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Hi!Can i use an unlocked hermes,(apart from the tytn),in any country round the world?Anybody tried doing so??Thanks!
No mobile works in every country around the world.
I think that answer is a bit terse. A quad-band phone like the Hermes can be used in virtually any country. Take a look here, and you'll see that with the 850, 900, 1800 & 1900 MHz bands covered there's not many countries you can't get a signal in.
http://www.coveragemaps.com/gsmposter_freqbands.htm
I'm not familiar with Japanese requirements, but while it stands out as having a different set of requirements, I'm reasonably sure the Hermes works there too.
Testing it out in every single country could be a bit of a large proposition though.
totallytechie said:
I think that answer is a bit terse. A quad-band phone like the Hermes can be used in virtually any country. Take a look here, and you'll see that with the 850, 900, 1800 & 1900 MHz bands covered there's not many countries you can't get a signal in.
http://www.coveragemaps.com/gsmposter_freqbands.htm
I'm not familiar with Japanese requirements, but while it stands out as having a different set of requirements, I'm reasonably sure the Hermes works there too.
Testing it out in every single country could be a bit of a large proposition though.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So add the countries with 850/1900/2100 UMTS to the GSM list, and you'll have a comprehensive list... and yes, Japan uses 2100 UMTS, so you can add that one, too.
That just leaves the wierd 1700 spectrum .. wonder if any country is running that ..
gravejoker said:
That just leaves the wierd 1700 spectrum .. wonder if any country is running that ..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not yet and probably not for a few years...
So in short,if i unlock the device,i may be able to use its phone capabilities on any carrier in the whole world,provided the carrier uses one of the 4 bands for communicating.The carrier may be anyone apart from the tmobile,o2,orange,cingular,vodafone?!
Yes ... you can use an unlocked TyTN on any carrier in the world that has one of the 7 bands that TyTN supports (4 GSM + 3 UMTS) ..
Ok thanks...the reason behind that question is that i'm going to Mauritius(a lost island situated in the indian ocean, beside reunion island) for a few weeks..And i wanted to be sure that my unlocked m3100 would work perfectly there...Anyway, thanks for ypur kind support..
Ahha .. Mauritius .. You are lucky my friend .. what a beautiful place from what I have heard .. enjoy your trip ..
Thanks,mauritius,the paradise on earth,here i come!
Thanks,mauritius,the paradise on earth,here i come!
gravejoker said:
That just leaves the wierd 1700 spectrum .. wonder if any country is running that ..
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Click to collapse
goestoeleven said:
Not yet and probably not for a few years...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Update: At the end of Nov 2006 T-Mobile won FCC auctions in 120 US markets for spectrum licenses in the 2100 and 1700 frequency bands. It is reported they will start rolling out service during 2007 (Sources: T-Mobile US Press Releases and Wikipedia). So the answer now appears to be, yes, the 1700 spectrum will be used extensively by T-Mobile USA.
I am not personally aware of any HTC phones which support 1700 yet. I am no engineer, but my assumption is that this could not be done through software upgrades on any existing devices. I imagine it will require different radio hardware. Clarification from the experts on this forum would be much appreciated.
Just a note of caution I've tried to use an unlocked VPA compact III in Barbados on the Bmobile network, but I can't geta signal. If I use a vodafone card I manage to get a signal, so I'm not sure all carriers support this phone.
flamingcrumb said:
I am not personally aware of any HTC phones which support 1700 yet. I am no engineer, but my assumption is that this could not be done through software upgrades on any existing devices. I imagine it will require different radio hardware. Clarification from the experts on this forum would be much appreciated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, a software upgrade cannot physically synthesize circuitry to support the 1700Mhz frequency channel.
Looking at the hermes architecture, their LNA's have just enough frequency coverage to support the 7 bands. So the answer is a concrete no in re: 1700MHz.
It is possible to deisgn an LNA with a larger bandwidth, for example, to cover frequencies from 1500MHZ to 2300MHZ configurable via MEMS capacitors and inductors (I have a PhD student working on this atm, but he is facing the problem of keeping up the gain as well as linearity of the amplifier). Motivation for this: the fewer LNA's the less power a device will consuming yielding greater battery life.
HTC maybe should think about hardware re-configurability as well, but then again, they would like to make their devices obselete ASAP.
NO, you cannot use it worldwide
I could not receive a signal in Brazil with my 8525. Others reported the same problem with the Samsung Blackjack. Cingular has not provided a solution to our problem.
I hope the band select hack that I found on this great XDA forum will let me use my unlocked 8525 in Brazil next time I go in March.
Australia, if I recall, was also a problem for a Blackjack user. See the Blackjack thread on the Cingular forum for details on our tribulations.
