Database Users

How XDA might be able to distribute ROM's legally without starting from scratch.

Just a thought... is it possible that we (XDA) could get a member of the OHA such as HTC (knowing they have a wiki already and are majorly banking on Android) or another vendor to "open a space" on their official wiki for us to host our ROM's? Something that has a clause in the membership stating that we agree that they have the right to incorporate anything that they want out of the developed ROM's into their own build and we get access to legally redistribute the Google apps as we are "members" of the vendor's development/testing team. Knowing the spirit of this community and the truly open attitude it supports I am sure this would be something that you all would be happy to agree with. This would protect the developers that have spent so much time making Android amazing and give the vendor an amazing "think tank" in action. This would basically give them hundreds or thousands of developers at no cost all innovating for themselves but contributing to the success.
**If you are a vendor reading...Just think of the great publicity your company would get for this small investment in the Android community**
This should allow us to continue to use XDA for most of our needs but give us a "safe place" to continue innovation.

i have a feeling, htc would do the opposite and send out C&D letters to all the hero devs since they are distributing htc's close source apps such as all of its htc widgets and apps and sense ui itself.

NguyenHuu said:
i have a feeling, htc would do the opposite and send out C&D letters to all the hero devs since they are distributing htc's close source apps such as all of its htc widgets and apps and sense ui itself.
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Click to collapse
Probably so but if we sell the idea of them having so many developers working on the project for free they might just jump.

As stated by some one else (i forgot who) just because we are in the oha doesent mean we have access to the closed source we would have to license it out **if** they allow us

jjcd51590 said:
As stated by some one else (i forgot who) just because we are in the oha doesent mean we have access to the closed source we would have to license it out **if** they allow us
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I recall that statement but if we where "honorary members/developers" of/for the vendor then we could fall under the shadow of their ability to develop with/distribute Google's apps for "the vendor's" development testers (us).

lock or merge please~~~~

jaaronmoody said:
lock or merge please~~~~
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With what???
This is a new idea that if gotten into the right inspired hands is another possibility that shouldn't get lost in the context of the other ideas.

XDA does not host any of the roms anyway. Whether normal activities can be conducted here is not really an issue. WinMo users have been doing the same thing here for a long time, and it is far from OS. The developers who choose to post links to their roms that contain questionable content do so at their own risk.
Also if you didn't notice, they already have us as a testing/development team. They can read this forum just like the rest of us. This is probably the reason most of what is done here is overlooked by folks like HTC. Even if we are a rather large user base, compared to the total # of Android users we are still only a few. They probably see it like "oh they got ahold of the Hero image huh? Too late to complain now. Just leave 'em be and let 'em hack at it a bit. Maybe they'll see or fix something we didn't" It's the better way to handle it PR wise.
Regardless of whether they mind what the end user is doing, I doubt HTC would be very willing to jump on board & slap google like that. We should probably leave that subject alone, and be glad they aren't complaining too.
Not that this isn't a good idea. I even suggested forming a group to join the OHA so we could attempt to license the apps, and be more in the loop. Just don't think HTC will go for it.

jaaronmoody said:
lock or merge please~~~~
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Do you make any other kind of posts?
At the OP this would be good idea if we could pull it off

gurnted said:
XDA does not host any of the roms anyway. Whether normal activities can be conducted here is not really an issue. WinMo users have been doing the same thing here for a long time, and it is far from OS. The developers who choose to post links to their roms that contain questionable content do so at their own risk.
Also if you didn't notice, they already have us as a testing/development team. They can read this forum just like the rest of us. This is probably the reason most of what is done here is overlooked by folks like HTC. Even if we are a rather large user base, compared to the total # of Android users we are still only a few. They probably see it like "oh they got ahold of the Hero image huh? Too late to complain now. Just leave 'em be and let 'em hack at it a bit. Maybe they'll see or fix something we didn't" It's the better way to handle it PR wise.
Regardless of whether they mind what the end user is doing, I doubt HTC would be very willing to jump on board & slap google like that. We should probably leave that subject alone, and be glad they aren't complaining too.
Not that this isn't a good idea. I even suggested forming a group to join the OHA so we could attempt to license the apps, and be more in the loop. Just don't think HTC will go for it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have considered all of the facts you have listed which are valid points but if HTC wouldn't do it which I only used as an example some other vendor might do it. I just think that HTC is the preferred vendor as most of us use their equipment. This wouldn't be a slap to Google, it would be a way to endorse us as part of their development team.
By the way the OHA membership is a great idea. I think both options should be explored.

