Related
I use the Storage to store some DLLs to save space. It works, not for all programs though.
Have tried installing programs to storage before (Journal Bar and Avantgo) but system seemed to be unstable afterwards.
Wonder if anyone has any good experience of storing and running other programs from Storage.
Also, has anyone tried installing the cab files from extended rom to Storage??? Is that possible at all???
RE
Yes, you can use Storage to store your cab files for the EXTROM.
BTW, program cab files for Storage and EXTROM are those that don't upgrade frequently otherwise you'll have to hard reset frequently too
Using Storage or Storage Cards should be avoided for anything on the today screen or anything which is bound to a hardware button. This is because the SD drivers take a little time to initialise when the device powers up and can result in files not being found - which can lead to small or big problems, depending on the nature of the 'missing' file.
This is why Pocket Plus cannot be installed in Storage any more and why Pocket Informant recommends installation into main memory. This is documented both by Spb Software House and WebIS.
I was beta testing SpbWeather and had some of the skins installed to Storage - whenever I used those skins, the plug-in was icon-less on power up, but main memory skins were fine.
As mentioned above, be careful selecting where to install Today Screen plug-ins.
As of the Storage, well I am not sure but I recommed you put in SMALL items in there since the storage becomes unstable at times because to OS may use a little of the Storage space to accomodate memory intensive applications like Adobe Acrobat. Correct me if I am wrong but this is what I understand about it.
Mvmajorem said:
As mentioned above, be careful selecting where to install Today Screen plug-ins.
As of the Storage, well I am not sure but I recommed you put in SMALL items in there since the storage becomes unstable at times because to OS may use a little of the Storage space to accomodate memory intensive applications like Adobe Acrobat. Correct me if I am wrong but this is what I understand about it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ther is so little storage there, why not just ignore it and use SD memory, or main memory where required?
I use storage to store my wma ringtones... haven't have the guts to move the DLLs yet. with regards to this... if i create a folder named Windows in Storage and move all my DLLs there would I need to hack into the apps individually ang make them look at this folder... or will the OS automatically look at both folders? Some people say to use systempath to do this.
bnycastro said:
I use storage to store my wma ringtones... haven't have the guts to move the DLLs yet. with regards to this... if i create a folder named Windows in Storage and move all my DLLs there would I need to hack into the apps individually ang make them look at this folder... or will the OS automatically look at both folders? Some people say to use systempath to do this.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I know U have to hack the registry files of single appz to point in to storage folder instead in the main memory... :roll:
Regards,
Primoz
belfast-biker said:
Ther is so little storage there, why not just ignore it and use SD memory, or main memory where required?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's 10% of the device's memory, that's not insignificant and certainly not worth wasting. I store 13.2Mb of utilities and etc. in Storage so that it frees up the same amount of Main Memory but permits me to use them when swapping cards. I think it's a waste not to use it.
Into my Storage i have install :
Resco keyboard pro
Laplink controller
Handymenu
Hottbutton plus
Phone today
Today phone pro
VIto voice dialer
Used space for all this 3.21 mb
Free space 4.31 mb
I Don't have any problem at all, my JAM works smoothly & stable plus the today plugins run faster than ever...
Try with no doubt ...
Hi all,
I'm trying to figure out what affect page pool sizes have on program memory. I understand that the larger the pagepool, the smaller the program ram. I understand, the larger the page pool, the "faster" the ROM operates since the pagepool is used as a pseudo-ram/cache for the OS.
However, Does anything else besides the Windows OS use the page pool memory? Can third party applications use the page pool?
Also, Because I have the HTC prophet which is known to be very limited in available RAM, I'm curious why sometimes I can't load third party input methods like calligrapher or tengo even when I have 15-20 megs of available program ram. Does the pagepool have some affect on this? This also seems linked to the today plugins since if I disable the today plugins, i can sometimes load calligrapher. Is the available ram split up between SIP (soft input panel) and today plugins vs. regular third party applications?
Thanks,
hheh 15-20 mb free ram?
man, change ROM...
btw, i never seen program, that cant be launched with 4 mb pp..
more = waste.
so a 4mb pp is best for freeing up ram for apps like calligrapher and today plugins... Does anyone know first hand whether a rom with only 4mb pp will be unbearably slow for things like loading /windows directory in file explorer?
