Database Users

Two galaxy S's, different animals...

Hi Guys,
Just to say, I had my defective Galaxy S replaced recently (had only had it two weeks), however its becoming clear that the new one is much better in a few ways.
Although they look identical (are are setup exactly the same way), they behave differently in a few key ways.
First up, my battery life was pathetic on the first handset, I'd be lucky if it made it to the end of the day. With the new one, I can still have 65% to 70% left after the same useage and setup at the end of the day. Bad battery?
Second, I dont seem to get much lag now. Its still there under heavy use but nowhere near as bad as it was....maybe it was a bad install on the first one? Although I did factory reset it, and it was still the same.
Third, Kies now connects perfectly every time. This drove me nuts on the first handset, kies would sit at connecting while the MTP app rebooted itself over and over on the phone. I worked out through reading, and trial and error that it was the internal sd card that caused it. Or rather specific files on the sd card, format it and it would connect...install my apps and it wouldn't.
The new phone however doesn't care what apps are on it (installed everything that was on the first one), it just connects. I have checked the firmware rev and its the same as phone one. Wierd
Fourth, my recovery mode now works It would never work on the first phone. In the end this was the reason it got swapped.
The phone was acting a bit weird so I took it to a Samsung service point who said they would flatten it and flash new software, however when they tried the bootloader / recovery would not work. They then said that this was a fault and it would need to be sent back to Samsung to fix recovery mode, however the phone was still under DOA with the shop I brought it from so I took it there with a note from the service centre to back me up. Hence I now have a new phone, and recovery mode works.
So two phones owned with in two weeks, from the same shop....different beasts. Quality control anyone?
Just thought I'd share my experiences with you.
Pete.

Good to hear your up and running on a proper phone.
One thing people don't seem to get is that when it come to mass production/manufacturing, there are going to be units that get shipped that are defective.
Quality control cannot possibly check every unit 100%, most is done by the way of batch inspection ( a few units from each batch) to check for major/minor flaws.
This goes for all manufactured products. I bought a Sharp LCD TV a few years ago and when I got it home I noticed there were significant ghost images especially in dark scenes. I took it back and they told me that 1 in 5 of any TV is defective. I took home another one, same make and model, have had it for over two years and it is still crystal clear.
Once people realize this they will enjoy their products much more. Put them to the test, in store or at home and keep it if it's good, return it if it's not. If you are happy with a product other than a possible defect it makes no sense to exchange it for something else unless you go through a few and they all have defects then this indicates poor quality all together. If possible, go to a different location to make the exchange, it is possible for one store to get a whole bad batch.
This does not mean that there is no crap out there. No shortage of that for sure. That said, who can name ONE manufacturer, besides Ferrari, that puts out 100% non defective products. ;-)

Hey man, yeah I agree with most of what your saying. It just surprised me a little how the same product can differ, but I guess this goes some way to explaining the different opinions / problems people have on / with the same hardware.
I'm happy now because I think I've got a good one, but someone else may not be so lucky. The thing is I would never have known the difference, if I hadn't had it swapped out.
By the way, didn't Ferrari have to recall the 458 Italia recently for turning into a fireball?

hansonator said:
Good to hear your up and running on a proper phone.
One thing people don't seem to get is that when it come to mass production/manufacturing, there are going to be units that get shipped that are defective.
Quality control cannot possibly check every unit 100%, most is done by the way of batch inspection ( a few units from each batch) to check for major/minor flaws.
This goes for all manufactured products. I bought a Sharp LCD TV a few years ago and when I got it home I noticed there were significant ghost images especially in dark scenes. I took it back and they told me that 1 in 5 of any TV is defective. I took home another one, same make and model, have had it for over two years and it is still crystal clear.
Once people realize this they will enjoy their products much more. Put them to the test, in store or at home and keep it if it's good, return it if it's not. If you are happy with a product other than a possible defect it makes no sense to exchange it for something else unless you go through a few and they all have defects then this indicates poor quality all together. If possible, go to a different location to make the exchange, it is possible for one store to get a whole bad batch.
This does not mean that there is no crap out there. No shortage of that for sure. That said, who can name ONE manufacturer, besides Ferrari, that puts out 100% non defective products. ;-)
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Hate to say this but theres been a recall on a certain Ferrari (458 Italia) due to about 5 sudden engine fires , Seems they are infact too HOT to handle. Heaps of pics of them fire on google
So eh.. even Ferrari has problems
Also it seems that Samsung had enough of noobs flashing beta roms and bricking them so they disabled the recovery modes after the first batch of the device. I myself don't really care as they never advertisted the fact the device has a recovery mode but everyone else seem to think its their RIGHT to have that mode so I'm guessing theres heaps of demands for exchanges which is cloging up the repair centres/supply for legit problems.

Actually, bell Canada re-released the UGJH2 build for the i9000m with the spl fix which enables the the recovery/download mode.

madpete said:
So two phones owned with in two weeks, from the same shop....different beasts. Quality control anyone?
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Your previous phone might have had faulty hardware, but its more likely that it had a different (buggy) firmware.

LOL, did not hear about that. Well there you go. If a company that hand builds and rigorously tests every unit that it sells can put out duds then expect nothing from anybody.

hehe i know the feeling. my girlfriend and i both got a galaxy S in the same week from the same shop..
connecting to Kies was for her no probs at all..
for me: it was a total pain in the ass

androiderer said:
Actually, bell Canada re-released the UGJH2 build for the i9000m with the spl fix which enables the the recovery/download mode.
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Could you clarify what you mean by this? I have a liberated (unlocked) i9000m that I'm using with Fido, is this an update I could install?
Thanks.
Sent from my GT-I9000M using XDA App

I've got 2 Galaxy S' here, one of them has a bluish tint, and the other one has a yellow tint. <_<

sturmeh said:
I've got 2 Galaxy S' here, one of them has a bluish tint, and the other one has a yellow tint. <_<
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I've had the exact same thing today. I saw the new Galaxy S from a friend, and it was way more bluish than my yellow display. Is this soft- or hardware related??