Rgds
Ben
I have used my TyTN in the USA, Japan, Taiwan, Thailand, Cambodia, Singapore, Philippines and Hong Kong all with no problems. All locations outside the USA were with pre-paid local SIM cards (except Japan and Taiwan, which were roaming on Cingular).
Are the people having problems using a Cingular SIM (and roaming), or using a local pre-paid card?
I got full coverage in the Geylang District in Singapore. full bars.
Am I right to understand that an 8525 purchased from Cingular is locked to Cingular and in order to use in another country it would need to be unlocked prior to inserting another sim card? Would I simply ask Cingular to provide the unlock code for such use?
I'm having a Problem using a local pre-paid SIM card in Barbados, if I Roam on Vodafone which is my original carrier then it's no problem at all
not quite sure how to search this so i guess ill ask (or reask) the question.
1. am i able to reflash my Leo to work with USA ATT 3g bands if a rom ever comes out in the future?
2. can someone confirm to me if step #49 of this tips and tricks thread (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=583638) and that piece of 3G activation software works and can allow my Leo to work with ATT 3g? (i dont think it does)
thanks!
1. Nope. It's all hardware.
2. See above. Nope.
It's all edge, my friend!
b-16707 said:
not quite sure how to search this so i guess ill ask (or reask) the question.
1. am i able to reflash my Leo to work with USA ATT 3g bands if a rom ever comes out in the future?
2. can someone confirm to me if step #49 of this tips and tricks thread (http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=583638) and that piece of 3G activation software works and can allow my Leo to work with ATT 3g? (i dont think it does)
thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The HTC HD2 will not use 3g in the US. But since the phone is so fast, browsing the internet using edge is faster then with 3G on a sony X1a (my last phone).
do you already have an HD2? Regardless of anything you've read thus far, 3G is hardware dependent. No USA 3G internal radio? No USA 3G.
If you don't already have one, just wait until next month because the HD2 is supposedly coming to Telstra (who operates on 850mhz 3G, just like AT&T). HTC have said that the HD2 is coming in Q1 2010 but it's more than likely going toward T-Mo (based on leaked pics) or other carriers other than AT&T.
ah well i was under the impression that the hardware was both same for euro and us releases and just the software controlling it was different...(and how come they didnt name it the T8582 vs the T8585 as with the HD1 standard for the 2 different radios?....how they gonna distinguish the different hardware HD2s?)
come next year i may just sell mine for the new one (testra one you said). i dont suppose that tmo one will work with att 3g as its on a worldwide 3g band huh.
truly is a nice phone no doubt still
T-Mo US operates on 1700mhz AND 2100mhz for 3G (someone correct me if im wrong...one for uplink and the other for downlink). ATT can operate on 850mhz OR 1900mhz. The European version only has 900mhz and 2100mhz. As you can see, if you use the HD2 in the US (t-mo or ATT) right now, you're restricted to only EDGE unless they both possess their respective 3G bands.
this is what someone on htcforums.com said to me...confirm? deny? reject? love? i guess im just receiving conflicting info as to why this guy would believe this then?
"What you are asking about is a software differentiation. According to PDADB.net, the HD2 US version is scheduled for March 2010. http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=2 ... us_htc_leo
The GSM version currently available is capable of T-Mobile US 3G frequencies; as T-Mo is the only US company to use WorldWide frequencies {2100MHz}. The version that is scheduled for March will be for AT&T frequencies. Since the hardware on these two versions are identical, you could flash a WorldWide version with a US version radio, & use a WW version with AT&T."
Your link doesnt work. I don't want to beat on a dead horse, but countless of T-Mo USA users have the HD2 and they could only have access to EDGE. Like I said, for T-Mo USA, their 3G has a split frequency (one for upload the other for download) that's why you need both 1700mhz and 2100mhz.
thats the link
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=2062&view=1&c=htc_hd2_us_htc_leo
bah oh well. the dude seems adamant that it will work...
ah here we go, this was the comparison i was looking for
USA
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=2062&view=1&c=htc_hd2_us_htc_leo
other
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=1783&view=1&c=htc_hd2_t8585_htc_leo_100
this on HTC's site
Europe: Network Bands
* HSPA/WCDMA: 900/2100 MHz
* GSM: 850/900/1800/1900 MHz <------
Asia Pacific:
* HSPA/WCDMA: 900/2100 MHz
* GSM: 850/900/1800/1900 MHz <------
which means it can work here no? since USA att 3G is 850 or 1900?
* HSPA/WCDMA: 900/2100 MHz <--3G
* GSM: 850/900/1800/1900 MHz <-- EDGE
Your problem is that you're looking at the voice/2G/EDGE bands. The HD2 is a quadband phone, so you can pretty much use it anywhere in the world. Your original question was regarding 3G, which the HD2 does not support here in the USA (yet).