Thanks,
I just switched to a 4MB PP on my Herald from a 12MB one. So far I am very happy. The amount of time is took to access the Windows folder was cut by more than 5sec. It only takes 3seconds max to load it up now.
thanks for http://www.roguegovernment.com/, and your avatar, God bless Canada.
neptune said:
I just switched to a 4MB PP on my Herald from a 12MB one. So far I am very happy. The amount of time is took to access the Windows folder was cut by more than 5sec. It only takes 3seconds max to load it up now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wait, What??
Reducing the pagepool will *increase* performance? not decrease it?
Isn't there a trade off at some point? I thought reducing the pp will decrease performance but increase program ram?
nothin said:
thanks for http://www.roguegovernment.com/, and your avatar, God bless Canada.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well Canada aint such a saint either but I'll take it over the US anyday. Did you know that some of the worst scientific tests from Project MKUltra were carried out in Canada under order from the American Military.These two governments go hand in hand. All the unwilling Canadian participants were drugged with LSD, run through ElectroSchock, and a whole load of sad experiments. I could go on all day about Government corruption, but when it comes down to it I'm all against it; and the only way to win a "war" against the government is by spreading the word of its wrong doings. SO whoever reads this thread pass this website along.
WWW.roguegovernment.com
ps: I know this ain't about PPC's but spread the word.
pps: if you havent already watch documentary Loose Change, then I'm sure that this website will be on your bookmark list.
mr_yellow said:
Wait, What??
Reducing the pagepool will *increase* performance? not decrease it?
Isn't there a trade off at some point? I thought reducing the pp will decrease performance but increase program ram?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It depends on your definition of peformance. Reducing page pool will speed up a few things on your device, it may also slow down a few things. However if you benchmark your device on sktools or similar then you will notice that greater page pool gives marginly better results.
Given that it is very simple to alter page pool I suggest that those wondering about the effects of page pool trial different page pool values and then note the subtle differences until they find a compromise.
mr_yellow said:
Hi all,
I'm trying to figure out what affect page pool sizes have on program memory. I understand that the larger the pagepool, the smaller the program ram. I understand, the larger the page pool, the "faster" the ROM operates since the pagepool is used as a pseudo-ram/cache for the OS.
However, Does anything else besides the Windows OS use the page pool memory? Can third party applications use the page pool?
Also, Because I have the HTC prophet which is known to be very limited in available RAM, I'm curious why sometimes I can't load third party input methods like calligrapher or tengo even when I have 15-20 megs of available program ram. Does the pagepool have some affect on this? This also seems linked to the today plugins since if I disable the today plugins, i can sometimes load calligrapher. Is the available ram split up between SIP (soft input panel) and today plugins vs. regular third party applications?
Thanks,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wm5 had problems with multiple SIPs which has been sorted out in WM6,
if you are still on wm5 upgrade to wm6...if you have wm6 and still have this problem then try searching for PQIIz and if possible change your rom
Hi All,
Thanks for all the new replies. It really helps!
Concerning wm5 vs wm6: I am running a wm6 rom, in fact it's a rom built on the latest available build of wm6 so as far as I know, it's "up to date". But even with running wm6, I still have problems loading third party SIPs. Right after a reset, it's fine. But after a few hours or days of uptime, they'll fail to load. Even things like HTC phone pad (which i had to install seperately) won't load up.
Also, I can't find anything about PQIIz. As far as I can tell from the small references here and there, it's a utility that manages freeing memory and closing apps. What's the full name of this app?
Going back to the pagepool discussion: I wish I could experiement with the pagepool size but I'm no rom cook.. =( One day I'll get there.
Sigh.. back to flashing i guess. =/
mr_yellow said:
Hi All,
Going back to the pagepool discussion: I wish I could experiement with the pagepool size but I'm no rom cook.. =( One day I'll get there.
Sigh.. back to flashing i guess. =/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
you do not need to cook to change.. just hexedit nbf..
btw, freeing mem app - oxios memory module hibernate.
About Canada and USA - Canada never destroyed other country, you know..(end of OT).