Any differences between the performance of these guys?
I'm very pleased with the 2nd handset I've got, curious now if its hardware or software....
I can appreciate now why some people have issues with what is a great phone.

I've just returned my Galaxy S due to a bad flash (caused by Kies crashing) and an inability to get into recovery mode. I've had a couple of Android phones and flashed software on them so I'm not a noob but nowhere near an expert. I took it to their approved repairer to be told that because they couldn't get recovery mode there was nothing they could do and I'd need to contact Samsung to arrange an exchange as the unit was obviously faulty.
I was annoyed with Samsung's response. First they said they'd organise an exchange (the phone's only 3 weeks old) and when no-one contacted me to organise I called them and they said they couldn't exchange and I'd need to take it to their approved repairers and get a job number. I explained their repairer wouldn't give me a job number as there was nothing they could do. Eventually I managed to speak to someone at Samsung who was organising a send-back bag to me so they could see for themselves there was a problem. Guess what, that was Wednesday and no bag arrived. I took the phone to the first approved repairer and asked them to send back to Samsung and deal with it.
I was told it would take about two weeks but that when it comes back not to expect the problem to be fixed as the work is normally subbed out to another company. The aftersales from Samsung is absolutely shocking to say the least and I've gone from recommending the phone to everyone I know to keeping my mouth shut or trying to push people in another direction.

Guess I was lucky I had a 28 day DOA then, that's not good. Sorry to hear that man, customer service is everything.

woutertichelaar said:
I've had the exact same thing today. I saw the new Galaxy S from a friend, and it was way more bluish than my yellow display. Is this soft- or hardware related??
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It is normal that happens during the manufacturing of the display

boogie71071 said:
The aftersales from Samsung is absolutely shocking to say the least and I've gone from recommending the phone to everyone I know to keeping my mouth shut or trying to push people in another direction.
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What country are you in?

Catalyst2012 said:
What country are you in?
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I'm in the UK.
As an update, had a call from Samsung today saying they'd reviewed my complaint and felt the service I'd received was shoddy and they'd push my repair/replacement along as quick as they can once they get the handset back (fingers crossed but not expecting miracles)

3G upload cap fix to be rolled out this week!

Taken from the official Sprint thread here:
http://community.sprint.com/baw/thread/43883?start=540&tstart=0&reqsorting=dec
"Good news - an update will be released tomorrow 9/30. It will be rolled out over a 4 day period so not everyone will get it on day 1.
I will have the standard MR information (fixes included, rollout schedule, etc) available tomorrow morning and will post it in a new featured thread."
AWESOME!

yea, the day after the 30 days is up for people that bought on the first day, so not really that awesome, lets just pray it fixes the problem. I'm not really optomistic to be honest. Just to convenient to hold off like this.

Second update since release. I do have to admit, it's kind of nice to see Samsung actually supporting a phone for once.

This is great news! And we are getting Cyanogen Mod 6! I couldn't be happier. :-D

robl45 said:
yea, the day after the 30 days is up for people that bought on the first day, so not really that awesome, lets just pray it fixes the problem. I'm not really optomistic to be honest. Just to convenient to hold off like this.
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While I understand where you're coming from, I agree with styckx that it's just good to see them doing something about it. I do wish they'd acted on this more quickly, but better to roll out a fix now than wait months to release one or not release one at all.

It's crazy to hear people complain about updates from Samsung from my perspective. I'm a Touch pro 1 owner that basically received no updates from Sprint/HTC. And previous to that was the Mogul that went months without an advertised feature (Rev A/GPS). I'm way more wary about HTC than Samsung.
Epic ordered finally here. Was waiting for 10/1.

fooo1 said:
It's crazy to hear people complain about updates from Samsung from my perspective. I'm a Touch pro 1 owner that basically received no updates from Sprint/HTC. And previous to that was the Mogul that went months without an advertised feature (Rev A/GPS). I'm way more wary about HTC than Samsung.
Epic ordered finally here. Was waiting for 10/1.
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It stems from Samsung's history, mainly with the T-Mobile Behold 2. They advertised that it would be getting Android 2.x then never delivered on their promise and stranded users with 1.6. While HTC has probably been the best manufacturer in terms of supporting their Android phones.

I had a launch day Hero, and I don't think support was the fastest for that either. Most everything I did through XDA and androidforums.<---alot faster than waiting for the manufacturer/carrier to roll out and update.
Just my thoughts...
Chris

cswee1932 said:
I had a launch day Hero, and I don't think support was the fastest for that either. Most everything I did through XDA and androidforums.<---alot faster than waiting for the manufacturer/carrier to roll out and update.
Just my thoughts...
Chris
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I've read a lot about Samsung after purchasing my Samsung Moment. I found they had a nice history of let downs and lack of support. Then the Moment went on and on without a mention of a fix, or patch, or anything. That was a complete lemon of a phone (data lock ups and unfixable GPS) that Samsung all but abandoned less than a year after launch and still to this day the Moment forums are mainly filled with people trying to fix data lock ups and the GPS. It's ashame really.
Epic was going to be my last run with Samsung, and despite some bumps in the road I've been pleased so far as they are at least taking initiative with this phone it seems. I personally think they have no choice. It's one thing to piss off 1 carriers customers, and another to piss off multiple carriers customers by not supporting a phone.
Hope the support continues.

so you guys are excited that they put out an update that fixed nothing and screwed up the phone? thats great, all it meant is I had to go and uninstall the mediahub crap so my battery life didn't suffer, the gps issue remains, the upload issue will likely remain after this update as well. so that really equates to them doing nothing in my eyes.