3G would be this line HSPA/WCDMA. See how it's only support 900/2100mhz?
GSM is only voice correct? .... getting my voice/data abbreviations all mixed up...
b-16707 said:
GSM is only voice correct? .... getting my voice/data abbreviations all mixed up...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
GSM is voice and EDGE (data)
For ATT the key is 850mhz 3G as that what ATT has been adding, I don't believe they are doing any new 1900 towers. You can bing it there are lot's of articles about the iPhone congestion and changing/adding 850 towers. If we are lucky Telstra an, Australian carrier, will pick up the phone soon because they use the same 850 just like ATT. This is how people got the 3G on the HD(1) to work on ATT in the united states. HTCPedia posted a Telstra HD2 rom on Dec 9th, so hopefully they are close to releasing.
Anyone who understands this "spectrum" 3g AT&T Tmob issue more than I.... I have a ?
Okay so here it goes....
WTF!!!!!!!!!!!???
So I've been reading all day to understand this and I do get how we ended up screwed on 3g from the rest of the world
Tmob is on "aws" which is sort of a halfway between 2100/1900 of Europe at 2100/1700
AT&T is on 1900/850 or 850... I couldn't find a straight answer on that.
Now everyone says this is "hardware" in the phone that dictates this issue. I've been researching (this is where I could use your help) and I'm missing something. Nexus one is using Qualcomm Snapdragon™ 3G QSD8250.... This AMAZING chip is not only the processor but the 3g chipset as well... (correct?) Yet this same chip is in the LG expo and the LG expo has 850/1900/2100 for it's 3g.
It would seem to me... (a simple man) that Qualcomm would NOT produce separate chips but would use some firmware/software to let the chip determine which frequencies to use. Otherwise they would have to stamp out more than one chip instead of just having one factory.
The other major issue I see is antenna length is a physical characteristic based on the radio wave you are trying to receive/send. So that may have to change too but that's more about being optimum than impossible.
Not that anyone has the cash for this but what would stop someone with REALLY amazing soldering skills from switching the two supposedly identical chipsets? Would that extremely silly idea work?
Just a thought that I thought a few people on this forum may understand more than I do.
First, the radio ROM should be the one to dictate what frequencies are supported if the radio chip can support multiple frequencies, which it does. There is a soft radio chip from Samsung (I think it's Samsung) that can be reprogrammed to change which carrier it's supporting, but I haven't read of it being used yet. I believe that's the future, but currently you get a chip that almost universally supports European 3G and quad-band GSM w/EDGE out of the box, and then *one* set of US/Canadian frequencies. That's it.
WIND (new Canadian carrier) is using the same AWS spectrum as T-Mobile US is, so that should give more "pull" for more AWS support in future handsets, but with T-Mobile moving toward a "dumb pipe" arrangement (no annoying a la carte options, no music services, no stupid "extras" to pay for, just voice/data/text plans) the hope is more devices will be available in the open market that will just work on T-Mobile and support whatever you're paying for. Since your ISP is just "there" and "supports" (ish) whatever you're using, the hope is T-Mobile US will set the trend for that behavior here, and WIND might be going the same way in Canada, and FINALLY bring this mentality to North America.
If that works out, expect to see more soft radio chips and ROMs to come out with these handsets so they can be "flipped" from network to network and still support all the data and voice options. If it doesn't (I think it will to some degree), then expect the long and annoying tradition of vertically integrated handset and carrier support where the handset has to be "made" to support whatever options the carrier chooses (for compatibility and being as cheap as possible to make) and not have full, cross network support for devices.
Softchips aren't common and won't be. You could probably swap the chips directly, but it's going to cause issues.
T-Mobile uses AWS, which is 1700/2100 for down/up stream. It's considered GSM band 4, which is different from Europe, who uses a 900 band and a 2100 band, both of those are full up/downloads on close bands, so some places use 900, some use 2100, some offer both. It's a bit different. The Nexus One supposed 900/AWS/2100, meaning it's 100% Europe and T-Mobile compatible. We're seeing more and more of these chips since it's significantly simpler than making Euro + AT&T chips.
Motorola is developing a chip with AWS + 850/1900, meaning sometime next year, we should be seeing truly "USA" model cell phones, which will support any US GSM carrier. Euro+USA full could come eventually, but the addition of AWS means it'd take a 5-band chip instead of Quad band like EDGE.
T-Mobile 3G Upgrade
FCC cleared radio frequencies about 3 years ago, T-Mobile bid on the majority of them and used it to upgrade its network.
Much lulz were had.
Here is a List of UMTS Networks. Pretty much all of Europe uses 2100.
I'll do more research as to WHY, but most carriers opt for certain frequencies because of hardware compatibility and cost effectiveness for when they were upgrading.