Someone (somewhere in one of these forums) mentioned that Microsoft's recommended "optimal" pagepool size was 4.5MB. I just assumed there had to be something wrong with that since my Dell Axim's OEM roms were set to 12MB pagepools. But perhaps there is some basis for a 4.5MB pagepool. I guess I will try it one of these days and see--unless someone else has already tried it on an Axim (X50v) and can give me an idea of performance results.
i would guess that ms dont have an optimal general pagepool
as it would depend on the transfer speed of the storage
compared to the speed of the ram
Rudegar said:
i would guess that ms dont have an optimal general pagepool
as it would depend on the transfer speed of the storage
compared to the speed of the ram
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So the best thing still is just to try several different pagepool sizes and pick the one that seems to have the most even balance of speed between various tasks/programs?
Does the process for changing the page pool size depend on the device? I found these instructions for changing pagepool for wizard roms:
http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=ChangingPagePoolofWizardWM6Roms
Are there any other factors I need to take into account before manually modifying a custom rom I did not build?
quick bump...
I'm still confused about the affects of pagepool and speed of OS and amount of program ram...
So my rom has 8mb pp. loading /windows takes only 4 seconds. I also get problems loading calligrapher, phonepad, and today plugins. I've had other roms with i think 12mb pp. loadinig /windows takes like 8-10 seconds with that and I don't recall any problems with loading 3rd party input method. I don't think i've ever tried a 4mb pp rom.
So from what I've experienced.
12mb pp:
slower OS (loading /windows is slow)
can load more input methods and today plugins
less program ram???
8mb pp:
faster OS (loading /windows is fast)
can NOT load more input methods and today plugins
more program ram?
4mb pp:
faster OS (loading /windows is ???)???
can NOT load more input methods and today plugins???
most program ram???
I have set the pagepool on my Diamond to 0Mb - very fast for all tasks. I used the tool in this thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=323269
But I am confused still. In the above linked thread they talk of 0mb being the fastest, but you guys are talking about more than 0mb. A very steep learning curve for me
http://blogs.msdn.com/windowsmobile/archive/2005/11/17/494177.aspx
that should help you
The Page Pool
Applications use RAM in two ways. There is code that runs, and there is data that is created while it is running. On a NOR device, the code can run directly from the ROM and not be loaded into RAM first. This process is called XIP (eXecute In Place). NAND devices can't XIP, so their code is loaded into RAM and executed from there. If you don't have a Page Pool, this code is loaded into normal RAM. The Page Pool is a mechanism to limit how much code is loaded into normal RAM. With a Page Pool, we can unload code that hasn't been used in a while and reload it later if we need to. We can't do that without a Page Pool.
On a typical NAND-based WM5 device, the Page Pool is 4.5M.
Taken from here.
i seen, a couple of roms that had a pagepool editor in the zip file
If this turned out to be the case... what would be the most optimised size of WM?
Would it be possible to remove literally everything and allow them to be added back in one by one...? That way users could optimise their device to their liking...
I'd just like to be able to install a really good browser like Opera 9.5 and not run out of space... surely not much would have to be removed to allow that to be done without constantly running out of space?
deleting files in windows directory
when i run memaid on the shift, i see close to 100 mb in the windows directory. i have just checked on my htc tytn (hermes) with wm6 and a lot of additional apps storred in the main memory, finally the windows directory is 67 mb,
i think a lot of the file in the shift are useless, and we could have a gain of 40 mb..
i.e the snapvue plug in may take a lot of space with all the .gif for the weather tool.
anyone have a list of the files needed to run windows? then we could delete the other, (if they are not in read only) or cook a lite windows directory
yep, that's exactly what i had in mind. i wonder how much space could be gained...
hey guys,would like to check where u installed the below software? either device memory or memory card?
1. Resco Explorer/Total Commander
2. Touchpal/SPB keyboard
3. SPB Mobile Shell
4. All the games
5. mapking/garmin
6. chinese or other font/CE-Star
7. S2U2
8. Gyrator/Gsen
9. Inesoft/iContact
10.G-alarm
11.Advance Config v3.3
12.SPB Pocket Plus
by the way, other than CE-Star, any other software that can allow us to read chinese in HD? i found CE-Star is not very compatible with my HD, and i read from other post that CE-Star will slow down the HD, is it true?
any of the application that i listed above have the feature for Clear Temp?
alexwai said:
hey guys,would like to check where u installed the below software? either device memory or memory card?