I've never experienced a upload cap on my phone. Does anyone know if this update includes other fixes other than just the 3g upload cap?

crajee16 said:
I've never experienced a upload cap on my phone. Does anyone know if this update includes other fixes other than just the 3g upload cap?
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Have you ran the Speed Test app on 3G? I've yet to see anyone get over a stable 150kbps (sure it bounces upwards towards 200 on occasion but then levels out). From working in hosting it shows exact throttling behavior, as it uploads it jumps past the 150 mark to around 170-180 and then down to a stable 150 almost immediately. It's hard to believe this to be some sort of coincidence since it's able to be replicated in many different 3G markets across the country.

punzada said:
Have you ran the Speed Test app on 3G? I've yet to see anyone get over a stable 150kbps (sure it bounces upwards towards 200 on occasion but then levels out). From working in hosting it shows exact throttling behavior, as it uploads it jumps past the 150 mark to around 170-180 and then down to a stable 150 almost immediately. It's hard to believe this to be some sort of coincidence since it's able to be replicated in many different 3G markets across the country.
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Lol, mine actually goes to like 6000+ for a little while, then dips down to under 50 kbps. Yes, under 50! I have some SpeedTest results that have come in under 20 kbps upload!
Even my 3G speed is horrible. Never over 500 download. I'm looking forward to this. Luckily I am usually either in a WiFi zone or a 4G zone.

punzada said:
From working in hosting it shows exact throttling behavior, as it uploads it jumps past the 150 mark to around 170-180 and then down to a stable 150 almost immediately.
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It may seem to be throttling behavior. Ultimately though, those of us aware of how a data radio and associated software *actually works* know full well that it's because the dwarf hamsters spinning in their wheels are, in fact, unionized. Because of the upload tragedy of 2009, in which millions of poor hamsters perished on the Touch Pro 2 because of faulty speed governors installed in the cages, strict regulations were put in place for the Epic, dictating that no hamster may run unsupervised in their wheels, and that they must trade off shifts every 128kB with their spotting partners. It's this switching that causes the fluctuations you observe during the speedtest runs. You may have noticed a bit more heft in the Epic vs say, the Captivate. You might mistakenly believe it's the keyboard, when in fact it is the added weight of the supervisory hamsters.
Another shortfall in communications speed arises because Samsung, to save weight from the added hamsters, decided to use smoke signals as a databus between the CPU and the baseband processor. This was chosen over the "flashing mirrors" approach due to cost and weight issues. This compounds the upload cap problem because as the phone rests in your pocket, it accumulates moisture. The soot particles from the smoke then seed rainclouds, which can interrupt the dataflow between baseband and CPU as the receiver operators duck for cover at a nearby tavern.
So, you see, this is clearly a compound problem. Obviously, this week's update will include a staff of more hamsters, more wheels, and dehumidifiers, all so your phone can shuttle data more efficiently. This is a brilliant feat of engineering, I might add. So, expect your phone to weigh more by the end of the week, though how much more, nobody knows. And please, do post the truth about how the phone's internals really work, punzada... anything else would be a blatant disservice to the hard-working bit-crunchers in your phone.

^^ wat
Also from that thread:
Desi,
I'm on the phone right now with tier 2 support to try to find out what's in the update because this is my last day if I'm going to return the phone and I'm being told that they don't see anything about the battery life, GPS, or this data upload issue in this release.
I know you said that you're putting that information up tomorrow, but I have to make a decision today.
The tech is saying there is NO FIX FOR THE CAP ISSUE FROM SAMSUNG yet or anything to improve the battery.
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Desi's (admin) reply:
Joe,
The 3G upload issue is definitely in the release.
I doubt the GPS issue is since I just forwarded input from this forum over to engineering for further analysis.
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I guess we will have to see if it actually fixes anything. But it seems like tier 2 is at least finally aware of (or admitting to) the problem with the upload. Doesn't sound like there will be anything for the battery or GPS though.

GlassGorilla said:
I guess we will have to see if it actually fixes anything. But it seems like tier 2 is at least finally aware of (or admitting to) the problem with the upload. Doesn't sound like there will be anything for the battery or GPS though.
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Battery and GPS are (for me, anyway) easy workarounds. 3G upload cap is what it is; there's no getting around it other than using wi-fi or 4G (which I can also usually do, but not everyone can).
I'll be happy to have that upload cap fixed if for no other reason than people will quit using it as an excuse to post "should I return my Epic for an Evo?" threads here and elsewhere.

My feeling is the amount of pressure on Sprint had an affect on how hard they pushed samsung.
That and the fact that until a few days ago users were being told for weeks running that no one but they were reporting the problem exacerbated the problem.
So it s a cause for celebration that they are pushing out a fix, but I don't think it is at all established that this would have occurred so soon if it where not for all the noise.
As far as GPS, not only are there problems, but the "advice" given by Sprint: use the unrelated "wireless networking" is an absolute laughable and patronizing dodge.
As others have noted, working around with cold starts or manual resets does fix the main issue.
I have been in contact with the moderator of eh Sprint forum privately some time ago, and he put me in with ADP (ADP, not ADS) on this issue. They are diagnosing it, and have not come to any conclusion other than they have seen the issue themselves.

aero1 said:
My feeling is the amount of pressure on Sprint had an affect on how hard they pushed samsung.
So it s a cause for celebration that they are pushing out a fix, but I don't think it is at all established that this would have occurred so soon if it where not for all the noise.
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Well. Apparently we have a voice, which is a good thing.
I'm hopeful, but I am not holding my breath. I think it is likely the vast majority of Epics were pre-ordered or bought on launch, 08/31. 30 days would be 09/30. The announcement could be an attempt to get people who bought on launch that were going to return it on the last day to keep their phones, and then when the update doesn't "may increase" or "possibly enhance" or whatever the legal gymnastics statement said, those people can't return the phone any more and Sprint isn't really under any obligation to fix it.
Whether it's an angleshoot or a genuine attempt to fix it, I am anxiously awaiting the first reports tomorrow.