That link makes it appear that AT&T is worthless outside of NA, but that's untrue (AT&T has, for the most part coverage worldwide, or so I think...) so I'll do some more research on my lunch break.
Renarudo said:
T-Mobile 3G Upgrade
FCC cleared radio frequencies about 3 years ago, T-Mobile bid on the majority of them and used it to upgrade its network.
Much lulz were had.
Here is a List of UMTS Networks. Pretty much all of Europe uses 2100.
I'll do more research as to WHY, but most carriers opt for certain frequencies because of hardware compatibility and cost effectiveness for when they were upgrading.
That link makes it appear that AT&T is worthless outside of NA, but that's untrue (AT&T has, for the most part coverage worldwide, or so I think...) so I'll do some more research on my lunch break.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ATT has some coverage (edge once again) everywhere, some places in canada and australia have 1900, but ATT for the most part is using a freq that's not very universal
The issue is the amplifier module.
I have the Rogers G1 running on AT&T 3G. The radio firmware/software is identicle to the T-Mobile/ADP1 phone.
They did a tear down of the G1's and they both use physically different amplifier part numbers. It's not a part from Qualcomm and has nothing to do with their chipsets. Their chipsets do indeed support AT&T's 3G frequencies, if paired with a compatible amplifier.
Now if someone tears down the Nexus One, and gets the part number for the amplifier, and that amplifier can do AT&T frequencies, it may just be an issue of hacking the radio somehow to enable it.
It's quite possible the amplifier on the Nexus One can handle AT&T 3G, but they didn't bother to "certify" it with the FCC because T-Mobile is te launch parter and AT&T is sucking Apples teet.
One can only wait and see. I'm betting it simple doesn't have the correct amplifier for AT&T.
There are amplifiers that work on all frequencies. Why they don't spend the extra dollar or whatever is beyond me. They are literally THAT cheap.
-James
jmacdonald801 said:
The issue is the amplifier module.
I have the Rogers G1 running on AT&T 3G. The radio firmware/software is identicle to the T-Mobile/ADP1 phone.
They did a tear down of the G1's and they both use physically different amplifier part numbers. It's not a part from Qualcomm and has nothing to do with their chipsets. Their chipsets do indeed support AT&T's 3G frequencies, if paired with a compatible amplifier.
Now if someone tears down the Nexus One, and gets the part number for the amplifier, and that amplifier can do AT&T frequencies, it may just be an issue of hacking the radio somehow to enable it.
It's quite possible the amplifier on the Nexus One can handle AT&T 3G, but they didn't bother to "certify" it with the FCC because T-Mobile is te launch parter and AT&T is sucking Apples teet.
One can only wait and see. I'm betting it simple doesn't have the correct amplifier for AT&T.
There are amplifiers that work on all frequencies. Why they don't spend the extra dollar or whatever is beyond me. They are literally THAT cheap.
-James
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Or sell two (or more) versions of the phone?
850/1900/2100
900/1900/2100
1700/2100
I would guess ... idiocy.
Even more idiotic ... phone manufacturers building phones with NAM 3G frequencies ... but not selling them.
It seems the Nexus One at least has the hardware to support AT&T 3G, see my post here.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=612950
-James
I was lamenting on my lack of foresight, getting a HD2 without researching the different bands that AT&T and T-Mobile use for 3G coverage, when just the other day...
NOTE: This was on a call to AT&T Support and the tech tells me:
a) Once unlocked from TMOUS, I should do a search on "AT&T APN's" and that if I search diligently, I will find APNs on AT&T's network that support HD2 3G Bands
b) AT&T techs, right in his data center have this working.
So I research a bit, and, apart form everyone and his brother professing to be 3G Band experts, and saying all I will see is Edge if I put the HD2 on AT&T. (Which is troublesome, since Wikipedia claims Edge is being dropped to facilitate more 3G bandwidth, so potentially I would lose even THAT).
Here is what official information I could find on the two:
The U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band. T-Mobile's UMTS (3G) service is now active in over 30 major US cities
Further all official documentation states that AT&T uses:
* 850 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
* 1900 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
Finally look at my screenshot, taken from the GSM 3G toggle on the "Settings Tab" of Manila. I am running a NRG ROM (see signature) and I KNOW this is wishful thinking. This screen in particular is no doubt a function of the many devices NRG cooks for, but really, can anyone explain to me why this technically would NOT WORK (other than "just because", LOL)?
AT&T's CEO recently gave an interview and stated that the company's 3G service is being migrated to the 850MHz band with a target date of 2010:
http://www.intomobile.com/2009/02/24/att-3g-network-going-850mhz-nationwide-by-2010.html
For what it's worth, I think the Australian version of the HD2 might have a band that overlaps with US AT&T bands.
Whos gonna buy me one?