david1171 said:
Do you make any other kind of posts?
At the OP this would be good idea if we could pull it off
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Click to collapse
Any idea which Senior Members had connections inside HTC?
I work for a carrier and the HTC rep I deal with isn't the best to go to with something like this.

Wrong forum, just because Dream Development is the most popular doesn't mean you post unrelated topics in it.

Gary13579 said:
Wrong forum, just because Dream Development is the most popular doesn't mean you post unrelated topics in it.
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Click to collapse
So where should something like this be posted???
The idea I am trying to get out there doesn't fit into anything else as it is geared to creating an Android development resource.
Something that if it somehow works saves us all from doing what we all do already illegally.

Gary13579 said:
Wrong forum, just because Dream Development is the most popular doesn't mean you post unrelated topics in it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Never mind I guess. Looks like I got moved to the forum you saw fit.

Honestly, it shouldn't even be posted .
Not to be rude, but something like this would probably never work. Who all are licensing the software from Google? HTC, Samsung, maybe one or two more? These are all gigantic corporations who would laugh at it, imho.
We would have a better chance of contacting Google and asking how much they want for a license, then starting a donation drive.

Yeah I guess I could see someone stepping up to support this. All they would have to do is give permission to mod their roms. They could then look like the good guys who give their users a choice. I could see it now "Don't like our stock build of Android? Try one of these, or make your own." Now that would be the move to make for one of these companies who claim their phones are all about being "user customizable"
We would have a better chance of contacting Google and asking how much they want for a license, then starting a donation drive.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This stands a way better chance than the other option though.

Gary13579 said:
Honestly, it shouldn't even be posted .
Not to be rude, but something like this would probably never work. Who all are licensing the software from Google? HTC, Samsung, maybe one or two more? These are all gigantic corporations who would laugh at it, imho.
We would have a better chance of contacting Google and asking how much they want for a license, then starting a donation drive.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't disagree that we should gun for a license but like I said previously I work for a carrier and I believe they would go for something like this but I figure that a vendor would be a more likely target.

gurnted said:
Yeah I guess I could see someone stepping up to support this. All they would have to do is give permission to mod their roms. They could then look like the good guys who give their users a choice. I could see it now "Don't like our stock build of Android? Try one of these, or make your own." Now that would be the move to make for one of these companies who claim their phones are all about being "user customizable"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You nailed it on the head!!! Thank you for "getting it". Now the question is how to get this idea beyond XDA

gurnted said:
Yeah I guess I could see someone stepping up to support this. All they would have to do is give permission to mod their roms. They could then look like the good guys who give their users a choice. I could see it now "Don't like our stock build of Android? Try one of these, or make your own." Now that would be the move to make for one of these companies who claim their phones are all about being "user customizable"
This stands a way better chance than the other option though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It'd require more effort from the vendor. They would have to be the ones distributing the ROMs to users, not us.
shagge68 said:
I don't disagree that we should gun for a license but like I said previously I work for a carrier and I believe they would go for something like this but I figure that a vendor would be a more likely target.
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Click to collapse
I doubt the carriers would have the license to distribute the software. Since it's essentially the vendor who installs the proprietary apps on them, I don't see the point to carriers having it.
And all of this is ignoring the fact that we don't even know the terms of the contract/license. It could very well be against the terms of either to do something like this.

A lot of carriers, and manufacturers have someone doing PR on most of the major social networks. Maybe you should try shooting some of them a line and see where it leads. Might at least get the message to someone who can get something like this worked out.