1. Resco Explorer/Total Commander: D
2. Touchpal/SPB keyboard: D
3. SPB Mobile Shell
4. All the games: SD
5. mapking/garmin: SD
6. chinese or other font/CE-Star: D
7. S2U2: I did not use it, if yes, D
8. Gyrator/Gsen: D
9. Inesoft/iContact: D
10.G-alarm: SD
11.Advance Config v3.3: D
12.SPB Pocket Plus: D
by the way, other than CE-Star, any other software that can allow us to read chinese in HD? i found CE-Star is not very compatible with my HD, and i read from other post that CE-Star will slow down the HD, is it true?
any of the application that i listed above have the feature for Clear Temp?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
CE star is 100% c/w with HD.
But is it a version from CE star or HTC?
The HTC version has been checked by HTC, so it is 100% compatible.
Monster Chinese could be another choice but it can't read Japanese and sometimes it will crash with certain programs.
Concerning slowing of HD, I do not have such feeling at all.
alexwai said:
hey guys,would like to check where u installed the below software? either device memory or memory card?
1. Resco Explorer/Total Commander
2. Touchpal/SPB keyboard
3. SPB Mobile Shell
4. All the games
5. mapking/garmin
6. chinese or other font/CE-Star
7. S2U2
8. Gyrator/Gsen
9. Inesoft/iContact
10.G-alarm
11.Advance Config v3.3
12.SPB Pocket Plus
by the way, other than CE-Star, any other software that can allow us to read chinese in HD? i found CE-Star is not very compatible with my HD, and i read from other post that CE-Star will slow down the HD, is it true?
any of the application that i listed above have the feature for Clear Temp?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All of them are installed in device memory
genesicgaogaiga said:
CE star is 100% c/w with HD.
But is it a version from CE star or HTC?
The HTC version has been checked by HTC, so it is 100% compatible.
Monster Chinese could be another choice but it can't read Japanese and sometimes it will crash with certain programs.
Concerning slowing of HD, I do not have such feeling at all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hi, thanks for your prompt replied. my ce-star is come bundle in the box, so i think should be HTC version.
u installed so many application in the device? dont they eat up a lot device memory?
iamcrazyfire said:
All of them are installed in device memory
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
...how many device memory u left>?
alexwai said:
...how many device memory u left>?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
about 100MB
iamcrazyfire said:
about 100MB
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
enough for u for future installation?
by the way, when u installed more application in the device storage, will it slow down the device?
alexwai said:
hi, thanks for your prompt replied. my ce-star is come bundle in the box, so i think should be HTC version.
u installed so many application in the device? dont they eat up a lot device memory?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
storage 222M
program 116 M
What wrong with your CE star?
genesicgaogaiga said:
storage 222M
program 116 M
What wrong with your CE star?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
my device storage as below:
storage:
total = 324.91
in use=39.12
free=285.79
program:
total=195.98
in use=90.51
free=105.07
what are they different? every time we install the application to the device storage, it will ocupy in the storage,right? then,what is the program about?
No, some of the program memory will be used at the same time.
For example, try to see this memory after surfing the net with opera or IE. There will be a drop by 20Mb, but this can be restored after a soft reset.
alexwai said:
enough for u for future installation?
by the way, when u installed more application in the device storage, will it slow down the device?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think good enough for furture use.
The software /service that run in the BG will impact on performance only.
device memory is a precious and limited resource. i wouldnt waste that for static things like program installations. specially with opera its used a lot and the more pages you open in different tabs and the more complex a page is, the more device memory opera will need.
As a result, i install programs to device memory only if absolutely necessary, which is the case for programs others depend on, or is needed by Windows itself or TF3D. A few examples:
- NetCF3.5
- AE Button
- S2U2
Everything else goes to storage card, which is "endless" in size compared to device memory.
just my 0.02€
http://www.studiokuma.com/wm/?section=support
This one works with HD without any problem for Chinese input.
6Fg8 said:
device memory is a precious and limited resource. i wouldnt waste that for static things like program installations. specially with opera its used a lot and the more pages you open in different tabs and the more complex a page is, the more device memory opera will need.
As a result, i install programs to device memory only if absolutely necessary, which is the case for programs others depend on, or is needed by Windows itself or TF3D. A few examples:
- NetCF3.5
- AE Button
- S2U2
Everything else goes to storage card, which is "endless" in size compared to device memory.
just my 0.02€
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok... i agree what u said, device memory is a precious and limited resource ... thanks a lot...
anywhere, what is AE button?
u install core player in memory card as well?
sproxy said:
http://www.studiokuma.com/wm/?section=support
This one works with HD without any problem for Chinese input.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hi, thanks for ur suggest..
but, is it only support for traditional chinese? i use simplified chinese more..
after install this, i can read chinese already?
