirmation" is not from a "higher positioned" employee, it's not more promising than the russian tweet about the Upgrade.

Maybe I'm a skeptic, but the only thing I believe from that statement is that WM7 is scheduled for release in November. I wouldn't be surpsied if like most CS reps he was a bit confused and didn't realize that MS/HTC is probably going to push out 6.5.3 to the HD.
More than likely 6.5.3 will be released as a free download
WM7 will start appearing in Nov (on new devices though)
And since I've never seen HTC develop 2 OS updates for a device, I don't see it happening now, unless times are changing and that WM7 license is free or something.

Personally I do believe we will get an update from HTC for the HD2 but I dont think it will be when WM7 launches or anytime soon after that. I hope I am wrong but if WM7 is as good as we hope and erases the ghosts of previous WinMo iterations then we will see an influx of new Handsets from most of the manufacturers. Leaving little time for the HD2...until the dust settles that it is...
Just my opinion mind you, I am thoroughly expecting to be wrong on this...

I'd say Windows 7 is being tested on the HD2 right now.
http://pocketnow.com/tech-news/microsoft-implies-windows-mobile-7-headed-to-htc-hd2

freyberry said:
OK, some additions to your points.
I really don't think that a WM7 upgrade would hurt HD3 sales. Would Apple still sell the iPhone 3G if it did hurt 3GS sales? Probably not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The critical difference there is that the iPhone 3G is still an active product: Apple is still making and selling them. (Though you'll note that they discontinued the 16GB version of the 3G as soon as the 3GS launched for precisely that reason - so as to avoid hurting 3GS sales by competing with it).
HTC doesn't operate like that. They have well-defined market sectors, and when a new device comes out in any one sector, the old one is retired and production ceases. Consider, for example, the Touch Diamond, Touch Pro and Touch HD - once the TD2, TP2 and HD2 came out, each of those replaced the earlier model, and the earlier version immediately ceased production. They didn't keep the old Touch HD going as a cheap version of the HD2; that role is fulfilled by the TD2.
Very few manufacturers offer any sort of ongoing development for phone models which aren't being made any more, and HTC is no exception: once the HD2 is no longer being made and sold, we won't see any more major updates for it. For so long as it remains in production, we may.
So the question is simply whether WM7 will become available before or after the HD2 ceases production. If it comes out several months before, there's a good chance of a port (because not offering it would hurt HD2 sales in the mean time). If it comes out after the HD2 isn't being sold any more, there is no chance. And all the precedents suggest that they will stop making HD2's as soon as a replacement model comes out, and that the replacement will likely appear about a year after the model it replaces - which is round about the time WM7 is expected to launch.
Even if you ignore HTC's history of model replacement, it's still very unlikely that the HD2 will remain in production after a new flagship model is released. The iPhone 3G and 3GS can coexist because there's such a large gap between the two in hardware terms (in the same way as there is between the HD2 and the TD2). But it's doubtful that the HD3 hardware will actually be that far ahead of the HD2. (Look how long HTC stuck with MSM72XX chipsets before moving to Snapdragon; it'll likely be a while before they move on from Snapdragon to anything faster). The fact that the HD3 has WM7 will quite likely be the primary thing that differentiates it from the HD2; giving existing HD2 owners access to WM7 would eliminate all motivation for upgrading. There's no way HTC will do that.

I paste also here my comment:
Well, HTC can motivate consumers to buy new devices end of 2010 in 2 ways - by not upgrading existing to WM7 and offering it only with the new devices, or by offering new devices with much faster hardware, which will be an incentive on its own. I am not sure which option HTC will choose though ... having in mind how the competition will upgrade the hardware soon (Apple, Motorola) I think HTC will be forced to do the same as well (and for good)
What I am sure about is that currently MS is testing WM7 on HD2. I hope that at least this version leaks out inofficially

Windows 7 mobile is already in leak..
http://www.engadget.com/2010/01/17/early-windows-mobile-7-build-given-some-hands-on-time-incompati/

mickfarr said:
I'd say Windows 7 is being tested on the HD2 right now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, WM6.5 has been tested also on Xperia X1 and finally there didn't come any update. I think that it is normal that the developers test it on phones that are able to work with the new OS, but it doesn't mean that HD2 will definetly get an official update - though I pray for it...

imperiallight said:
Windows 7 mobile is already in leak..
http://www.engadget.com/2010/01/17/early-windows-mobile-7-build-given-some-hands-on-time-incompati/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www.mobiletechworld.com/2010/01/17/windows-mobile-7-rumors-getting-out-of-hand/
Certainly not the most reputable source... I would say... also doesn't seem to be a very educated one either.