GlassGorilla said:
I think it is likely the vast majority of Epics were pre-ordered or bought on launch, 08/31. 30 days would be 09/30. The announcement could be an attempt to get people who bought on launch that were going to return it on the last day to keep their phones, and then when the update doesn't "may increase" or "possibly enhance" or whatever the legal gymnastics statement said, those people can't return the phone any more and Sprint isn't really under any obligation to fix it. .
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Sprint is serious exposed to class action liberality, which involves not just awards, but legal costs, and more importantly really bad press.
I have a written note from ecare from last week saying no one has reported this issue. Hundreds of users seem to have been told the same thing. Not that the speeds are normal, but that they were low speeds but unique to the customer. That presents a legal liability for Sprint right here.
I think we will all know in a few days.

You guys should probably take a chill pill on the conspiracy theories already. I'm sure it would cost Sprint much less money and hassle just to fix this software issue rather than go out of their way to "conveniently" tell you that there's a "fix" that doesn't really exist but they used their "legal gymnastics" to trick you into holding onto your phone past the 30 day mark. They are a company that wishes to exist more than 2 more years, why would they go out of their way to screw you and guarantee you leave in two years when a couple of patches could save them and Samsung a ton of customers?
Its not like fixing this issue requires the recall and replacement of every phone, and them fixing this problem is not an incredibly inconvenient issue. You know why they're telling you the day before your 30 days that the update is coming? Because telling you after you return the phone wouldn't do anyone much good. Why didn't they tell you sooner? Because these things, while not impossible or some ludicrous endeavor, do take time.
I'm not even meaning to take their side really. Sure, they should have caught the issue before launch, and they should have addressed the issue in public... but if you're only gonna sign onto networks willing to do either of those things then you're not going to be purchasing a cell phone in America. I mean, Steve Job's stance on Antennagate is still "Shut up whiny babies, this issue doesn't exist, but I'll give you a free case if you shush and go back to fellating me..."

Online sale of G2 halted

I heard from another community that Tmo has halted the sale of G2, the people said that claims to have with connections in HTC. Newer G2 will have spring for their hinges to address the heated issue. US owner probably can have their G2s replaced. But people who have imported it (I am one of them) can just hope that the spring can be installed by local cellphone mechanics, or just live with it.

Where is this information coming from?
I personally have no problems with my G2 as is... but I'm sure a great many will be happy if this is true.

Please provide source. But I really hope HTC and T-mobile will make it up to their customers.

I got to elaborate...
I heard it from a non-English speaking Android community (one of the most well-known ones in the country)
someone questioned the guy by posting a picture of Tmo website with the G2 still on sale
then he replied that he got inside source and even you have ordered, you may have to wait and the people in the shops might not know it
I don 't live in the States, so non-US owners have to depend on US owners to prove if it is true by testing out the new G2s

o>c said:
I got to elaborate...
I heard it from a non-English speaking Android community (one of the most well-known ones in the country)
someone questioned the guy by posting a picture of Tmo website with the G2 still on sale
then he replied that he got inside source and even you have ordered, you may have to wait and the people in the shops might not know it
I don 't live in the States, so non-US owners have to depend on US owners to prove if it is true by testing out the new G2s
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So a lot of hearsay ... could wind up being interesting if it turns out to be true.

Remember
Remember, PT Barnum said it best... There's a sucker born every minute...

If you call TMO they will say it's back ordered for a week, but may ship much sooner. So only online sales are "halted", but TMO stores, Radio Shack and other resellers are still selling the "defective" units? I doubt it.

I am a manager of a Target Mobile and we have had no communication from T-Mobile about halting the sales of the G2.

The guy says he has inside info from HTC, not Tmo
All we can do is to wait and see if the newer G2s are spring loaded

I have no problems with mine, but I just might make some up if they next ones will be spring loaded haha. No worries here though, could careless sorta if this is fake.

Mog said:
I have no problems with mine, but I just might make some up if they next ones will be spring loaded haha. No worries here though, could careless sorta if this is fake.
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^^^ This....
If it is true great, if not oh well. Nothing really lost.
Might "brick" my phone via OC'ing if the spring loaded ones come out.

SuperFly03 said:
Might "brick" my phone via OC'ing if the spring loaded ones come out.
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I hate when people do stuff like this.
Just tell them you want the better hinge, or make up an issue that doesn't truly exist. There's no sense in destroying perfectly fine hardware just to satiate your little desires.

Jorsher said:
I hate when people do stuff like this.
Just tell them you want the better hinge, or make up an issue that doesn't truly exist. There's no sense in destroying perfectly fine hardware just to satiate your little desires.
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You can't actually kill something by OC'ing... they build in protection mechanisms on the CPU die itself. You'd have to ESD it or run it extremely overvolted for a serious period of time to do any actual damage.
Also, in all actuality the "crappy" hinge G2's would never be resold and thus would have 0 value.

Jorsher said:
I hate when people do stuff like this.
Just tell them you want the better hinge, or make up an issue that doesn't truly exist. There's no sense in destroying perfectly fine hardware just to satiate your little desires.
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I'd feel bad if HTC hadn't screwed us over and locked down the eMMC. With that said, go for it!