I'm installing nearly every software on my device. As the sd card can be removed it is totally non-sense to put software on it. The only thing I put on memory card are games, because they are mostly too big for the device flash.
Putting any software on memory card means that you loose performance, as the
card reading process is known to be slow (for the HD). So putting Opera on memory card is really not a booster.
The only thing, boosting up the opera's cache would be a ram disk. I have such a ram disk on my x51v and will try to configure it on the HD. This would be a real improvement.
So don't be afraid to install your software on your device with a 512 MB Rom thats not a problem at all. By installing really many applications your device will get slower, especially the boot-up will take some more time.
So the only thing you should consider is to install only software you really need, but then you should put it on your device.
Sorry about that.
I had the impression that there was a download link for simplified Chinese as well. I must be wrong.
johnpatcher said:
I'm installing nearly every software on my device. As the sd card can be removed it is totally non-sense to put software on it. The only thing I put on memory card are games, because they are mostly too big for the device flash.
Putting any software on memory card means that you loose performance, as the
card reading process is known to be slow (for the HD). So putting Opera on memory card is really not a booster.
The only thing, boosting up the opera's cache would be a ram disk. I have such a ram disk on my x51v and will try to configure it on the HD. This would be a real improvement.
So don't be afraid to install your software on your device with a 512 MB Rom thats not a problem at all. By installing really many applications your device will get slower, especially the boot-up will take some more time.
So the only thing you should consider is to install only software you really need, but then you should put it on your device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wo...thanks for ur good explaination....
seems like my question is very subjective, some said better install in device memory, on the other hand said better install in memory card...
alexwai said:
seems like my question is very subjective, some said better install in device memory, on the other hand said better install in memory card...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think its subjective at all. You are invited to put figure it out yourself.
Put Opera on a) your device and b) the memory card and finally c) a ram disk.
You can read something about ram disks here, and after playing around with it, you will see how fast it is .
This has come up many times in many forums, but still cannot find an answer.
We develop commercial apps for windows mobile. We would like to be able to use emulators for testing. I realize we cannot rely totally on emulators for testing and do need to test on real devices as well, but it would be very beneficial to do some testing without having to buy umpteen devices for every developer.
Currently we can only use emulators for PPC2003. The problem is that WM5 and WM6 emulators only allocate 32 MB for storage space on the device, which is ridiculous. My HTC Fuze has over 290 MB for storage.
32MB is not enough to store our application plus the database.
Before someone tries to tell me about MEMSIZE parameters and settings in visual studio to increase memory, that is RAM, not storage space. Microsoft seems to have made no provision for changing the amount of storage space.
You can of course set up a virtual storage card using a folder on your hard drive. The problem is that the driver is buggy and does not work correctly for storing a database. I have seen references to this bug in relation to SQLCE and SQLite and it also affects DB2E (the database we use).
So is there either:
- A way to get more than 32MB storage space (not RAM) in the emulator
- A fix for the virtual storage card bugs
This pretty much renders the emulator useless for serious testing.
Workaround using Ramdisk
I have found sort of a workaround that lets me do testing using an emulator.
If you go to this thread there is a discussion of a Ramdisk driver that allows for large ramdisks.
Unlike the previous ramdisk driver which would only give me 17MB of ram disk, with this one I could get up to a 127MB ram disk.
The original source of this new RamDisk is gone, but go to that thread you can download a zip containing the executable and dll but none of the other files.
I did some work and figured out the lnk files you need and attached them to this post.
The exe and dll go into \Windows
The Ramdisk.lnk goes into \Windows\Startup. The link I provided sets up a 64 MB RAM Disk. You can edit the text in the lnk file to change that.
The Ramdisk-Unload.lnk is used to unload the RamDisk.
The downside is that you lose the contents when soft resetting, but that is not often with an emulator.
I know we had some trouble with the storage size limitation as well because we use a large database, but creating the folder on the hard drive and using that as an "storage card" word. Although ours isn't a sql database, it's a binary one. We have noticed writing a lot to the "storage card" that is on the hard drive, tends to fail every once in a while, not sure why. But if you try again two seconds later, it works.
So beyond doing good try...catches and maybe having a retry method. As far as I know, there isn't a way of changing that.