[NEEDED] Programmer for a Android Game

I am currently in the R of R&D for a new type of rpg card game I need a programmer to programme the apk as all the info needed will be supplied during the programming stage.
I am new to developing android games.
When the android market opens to canadian sellers I am offering up a permanent cut of the sales to whomever is chosen for the programming as updates will need to be made over time (aside from bug fixes).
anyone interested email me at: [email protected]

Go start reading the Android documentation and learn to do it yourself. Ideas are worth nothing in the game programming world. You can't ask someone to do all the work, and then give you most of the money.
/thread

Clarkster said:
Go start reading the Android documentation and learn to do it yourself. Ideas are worth nothing in the game programming world. You can't ask someone to do all the work, and then give you most of the money.
/thread
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Click to collapse
Ditto, if I were experienced enough to do a RPG, then I might be willing to help you. But you can bet that whoever would make it would put it on THEIR dev account & keep the profits to themselves, they did the work anyway.
Just sayin.

man, this thread is brilliant. hey guys ive got a game idea too, i need a dev too to all the coding and programming for me and in return i'll give you a cut. Just do the coding, developing, graphics and leave the rest to me.

I guess I wasn't clear with the request. Not all the programming is to be done by someone else and is not an Action RPG, Its a cardgame related to the CARD RPG genre, the difficulty is my programming is out of date and I am looking more for a mentor to watch over me and someone who is more familiar with the apk architecture. I could have easily taken a Poker game and shredded it for code and exceptions but that is a little more complicated. But I guess its easier to beat a person down verbally then inquire with decency.

Really
I've stop doing these kind of trade out because the person who owns the account will never show you the actual numbers.

There must be a way to work together on app development, even if only one of them has access to the market account. For instance, you could add a certificate mechanism in the program that adds the other party into the application activation process?
Anyway, if you're willing to pay the dev his/her commercial hourly rate I'm sure you can work out a deal.

Such an odd thread - I wonder how many developers working for the big games houses expect to own all the code they are paid to write. Oh, wait... Yeah, fundamental flaw in certain replies here I guess?

rTiGd2 said:
Such an odd thread - I wonder how many developers working for the big games houses expect to own all the code they are paid to write. Oh, wait... Yeah, fundamental flaw in certain replies here I guess?
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I get paid a salary for the code I write for my employer. The OP isn't offering a salary.

Just because he/she lacks the resources to provide a salary (or fixed rate) doesn't really open the doors for such mocking replies though. After all, there are many good/great ideas from people who lack the ability to produce them, the same as there are many great developers who lack the ideas for something to write.
At the end of the day, every project has to start somewhere and this could be with funding in place, developing and idea to obtain funding, or starting something as a team of individuals who agree how to split revenue from a final product.
For example, the comment that 'ideas are worth nothing' implies that every great gaming idea came from a developer. If that were the case, game design positions wouldn't exist.

Project

I just hope this is the right place to post this, as I do not intend to misuse this forum, it has been very helpful to me over the past few years and I love seeing what yall come out with. That being said here is what I am proposing.
I am looking for some people who know how to build apps for android. As well apps for windows. ( pick whatever programing language you like we just need it to work) I can not pay anyone, but if a small team of people will join me and help get my ideas built as a team I believe we will become successful in the first prototype of what will be the future of cell phones.
I don't get to check the forum often so please reach me via email [email protected]
thank you all for taking the time to read this.

When you say "apps for windows" are you suggesting applications for Windows Phone OS or Windows OS (as in the OS that runs on PCs)?
People will find it hard to work without getting paid and they definitely don't want to work on an idea without getting paid that wont take off so I suggest you give some hints about what your idea is to let people make a better decision?

camp sheckbo
Thanks for the response, and I should have clarified that. Sorry. I was referring to Windows os for pc. I can completely understand people not wanting to work for free as what I am asking I imagine will be quite some work and most likely quite a bit of testing. I have to admit I am apprehensive about just laying any part of my idea out there but for the sake of giving everyone a vague idea of what I have in mind ( please forgive grammar and spelling at this point) is google glass but trust me when I say far better then google. and for now we aren't even building the "phone part" the app on both the phone and its counterpart on the pc should be generic in the sense that any android phone & windows pc user can use the prototype once it is done. Then we shop it around with the concept for the new phone. anyone willing to know more please just shoot me an email. I realize yall don't know what it is yet but I am convinced if made this product would make those involved if not as big as google then pretty close (maybe not in terms of there money but in terms on the name)
Brand is everything.