HTC Tattoo vs Wildfire

I've just been reading a review of the HTC Wildfire which is HTCs new budget android device... they seem to think its a lot better than the Tattoo. The specs though are very similar except it has a bit more RAM and a decent camera.
http://www.itpro.co.uk/624604/htc-wildfire-review/4
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTC_Tattoo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTC_Wildfire
Anyway, I thought it was an interesting comparison and shows what the Tattoo can still do especially as the chipsets are the same. I hope with a Froyo release for the Tattoo it can show its potential!

dom_b said:
I've just been reading a review of the HTC Wildfire which is HTCs new budget android device... they seem to think its a lot better than the Tattoo. The specs though are very similar except it has a bit more RAM and a decent camera.
http://www.itpro.co.uk/624604/htc-wildfire-review/4
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTC_Tattoo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTC_Wildfire
Anyway, I thought it was an interesting comparison and shows what the Tattoo can still do especially as the chipsets are the same. I hope with a Froyo release for the Tattoo it can show its potential!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wildfire has a capacitive touchscreen --> multitouch

alberto88a said:
wildfire has a capacitive touchscreen --> multitouch
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apart from being able to pinch zoom who cares? And with a 3.2 inch screen anyway I don't think its the going to be beating an iPhone for web browsing just because it has multi touch lol. My point is that the Tattoo can be brought up to the same level with a complete 2.1/2.2 update.

Maybe that "bit more RAM" is necessary to have 2.1 and sense working fine.
But i'm not sure

dom_b said:
Apart from being able to pinch zoom who cares? And with a 3.2 inch screen anyway I don't think its the going to be beating an iPhone for web browsing just because it has multi touch lol. My point is that the Tattoo can be brought up to the same level with a complete 2.1/2.2 update.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes but in my opinion it won't arrive!
instead htc assured froyo for device from genuary 2010 excluding tattoo that exited on november/december 2009 -.-
i'm not talking about hardware that is almost the same but the support won't be the same for these devices...
do not forget wildfire start with a 2.1 upgradeable to 2.2
and the cost is almost the same for both devices...

Not from HTC it won't... but the development team here are almost there anyway so hopefully a fully working ROM will be here soon without the need for HTC!
And I think you're missing my point. Im just saying that the new device is basically the same as the Tattoo. Im not saying sombody should go out now and buy a Tattoo, that would be stupid lol.

HTC Wildfire is what the Tattoo should have been.
I'm not convinced in upgrading to the Wildfire just to replace my dying Tattoo.

People, I'm quite sure that HTC won't update Wildfire to 2.2. They will just leave it behind like they left behind the Tattoo! They clearly said that they will update most of the phones released in 2010...I don't know, but I sense that the wildfire users will be as disappointed as we were when they said that 2.1 isn't going to come for our tattoos...

TheSSJ said:
People, I'm quite sure that HTC won't update Wildfire to 2.2. They will just leave it behind like they left behind the Tattoo! They clearly said that they will update most of the phones released in 2010...I don't know, but I sense that the wildfire users will be as disappointed as we were when they said that 2.1 isn't going to come for our tattoos...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ditto. HTC just likes to put phones out there that they can't support, you buy it, you have to put up with it if it breaks. Makes me angry.