Interesting News. My hinges seem a bit loose. But, I already put the full body protector around it. I still have 30 days from radio shack to return.
I wonder if i should. If they got the new batch in yet. maybe I will go check.
Thanks for the info.
+1

Finally...some good news

Hello fellow DVP owners, I've been following all the issues we've had pretty closely and stalking DellCares twitter quite a bit. I know everyone has been focused alot on the issues with it but this is the first official word we've had that Dell is looking to address some of the issues.
emed795 Hi Erik, just wanted to let you know that DVP memory and other issues to be addressed in future sw update. No ETA yet. Thanks, AB 6:00 PM Jan 13th via CoTweet
im_thatoneguy Software update for DVP camera in progress, no ETA on it yet. Let us know how troubleshooting steps worked for you. SV 5:39 PM Jan 6th via CoTweet
Hopefully WiFi is also included in this update........

Saw the Twitter post. Hmm, well, another promise. Hope they do something. Of course, we'll have to go through the long, long wait, but this sort of goes with Dell's MO--problems addressed (in part) in the future. At least in my experience with them. It'd be nice to avoid problems at the get-go, but as they say, "Remaking the world, now that is folly."
At least they're not being adamantly silent about it.

Too little too late and still no mention of an international release. I've given up on that phone and everyone should at least until MWC. There are alternatives if you can't wait and if you can there will be stuff at MWC.

Peew971 said:
Too little too late and still no mention of an international release. I've given up on that phone and everyone should at least until MWC. There are alternatives if you can't wait and if you can there will be stuff at MWC.
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The phone works fine for me, can even use wifi with a workaround so I'm quite happy with it. With the DVP being one of only 2 options for T-Mobile US users there really isnt much of a choice if you want a WP7 phone. You guys in Europe have more options to choose from, but if the issues are resovled it will be one of the best WP7 devices. And again MWC may bring new devices but I doubt they will be US bound so again the DVP still looks like a good buy to me. Even the camera can be made to produce good pictures with some adjustment of the settings, so this update will definitely be a plus.

efjay said:
The phone works fine for me, can even use wifi with a workaround so I'm quite happy with it. With the DVP being one of only 2 options for T-Mobile US users there really isnt much of a choice if you want a WP7 phone. You guys in Europe have more options to choose from, but if the issues are resovled it will be one of the best WP7 devices. And again MWC may bring new devices but I doubt they will be US bound so again the DVP still looks like a good buy to me. Even the camera can be made to produce good pictures with some adjustment of the settings, so this update will definitely be a plus.
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What has the tech world come to when we pay for a premium product and we are forced to accept work arounds to get it to work. I understand that some fixes are always needed but most are usually software related (WP7 being new) but this device seems to have more issues that are directly related to the unit itself.
I have to say every time I hold one I am drawn to it but I have a hard time with a unit that costs this much and has these kinds of issues.
I hope that Dell can get the fixes out there quick so that we can get more of these in people's hands.

gshocker said:
What has the tech world come to when we pay for a premium product and we are forced to accept work arounds to get it to work. I understand that some fixes are always needed but most are usually software related (WP7 being new) but this device seems to have more issues that are directly related to the unit itself.
I have to say every time I hold one I am drawn to it but I have a hard time with a unit that costs this much and has these kinds of issues.
I hope that Dell can get the fixes out there quick so that we can get more of these in people's hands.
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Click to collapse
I understand your point but is there a perfect device? Even the phone to rule all phones (iphone) has issues (bumper anyone?), the WP7 OS itself has a reproducable bug on every handset with the MP crashing, yet we still use it. Problem with the Dell was the high expectations of the device since it was first leaked, then we had to deal with the release delays, shipping issues, virtually no communication from Dell and then after finally getting the device bugs that affected what could be considered fundamental functions. Probably led many to either give up and purchase something else or return it after receiving it and feeling it didnt live up to the expectation.
However the fact that I am happy to use a workaround does not mean I have accepted the faults and overlook them, I and others have contacted Dell and told them about the issues and as any decent company would they have responded with an upcoming fix (more than we can say for HTC and the pink camera bug on the HD7). This is what I would expect of any company and since Dell has responded I'm OK with a workaround till the fix is released. If there was another bug free device available to me I would have switched to that, but there isnt on my carrier so I still use it as I personally have no other option on T-Mo US. This whole saga could have gone better and will obviously be a factor in any future decision about purchasing a Dell smartphone but for now I feel satisfied with the choice I made, all things considered.

I think I am willing to be a bit more forgiving, given that I used to be a Software Developer. I understand the qualms of getting bugs fixed ASAP, but the SDLC doesn't allow it all the time. I am also willing to cut Dell some slack because the guys in the Mobility team have been awesome. Sure, customer service at Dell, as a whole, sucks monkey balls, but once they have you transferred to the right team, they're quite helpful. I think a huge issue for a lot of people is that they don't like talking to people from India, and then that's where all the bashing starts. I guess it depends on your tolerance level?!
If it is a concession, I spoke to someone in the Mobility team yesterday evening and they confirmed that these issues (camera, bluetooth, WiFi, etc.) are known and have been escalated. She did not know about how soon the update would roll out.
I think if they continue to communicate with us early adopters and roll out a software update to address some of these core issues, they'll at least have one happy camper on their side.

I am pretty patient with my devices these days, and with purchasing a first gen device (from a company with little experience in mobile) I am even more forgiving. Worst case scenario, I sell the phone and buy something else, lesson learned. From my experience with Dell (currently and past) they get fixes out, it just takes some time.
I won't be making any of those decisions on this phone until we see the issues with memory and camera fixed (WiFi is much less of an issue for me because I'm in a "4G" zone.) For now, I love the form factor, and I get more questions and "wow's" than anyone else when they see me pull the thing out with the giant DELL logo on the back (teh sex).