You could ask here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2349036

Re
nikwen said:
You could ask here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2349036
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for the feedback. I will be checking it out.

A developer, looking for collaboraion
Hi Guys,
I am a long time developer for Android, iOS, BB etc with bunch of apps on the app stores, some dead on arrival, some successful, nothing like the next Bill Gates tho . Apps development is side job for me "for now", I am sure you know the feeling.
I guess what I am looking for here is somewhat the opposite to most of the posts here, where folks with amazing ideas looking for developers to "just make it happen". I have bunch of ideas, as well! (too many to count some for apps and some for other areas - chemistry, physics etc). I am looking for *developers* to work and collaborate, basically to brain storm and run through their ideas and my ideas, take our time to proper research and figure out business model, patents etc, maybe throw few baits in apps stores and see where it's going.
My thinking is that if bunch of us developers get together we stand a chance, I find it close to impossible to do it alone..
Of course we can sign all NDAs required etc to make everyone happy. I hope I did not violate any written or conceptual guidelines here.. please feel free to contact me, [email protected]
Thanks!
Udi

udihamudi said:
Hi Guys,
I am a long time developer for Android, iOS, BB etc with bunch of apps on the app stores, some dead on arrival, some successful, nothing like the next Bill Gates tho . Apps development is side job for me "for now", I am sure you know the feeling.
I guess what I am looking for here is somewhat the opposite to most of the posts here, where folks with amazing ideas looking for developers to "just make it happen". I have bunch of ideas, as well! (too many to count some for apps and some for other areas - chemistry, physics etc). I am looking for *developers* to work and collaborate, basically to brain storm and run through their ideas and my ideas, take our time to proper research and figure out business model, patents etc, maybe throw few baits in apps stores and see where it's going.
My thinking is that if bunch of us developers get together we stand a chance, I find it close to impossible to do it alone..
Of course we can sign all NDAs required etc to make everyone happy. I hope I did not violate any written or conceptual guidelines here.. please feel free to contact me, [email protected]
Thanks!
Udi
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can ask in this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2349036
Another possibility would be making it open-source.

We'll be happy to make it open source when we actually get to work on something
I will be happy to make "it" open source when I finally get to work on something exciting .. need to figure out first what it is thus first step before this need to get together with some bright minds here and decide what we want to work on.. then get it to format where folks can look at and work with as open source
nikwen said:
You can ask in this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2349036
Another possibility would be making it open-source.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

udihamudi said:
I will be happy to make "it" open source when I finally get to work on something exciting .. need to figure out first what it is thus first step before this need to get together with some bright minds here and decide what we want to work on.. then get it to format where folks can look at and work with as open source
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Of course, you need an idea. Check the thread I linked. You might find an idea there.
For example you could join the WidgetsEverywhere project. It's working and it's open-source.

Let the 8.1 RT hacking start anew!

Today, a couple posts in this thread gave me an idea...
jimmng said:
how about a 1k reward for 8.1 jailbreak?
community needs a bit of a push.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
mkwhater said:
lol are you going to donate that 1k?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I haven't checked if starting this "project" on XDA would go against any forum rules, but let me try this...
Let's offer a crowd-funded "reward" to the first hacker who comes up with a WORKING jailbreak for Windows RT 8.1. It doesn't have to be "pretty" or polished, just good enough to provide the same functions as the 8.0 jailbreak!
As far as amassing the reward, I would need suggestions to keep it transparent and really entice all these devs and hackers out there...
What do you guys think??