Mase_Mase said:
AT&T's CEO recently gave an interview and stated that the company's 3G service is being migrated to the 850MHz band with a target date of 2010:
http://www.intomobile.com/2009/02/24/att-3g-network-going-850mhz-nationwide-by-2010.html
For what it's worth, I think the Australian version of the HD2 might have a band that overlaps with US AT&T bands.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, I have been hearing the same. Problem is, I am not likely to fork out $$ for ANOTHER HD2. I just wanted to get the most out of the one I have. Thx!
if something like this WAS possible, it would have to be through something like a rogue apn setup on non-standard frequencies on ATT's network...but good luck finding anything like that, it wouldn't be able to remain a secret if it existed. also, if the hd2 had the ability to use those native frequencies, it would have had to have been certified as such by the FCC (which of course it wasn't).
To summarize, the only way to make it happen is if ATT did indeed somehow sneak in alternative-frequency apn's across it's entire network. Let us know how the search for those turns out
SmartAs$Phone said:
The U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band. T-Mobile's UMTS (3G) service is now active in over 30 major US cities
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-Mobile_USA
3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+) service by T-Mobile exclusively uses the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band, making it incompatible with other existing 3G UMTS/HSPA networks already established in the United States.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its not physically possible. The hardware would have to be changed. They don't make radio chips with all the bands in it. I see this all the time, some random csr from whatever company says it can be done, but its just not true. Cell phones are designed and made for a specific company. They don't make universal radios and just turn off some bands. They don't exist, though I did read a few months back that Motorala was working on making one.
Although I understand the reason for your wishful thinking (and you did do some research which is always great), unfortunately it is just that and I'll gladly (though not happily) tell you why.
As you stated "U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band" which is correct (and it also uses the 850 band for edge as well....though this is usually more 'roaming' aka you're using another companies cell tower because tmobile made a contract with them to allow you). You were also correct in stating that "Further all official documentation states that AT&T uses:
* 850 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
* 1900 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G"
Also, ironcroth was also correct in quoting that "3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+) service by T-Mobile exclusively uses the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band" which alone might not answer your question.
So where is the problem if both use 1900 and 850 bands? Well, the problem is that in the hardware, there is a difference between GSM/GPRS/EDGE and 3G/UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+. In other words, you can't use 1900 and 850 Edge frequency of the HD2's radio chip to get 3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+); they are incompatible. This is why phone spects always list both seperatly and not just all the frequencies that it supports.
The above reason alone will make the TmoUSA HD2 incompatible with AT&T's 3G, but there's even more. When Tmobile says that it uses the (for example) 1900 frequency band for Edge, it doesn't actually mean that it uses 1900-1999 frequencies; instead it only uses a part of that spectrum (buying the full 100 frequency range would be expensive so they only buy what they need). Instead they only use maybe something like 1943-1978. And this range will likely not overlap with the frequncies that AT&T uses for their 3G (you can look up the exact values on the internet if you'd like). This second reason is why a european phone which supports 2100 band for 3g will not work on Tmobile's 3G 2100 frequncy (because they don't actually overlap).
Lastly (and I almost forgot to mention this), the screen shot you posted from your ROM can indeed be changed by a cook to whatever they want (though it won't actually make any difference since it all depends on the hardware). However, in this case, it's likely because htc actually made the error and never updated that screen and just used it from their previous builds from previous phones (this was stated on the forums before and I'm sure you'd be able to find it given some searching).
Hope this helps.
sirphunkee said:
To summarize, the only way to make it happen is if ATT did indeed somehow sneak in alternative-frequency apn's across it's entire network. Let us know how the search for those turns out
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Quite unlikely, the AWS bands are licensed to TMO, im sure TMO would notice real quick if there were unlicensed cell towers on the AWS band and the FCC would be slapping ATT with fines pretty quick. quite alot of work goes into setting up cell towers and the frequencies each cell segment runs on, If a rouge cell tower went up overlapping TMO's frequencies, all hell would likely break loose as far as customers being able to get usable service in the area.
also as far as the terminology APN's don't operate on a "frequency" an APN is more or less and authentication/proxy server on the data network after the data has transferred over the air interface.
Maybe the best way to think of it is similar to a cell tower being like a wifi access point, and the APN being like an authenticating router/firewall on a standard tcp/ip network. yeah i know its not quite the same, but that might be a simple way to visualize it for those familiar with networking
d0ug said:
Quite unlikely, the AWS bands are licensed to TMO, im sure TMO would notice real quick if there were unlicensed cell towers on the AWS band and the FCC would be slapping ATT with fines pretty quick. quite alot of work goes into setting up cell towers and the frequencies each cell segment runs on, If a rouge cell tower went up overlapping TMO's frequencies, all hell would likely break loose as far as customers being able to get usable service in the area.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly
d0ug said:
also as far as the terminology APN's don't operate on a "frequency" an APN is more or less and authentication/proxy server on the data network after the data has transferred over the air interface.