hi
not development related moved

Coburn64 said:
HTC Wildfire is what the Tattoo should have been.
I'm not convinced in upgrading to the Wildfire just to replace my dying Tattoo.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I couldn't say that any better. 100% agree. I think there are basicly two type of needs/users.
One is what I call the "leisure" user (that could be myself on week ends) who wants a ample web browsing, full multimedia, multiple messaging (SMS's and chat), gaming, and so on. For these users, iPhone 3g/3gs/4, Nexus One, or alike any of both is the choice.
Another one is my so called "working" user (myself monday to friday), when your needs are mostly email (mostly exchange and push), quick browsing, mapping or navigation, shopping lists, to do lists, calendars, reminders, transportation routing or schedule querying, not too ambicious web browsing, some music/sudokuing is well appreciated. For this use, Tattoo-like->Wildfire is simply perfect: does it all, with no excess luggage (weight/size).
I don't know if I should say pitty or shame on HTC for releasing a device that in a very few months will be improved to the obsolecense point. We all know that in consumer technology you will never catch up with the very best, but HTC guys, we should be happy at least for one year. Is it to ask for too much? Did they invent the "decent camera" last week so it is just now that you could include it in your phones, or couldn't you do that on the Tattoo? And cant't you upgrade to 2.1 or 2.2? You HTC want to tell us that you can't do what some cooks on XDA have already done? I am certain that these guys are very well prepared, qualified and smart, no doubt on it, but what they do is some kind of hobby on their spare time, and they are charging not a cent!
Well, my hope like many others, is on these magnificent guys cooking new ROMs for all of us (hopefully we will have a 2.1 or 2.2 fully functional), and as some other dudes already have expressed, Tattoo might well be my last HTC device.

I think tattoo is lack of screen resolution and size of the screen other than it's good if you just work around with roms and install market patched hopefully soon we will have 2.2 or 2.1 fully working custom Roms with market patched and it will be really cool
But htc should do something about tattoo they can't just leave tattoo in blank

don't think on buying a wildfire. haven't you got enough with Tattoo? save some more money and buy a nexus one or an iphone, they are truly speedy and better quality

Coburn64 said:
Ditto. HTC just likes to put phones out there that they can't support, you buy it, you have to put up with it if it breaks. Makes me angry.
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Click to collapse
HTC Officially released Android froyo (2.2) update for wildfire in europe. Just check below link,
http://www.htc.com/europe/support.aspx?type=Others
Soon to india.. wait.

whats HTCs reaction to this development?

is HTC quietly standing by?
supporting?
or trying to prevent the further development?
because from the company's point of view we are cutting into their cash by preventing people from buying a new model of android phone.
i ve seen what happened to alot of gadgets that got hacked and then company usually releases an update that prevents further hacking and prevents from downgrading.
seagate HT+, apple newest iphone firmware, archos502 etc.
what are che cances of HTC working on a lock out for the HD2 specifically?
the only development we have here for HD2 and android...

In your post you fail to state what development you are talking about.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

I think he is talking about porting android to the HD2. I dont think they would care seeing as how many people, myself included bought an HD2 because of android development going on. If this didn't happen I would think they would have sold less phones.
Theoretically they shouldn't care since at the end of the day we bought their product irregardless to what OS was on there. If anything, I would think Microsoft would get pretty upset and take action if we continued on the path to porting WP7 on the HD2.

dubbingt said:
I think he is talking about porting android to the HD2. I dont think they would care seeing as how many people, myself included bought an HD2 because of android development going on. If this didn't happen I would think they would have sold less phones.
Theoretically they shouldn't care since at the end of the day we bought their product irregardless to what OS was on there. If anything, I would think Microsoft would get pretty upset and take action if we continued on the path to porting WP7 on the HD2.
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not if you buy from their market place
at the end of the day. microsoft is just like google. a software company. they want their software on as much phones as possible. if you happen to be an hd2 user who is running windows 7 and buying stuff from their market place, then awesome to them.
htc is the one who would be pissed. because you didnt change ur HD2 and buy a new phone windows 7. they lost 1 customer " figure of speach "
i dont see them happy that android is working on hd2 . they lost desire hd sales.
you know where i am going with this. for hardware companies, this is bad.
for software companies like microsodt and google ? the more the better.

ll_l_x_l_ll said:
not if you buy from their market place
at the end of the day. microsoft is just like google. a software company. they want their software on as much phones as possible. if you happen to be an hd2 user who is running windows 7 and buying stuff from their market place, then awesome to them.
htc is the one who would be pissed. because you didnt change ur HD2 and buy a new phone windows 7. they lost 1 customer " figure of speach "
i dont see them happy that android is working on hd2 . they lost desire hd sales.
you know where i am going with this. for hardware companies, this is bad.
for software companies like microsodt and google ? the more the better.
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True but not completely true!
HTC is definitely loosing by not selling new phones but winning by selling more HD2s!!! (as i've read many bought HD2 just for porting android!! Really weird but it's true!!)
Both Google(android) and Microsoft(WP7) are winning and loosing at the same time!!!!
How is that you might ask?!
You are using their product, you are making propaganda, you are paying for apps from marketplace... It's all good!
However you are not purchasing their OS! As you know part of the price of a phone goes to the OS company! So practically it's true that you have ported their OS but you didn't actually buy it!