I'm generally happy; I have very few problems. The worst one was Monday the phone locked up while charging overnight so my alarm didn't go off.
I'm much more irritated by Dell's almost total silence on what issues they're aware of, which are being investigated, etc, etc. Heck, the twitter feed is the only confirmation we have that they even consider the RAM reports from the WP7 API an issue to investigate!
Still, the device is very responsive and performs very well as I suck its battery dry on Xbox Live, so I'll hang on to it and wait patiently for updates.
Thanks for pestering Dell for us!

efjay said:
The phone works fine for me, can even use wifi with a workaround so I'm quite happy with it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
can you describe the workaround and what it fixes for you?

xthing said:
can you describe the workaround and what it fixes for you?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I disable 3G in the Cellular settings, but I have had 1 crash with that turned off so it may not be a consistent fix.

That just made my week. Hopefully it comes soon.
efjay, I've been trying your workaround and I think it's working. Thank you!

Saitek009 said:
That just made my week. Hopefully it comes soon.
efjay, I've been trying your workaround and I think it's working. Thank you!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good to hear, don't know why it doesn't work for me anymore but hopefully Dell's fix won't be long.

Froyogate page

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Froyogate/112615255487997
Just started this page, like it if you do. I will update tomorrow. I know it wont do much, but it makes me feel better. If anyone wants to help, PM me here or on Facebook.

Why worry about this when you see things progressing? You're wasting your time, watch development and you will be happier than you would be with stock froyo anyway.

I see things progressing because off our devs, not because of verizon or samsung. I'm tired of big business getting away with anything they want. I get your point, but I'm still trying to get answers.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA Premium App

Quite frankly, no one will care about a Facebook page. Even if everyone on XDA with a Fascinate liked it, it still wouldn't be anywhere near an impressive number.
And Verizon/Samsung haven't really 'lied' to us (not counting their lower level reps, but no one should be trusting them anyways), they've never officially promised any sort of release date AFAIK... meaning long as they eventually release it, they'll have kept their promise (things like 'soon' are totally subjective, which is why they say them).
Verizon/Samsung have, simply put, just given us terrible support. We're low priority for them- we're basically an offbrand (i.e. not a Droid) phone, with a relatively small userbase. We're small fish in a big sea. Taken on top of Verizon & Samsungs already poor support, it really shouldn't be a surprise to us that we're still waiting for Froyo (unfortunately that's a lot easier to realize in retrospect... if I'd realized it back then, I'd have likely gone with the Incredible).

It is so sad that we are considered "not a droid". The one thing that attracted me to my Fascinate was the nice hardware, sweet screen, and the Android OS. I don't know what I would do without the devs around here. It's a shame that we have been swept under the rug by Samsung and VZW.
Sent from my ComaVolted Fascinate running SC 2.9.2

KitsuneKnight said:
Quite frankly, no one will care about a Facebook page. Even if everyone on XDA with a Fascinate liked it, it still wouldn't be anywhere near an impressive number.
And Verizon/Samsung haven't really 'lied' to us (not counting their lower level reps, but no one should be trusting them anyways), they've never officially promised any sort of release date AFAIK... meaning long as they eventually release it, they'll have kept their promise (things like 'soon' are totally subjective, which is why they say them).
Verizon/Samsung have, simply put, just given us terrible support. We're low priority for them- we're basically an offbrand (i.e. not a Droid) phone, with a relatively small userbase. We're small fish in a big sea. Taken on top of Verizon & Samsungs already poor support, it really shouldn't be a surprise to us that we're still waiting for Froyo (unfortunately that's a lot easier to realize in retrospect... if I'd realized it back then, I'd have likely gone with the Incredible).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed, but if we never take any action, the corportations will continue as usual and we will get even less actions. Corporations already run this country. Its not we the people anymore, its whatever corporate america buys in our congress.

Just like it! Is that a lot to ask?

Just vote with your wallet and don't buy samsung phones anymore.
Also, always make it a habite to tell anyone shopping for a phone about how bad samsung is and why they shouldn't buy a samsung phone.
It's amazing how many people are complaining about froyo, yet they get really excited when they hear about the Galaxy S 2 that's coming out soon!!!!

modus81 said:
Just vote with your wallet and don't buy samsung phones anymore.
Also, always make it a habite to tell anyone shopping for a phone about how bad samsung is and why they shouldn't buy a samsung phone.
It's amazing how many people are complaining about froyo, yet they get really excited when they hear about the Galaxy S 2 that's coming out soon!!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I will NEVER buy another samsung phone, Eff the Galaxy S2. It's too bad, the fascinate has some great qualities, but I refuse to give money to someone who doesn't care. I was burnt once, not gonna get me again. I'm debating if I leave Verizon, quite honestly.
I completely agree with you about voting with your wallet!

I will always argue that you should make your decisions based on the hardware. Not the software, not the manufacturer, not the carrier. Hardware will always win out, and Samsung makes great hardware.