Maybe the best way to think of it is similar to a cell tower being like a wifi access point, and the APN being like an authenticating router/firewall on a standard tcp/ip network. yeah i know its not quite the same, but that might be a simple way to visualize it for those familiar with networking
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right, very true...I should have said "apn's attached to alternative-frequency radios" Are you a Ham d0ug?
sirphunkee said:
Exactly
Right, very true...I should have said "apn's attached to alternative-frequency radios" Are you a Ham d0ug?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haha no, though i do have scanners and listen in on HAMs sometimes and have read up on the stuff somewhat. never gotten myself licensed.
On the subject of scanners, there isnt all that much interesting to listen too anymore. Here in tampa the police and sheriff are on analog trunked now, so its impossible to follow anything without a trunking scanner, and about the only other things you can listen to are cabbies, tow truck drivers, aircraft, and hams. I don't even know why scanners still have the 800mhz blocks anymore, analog amps cellular has been dead a few years now. you find lots of digital noise scanning around though, just about everything is transmitted digitally now. i've got an icom R20 that goes from 150khz all the way upto 3ghz
So why don't you put in an AT&T sim card with a 3G data plan and let us know if you get 3G on your HD2?
Svegetto said:
Although I understand the reason for your wishful thinking (and you did do some research which is always great), unfortunately it is just that and I'll gladly (though not happily) tell you why.
As you stated "U.S. T-Mobile network predominately uses the GSM/GPRS/EDGE 1900 MHz frequency-band" which is correct (and it also uses the 850 band for edge as well....though this is usually more 'roaming' aka you're using another companies cell tower because tmobile made a contract with them to allow you). You were also correct in stating that "Further all official documentation states that AT&T uses:
* 850 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G
* 1900 MHz UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+ 3G"
Also, ironcroth was also correct in quoting that "3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+) service by T-Mobile exclusively uses the AWS 1700/2100 MHz frequency-band" which alone might not answer your question.
So where is the problem if both use 1900 and 850 bands? Well, the problem is that in the hardware, there is a difference between GSM/GPRS/EDGE and 3G/UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+. In other words, you can't use 1900 and 850 Edge frequency of the HD2's radio chip to get 3G (UMTS/HSPA/HSPA+); they are incompatible. This is why phone spects always list both seperatly and not just all the frequencies that it supports.
The above reason alone will make the TmoUSA HD2 incompatible with AT&T's 3G, but there's even more. When Tmobile says that it uses the (for example) 1900 frequency band for Edge, it doesn't actually mean that it uses 1900-1999 frequencies; instead it only uses a part of that spectrum (buying the full 100 frequency range would be expensive so they only buy what they need). Instead they only use maybe something like 1943-1978. And this range will likely not overlap with the frequncies that AT&T uses for their 3G (you can look up the exact values on the internet if you'd like). This second reason is why a european phone which supports 2100 band for 3g will not work on Tmobile's 3G 2100 frequncy (because they don't actually overlap).
Lastly (and I almost forgot to mention this), the screen shot you posted from your ROM can indeed be changed by a cook to whatever they want (though it won't actually make any difference since it all depends on the hardware). However, in this case, it's likely because htc actually made the error and never updated that screen and just used it from their previous builds from previous phones (this was stated on the forums before and I'm sure you'd be able to find it given some searching).
Hope this helps.
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Thank you very much. I myself had been wondering why I couldn't get an HTC Desire (honestly, pretty much the only phone I'd change my HD2 for unless a GSM version of the Supersonic becomes available) and have it work in the US at the 2100 frequency.
When I asked before, people would tell me that a phone would have to support both bands (1700/2100) to actually run on T-Mobile because one did HSDPA and the other did HSUPA, but that didn't make sense to me since all you need is a single band frequency to handle both D and U data streams.
Your explanation makes a lot more sense. It's a sad thing, though.
I remember reading somewhere that a chip manufacturer (motorola?) was working on a all frequency chip. I also read that the inherent problem with that would be the antenna.
It would be awesome to have an all band phone that world travelers could utilize. I love the HD2, I had upgraded from a long time use of a Treo 750. That phone was pretty close (quad GSM, triple umts). However when Tmo rolled out it's 3G on 1700 I was still stuck on edge with the 750.
Finally bit the bullet for an HD2, really like this phone. The 750 seems antique now heheh
moonchaser said:
I remember reading somewhere that a chip manufacturer (motorola?) was working on a all frequency chip. I also read that the inherent problem with that would be the antenna.
It would be awesome to have an all band phone that world travelers could utilize. I love the HD2, I had upgraded from a long time use of a Treo 750. That phone was pretty close (quad GSM, triple umts). However when Tmo rolled out it's 3G on 1700 I was still stuck on edge with the 750.