There are actually two sides to this story: Yes, making Android possible on a HD2 will indeed keep people using their HD2 in stead of buying a new android phone so from a short term point of view on might say that this has a negative effect on sales.
On the other hand, phone sales is mainly driven by "sponsored sales" by phone operators. A lot of phones get replaced after the initial contract periods regardless whether it is still usable. Only a relative small group of people actually use custom roms/android installs, but they spread a lot of good publicity about HTC and its possibilities. HTC is the fastest growing company at the moment, showing 139% growth in Q2 this year compared to Q2 last year. Still, Samsung is holding 20% of the market and HTC less than 2%, so enough room for expansion.
To cut a long story short: I don't think they mind too much, they probably watch this forum closely, pick up ideas for development and just let XDA do the marketing for their brilliant smartphones.

i agree with the post above me.. i don't think HTC cares much about the android port.. besides, i think they owe it to us.. coz like M$, they said that there will be a free wp7 upgrade for our phones.. so, since there's no wp7 upgrade for our phone, they should give us android instead... and they can't do anything about the android port anyways, as android is an open source program.. but if HTC was apple though, things would be different.. a lot different..

Ive got a few mates who bought or are planning to buy a hd2 simply because it allows the dualboot.
I dont think HTC should be complaining as XDA has made their devices much more interesting then most others.
I even think that without XDA or any chefs HTC would see their sells go down fast

I think that quietly they helped us to run android on hd2.They give the kernel sources of desire and other android phones,so the developers of porting android to hd2 can take some code from there and port it to hd2
Also they give us the new 3.14 rom with radio 2.15.50 who gives us the ability to run android without the need of hspl and losing the warranty.

clio94 said:
They give the kernel sources of desire and other android phones,so the developers of porting android to hd2 can take some code from there and port it to hd2
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That is not because HTC is somehow beneficial, they have to release the kernel sources or else their license to distribute their modified kernel (by selling phones in this case) is void.

True, they may be losing some sales because of android port on HD2. Many people with HD2 may have had shifted to Android phones including myself...but since Android is running on HD2 and its running fine...I've decided to postpone an upgrade...
But I think HTC has gained from XDA then it lost...if it weren't for XDA, HTC wouldn't have been the company we all know it...things are different now because HTC has now become popular but initially in WM days people bought HTC phones because of great XDA support otherwise it may just ended up like an ordinary Taiwanese manufacturer like ASUS, etc in phone market...

Mikenif said:
Ive got a few mates who bought or are planning to buy a hd2 simply because it allows the dualboot.
I dont think HTC should be complaining as XDA has made their devices much more interesting then most others.
I even think that without XDA or any chefs HTC would see their sells go down fast
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That's the exact reason I bought the HD2. I was going to get an iPhone otherwise. HD2 > iPhone in every aspect except for Android (which was my deciding deal, I found out you could dual boot)

While I agree with a lot of the aspects of both winning and losing, in the end, HTC wins. Some of you say that they are losing be side of an upgrade, if you think about it, they still win. Why?
Let's say the HD2 costs $200(not sure...) if people were to buy 2 or 3 times as many HD2 devices, that beats an silly update which costs only $200?...They look at it in a BUSINESS perspective. And the numbers prove the best move.
In addition to, Google is much happier, that there OS is going to more devices. The small OS fee for factory devices hurts none. In the end, more people by from the Market. Even if it does hurt them, the publicity is well worth it, and will prove them good in the end. Besides, XDA has helped HTC, so I would be disappointed to see HTC block what XDA's main source comes from..... Everyone is happy, unless Microsoft were to complain, but even then, HTC could easily support Android instead, which I believe they will do eventually.
And in another addition to, I'm sure many people have multiple HD2 one Android, one Windows Mobile, or even both Android. You can't beat that.... HD2 is quite distinct. They may even support the movement, and design a newer HD2 that will be (secretly) compatible with both OS, as the devices we are using now work very well with both.
I think it has done more good than bad, so what's there to concern HTC.
Sent from my HTC Desire using XDA App

HTC aren't Apple - they aren't megalomaniacs. From their perspective, all this hacking and modding is just free marketing, brand awareness and of course brand loyalty, as a result of HTC devices being known to be flexible, you are more likely to pick up another HTC than say, Samsung.