Kevin Gossett said:
I will always argue that you should make your decisions based on the hardware. Not the software, not the manufacturer, not the carrier. Hardware will always win out, and Samsung makes great hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I used to say the same thing, based upon past experience with numerous WinMo phones.
I no longer agree. Not in the least. I had a Samsung WinMo, but my last two WinMo phones were HTC. Compared to this Samsung.....
a) The Samsung pulls 300ma max from the PC USB port. That is fine. It only pulls 650ma max from a 5 volt adapter. The phone can consume well over 650ma to operate as a car GPS (screen bright, downloading map data, etc). So, the battery can rather quickly die even plugged into a high rate charger in the car. I have never seen an HTC phone do that. If the operating current goes up, the HTC pulls more current from the charger. Usually up to about 1 amp. So if it is plugged into a high rate charger, the HTC phones will never drain the battery even in the worst conditions. Charge rate FAIL.
b) In total darkness, it is too bright. In bright sun, it is too dim. You can go to manual mode, and adjust to a good level, but that misses the point of having the AUTO sensor... Auto brightness adjust FAIL.
c) On my phone, when used for a long while on charge at high brightness (car again), the four bottom buttons appear to be pressed randomly. The phone becomes a worthless brick. According to Verizon, this is fairly normal for the generated heat and there isn't anything I can do but not use it when it is charging. FAIL button sensor sensitivity. (though I believe this is just my phone being defective, and I can't get it fixed)
d) Charge plug. Who designed that piece of garbage. Pretty much every plug I have, and I have a lot of them, had to be cut up in the front side to allow it to fully seat in the Samsung jack. FAIL plug placement.
e) No notification LED. What??? FAIL.
f) Minor items like the mediocre loudspeaker placement, no camera button, and slippery back cover add up to another FAIL IMHO.
I used to think highly of Samsung devices from my past experience. This device has tarnished that image. I would only recommend this phone to someone because I thought they might want to buy this one that I have.

So, I sent an email to verizon, and this is what I got....
Good afternoon Mr. ****,
Thank you for contacting Verizon Wireless through our website. My name is Nicholas and resolving your issue is my top priority. I sincerely apologize that you are dissatisfied with the new froyo software update not being available for the Samsung Fascinate. I can recognize the importance in having the newest, most sophisticated software when purchasing new equipment. Despite all, I'm eager to assist with all of your concerns today.
Mr. *****, I can understand your urgency in regards to this matter. However, before new software is released, it must be approved by the manufacturer ( Samsung ) and Verizon Wireless. Therefore, based on this process I'm unable to provide a definitive answer as to when the froyo software update will be available for the Fascinate. This information is not readily available for the public. Nonetheless, if or when it becomes available you will receive a text on the handset prompting you to update your phone.
Additionally, based on your inconvenience I've issued a $ 50.00 courtesy credit on the account. The total credit amount of ( $ 50.00) , will appear on your next billing statement, ( Apr. 26, 2011 ), and will include an additional adjustment for taxes if applicable. You can check your revised balance immediately by dialing from you wireless device, # BAL and the SEND button. You will be connected with an automated system which will relay your account balance as a free text message to your wireless phone. You may also continue to listen and follow the voice prompts to receive the information airtime-free. You will be provided with the amount and date of your most recent payment, as well as your current balance due.
Lastly, I am also pleased to offer you the option of obtaining a new device with the software update currently, if it doesn't become available for the Fascinate. This offer will not extend your contract nor upgrade date. If you wish to take advantage of this option, you may contact me directly at ( 803 ) 231 - 1825 / Mon - Fri / 2:30pm. - 11:00pm. For your added convenience, below I've listed a link that includes our available device line - up. I hope you find this information to be beneficial:
So it does pay to continue to fight the good fight! I suggest you ALL email verizon and let them know your unhappy!!!

My old Samsung dumb-phone was wonderful. I took crap care of it, and it took a beating (I'd frequently toss it), I'd never give a single concern for maintaining the battery, it got great signal pretty much everywhere (when I went to the woods with a bunch of people, the people on AT&T would have a paper weight, the other people on Verizon would have occasional signal, and I'd have consistent, albeit poor, signal), and I'd easily go a week on a charge.
Occasionally I'd get hit by a software bug, like once ever several months, but over the several years I had the phone (5+ I think?), those were quite few in number.
My Fascinate, on the other hand, other than the screen the hardware seems moderate at best. The processor/GPU don't matter a lot long as they're at least as good as what 'most people' have, since generally programs are designed to be used on the more common phones. Now the GPU could have been leveraged on Gingerbread, but, we don't really have Gingerbread, although people like PK are working on it.
There's also 'only' 384 MBs of usable RAM in the phone, meaning less apps can be kept asleep in the background, causing apps to have to save their state & be restarted more often (IIRC, all the other Galaxy S phones have 512 usable!).
Then there's the GPS. It was flat out broken when Samsung released this phone, and I still have a horrible GPS- the other day it took ~25 minutes for the GPS to lock (even after downloading AGPS data, and getting the no help that cellular triangulation and wifi location services provides), just in time for us to miss the turn to our destination! (resulting in everyone agreeing that my phone "sucked").
No notification LED... we've had to work around that with 'No LED' and BLN- hardly ideal solutions... more like clever hacks. 802.11N also doesn't support the 5Ghz band, apparently... lovely. The battery life is also nothing to write home about. And there's quite a number of other shortcomings with this phone's hardware.
Is the Fascinate's hardware horrible? No, with the exception of the screen (which is quite good), most of it's around par, some above, some below. But the Fascinate's problem is it's crippled by horrible software! Our Devs will fix that, you say? So how's that CM7 working for you? MIUI? AOSP? Your options, at this point, are either use a hacked up Samsung ROM, or lose various hardware support. Is it because our devs suck? Hell no, they've long since shown they're damn good at what they do- but even so they can only do so much at a time. Take the best hardware in the world, but put **** software on it, and you've got ****. Bad software will ruin any hardware.
Good software on bad hardware, though, can at least make the hardware bearable. Next time, I'm picking my phone based off which actually has a fully custom ROMs ported to it, like MIUI or CyanogenMod- that should be a good indicator of how good the software support should be- then I'll go by hardware.
Edit: New post while I was writing... Does "obtaining a new device" mean, "trade in for a phone with Froyo"? If so... that's quite surprising, and it'd be interesting exactly what phones are available for that. Although, at this point, I just feel like taking it until my renewal comes around- all the phones are going to be far superior by then, and, with any luck, this sort of BS will have been reined in by Google.