Finally bit the bullet for an HD2, really like this phone. The 750 seems antique now heheh
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Click to collapse
Building a multi frequency chip isnt all that hard. software defined radios have existed for quite some time. basically a simple reprogramming allows it to xmit/rec on a different frequency. the trouble comes in the antenna design. antennas must be designed to work at specific frequencies to be the most efficient at transmitting and the most sensitive at receiving. trying to make a single antenna capable of xmit and rec anywhere in a bandwidth ranging from 700mhz upto say the 2500mhz that wimax uses, is going to make for quite a ****ty antenna at any frequency. When you see the piece of foil antennas in todays phones, they may just look like a simple piece of foil, but a lot of design goes into them to make them work well at the frequencies they need to work with.
I guarantee if you compared the internal antenna of the Euro, AUS and USA HD2 there are slight differences. Ill bet the radio chip in them is for the most part identical, there may be something modified on them to keep people from interchanging the radio roms between them though since that would invalidate any FCC or other country equivalent certification for that phone to operate
Its one thing to run a hacked rom, its something completely different to use an uncertified radio rom. Could cause all kinds of havoc with the cellular network, and get slapped with FCC fines if they could track down your trouble causing phone
d0ug said:
Building a multi frequency chip isnt all that hard. software defined radios have existed for quite some time. basically a simple reprogramming allows it to xmit/rec on a different frequency. the trouble comes in the antenna design. antennas must be designed to work at specific frequencies to be the most efficient at transmitting and the most sensitive at receiving. trying to make a single antenna capable of xmit and rec anywhere in a bandwidth ranging from 700mhz upto say the 2500mhz that wimax uses, is going to make for quite a ****ty antenna at any frequency. When you see the piece of foil antennas in todays phones, they may just look like a simple piece of foil, but a lot of design goes into them to make them work well at the frequencies they need to work with.
I guarantee if you compared the internal antenna of the Euro, AUS and USA HD2 there are slight differences. Ill bet the radio chip in them is for the most part identical, there may be something modified on them to keep people from interchanging the radio roms between them though since that would invalidate any FCC or other country equivalent certification for that phone to operate
Its one thing to run a hacked rom, its something completely different to use an uncertified radio rom. Could cause all kinds of havoc with the cellular network, and get slapped with FCC fines if they could track down your trouble causing phone
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Click to collapse
Yeah that's on par with what I had read, you do well at explaining it.
Maybe some futuristic worldphone designer would opt for interchangeable external antenna's... I could live with that or maybe multiple builtin foils with a software driven switch between them and the radio... that would be neat. Not holding my breath though...
Interesting on the FCC, hadn't thought of that.
moonchaser said:
Yeah that's on par with what I had read, you do well at explaining it.
Maybe some futuristic worldphone designer would opt for interchangeable external antenna's... I could live with that or maybe multiple builtin foils with a software driven switch between them and the radio... that would be neat. Not holding my breath though...
Interesting on the FCC, hadn't thought of that.
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Thanks, I was just again looking at the spec differences between the euro and TMO HD2s and i really don't know why HTC did not also give the TMO HD2 850/900mhz HSPA/WCDMA to truly make it a world 3G phone. According to the tech specs over at HTC.com, TMO HD2 can already use 850/900mhz for GSM/GPRS/EDGE so the antenna is obviously quite capable of both. The only other frequency the TMO HD2 has to handle that the euro doesn't is 1700mhz
Part of me thinks it was probably done so the HD2 couldn't be used over on AT&T
d0ug said:
Thanks, I was just again looking at the spec differences between the euro and TMO HD2s and i really don't know why HTC did not also give the TMO HD2 850/900mhz HSPA/WCDMA to truly make it a world 3G phone. According to the tech specs over at HTC.com, TMO HD2 can already use 850/900mhz for GSM/GPRS/EDGE so the antenna is obviously quite capable of both. The only other frequency the TMO HD2 has to handle that the euro doesn't is 1700mhz
Part of me thinks it was probably done so the HD2 couldn't be used over on AT&T
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It had nothing to do with AT&T, it's because there's a difference between Edge and 3g radio frequency. More than that, there is no phone radio chip that supports all those frequencies and even more so, htc doesn't manufacture radio chips, they purchase them and put them in their phones....just like the majority of the hardware
Srs wow hd
How do you get SRS WOW HD downloaded onto the HTC HD2?
Svegetto said:
a european phone which supports 2100 band for 3g will not work on Tmobile's 3G 2100 frequncy
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I think this is incorrect -- the 2100 band support on the HD2 is in fact expressly intended for 3G compatibility in Europe/Asia, and people have reported being able to get 3G in Europe with their US HD2.