I'll go one further and say i reckon that there is a chef on here or maybe more than one who are employed by HTC but obviously this isn't public knowledge and they could lose their jobs if found out,it's well possible.
If HTC were really that bothered being a global company they could have instigated some type of legal action against this website allowing people to hack their product, im not sure exactly what but realistically they could prevent this from happening if they were really bothered.

aussiebum said:
HTC aren't Apple - they aren't megalomaniacs. From their perspective, all this hacking and modding is just free marketing, brand awareness and of course brand loyalty, as a result of HTC devices being known to be flexible, you are more likely to pick up another HTC than say, Samsung.
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yes id agree with this.

only HTC
When I was first looking at widows phones and I saw XDA and the work being done I was sold I started with the T-mo MVA then the S620 (t-mo Dash)-the TyTN- which i replaced with a tp2 which i Just sold. I still have my HD and HD2 for dual boot but I'm at the crossroad should I just get android like the MyTouch 4g or the desire HD??? Point is only because of the amazing and innovative work here at XDA did I try out and stay with windows other wise I would have ended up with 'shudder" the Icrap or crackberry...
My guess is that for corporate reasons they have to advise against it and can not support the work openly but I'm sure that they enjoy and are happy to have the free publicity and the building of brand loyalty as well as the development work and seeing how HTC Sense can be developed and customized by people like Cookie and Max for them for free, is an added bonus.
As for phone sales lets be honest despite 3 or even 2 year contracts the average reliability of most phones is about 18-24 months sometimes less and the handset makers know that and base there future sales on that not on the rarer cases of people who were going to buy a new phone after 9-12 months but kept it because of duel boot.

Personally, I think it is a win, win situation for HTC and Google for this device to have the dual boot ability. I am on AT&T, have an unlocked HD2 that runs Windows Mobile as well as 4 different builds of Android. I don't think you can get much more versatile than that. Personally, I am not worried about, nor in any hurry for NAND boot capabilities for Android on the HD2, that would just cause a new set of headaches in the early stages. Not to say that I won't give it a shot after it has been publicly released for quite a while, but as I stated above, I am in no hurry at all.
I traded one of my HTC Touch Pro 2's for this carrier unlocked T-Mo HD2 a couple of months ago and it had nothing but problems as it still had the stock ROM on it. I did the Hard SPL, flashed it with a custom ROM and the rest is history. This thing is a tremendous device, even if I do not get 3G speeds on the AT&T network. There is no 3G service in my area anyway so I don't think I am missing out on much at all.
XDA Devs - Don't stop what you are doing as far as Android on HD2 development. HTC could learn a few things from you folks!
HTC - Keep up the great work and keep on releasing these great devices!
GooG - Same thing, keep those fresh Androind builds coming!
AT&T - Get a clue as to what your customers want and quit bottling Steve Jobs crack sweat (iPhone) and shoving it under your customers noses! And if you are going to claim the biggest 3G network, actually create and maintain that network to make the statement true!
My .02 ..... HTR

The only reason I got an HD2 is for the Android experience and the potential to run WP7 on it. Win Mo 6.5 sucks (in my opinion) but I am still rocking an HD2 because of what it can do, and because the hardware is awesome.
I think HTC as a company would be happy that enough people like their hardware that they are willing to buy the HD2 just to run a (less than stable) version of Android off an SD card. Tthe HD2 hardware is amazing, and HTC is more in the hardware business than anything.
Think of it this way, its like buying a Dell computer with Windows 7 and installing Ubuntu on it. Does Dell care? Nope, they sold the hardware so they're happy.

I dont think that they lose as much business as one might think.
I was at my local T-Mobile store yesterday morning to pick up the MyTouch 4G...I love HTC devices because of what devs here at XDA do for them and have owned quite a few (MDA, Dash, Wing, TP2, G1, MT3G, Nexus One, HD2...and now MyTouch 4G) I still show all of my phones affection and still cruise the different sub forums here and keep my phones updated on the newest builds, but HTC hasn't (and never will) lose me as a customer.
Sure, there are some people who will buy phones from places like craigslist or ebay, and HTC does not see any monitary profit from transactions like this...but I am sure that they win a future customer when that same person walks into their carriers store with an upgrade available and sees a new HTC device...Especially those who find their way to forums such as XDA. No device will last forever and will need to be upgraded eventually...and I feel that HTC has built a great name for itself.