TRSHD said:
Today, a couple posts in this thread gave me an idea...
I haven't checked if starting this "project" on XDA would go against any forum rules, but let me try this...
Let's offer a crowd-funded "reward" to the first hacker who comes up with a WORKING jailbreak for Windows RT 8.1. It doesn't have to be "pretty" or polished, just good enough to provide the same functions as the 8.0 jailbreak!
As far as amassing the reward, I would need suggestions to keep it transparent and really entice all these devs and hackers out there...
What do you guys think??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed.
I vow to put $50usd up

I like the idea, but I don't think it would help much. People have been working on this for months. Maybe you can convince them to work a little harder, but it's not like this is going to take the place of our day jobs ($1000 US is less than I make in one week, after taxes, for example; I've already put in more than 40 hours of effort myself and I'm far from the most as the majority of my effort goes to WP8).
For bounties like this to be effective, they need to either be large enough to motivate people to work on a long-term project when they would otherwise work on other things (possibly even on other paying activities), or the bounties need to be for small things that people can do in a few days max. As proposed, this is neither.
Don't get me wrong, if I could drop $50 to make a JB magically appear, I'd do it too. But, that's not how research works. Putting money into it - even "real" money, which this is not - doesn't guarantee faster results. It doesn't even guarantee *eventual* success; in this case I'm confident that we'll get it eventually, butI can't actually promise that.

I agree completely with GoodDayToDie, another problem isnt the money but some of the concepts are hard for us to wrap our heads around... Which means more time needs to be dedicated...

I understand your point, GoodDayToDie. This is the exact reason why I started this thread. If I could write code and understand the basics of hacking, I'd work on this myself. Unfortunately, I'm only a very advanced "end-user" that really can't wait for that JB.
As for the monetary compensation, your input is very appreciated. It's also why I didn't mention a specific amount for now. I just thought I should get that discussion going.
BTW, thank you for any and all time you dedicate to the JB!!
GoodDayToDie said:
I like the idea, but I don't think it would help much. People have been working on this for months. Maybe you can convince them to work a little harder, but it's not like this is going to take the place of our day jobs ($1000 US is less than I make in one week, after taxes, for example; I've already put in more than 40 hours of effort myself and I'm far from the most as the majority of my effort goes to WP8).
For bounties like this to be effective, they need to either be large enough to motivate people to work on a long-term project when they would otherwise work on other things (possibly even on other paying activities), or the bounties need to be for small things that people can do in a few days max. As proposed, this is neither.
Don't get me wrong, if I could drop $50 to make a JB magically appear, I'd do it too. But, that's not how research works. Putting money into it - even "real" money, which this is not - doesn't guarantee faster results. It doesn't even guarantee *eventual* success; in this case I'm confident that we'll get it eventually, butI can't actually promise that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Great idea!
What about to start project on kickstarter? (where everyone can donate what he can). I guess there are will be much more than 1K.
I think we can call it "extending" Surface 2 functionality.

Double-check whether KS (or any of the other crowdfunding sites) support such bounty projects. It's not usually how they're used and there may be a reason for that. I'd tend to say that doing it right on XDA isn't a great idea anyhow. There probably is a better option that you could link to from here, though.

That was my initial idea, I just don't think the 30-day timeframe is realistic. I'm still looking for an alternative that doesn't require a set date but that's still as transparent...
fakevs said:
Great idea!
What about to start project on kickstarter? (where everyone can donate what he can). I guess there are will be much more than 1K.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Ok, I found two interesting alternatives: RocketHub and Quirky
Any suggestions?
GoodDayToDie said:
Double-check whether KS (or any of the other crowdfunding sites) support such bounty projects. It's not usually how they're used and there may be a reason for that. I'd tend to say that doing it right on XDA isn't a great idea anyhow. There probably is a better option that you could link to from here, though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

The suggestion wasn't "don't use KS", it was "make sure the site you use allows this kind of 'bounty' project". That still holds. I don't personally use much crowdfunding; I can't really recommend one site over another.

oooo this is good, I reckon something like kickstarter would work indeed. At least developers will be able to allocate more time than they are now, time is money my friends.

... I don't know what kind of job you have, but that's not how most jobs in the software world work. I[m salaried; I can't just ask for fewer hours because I have some other project to work on. That's even assuming that the other project (jailbreaking RT 8.1) paid out at all; maybe somebody else gets it first and I have nothing for that time? Maybe nobody ever manages it, and the money sits and languishes while we spend time on things that (according to you) we could be spending on something that makes money instead? Maybe (this one is actually really common) we have good jobs that pay well, but consume enough of our time that we don't *want* to spend our free time on something that feels like work?
A bounty project might get people to work on this when they might otherwise work on some other hobby or research. This would be valuable, and may be worth establishing a bounty for. But trust me, it's not going to make them "able to allocate more time than they are now". Not for something with no income while working and no guarantee of payout at the end. That's just not how the world works.