1700 == US-only 3G
2100 == Europe, Asia 3G
What's missing, I believe, might be 3G support in certain areas of places like Latin America which may follow US frequencies but don't have T-Mobile USA there to provide 1700 service... e.g., no 2100 and no 1700 either.
T-Mobile U.S. uses both AWS 1700mhz and 2100mhz for 3G. The 2100mhz band is used for transmit and 1700mhz is used for receive. Hence the incompatibility with other carriers phones that only operate in one spectrum.
Cheers.
~Jasecloud4
hi all
well, fianly after a big argument and debate with vodafail, about my ghg, and them saying that it will support ALL bands and freq's that they are supporting, or launching. i find out that, it will infact NOT support their 850 G network. which sh8ts me to tears. i have had nothing but trouble with them about this, and the constant reception dropouts that i am having.
i have flashed: radio 12.54.60.25_26.09.04.11_M2
and RIL_12.54.60.25_26.09.04.11_M2
but that hasnt seemed to help. so, i am wondering if there is a way to get my phone to support the aus 850mhz 3g network? is it a radio flash or anything? or is it a hardware based thing?
i looked around, but nothing is specific to my location.
i did however notice that the american version of the phone supports the 850 3g network.
so, is it possible to get it to work? or will i need another phone?
cheers
jbates58
Wait, are you in Australia? As far as I know only Telstra uses the 850 MHz band. Vodafone uses the 900/2100 MHz bands.
yea. but vodafone are starting to roll out on the 850mhz for 3G. they havent fully done it yet, but my area is sposed to have it, and with all the constant drop outs that im facing, its BS. i have flashed a different radio to stock (listed in OP) and that hasnt made alot of difference. is there some way i can up the power or something?
cheers
jbates58
I think you may need another handset my friend. It is a hardware issue.
Be thankful you are on not on WIND mobile in Canada! AWS and so few handset choices!
jbates58 said:
hi all
well, fianly after a big argument and debate with vodafail, about my ghg, and them saying that it will support ALL bands and freq's that they are supporting, or launching. i find out that, it will infact NOT support their 850 G network. which sh8ts me to tears. i have had nothing but trouble with them about this, and the constant reception dropouts that i am having.
i have flashed: radio 12.54.60.25_26.09.04.11_M2
and RIL_12.54.60.25_26.09.04.11_M2
but that hasnt seemed to help. so, i am wondering if there is a way to get my phone to support the aus 850mhz 3g network? is it a radio flash or anything? or is it a hardware based thing?
i looked around, but nothing is specific to my location.
i did however notice that the american version of the phone supports the 850 3g network.
so, is it possible to get it to work? or will i need another phone?
cheers
jbates58
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
jbates58 said:
hi all
well, fianly after a big argument and debate with vodafail, about my ghg, and them saying that it will support ALL bands and freq's that they are supporting, or launching. i find out that, it will infact NOT support their 850 G network. which sh8ts me to tears. i have had nothing but trouble with them about this, and the constant reception dropouts that i am having.
i have flashed: radio 12.54.60.25_26.09.04.11_M2
and RIL_12.54.60.25_26.09.04.11_M2
but that hasnt seemed to help. so, i am wondering if there is a way to get my phone to support the aus 850mhz 3g network? is it a radio flash or anything? or is it a hardware based thing?
i looked around, but nothing is specific to my location.
i did however notice that the american version of the phone supports the 850 3g network.
so, is it possible to get it to work? or will i need another phone?
cheers
jbates58
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Worth trying the TELUS Rom Radio 23rd June 2011: Radio_12.56.60.25_26.10.04.03_M - Telus DHD 2.43.661.1 with matching RIL from Jkoljo thread. TELUS in Canada seems to operate on 850mhz for 3G. Hope that will solve your problem. If not... New phone I guess.
Cheers
You can flash every radio out there and it won't help. It is a hardware issue and not a software issue as mentioned above. The only Desire HDs that will have the 850 UMTS band is Telus of Canada or the Inspire from ATT in the US. I am surprised that Telstra does not have a NextG version.
Hmm I'm on Three which will be merging networks with voda at the end of the year.. apparently we'll be forced to switch sigh..
Hopefully it wont cause any problems, although, Three is only on 2100 and I currently have no issues with my reception (Three also uses Telstra's 850 network, but I'm guess I only pick up 2100 with my DHD).
I guess we'll have to wait and see. You would think that being able to pick up voda's 900mhz network would improve reception...
But yeah, as Agoattamer said, Voda and Three's DHDs wont work on UMTS850.
As per both Voda's and Three's websites, specs for the DHD:
GSM: 850/ 900/ 1800/ 1900
UMTS: 900/ 2100 HSDPA/ HSUP
So it looks like you'd need a new phone to make use of the new 850mhz network.