Im going to call tomorrow and see what that means....but its a start. 50 bucks off my bill is nice!

modus81 said:
Just vote with your wallet and don't buy samsung phones anymore.
Also, always make it a habite to tell anyone shopping for a phone about how bad samsung is and why they shouldn't buy a samsung phone.
It's amazing how many people are complaining about froyo, yet they get really excited when they hear about the Galaxy S 2 that's coming out soon!!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
but look at the specs on the galaxy S2, at least here in america its gonna have the samsung Exynos chip that is a 1.2 Ghz Dual Core, 1 GB of RAM a super AMOLED+ screen and does FULL HD VIDEO </Sarcasm>
sounds nice but knowing samsung it won't receive any support i've only had this phone since thursday and i really, really don't like it and wish that even with the locked bootloader i had gone with the droid X simply because i'd like to have gingerbread instead of eclair, though putting the miui alpha on it sorta make the fascinate worth while

420fan said:
So, I sent an email to verizon, and this is what I got....
Good afternoon Mr. ****,
Thank you for contacting Verizon Wireless through our website. My name is Nicholas and resolving your issue is my top priority. I sincerely apologize that you are dissatisfied with the new froyo software update not being available for the Samsung Fascinate. I can recognize the importance in having the newest, most sophisticated software when purchasing new equipment. Despite all, I'm eager to assist with all of your concerns today.
Mr. *****, I can understand your urgency in regards to this matter. However, before new software is released, it must be approved by the manufacturer ( Samsung ) and Verizon Wireless. Therefore, based on this process I'm unable to provide a definitive answer as to when the froyo software update will be available for the Fascinate. This information is not readily available for the public. Nonetheless, if or when it becomes available you will receive a text on the handset prompting you to update your phone.
Additionally, based on your inconvenience I've issued a $ 50.00 courtesy credit on the account. The total credit amount of ( $ 50.00) , will appear on your next billing statement, ( Apr. 26, 2011 ), and will include an additional adjustment for taxes if applicable. You can check your revised balance immediately by dialing from you wireless device, # BAL and the SEND button. You will be connected with an automated system which will relay your account balance as a free text message to your wireless phone. You may also continue to listen and follow the voice prompts to receive the information airtime-free. You will be provided with the amount and date of your most recent payment, as well as your current balance due.
Lastly, I am also pleased to offer you the option of obtaining a new device with the software update currently, if it doesn't become available for the Fascinate. This offer will not extend your contract nor upgrade date. If you wish to take advantage of this option, you may contact me directly at ( 803 ) 231 - 1825 / Mon - Fri / 2:30pm. - 11:00pm. For your added convenience, below I've listed a link that includes our available device line - up. I hope you find this information to be beneficial:
So it does pay to continue to fight the good fight! I suggest you ALL email verizon and let them know your unhappy!!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you dont mind me asking, what all was in your email? It may be beneficial to know the way you went about contacting them if there are those (like myself wishing to get a tbolt lol) that want to go this route. Also what email address did you send the complaint to?

Neuman.Tim said:
If you dont mind me asking, what all was in your email? It may be beneficial to know the way you went about contacting them if there are those (like myself wishing to get a tbolt lol) that want to go this route. Also what email address did you send the complaint to?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yea, I emailed and they called me back. They offered to give me a new phone line instead... I would also have to pay for another phone... Bogus... What did you tell them?

I've looked for the email on yhier website and all and I can't find it. Anyone got a quick link to it?
Sent from my ADR6400L using XDA Premium App

http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/contact/index.jsp
is the page I used.
Email I sent
Why am I still waiting for my fascinate to be updated to froyo? All the other galaxy S phones have received it, Samsung has given you the code, now I am curious as to why we still don't have it. I was told when I purchased the phone that it would be 'soon'. I did a lot of research and am tired of being lied to by your company. Your contract states that I can't lie to you, but your are not held responsible for what an agent tells me. WTF is that?? You will probably loose my business when my contract is up, and maybe even before if I can sell this phone. Why won't you take care of your existing customers? Too busy trying to sell 4G when its not even in my area. I was told 'soon' about that too! I understand that the email I will get will say Im sorry for the delay, but we are working hard at it....BLAH BLAH BLAH!!!!

420fan said:
I see things progressing because off our devs, not because of verizon or samsung. I'm tired of big business getting away with anything they want. I get your point, but I'm still trying to get answers.
Sent from my SCH-I500 using XDA Premium App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm afraid I have to disagree with you. While it's very true that our devs are to be applauded for their efforts, the very reason that we have working Froyo roms like SuperClean (aside from jt's AOSP, which still is lacking a few features) is because of leaked builds from Samsung/Verizon. Our devs did not make those, only released them and cleaned them up a bit. We have three leaked builds total now, so there is no longer any basis upon which to claim that the official update will not be released. They would not be putting that much work into builds for this phone if they did not intend to release it once it's complete. Also, I think we should be grateful that they are taking the time to properly fix issues like GPS, which the new radio does, instead of rushing a new release with more bugs.
I too am disappointed at the time it's taking for them to get this release out, but it is clearly coming, and soon, if the last leak is any evidence at all, so I think we all just need to remain patient for a little bit longer. However, I do have one question. We have had working Froyo roms here for quite some time now. If you're posting here on XDA, I can only assume you're interested in modifying your phone, as opposed to leaving it stock, since that is, after all, what XDA is all about. If that is true, why are you still complaining about the lack of official release? Just install SuperClean or your rom of choice and move on.
Sent from XDA Premium on my Super Clean Fascinate