Closing the Samsung Galaxy backdoor with the Replicant Samsung RIL

Back in March, Replicant developers revealed a backdoor in the Samsung Galaxy application processor that lets the modem perform I/O operations on the device's storage.
(There was one security researcher who claimed on Ars Technica there was no evidence that the backdoor was used; Replicant's developers have responded to that here and here.)
Anyway, any progress on Galaxy S5 ROMs that use Replicant's replacement library, which won't collaborate with the backdoor, whether it's been used or not?
CC @Leigh Kennedy, @a2441918, @elelinux, @optx, @firebird11, @albinoman887, @kornfed, @ks3rv3rg, @BeansTown106, @tp2215, @edgarf28, @keysoh2, @AxAtAx

Nobdy...
Anyone?

Up

Up

@Leigh Kennedy, @a2441918, @elelinux, @optx, @firebird11, @albinoman887, @kornfed, @ks3rv3rg, @BeansTown106, @tp2215, @edgarf28, @keysoh2, @AxAtAx, Denis "GNUtoo" Carikli and Paul Kocialkowski where you at?
Security holes like this effect the community as a whole. I have no doubt this an intentional flaw brought to us all by the Auroragold mission. Whats it going to take for this type of lunacy to stop, a figurehead's child's phone getting hacked by a malicious actor, or terrorist? Because it's only a matter of time before that exact threat is a damning reality, & Samsung will be left holding the bag. This flaw has been an open wound for me ever since I first read Paul Kocialkowski's report in February. The issue has been burred for way too long; on behalf of devs, users, people who don't want to know, and the ones that just wont ever get it, I demand a full community based effort to KILL THIS BUG. This is why were all here right? On XDA, we help one and other learn, as well as help ourselves to use our personal devices better, and soon, safer. But if we are not making a strong enough effort to get what we require as basic device security, why use one at all?
".....because once NSA introduces a weakness, a vulnerability, it’s not only the NSA that can exploit it". -Karsten Nohl

Agent Soap said:
@Leigh Kennedy, @a2441918, @elelinux, @optx, @firebird11, @albinoman887, @kornfed, @ks3rv3rg, @BeansTown106, @tp2215, @edgarf28, @keysoh2, @AxAtAx, Denis "GNUtoo" Carikli and Paul Kocialkowski where you at?
I demand a full community based effort to KILL THIS BUG. This is why were all here right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If that's the reason you are here, do something about it, instead of 'demanding' someone else doing it for you.

kornfed said:
If that's the reason you are here, do something about it, instead of 'demanding' someone else doing it for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for your input. I mentor felons and teach them to use linux, windows, and android, essentally building a small army of informed individuals, teaching others to teach others. Sooo congrads for calling me out! And thanks for editing my statement to make me look silly.

Agent Soap said:
Thank you for your input. I mentor felons and teach them to use linux, windows, and android. Sooo congrads for calling me out!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good, take the lead, we are all very excited about your efforts.

kornfed said:
Good, take the lead, we are all very excited about your efforts.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Whats your deal with me man? If you love these flaws, please please please continue to berate/belittle/troll me. I didnt deliberately make your phone work against you, hate on someone who deserves your hate. If you are such a narcissist that you cant see that your higher skill set will aid with RESOLVING the problem, please gtfo the away. Use your anger on some one else. Because in the real world I'm the scariest thing on the street, here, you are. Now that **** measuring competition has completed, what can we do as a community to resolve this important security issue?

:laugh:

Good question and nice of you to bring this up. I think people don't give these matters enough attention.
I mean you can play pretend with your "encrypted" & "selinux secure" device as much as you want but there's no sense to it if the hardware is hardwired to spy on you.

This is an active backdoor
Six months later...
Is this backdoor still not fixed by current ROMs?